Author Topic: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300  (Read 23522 times)

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Offline Lightages

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2016, 04:08:23 pm »
I did a thread on a cheap lab setup years ago, but I can't find it. Anyone?
 

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2016, 04:47:51 pm »
Seems easier to buy one new one ?  $7.15

I think that would depend if you want or need genuine ones or not.

Plato cutters are readily available from China (indeed I've bought several carton loads for resale over the years), if you buy in lots of 10 they usually come in branded 10-pack cartons, they are also usually stamped physically on the metalwork under the handle with "Made in USA".

I certainly have no evidence to say they don't, but I would certainly be surprised if random chinese vendors were importing their flushcutters from the US for resale :-/

But of course they work just fine at least for casual use, indeed I find them very nice.  Sharp, good tight point, cut well, as long as you use them for what they are intended, component leg trimming, and not try and cut like 0.1" header pins or something. 


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Offline Someone

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2016, 05:51:48 pm »
But of course they work just fine at least for casual use, indeed I find them very nice.  Sharp, good tight point, cut well, as long as you use them for what they are intended, component leg trimming, and not try and cut like 0.1" header pins or something.
But thats the problem, you don't expect a cheap cutter to be able to cut the common example of 0.1" header pins (0.65mm brass or phosphor bronze pins) which are soft and trivial for the next step up of a sub $20 cutter. How low should the expectation of a cutter be? Cutting soft materials under 1mm diameter is a very common electronics application.
 

Online EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2016, 05:58:11 pm »
I'm getting into electronics for DIY guitar pedal building and some amp stuff. Is the owon scope going to be ok for this? I did a search but saw some comments that it might be unsuitable. A cheap 2nd hand analog scope hasn't come my way yet.

What price?
A cheap 2nd hand analog scope is nice.
I wouldn't pay more than $50 for one
 

Online Towger

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2016, 06:16:09 pm »


Actually, I've always wondered how well those "jewelers/dentists" magnifiers work.  Anyone have any comments on these ?

My mate Doug Ford who you've seen on the show swears by them.
Not a huge fan myself, I find them annoying, but they kinda work.

The proper ones are big money, several times full the budget.
 

Online sleemanj

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #30 on: December 11, 2016, 06:38:04 pm »
0.1" header pins (0.65mm brass or phosphor bronze pins)

The majority of cheap square pin male pcb header pins I've come across are magnetic, if that says more about the pins or about my cheap-ass-ness, I can't say.

It's not that cheap flushcutters won't cut 0.1" headers, but that you probably shouldn't if you want to keep the blades in good nick.

There's not much call for trimming header pins anyway. 
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Offline Someone

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #31 on: December 11, 2016, 08:58:04 pm »
0.1" header pins (0.65mm brass or phosphor bronze pins)

The majority of cheap square pin male pcb header pins I've come across are magnetic, if that says more about the pins or about my cheap-ass-ness, I can't say.

It's not that cheap flushcutters won't cut 0.1" headers, but that you probably shouldn't if you want to keep the blades in good nick.

There's not much call for trimming header pins anyway.
I've trimmed endless volumes (10's of thousands) of header pins with the same pair of Xuron 170 cutters, their budget line under $10USD:
http://www.jensentools.com/xuron-170-ii-micro-shear-sup-tm-sup-flush-cutter/p/114-845
http://www.concorde-electronics.com/products/Xuron-170-II.html
http://www.techni-tool.com/892PL1025
Thats the sort of performance you should demand in the price range, this is a production quality tool thats used around the world professionally. Sure there are harder tools available from Erem or Lindstrom but everyone I know who's tried the Xuron tools has been amazed at the performance and price.
 

Offline G7PSK

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #32 on: December 11, 2016, 09:11:39 pm »
Actually, I've always wondered how well those "jewelers/dentists" magnifiers work.  Anyone have any comments on these ?

I have one  of the head band type magnifiers, they work very well, but as I started life as a horologist I guess I am used to using them and loupes. Mine came with an led light but that was a bit weak so I built my own with the front of a 1 watt led torch and a lithium battery plus usb charging and protection.
 

Offline Fungus

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #33 on: December 11, 2016, 09:44:59 pm »
I just realized: I want a purple multimeter!

At first I was like  :palm: but then it kinda grew on me.

I haven't seen those before, Must be a new design.

Autoranging? uA, Hz and capacitance modes? "Off" positions at both ends of the dial....?

I just ordered one.  Can't wait to pull it out at Arduino club.  :popcorn:
 

Offline george graves

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #34 on: December 11, 2016, 10:21:33 pm »
Really glad you did this video! It's going to help a lot of people out.....

When I started out, all those prices were triple, at least.

Question:  When did the likes of Mouser and Digikey make it so that anyone Joe could order a single component?  I recall their printed catalogs back in the 80's - had one in my bedroom - and would offten look at the parts.  But didn't you have to have a cooperate account or something? That would be a great video blog idea - how and when the suppliers open up to the little guy.


