Author Topic: Dremel / Dremel like device?  (Read 3576 times)

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Offline wilfred

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #75 on: March 13, 2018, 06:16:29 pm »
I don't have a drill like that and I am in a distant place now, hard to get one. So the only thing I have is the hand drill I linked above with some bits that came with it. I don't know if the bits are for iron or concrete.

You will not have been supplied masonry bits with that handheld drill. You will certainly ruin the bits you got if you try drilling a brick wall. A masonry bit does not work like a wood or steel drill bit. You need the vibrating hammer action because it works like a hammer and chisel chipping away little bits like dust.

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Offline boffin

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #76 on: March 13, 2018, 06:41:13 pm »
For PCBs I have one of these.  It looks like it's much bigger than it really is, about 35cm tall (that's 13" for those three countries that refuse to modernize).
It's not the best, with not a lot of torque, but it's very solid, and much better than a dremel and its wobbly stand. 



From a jewelry making supply company called Rio Grande
https://products.riogrande.com/products/330012IN1.jpg

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Offline VEGETA

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #77 on: March 13, 2018, 07:37:15 pm »
Quote
Beg, borrow or steal the right tools.

I will try to get a proper drill in 2 weeks when I return home.

However, can the hand drill handle the job given the right bits? or is it not possible due to being hand drill and not designed for the job?
 

Offline KL27x

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #78 on: March 13, 2018, 07:48:10 pm »
Yeah, a hand drill is the most common way to drill holes in concrete. Provided it is something like this:

https://www.amazon.com/Bosch-HD18-2-Two-Speed-Hammer-Drill/dp/B01AX4AEGM/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1520932384&sr=8-2-spons&keywords=bosch+hammer+drill&psc=1

I have used this to drill 4" deep 1/2" holes in concrete. This thing weighs 6 lbs. There are smaller battery powered drills with hammer feature (which I also have this kind), but it is more for drilling through cinder blocks, at best. For this, these are good. But you can drill holes through cinder block with a regular drill, even.

BTW, I tried to cheap out and bought a Harbor Freight hammer drill that weighed like half of this Bosch drill. If the thing lasted 10 hours, it still wouldn't have made anything more than a scratch. If you can comfortably pick it up and aim/operate it with one hand, it's probably not suitable.

In the US, you can sometimes rent heavy duty tools like these by the day, from home improvement stores.

Are your walls really concrete, or just cinder blocks? Concrete is a very expensive way to build walls. In the US, concrete for residential walls is relatively uncommon outside of high end connected condominiums and apartments, particularly in high rises. Even in earthquake zones, concrete is usually just in the foundation of a house. And here, in some places of California, for instance, they sometimes use high tensile concrete... this is not regular rebar in there, but steel members/cables under high tensile stress. I have heard you should not drill into this stuff. You can cause a lot of property and bodily damage - even death - if you hit the wrong spot.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2018, 08:43:03 pm by KL27x »
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #79 on: March 13, 2018, 07:50:07 pm »
Dremel is a high speed low torque tool, not the best tool to work plastic. If you want to make round holes get a drill stand. If you want to make rectangular holes using just a drill or Dremel it is going to be difficult to make nice straight and corner cuts. You are talking now about a entry level milling machine or router and that cost more than a 100 buck.
Plastic can be a bit finicky regardless. Depending on the specific plastic type, as the category plastic covers a very wide range of materials with wildly varying properties.
 

Online RoGeorge

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #80 on: March 13, 2018, 09:59:18 pm »
Quote
Beg, borrow or steal the right tools.

I will try to get a proper drill in 2 weeks when I return home.

However, can the hand drill handle the job given the right bits? or is it not possible due to being hand drill and not designed for the job?


Offline KL27x

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #81 on: March 14, 2018, 05:12:49 am »
^That Dewalt hammer drill is perfect example of borderline too light for concrete. And you can't make up for it by pressing harder.

