Soldering Station: JBC CDB vs CDS - which one to get?

[jimjam]

JBC has two soldering stations, same price.

http://www.jbctools.com/cd-b-soldering-station-product-505-gama-10.html
http://www.jbctools.com/cd-s-precision-soldering-product-506-gama-10.html

I think I'm going to dive into electronics again and want to get a decent soldering iron, and I'm sold on JCB (based on dave's youtube video)

Question:
1. Which one to get for: normal through hole work, and possibly SMD work (I've never worked with SMD before)
2. Is the base basically the same with just a different tip / handle? Can't they be interchangeable, e.g. buy a CDB base unit / kit and later buy a CDS handle / tip to plug into the base?

Anything other that is cheaper but just as good? I like the sleep/hibernation since I mostly day dream rather than do soldering.

[digsys]

Unless you're doing mostly surface mount, the T245 has more tip options, including very fine s/mount tips. The T210 is just much
smaller and lighter. There are many tip options as well. You can interchange handles, including tweezers.
If you follow their links, you'll find master parts reference / inter-changeability charts. I have all the models and each has it's own strengths.
Unless you're wanting to save a huge amount, I wouldn't bother looking at other options. IMO, and many others, JBC is as good as you can get.
YMMV

[jimjam]

Thanks! Anyone knows where I can buy JBC stuff in Australia at the best price?

[kolonelkadat]

I would get the cdb
the cdb has 3x the wattage of the cds so presumably it has a different transformer and maybe circuitry.

Question:
1. Which one to get for: normal through hole work, and possibly SMD work (I've never worked with SMD before)
2. Is the base basically the same with just a different tip / handle?

[nanofrog]

Thanks! Anyone knows where I can buy JBC stuff in Australia at the best price?

Not sure about a local distributor, but you might want to check out janelonline.com. They're in the US, but sell internationally, so they offer the 230V unit.

As others have said, get the CD-B for the T245 iron (CD-2BC is the 230V version), as it's designed for general purpose work (great with SMD, save perhaps the smallest packages done under a microscope, where the T210 iron would be better suited). You'd actually be able to use either iron with each station (stated in the manual), just as is the case with their modular line. Both irons also fit the same stand, so you'd only need to get the second iron and suitable tips (iron is ~$60 last I checked).

Link to the CD-2BC (prices are even set for AUD). Unfortunately, it's currently out of stock, but that only means it will take 10-14 business days to ship instead of 1 or 2 (presume it goes out as a drop ship from JBC's warehouse instead of Janel's).

[digsys]

Thanks! Anyone knows where I can buy JBC stuff in Australia at the best price?

I buy mostly from Mektronics and sometimes from Oritech. Both have sales offers every now and then.
And you can definitely barter with Mektronics and maybe with Oritech. Maybe try a price match approach.

[Dago]

Unless you're doing mostly surface mount, the T245 has more tip options, including very fine s/mount tips. The T210 is just much
smaller and lighter. There are many tip options as well. You can interchange handles, including tweezers.
If you follow their links, you'll find master parts reference / inter-changeability charts. I have all the models and each has it's own strengths.
Unless you're wanting to save a huge amount, I wouldn't bother looking at other options. IMO, and many others, JBC is as good as you can get.
YMMV

I personally have both handles and they're fairly similar. The T210 is slightly smaller and has less tip options. Don't think you can go wrong with either one.

Btw. are you sure you can attach tweezers to a CDS or a CDB station? I understood you need a tweezer station for those...

Ps. I've been extremely happy with my JBC. One of the most expensive electronics related items I've ever bought but worth every penny.

[braddrew0]

Hi Guys,


Sorry for dragging up an old post but I'm in a similar situation. I'm looking to purchase either CD-B or CD-S. I will be using it predominately (>95%) for delicate SMD work. Right now I can get the CD-B plus the 210 handle for a bit over $100 cheaper than the CD-S. This seems to be a no-brainer (best of both worlds) but I'm wondering if there's any negatives to using the 210 handle with the CD-B station? Given that it's 3x more powerful, will this be an issue on finer pitch soldering? I should also state I'm planning on using the 0.1mm tip for the 210 (C210020 - http://www.jbctools.com/c210020-cartridge-conical-o-01-product-237-category-9-menu-70.html).


Thanks!


Brad

[wblock]

These appear to be the same base station, the only difference being which iron is included.  The "output peak power" appears to be based on the iron.  The stations have the same size, same weight, and same fuses.  The temperature is regulated, so that is no problem.

My concern would be whether the iron holder works for both sizes.  It's hard to tell from the photos whether the T210 handle has a smaller contact ring than the T245.  Probably not, since there is only one part number for the CD-E tool holder.

[Dago]

These appear to be the same base station, the only difference being which iron is included.  The "output peak power" appears to be based on the iron.  The stations have the same size, same weight, and same fuses.  The temperature is regulated, so that is no problem.

My concern would be whether the iron holder works for both sizes.  It's hard to tell from the photos whether the T210 handle has a smaller contact ring than the T245.  Probably not, since there is only one part number for the CD-E tool holder.

Yes the station is identical and both handles fit the same holder.

[braddrew0]

Perfect, thanks guys - that makes it a no brainer


Brad

[flolic]

As Dago said, you can use T245 and T210 handles on that station without any problem.

Do you absolutely need tip that small (C210020)? I have similar size tip (C210009) and find it marginaly useful for anything but smallest components on flex PCB.

