Flux in Europe

[ollihd]

Hi all,

What kind of Flux do you generally use for lead based soldering? I'm looking for a tacky flux, something like Amtech, but can't seem to find a decent seller anywhere in Europe. I have ordered and tested a few fake ones from Ebay, but I really would like to try the real thing.
Any suggestions? Is there something similar in the EU-market? What exact model of the Amtech flux do people use? Amtech 559? 223?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

[orbiter]

I use Amtech NC-559-V2 tacky flux and find it very good indeed. I buy it from BGA-Reworking in the UK.. I believe they'll ship it most places too.

http://www.bga-reworking.co.uk/flux-solder-paste/amtech-nc-559-v2-bga-reflow-reball-tacky-flux-10cc.html

[ollihd]

Thanks for the advice. Just out of curiosity, where does the "V2" come from? I don't see a V2-label on any of the Amtech products on their datasheet?

Anyone else liking the 559?

What about liquid flux? Is Amtech the way to go?

[cs.dk]

I have bought a couple of these; http://www.tme.eu/en/details/kes-tsf6502_10/fluxes/kester/

The only thing that annoy me is, where to get the "piston" for them - Have to use a screwdriver to push the gel out of the syringe.

[sleemanj]

I have bought a couple of these; http://www.tme.eu/en/details/kes-tsf6502_10/fluxes/kester/

The only thing that annoy me is, where to get the "piston" for them - Have to use a screwdriver to push the gel out of the syringe.

Just buy a normal 10cc syringe, transfer the gel into it.  I don't even use a tip.

[orbiter]

Thanks for the advice. Just out of curiosity, where does the "V2" come from? I don't see a V2-label on any of the Amtech products on their datasheet?

Anyone else liking the 559?

What about liquid flux? Is Amtech the way to go?

I've no idea what the v2 is for in relation too the flux. Although NC-559-V2 is listed in their solder paste section on the inventec website. So they do use that code.. Perhaps I think perhaps that the website has not been updated in a while in relation to the NC 559 'V2' TF (tacky flux)

http://www.inventecusa.com/amtech-data-sheets.html

[RoGeorge]

I am using AMTECH NC-559-ASM with a DIY syringe dispenser: https://hackaday.io/project/7574-the-devil-is-in-the-details/log/24733-flux-paste-dispenser

It was bought from AliExpress, so I guess it's fake, but it works very well, and it doesn't smell at all.

[capt bullshot]

I usually use Edsyn FL22, you can get it from reichelt.de, 13 EUR for a small quantity (5ml in a syringe).
Works well for all kinds of soldering requiring flux

[that_guy]

+1 for Amtech paste flux. Watch out for fakes though.

[mariush]

TME.eu stocks a bunch of gel fluxes from Amtech, Kester, Alpha and AG Termopasty (a Polish company) : http://goo.gl/2u2aLD  (i took the liberty of filtering out the water soluble fluxes as those are somewhat of a pain to clean properly)

They sell genuine stuff, shipping costs are reasonable.
I've personally only used AG Termopasty TK83 no clean liquid flux and it works great for my needs.  May be worth trying out the gel fluxes from that Polish company, they're cheap enough to add to the "basket" besides one of those more expensive Amtech fluxes.   

[ollihd]

Thanks a bunch for the advice! I will try TME for sure. Any recommendations regarding liquid flux? I could order it at the same time. As for the difference between the Amtech 559-V2 and Amtech 559-ASM I can only see:

ASM: + Compatible with high temperature alloys (221-300 °C) (not listed for V2)
ASM: Stencil life: >12 hours @ 30-45% RH and 20-25 °C (V2 Stencil life: >8 hours @ 30-45% RH and 20-25 °C)
I would say besides the mentioned differences these fluxes are more or less really similar. Mind someone telling me what stencil life is?

I think I will try the Amtech, some cheaper ones and if someone could recommend a liquid flux as well, that would be perfect.

Thanks alot!

[Zero999]

Hi all,

What kind of Flux do you generally use for lead based soldering?

I use rosin cored solder, making additional flux unnecessary. The only time I use extra flux, is when I'm forced to use old components or boards which are badly oxidised.

Any suggestions? Is there something similar in the EU-market?

Use rosin cored solder, which is widely available in the EU and avoid using old components and oxidised boards.