Offline bleko

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« Last Edit: December 11, 2016, 10:29:05 pm by bleko »
 

Offline LeadInMyHead

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #36 on: December 12, 2016, 02:37:39 am »
I love my Italian "Hakko" CHP-170 flush cutters. They aren't as sharp as the Plato ones, but they do a better job at cutting pins and component leads. They sell for under 5 bucks on Amazon USA!
I stuck two little neodymium magnets to the cutters and it helps to stop the component leads from flying across the room. My wife appreciates that I keep my workspace / her bedroom clean.

I also got some Plato cutters from China for like 3$ (probably clones), which I use as my general purpose cutters. Being so sharp, they do a good job with softer material.

CHP 170 cutters (5$)
https://www.amazon.com/Hakko-CHP-170-Stand-off-Construction-21-Degree/dp/B00FZPDG1K/ref=pd_nav_hcs_bia_t_3?_encoding=UTF8&refRID=C0SZ0A4RFC42W072Y9HJ&th=1

I also love the long-nose pliers that CHP makes. I use CHP PN-2007 for bending the leads of through-hole components and other "precision" work.
 

Offline Lightages

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #37 on: December 12, 2016, 02:45:41 am »
I did a thread on a cheap lab setup years ago, but I can't find it. Anyone?

http://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/the-$250-electrnoics-lab-a-suggested-setup-for-beginners/msg265338/#msg265338

Thanks. It is hopefully a good reference too. Some prices have changed and some of the products are sold out with the links provided, but they are still available as relisted porducts or are still good references .
 

Offline Koldman

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #38 on: December 12, 2016, 08:37:47 am »
Which model OWON?

I've got some old CRO's that might be OK for you but need fixing.
As a Kiwi (local) and an EEVblog member now I can probably do you a better deal on an entry level Siglent.
What price?
A cheap 2nd hand analog scope is nice.
I wouldn't pay more than $50 for one
I was referring to the OWON VDS1022I USB Oscilloscope: http://amzn.to/2hguCer linked in the youtube video for about $110
2nd hand analog scopes in working condition tend not to go for less than $200nz on trademe. Saving is difficult but I realize going cheap can be costly too.
 

Offline rolycat

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #39 on: December 12, 2016, 08:45:21 am »
I just realized: I want a purple multimeter!

At first I was like  :palm: but then it kinda grew on me.

I haven't seen those before, Must be a new design.

Autoranging? uA, Hz and capacitance modes? "Off" positions at both ends of the dial....?

I just ordered one.  Can't wait to pull it out at Arduino club.  :popcorn:

There are several different names and colour schemes for what appears to be the same, consistently mis-spelled "DIGTAL MULTIMETER", you can pick the NKTECH NK51E, the AIMOMETER F0601005 (or MS8233D Pro), or the WIYSOND WD136B, and quite possibly others.

The cheapest currently seems to be the green version, at $12.22 with free shipping.



 

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #40 on: December 12, 2016, 08:59:55 am »
Which model OWON?

I've got some old CRO's that might be OK for you but need fixing.
As a Kiwi (local) and an EEVblog member now I can probably do you a better deal on an entry level Siglent.
What price?
A cheap 2nd hand analog scope is nice.
I wouldn't pay more than $50 for one
I was referring to the OWON VDS1022I USB Oscilloscope: http://amzn.to/2hguCer linked in the youtube video for about $110
2nd hand analog scopes in working condition tend not to go for less than $200nz on trademe. Saving is difficult but I realize going cheap can be costly too.
That'll be OK to start with but if you need to use it anywhere else you'll need to lug a laptop along as well of course.
You've probably seen my stuff on Trademe and I can do much better deals if you contact me direct as I don't have to shell out any success fees after sale to Trademe.
Only you can make the decision to shell out on the OWON only to have what you spend on it unavailable for something better.
Give us a yell if you like.

BTW Welcome to the forum.
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Offline djos

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2016, 10:04:17 am »
Actually, I've always wondered how well those "jewelers/dentists" magnifiers work.  Anyone have any comments on these ?

My mate Doug Ford who you've seen on the show swears by them.
Not a huge fan myself, I find them annoying, but they kinda work.

If you've got wonky eyes like me and have full prism lenses they are next to useless.  :o
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.

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Offline ez24

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #42 on: December 12, 2016, 10:15:12 am »
Dave: suggestion

Do not use  $  and  !   in titles.

Links to these posts do not work unless HTML is used on them.  It took me an hour to learn how to link to this post.

