EEVblog Electronics Community Forum

EEVblog => EEVblog Specific => Topic started by: EEVblog on August 04, 2015, 03:00:56 pm

Title: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: EEVblog on August 04, 2015, 03:00:56 pm
A look at the Ultra Micron, the world's smallest digital ionising radiation dosimeter, and it's Open Source Hardware.
https://github.com/shodanx/ultramicron (https://github.com/shodanx/ultramicron)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKjtOTeAevg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKjtOTeAevg)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: alimirjamali on August 04, 2015, 03:39:38 pm
I wish if Andrey sold this device.  :( He did an excellent job

The Windows software is available on his Github repository (https://github.com/shodanx/ultramicron/tree/master/MadOrc_soft) which is written in Delphi. Should be very easy to translate to English.

Thank you very much Dave for review and tear-down  :-+
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: nitro2k01 on August 04, 2015, 05:19:50 pm
What I want to know is how well it can tolerate higher radioation levels, in terms of not crashing and so on. Do rad hardened micros come in such small packages?
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: sergey on August 04, 2015, 06:41:25 pm
Very nice, Andrey! :)

Dave, uR/h is rather quite common in russia actually, so not a problem here at all :) And thanks for the teardown!
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Artlav on August 04, 2015, 07:33:46 pm
Tried to translate the software, but it won't compile for me. Needs some post-7 (and so braindead) version of Delphi.
So i only translated the screenshots:

(http://i.imgur.com/8LFWvmi.png)

(http://i.imgur.com/oqvBiix.png)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dadler on August 04, 2015, 10:54:50 pm
I really want one of these!
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: LabSpokane on August 04, 2015, 11:15:03 pm
Wow!  I thought I had seen a small dosimeter until now.  It'll be interesting to see what shows up in the nuclear pavilions at the power trade shows with this new benchmark.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Stonent on August 04, 2015, 11:28:26 pm
Datasheet for the SBM-10 http://www.gstube.com/data/2396/ (http://www.gstube.com/data/2396/)

More info about Soviet surplus tubes: https://sites.google.com/site/diygeigercounter/gm-tubes-supported (https://sites.google.com/site/diygeigercounter/gm-tubes-supported)

The SBM-10 is not particularly sensitive tube, but it is small.

If you remove the inside of the smoke detector from the housing, you can get a lot more activity from the Americium.

Another interesting thing to test is Potassium Chloride, sold as "Lite salt" or sodium free salt.  Potassium and Potassium chloride typically contain enough K-40 in it that it will increase your activity by several ticks per minute.  It's not dangerous, it's just that's the way Potassium exists in nature.

Another thing to keep in mind is dosage is highly dependent on the material being tested.  A geiger tube is only a counter. It has no ability to measure magnitude.   As far as it is concerned, one click of Potassium 40 is the same as one click of Plutonium.  So the meter has to be calibrated to the sample.   You could think of it as a device that counts cars passing by on the road. A Smart car is the same as a 18 wheeled diesel truck.  Typically counters are calibrated to CS-137 or in the case of the CDV-700 counter I have, calibrated to depleted uranium.

If you did want to measure magnitude of unknown samples, you'd need a scintillation counter.

So if you are measuring to anything other than it is calibrated to, make sure if you know what you're measuring, do some googling and see how you can covert counts to sieverts for your sample.

And remember, half-lives have to do with how much radiation is spewing out.  Short half-lives mean lots of radiation, long half-lives mean slow emissions.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: jnissen on August 05, 2015, 12:04:33 am
Dave, if your interested you may be able to interface the dossimeter into a world map. I am using the following service as it's free and the guys here support many different devices. Perhaps they can support your meter? Give them a try.

http://radmon.org/ (http://radmon.org/)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: elektronaut on August 05, 2015, 01:55:49 am
That's a really nice dosimeter.
Can this one be used in an environment where one is prone to be exposed to X-rays?
In other words in situations where the exposure is very short but somewhat intense.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Someone on August 05, 2015, 02:04:47 am
Argh, never heard anyone pronounce it that way before. The manufacturers videos and professionals I have worked with always pronounced it "dose-im-eter" emphasis on its function of estimating dose.
Quote from: elektronaut on August 05, 2015, 01:55:49 am
That's a really nice dosimeter.
Can this one be used in an environment where one is prone to be exposed to X-rays?
In other words in situations where the exposure is very short but somewhat intense.
The detector used in this small unit is sensitive almost exclusively to gamma radiation, it would be a very poor choice as a general purpose dosimeter or for use with narrow energy emitters such as x-ray equipment. They are intended for consumers worried about nuclear hazards.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Pentium100 on August 05, 2015, 03:16:52 am
I noticed one mistake in the display. The dosimeter displays uR/h current level, but then the day dose is in uRh. Why? Roentgen is a measure of dose, you do not need to multiply it by hours. For example, joules - you can measure power in J/h, but won't measure the total energy in Jh.

I know this is pedantic, but for some reason I really notice this kind of mistake. For example, saying that a lightbulb uses 100W/h.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: 99tito99 on August 05, 2015, 03:50:56 am
Hi Folks,

MegaNubie question/request: Can someone point me in the right direction to cut-my-teeth on understanding GitHub?

I'm opening and looking at files and it's a bit of a train-wreck in my brain.

Cheers,
Mark
***********************
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: elektronaut on August 05, 2015, 04:00:23 am
Quote from: 99tito99 on August 05, 2015, 03:50:56 am
Can someone point me in the right direction to cut-my-teeth on understanding GitHub?
I'm opening and looking at files and it's a bit of a train-wreck in my brain.

In the readme.md file this links shows up ftp://www.xn--80aighkbzclf7a.net/%D0%94%D0%BE%D0%B7%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%B5%D1%82%D1%80%D1%8B_%D0%9C%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD/%D0%A3%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B0-%D0%BC%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD/ (http://ftp://www.xn--80aighkbzclf7a.net/%D0%94%D0%BE%D0%B7%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%B5%D1%82%D1%80%D1%8B_%D0%9C%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD/%D0%A3%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B0-%D0%BC%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD/) here you can download all files in a simple way
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: 99tito99 on August 05, 2015, 05:02:36 am
Quote from: elektronaut on August 05, 2015, 04:00:23 am
Quote from: 99tito99 on August 05, 2015, 03:50:56 am
Can someone point me in the right direction to cut-my-teeth on understanding GitHub?
I'm opening and looking at files and it's a bit of a train-wreck in my brain.