SDS drills are supposed to be more efficient due to less reciprocating mass, not having to move the entire chuck. But OTOH, I have never seen a very small lightweight SDS hammer drill. I think there's maybe a minimum size for the SDS mechanism. OTOH, I have a super small hammer drill with a super lightweight chuck. I think the reality is SDS is a more robust mechanism that is only used in the larger hammer drills, anyway. I.e., when you go bigger/spendier, you are eventually in SDS territory.

FYI, cinder blocks are technically made of concrete, but at least in the US, they are made with a different mix than typical concrete. Cinder block is not as dense. It is much easier to drill than typical poured concrete.

We have hammer drills for brick and cinder blocks and sandstone and a whole range of other things. Don't by surprised if you buy any old hammer drill and find it won't work on concrete.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2018, 05:34:41 am by KL27x »
 

Offline MyHeadHz

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #82 on: March 14, 2018, 05:27:15 am »
Actually, with the Dremel, I do like their miniature cutting disc.  Carefully, I have cut and sanded openings on cheap Chinese project boxes using it without melting the plastic on the slowest speed.

With a good set, you also get milling/burrs bits which also carve away the plastic without making crap edges or melting.  But, they are harder to control than drill bits.  You need a sturdy stand for the drill to do any good with them.  Which kinda leaves you back to my above drill press, with a good dremel bit kit.

https://www.amazon.com/10pcs-Milling-Rotary-Carving-Dremel/dp/B01H72VWYG/ref=sr_1_21?ie=UTF8&qid=1520464534&sr=8-21&keywords=dremel+bit+set
https://www.amazon.com/Yosoo-Tungsten-Carbide-Dremel-Rotary/dp/B00CYA6I46/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1520464273&sr=8-8&keywords=dremel+bit+set


https://www.amazon.com/Lukcase-Diamond-Cutting-Cut-off-Blades/dp/B01LWYXPJZ/ref=sr_1_12_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1520464273&sr=8-12-spons&keywords=dremel+bit+set&psc=1

https://www.amazon.com/WORKPRO-276-piece-Accessories-Universal-Polishing/dp/B0109U88KE/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1520464273&sr=8-7&keywords=dremel+bit+set

Yes, but I suggest that if you're going to buy cheap chinese knockoffs, avoid the resellers and just buy them directly.  You save a lot of money that way.  If you are too impatient to wait for the slow boat, which can take over a month, then I guess you can pay the premium. :p

Some of the sources for the products you recommended:

https://www.banggood.com/10pcs-Diamond-Saw-Discs-Wheel-Blade-Rotary-Tool-Set-For-Dremel-p-936102.html
https://www.banggood.com/Drillpro-10pcs-HSS-Router-Bits-Burr-For-Dremel-and-Rotary-Engraving-Woodworking-Tool-p-1034598.html

helpful search link: https://www.banggood.com/search/rotary.html

Always buy the genuine tool (Dremel), then you can save on cheap accessories.

I've had my Dremel for about 15-20 years and it still works like a champ.  I haven't really used any other ones, so I don't have an opinion on those, but you can't go wrong with Dremel.  Personally, I strongly prefer the infinitely-variable versions over the ones with preset speeds.

However, I don't recommend using drill press/router stands and similar devices.  Dremels are for freehand work, despite what the marketing department would like you to think.  You wouldn't use a drill press as a milling machine, and you shouldn't try to use a Dremel as a drill press.  They are very different tools for very different purposes.

It is very easy to melt plastic and clog bits if you try to cut/grind it with a Dremel, depending on the type of plastic.  Plastic also gives off some nasty chemicals and particulates.  I recommend good ventillation and/or a good respirator, especially when dealing with plastic.  Always wear proper eye and ear protection.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2018, 05:58:20 am by MyHeadHz »
 

Offline Bassman59

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #83 on: March 14, 2018, 01:54:03 pm »
We have hammer drills for brick and cinder blocks and sandstone and a whole range of other things. Don't by surprised if you buy any old hammer drill and find it won't work on concrete.