Another thing you can do, if a part is oxidised is clean it first with abrasive paper, then it's normally possible to solder it using rosin cored solder and no additional flux.

[alm]

You use rosin core solder without extra flux for SMD packages like TQFP?

[TheUnnamedNewbie]

I use Stanol flux (their gels, they mainly provide bulk stuff in 2.5l bottles, but I prefer my little 10ml syringe that lasts me a lonnggg time. Get it from the local electronics store). Comes in a syringe with tiny tip, easy for accurate deposition. Nice and thick at room temperature. Sure, not strictly necessary for any soldering nowadays since any half decent brand of solder will have rosin cores anyways, but it really does make SMD soldering easier in my opinion.

 Can wash it off with regular old food-grade alcohol and a soft brass or similar brush, which I like because I don't think every component can stand up to acetone, which is another often suggested solvent. And food-grade alcohol is cheap and we always have some in the house on account of familymembers using it for making their own limonchello and such.

Only downside is that it gets really sticky, so I almost always have a bit of alcohol close-by to clean up my tweezers after every few components. Don't know which exact number it is, I'll have a look when I get home.

http://www.stannol.de/en/products/accessories/rework/

[Zero999]

You use rosin core solder without extra flux for SMD packages like TQFP?

Yes.

[BBBbbb]

Can you get MG Chemicals ones?

Haven't seen it in stores around EU.

ERSA has a good no clean flux (I'm guessing a rebrand), not so hard to find in stores, also not so cheap, around 20eur for 5ml. Haven't tried Stannol's flux, but their soldering wires are good.

[twist3r]

Hello everyone.

I'm new to electronics and new at this forum. I wanted to share with you the information that you will read below, so in case anyone in the future decide to visit topic by trying to 'hunt down' an amtech distributor in europe, he can find this topic and 'this post' and read it.

So, lets start...

I was looking what flux should I buy. I did some research and I ended up at youtube watching Rossmann suggesting Amtech tacky flux NC-559-V2-TF.



I know that Amtech flux is being sold (fake one) from china, and since I don't want to use fake Amtech, I was looking where to buy original one. So I've checked his (Rossmann's) website and IMO his price of $21.99 for 30cc volume tube doesn't look 'too expensive' (maybe I'm wrong, I don't know) BUT, since I don't live in USA, shipping cost would 'kill the whole purpose' of getting it. I guess shipping from USA to europe is at least 20 bucks. (plus customs fee)... NO WAY!


Anyway, I checked Amtech website but I coudn't find tacky flux that Rossmann suggest (NC-559-V2-TF) listed on Amtech website (as Rossmann) already said, 'its not listed'.

http://www.inventecusa.com/tacky-flux.html

^ the only one from '559' serie which is listed is NC-559-ASM

They do have listed solder paste NC-559-V2 but not tacky flux (NC-559-V2-TF). At the other hand, there is a listed solder paste NC-559-ASM, along with already mantioned NC-559-ASM-TF (tacky flux)

http://www.inventecusa.com/amtech-data-sheets.html


So, I decided to contact Amtech directly and ask them do they really have a tacky flux which they sell under name NC-559-V2-TF, and where to buy them in europe (what are european authorized distributors).

I got a respond that they do produce that tacky flux (NC-559-V2-TF). She also said: "We do sell the NC-559-V2 TF to the Rossmann Repair Group". Then I was told that all their fluxes are already listed on their website. I thought, maybe I was blind.. 'lets check again'. And, again, there was NO tacky flux which I was looking for (NC-559-V2-TF) listed on their website. I also received a list of two website to check it for Amtech flux products, since they are 'closer to me'.


=========================================
Poland

Transfer Multisort Elektronik Sp.zo.o.
ul. Ustronna 41
93-350 Lodz
Poland
Ph: 48.42.645.7021
Fx: 48.42.640.0107
Web: www.tme.pl

=========================================
Russia

DCM-GROUP, LLC
Zubovsky Boulevard, 21-23,
room I, room 3,
119021 Moscow
Russia
Ph: +7 (495) 116-00-58
FX: +7 (495) 116-00-58
Web: esd-line.ru
=========================================

So... I decided to check russian site (esd-line.ru) and...I also sent them a message asking for the price and how much would it cost shippin to send it to my country. I got a reply from them, telling me that they only distribute in Russia and not EU.

