EEVblog #1112 - Vintage Computer Warehouse Diving

[EEVblog]

The Australian Computer Museum Societies' warehouse has to shut down next week, so Dave goes warehouse diving.
If you know of someone willing to donate warehouse space in Sydney, please let me know.

#1111 will be coming soon!
Be sure to subscribe to EEVblog2 in order to see some of the teardowns: https://www.youtube.com/eevblog2

[bsfeechannel]

Dave, I can't believe you missed the Olivetti Programma 101, at 2:40 min, the first desktop computer evva! Released in 1965.


Source: Wikipedia.

Man, I'd give an arm and a leg to have the chance to be in front of one of those landmarks of computing.

[jonovid]

Dave start your own EEVblog Museum
maybe crowdfunding can help pay for it,
modern era, recent history is somewhat undervalued,in the neverending rush for new technology. 

[chickenHeadKnob]

Dave start your own EEVblog Museum
maybe crowdfunding can help pay for it,
modern era, recent history is somewhat undervalued,in the neverending rush for new technology. 

Except Dave's idea of "curating" is to dremel or otherwise dismantle the items and then leave the bits in a box, or dumpster. Kind of like letting a pervert run a kindergarten.

I don't understand this computer nostalgia thing anyway. I come from the very last generation of programmers forced to use punched cards and  FORTRAN IV in high school and then witched to dumb terminals hanging off of a mainframe in University. Good riddance to that whole steaming pile!

[barbeque]

How bad is the battery on that Amiga 2000 going to be? Hopefully it didn't leak into the RAM considering it was on its side.

[Jr460]

Wow at 5:15.   Last time I touched one of those was in the spring of 1981.   An Olivetti P6060.

[Brumby]

My attention was caught at the very beginning.  The TRS80 Model II.  I actually helped someone choose and finance the purchase of one of those and a printer for around $6K.  On key factor was that the 8" floppy could store 1MB.

I provided them with half a dozen old IBM mainframe floppies that I'd punched for compatibility with the TRS80.

[bsfeechannel]

Except Dave's idea of "curating" is to dremel or otherwise dismantle the items and then leave the bits in a box, or dumpster. Kind of like letting a pervert run a kindergarten.

Well, museums do not only preserve things, they also study them. Sometimes it is necessary to take an original item apart to do that. Be it a dinosaur bone, a pharaoh mummy or a Commodore Amiga. The accumulated knowledge resulting from the study is also part of the preservation.

I don't understand this computer nostalgia thing anyway. I come from the very last generation of programmers forced to use punched cards and  FORTRAN IV in high school and then witched to dumb terminals hanging off of a mainframe in University. Good riddance to that whole steaming pile!

That's pretty much the story of my life too, but it's one thing to feel nostalgic (I don't want to go back to punching cards and dumb terminals), it's another thing to be passionate about preserving an authentic piece of history.

[EEVblog]

Man, I'd give an arm and a leg to have the chance to be in front of one of those landmarks of computing.

I want your first born too.

[Halcyon]

Dave, I spoke to John from ACMS today. I've offered them my garage. I would hate to see this stuff scrapped. I haven't watched your video yet, but was there much left to move? He mentioned he has an IBM 1401 in there still.

[Retromat]

OMG!!!!!!
Tell me you saved the Amiga 2000!!!
If you need any backinfos on it then pls contact us, we dedicated our lives especially to the Amiga 2000 Series the past years!

Depending how good they took care of it you might need todo what we had done :

[BravoV]

The 1st thing came out of my mind when at beginning of the video, must be plenty of IBM M keyboards in there. 

[dexters_lab]

what a cool place, would love to spend some hours looking through all that

i hope they can get most/all of it stored somewhere and keep it from the recyclers and all that documentation could be so useful to someone brave enough to restore one of those old machines

[Fungus]

Awesome! You never know what's in those old buildings you drive past.

But ... mostly worthless junk, I suspect the good stuff already found a 'home'.

(Do they make people sign a receipt for the stuff they take or will it all end up on eBay?)

The 1st thing came out of my mind when at beginning of the video, must be plenty of IBM M keyboards in there. 

Yeah, I'd have been looking for nice keyboards, too.

[PinheadBE]

I wish i was able to help.

I think that all those technical documentation should be saved.  Once scanned and put online it could be invaluable, and will take no more (physical) space for storage.

(PDP-11 schematics.... OMG ! )

[Fungus]

I think that all those technical documentation should be saved.  Once scanned and put online it could be invaluable, and will take no more (physical) space for storage.

(PDP-11 schematics.... OMG ! )

I was thinking that, too, but ... it's already been done: https://www.google.com/search?q=pdp+11+schematic

[EEVblog]

Dave, I spoke to John from ACMS today. I've offered them my garage. I would hate to see this stuff scrapped. I haven't watched your video yet, but was there much left to move? He mentioned he has an IBM 1401 in there still.

Yes, tons more stuff, practically the same as yesterday. There was a shipping container there today and more shipping containers on the way until it's all gone. Another video coming shortly.