In the readme.md file this links shows up ftp://www.xn--80aighkbzclf7a.net/%D0%94%D0%BE%D0%B7%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%B5%D1%82%D1%80%D1%8B_%D0%9C%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD/%D0%A3%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B0-%D0%BC%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD/ (http://ftp://www.xn--80aighkbzclf7a.net/%D0%94%D0%BE%D0%B7%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%B5%D1%82%D1%80%D1%8B_%D0%9C%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD/%D0%A3%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B0-%D0%BC%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD/) here you can download all files in a simple way

Hi elektronaut:

Thanks, that focused me in and helps a lot.

Cheers,
Mark
*********************
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: TiN on August 05, 2015, 12:19:51 pm
Nice piece of russian engineering :)

And meanwhile, EEVBlog not supporting russian language posts!?

P.S. ??????? ??????, :) Nah, not supporting, changes posts/PMs to bunch of questions marks. ??? :)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Rubi on August 05, 2015, 02:34:43 pm
Hi

Since it's open source hardeware where can I find the pcb files ?
I could not find them in the github folder, did I overlook something ?
I would love to build one.

Cheers
Michael

EDIT
Please excuse, after removing the tomatoes from my eyes I found the pcb files and ordered them from osh park.
8$ for three pcbs, awesome!

Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: bitwelder on August 05, 2015, 05:07:54 pm
Hats off to Andrei for making this little beauty!  :-+

Besides, looking at the files in www.xn--80aighkbzclf7a.net (http://www.xn--80aighkbzclf7a.net) I see that before Ultra-Micron there was a Micron project, running several versions, with older versions dating back to 2012.
So the device we saw in Dave's hands is likely the result of a long evolution process.

Thanks also for releasing it as open source.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: LabSpokane on August 05, 2015, 05:16:00 pm
Shodan,

I forgot to thank you.  Projects like this are what make it fun to visit here.  Nice work!!
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: SEKCobra on August 05, 2015, 06:06:57 pm
Man, I'd love this as a kit, maybe a bit more rugged case (Like Honeywell CO Warners maybe?).
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Stonent on August 05, 2015, 11:30:33 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on August 05, 2015, 08:03:18 pm
Quote from: Rubi on August 05, 2015, 02:34:43 pm
Please excuse, after removing the tomatoes from my eyes I found the pcb files and ordered them from osh park.
I recommend use Seeedstudio, because it have better "Annular Ring" PCB limitations.

Quote from: SEKCobra on August 05, 2015, 06:06:57 pm
bit more rugged case
This case(from Dave video), the best and small what i can found.
Key thing it is small.
As one option to order the plastic case molding in the factory, but it is very expensive.

I thanks to everyone!
I was interested to read the comments.
Glad that you liked the project.

No, i not sell "kit".
But if you can find more 60% components yourself, maybe i can help you.... i can send to you rare components by mail.

Sometimes i sell 1-3 pieces(fully assembled device), but it very expensive price. Therefore i recommend bying components and assembly it yourself, it more cheaper.

Well one thing I like is if you have the full schematic, you can modify it as needed.
For instance building the HV section and then being able to sample the voltage would be what I would be most interested in.  As long as I can get pulses from that, I could use another MCU if I'm more comfortable with it.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 06, 2015, 01:06:08 am
Well, I'm building one or two of these I'm amazed of the PSU design, very nicely done. I've already ordered all the components. For your reference on things I've found difficult to get:

I'm 99% sure that these are the cases:
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/plastic-case-small-6-pcs-49-27-18mm-electronic-project-box-electronic-case-abs-swith-housing/32219511996.html (http://www.aliexpress.com/item/plastic-case-small-6-pcs-49-27-18mm-electronic-project-box-electronic-case-abs-swith-housing/32219511996.html)
It has the exact inside dimensions and looks very similar on the outside.

This is the only source I've found for screens:
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Original-LCD-screen-digitizer-display-Second-External-LCD-For-Nokia-2760-Mobile-Phone-Repair-replacement-Tools/1822978844.html (http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Original-LCD-screen-digitizer-display-Second-External-LCD-For-Nokia-2760-Mobile-Phone-Repair-replacement-Tools/1822978844.html)

As for the vibration motors the ebay seller listed on the motor parameters ( ebay store 4hobbyde) seems not to be carrying them, but no worries, I'm 99% sure they are these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231218458556?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.com/itm/231218458556?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)

SBM-10 tubes are readily available on ebay from lots of sellers, no problem there.


As for the rest of the electronic components all of them are readily available on digikey and mouser. Well, there are no matching tactile switches on mouser but those can be found on ebay for dirt cheap (the model listed on the BOM is from a russian store but it's standard. So is the orange LED, any 1206 orange led will do). It gets cheaper on mouser. Only things I've found are that:

- ATB322515-0110 transformers are out of stock everywhere until september 2015, but you can get ATB322524-0110 which seems to be fully compatible, just a bit taller (same series, same datasheet, higher current rating)

-ABM7-8.000MHZ-D2Y-T has a unique footprint and there are literally no other crystals on that size and frequency anywhere. They are out of stock until late october 2015 in mouser and digikey, thankfully they're in stock at farnell and I had to make an order there anyway. I've ordered extra in the case anyone needs. I was about to change the crystal for something in 5032 package which is more readily available but I had already ordered the PCB's. Elecrow seems to be happy so far with the gerbers. Looking at the design rules and browsing the PCB it seems that the tolerances are within the capabilities of all 6mil/6mil chinese manufacturers.
 