Ain't that the truth. A couple of years ago I put up a wooden shed on my back patio. That patio is a poured slab of concrete that's 60 years old. The shed had to be built on a sill, and the sill had to be anchored to the slab. OK, no problem, I have a ½" hammer drill and appropriate bits, no problem.

Except, problem. Drilling one hole to appropriate depth (4") took half an hour and destroyed the bit. The drill got so hot that the plastic for the hand-hold softened and started to melt. Clearly this wasn't going to work!

A web search turned up the answer: rotary hammer. So off to the store I go, and $200 later I had a new Bosch rotary hammer and two bits. That thing went through the concrete like a hot knife through butter. Unbelievable. When finished, the bit I used looked like it was new, too.

aside: so the sill is just pressure-treated 2x4s. But the stuff that is used to treat it requires special fasteners, which of course the store that sells the wood doesn't have. McMaster-Carr to the rescue. (They were cheaper than the big box store, too.)
 

Offline 6PTsocket

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #84 on: March 14, 2018, 02:18:59 pm »
There are other options. Milwaukee makes a 12 volt rotary tool that does not lack for power. Dremel also makes a 12 volt lithium battery tool. Both look pretty hefty. There is a dissection review of the Milwaukee and the speed control is not a triac but a more elaborate MOSFET circuit.

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Offline Back2Volts

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #85 on: March 15, 2018, 03:43:41 am »
I made it after looking at dozens of builds, online. And Matthias Wandel's router table lift is about 1000x better than anything else that I have ever seen. Simple and effective. And it tilts! (The tilt is absolutely wonderful for cutting FR-4. With a normal 3mm endmil tilted 45 degrees, you can score FR-4 with a 90 degree V groove. Eats FR-4 for lunch).

Matthias Wandel's Tilting Router Lift Build
http://woodgears.ca/router_lift/index.html

Essentially, mine is a pretty close (but crude) copy to this, minus the gear lifting mechanism. For a rotary tool, it's easy enough to just lift it yourself, lol. Plywood isn't very sexy, but it is way more rigid than any molded plastic and sheet metal rotary tool router table you can buy off-the-shelf.

It's just bolted to the underside of a Harbor Freight drill press table. Loosen the knob on the back, and you can move the whole tool up/down. Loosen the knobs on the sides and you can tilt the entire tool. I made a pretty mediocre "Instructable," years ago. Basically, I took a few pics while making it, is all, then put them up with a bunch of boring words. It looks like it's still viewable. This was done before I added the legs and the tilt mechanism, which was eezy peezy to add-on after the fact. I link it so you can see the drill press table and the wooden Proxxon tool mount. I paid $30.00 for the table, and it is perfect. Other than those specific things, the top link to Matthias's webpage is what you want to see.

Crummy Pictures of my Proxxon Router Table Build:
http://www.instructables.com/id/Garbage-Can-Dremel-Router-Table/

In a way, perhaps it is better to see the simplified version, first. After you have this working, the tilt mechanism is easier to figure out. You just unscrew the "back plate" from the table and reattach it with just hinges on the front. Then affix two slotted arbors* to the table, right up against either side of the plate. These arbors are the part that must be solidly bolted to the underside of the table; the hinges can be gimpy as heck. Then you attach a length of threaded rod to the back of the "back plate" which extends out either side to slide through the curved slot in the arbors and make some knobs to lock it in place in any position thru the arc.

*Arbor might be the wrong word. I know there's a word for a plate with an arc cut in it for a bolt to slide around in.

Nice work!   That is the kind of project I would have looked forward thirty years ago, but at this point in my life, I was hoping it was a readily available Proxxon machine. 
 

Online tooki

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #86 on: March 15, 2018, 05:35:06 am »
Yes, but I suggest that if you're going to buy cheap chinese knockoffs, avoid the resellers and just buy them directly.  You save a lot of money that way.  If you are too impatient to wait for the slow boat, which can take over a month, then I guess you can pay the premium. :p

Some of the sources for the products you recommended:

https://www.banggood.com/10pcs-Diamond-Saw-Discs-Wheel-Blade-Rotary-Tool-Set-For-Dremel-p-936102.html
https://www.banggood.com/Drillpro-10pcs-HSS-Router-Bits-Burr-For-Dremel-and-Rotary-Engraving-Woodworking-Tool-p-1034598.html

helpful search link: https://www.banggood.com/search/rotary.html

Always buy the genuine tool (Dremel), then you can save on cheap accessories.
Are those diamond cutting discs any good?