[EEVblog]

(Do they make people sign a receipt for the stuff they take or will it all end up on eBay?)

Nope, people just walked out with stuff.
I suspect a fair bit will end up on ebay.

The 1st thing came out of my mind when at beginning of the video, must be plenty of IBM M keyboards in there. 

I just saw some older IBM ones.

[EEVblog]

[Fungus]

I just saw some older IBM ones.

Maybe they've already been snarfed.

[DrGeoff]

The Concurrent Computer Mainframes and Kennedy tape drives behind them brought back memories of the 1980's.

[madires]

As a former owner of several Amigas including a 2000 I remember the "Reference Manuals". Back then I've paid about DM260 (bargain) for the complete set at an Amiga fair. Another cult computer was the SparcStation series from Sun. We used lot's of them as servers in the early days of commercial ISPs.

[Fungus]

As a former owner of several Amigas including a 2000 I remember the "Reference Manuals".

Back in the 80s I used to know the Amiga hardware reference manual by heart. Been there, programmed that.

[bsfeechannel]

Man, I'd give an arm and a leg to have the chance to be in front of one of those landmarks of computing.

I want your first born too.

That can be arranged.

Meanwhile, since I need to swim two oceans to get to Sydney, it would be nice if some of the old mechanical and electromechanic calculators ended up in the possession of John Wolff's and his amazing web museum of calculating machines. He's based in Melbourne, which is a little nearer than where I live. I've already contacted him, in case he hasn't been yet.

[Quarlo Klobrigney]

If they do end up scrapping the stoof, there's a fortune in gold in them thar hills.
Gold reclamation from boards that put it on thick in those days.

[james_s]

Wish I could help but it's on the wrong side of the world. I love old technology and hate to see any more of it get scrapped. A lot of that stuff is already so rare, there's a Living Computer Museum in Seattle which is really unique because they have the old stuff up and running and you can play with it.

For those of us not old enough to have ever used a punch card, teletype machine, or a mainframe, it's a really unique experience. People who relied on this stuff when it was current are probably not going to understand but to someone who missed that whole era it's completely new and different.

[TerraHertz]

Dave, I can't believe you missed the Olivetti Programma 101, at 2:40 min, the first desktop computer evva! Released in 1965.


Source: Wikipedia.

Man, I'd give an arm and a leg to have the chance to be in front of one of those landmarks of computing.

I'll see if it's still there when I go back. I'm running out of space at the TeraHertzery, but can probably squeeze it in. Then if you take a holiday in Oz, you can see the Olivetti for free.
The deal is that some things they prefer to keep, and stuff taken away remains theirs, and they ask for a list (eventually) of stuff taken. But chances of them asking for things back is very low. Meanwhile, what doesn't get moved out by end of next week will get bulldozed.

So far I've filled up the TerraHertzmobile three times (and one trailer load - an IBM 026 card punch.)

I'm taking lots of pics there, all the better to brain-explode a friend of mine. He's a keen computer collector, but in Melbourne. Ha ha sucks for him.  (May sound cold, but I know he's exceeded his practical storage space already.)

Not sure where to begin with pics of stuff I've scored become custodian of. How about this: I found a dusty brown briefcase, with a combination lock. Took it as a surprise to enjoy opening at home. Home, the lock was an easy crack. Opened the case. Oh, it's a portable microfiche reader. Annnd... there are two packs of microfiche. OMG... A COMPLETE set of DEC PDP 11 user and service documentation.
The reader needed some tlc. Disassembled, removed decayed urethane foam, cleaned everything including optics path. It works.

[james_s]

That's so cool! I remember using a microfiche at the library to browse archives of old electronics magazines when I was a kid. I don't recall when they went away, maybe mid 90s? It's one of those things that was everywhere, then it wasn't.

[Brumby]

Nice to see that microfiche reader receive some TLC and well done on that 026 punch (I think I can remember how to prepare a program card for those things.)

I've been tossing up whether I should drop in myself, but the space I have available is bordering on the negative.  Two items the size of that microfiche reader would probably be all that I could safely store without a thorough reorg of the garage.  That's a job that needs to be done, but I wouldn't be able to get far enough into that to be able to make room before time ran out.

[sean0118]

I was there for sometime today, they are starting to load up shipping containers which will continue during the week. I think they would like some help. 


Nice work on the IBM 026 card punch TerraHertz, I think I saw two more there today? Lots of cool stuff, hope it's all displayed one day.

[jonovid]

this only get's fully appreciated in the fullness of time. when its discovered, you have the only known
example in existence. because all others got destroyed in ignorance.

[TerraHertz]

I was there today (Sat morning. sean0118 did I meet you? I have a bushy grey beard.) The Olivetti 101 was gone, darnit. Not sure if Dave or someone else later took it. Dave?

The Amiga manuals I got. I found more treasure there today too. It's AMAZING how much more gets revealed as the pile is whittled down (a little.)

