Author Topic: The Hyperloop: BUSTED  (Read 61910 times)

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Offline David Hess

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #350 on: January 23, 2018, 05:46:35 am »
I wonder though if the extra construction cost to produce the specialized track or partial vacuum tube in this case is insignificant compared to the costs of securing a high speed rail track and purchasing the right of way.

The Edinburgh trams are good case study of the gotchas in that. Cost now approaching a cool billion, I believe. To serve just one route.  :palm:

San Fransisco's BART faced this because they used a track gauge wider than standard.  But that was just dumb because there was no reason to do so when standard gauge would have worked just as well and maintained compatibility with industry infrastructure.  I suspect this was just an exercise in legislative rent seeking rationalized by the "more comfortable ride" excuse and it is one of my favorite examples of why public mass transit projects are a waste of taxpayer money at least in the US where legislative corruption is the rule rather than the exception.

 

Online nctnico

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #351 on: January 26, 2018, 12:22:56 am »
hyperloop may cost as much as the space shuttle program  :o 
It wouldn't surprise me if more money got spend on crypto mining gear then the space shuttle program. You have to put things into perspective and modern day solutions get more expensive because the low hanging fruit when it comes to optimisations is long gone.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Lord of nothing

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #352 on: December 04, 2018, 04:17:43 am »
 :=\ Hyperloop a Green Transportation Technologie which an Engine who run with a Fossil Fuel Engine.  :palm:
Made in Japan, destroyed in Sulz im Wienerwald.
 

Offline ebastler

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #353 on: December 04, 2018, 04:28:48 am »
Please help me out here (and help me to avoid watching the whole video ;)):
Where does the engine sit, and what type is it? I assume it is not preferred to run an internal combustion engine within the evacuated tube...

 

Offline james_s

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #354 on: December 05, 2018, 05:26:20 am »
IIRC the engine is not in the tube, it's driving fans/pumps that suck the air out.
 

Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #355 on: December 05, 2018, 08:36:45 am »
Air is probably not the only thing being sucked here.  :-DD
 
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Offline james_s

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #356 on: December 05, 2018, 06:08:20 pm »
Well I'm not arguing that it's a good idea, frankly I don't know whether it will work or not, although I suspect it's possible to solve the technical hurdles. Now whether it could ever be made economical, that's something I'm far more skeptical of.
 

Offline StillTrying

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #357 on: December 06, 2018, 01:05:07 am »
We don't call it Hyperloopy for no good reason. :)
 

Offline apis

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #358 on: December 13, 2018, 04:24:55 pm »
I haven't heard them officially mention the mode of propulsion, although I haven't followed it that closely. I assume they want to use linear motors and magnetic levitation (aka maglev). But maybe they can't because of piles of patents? It's the only thing that makes sense though imho.

This video seems relevant (sorry if it's already been posted):
TLDR: Often it is more cost effective to improve on existing infrastructure and technology rather than to build some fancy new revolutionary, expensive thing.
 

Offline james_s

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #359 on: December 13, 2018, 04:48:49 pm »
I'm pretty sure they did discuss propulsion, the idea is to work like the pneumatic tubes they have at banks. A big vacuum pump at one end sucks the air out of the tube while a blower at the other end forces air in behind the capsule. The capsule itself has no built in propulsion.
 

Offline apis

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #360 on: December 13, 2018, 05:26:13 pm »
I found the hyperloop Wikipedia article:
Quote
Elon Musk's version of the concept, first publicly mentioned in 2012, incorporates reduced-pressure tubes in which pressurized capsules ride on air bearings driven by linear induction motors and [...]
an electrically driven inlet fan and axial compressor would be placed at the nose of the capsule to "actively transfer high-pressure air from the front to the rear of the vessel"
However
Quote
The Hyperloop concept has been explicitly "open-sourced" by Musk and SpaceX, and others have been encouraged to take the ideas and further develop them.
There are now several different competing designs.

EDIT: Actually linear motors are also mentioned in the RI talk (@14.15) that Lord of Nothing posted earlier.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2018, 05:50:32 pm by apis »
 

Offline BrianHG

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #361 on: January 24, 2019, 12:16:55 pm »
Another analysis of the Hyperloop:

"The Biggest Problem With Hyperloop - Why It Will Fail Hard"

__________
BrianHG.
 

Offline usagi

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #362 on: January 24, 2019, 11:18:12 pm »
However
Quote
The Hyperloop concept has been explicitly "open-sourced" by Musk and SpaceX, and others have been encouraged to take the ideas and further develop them.
There are now several different competing designs.

so when they all fail, elon can blame everyone else, instead of admitting it was a braindamaged idea to begin with.

Offline EEVblog

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #363 on: January 24, 2019, 11:23:00 pm »
However
Quote
The Hyperloop concept has been explicitly "open-sourced" by Musk and SpaceX, and others have been encouraged to take the ideas and further develop them.
There are now several different competing designs.
so when they all fail, elon can blame everyone else, instead of admitting it was a braindamaged idea to begin with.

Which is why he isn't putting any real money into it himself, apart from (SpaceX?) funding some student comps which is probably a tax write-off anyway. He left it up to other suckers to put in the serious money and try and do it. Same with the Boring company, Musk admitted on the Joe Rogan podcast that it's basically a joke.
Wouldn't surprise me if he's deliberately trolling everyone just for kicks.
 
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #364 on: January 24, 2019, 11:48:46 pm »
Another analysis of the Hyperloop:

"The Biggest Problem With Hyperloop - Why It Will Fail Hard"


Great video, well researched and produced. Conclusions are bang on.
 
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Online nctnico

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Re: The Hyperloop: BUSTED
« Reply #365 on: January 27, 2019, 01:29:30 pm »
I see mostly FUD in the video. I wouldn't be too quick to write the idea off (lots of companies are investing in hyperloops after all). Think about transporting of goods. In Europe the effective speed of a freight train is 30km/h. This means a lot of stuff gets trucked for hundreds of kilometers from harbours to places inland because using a freight train takes too long. A hyperloop system which can automatically transport containers to and from a harbour could save a massive amount of money (no drivers) and fuel (less CO2 emissions). Having the pods run inside a tube makes them not prone to collisions like railways are. An automated routing system would take away the time needed to assemble a train and connect/disconnect wagons at each stop. Each pod can be directed to the place it needs to be.

https://venturebeat.com/2018/12/05/hyperloop-transportation-technologies-partners-with-port-of-hamburg-operator-to-develop-cargo-service/
« Last Edit: January 27, 2019, 01:33:32 pm by nctnico »
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 


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