I then checked tme.pl (tme.eu) and I got pizzed because on tme.eu, I coudn't find tacky flux that I'm looking for (NC-559-V2-TF) listed. tme.eu website list the flux like this:

NC-559-TF

^ so you're left to figureout for yoruself what is what.

maybe it's NC-559-V2-TF
or
maybe it's NC-559-ASM-TF

Here is the link of what search has found:


TME search results





So, when you click on 30cc (ANC559TF/30) and when the page opens, you see that price is $23.81 (or 20.32 €). BUT when you click on the image itself, you see it sais: NC-559-AS


I also checked other two products that search gave (for 10cc volume)

One is:
ANC559V2/10 (currently 0 quantity in stock)
and
ANC559TF

When you open a page for 'ANC559V2/10' (which has 0 in stock) you see there is no picture of the product.
When you open a page for 'ANC559TF' and when the page loads, it sais "AMTECH NC-559-AS". Also the address bar link has 'nc-559-as' in the link, like:

Code: [Select]

https://www.tme.eu/en/details/anc559tf/fluxes/amtech/nc-559-as/
Well, F*CK this!

======================

So, since I was confused, I sent another email as my reply to that nice lady from Amtech. I explained that russian site only distribute in russia, and that tme.eu doesn't have a tacky flux under name "NC-559-V2-TF". I told her that they only listed 'NC-559-TF' so I don't know if it is NC-559-ASM-TF or NC-559-V2-TF (which I'm looking for), and to make things even worse, once I click on the image I see the name of that image is 'NC-559-AS'.

So, she replied (since I already asked her about that) that Amtech do deal with private persons (not only with firms), and its not issue for them to send the product. The only requiremant is that the minimum order quantity for 10cc volume is 20 pcs, and for 30cc is 10 pcs.

Anyway, regarding my confusion at tme.pl (tme.eu) website, she said this: (now pay attention)

Thank you for your response.  First let me tell you that it is not a problem that you are a private person using our product and not associated with a company.  Please note that if you choose to order our tacky flux products, you will need to purchase the minimum order shipment quantity.  The minimum order shipment quantity for the NC-559-V2 10cc tacky flux syringes is 20.  The minimum order shipment quantity for the NC-559-V2 30cc tacky flux syringes is 10. Formulations cannot be combined to meet the minimum order shipment quantity.  You (the buyer) are responsible for all duties and taxes.

Second part of her reply was, what put some light on all this tacky flux naming mess:

The NC-559-V2 and NC-559-AS have the same formulation.  The NC-559-ASM has a slightly different formulation.
TME purchases the NC-559-AS TF from us which is the same formulation as the NC-559-V2.  Insat International purchases the NC-559-V2 TF from us.

So: NC-559-V2-TF = NC-559-AS-TF

^ both not listed on Amtech website (http://www.inventecusa.com/amtech-data-sheets.html) even though Amtech do have such product and do sell them. Why they don't list them on their site, I have no clue.

Here is the link to 30cc volume at tme.eu website: https://www.tme.eu/en/details/anc559tf_30/fluxes/amtech/


^image from tme page for 30cc tacky flux


And...

NC-559-ASM-TF 'has a slightly different formulation than NC-559-V2-TF (NC-559-AS-TF)


She also sent me few of their other european authorized distributors, so I'm sharing that here as well, so maybe we (the europeans) will finally have an easier way to buy it on our own continent


=========================================
Netherland

HDSA
Peeleik 15
5704AP Helmond
The Netherlands
Ph: 31.492430030
Fx: 31.492430032
eml: info [at] hdsa.nl

=========================================
Germany

JL Goslar
Im Schleeke 108
Goslar, D-38640
Germany
Ph: 49.53.21754221
Fx: 49.53.21754222
Web: www.elsold.de

=========================================
Great Britain

Insat International
1A Gateway Mews, Ringway
Bounds Green
London, N112UT
www.insatinternational.com

=========================================

^ for insatinternational.com, once you visit their site and click on the 'BGA Reworking tab' you get redirected to: https://www.bga-reworking.co.uk/ (thats the site others also noted as place where to buy original Amtech flux)


I hope this will also help other people from Europe while searching for Amtech authorized distributors. Thanks to polite lady from Amtech, now we have more information.