The big shipping container is being filled exclusively with boxes of documentation from a back room. Separately, the company that runs Sydney Vivid has a huge truck and are providing warehouse space in Milperra. They have taken out a lot of large items, but it's still barely made a dent.
Today there were a lot more people sifting. It will be interesting to see how many honestly provide lists of what they took, and actually store it for eventual return.

In general, items of high historical worth (like the remaining IBM 026 card punches) are reserved by the museum, not to be taken.
That said, they admit they probably can't get it all out in time.

I've got my name on the best (most complete, clean) 026 punch if they're unable to remove it themselves in time. And a few other items. By agreement with the ACMS guys. The 026 I took already is in very poor condition, probably not restorable to working. But I'd really like to get one working.
Speaking of which, net hunting finds manuals including service for the later IBM 028 card punch. But bloody nothing on the 026. Even sites talking about restoring 028 punch units mention no service docs for the 026 are known of.
I don't suppose anyone here has some IBM 026 documentation?

The most frustrating experience (very typical there) is when you find some really amazing item, but it's missing critical elements. Egs:
* Tek 4014-1 vector graphics terminal - but it's just the top half, missing the pedestal which contains all the communications & control electronics.
* HP 9835A programmable desktop calc - but it's missing the (unique) display monitor.
* Facit 4047 paper tape punch unit - but missing some kind of front cover & chad bin, apparently with controls on it. To judge by the unconnected ribbon cable. [Edit: actually the missing part is a tape reader and the chad bin. http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/facit/Facit_4046_4047_Punch_Reader_Technical_Description_Edition_3_Oct86.pdf   Oh, that is SO annoying. How the heck does that get separated? ]

Sigh.

But sometimes, gold! For eg a complete HP 9030A programmable desktop calc. Near perfect condition, clean, dust cover, a set of manuals, the printer, some rolls of paper, and most amazingly the cable between printer and calc, with the unobtainium plugs.

[madires]

Any bets on a leaky NiCd battery in the Amiga 2000?

[Towger]

The Olivetti 101 was gone, darnit. Not sure if Dave or someone else later took it. Dave?

He went back and got it.

[sean0118]

I was there today (Sat morning. sean0118 did I meet you? I have a bushy grey beard.)

Maybe, I was wearing an Amp Hour tshirt. 

I'm really short on space already, so all I grabbed was a very early RCA transistor databook. I'll scan it and return it once they get a new place, can't find any PDFs of this databook online either.

[TerraHertz]

I was there today (Sat morning. sean0118 did I meet you? I have a bushy grey beard.)

Maybe, I was wearing an Amp Hour tshirt. 

I don't remember. So many people and I don't tend to read t-shirts. Most people I chat with there, I swap contact details. Since just by being there, demonstrates common interests.

I'm really short on space already, so all I grabbed was a very early RCA transistor databook. I'll scan it and return it once they get a new place, can't find any PDFs of this databook online either.

Ha ha! I'm still amazed to see & hear what people are finding. I'd definitely have grabbed that if I'd seen it. I have a large data book collection. Scanning is good, but I think it's important to keep physical copies of old tech info too.
I'm quite sad that crate of old Tektronix manuals Dave showed in the video, seems to have vanished.

[(*steve*)]

The HP150 is the PC.  All it's missing are the disk drives (and keyboard) the disk drives connect via the HP-IB.

I used these from the time they came out.  Yes, the holes in the bottom of the screen filled up with enough dust to make the screen unworkable.  The solution was to blast out the dust with canned air then place a strip of clear adhesive tape over the bottom holes.  The later HP 150B used IR transparent plastic.

Yes, you could use the HP150 as a terminal, and there were special extensions to the HP control codes to access the touch screen.

This little beastie was faster than the regular IBM PCs, and with a set of dual floppies I think it came in at something around $8000 when relatively new.

[sean0118]

Ha ha! I'm still amazed to see & hear what people are finding. I'd definitely have grabbed that if I'd seen it. I have a large data book collection. Scanning is good, but I think it's important to keep physical copies of old tech info too.
I'm quite sad that crate of old Tektronix manuals Dave showed in the video, seems to have vanished.

I have a collection of databoosk too, mostly more recent, but even some of those are not available online, such as those from Philips. I really should post up a list of what I have and scan them when I have time.

We have heaps of Tektronix user manuals at work which I'm keeping my eye on. 

[Quarlo Klobrigney]

Yikes! A TI Silent 700! I used up many a roll of thermal paper on that guy sending and receiving environmental monitoring reports to and from HQ in the day.
The off hours were spent perusing various BBS's, all on paper because there was no monitor.

[TerraHertz]

Yikes! A TI Silent 700! I used up many a roll of thermal paper on that guy sending and receiving environmental monitoring reports to and from HQ in the day.
The off hours were spent perusing various BBS's, all on paper because there was no monitor.

Fanged it.
Sorry about poor quality pic. Just one of the quick 'stock take' pics while unpacking my car at home.

It has a lot of urethane foam to exorcise

We have heaps of Tektronix user manuals at work which I'm keeping my eye on. 