Total cost ordering in 1's is about 60€. If anyone is interested I can share a cart for digikey/mouser with everything you need in exact quantity (once you stockpile about 8 large boxes full of leftover SMD's you start seeing the value of ordering just two damn 0603 resitors even if that's more expensive than ordering 25 or 50 as you did when your room had more space)

I've ordered six cases and I have a milling machine that can do plastic. I only plan on building two of these and once I get the milling machine set up right I might machine all six cases so I might offer them here if anyone is interested. I plan on using a CD as a source for polycarbonate windows.

I'll tell you how it goes when It's built. Very nice project.

Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 06, 2015, 01:48:15 am
Quote from: shodan@micron on August 06, 2015, 01:32:16 am
Display - Last time i buy here (http://www.ebay.com/itm/161499389504), but it expencive.
Case - I use this (http://www.ebay.com/itm/160833181642), but you is very similar.
Transformer -  ATB322524-0110, yes, it will be work fine.
Crystal - yeah.. its very rare thing.... But i buy it on Farnell.

Thank you very much, I'm pretty sure that my case is exactly that one. I've seen the exact same model I ordered listed elsewhere with the same dimensions as yours (in my link the case is listed with a height of 18mm but I've see it listed as 14mm with the exact same part number. You know, chinese millimeters aren't always as everywhere else's millimeters).

 By the way, is there anything else I need to know before building the 4.06 version? I've seen that the design is mostly the same as 4.04 except for a 1.6ohm ferrite which is now a 22 ohm resistor and an extra mosfet at the HV power supply. Will it work with the current firmware? I've also read in your blog something about some resin that you applied to the positive terminal of the geiger tube but later you had to scrape off the PCB but I didn't understand very well. Could you explain? I have a friend who speaks russian and could help but she's on holiday.

EDIT: I have a CNC milling machine. The window for the screen and the holes for the buttons are easy to make but the USB micro hole will require a custom tool to support the case in a vertical position. I hope the plastic is ABS or something easy to machine. I'll make a 3D model of the enclosure when it arrives and hopefully I'll get it right before the 6th trial.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: AccountRemovedPerUsersRequest on August 06, 2015, 08:15:42 am
Well, I tried to recompile English translated Win-software, but too many 3rd party version depended files required.

Axel.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: AccountRemovedPerUsersRequest on August 06, 2015, 11:29:30 am
Quote from: shodan@micron on August 06, 2015, 08:21:22 am
Just install Delphi JCL (http://www.delphi-jedi.org/)

That was obvious. But besides Jedi there are some missing properties (modified std Classes?), missing VCL(s) (at least MyTray), version conflict between Jedi and zlib object files (or pngimage-source... can't say), modified or updated Indy... etc etc.
Anyway: too many conflicts between my D7 and dosi-win software.

If it were only changing some texts and recompile I would do that. Investigating and reverse engineering goes beyond my economical effort in this case...

Axel.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 06, 2015, 11:36:10 am
Quote from: shodan@micron on August 06, 2015, 02:24:37 am
Oh... resin this is most complicated thing!
I will try to explain.

My design is based on the ultra-low leakage on HV side.
For this i tested many-many different components on different manufacture and select that diodes and capacitors witch have low leakage. It should be understood very clearly. It means replace component on HV with analogs are not allowed in most cases.

About resin... The decrease in current consumption I was so successful that mosisture level in atmosphere is now be critical to current consumption.
In high moisture level it be high current consumption and battery discharging is faster. I do not like it, although in most cases it is not critical.

[...]


I was kind of expecting this, thankfully all the components in the HV section are easily available in exact part number, so no problems there. That HV power supply design is a masterpiece. I also have an ultrasound cleaner, but is it OK to clean the board with the SBM-10 installed or do I have to clean it before installation? I'm concerned about vacuum seals potentially cracking due to vibration. I'm no expert on HV/humidity barrier coatings but there are people in my company who are, I'm gonna ask them to see what can be done.

Thanks again
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: AccountRemovedPerUsersRequest on August 06, 2015, 11:42:52 am
Quote from: shodan@micron on August 06, 2015, 11:38:44 am
Its compiled by RAD studio XE6 with JCL, noting else!

You dont need make anything, in this week i added language selector to this software.

That is very good - and the only thing I was going to do anyway.

Axel.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on August 06, 2015, 11:56:31 am
Look what I have found:
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Original-LCD-screen-digitizer-display-Second-External-LCD-For-Nokia-2760-Mobile-Phone-Repair-replacement-Tools/1822978844.html (http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Original-LCD-screen-digitizer-display-Second-External-LCD-For-Nokia-2760-Mobile-Phone-Repair-replacement-Tools/1822978844.html)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Rubi on August 06, 2015, 11:58:10 am
Hi Shodan!

Quote from: shodan@micron on August 05, 2015, 08:03:18 pm
I recommend use Seeedstudio, because it have better "Annular Ring" PCB limitations.

First thank you very much for this great project!

Seeedstudio is also great, esp. when you want to build more than one unit, but I recently prefer oshpark because of the default golden coating , at seed this would cost an extra 20$.

On another great russian project i built recently I had to use dirty pcbs which were extremly cheap and also very good quality but it nearly took two months to get to me.
http://dirtypcbs.com/view.php?share=6586&accesskey=cad38a0e9484b06ec39b33055847b133 (http://dirtypcbs.com/view.php?share=6586&accesskey=cad38a0e9484b06ec39b33055847b133)

Cheers
Michael



Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: VK3DRB on August 08, 2015, 08:59:13 am
What the country of Japan needs is a tool to detect radioactive trace elements in their food. Invent that and you will become very wealthy. In the meantime, many Japanese are buying foreign fish because they do not trust the stuff from local waters.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Skibane on August 09, 2015, 04:14:09 am
"World's Smallest"?

