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Author Topic: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown  (Read 5440 times)

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Offline Windfall

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2017, 08:59:06 AM »
"EEVBlog : the oscilloscope !"  :)
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2017, 11:24:29 AM »
What?
A  EEVBlog branded  scope?   :-+



You don't remember last year's Scope Month, do you?
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #27 on: March 18, 2017, 11:33:21 AM »
Dave's announcement of the 2016 Scopemonth promotion - (LAST year's)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xaSYi_n6fw#t=2m17s

I do love that dumpster ... !
« Last Edit: March 18, 2017, 11:45:37 AM by Brumby »
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #28 on: March 18, 2017, 11:50:22 AM »
Here's a shot of the front panel, showing the power on splash screen...
« Last Edit: March 18, 2017, 12:04:12 PM by Brumby »
 

Offline james_s

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #29 on: March 18, 2017, 04:21:00 PM »
Does it make snarky remarks if you try to do something it doesn't like?
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #30 on: March 18, 2017, 05:35:37 PM »
Not that I know of.

It just has Dave's trademark graphic to do that.
 

Offline Windfall

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #31 on: March 19, 2017, 04:48:23 AM »
Not that I know of.

It just has Dave's trademark graphic to do that.

It's a rather unfortunate logo isn't it. It looks like Dave trying to warn you against using this scope !
 

Offline Twoflower

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #32 on: March 19, 2017, 07:12:43 AM »
The downlooking IR-sender/receiver combo is to prevent to fall down stairs. At least the Rooma has some trouble with it there are reports that they not work 100% (dust?) and it also prevents to use them on very dark tiles/carpets (cover with white paper solves this, but it makes the Roomba blind for stairs).

The UV is probably meant to desinfect the floor. How useful it is? I don't know. Probably marketing.

For the Roomba the base station sends two different beams for left and right to identify the alignment between base-station and vacuum. The Top-signal is (again for Roomba) used to prevent the Roomba hitting the base-station.

I think the piezos are only used as impact detector. If dirt is detected it changes the cleaning mode.

Below is a picture of a Roomba in action with a old** NightVision (no IR filter) capable Sony video cam. In IR it makes a nice light-show.

** Yes it uses tape, and the good old PAL resolution ;D
« Last Edit: March 19, 2017, 07:14:50 AM by Twoflower »
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #33 on: March 19, 2017, 12:35:21 PM »
Not that I know of.

It just has Dave's trademark graphic to do that.

It's a rather unfortunate logo isn't it. It looks like Dave trying to warn you against using this scope !

Not against using the scope - just the reaction you'd get when about to clip the ground lead of the probe to somewhere you shouldn't.

Maybe that's why they put that graphic down near the input sockets.....
« Last Edit: March 19, 2017, 12:37:05 PM by Brumby »
 

Offline Alexei.Polkhanov

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #34 on: March 21, 2017, 09:14:59 AM »
Cold cathode UV lamp to kill bacteria in dust collector?

 

Offline thm_w

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #35 on: March 21, 2017, 10:32:46 AM »
Cold cathode UV lamp to kill bacteria in dust collector?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultraviolet_germicidal_irradiation

Yes to kill bacteria, no not in the dust collector as it was pointing down towards the floor.
The cover is likely plastic as well (best case glass) which will block a decent percentage of that UVC. As others have stated, its essentially a gimmick.
 

Offline james_s

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #36 on: March 21, 2017, 11:15:35 AM »
I doubt it would spend enough time over any given area to kill a significant amount of bacteria, and if it did, it would fade the carpet.
 

Offline bitwelder

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #37 on: March 21, 2017, 05:01:18 PM »
Generally how long would it take for a UV lamp to kill bacteria? I guess more than a few seconds.
Considering the location of the lamp on the RoboMaid it would 'disinfect' the floor one poststamp-sized tile at a time. It doesn't look much practical to me.