It's about time they disposed of those old paper relics, don't you think? I'd be happy to assist in their removal. 
But seriously, please see if you can grasp the nettle. Preservation of this stuff is rapidly becoming critical, given that one of the two major manuals archives in the USA shut down (and dumpstered the great bulk of their collection.)
By 'heaps' what sort of number do you mean?

[rsjsouza]

But sometimes, gold! For eg a complete HP 9030A programmable desktop calc. Near perfect condition, clean, dust cover, a set of manuals, the printer, some rolls of paper, and most amazingly the cable between printer and calc, with the unobtainium plugs.

That is a great score!!! 

[james_s]

It would be great if all the paper manuals could be scanned at some point too. It's getting harder all the time to justify keeping a mountain of paper manuals, but in digital form a whole room full will fit on a micro SD card.

[aargee]

The ABC has a news article on it...
http://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2018-08-07/australian-computer-museum-society-risk-from-bulldozers/10077580
It looks like they trying to get some traction in finding a curator, but if it has already been ‘cherry picked’  for the valuable on eBay stuff, I’m not sure the collection would be complete enough to be standalone.

[wilfred]

It would be great if all the paper manuals could be scanned at some point too. It's getting harder all the time to justify keeping a mountain of paper manuals, but in digital form a whole room full will fit on a micro SD card.

I scanned a few hundred magazines using an EPSON DS-520 document scanner. with all the enhancement and OCR switches turned on it could do a magazine in 20 minutes at 300dpi. It was pretty full on for two weeks.

I was amazed at how reliable it was and never missed a page. It would stop if two pages fed together which was rare. I found it easier to just restart from the beginning. Two pages usually got stuck because I cut the spine of the magazines so the auto feed could be used. If I inadvertantly left two pages joined a bit the machine just couldn't separate them.

I am glad I did it but I wish I hadn't destroyed the magazines now since reading this thread. I could have found a proper home for them. But I bought 20 years on Ebay for $5.50 so obviously no-one else wanted them.

[snoopy]

The Australian Computer Museum Societies' warehouse has to shut down next week, so Dave goes warehouse diving.
If you know of someone willing to donate warehouse space in Sydney, please let me know.

#1111 will be coming soon!
Be sure to subscribe to EEVblog2 in order to see some of the teardowns: https://www.youtube.com/eevblog2

Hey Dave. It's been reported on "World Today" on ABC radio today !! Lets hope the government or some philanthropists who are interested in our computing history chip in instead of sinking money into building yuppy flats !

http://www.abc.net.au/radio/programs/worldtoday/

cheers

[james_s]

It would be great if all the paper manuals could be scanned at some point too. It's getting harder all the time to justify keeping a mountain of paper manuals, but in digital form a whole room full will fit on a micro SD card.

I scanned a few hundred magazines using an EPSON DS-520 document scanner. with all the enhancement and OCR switches turned on it could do a magazine in 20 minutes at 300dpi. It was pretty full on for two weeks.

I was amazed at how reliable it was and never missed a page. It would stop if two pages fed together which was rare. I found it easier to just restart from the beginning. Two pages usually got stuck because I cut the spine of the magazines so the auto feed could be used. If I inadvertantly left two pages joined a bit the machine just couldn't separate them.

I am glad I did it but I wish I hadn't destroyed the magazines now since reading this thread. I could have found a proper home for them. But I bought 20 years on Ebay for $5.50 so obviously no-one else wanted them.
[/quote]


I think it's worth destroying one set of magazines in order to build a digital archive. Once archived then numerous people can enjoy them and they will not deteriorate further. Otherwise given enough time the magazines would fall to pieces anyway. It would be different if it was a very rare printing, but for the most part magazines were printed by the tens of thousands and many are not particularly rare.

Seems like the sort of task that one could idly do while watching TV or something.

[sean0118]

We have heaps of Tektronix user manuals at work which I'm keeping my eye on. 

It's about time they disposed of those old paper relics, don't you think? I'd be happy to assist in their removal. 
But seriously, please see if you can grasp the nettle. Preservation of this stuff is rapidly becoming critical, given that one of the two major manuals archives in the USA shut down (and dumpstered the great bulk of their collection.)
By 'heaps' what sort of number do you mean?

Probably something like 30-40, not really heaps I guess, but we have non-Tektronix manuals too, so probably 100-200 total. I should really have a good look through them, are there any Tektronix manuals which are now unobtainable?

[pamperchu]

The most frustrating experience (very typical there) is when you find some really amazing item, but it's missing critical elements. Egs:
* Tek 4014-1 vector graphics terminal - but it's just the top half, missing the pedestal which contains all the communications & control electronics.
...


see if someone will send it back home, to the tektronix museum, in Beaverton Oregon.... or just send it to my house, 3 blocks away ^__^

im working on building a computer for a smaller tektronix DVST, 603a.