Not sure about that... (http://ludlums.com/component/virtuemart/area-monitoring-5/handheld-instruments-29/dedicated-purpose-instruments-31/gamma-dose-rate-46/personal-radiation-monitor-9-detail?keyword=25&Itemid=0)

(http://www.skibane.com/Ludlum 25.jpg)

Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: drago on August 09, 2015, 01:29:28 pm
Awsome project!
I like the clean design especially the high voltage converter but also other features:
 • user interface
 • Nokia display
 • USB ESD protection
 • cute vibration motor
 • digital design

Thanks for sharing this as an open source.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Kleinstein on August 10, 2015, 08:27:28 am
Food testing is much more complicated. The radiation levels are much lower, so one needs quite heavy shielding.
Normaly they also use only gamma radiation, but a energy seperated cintilation detecor. The expensive part is the detector (special crystal and photomultiplier tube). The electronik can be small and cheap - though in small quatities it has a price. Even than it takes hours to get a usefull reading, unless  the radiation levels are way to high.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 10, 2015, 02:11:28 pm
Hi again, I just received the main components order but I'll take about a month to get everything else from china. I can't find a datasheet for the screen, do you have one? Could you at least tell me the main dimensions (width, length and thickness) of the screen so I can model it in 3D for the case design?

I live in a part of Spain with relatively high levels of natural radiation. Right where I live it's about 15 uR/h just in gamma radiation according to available maps, but in the mountains nearby it can go up to 30 uR/h. I plan on taking this to mountain trips and monitor the radiation.

EDIT: also, do you have a source for the button plastic keys? I've seen in your blog that you used calculator keys in previous designs but now all your cases have the same black buttons. I can't find them on ebay.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 10, 2015, 03:01:00 pm
Thanks, I'll get that exact calculator if possible.

Right where I live the soil is basically sand and river sediments but the mountains nearby are mostly made of granite and that's why radiation is higher than average. I hope this device can detect the extra radition.

Besides that, I think that the only potentially highly contaminated area in Spain is near a small southern town where a yankee plane accidentally dropped 4 atomic bombs in 1966 and the explosives in one of them detonated spreading plutonium over a large area. Thankfully it wasn't a nuclear explosion. They cleaned most of the stuff but as far as I know there are places that are still contaminated. I might visit that place one day.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: SNGLinks on August 10, 2015, 11:52:00 pm
Quote from: dmg on August 10, 2015, 03:01:00 pm
Thanks, I'll get that exact calculator if possible.

Right where I live the soil is basically sand and river sediments but the mountains nearby are mostly made of granite and that's why radiation is higher than average. I hope this device can detect the extra radition.

Besides that, I think that the only potentially highly contaminated area in Spain is near a small southern town where a yankee plane accidentally dropped 4 atomic bombs in 1966 and the explosives in one of them detonated spreading plutonium over a large area. Thankfully it wasn't a nuclear explosion. They cleaned most of the stuff but as far as I know there are places that are still contaminated. I might visit that place one day.

That's near Vera Playa where I go on holiday every year!
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: JackM on August 11, 2015, 10:00:37 pm
Quote from: dmg on August 06, 2015, 01:06:08 am
Total cost ordering in 1's is about 60€. If anyone is interested I can share a cart for digikey/mouser with everything you need in exact quantity (once you stockpile about 8 large boxes full of leftover SMD's you start seeing the value of ordering just two damn 0603 resitors even if that's more expensive than ordering 25 or 50 as you did when your room had more space)

I am interested in sharing a cart. I am located in Canada however, which might make things more difficult. Let me know!
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: TheElectricChicken on August 12, 2015, 12:41:11 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on August 06, 2015, 01:32:16 am
because it need complicated milling like this (https://www.xn--80aighkbzclf7a.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/%D0%91%D0%BE%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B0%D1%8F-%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%81%D1%82%D0%BE%D1%87%D0%BA%D0%B0-2.jpg) and this (https://www.xn--80aighkbzclf7a.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/%D0%9A%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%BF%D1%83%D1%81-%D0%B8%D0%B7%D0%BD%D1%83%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B8.jpg). It make by the hands with Dremel and "file" in first prototype. Last versions fully doing on CNC machine.

I want to help with this important project. I want to make for myself. I can print 3D, I can Draw 3D. I design for 3D printing. Can you post measurements ? I can draw and post STL file for 3D printing for free. I want to help.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: JackM on August 12, 2015, 11:33:24 pm
shodan, I've got a question about the chosen values for the resistor network configuration on the buck converter.

Based on the schematic, you've chosen to go with the 4-resistor configuration detailed in the TPS62736 datasheet. It's basically two resistor voltage dividers for the VOUT_SET and the VIN_OK_SET pins that determine the output voltage and set the acceptable VIN threshold to control the VIN_OK output indicator logic pin.

In the TPS62736 datasheet it recommends that the sum of the two resistors in each divider be 13 Mohm. In your schematic you've got a 7.5 Mohm and a 5.1 Mohm resistor for the VIN_OK_SET divider. I was wondering why you chose the 7.5 Mohm instead of an 8 Mohm resistor? Is it because you wanted a slightly lower (2.989V) VIN_OK threshold? I would have figured you'd go for 3.1V as a threshold, but maybe there is something I'm missing here.

Also, for the resistor divider on the VOUT_SET pin, the sum of the two branches (R16 + R17||R20) is no where close to 13 Mohm, it's more like 5.5 Mohm. Why is this? Is it to achieve a very slightly higher input quiescent current?
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 14, 2015, 10:31:30 am
Hi, I have just received the two SBM-10 I ordered. I am concerned because they make a rattling noise when you move them, like they have something loose inside. Is this normal or did I get two broken geiger tubes?
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Rubi on August 14, 2015, 01:08:17 pm
Hi

Mine also rattles, hopefully this is by design.

Cheers
Michael
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 15, 2015, 04:47:08 pm
The seller has told me that some SBM-10 were manufactured with fixed getters, while others have unfixed getters and thus they rattle. Is that a possible explanation?