For example here is a link to your post, notice the link stops at the $ sign (someone said ! does the same thing)

http://www.eevblog.com/forum/blog/eevblog-954-how-to-setup-an-electronics-lab-for-$300/msg1088467/#msg1088467

YouTube and Website Electronic Resources ------>  http://www.eevblog.com/forum/other-blog-specific/a/msg1341166/#msg1341166
 

Online mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #43 on: December 12, 2016, 10:24:57 am »
I looked at one of the higher-end OWON PC scopes and found it surprisingly good. What they had got particularly right is that it was basically a complete scope in the box, with USB just being used to transfer the screen images. This is unlike many others which transfer ADC data over USB, and so are subject to latency & delays etc., caused by the PC






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Offline ez24

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #44 on: December 12, 2016, 10:33:42 am »
I looked at one of the higher-end OWON PC scopes and found it surprisingly good. What they had got particularly right is that it was basically a complete scope in the box, with USB just being used to transfer the screen images. This is unlike many others which transfer ADC data over USB, and so are subject to latency & delays etc., caused by the PC



Yes but it is $400.  So I think it should be compared to the Rigol DZ1054

https://www.amazon.com/VDS3104L-Virtual-Oscilloscope-Channel-Control/dp/B00KFX5C2S/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1481498978&sr=8-2&keywords=owon+usb+oscilloscope
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Offline lowimpedance

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #45 on: December 12, 2016, 11:20:52 am »
Actually, I've always wondered how well those "jewelers/dentists" magnifiers work.  Anyone have any comments on these ?

My mate Doug Ford who you've seen on the show swears by them.
Not a huge fan myself, I find them annoying, but they kinda work.

Like anything optical - you generally get what you pay for. The super cheap ones are useless IME. The Donegon Optivisor brand for $40-50 is decent and what I often use. Bonus is the wide range of easily swapable lenses and optional LED lights.

If you have the money to spend, you can invest in a custom pair of surgical loupes with quality lenses - at a cost of $800 or so. Surgeons will tell you they're well worth the money.  I've never been able to justify that expense myself.
Absolutely agree. I have tried quite a variety of magnifying solutions for my aging eyes and the 'optivisor' at around 2.5 X mag with the flip around loupe to be the best optical quality at the lowish cost end. I would not recommend the surgical/dentist types though purely on the cost.
 And really a decent quality magnifier will last a very long time, (unless you don't like caring for your tools!), but how long will your eyesight ?. Heh I used to poke fun at all the older duffers at work with their head band mags permanently glued to their heads when I was younger and didn't think that would eventually be me. Well move on a 'few years' and now I am the blind old f@rt constantly looking for any sort of magnification before starting any job !.
The odd multimeter or 2 or 3 or 4...or........can't remember !.
 

Online mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #46 on: December 12, 2016, 11:36:34 am »
I looked at one of the higher-end OWON PC scopes and found it surprisingly good. What they had got particularly right is that it was basically a complete scope in the box, with USB just being used to transfer the screen images. This is unlike many others which transfer ADC data over USB, and so are subject to latency & delays etc., caused by the PC



Yes but it is $400.  So I think it should be compared to the Rigol DZ1054

https://www.amazon.com/VDS3104L-Virtual-Oscilloscope-Channel-Control/dp/B00KFX5C2S/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1481498978&sr=8-2&keywords=owon+usb+oscilloscope
Just mentioning it as they'd done a decent job on the higher-end unit, so reasonably likely the low-end one is OK, though I've not seen it.
 A USB scope is not a good alternative to a real scope, and unless you really need the portability, the Rigol is s total no-brainer over the Owon 3xxx, but the low-end Owon, if it's as reasonable, would be a good option for someone who really couldn't afford even the cheapest standalone scope.
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Offline nanofrog

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #47 on: December 12, 2016, 11:50:54 am »
"Flush side cutters"?
Granted, it depends on location and when you look, but it's possible to get top quality cutters cheap on eBay IME. Takes patience though.  ;)

For example, I've gotten $200+ cutters this way. Granted, I had to wait a few years for this particular pair as they're Tungsten Carbide. Far more common to find ~$60 cutters for say $15 or so though however.  >:D And then there's the stamped steel cutters, such as Xuron or Piergiacomi that can be had inexpensively new.

FWIW, for those in the EU/other parts of the planet, best to look for rebranded Schmitz as used (i.e. Bernstein or C.K. Tools), or buy directly from them as new (~24EUR or less for common shapes & sizes; their Tungsten Carbide cutters are very inexpensive vs. the competition).
 

Offline ez24

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #48 on: December 12, 2016, 12:11:49 pm »
Just mentioning it as they'd done a decent job on the higher-end unit, so reasonably likely the low-end one is OK, though I've not seen it.
 

Good point
YouTube and Website Electronic Resources ------>  http://www.eevblog.com/forum/other-blog-specific/a/msg1341166/#msg1341166
 

Online nctnico

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Re: EEVblog #954 - How To Setup An Electronics Lab For $300
« Reply #49 on: December 12, 2016, 12:19:47 pm »
I'd ditch the lead free solder because it will be a waste of money anyway. Lead-free solder depends a lot more on good flux and a soldering iron set to the right temperature. Even though I'm in lead-free territory I use leaded where I can because it is much easier to work with. On the subject of soldering: IMHO a low end soldering iron from an A-brand will be a good investment even if it means not getting the USB microscope and/or head magnifier.

I'm kinda surprised the Owon scope has isolated USB. It could be an interesting instrument for making floating measurements even if you have a good scope sitting on your bench!
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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