Author Topic: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!  (Read 12207 times)

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Offline Tony_G

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #25 on: September 14, 2018, 09:29:05 pm »
I think the point of Dave's "...why hasn't someone done it before?" is as a flag that you should think more deeply about the problem and the proposed solution rather than as a "this is a scam" filter.

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Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #26 on: September 15, 2018, 01:03:56 am »
This is where it gets interesting.   As someone who created several things and turned them around into products that people buy, which are unique ( well were unique and have been copied ),  If i had said " nobody has done this before, so it can't be done", I would have not done it.   Before the Manhattan project,  Nuclear power probably looked impossible too, and putting a man into space..

We need to encourage inventive thinking to solve new problems, but it has to be done in a way that lets things happen sensibly.
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident." Arthur Schopenhauer
 

Offline EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #27 on: September 15, 2018, 01:09:15 am »
It just requires the slightest skepticism to think "Sound cool, but why hasn't someone done it before?, I'll Google Fontus and see if anyone has critiqued it."
Skepticism is the key, not the ability to technical analyse something. PHY101 is no good to you if you don't have skepticism and the inclination to ask questions.
The problems is that the internet is full of self proclaimed 'experts' so without a solid understanding of phsysics it just comes down to who someone believes. For some science is no different than religion. Or put differently: absolute truth no longer exists.
[/quote]

But it's not hard to get "the vibe" when one of these "self proclaimed experts" is just waffling on, or that they might know something about what they are talking about.
And engineering or science Youtube channel for example doesn't usually get very far unless they have at least some technical credibility.
Running the numbers for example is a good first step, as most "self proclaimed experts" won't bother (or aren't able) to do that. You don't have to necessarily understand the numbers in order to get a feel that person may have a clue. Or at the very least is worth listening to more than someone else who is just waffling. Then there are the comments etc.
In any case, we are talking about just critical doubt here. You don't have to know and understand the numbers for sure to be able to think "Gee, this Fontus thing sounds a bit fishy, so it's probably not side to back it".

I know there are countless examples of "self proclaimed experts" on Facebook etc with millions of followers etc, but these people almost always promote stuff instead of critically analyse stuff. It's almost a self filtering mechanism in science and engineering that those with the knowledge and skills will tend to criticise/run the numbers etc rather than promote.
 
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Offline EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #28 on: September 15, 2018, 01:11:41 am »
I think the point of Dave's "...why hasn't someone done it before?" is as a flag that you should think more deeply about the problem and the proposed solution rather than as a "this is a scam" filter.

Correct, it's just a flag that means you should maybe (if you don't have the skills yourself) do a basic search and see what people are saying about it. And yes, that means deliberately seeking out "negative opinion" and seeing what they have to say.
 
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Offline jonovid

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #29 on: September 15, 2018, 06:29:04 pm »
it won't be the first time people are led astray by they own new age collective feelings.
if it involves earth , wind and fire or more like solar,wind or water.
it becomes magical, common sense is no longer common anymore.
new age cosmic fluffy logic has made fools of many.  :clap:
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Offline daqq

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #30 on: September 15, 2018, 07:00:36 pm »
Quote
You knew it was a scam. TF knew it was a scam. We knew it too. And there was no way to stop it?
Well, the moment a government would forcefully shut down something like this, they'd just milk it, say that some lobby was behind the shut down and claim a conspiracy. Imagine if someone had sued and shut down Batterizer. Heck, even Dave was accused of working for Big Battery companies if I remember correctly...
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Offline SparkyFX

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #31 on: September 15, 2018, 08:40:50 pm »
It just requires the slightest skepticism to think "Sound cool, but why hasn't someone done it before?, I'll Google Fontus and see if anyone has critiqued it."

This is where something like Rbutr comes in, a friend of mine developed that and it's a browser plugin that crowd sources critical opinion of the webpage you are visiting.
It is surely a good tool, but for people that already do possess the required skepticism to see the need for it.

Quote
Skepticism is the key, not the ability to technical analyse something. PHY101 is no good to you if you don't have skepticism and the inclination to ask questions.
People die of thirst and probably not in regions at 95% humidity where there are simplier methods of condensing water.

I mean... going to the electric kettle and check how much power it has (lets say ~2kW). Check how long it takes to boil a kilo of water and check how long it then takes to convert all of it to steam while monitoring energy use (practically what thunderf00t showed). Not that big of a deal to make - compared to hundreds of dollars of an investment.

Maybe it mentally blocks people that the heat pump is operated backwards. Maybe they overestimate the power a solar cell can deliver.

But probably this is just another case of group psychology surpassing logical thinking. Lots of wishful thinking is happening and assumptions are made and stated as facts. The internet with its fast communication capabilities amplifies not only the good things, but also the bad things.

I would´t have thought that those guys actually get that far with it, on the other hand scammers always build on trust and are able to scam millions out of their victims. I don´t really buy the "oops, we got that part of physics wrong".
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Offline ogden

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #32 on: September 23, 2018, 08:09:30 am »
i thought i just put this 1 here for reference

has indiegogo ALWAYS been a scammer/problem itself from the start?
this guy got stuck in it ...  :-//

funders have to complain to indiegogo themselves?

LOL flexible goal ;) To me he seems like scammer himself. Most likely he is just reselling ink available from multiple sources, like this:

http://www.creativematerials.com/products/carbon-inks/
 

Offline Muttley Snickers

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #33 on: September 23, 2018, 08:17:23 am »
In regards to the Fontus thing, if the backers got skinned then that's their bad luck for not using due diligence or having any common sense. Surely a product of this nature is thoroughly field tested prior to any promotion or marketing campaign so it's those poor beta testers that I have the gravest concerns for.
 

Offline GeorgeOfTheJungle

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #34 on: September 23, 2018, 08:55:47 am »
LOL flexible goal ;) To me he seems like scammer himself.

He talks loads of bollocks, I tell ya.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2018, 09:00:47 am by GeorgeOfTheJungle »
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Offline Cyberdragon

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #35 on: September 24, 2018, 01:01:49 am »


Somebody needs to pedal a fake one of these water collectors (tank and blinky lights) to the mainstream media. You say it's full of secret stuff so you can't show them and when it gets popular enough you finally open it and besides just a tank and pump there's just a big blinking sign that insults your intelligence and provides its own debunking info with included paperwork. I bet you could seriously pull it off given how stupid media outlets are. >:D
*BZZZZZZAAAAAP*
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Online BrianHG

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #36 on: September 24, 2018, 04:30:30 am »
Too bad we couldn't purchase shorts, like when you bet against stocks where you make money as the stock falls and dies, for these crowd funded projects.  Us better engineers could make a ton of money on many of these guaranteed doomed to failure projects, collecting on the investment everybody else is making.

Damn, too late, I could have created a new crowd funding web site with the added feature, on top of normal investment, the ability for of additional investors who can bet on projects flopping within 2 years...  I wonder how we could economically make that work...
« Last Edit: September 24, 2018, 04:36:45 am by BrianHG »
 
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Offline Money4Nothing

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Re: EEVblog #1121 - Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
« Reply #37 on: October 01, 2018, 03:58:18 pm »
The correct skeptical question wouldn't be "Why hasn't anyone ever done this before?"
The correct skeptical quiston would be "Hasn't this been done before?  Google: Dehumidifiers"
 


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