They don't rattle the same way, one of the tubes sounds like if it had a completelly loose ball inside that can move in any direction while the other sounds like it has a ball attached to some flexible structure/spring. I'm not sure about what's the deal in here, I don't know how the internal structure/components of this tubes would look like. On the other hand considering how small they are I find them quite difficult to break...
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 15, 2015, 05:21:21 pm
I won't get all the parts until late august so I won't be able to test the tubes until then... and ebay buyer protection will have already expired by then, that's why I'm investigating if this rattling is important or not. Apparently rattling SBM-20's are sometimes sensitive to movement and that would be unacceptable for me:
https://mightyohm.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=3388

This is exactly what the seller has told me about the fixed/unfixed getters:
Quote
Some manufacturers made tubes with fixed getter, but few manufacturers made is unfixed. it is absolutely normal.

In vacuum tubes (triodes, pentodes, etc) the getter is typically a ring of metal  that they heat after the tube is sealed (they call that flashing) so it sputters a coating of metal that adsorbs residual gases and helps to keep the vacuum. As far as I know geiger tubes aren't in a vacuum and don't require a getter. (https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%93%D0%B5%D1%82%D1%82%D0%B5%D1%80_%28%D0%B3%D0%B0%D0%B7%D0%BE%D0%BF%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%BB%D0%BE%D1%82%D0%B8%D1%82%D0%B5%D0%BB%D1%8C%29)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 25, 2015, 10:46:05 am
Today I've received the PCB's and cases and everything fits well. The only components I'm still missing are the screens (on their way but quite delayed because of some "chinese military manouvers"), the vibration motors and some diodes that were out of stock and got sent yesterday so they'll arrive tomorrow. I would have assembled the PCB today if I had the missing diodes... I'm travelling tomorrow and I'll be out of town until september so I'll have to wait.

I have 6 spare PCB's. Let me know if anyone wants one.

(http://i.imgur.com/PcXCuF9.jpg)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Rubi on August 29, 2015, 05:22:01 pm
Hi

I ordered the 8.06 pcb, does the 8.02 firmware work with this board ?

Is it possible to buy one or two cases from you ?
I am not the best in cutting plastic,...

Cheers
Rubi
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Rubi on August 29, 2015, 05:23:58 pm
Quote from: dmg on August 25, 2015, 10:46:05 am

I have 6 spare PCB's. Let me know if anyone wants one.


I could also give some away within the european region.

Cheers
Rubi
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 30, 2015, 07:38:49 am
What do you mean by thermal barrier is missing in some pads? Does it mean that you wanted pads to connect like the left image and they connect like the right one? [img]http://i.stack.imgur.com/MkZdx.png[\img]

I still haven't received the screens but now at least they have  left china.

BTW I have 6 cases and I only need 2. I don't think I'll get the machining right the first time and I'll sacrifice one for testing the plastic with my cnc's tools to get the correct speed and feedrate. In the best case scenario I'll get 4 machined cases so 2 spares if anyone wants one.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on August 30, 2015, 10:06:48 am
At the first blink it was not obvious what that image tried to show, so probably the info below would be helpful to others also.

thermal relief
Since copper is an efficient heat sink, connections to a large region of copper would be very difficult to solder - the copper heat sink prevents you from adequately heating the connection. To fix this, small cutouts are made around each such connection to create a thermal barrier, so that heat applied to the connection stays at the connection. Such a set of cutouts, and the copper bridges that remain, is called a “thermal”. Thermals come in many patterns, which allows the designer to ensure adequate electrical connectivity and/or manufacturability.

(http://s9.postimg.org/4acoa1v1r/term_thermal_1.png)
Pins with no connection, three types of thermals, and no thermal.


(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d4/PCB_copper_pour_thermal_pads.png/500px-PCB_copper_pour_thermal_pads.png)
Thermal pads can be seen in several locations on this Printed circuit board (PCB), in particular, the bottom pad of the three vertical pads in the top left corner.



Sources:
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 31, 2015, 06:32:21 pm
Well, I've almost assembled one ultramicron. I still haven't installed the geiger tube because I've run out of isopropyl alcohol so I can't properly clean the PCB yet, I'll buy some tomorrow and install the geiger after cleanup.

Here are some pictures:
Part way through assembly:
(http://i.imgur.com/7WnRMmB.jpg)
After reflow and fixing some minor shorts. Note the flux residue.(yes, I've reflowed the motor but I think these are reflowable and if not... well... YOLO):
(http://i.imgur.com/Gbl3vGw.jpg)
Charging the battery (led not visible due to flash):
(http://i.imgur.com/dBQSgtM.jpg)

As you see I've done a little mod to include a connector for the battery. It's an SMD connector hacked to somewhat fit in there. I've checked and there should still be enough clearance with the case. I've also checked that the geiger can still be assembled and fit in the case this way.

I have uploaded the DFU bootloader succesfully and then loaded the firmware via DFU. No problems there. The micron is detected as a virtual com port but I have issues with the USB geiger program. It doesn't detect the micron automatically (I've assigned the micron to COM2) and this is how the program looks like in my computer (Win 7 64bit, windows classic theme, 1920x1080 screen resolution):
(http://i.imgur.com/jTkbnfJ.png)

Any clue?

Also, after assembly, programming and powe up I've checked the voltage at the tube terminal and my crappy multimeter tells me it's 200V when it should be 400. Probably the multimeter is loading the supply too much to keep the voltage up... what do you think? I'll check with a real high-z meter at work one of these days.

Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on August 31, 2015, 07:33:59 pm
Ouch, I've turned it off right now, I hope I haven't fried the mosfets. I checked the voltage at the HV cap and my crapmeter says 317 V. Anyway I still have materials to build another one in case this one doesn't work or I've fried something.

I'll have to wait for the screens as I still haven't received them. Hopefully they'll be here this week....

edit: Yes, I run on medium or big fonts. But don't worry, after you dowload the logs it becomes usable.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: callipso on September 01, 2015, 08:25:21 am
Quote from: Rubi on August 29, 2015, 05:23:58 pm
Quote from: dmg on August 25, 2015, 10:46:05 am

I have 6 spare PCB's. Let me know if anyone wants one.


I could also give some away within the european region.

Cheers
Rubi

Ooh, do you have any left?
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on September 03, 2015, 07:09:07 pm
Today I got the screen and assembled the tube. I've set the pump to 8T (it was the default value). It always reads 0 uR/h... I think the tube is broken... Any extra things to do?