 

Offline Paul Moir

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #38 on: March 21, 2017, 05:18:27 PM »
It depends on the exposure strength mostly.  It's pretty much a linear relationship with most microbes.  The other thing is how many microbes you want to kill.  1 second might get you 1 log reduction, then 2 seconds gets you 2, etc, so a log relationship on that.
And of course it depends on the microbe:  some are pretty hardy while others are wimps.  That all said, I can't imagine this would work very well on carpet where I expect most the microbes would be hiding down inside and well protected from the UV.
EDIT:  I don't think that really answers you question.  Lets just say that to kill almost all of a fairly average nasty you'll need exposure from a 253nm UV source to the point where you're you're going to get skin irritation.  This little bulb may actually kill the occasional bug but it's not going be sterilizing anything.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2017, 05:32:24 PM by Paul Moir »
 

Offline SeanB

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #39 on: March 22, 2017, 05:23:56 AM »
There to find the nose candy you dropped, so you can grab it out of the dust collector. Will also work to annoy any bacteria on the carpet.
 

Offline Domagoj T

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #40 on: March 22, 2017, 06:56:24 PM »
What's the deal with the wheel drive? It's a rather complicated system, having stepper motors and drivers, optical encoders, logic for both and then the belt and worm gear.

While, generally speaking, I like stepper motors and their simple control logic, once you introduce optical encoders you can easily use regular DC motors which are cheaper, produce less noise, require simpler electronics and are more energy efficient (something that is usually an interesting aspect in a battery operated device).

Now I'm thinking of going to flea markets and salvage some Roombas for their motors.
 

Offline Zbig

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #41 on: March 22, 2017, 07:03:20 PM »
What's the deal with the wheel drive? It's a rather complicated system, having stepper motors and drivers, optical encoders, logic for both and then the belt and worm gear.

While, generally speaking, I like stepper motors and their simple control logic, once you introduce optical encoders you can easily use regular DC motors which are cheaper, produce less noise, require simpler electronics and are more energy efficient (something that is usually an interesting aspect in a battery operated device).

Now I'm thinking of going to flea markets and salvage some Roombas for their motors.

Do you read threads also or only reply? :P I commented on that in the 4th or so post. Dave's not that big on (electro)mechanics and sometimes makes mistakes like that.
 

Offline Domagoj T

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #42 on: March 22, 2017, 08:34:55 PM »
Do you read threads also or only reply? :P I commented on that in the 4th or so post. Dave's not that big on (electro)mechanics and sometimes makes mistakes like that.
My bad. Not sure if it's an excuse, explanation or an even bigger hole I'm digging for myself, but I did read you comment a few days ago, it's just that I occasionally take my time to jump in the conversation.
In any case, I've rewatched the segment with the motor and it really is just a regular DC thingy. A PCB on the motor and a bunch of wires leading to it, combined with Dave's mistake contributed to my own perception that it is a stepper, so I didn't give your post the credit it deserved. My apologies.

Also, for the last couple of weeks I've been working on several different stepper applications of my own, so I'm starting to see them everywhere.
 

Offline Zbig

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #43 on: March 22, 2017, 08:44:28 PM »
No need to apologize, my comment was a bit too harsh :) Peace! :-+
 

Offline ErikTheNorwegian

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #44 on: March 24, 2017, 12:39:59 AM »
From:

"http://tothotornot.com/2013/08/hot-robomaid-robot-vacuum-cleaner/

An unexpected feature that I discovered when I first turned on the Robomaid was a little blue light and ‘UV’ on the display screen. Turns out that the machine includes an in-built UV light which apparently kills bacteria, germs, dustmites and microscopic insects as it vacuums. I have no scientific data to back up whether this in fact occurs but I figure it can’t hurt, especially as Tim suffers from hayfever and my nose is pretty sensitive to dust."

The UV light seems to killed the company to..

http://www.commerce.wa.gov.au/announcements/consumer-advice-buyers-robomaid-vacuum-cleaners

"Consumer Protection has issued advice to WA consumers who have ordered a Robomaid automatic vacuum cleaner and are yet to receive it, to claim a chargeback from their credit card provider or PayPal.

Robomaid Australia, the company which has been importing the product from China, has ceased to trade but has not yet appointed a receiver or liquidator."

« Last Edit: March 24, 2017, 12:44:01 AM by ErikTheNorwegian »
 

Offline Nobody2

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #45 on: March 28, 2017, 02:42:43 AM »
The downlooking IR-sender/receiver combo is to prevent to fall down stairs.
Oh that would make sense. When I first saw them I thought they might be motion detectors (working like a simple mouse sensors), but a stairs detector sounds much more likely.
 