[EEVblog]

Hey Dave. It's been reported on "World Today" on ABC radio today !! Lets hope the government or some philanthropists who are interested in our computing history chip in instead of sinking money into building yuppy flats !
http://www.abc.net.au/radio/programs/worldtoday/

Nice!
Seems like it was video, but I can only see an audio podcast version?

[snoopy]

Hey Dave. It's been reported on "World Today" on ABC radio today !! Lets hope the government or some philanthropists who are interested in our computing history chip in instead of sinking money into building yuppy flats !
http://www.abc.net.au/radio/programs/worldtoday/

Nice!
Seems like it was video, but I can only see an audio podcast version?

Just audio I think.

Maybe the folks from Atlassin can incorporate a computer Museum in their new Silicon Valley style precinct they want to setup in Sydney

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/nsw-government-atlassian-australias-silicon-valley-sydney-2018-8

cheers

[DrGeoff]

No Microbees?
A classic of the Australian Computer History from the 1980's.

[Brumby]

I have an opportunity to swing by tomorrow (Thursday) morning.

Can anyone tell me if they are still clearing stuff out?

[TerraHertz]

I have an opportunity to swing by tomorrow (Thursday) morning.

Can anyone tell me if they are still clearing stuff out?

I was there on Tuesday to pick up some unwanted metal shelving. They are making great progress, with at least a container-load a day going. Not much left, and they might actually get all the worthwhile stuff out in time.

[Brumby]

Thank you.

Some shelving might be useful - it could even allow me to take some items and be able to house them.

I'll drop in and see what there is to see.

[Halcyon]

I was there this evening and picked up a car load of items to preserve. I would have liked to have grabbed more but I can only fit so much into a sedan. It was lovely to meet the guys, a lot of great stories. One guy was there from country NSW somewhere, had travelled a long way to help out. 

It's looking bare compared to when Dave visited last week but there is still a lot of stuff to move. There are some old mainframes out the back which will probably need a shipping container of their own.

The bulldozers start on Saturday.

Their collection is absolutely phenomenal, never have I seen such rare items in one room. Their plan is to get some kind of hands-on computing museum up and running in NSW sometime in the future, however it's likely to be regional/country due to the cost of premises anywhere near Sydney.

[Brumby]

I hope to be able to borrow a station wagon.  That's going to have more room in it than I have in the garage - but I have this knack of finding space.   

[TerraHertz]

... the Olivetti Programma 101, at 2:40 min, the first desktop computer evva! Released in 1965.


Source: Wikipedia.

Man, I'd give an arm and a leg to have the chance to be in front of one of those landmarks of computing.

More on that. They were able to determine where it went. A restorer down the coast. So it's hopefully going to be treated well, and eventually come back to the ACMS.

Now here's the amusing part. Every day I went there, there was a different set of pallets of random boxes of supposedly low grade junk (magazines, cables, etc) out the front in the parking area. They had to move these out of the entrance passageway, to get into the building.
I and everyone else rummaged a bit in these piles. Gradually they diminished.
Tonight I've been going through a few boxes of stuff I saved from there. Guess what I just found?
The manuals for the Olivetti Programma 101. Looks like a full set.

How lucky was that? Those piles were as close to trash as can be, without actually being in a dumpster. Chances these manuals would have gone forever, were way higher than 50%.

I'll let them know.
bsfeechannel, since you knew of the 101, do you know if all these manuals exist online?
If not I can scan the thin ones. The thick ones need an edge scanner.
Hmm, the 'Program Forms' sheets are quite different to these: https://www.oldcalculatormuseum.com/a-p101form.html
Most of the form sheets in this booklet are used (hand writing in soft pencil) but there's a few at the back still blank.
So here's a hi-res scan. A4 sheet, 400dpi, 16-grayscale PNG

[Towger]

More on that. They were able to determine where it went. A restorer down the coast. So it's hopefully going to be treated well, and eventually come back to the ACMS.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=22185.msg1721621.msg#1721621

[Brumby]

Well, it was an interesting trip down memory lane.  My details were recorded and I've taken away a carload for safekeeping.  It wasn't much, but it was something.

Their intention is to not lose anything, but they really need bodies.  Even if you have no storage to offer, anyone who can give a hand moving stuff into containers that are on site would be very welcome.



Now ... to rearrange the garage.

[bsfeechannel]

More on that. They were able to determine where it went. A restorer down the coast. So it's hopefully going to be treated well, and eventually come back to the ACMS.

Meno male! But I hoped Dave, you or someone else in the forum could get it and show us more details about it.

Now here's the amusing part. Every day I went there, there was a different set of pallets of random boxes of supposedly low grade junk (magazines, cables, etc) out the front in the parking area. They had to move these out of the entrance passageway, to get into the building.
I and everyone else rummaged a bit in these piles. Gradually they diminished.
Tonight I've been going through a few boxes of stuff I saved from there. Guess what I just found?
The manuals for the Olivetti Programma 101. Looks like a full set.

How lucky was that? Those piles were as close to trash as can be, without actually being in a dumpster. Chances these manuals would have gone forever, were way higher than 50%.

