Author Topic: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown  (Read 29107 times)

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Offline EEVblog

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EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« on: October 01, 2014, 11:40:54 pm »
What's inside the new FLIR TG165 Visual IR Thermometer / Thermal Camera using the new Lepton sensor?
Does it have a calibration shutter?
How does it compare to the FLIR ONE & FLIR E4?
Does it have any extra capability built in ready to be hacked?
How easy is it to open? (SPOILER - it's a BASTARD!)

Datasheets:
Lepton Module: http://www.flir.com/uploadedFiles/CVS_Americas/Cores_and_Components_NEW/Products/Uncooled_Cores/Lepton/FLIR-Lepton-DataBrief.pdf

http://www.st.com/web/catalog/mmc/FM141/SC1169/SS1031/LN1565

« Last Edit: October 01, 2014, 11:42:39 pm by EEVblog »
 

Offline firewalker

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2014, 12:09:55 am »
That coil looks like am electromagnet for a shutter.

Alexander.
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Offline firewalker

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2014, 12:13:01 am »


Alexander.
Become a realist, stay a dreamer.

 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2014, 12:21:24 am »
That coil looks like am electromagnet for a shutter.

That didn't occur to me.
I was under the impression that the Lepton sensor didn't have a built in shutter.
Now that I check, it is different from the photo of sensor in the datasheet.
I'll check when back in the lab.

 

Offline Sparkey_500

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2014, 12:29:11 am »
Perhaps you could 3D print a better case. But I have a feeling you are going to do something else with the lepton.
 

Offline nixfu

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2014, 12:35:57 am »
Agreed.  Kill whoever designed the plastic assembly.
 

Offline marcan

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2014, 12:39:08 am »
Mike's unit from the FLIR One didn't have the metal module on the front, but did have two pins on some flex leading to it. He suggested those would be used for a shutter version, with an extra shutter add-on on top. Looks like you got the version with a shutter :-) (which suddenly makes a hacked firmware a lot more appealing, since it should be able to get decent absolute temperature measurements from the Lepton!)
 

Offline Artlav

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2014, 12:44:48 am »
You can see the shutter moving at 19:20-19:40 in the video, when Dave was waving at himself - look at the sensor when the screen freezes.
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2014, 12:50:39 am »
Mike's unit from the FLIR One didn't have the metal module on the front, but did have two pins on some flex leading to it. He suggested those would be used for a shutter version, with an extra shutter add-on on top.

Ah ok, I didn't watch all of Mike's teardown. I do recall the ONE had a large external shutter?
That makes me instantly wonder that this "micro shutter" is probably not the best performer?, otherwise why wouldn't they have used it in the FLIR ONE?
I'm going to run some experiments on it tomorrow.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #9 on: October 02, 2014, 12:52:08 am »
You can see the shutter moving at 19:20-19:40 in the video, when Dave was waving at himself - look at the sensor when the screen freezes.

I see it!
Nice spotting!
 

Offline nitro2k01

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2014, 12:55:48 am »
You can see the shutter moving at 19:20-19:40 in the video, when Dave was waving at himself - look at the sensor when the screen freezes.
!!
So that settles that. But, I'm still as puzzled as Dave as to why they would put a shutter on it, though. They don't need it for the application.

Likely, the intended method to access those screws is to actually remove the front glass panel, possibly using heat. This is common for example in certain smartphones. Or, it may just have been designed to basically be indestructible, and otherwise disposable.

The 8 MHz is likely not used directly as the CPU clock. The datasheet for STM32F103 specifies that it has a PLL which takes a 4 to 16 MHz input, so you would never clock it directly at the CPU frequency anyway. As for the bizarro device, you guessed it, the traces are snaking off to the 32 kHz oscillator pins, according to the same datasheet.
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Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2014, 12:58:37 am »
It's obvious those screws go in behind the display window, maybe they just put a bit too much glue on the window?
Maybe try a suction cup to remove the window rather than going in from the side? - once you get the window off it should be a doddle to open.
The temp sensor will be thermopile not pyroelectric - the latter only senses temp  changes
The shutter mech looks like it just unclips
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Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2014, 01:01:15 am »
You can see the shutter moving at 19:20-19:40 in the video, when Dave was waving at himself - look at the sensor when the screen freezes.
!!
So that settles that. But, I'm still as puzzled as Dave as to why they would put a shutter on it, though. They don't need it for the application.