EDIT: it says BAT= 3.8V, 3V = 3.08V HV=360V

imp/min = 34
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on September 03, 2015, 07:48:21 pm
My meter measures 308V at HV cap. If i touch with something metalic the uR/h jump a lot and the alarm sounds. I've reset it and now it says between 130 and 172 imp/min but still 0uR/h

By the way how do I wake it up? when it goes to sleep I can only turn it back on by connecting the USB. If I touch the buttons nothing happens.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on September 03, 2015, 08:22:24 pm
I've increased pump voltage to 410 V and I measure 350V at HV cap. My meter is very bad, I'll try at work tomorrow.

Yes, uR/H goes up and the line moves right, that works well.


Here are the pictures, hope they are high resolution enough.

(http://i.imgur.com/B6f5iUc.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/hgtTesB.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/EUEsb7o.jpg)

BTW I think it's been working for some time because it was measuring steady 15uR/h, but I moved it to test the HV cap and now it reads 0 uR/h again....
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on September 05, 2015, 09:16:55 pm
Well, looks like the first geiger tube I used was bad as it was working intermitently and required higher than normal voltage for starting counting. It was also somewhat insensitive. I've swapped it for the other sensor I had and now I think my UltraMicron is 100% working.

I've popped the bad tube open to see what's inside and what was the source of the rattling noise it had. Turns out there was nothing broken inside. The tube has three main parts, the outer can, an inner tube and a glass insulator that caps the inner tube. That glass insulator is loose and it doesn't seem to have any glue residue nor any other evidence suggesting that this came loose, it was just manufactured like that so the rattling noise is perfectly normal.

Here are some pictures (sorry for the very bad focusing, for some reason my phone had a very hard time focusing on the thing....):

(http://i.imgur.com/7v1UrO2.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/lVFEfh7.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/y71HAPP.jpg)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: JackM on September 07, 2015, 01:28:42 am
Quote from: dmg on September 05, 2015, 09:16:55 pm
I've popped the bad tube open to see what's inside and what was the source of the rattling noise it had. Turns out there was nothing broken inside. The tube has three main parts, the outer can, an inner tube and a glass insulator that caps the inner tube. That glass insulator is loose and it doesn't seem to have any glue residue nor any other evidence suggesting that this came loose, it was just manufactured like that so the rattling noise is perfectly normal.

Thanks for the interesting dissection photos! Pretty simple device when you get down to it.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: NO_name on September 07, 2015, 08:40:55 pm
solder it quickly, otherwise and you will have chance to make such photos :)
(https://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/15539/1385574.4/0_d6565_52293d1_L.jpg)(https://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/6500/1385574.4/0_d6563_8f62745a_L.jpg)(https://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/5901/1385574.4/0_d656f_75ff6616_L.jpg)(https://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/3805/1385574.4/0_d656d_e9987cfa_L.jpg)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on September 08, 2015, 08:45:33 pm
I made my first attempt to build the case today. It went relatively OK. For anyone that wants to machine a case like this note that they are made of a very easy to machine plastic. It has to be some sort of ABS with tons of fillers that make it hard-ish and resistant to temperature. It won't easily melt and clog your tool. I've been able to machine it at 10k RPM with a 4-flute 1mm end mill that I normaly use for fiberglass laminates and hard stuff using water as lubricant and the results are good enough for the pourpose. All the mills I have for cutting plastics turned out to be too short for the job.

(http://i.imgur.com/4SsSlsu.jpg)

It's still missing the butons and the scren guard, I plan on making the screen guard out of machined polycarbonate from a CD and I'll try to mill the buttons in acrylic. But well, everything fits!
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Rubi on September 14, 2015, 06:45:08 am
Sorry I was on vacation, yes I have one left, pm me your address.

Cheers
Michael

Quote from: callipso on September 01, 2015, 08:25:21 am
Quote from: Rubi on August 29, 2015, 05:23:58 pm
Quote from: dmg on August 25, 2015, 10:46:05 am

I have 6 spare PCB's. Let me know if anyone wants one.


I could also give some away within the european region.

Cheers
Rubi

Ooh, do you have any left?
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: NO_name on September 18, 2015, 07:31:58 am
Good job, I already have tested it.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: JackM on September 21, 2015, 11:58:38 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on September 19, 2015, 08:12:34 am
Also i be forced to delete all sourcecode of firmware and PC Software in public repository. I afraid it be steal my project.

Now i provide only "compiled binary firmware".
Without license on it, work almost all features, except new.

That's too bad to hear :(
I was still planning on making one of these dosimeters of my own and even possibly contributing to the project.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on September 27, 2015, 01:01:41 pm
Why building one when you can build two?
(http://i.imgur.com/zkmGiuh.jpg)
Both are now working, I need to machine a new case for the second one and re-clean it a little bit. The one in the case has a rattling tube, the other has a non-rattling tube. I've checked them for a while and they correlate very well, not only do they stay at almost the same radiation level but they do track each other very well too, if one starts reading higher the other follows the trend very soon. This mostly confirms that indeed I have the radiation record of all microns currently registered within the monitoring system and that the tubes are consistent with each other. Next step is finding something radioactive to test them, maybe I'll hide one of these inside the pile of bananas at the supermarket...

I've had a lot of fun building these, It's hard to find great self-contained and useful proyects that are worth building in these days of arduinos, and this is also a very good lesson on low power electronics and power converters.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: SeanB on September 27, 2015, 01:33:30 pm
Big bulk pack of gas mantles will work well as a test source. The cheaper the better, just buy a big pack of the cheapest ones, which will have enough Sr in them to register above your background levels.

If you have piped natural gas that is also slightly radioactive from Radon inside it.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: apis on September 27, 2015, 04:44:08 pm
This is indeed a cool project.

I'm sorry if this is a stupid question but why is the isolation so important on the HV side, is it to save battery power or is it because the detection circuit is so sensitive?

(And system shock was a good game  ^-^)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 12:44:23 pm
Hello,
can I buy the UltraMicron somewhere?
I am very interested in the data the device provides.
But unfortunately I lack the knowledge to build the device.

