New AMD Ryzen Threadripper Editing Machine

[EEVblog]

Getting tired of the issues with my dual Xeon E5-2680 machine editing machine with Windows 10.
Thinking about maybe a new AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1920X or 1950X machine.
Opinions?...

[amspire]

It depends if you are going to use GPU rendering or not.

I gather that to use the Sony AVC rendering, you need a GTX580 - anything newer currently can only use OpenCL but I gather it is not as fast. Your Xeon would probably be fine with a 2nd hand GTX580. I am not sure if Magix has recently added proper support for newer cards, but last I heard they hadn't. If you find a GTX580, to enable it, "Enable Legacy GPU Rendering" in Preferences.

Apparently you can add a second OpenCL GPU for more speed (like the not yet released nVidia Volta).

If you are using CPU rendering, the new 180W AMD chip seem to be very fast (see attached graph).

From the tests I have seen, there is not much real difference between the DDR4 2133MHz and the expensive DDR4 3600MHz RAM, so spend the money instead on water cooling and really fast M.2 drives or the PCIe cards like the 2500 MB/s Intel Optane cards.

I have a GTX580 on a fairly modest machine (An old 6 core Phenom II after my faster CPU/motherboard blew up) and I can do a benchmark test if you like. I have a second PC with the same processor and a GTX1080 so I could do a comparison.

EDIT: I only have Vegas 14 and I gather there is a new MAGIX AVC codec in 15. I cannot test that.

[Halcyon]

Getting tired of the issues with my dual Xeon E5-2680 machine editing machine with Windows 10.

What kind of issues are you having? I used to do some pretty heavy editing using uncompressed video on a single Xeon which is old by today's standards and never really ran into any dramas.

[1anX]

Probably a good move, especially when you consider that Intel is in trouble with the Meltdown and Spectre exploits that have delivered a performance hit on their CPU's. AMD claim their CPU's are not effected by the Meltdown exploit and only minimally exposed by Spectre.

Plenty of good MB's available, ( https://www.anandtech.com/show/11685/amd-threadripper-x399-motherboards ) and the performance for video editing looks pretty impressive, ( http://www.4kshooters.net/2017/09/18/16-core-threadripper-8k-video-editing-workstation-for-premiere-pro-cc-and-davinci-resolve/ ).

A updated Threadripper 2 will be available in the second half of 2018 and will have a die shrink to 12nm and tipped for a performance lift as well. This means the current Threadripper's price will drop if you want to wait.

I think the Threadripper represents best performance and bang for buck at the moment,  but need to see comparison reviews running whatever video editing apps you run.

[Halcyon]

More info here: https://www.amd.com/en/corporate/speculative-execution

[Someone]

Back on the actual question of performance there might not be much in it either way, the 1950x Zen (Threadripper) has a 10-20% lead in peak flops/ops but has a lower memory bandwidth as the single chip has 4 memory channels the same as one of the Xeons. It would need a Epyc to make a step change up from the existing dual Xeon system.

[amspire]

Looks like the new Magix AVC codec has direct nvidia support options that cuts rendering over 40% from the Sony AVc with GPU.

If you are going to use a GPU rendering, then the Xeon will probably not be anywhere near 100% CPU utilization. So just invest in one (or two) fast nVidia GPU card.

My Phenom II 6 core (benchmark under quarter of the dual Xeon CPUs) was at 90% CPU usage when using the GPU rendering for 1080P 30fps Sony AVC rendering.

[EEVblog]

It depends if you are going to use GPU rendering or not.

I gather that to use the Sony AVC rendering, you need a GTX580 - anything newer currently can only use OpenCL but I gather it is not as fast. Your Xeon would probably be fine with a 2nd hand GTX580. I am not sure if Magix has recently added proper support for newer cards, but last I heard they hadn't. If you find a GTX580, to enable it, "Enable Legacy GPU Rendering" in Preferences.

Vegas 15 supports new cards it but it too buggy. I've done videos on this.
I've also used the fastest GPU card available for Vegas 14, it makes it slower.

From the tests I have seen, there is not much real difference between the DDR4 2133MHz and the expensive DDR4 3600MHz RAM, so spend the money instead on water cooling and really fast M.2 drives or the PCIe cards like the 2500 MB/s Intel Optane cards.

Fast drives do not help my rendering.

I have a GTX580 on a fairly modest machine (An old 6 core Phenom II after my faster CPU/motherboard blew up) and I can do a benchmark test if you like. I have a second PC with the same processor and a GTX1080 so I could do a comparison.
EDIT: I only have Vegas 14 and I gather there is a new MAGIX AVC codec in 15. I cannot test that.

Done several videos on this.

[EEVblog]

Getting tired of the issues with my dual Xeon E5-2680 machine editing machine with Windows 10.

What kind of issues are you having? I used to do some pretty heavy editing using uncompressed video on a single Xeon which is old by today's standards and never really ran into any dramas.

It's compatibility problem with Windows 10, not editing problems (apart from Vegas 15).

[EEVblog]

Looks like the new Magix AVC codec has direct nvidia support options that cuts rendering over 40% from the Sony AVc with GPU.

If you are going to use a GPU rendering, then the Xeon will probably not be anywhere near 100% CPU utilization. So just invest in one (or two) fast nVidia GPU card.

My Phenom II 6 core (benchmark under quarter of the dual Xeon CPUs) was at 90% CPU usage when using the GPU rendering for 1080P 30fps Sony AVC rendering.