I’m leery of cheap accessories, since I don’t want a shitty dull bit dancing all over the place.

However, I don't recommend using drill press/router stands and similar devices.  Dremels are for freehand work, despite what the marketing department would like you to think.  You wouldn't use a drill press as a milling machine, and you shouldn't try to use a Dremel as a drill press.  They are very different tools for very different purposes.
I really don’t think you can make a broad statement like that. Some materials need low-RPM high0-torque drilling, and others need high-RPM low-torque drilling. Think about where you are: EEVBlog. Electronics. What’s something we drill? PCBs. And they need high-RPM low-torque drilling. (And they need it with tungsten carbide bits, because FR4 will dull steel bits in no time. But carbide is brittle, so handholding those bits risks breaking them. Heck, they even break in Dremel’s shitty wobbly plastic drill stand. No such problems with Proxxon — or even a Dremel in a third-party metal stand.)
 

Offline KL27x

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #87 on: March 15, 2018, 05:38:37 am »
Quote
That is the kind of project I would have looked forward thirty years ago, but at this point in my life, I was hoping it was a readily available Proxxon machine.

I got a late start. I hardly knew how to pick up a hammer until I was 30. It's not something I was exposed to at home or university. Passion for electronics is what got me sideways into what is now a tiny garage workshop. As I recall, the first power saw (a jigsaw) I ever bought was to build a better etch tank. (After 3 iterations, and as many years, I finally succeeded.) The mini router table was largely an attempt to step up my FR-4 cutting and machining ability.

At first, I was allergic to wood. I was more interested in engineering plastics. Wood seemed so old-fashioned and imprecise. But wood is incredible. Fast and easy and sturdy, once I got over the "analog-ness" and saw that sometimes close is more than good enough. And in some cases, hand-fitting and tuning is a pain, but overall the fastest and sometimes best way to build things. It's a matter of trusting that your eyes and hands, while not as digitally perfect as a CNC, they are pretty darn good. And where I am now, I hope that in 30 years, I will be able to spend all day in the garage workshop. It's a great change of pace from the headache of coding and debugging and using OP's software.  There are some similarities to coding where you sometimes need to make the tool to build the tool to build the jig to make the widget, based on what tools you have and know how to use, to start. But it's all so refreshingly not abstract. :)

Today, a lot of people's first workshop tool might be a 3D printer. A few different choices here and there, and that could have been me. But that's not how it turned out. The 3D printer is one of the last tools I would buy; there are several thousands of dollars of things I feel are more important and useful to have, first. 40 yr-old me looks back at 25-yr-old me and sees a completely useless asshole.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2018, 06:38:43 am by KL27x »
 

Offline mcinque

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #88 on: March 15, 2018, 08:32:45 am »
I had a Dremel for a couple of months then I tried Proxxon. It was like reborn. I would never change it. There is not even comparison.
I'm basically still a rookie and because of this, even with the best intentions, I often say bullshit :)
 

Offline MyHeadHz

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #89 on: March 15, 2018, 10:31:03 am »
Yes, but I suggest that if you're going to buy cheap chinese knockoffs, avoid the resellers and just buy them directly.  You save a lot of money that way.  If you are too impatient to wait for the slow boat, which can take over a month, then I guess you can pay the premium. :p

Some of the sources for the products you recommended:

https://www.banggood.com/10pcs-Diamond-Saw-Discs-Wheel-Blade-Rotary-Tool-Set-For-Dremel-p-936102.html
https://www.banggood.com/Drillpro-10pcs-HSS-Router-Bits-Burr-For-Dremel-and-Rotary-Engraving-Woodworking-Tool-p-1034598.html

helpful search link: https://www.banggood.com/search/rotary.html

Always buy the genuine tool (Dremel), then you can save on cheap accessories.
Are those diamond cutting discs any good?