I want the end of my trip to Japan Blog restart. Of course, the data would be very intresting by fukushima.
Thank you very much
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 02:05:33 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on February 14, 2016, 01:55:21 pm
Dear frank, unfortunately i do not sell it now.
Just because i have no time for it.

No problem, maybe someone else can help me in this forum?

By the way, is this (https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/sQYExg6e) the new one?
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 02:23:49 pm
I can understand you well, you want that is not stolen your idea. I have but the problem that for me knowledge, technique and skill is lacking :'( .
Moreover, I think that is not "selling" here. I pay the material and working time for only one device.
And I can imagine to donate to you, even if someone else is solder for me.

But please answer my second question, is this (https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/sQYExg6e) the new one?
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 04:05:39 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on February 14, 2016, 02:28:04 pm
"I pay the material and working time for only one device." - that is also selling.
It's like giving a beer to a good friend for his help or is it also selling for you? I don't say bring it on the market...


Quote from: shodan@micron on February 14, 2016, 02:28:04 pm
It project i made for hobbyists who like build some devices by itself.
And I'm a hobbyist how likes to make something with the data provided by the device.
But I'm not good at suche things like soldering, because of my shaky hands. I've been just not steady enough.

You have the opinion because I'm not good enough in dealing with the soldering iron, I may not have the hardware?
This contradicts the open source idea completely. I do not know what you want to achieve with it.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on February 14, 2016, 09:34:27 pm
This is just a hint for your clue.

You see, you are the one who killed your own project,
why would anyone be part of it?

You own it, you sell it or just let it die peacefully,
there is not much reason to contribute with you.

This gadget just faintly more than a proprietary stuff,
so you are the one who needs to decide how to treat it.

If you stick to it so hard and also want to share it with others
someway do everything by yourself.
(Arrange the mass production, retailing and selling).

OR just simply amuse yourself and few of your fellas.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on February 14, 2016, 09:53:42 pm
Be happy with yourself, your attitude and few of your friends.

I will do the same with my "solder iron", what is working, even if you "do not see".
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 09:59:14 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on February 14, 2016, 09:46:52 pm
I do not see hobbyst here, it is sad for me... i see only "I CAN'T" "I WANT BUY" "MASS PRODUCTION"....
No hobbyists... almost nobody!
Okay my hobby is not make new hardware that is true, but my hobby is big data.
I'm working on projekts like loklak.org or yacy, why is using data no hobby?

And I want to contribute to you.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 10:05:25 pm

Why you give yourself then the effort to create a possibility to load the data to the PC?
I do not get the idea
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on February 14, 2016, 10:08:00 pm
Quote from: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 09:59:14 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on February 14, 2016, 09:46:52 pm
I do not see hobbyst here, it is sad for me... i see only "I CAN'T" "I WANT BUY" "MASS PRODUCTION"....
No hobbyists... almost nobody!
Okay my hobby is not make new hardware that is true, but my hobby is big data.
I'm working on projekts like loklak.org or yacy, why is using data no hobby?

And I want to contribute to you.

It has been revealed: "So this project is not for you. Sorry!
" , do not worry it is not for me either and many other "inferior ones", even if I am able to assemble it.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 10:14:23 pm
If you think I'm not the person for your device... help me to finde a divce which i can use without you.
Noone will earn money with the data on a travel blog but I can show that japan is safe to travel.
I love Japan.
(http://bilder-upload.3server.de/thumb.php?image=1455488155_unbenannt.png) (http://bilder-upload.3server.de/index.php?info=1455488155_unbenannt.png)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Someone on February 14, 2016, 10:59:45 pm
Quote from: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 10:14:23 pm
If you think I'm not the person for your device... help me to finde a divce which i can use without you.
Noone will earn money with the data on a travel blog but I can show that japan is safe to travel.
I love Japan.
Just measuring external count rates does not provide the complete picture, ingestion/inhalation of alpha emitters is possibly the biggest risk after an accident and very hard to measure with compact or cheap equipment.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 15, 2016, 08:04:42 am
Quote from: Someone on February 14, 2016, 10:59:45 pm
Quote from: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 10:14:23 pm
If you think I'm not the person for your device... help me to finde a divce which i can use without you.
Noone will earn money with the data on a travel blog but I can show that japan is safe to travel.
I love Japan.
Just measuring external count rates does not provide the complete picture, ingestion/inhalation of alpha emitters is possibly the biggest risk after an accident and very hard to measure with compact or cheap equipment.
I think some data is better than no data. I think for a guidance value the unit is good.

Quote from: shodan@micron on February 14, 2016, 10:18:04 pm
Try this https://www.sparkfun.com/news/1099 (https://www.sparkfun.com/news/1099)
Your device looks like a better one.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 15, 2016, 10:42:38 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on February 15, 2016, 09:50:13 am

Besides, I told you before, any distribution fee it is deny! Only I have the right to do so. But now i no have time for it.


Sounds like microsoft for me... not like open hardware.
Sorry that is my opinion.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on February 15, 2016, 10:53:53 pm
Quote from: frank_gamefreak on February 15, 2016, 10:42:38 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on February 15, 2016, 09:50:13 am

Besides, I told you before, any distribution fee it is deny! Only I have the right to do so. But now i no have time for it.


Sounds like microsoft for me... not like open hardware.
Sorry that is my opinion.

Exactly, with just a little difference: other owners of successful proprietary stuff take the effort to reach  the goal by themselves,
when they have decided that they do not want to share their goods for real. That is viable way of thinking and who thinks it seriously
can do it seriously.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on February 15, 2016, 10:56:21 pm
Quote from: shodan@micron on February 15, 2016, 10:50:57 pm
This is open, but i deny distribution by fee.
It is my right, and I use it.
As I say to you yesterday... this project not for you.