I'll let them know.

bsfeechannel, since you knew of the 101, do you know if all these manuals exist online?

Unfortunately I don't. But, man, what a score!
 
Here's a promotional video for the Programma 101. This beast was way ahead of its time.

[TerraHertz]

More on that. They were able to determine where it went. A restorer down the coast. So it's hopefully going to be treated well, and eventually come back to the ACMS.

Meno male! But I hoped Dave, you or someone else in the forum could get it and show us more details about it.

It's curious. Dave posted he had it, but the ACMS guys reiterate they have a record of it going to some other guy.
I'm bearing in mind that things were pretty chaotic and they may be wrong. Or perhaps there were two Olivetti Programmer 101's there? Anyway, Dave's one should get a showing on the forum eventually.

I was there on Friday. The actual bulldozer start day is Monday, ACMS still has Saturday and Sunday to work, and there is very little remaining to be moved. (pic 1) They have achieved the near-impossible. I'm amazed.

Well that was a busy two weeks. I'm still doing preliminary evaluation and urgent restoration chores on the stuff I got. I should start a 'post your ACMS finds and restorations' thread over in Projects.

Hey, you know about not putting magnets near floppy disks, right? Well what's the equivalent of evil magnets for punched paper tape?
A: Evil rubber bands. Never ever store that concertina-folded variety of paper tape with rubber bands. Two boxes of old paper tapes among my treasures turned out to have been put away years ago with rubber bands around all the tape blocks. Urrrgh! (pic 2) That took several sticky hours to rectify.

But in general, I'm hoping that in a few more days I can get back to the urgent  project 'tree' I was in the middle of when I got an email notification about the ACMS situation two weeks ago. After that I'll deal with the ACMS stuff one item at a time.

[TerraHertz]

You don't think "Vintage Computing" would be a better place? I'd suggest not mixing everything into one big thread.

Hmm, for listing pics of what people have, one big thread would be best. A handy index for locating things.
But for detailed restoration projects, yes, separate threads. In Vintage.

Museum's have very specific requirements for what restoration is appropriate. Sometimes preserving the original patina is better and tampering with that is ill advised. Preventing loss and further degradation might just be sufficient for now.

I'm aware of all this. It also depends on the rarity of an item. For instance a couple of boxes I have are relics from the CIRRUS computer project, University of Adelaide, 1959-1962. Those are absolutely 'don't touch'.
Most other things I have are common enough that the best approach is to just clean off the dust & grime (that warehouse space was filthy, next to a highway, flaking concrete ceiling), check for urgent issues like Ni-Cad batteries and urethane foam, and where it's feasible see if can be restored to working.
The biggest and most ambitious restoration for me, would be the IBM 026 card punch machine, that is in an extremely poor state. Missing and broken parts, totally filthy & corroded, it's a tragic sight.

Then there's data recovery. Quite a bit to do here. For eg several boxes of programs on punched tape, boxes of microfiche, an Intel development system for '51 series micros, complete with the software... Lots to catalog and compare against archives to see what isn't already online.

Incidentally my work will be in ongoing communication with the ACMS, as a restorer. They don't have enough people capable of electronics/mechanical restoration.

[Brumby]

The biggest and most ambitious restoration for me, would be the IBM 026 card punch machine, that is in an extremely poor state. Missing and broken parts, totally filthy & corroded, it's a tragic sight.

I saw an IBM 059 verifier when I was there on Thursday.  I couldn't check out the condition very closely, but it was dirty and missing a cover panel next to the card hopper.  It would be good to get that next to the card punch.  It would be even nicer if they had an IBM 029 card punch next to it as it has the same styling of keyboard.

That area is amazingly clear compared to when I was there.  They did have a couple of back rooms, but they seemed to contain larger pieces which would be quicker to clear, as long as they had the manpower and destinations.

I still have to photograph the items I took and email them.  I had to empty the car and stash them quickly, so I'll have to get onto that.

[TerraHertz]

I saw an IBM 059 verifier when I was there on Thursday.  I couldn't check out the condition very closely, but it was dirty and missing a cover panel next to the card hopper.  It would be good to get that next to the card punch.  It would be even nicer if they had an IBM 029 card punch next to it as it has the same styling of keyboard.

They had three 026 punches, and one of the latter (transistors) 029 punch. The 026s were in varying condition: one excellent, clean and no missing parts that I could see. One moderate condition, fairly clean but missing pedestal back panel and chad hopper. The 3rd is terrible - and of course that's the one I have. I was hoping the best one would still be there on Friday. They were OK with me taking it if it was, but unfortunately for me the Sydney Vivid guys had cleared out that area to their warehouse in Milperra on Thursday.

I've always wanted to get an old card punch going. Learning the 026 is valve-driven made it more interesting. But the one I have... not sure if restoration will be possible. I'd have to make quite a few replacement bits, and without a manual or comparison unit that's a problem.

That area is amazingly clear compared to when I was there.  They did have a couple of back rooms, but they seemed to contain larger pieces which would be quicker to clear, as long as they had the manpower and destinations.