I’m leery of cheap accessories, since I don’t want a shitty dull bit dancing all over the place.

However, I don't recommend using drill press/router stands and similar devices.  Dremels are for freehand work, despite what the marketing department would like you to think.  You wouldn't use a drill press as a milling machine, and you shouldn't try to use a Dremel as a drill press.  They are very different tools for very different purposes.
I really don’t think you can make a broad statement like that. Some materials need low-RPM high0-torque drilling, and others need high-RPM low-torque drilling. Think about where you are: EEVBlog. Electronics. What’s something we drill? PCBs. And they need high-RPM low-torque drilling. (And they need it with tungsten carbide bits, because FR4 will dull steel bits in no time. But carbide is brittle, so handholding those bits risks breaking them. Heck, they even break in Dremel’s shitty wobbly plastic drill stand. No such problems with Proxxon — or even a Dremel in a third-party metal stand.)

I can't vouch for those particular accessories-- they just happened to be the source for links others had posted.  I have tried other cheap chinese knockoff tools without noticing any meaningful differences to performance or durability, though I only really do grinding, cutting, and polishing with it.

Proxxon tools seem to only be 220v, so I never really bothered looking into them since we have 110v here.  From a machinist's perspective, the dremel tools move several thousandths in all directions while moving freehand, which is fine... it's freehand.  When you take those cheap (Dremel) stands it magnifies everything.  Unless your tolerances are super loose, then you're going to have some serious issues.  Tungsten carbide is very fragile, even for proper equipment.  Using that or HSS in such a setup is a complete waste.  The tools will break or chip from getting jammed or misaligned far before the tool could ever dull.  If you're going to do it, just go with some cheapo bits, especially if it is just plastic.  Again, that's just going from the dremel stands I've seen.  Those attachments aren't cheap either- around $45.  For $65 you can get a basic drill press, which is far more versatile in what it can make holes in.  With the proxxon you would be in a similar boat.  Assuming it will do your basic job, it will probably cost as much as a real drill press, so there is no reason not to.  Those little attachments are just marketing wank.  I see a lot of people getting accessories like that to "justify" their original purpose, but there is no need.  Those tools have a purpose and a place, just like drill presses and milling machines.  You're just going to cause a lot more headache and expenses in other ways by trying so hard to make something work outside of its element.

But to each his own.  He can hog the holes out with a spork for all I care, as long as he's happy.   :popcorn:
 

Offline IanMacdonald

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #90 on: March 15, 2018, 06:32:40 pm »
Major aggro I find with all the Dremel-type units is the collet chucks just letting go in the middle of a job. A unit with a proper keyed chuck would save a lot of swearing.
 

Online ebastler

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #91 on: March 15, 2018, 07:01:51 pm »
Proxxon tools seem to only be 220v, so I never really bothered looking into them since we have 110v here. 

I don't think that is correct; they seem to have a decent selection of 115V tools:
https://proxxon-us-shop.com/
 
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Offline beanflying

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #92 on: March 15, 2018, 08:17:39 pm »
Major aggro I find with all the Dremel-type units is the collet chucks just letting go in the middle of a job. A unit with a proper keyed chuck would save a lot of swearing.

Ever wonder why Mills use collet chucks and not keyed?

Are those diamond cutting discs any good?

I’m leery of cheap accessories, since I don’t want a shitty dull bit dancing all over the place.

Maybe on glass or ceramic and even then used wet if you want any life out of them. I haven't used them for PCB's and am unlikely to try.