The only reason to need it is if it's looking at a static scene, but as it doesn't have a tripod mount that's unlikely.   
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #13 on: October 02, 2014, 01:04:23 am »
So that settles that. But, I'm still as puzzled as Dave as to why they would put a shutter on it, though. They don't need it for the application.

I didn't think so either, as the Lepton after all is supposed to have automatic temperature compensation.
Given that it seems a random time between calibrations from what I've seen so far, I can only presume that it calibrates when it detects a large enough drift in the sensor. Possibly based on a temp sensor in the device or somewhere else?
If that's the case then I should be able to demonstrate that with some thermal chamber testing to increase the rate. Will try that tomorrow I think.



 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #14 on: October 02, 2014, 01:06:27 am »
It's obvious those screws go in behind the display window, maybe they just put a bit too much glue on the window?
Maybe try a suction cup to remove the window rather than going in from the side? - once you get the window off it should be a doddle to open.

The rubber looks like it's molded over the window edges.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2014, 01:06:59 am »
The only reason to need it is if it's looking at a static scene, but as it doesn't have a tripod mount that's unlikely.

It does have a tripod mount.
 

Offline SpiderElectronics

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2014, 01:17:35 am »
I agree with Mike, you should have pulled off the screen cover. It would have come out.
 

Offline firewalker

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #17 on: October 02, 2014, 01:19:29 am »
Is that shutter capable of calibrating the sensor?

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Offline nitro2k01

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #18 on: October 02, 2014, 01:30:08 am »
The only reason to need it is if it's looking at a static scene, but as it doesn't have a tripod mount that's unlikely.

It does have a tripod mount.
So maybe that's ultimately the reason. Maybe it doesn't calibrate periodically, but rather based on the contents of the scene, somehow, for example a long timeout, but more frequent recalibrations if the scene is mostly static.

I don't think we saw all 4 sides of the sensor in the video. I saw a pair of gold traces going up to the top of the module along one side. Check if there's another pair on one of the sides, which would indicate there's a temperature sensor connected as well.

As for whether the lens assembly contains a Fresnel lens, you could always look into the lens assembly using the Lepton sensor to see if and how the image is distorted.
Is that shutter capable of calibrating the sensor?

Alexander.
It's referred to as a calibration shutter in this document, so yes, that must be it. If there's no temperature sensor on the module, that would indicate that it's only doing non-uniformity correction (for static scenes) and not temperature calibration.

http://www.eevblog.com/files/FLIR-TG165/TG165_Comparison_FINAL.pdf
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Offline German_EE

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #19 on: October 02, 2014, 01:31:43 am »
The amount of destruction required to open that device was painful to watch and whoever designed it like that deserves to be taken out into the parking lot and shot. Twice. Just to make sure that they don't do something like that again >:(
Should you find yourself in a chronically leaking boat, energy devoted to changing vessels is likely to be more productive than energy devoted to patching leaks.

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Offline firewalker

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2014, 01:33:23 am »
Maybe there is a trick to dismantle it. E.g. Slightly heat the window and suck it off.

Alexander.
Become a realist, stay a dreamer.

 

Offline bktemp

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #21 on: October 02, 2014, 01:52:20 am »
Thanks for the teardown!
That brings me back to the question from the mailback thread: Why do they need two sensors? The lepton core can measure absolute temperature with manual shutter (at least the FLIR ONE can). So it should be even better with automatic shutter.
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #22 on: October 02, 2014, 01:56:20 am »
Thanks for the teardown!
That brings me back to the question from the mailback thread: Why do they need two sensors? The lepton core can measure absolute temperature with manual shutter (at least the FLIR ONE can). So it should be even better with automatic shutter.
Accuracy and field of view. Look at the relative sizes of the lenses - for the thermopile, you can use a large, cheap plastic fresnel lens.
Even with a shutter, it will only give accurate temps once shutter temp has stabilised, so if you pull it out of a cold toolbox, it could easily take several mins to give a stable reading.
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Offline nixfu

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #23 on: October 02, 2014, 02:01:10 am »
> Why do they need two sensors

I would say this is a pretty strong eenforcement by flir themselves that a using the lepton itself to measure the temp even with a shutter is inaccurate and useless.


 
 

Offline nitro2k01

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Re: EEVblog #669 - FLIR TG165 Thermal Imager Teardown
« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2014, 02:03:57 am »
I suspect the main reason is temperature range. The thermopile sensor in the TG165 is rated -25 - 380 °C whereas the Lepton sensor (or at least the Flir One, according to the comparison PDF linked above) is only rated 0 - 100 °C which may be limiting for some uses.
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