[braddrew0]

Hi flolic,

Sorry, I wasn't very clear - the C210020 wouldn't be for everyday use, but that would be as small as I was planning to go. I was more worried that maybe if the base station was a higher power, it could damage a tip that fine but it seems like that's not the case. Planned use for that tip is fine connectors and fine pitch QFP.

Thanks


Brad

[braddrew0]

Hi Guys,


Just wanted to say thanks to everyone here - I ended up going with the C245 only and bought the 3mm tip. I know if I need/want to go smaller now, I'll have that option.


Thanks! 

[SteveyG]

Looks like I'm too late. We have CDBs and CDSs at work and they are thoroughly unimpressive compared to the competition.    The Pace and Metcals are IMO much better especially the thermal response

[Dago]

Looks like I'm too late. We have CDBs and CDSs at work and they are thoroughly unimpressive compared to the competition.    The Pace and Metcals are IMO much better especially the thermal response

I've used a couple different Metcals and in my experience the JBCs blow them out of the water. Also saw some temperature regulation measurements somewhere which also agreed. Never used any Paces though.

Mechanically the Metcals were also very disappointing with a very cheap feeling (and larger, compared to JBCs) cast plastic handle and the handle mount which didn't even seemed to be designed for the handle (handle could move like 45 degrees each way!). The cables were also some rather thick super sticky material which constantly caught on the table edge and everything else. Swapping cartridges was also a pain compared to JBCs.

[SteveyG]

Mechanically the Metcals were also very disappointing with a very cheap feeling (and larger, compared to JBCs) cast plastic handle and the handle mount which didn't even seemed to be designed for the handle (handle could move like 45 degrees each way!). The cables were also some rather thick super sticky material which constantly caught on the table edge and everything else. Swapping cartridges was also a pain compared to JBCs.

That sounds like the older models. The new ones are metal handpieces and much better stands. Not sure about the temperature regulation though - I've had mine on a calibrator and it doesn't drift.

[digsys]

I'd have to agree with Dago. I gave our Pace and Metcals away, and they rarely get used. We have dozens of JBCs, and they work damn hard.
They are lasting years and rarely EVER let us down, and range of tips is awesome.

[GreyWoolfe]

Looks like I'm too late. We have CDBs and CDSs at work and they are thoroughly unimpressive compared to the competition.    The Pace and Metcals are IMO much better especially the thermal response

I've used a couple different Metcals and in my experience the JBCs blow them out of the water. Also saw some temperature regulation measurements somewhere which also agreed. Never used any Paces though.

Mechanically the Metcals were also very disappointing with a very cheap feeling (and larger, compared to JBCs) cast plastic handle and the handle mount which didn't even seemed to be designed for the handle (handle could move like 45 degrees each way!). The cables were also some rather thick super sticky material which constantly caught on the table edge and everything else. Swapping cartridges was also a pain compared to JBCs.

I have a Metcal MX-500P and a Hakko FX-951.  I don't think the RM-3E is cheap feeling at all, I find it very comfortable to use.  There is some play in the stand and the Hakko has the same amount of play-to me, it makes it easy in, easy out and neither wand has fallen out or has had any issues.  I have no issue with the cables on the RM-3E or the Talon being sticky and catching anything.  I have never used JBC or Pace, but I think the changing of the tips on the Metcal is quite easy, in fact, easier than the Hakko.

[SteveyG]

I have never used JBC or Pace, but I think the changing of the tips on the Metcal is quite easy, in fact, easier than the Hakko.

Just pull the old one out and push in the new one - this is no different to the JBC, so I'm not sure I understand Dago's comment about that 

[Dago]

I have never used JBC or Pace, but I think the changing of the tips on the Metcal is quite easy, in fact, easier than the Hakko.

Just pull the old one out and push in the new one - this is no different to the JBC, so I'm not sure I understand Dago's comment about that 

At least with the ones I've used you have to use some "potholder" (usually some piece of silicon annoyingly hanging from the soldering iron cable) and two hands to remove the cartridge. With JBC you only need one hand (just put the cartridge end to a slot in cartridge holder and pull the handle).

[braddrew0]

It's light years ahead of my old Weller and the quality is good enough that I can pass it down to my son one day (if it's something he's interested in) - glad I made the purchase! 

On a different note, how do you all store your tips?

[GreyWoolfe]

It's light years ahead of my old Weller and the quality is good enough that I can pass it down to my son one day (if it's something he's interested in) - glad I made the purchase! 

On a different note, how do you all store your tips?

For my Metcal, the wand holder has holes molded in to hold the tips.  The Hakko FX-951 came with a separate tip holder.

[wblock]

JBC sells metal tip holders/stands: http://www.jbctools.com/cataleg.php?search=sc-b&x=0&y=0.

The price is eye-watering, of course.  Making something like that is probably not too hard.  It's odd that the metal parts do not have a wire to connect to a stand, like the built-in tip changers.

[nanofrog]

On a different note, how do you all store your tips?

FWIW, I store the additional retainer tubes with the tips I want to use in the tip holder holes in my stands (Weller gear). Makes it quick and easy to install the tip I want (pre-select the tips I need when starting a board).

The rest of the unused tips are stored in Altoids tins so I don't lose them (the LT series in an Altoids Smalls tin; to give you an idea of size, I can fit at least 50 LT series tips in one of these little tins  ). I'd probably only be able to fit ~35 of the NT series tips in a standard Altoids tin (they don't offer that many profiles in this series, so it's a non-issue  ).

I might make something out of a bit of aluminum one of these days, but not particularly motivated to do so (too likely I'd dump it over and lose tips in the process).