Offline james_s

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #46 on: March 28, 2017, 02:49:02 AM »
The downlooking IR-sender/receiver combo is to prevent to fall down stairs.
Oh that would make sense. When I first saw them I thought they might be motion detectors (working like a simple mouse sensors), but a stairs detector sounds much more likely.

The proper term is "cliff sensors", that is precisely what they're used for. When the Roomba approaches an edge, it immediately stops, backs up and turns.
 

Offline Zbig

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #47 on: March 28, 2017, 02:51:14 AM »
Oh that would make sense. When I first saw them I thought they might be motion detectors (working like a simple mouse sensors), but a stairs detector sounds much more likely.

Don't get mislead by their (mouse sensors, that is) low price and ubiquity - there's nothing simple about them. What they really are is tiny integrated machine vision systems with video cameras taking detailed high-FPS footage of the surface and DSPs comparing each subsequent frame to the previous one and calculating the speed and offset in real-time. Compared to that, simple reflective IR sensor that either sees a floor below it or doesn't is a walk in the park.
 

Offline Domagoj T

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #48 on: March 28, 2017, 03:57:44 AM »
(mouse sensors, that is) low price and ubiquity - there's nothing simple about them. What they really are is tiny integrated machine vision systems with video cameras taking detailed high-FPS footage of the surface and DSPs comparing each subsequent frame to the previous one and calculating the speed and offset in real-time. Compared to that, simple reflective IR sensor that either sees a floor below it or doesn't is a walk in the park.

They really are marvelous things, and to think that you can get one shipped from China to your doorstep for less than $2.

*Some microswitches, optical sensors on scrollwheel and a few feet of cable included.
** Optional wireless connectivity for minimal additional cost (batteries not included).

Mind-boggling.
 

Offline brucehoult

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Re: EEVblog #980 - RoboMaid Automated Vacuum Cleaner Teardown
« Reply #49 on: March 28, 2017, 04:25:40 AM »
I bought one of the first Romba back in I guess 2006 or 2007. They're pretty awesome. You think you've done a good job of vacuuming until you see how much crap the Roomba picks up after! And possibly the other way around too .. they're somewhat complementary devices.

Navigationally they're very stupid. It's mostly a drunk walk around your house, just with a few different behavioural patterns that it follows for a more or less random time (a few seconds up to maybe 30 seconds) each e.g. "follow walls on the right side", "make 80 degree (or 100 degree) left turns when you hit something", "make right turns when you hit something","make a nearly 180 degree turn displaced by one Roomba-width when you hit something after a long (~5m?) straight run without hitting anything". It ends up over the course of an hour or so being pretty effective at discovering every room and covering every spot in at least a 50 - 80 m^2 level of a house or apartment.

Sadly, that machine is back in NZ and I've been cleaning manually in Moscow. Sadly the air here is very dusty and you need to clean hard floors every day, or two at the most, to avoid a gritty feeling underfoot and black soles of your feet when you go to put your shoes and socks on.

I guess this thread inspired me to notice a Roomba in the window of an icover.ru store as I was walking around near (but not tooo near) the protests yesterday and I picked up a Romba 681. The 616 was a bit cheaper (19900 rubles, AU$450, NZ$500) but for an extra AU$135/NZ$145 the 861 comes with a higher capacity LiOn battery instead of NiMH, and a few included accessories such as a virtual wall and spare filter and side-brush. Other than the battery those things are pretty cheap as spare parts anyway.

The thing is overall very much the same as my original model, but you can see small improvements everywhere. The most immediately noticeable difference is it now somehow slows down a lot about 10 cm before crashing into walls and furniture. The original just crashed into things at full speed. The new one gives a very gentle almost inaudible nudge. I don't know what sensor they're using for that. I'm guessing ultrasonic, but I haven't spotted a transducer. It's not sensitive enough to notice thin chair legs or the ends of panels on flat pack desks, and still hits those at full speed.

There's now a 900 series of Roombas for about twice the price with WIFI and remote and smartphone apps and apparently real mapping of your house using a camera and proper planning of efficient cleaning patterns. Meh. The cheap one works fine.
 


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