FREEMIUM
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: Someone on February 15, 2016, 11:57:21 pm
Quote from: frank_gamefreak on February 15, 2016, 08:04:42 am
Quote from: Someone on February 14, 2016, 10:59:45 pm
Quote from: frank_gamefreak on February 14, 2016, 10:14:23 pm
If you think I'm not the person for your device... help me to finde a divce which i can use without you.
Noone will earn money with the data on a travel blog but I can show that japan is safe to travel.
I love Japan.
Just measuring external count rates does not provide the complete picture, ingestion/inhalation of alpha emitters is possibly the biggest risk after an accident and very hard to measure with compact or cheap equipment.
I think some data is better than no data. I think for a guidance value the unit is good.
Suggesting an area is "safe" from incomplete data would be very dangerous.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on February 16, 2016, 06:29:43 am
Quote from: shodan@micron on February 15, 2016, 11:01:27 pm
Quote from: osiixy on February 15, 2016, 10:56:21 pm
FREEMIUM
You are wrong!

Source code and hardware is open!
I no longer receive a license fee and provided keygen and all sources to public!
I only get stats about count of assembled devices.

Any hobbyst can use my source, but he(or some else) can't get fee on any reason. It is open for my opinion!

Open it don't mean - any can get fee on my project.

That means yours flood is fail. :-DD :-DD :-DD


I like when people learns, do some device by hands, I respect that!

But when someone complains that he lacks experience to do make some OPEN hardware what he wants. I hate that!
If you can't do some, learn it! This is useful!

Sorry for my opinion!

It does not matter. You have the right for your opinion, and changing it as many times as you wish
(but you was the one also who complaining:
Quote from: shodan@micron on September 19, 2015, 08:12:34 am
But now, all new features is must contain licensed(8$).

I got a lot of offers on the production from many different companies, but not one of them do not agree my fees 1% sale price.
Also i be forced to delete all sourcecode of firmware and PC Software in public repository. I afraid it be steal my project.

Now i provide only "compiled binary firmware".
Without license on it, work almost all features, except new.

Ah... 8$ - it is because... no one... NO ONE of all people who make my devices of many-many years, not donate just a cent for my projects.... no one ...
I think... it little fees for some features and closed source... do people little more generous in future. :)
)

I have got no intention to follow your project so deeply to learn
that you do not insist on money anymore (which is acceptable
but in this case your DIY open design hardware is a honeypot
for FREEMIUM pricing strategy, which is also OK just lets clarify definitions).

I also agree that doing hardware by yourself is a wonderful way to gain new
knowledge, I do the same, and there is nothing fancy or impossible with SMD
(but it is also a fact that not everybody has all the possibilities to get in to it,
you can be sure it does not matter how tough or repelling you are you cannot
stop others to crack your code get around your restrictive licensing.
IMHO there are already many guys who are selling your gadget but not
interested in to notify you. They help themselves and others, who are
imbecile and inferiors in your eyes, out).

Be tough like adamant you have the right!
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on February 16, 2016, 07:09:48 am
Quote from: osiixy on February 16, 2016, 06:29:43 am
IMHO there are already many guys who are selling your gadget but not
interested in to notify you. They help themselves and others, who are
imbecile and inferiors in your eyes, out).

You're absolutely right. I was just kind enough to ask you.
I also could go to the nearest university and ask for help there. You would never know it.  :-//
I would donate something for education in my town.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on February 16, 2016, 07:16:23 am
Quote from: shodan@micron on February 16, 2016, 07:01:11 am
osiixy - Yours misconception not interested for me.

No need crack my code ;D it is open fully and included keygen.

PS.As i see you just dont understand me. Sorry i cant help you. I try to explain, but you don't understand again...

I rejoice with you over your supremacy!
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: dmg on March 01, 2016, 10:46:15 pm
I missed this, and yes, I'm building the new model too. Already ordered the tubes and shodan was kind enough to give me a couple PCB's, so I'm in business again. If all goes well and I don't break any tube (they're expensive) I'll build two.
Being alpha sensitive I'll hopefully be able to monitor radiation from granite.

EDIT: Maker culture is quite different in Russia than it is in the US or Europe, russians tend to pride themselfs a lot in creations and tend to be quite zealous about diffusion until the product is mature and well proven. I don't see the rules in this proyect that abussive, It's just open as long as you don't make any profit from it, pretty common in software (non-commecial usage licenses). This limits the diffusion and the liability of the creator. Imagine if this went mass-produced and sold by someone... being quite a delicate device that's not designed for mass-production and has fragile components inside and requires technical knowledge to operate, I imagine people would break things and then likely turn to shodan for support, so he'll end up supporting people and getting in trouble for free, while other gets the profit.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: frank_gamefreak on March 05, 2016, 11:00:38 pm
Quote from: dmg on March 01, 2016, 10:46:15 pm
Maker culture is quite different in Russia than it is in the US or Europe, russians tend to pride themselfs a lot
It simply proves all prejudices i have.
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: osiixy on March 05, 2016, 11:23:49 pm
Quote from: frank_gamefreak on March 05, 2016, 11:00:38 pm
Quote from: dmg on March 01, 2016, 10:46:15 pm
Maker culture is quite different in Russia than it is in the US or Europe, russians tend to pride themselfs a lot
It simply proves all prejudices i have.

 ;D No need to have that sort of prejudices  ;D
I know so many type of people regardless to her or his nationality.
I even know quite nice Russians.

So, if you take my advice, draw a conclusion per se.
(but you do not need to take it, everybody has her or his own way,
my part is only to decide if I would like to be part of her or his life).

(that's f*cking nothing wisdom and absolutely futile,
do not take me seriously)
Title: Re: EEVblog #776 - World's Smallest Digital Dosimeter
Post by: teddhj on April 17, 2016, 05:56:07 pm
I have build the 5.01 model .
First time for me to build with SMD ...let me tell you it's very small :) I did use USB microscope and magnifying glasses.
I will recommend to build the one with Mica window ....it's actually very sensitive and you can detect Alfa radiation.
I want to thank Shodan for all help and support without his help i will not have made it. He even sent me a Geiger tube for free to help me finish the project :)
Shodan did a excellent piece of engineering on this geiger counter.

Here is som Picture from the Build........