[RoGeorge]

TL; DR

I bought from China twice, about 3-4 months apart, from the same vendor:
- first time the "Freeshipping 2 pcs/lot No-clean Lead Free AMTECH Solder Flux Soldering Paste NC-559-ASM 10cc solder paste for $6.89 ($3.45 each)" the solder paste was translucent, no smell, incredibly high quality for the price, so I placed another order.
- in the second order the paste was slightly different, more opaque, nothing special, almost didn't liked it, but still usable.

[screwbreaker]

I've got the Amtech 559 tacky flux from TME, this one: https://www.tme.eu/it/details/anc559tf/fondenti/amtech/nc-559-as/

And this is what I've received:

the NC-559-AS-TF

I've also got this dispenser for this type of flux: https://it.aliexpress.com/item/10CC-Manually-single-liquid-dispensing-glue-gun-with-10cc-syringe-set-Liquid-glue-dispensing-needles-free/32642693516.html

It's very handy.

[tszaboo]

I use rosin cored solder, making additional flux unnecessary. The only time I use extra flux, is when I'm forced to use old components or boards which are badly oxidised.

You need flux for example QFN parts, reworking small parts, soldering anything below 0.65mm.
Multicore 425 flux is what I'm using. I've just checked the price at farnell, and wow this thing is expensive. Good thing it lasts almost forever. Screw expiration date.

[nanofrog]

...[snip]...someone could recommend a liquid flux as well, that would be perfect.

MG Chemicals 835 comes in hobbyist friendly sizes (125ml or 1L), is inexpensive, and is readily available in both the US and UK/EU from what I've seen.  Works very well IME.

Multiple methods of applying it, and they're generally inexpensive as well.  The most expensive I'm aware of is a genuine Bonkote refillable brush pen @ ~$16 - $20 if you can find it as a single (come in 5 packs, and it's up to the seller if they'll break them down). I eventually broke down and bought one, and now wonder how did I cope so long without it.    Do note these are heavily counterfeited in China, so if you're after one, you've been warned (seems the innards don't always work). 

Full international distributor's list for MG Chemicals. From what I can tell, Cicuit Specialists Europe has the lowest price @ 5.95GBP before VAT (here for the 125ml size bottle).

In regard to paste, I use the Kester TF741 and either 186 (RMA) or 1544 for liquid (CML Supply breaks some Kester products down into hobbyist/repair shop quantities). Oh, and they do ship internationally. Some eBay sellers as well, and when I'm in Orlando, I pick up 1544 from Skycraft Parts & Surplus.

[RoGeorge]

Bonkote refillable brush pen?

The same thing is used by painters, various producers, 10-20 times cheaper: "Refillable Water Brush Pen For Painting"
e.g. https://www.jetpens.com/blog/guide-to-water-brushes/pt/792

[nanofrog]

Bonkote refillable brush pen?

The same thing is used by painters, various producers, 10-20 times cheaper: "Refillable Water Brush Pen For Painting"
e.g. https://www.jetpens.com/blog/guide-to-water-brushes/pt/792

Interesting.  Never knew about these. Just need to find out what the bristles are made of (i.e. can handle alcohols and acetone used as flux solvents).

As per cost though, what I'm seeing on the Kuretake brush pens, they're perhaps only ~1/2 the cost or so of a single Bonkote (~$75 is for a 5 pack, which is how Bonkote sells them). Retailers can split the pack and sell them individually if they desire.

[Ian.M]

This looks interesting:
https://www.nonpaints.com/en/paint-pen-stone-chip-paint-touch-up-pen-empty
Its intended for car paint so should be resistant to flux solvents.
It has a combo of a needle tip applicator and a brush inside the lid.

[RoGeorge]

Probably the brush material is the same, but most of the water brush pens does not have a double chamber, like Bonkote.

Anyway, I just checked the prices, and there are nowhere so expensive as in $15-$20 for 1 pcs.
On Aliexpress they are less than $1.5/piece in 1 pcs, totally OK:
BONPEN BONKOTE BON-102 - 1 pcs $1.33, shipping included
BONPEN BONKOTE BON-102 - 1 pcs $1.37, shipping included

I have one from Aliexpress and is just fine. It works perfectly, just that I'm not a fan of liquid flux. I prefer the gel/paste flux.