EEVblog #179 - Mitsubishi iMiEV Electric Car Test Drive

[Ferroto]

Looks interesting. Most electric cars are powered by hydrogen fuel cells, I didn't know Lithium Ion was viable for this. I also like how the engine is in the back of the vehicle.

The only problem is the shape of the car. Can't auto companys just make an electric car that looks like any other car. It seems that when they design a hybrid or electric car they always have to come up with some wacky design such as the almost non-existent trunk, and the rounded off front end.

It was kinda nerve wracking seeing a dashboard view of a car driving on the left side of the road (people drive on the right where I am). When you were in Hawaii awhile ago did you have the same anxiety when on the road.

[david77]

The only problem is the shape of the car. Can't auto companys just make an electric car that looks like any other car. It seems that when they design a hybrid or electric car they always have to come up with some wacky design such as the almost non-existent trunk, and the rounded off front end.

True. Why not stick it into a normal car that can be used like a normal car? I couldn't even do the weekly shopping with the iMiev.

The other thing I'm not keen on: Battery powered electric cars. That's just rubbish. What use is a car that's out of juice after 40km? I live in a rural area not a big city, work is 35km away from home. That's a close shave...
And the idea of keeping two cars is just ridiculous, do you have any idea what it costs to keep a petrol car in Germany? The taxman & the insurers rip you off left right and center.
I wouldn't even know where to put a second car. Let alone recharge it as I have to park in the street, far away from the next power point.

Now, an electric car with hydrogen fuel cell technology and a decent range is something I would definitely be interested in. What appeals most is that it should be possible to fill it up in a couple of minutes at the petrol/hydrogen station, instead of having to faff around with extension leads and chargers for hours.

Basically I'd like to have a car that works exactly like cars today but without petrol.

[DrGeoff]

Would be nice to see further use of Vanadium redox batteries. The electolyte can be pumped out discharged and fully charged electrolyte can be pumped into the tanks, a bit like petrol.
Great for solar power storage too since you can change as much as you are able to in summer (provided you have the tank space) and use it during winter.

[Ferroto]

Would be nice to see further use of Vanadium redox batteries. The electolyte can be pumped out discharged and fully charged electrolyte can be pumped into the tanks, a bit like petrol.
Great for solar power storage too since you can change as much as you are able to in summer (provided you have the tank space) and use it during winter.

This would be great for those with a long drives. I live in a small town where everything is within a 5 minutes drive from my house, however when I have to drive on the highway I don't have the luxury of charging my battery every 40 km and being able to pump new electrolyte would be a neat alternative.

You could also design a pump that removes the old electrolyte and pumps in new electrolyte at the same time. The old electrolyte could be recharged at the service station and resold.

[quantumfall]

Have another look at the video again guys, Malcolm  said it can do 80 km normal driving or 100 km if driven carefully.

Thats quiet usable for a lot of people who commute to work.  The big thing with electric cars is the battery or power source  keep in mind the  replacement costs if the vehicle is to have a long life.

I'm sure you could get the weeks shop in there with the back seat folded down as well.

I think its practical enough for a lot of people.

Not sure of the range if using air con etc though.

[david77]

  Woops... my bad mixed up the figures.

Anyway, does anybody know how long a battery pack for a car like the iMiev will last?
The LiIon cells will certainly deteriorate like we know it from phones and notebooks,
so I assume the achievable range will drop with use.

I'm still not sold on battery powered cars...

[quantumfall]

There is so much to consider and who knows the true costs of ownership.

I'm expecting that the batteries are dealer only supply at top price and the tyres are a non standard size with a non standard price to match possibly.

There is not much protection in front from a crash if you are involved in one it looks like.

The good points, quiet, lots of torque for a small car. Cheaper fuel ? who knows.

It all comes down to the whole cost of ownership for most people.

[Mechatrommer]

The only problem is the shape of the car. Can't auto companys just make an electric car that looks like any other car. It seems that when they design a hybrid or electric car they always have to come up with some wacky design such as the almost non-existent trunk, and the rounded off front end.

True. Why not stick it into a normal car that can be used like a normal car? I couldn't even do the weekly shopping with the iMiev.

you havent seen much... and you are lucky they still havent much around...



you should ask why agilent didnt stick design like this?

by nature electric car doesnt have heavy engine and much power as one (gas), so whats the front hood is good for? plus, they need to cut the weight as much as possible, some small aspects to be mentioned. but sure its not the area of expertise of eevblog.

what i dont get is... dave mentioned its too much if it costs 50 grand (50K right? not 50 millions) where their (Australian) standard income is AUD80K/year, thats AUD6.7K/month. i earn only 3K++/month (our currency MYR), and i have two cars that costs MYR150K++ (on loan of course! ), if that imiev car is MYR50K, sure i'll get one soon! but sadly it is, AUD50K is MYR150K++ here, if including our non-afta non-compliance tax, than can take another 100-500% tax!, that can cost me cheapest MYR300K++! NUTS! that car is super COOL! i want one!

it has similar look like one of our national car sold here which cost a sucking ~MYR50K! no electric! just 10-20 years old tech of gas engine...

There is not much protection in front from a crash if you are involved in one it looks like.

they can put all the safety bars, struts etc on the front under the hood/trunk, side top frame etc. there's no magic and complicated to that. the weight of the car is more than a ton, without the gas engine+accessories fuel etc, where do you think that weight coming from? just like dmm/ee design, there's safety and regulation that need to be meet in order for the car to be approved on the road.

[Mechatrommer]

You could also design a pump that removes the old electrolyte and pumps in new electrolyte at the same time. The old electrolyte could be recharged at the service station and resold.

very good idea. just like our "old tech" gas for cooking filled in a tank. when its empty we can change with the new refilled tank at nearest shop at the cost of the gas alone. fast and we dont need to worry of the aging battery/electrolyte.

[DrGeoff]

That's the whole idea of Vanadium Redox batteries. The charge is stored in a liquid electrolyte (well two actually). This is pumped into the tanks and when combined produce electrical energy. The depleted mixture can then be pumped out and recharged. It's not explosive like hydrogen and Vanadium is a common element, so it is fairly inexpensive.
UNSW produced some nice working technologies and I belive that China is using it on some large industrial applications. There was talk of a residential cell about the size of a bar fridge which could run a whole house.

[Alex]

What about the electrodes? They are part of the chemical reaction during charging and discharging. Is this not the case with Vanadium batteries?

Alex

[DrGeoff]

No. The electrolyte contains the charge. It is a redox battery.
http://www.vrb.unsw.edu.au/

and recent significant updates:
http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2011-03/dnnl-utv031711.php