Re Dremel/Proxon both are good but if you are using either with side loads like a Mill then expect issues with keeping straight. The Bits and Connecting Bars will flex for a start before you even get to the tool and it's bearings.
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Offline KL27x

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #93 on: March 15, 2018, 09:37:05 pm »
Quote
Major aggro I find with all the Dremel-type units is the collet chucks just letting go in the middle of a job. A unit with a proper keyed chuck would save a lot of swearing.
I have the same issue with my particular Dremels because of the vibration and/or runout, but to be fair, I can't adjust the speed on my mains Dremel; it's 35K, all the time. (And my Li ion Dremel has crazy runout). The main bits I use in my Dremels are 99% cutoff wheels, 1% nondirection carbide bur, non directional cutters, felt polishing wheels, or stone grinding bits. Stuff that doesn't "dig" itself out of the tool. My Dremels are pretty much useless at freehanding with endmills. It's too herky jerky, even if the bit would stay in.

With Proxxon, I use carbide endmils, freehand, all the time. It's probably the most common bit I use in my Proxxons. And despite Proxxon having excellent 3 slot steel collets, I use the adjustable chuck adaptor for everything. Even the Proxxon in my router table wears this adjustable chuck, despite I hardly ever change that bit from 3mm endmill. It makes no difference in performance that I can tell (although it probably isn't great for the life of the tool, considering the extra length and resultant side load). Smoothness and balance fundamentally changes what you can do with a rotary tool. (I'm not suggesting that Dremel doesn't make tools that aren't smooth enough to do this stuff; just that my 2 Dremel do not fall into this category).

Quote
Re Dremel/Proxon both are good but if you are using either with side loads like a Mill then expect issues with keeping straight. The Bits and Connecting Bars will flex for a start before you even get to the tool and it's bearings.
Dunno about Dremel, but I mill plastics, sheet metal, wood, and FR-4 with my Proxxon router table. No problem at all. The main limitation is the torque, not the herkyjerk, broken bit, or magic smoke.

Quote
Dremels are for freehand work ... You wouldn't use a drill press as a milling machine, and you shouldn't try to use a Dremel as a drill press.  They are very different tools for very different purposes.

Exactly. A high speed rotary tool is more like a mill motor than a drill. Milling/routing goes much better when the mill motor is solidly mounted and the material is fed in a controlled manner. Hence, accessories like router tables and drill presses can be useful (if they are well designed and manufactured). There is rare occasion one should actually choose a rotary tool to properly drill things (with a regular fluted drill bit), but drilling is not the only way to make (or to enlarge/shape/finish) "holes," including "holes" that are not round. And since this is EE forum, some of us actually have this rare application where you might want to drill at high RPM. Carbide drill bits will punch super tiny holes in PCBs very rapidly and cleanly, provided the RPM is high(er than a proper drill press). Suggestion to "buy a REAL drill press" is missing your own point. The "real" upgrade to a rotary tool is a die grinder or router or mill motor. And with proper accessories, you can do more. With just a mount, a flat table, and a fence you can mill straight slots, do radial symmetry, edge jointing/plane-ing, follow cuts parallel to an outer reference edge (that could be made with a saw or belt sander), all of this is in addition to more control and cutting speed in free-hand shaping (with the additional benefit of having a fixed perpendicular bit angle, if not adjustable). When you figure out how to take advantage of all this stuff, it means you can make more complex things. And most of this stuff can aid in shaping/cutting/milling thin, flat things like enclosure front/back/top/sides, which is presumably what the OP is about.

In short, yes. 15-35k RPM is, indeed, too fast to drill almost everything. Aside from plastic, this is a disaster for wood or metal or just about anything. But it is in the right ballpark to mill or grind almost anything. But if the tool vibrates and chatters out of control, you will never know. Esp considering the small radius of bits you will use in such a tool, a rotary tool might be too SLOW for a lot of milling operations. I would give the OP benefit of doubt and suppose he is interested in milling openings in an enclosure. If he only wanted to drill standard size round holes, you don't need a press of any kind to do that in 1/8" plastic and sheet metal. A hand drill is fine.   

