How good of a multimeter does a hobbyist *really* need?

[dmlandrum]

When you consider that the better, higher-confidence multimeters cost as much as a good brand new oscilloscope, I'm wondering how good I really need my multimeter to be for the occasional project that will never be turned into a product for sale. I understand the argument against cheap Chinese multimeters, which can lead to false confidence in your readings, but if you consider that $300-400 for a multimeter might be overkill for a non-professional, is there perhaps a happy medium that can be found? What brands and models might that happy medium be?

I suppose one other option would be hunting around for used Flukes, which come up a lot on eBay. They often spur fierce bidding wars, though, which is why I hate eBay sometimes. (Yes, I'm one of those annoying old "I used eBay before it was cool" people. ). Still, I've seen Fluke 77's on my local Craiglist for not too much, so that might work for me. So I guess the secondary question is, what do we want to look out for in a used meter?

Thank you for your time. I love the videos and the forum here.

[GeekGirl]

Some 20 odd years ago, I worked as a tech, Installing security, intercom and CCTV, I had a series 1 Fluke 77, was a very reliable, trustworthy meter. I would buy one if you can find it at the right price

Things to look for on a used Meter, that ohms works shorted leads should be <1 ohm, to test DC voltage use an 1.5V AA cell, you should measure >1.5V on a brand new one ~1.6V, if you also have say a 1.5 Ohm 5W resistor, you could use this with the battery to make a 1A current source ( I have used these tests at an electronics swap meet, if it passes some basic tests and looks in reasonable condition , I have no worries handing over money

[charliex]

I got a broken fluke 88 from a friend for free, sent it in to fluke for a repair with a flat repair fee of $150, Bad LCD and a broken case.

Its always hard to say when you're recommending tools, everyone has a different set of rules for what works for them. Some people are happier to put up with flaws for a reduction in cost, and others will pay a lot for a recognised name, though hopefully with the support.
 
I like fluke, I like the $50 protek handheld i got from frys, lots of features. Didn't like the protek bench dmm though.

[Zero999]

Was the Fluke your friend gave you worth repair?

[qno]

The main problem I have with cheaper DMM's is overload protection and insulation.
If you measure AC 110, 230 or even 400 V I would stick to the quality Brand's.
If you measure electronics <24VDC you will be fine.

I think there is nothing wrong with using a meter of $5 from your local supermarket.
It will learn you to do measurements. And if you make a mistake you only loose $5.
As long as you do not measure on the grid or use the high current settings for more than a few seconds.
Then after a while you know what is important for you.

What is also important to me is the test leads. You can end up paying more for a good set of leads than the meter itself.

Watch out! Older meters sometimes use odd input impedances on some ranges. Not the 10 Mohm you are used to today.

Fluke isn't the only quality meter manufacturer. You can pick up good quality brands for a good price anywhere on the web.
Gossen is one example. It is well known in Europe but maybe you can do a nice deal elsewhere in the world.
Hewlett Packard (now Agilent) Tektronix, Philips and Beckman, Simpson, Hioki are among the brands I have or used.

Also look for brands that have faded or became unpopular due to takeover by a competitor.
Philips is bought by Fluke in the 90ies and relabeled the successful products to Fluke.
Philips started the Scopemeter in the mid 90 with the 93, 95 and the 97 models. Hardly anyone remembers because Scopemeter is now synonym to Fluke.
Tektronix is now owned by the Danaher group. They use to have a line of multimeters.
You can buy older Gossen meters renamed to BBC or ABB.
And there is nothing wrong with my Fluke 8020 if you can do without the bargraph display and only do basic Volts ohms and current measurements.

[EEVblog]

A hobbyist doesn't NEED a top quality meter, it's just nice to have, there are much cheaper options that will do just fine. Heck, even professionals can "get by" with a cheap $20 meter if they have to.

Forget the $5-$10 hardware store ones, they really are crap, you need to spend a bit more than that get a decent build quality. By that I mean one that isn't held together with plastic clips that just break off when you change the battery etc.
And get autoranging, manual ranging sucks.