[kalel]

I don't have to check all of the videos yet (I might have seen some of them - but I couldn't remember the content), but what are the issues involved?

(This goes for everyone) have you also considered AMD GPUs if using OpenCL?

[Electro Detective]

I'm betting the Xeon rig is too busy keeping Windows 10 fed and happy 
and not doing the actual tasks required by the frustrated user efficiently 

I would consider updowngrading to Windows 7 Ultimate SP1, or better still Windows Server 2008R2

If the programs/apps and hardware claim to run on Win 7, 8, and 10,

why not run it on 7 ? and let MS do their own Win 10xxx beta testing

Stay clear of Radeon half baked driver junk nVidia/GeForce are still KING in video cards with solid working drivers 

FWIW, I've never had an issue running Vegas 14 or 15 on AMD gear, Win 7 x64 


Then again, if you've got some spare cash to buy the latest AMD rig and see if it fares better with Win 10    ... we patiently await the outcome   
 

[amspire]

Just had a quick scan through the video's.

I gather you haven't tried the GTX580 card that can use the Cuda cores (I think). You would think the newer cards should be faster.
I didn't see you monitor the CPU and GPU load (GPU-Z.2.5.0.exe is a simple tool for the GPU) to find out of you were CPU or GPU limited.

[EEVblog]

I gather you haven't tried the GTX580 card that can use the Cuda cores (I think). You would think the newer cards should be faster.

I used a Radeon R9 290 card, supposedly even faster if IIRC.

I didn't see you monitor the CPU and GPU load (GPU-Z.2.5.0.exe is a simple tool for the GPU) to find out of you were CPU or GPU limited.

It was not CPU limited.

[wraper]

BTW if you get right motherboard, you can use unbuffered ECC RAM (non official support). Nice to have on a machine where you process large files. And just for general stability as well.

[hayatepilot]

The PC will probably run more stable with just a single CPU.
I'm getting the feeling that WIN10 is not all that stable on dual CPU systems.
And your MB is not properly supportet on WIN10.

With Threadripper you are getting better bang per buck than with a i9. So it's probably the best choice.

I would say go for it! Nothing is more annoying than a buggy, crashing PC. An upgrade that fixes that is well worth the money. 

[EEVblog]

The PC will probably run more stable with just a single CPU.
I'm getting the feeling that WIN10 is not all that stable on dual CPU systems.

I might try and disable one CPU and see.
In BIOS, or physically remove it?

[BravoV]

BTW if you get right motherboard, you can use unbuffered ECC RAM (non official support). Nice to have on a machine where you process large files. And just for general stability as well.

I thought Win 10 doesn't support ECC RAM ? Last time I read only at Linux, cmiiw.

[kalel]

I would likely use AMD GPU if OpenCL is utilized (at least in Windows, drivers should be better for OpenCL than nVidia - or maybe that's just how it used to be), and obviously nVidia for CUDA.
But the actual choice depends also on the price/performance of available models at a given time. Sometimes nVidia is more cost effective, and sometimes AMD.

[tszaboo]

The PC will probably run more stable with just a single CPU.

Well, than Threadripper is an excellent choice, considering it is just two CPU glued together. With random latencies introduced and maybe worse performance than a monolithic CPU.
I guess the only way of knowing, if TR CPU would be worth it, if Dave would test his usual rendering setup on a TR machine. And if it would be worth the investment, or not.

[EEVblog]

I guess the only way of knowing, if TR CPU would be worth it, if Dave would test his usual rendering setup on a TR machine. And if it would be worth the investment, or not.

Actually, I think David2 just bought a Ryzen for home, not sure if threadripper or not

[hayatepilot]

I might try and disable one CPU and see.
In BIOS, or physically remove it?

I don't know if it's possible to disable a entire CPU in the BIOS. Individual cores can be disabled for sure.
Physically removing the second CPU should work regardless.

[tszaboo]

I guess the only way of knowing, if TR CPU would be worth it, if Dave would test his usual rendering setup on a TR machine. And if it would be worth the investment, or not.

Actually, I think David2 just bought a Ryzen for home, not sure if threadripper or not

The two CPU uses such a different architecture, it is hard to predict how your workload will work on it. Probably it is fine, and you get 2x performance for 2x the cores, but you should be careful making those assumptions.

[hayatepilot]

The PC will probably run more stable with just a single CPU.

Well, than Threadripper is an excellent choice, considering it is just two CPU glued together. With random latencies introduced and maybe worse performance than a monolithic CPU.
I guess the only way of knowing, if TR CPU would be worth it, if Dave would test his usual rendering setup on a TR machine. And if it would be worth the investment, or not.

You sound a little bit like Intel back in July when they called them "glued together"....

http://www.pcgamer.com/intel-slide-criticizes-amd-for-using-glued-together-dies-in-epyc-processors/

https://wccftech.com/amds-reply-to-intel-calling-naples-epyc-4-glued-togather-desktop-dies/

[wraper]

BTW if you get right motherboard, you can use unbuffered ECC RAM (non official support). Nice to have on a machine where you process large files. And just for general stability as well.

I thought Win 10 doesn't support ECC RAM ? Last time I read only at Linux, cmiiw.

ECC does not care about OS to operate, another thing is how much diagnostic data you can get from OS. On win 10 will see corrected hardware error event if ECC corrects some error.