Fun fact: you can turn the basic Proxxon drill press into a spring loaded arbor press by moving the spring from the top to the bottom. (You would get it if you look at it). This can be useful for milling, if you don't have a router table. Lift, insert the stock, then let it drop into the hole/slot you are wanting to mill. I occasionally use one of mine* to do stuff like this when I want to do it at my main workbench, with the comfy chair and good lighting. This spring loaded arbor configuration is also useful if you ever have to flash a bunch of PCB via ICSP. But if you want to mill anything thick with such a weak tool, you will want a very quick and easy way to adjust the height of the bit. Gotta take shallow cuts. This is where Matthias's router table design and a quickly adjustable fence are key.

*I actually have found enough uses to own two of these Proxxon drill presses. And yeah, you know I have a real drill press, too.






 
« Last Edit: March 16, 2018, 10:06:59 am by KL27x »
 

Offline BBBbbb

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #94 on: March 16, 2018, 03:48:22 am »
Once I bought a big set of accessories for my Proxxon from china (banggood), and I will never do it again. They were absolute rubbish in every aspect, not sure there was a single one that was straight, maybe only the polishing bits were usable. I'm a bit afraid to use the cutting discs from that set.
I should have expected it, since the price was around 10eur, close to what I pay for a single bit from Proxxon (or Dremel)

I'm sure there are more quality ones from alibay, but even this one had positive comments and I'm not sure I'm willing to experiment with further orders from chine, unless I see some of them live in action first. 
 

Offline Paul Moir

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #95 on: March 16, 2018, 06:28:23 am »
Are those diamond cutting discs any good?
They're awesome for finely grinding tools.  For example, they do an excellent job at splitting the point of drill bits.  Just don't run them at high speed against iron containing materials or the diamond dissolves.   And of course they work great on carbide.
However this may not be much use if you aren't grinding your own tools very often.
 

Offline KL27x

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Re: Dremel / Dremel like device?
« Reply #96 on: March 16, 2018, 09:16:34 am »
Rotary tool  / mini router table worthless for milling plastic? Too fast, they say. Wrong tool.

Just a few examples that could be of particular interest on the forum. All HPDE. ABS mills about the same.

Solder dispenser for magnifying lamp.
<img src="https://i.imgur.com/OEf24co.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" />

Flux syringe holder on the right of my microscope:
<img src="https://i.imgur.com/vyu8xZs.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" />

Tweezer holder on the left:
<img src="https://i.imgur.com/5xMHhpg.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" />

Bushings:
<img src="https://i.imgur.com/AQtQOcn.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" />

And there's this thing: I would like to see this done, freehand. Even a 3D printer will not achieve the surface finish for the raceway/track. FF to the 55 second mark, about the last sixth of the bar. The white plastic ring around the top dish is also milled on my lil router table. It is partly covered by the orange lid. There's a larger diameter shallower step that perfectly fits under the orange part.


I still remember my first "router table" accessory. I heat bent 1/4" plexiglass into a tube shape and cemented that to the underside of a small sheet of plexiglass. The Dremel was stuffed into the tube and then about 30 rubber bands were put over the tube to try to keep the Dremel from slipping around TOO much. No fence or miter slot, just a small flat surface. Of course, this was terrible, from concept to material selection to execution. (As I have said before, 25-yr-old me was fairly useless.) But even this router table was still a gigantic improvement over freehanding, for certain specific things. Making clean and accurate holes/openings in an ABS or styrene plastic enclosure would perhaps qualify.

I used this router table to make a form fitting holder for the same Dremel, out of plexiglass, which is a terrible material for this and is much harder to machine than ABS.
But this worked out and helped make the next iteration not quite as terrible.

If you are stuck with a buzzy rotary tool, you might want to try carbide burrs, the kind with the large "diamond-cut" grooves. They cut down on the chatter and vibration quite a bit compared to endmills and will rough away plastic much faster and safer in a buzzy tool. The 1/4" "high speed cutting bit" that looks like a drum with a bunch of blades around the circumference is good for rounding and smoothing inside arcs, but be sure to avoid cutting anything abrasive with the steel cutting bits like this. In a more balanced tool, step aside as see what an endmill can do.

« Last Edit: March 16, 2018, 11:19:18 am by KL27x »
 


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