And I'll re-iterate the comment about high voltage and safety. Don't use cheap meters on anything mains related, even if they claim to be CAT rated, as many are simply fakes that don't really meet the standard for safety. I've got to do a blog on this...

Old ebay meters can be a real lucky dip, I've bought good and bad ones...

There are decent quality "mid range" brands. Amprobe, Protek, Extech and Ideal come to mind.

How much do you want top spend?

For example, this Amprobe 35-XP for $35 would do just fine and dandy:
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-Amprobe-35XP-A-Digital-Multimeter_W0QQitemZ170415606476QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item27ad8fcacc
In fact that's damn cheap...

Dave.

[cybergibbons]

My view is this - generally a hobbyist is looking for ballpark figures (3.3 or 5.5V? 10kOhm or 22kOhm?) or comparing values, where it only matters that the reading is repeatable.

There's these little yellow meters available everywhere in the UK (Maplin, B&Q, Homebase, Wickes etc.) that cost as little as £2.50 and are pretty useful for things like automotive electronics and general troubleshooting. The price makes them disposable.

Problems begin when you start working with mains electricity. In this case, the hobbyist, for the most part, is simply looking for either the presence or absence of voltage. I'd even say the opportunity to measure current is a liability. Rather than fork out £120 on the cheapest Fluke meter, you can get a Fluke T50 probe for £25. It's been really rare that I've needed anything more, even with quite complex control circuits.

Back onto the subject of mains and current measurements. We had two broken digital meters. Both appeared to be unfused on the 10A current range. We put it across the low voltage side of a welding transformer - it quite quickly went on fire before going open circuit. The other we put directly across the mains at the end of an extension lead. It was obliterated before the breaker had time to trip. If you'd been holding it, you would have probably lost your hand.

[dmlandrum]

Thanks for the info, everyone. I must say, those Amprobe meters look like just the ticket.

[EEVblog]

Thanks for the info, everyone. I must say, those Amprobe meters look like just the ticket.

And owned by the evil Danaher group, so same company as Fluke and Tektronix.
Meterman meters have now all been renamed Amprobe.

I was talking with the Oz Fluke GM the other and he told me that Amprobe are designed and built in Taiwan as a separate group still, but all certification and testing is done by Fluke.

Dave.

[dmlandrum]

Consolidation is the wave of the future, and the future is NOW!

 

I suppose, given my other posts on the board, that I should be thinking about whatever scientific data collection applications as well. But for that, I'm thinking the accuracy of whatever data logger I get or make will be more important than anything else.

[Simon]

I'd be interested to know the accuracy and resolution of the measurements a digital osciloscope takes, the rigol will provide many voltage measurements simultaneously, could this function compete with a good quality multimeter or is it just a guide.

I've been through about 4 cheap meters so far, they just aren't worth it. for what I've spent so far I could have bought a decent one that would still work now. I'm on the road again looking for another meter

[jahonen]

DSOs are not particulary accurate for DC measurements, which is not a surprise considering that they typically have only 8 bit ADC's. Spec accuracy is in order of percents, whereas the DMMs have at least a decade better specs. Scope is a very versatile instrument and can measure a plethora of different things, but none of them very accurately compared to a specialized measuring instrument (DMM for voltage, frequency counter for frequency etc.) Though figures (at least for noise) can be improved somewhat by using trace averaging. The power of the scope is that you can actually see if there is anything wrong with something what is supposed to be for example a perfectly steady DC-voltage. You can't easily see that with a DMM.

Regards,
Janne

[Simon]

thats about what I thought

[qno]

I am not sure but I think the old Wavetek meters where renamed to Meterman and are now called Amprobe?

[EEVblog]

I am not sure but I think the old Wavetek meters where renamed to Meterman and are now called Amprobe?

Yep, Meterman bought Wavetek meters, who were in turn bought by Fluke and merged with the Amprobe brand Fluke also acquired.
It gets complex!