The large backroom that contained documents and mainframes, is completely cleared. It was a coldroom, and empty it has a really nice reverberation (for whistling.)
The rear (small) coldroom is a kind of old monitors graveyard. Not sure if anyone is even trying to clear those. Probably not.

I still have to photograph the items I took and email them.  I had to empty the car and stash them quickly, so I'll have to get onto that.

Ideally they'd like a text list, with descriptions, models and serial numbers. Searchable.  Photos are nice too, but I can imagine how awkward that would be to actually track down items.

[Brumby]

I still have to photograph the items I took and email them.  I had to empty the car and stash them quickly, so I'll have to get onto that.

Ideally they'd like a text list, with descriptions, models and serial numbers. Searchable.  Photos are nice too, but I can imagine how awkward that would be to actually track down items.

I'd actually considered doing just that so it's not just a record of what I've taken, but giving that extra detail.  I'll make a point of writing them up for searchability.

[Brumby]

I saw an IBM 059 verifier when I was there on Thursday.  I couldn't check out the condition very closely, but it was dirty and missing a cover panel next to the card hopper.  It would be good to get that next to the card punch.  It would be even nicer if they had an IBM 029 card punch next to it as it has the same styling of keyboard.

They had three 026 punches, and one of the latter (transistors) 029 punch.

That's brilliant!  I do hope they can keep the 029 and 059 together.  They were the backbone of the first installation I ever worked at.

[tooki]

#1112: 23:50

IBM RAMAC was the very first commercially available hard disk drive!!!

[TerraHertz]

So I went today (Monday) to get photos of the bulldozing start, for closure. No sign of bulldozers.
John Geremin also turned up, for a last check-over. It's now an empty/trash zone, already with resident homeless.

Afterwards I invited him round to my place for a chat. One rather sad point, is that so far, I'm the ONLY person who actually gave ACMS any kind of list of items taken. And mine is just a photoset, not yet a text list.
It will be interesting to see if that situation improves as people get themselves organized. ie what proportion of people actually intend to do the right thing as opposed to those who just grabbed stuff to keep.

I'm pretty cynical about human nature. I think I know what the outcome will be.

[Halcyon]

Thanks for the update Terrahertz.

I'm yet to submit photographs/lists to them, however my priority was preservation (get the stuff out of there and somewhere safe). I plan to do this next weekend when I have time to go through it all.

I did express my concern as to how much of this gear will end up on ebay and unaccounted for. My view is that they are being way too generous about the whole thing. It wasn't very well managed and they are basically relying on the honesty system.

[Towger]

I am not at all surprised nothing has happened to the building. It still has power and probably other utilities such as water etc.  They all need to be discontinued by the relevant companies, not something which happens fast.  In fact I would not be at all surprised if it is still there in a few months time.

[Brumby]

Dropped by this afternoon.  The building is still there and no sign of activity - not that that surprises me in the least.

[Brumby]

Just some rubbish outside.  I didn't try going inside.

[TerraHertz]

I didn't try going inside.

This forum needs a chicken emoticon.
We must have just missed meeting, again, unless you're a Dexion fan.
It's only 11km from my place, and I really want photos of it being demolished. Since going back repeatedly is a nuisance, I wanted to get relevant contact details. Had stupidly forgotten to take a note of that every previous time. So, today went around midday.

result: www.888villawood.com.au

A guy associated with the mosque that occupies the other building on site, knows the owner (also Muslim), and demolition should begin sometime in the next two weeks. The homeless guy, who's quite nuts but probably harmless, is seriously pissing off the mosque people, by moving crap into their spaces - which are still in use for a little while more.

[Brumby]

I didn't try going inside.

This forum needs a chicken emoticon.

It's not my property and I did not have an invitation to enter - so I take a step back in such situations.


I dropped by about 2 pm or so.  Just happened to be within cooee with a bit of time to spare.  I don't expect to be around there with any certainty in the foreseeable future.

[sean0118]

So I went today (Monday) to get photos of the bulldozing start, for closure. No sign of bulldozers.
John Geremin also turned up, for a last check-over. It's now an empty/trash zone, already with resident homeless.

Afterwards I invited him round to my place for a chat. One rather sad point, is that so far, I'm the ONLY person who actually gave ACMS any kind of list of items taken. And mine is just a photoset, not yet a text list.
It will be interesting to see if that situation improves as people get themselves organized. ie what proportion of people actually intend to do the right thing as opposed to those who just grabbed stuff to keep.

I'm pretty cynical about human nature. I think I know what the outcome will be.

Thanks for posting, some of those CRTs in your second pic look old enough to keep? Did you get a look at them?

[TerraHertz]

Thanks for posting, some of those CRTs in your second pic look old enough to keep? Did you get a look at them?

Actually I was looking for any monitor with RGB BNC inputs. For a VAX machine I have. Did find one (outside) but it was badly damaged.  Otherwise my own CRT monitor graveyard up in my storage loft is already too full.
Then there's the monitor graveyard in the rear coldroom at 888 (pic). They are still there, and the building is an abandonment, soon to be demolished.