The Amprobe brand is (so I'm told) the 2nd most recognisable meter brand in the US, so Fluke made the decision to rename all Meterman meters under the Amprobe label.

Dave.

[Simon]

sounds a bit like the company I work for 

I've just bought a meter from ebay (just now so won't see it for a good few days), it was only £ 26.99 but looks like a really nice meter with lots of functions:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280422150524&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSA:GB:1123

I was thinking dave of contacting him and telling him to send you a free sample to do  a blog on, I mean hey at £ 26.99 if its anything near the quality of a real good meter then its a real bargain.

I'm still confused at to whether its made by a fluke subsidery or if they are dsaying that its the same as a fluke 17B

[armandas]

sounds a bit like the company I work for 

I've just bought a meter from ebay (just now so won't see it for a good few days), it was only £ 26.99 but looks like a really nice meter with lots of functions:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280422150524&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSA:GB:1123

I was thinking dave of contacting him and telling him to send you a free sample to do  a blog on, I mean hey at £ 26.99 if its anything near the quality of a real good meter then its a real bargain.

I'm still confused at to whether its made by a fluke subsidery or if they are dsaying that its the same as a fluke 17B

I've seen Fluke 17B being sold on ebay, but the meter shown is not Fluke. The 15B and 17B models are made exclusively for china's market, but since it's Fluke branded I guess you could expect somewhat better quality than most Chinese brands.

The meter you bought obviously has nothing to do with Fluke (apart from ripped-off design). That is not to say it's going to be crap meter. My first meter cost $8 and I spent 2 years with it before I decided to get a real Fluke. I still have the old one and use it sometimes. What I'm trying to say is that you should be careful with that meter and don't try to measure mains or any high voltage/current. Take it apart, see what's inside. Post pictures here if you're unsure.

[Simon]

looks like someone needs reporting to ebay, I had serious trouble trying to figure out who made this

[EEVblog]

I'm still confused at to whether its made by a fluke subsidery or if they are dsaying that its the same as a fluke 17B

It's very clear it's not a Fluke, that's why they add the word "compare" in the title.
It's a classic eBay marketing trick, you sell a rip-off product and put the real products name in the title bar so it shows up on searches.
You see terms "like fluke" and "compare fluke" all the time.

This is a classic el-cheapo meter. Dead give-aways are:
a) The price
b) Transistor tester (a classic feature found only on the cheapest meters)
c) The cheap folded paper manual
d) The classic Fluke shape and appearance. Enough to look similar, not enough to get sued.

I'd be surprised if it actually meets it's CAT-II 1000V rating.

Show us some inside pics when you get it!

It would actually be good to do a blog on what the best el-cheapo meter you can get for under $50, but the damn things last such a short time on the market the review is obsolete by the time it's done!

Dave.

[Simon]

yep when i get it I "won't turn it on I'll take it apart !"

[Neilm]

Cheap multi-meters are OK provided you only work on low voltages. I stopped trusting them for anything involving mains when I saw the results of one plugged into the mains on the wrong setting. The user had 3rd degree burns over his face and torso... When the situation was recreated (with a dummy rather than a real person) the high speed video showed a fireball of about 5ft diameter!

[desolatordan]

I bought a handful of Cen-Tech multimeters when they were on a deal for $2 or so from harbor freight. They're just handy for monitoring a number of dc voltages at the same time. I surely do not expect much out of them. 

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Category.taf?CategoryID=551&pricetype

[Simon]

oh yea those, don't hold out ya hopes, I've been through 3 of those in a few years, one is still going but i think on its last legs, they all came under different brand names but i'm sure they are made by one manufacturer or have something in common although functions vary slightly from "manufacturer" to "manufactuer"

[qno]

If you want a peek at what is "coming to a shop near you" type in
www.madeinchina.com and type in multimeter in as a search string.

In my search it started at $3.22. Check out the spec's...

This is the stuff sold in blisters by the hundreds for a few bucks.
Note there is no mention of a CE or UL compliance.

[charliex]

even they did mention ce/ul or fcc compliance its often fake anyway.