[rsjsouza]

Thanks for posting, some of those CRTs in your second pic look old enough to keep? Did you get a look at them?

Actually I was looking for any monitor with RGB BNC inputs. For a VAX machine I have. Did find one (outside) but it was badly damaged.  Otherwise my own CRT monitor graveyard up in my storage loft is already too full.

Your post made me recall a sad time: a few years ago I was unable to save a wonderful 21'' Sun Monitor with RGB inputs due to the absolute lack of space...

Then there's the monitor graveyard in the rear coldroom at 888 (pic). They are still there, and the building is an abandonment, soon to be demolished.

I imagine the mayhem of a building being destroyed with these dangerous amalgams of glass and phosphorous flying in the air.

[Brumby]

Somebody should probably organise for an e-Waste collection.

[Brumby]

Actually I was looking for any monitor with RGB BNC inputs. For a VAX machine I have. Did find one (outside) but it was badly damaged.  Otherwise my own CRT monitor graveyard up in my storage loft is already too full.
Then there's the monitor graveyard in the rear coldroom at 888 (pic). They are still there, and the building is an abandonment, soon to be demolished.

I took 3 Tektronix monitors into my care from 888.  They appear to be the same model (haven't pulled all three out for a proper check) but are 19" vertically flat screens .... and the back panel of one looks like this:


I also have a 17" Philips Brilliance 107P10 of my own with dual input: VGA and BNC (x5).  I've had this since new and it is the last CRT monitor in the house.

[TerraHertz]

The VAX I got is a VAXstation 3520. It took me an embarrassingly long time to figure out how to open the case. Then I found the graphics output is BNC RGB. Presumably sync-on-green. 

Online info says the 19" RGB monitor had a resolution of 1280 x 1024 pixels. Ha ha, the exact same resolution as this old street-tossed LG Flatron L1953H LCD I'm using right now. I bet it weighed 10x as much, and cost 20x as much.

Not much point even powering it on until I find some documentation. At the moment I have zero.

[TerraHertz]

Minor update. At 888 the power is disconnected and the site fencing enclosed, with added gate - not yet locked. Mosque has moved out. Next stage, demolition. Sometime.  I always find it fascinating to watch the final stages of old buildings declining.

Man, that homeless guy is a force of entropy. Really puts things in perspective. Some people here may joke about TEA & GAS, but that's nothing compared to genuine mental illness. Be thankful for what you have, including your mind.

[michelinux]

From channel History (only Italian Language):

1965, Olivetti P101:

english language:



...and tatata! "P101 Simulator" 

http://p101.unicas.it/p101/

from Unicas (http://www.unicas.it/) "University of Cassino and southern Lazio" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lazio where I live). 

Bye 

[Towger]

Man, that homeless guy is a force of entropy. Really puts things in perspective. Some people here may joke about TEA & GAS, but that's nothing compared to genuine mental illness. Be thankful for what you have, including your mind.

The problem (certainly here) is that the mental institutions (for non dangerous/criminal people) have been shut down.  They has been replaced by 'care in the community' schemes.  This is all fine in theory, but there are still people who can't survive if left up largely upto their self and would be better off in a modern institutionalised environment.  They often end up in one of these schemes when their parents become too old or die.  But, As many have time on their hands and are easly lead astray, it does not take long for them to become addicted to drink/drugs and go further downhill.

[TerraHertz]

Demolition has begun at the 888 site. It's locked up now and demolition machinery onsite, so no more inside photos. They are currently stripping all the removable stuff - plaster, woodwork, etc.

[Brumby]

I must confess ... I haven't done my cataloguing yet.  In the rush to get the gear safely secured, it wasn't placed in a conveniently accessible arrangement.

I will get around to it - it's bugging me that I haven't done it yet.

[TerraHertz]

Annnnnd... I got the roller door. The demolition crew are nice guys. I'm making a small storage space extension at home, and it needs a roller door. By chance the side roller at 888 is about the right size, and hopefully if can be made to fit. I asked the crew if I could salvage it, and they said yes. Started 7am this morning, out of there by 9:30am. They expect to start dropping that building this afternoon.

One lesson: DO NOT release the winding spring tension in a big roller door, before tying the roll securely so it can't unwind.
That was a very spectacular and loud mistake. Oh well no serious harm done to the door, only to my pride. It definitely wasn't part of the plan, but it did make it easy to take apart section by section. Instead of lowering it all rolled up - and very very heavy.

The 'monitor room' is finally empty.

[Halcyon]

Thanks for the update and photos TerraHertz.

Yes that small room which had a bunch of PC's and monitors looks rather spooky, like a dungeon or former torture chamber.

[decryption]

Anyone know what happened with most of the books/documentation/brochures etc from this collection?

I'd love to get my hands on some to scan in and upload to the Internet Archive. If anyone's got a lead on who I can chat to about digitising some of the printed materials, please let me know!