Texas Instruments to Hobbyists: No soup for you!

[mtdoc]

Got this email below from TI today.  I guess the hobbyist sample gravy train is done. Seems shortsighted to me. I have only requested samples from them twice but I know others do it regularly.  I wonder if they'll accept my work .org email address?

[marshallh]

easy, register yourname.com and use it for the emails

[T3sl4co1l]

Although if you're going to the trouble of registering a domain (>$12/yr?) plus email, you might as well order a handful from Digikey...

Tim

[SirNick]

I'm not surprised.  I've never worked for a silicon vendor, but I do assume they were never meant to be the source of free / cheap parts for hobbyists.  They're called "samples" for a reason -- you're meant to buy something if they work out for you.  1-off projects pretty much preclude that from ever happening.

I know many will disagree, but IMO, "hobbyist use" was a bit of an abuse of the system, unless they specifically advised otherwise.

[tesla500]

I never really understood the point of free samples. They primarily target businesses, yet in a business,  the time and money (possible custom PCB etc.) required to evaluate a sample is orders of magnitude greater than the cost of just ordering the sample from a distributor. And for really expensive parts where it would make a difference, samples aren't offered.

What's the point?

[mtdoc]

Easy ways around it for sure. For the occasional part it's not worth the effort. Ironically, it would be worth the effort for those apt to abuse it with lots of sample requests.

[miguelvp]

Silly to do free samples, I never once use that. But I do get into their special offerings where you pay for pretty much sample parts but way cheap.

Even if I ordered those discounted samples direct from them I didn't get that e-mail you got yet (or maybe it only applies to actual free samples).

My take on free samples is that it's for companies that an engineer is curious on some new part and if he can get his project green lit it might become a substantial order for the vendor that offered the free sample in the first place.

[Bud]

Free samples work wonderful to establish relationships. If ADI gives me a free PLL chip for my high frequency clock source prototype, when it is time for me to look for an ADC, guess who I will check first to buy one from , ADI or TI ?

Also another example, while not exactly about free stuff but about relationships. Many years ago I decided to buy a new car. I walked in to a Honda dealership and the sales guy told me sort of it does not necessarily they will be willing to sell me one, until they check my criminal records, my financial status, my this and my that. I said fine, walked out and went to a Toyota dealership across the road and made a deal there with no stupid conditions. Guess what, since then many years have passed and I am on my 3rd car now and all my 3 cars were Toyotas. I never bothered checking Honda anymore after that case when they damaged relationships with me by treating me badly.

So yes, it may not seem obvious but free samples help get customer's feet at your door through establishing trust and relationships. Minicircuits has just resurrected free samples program after they stopped it years back. Do not you think there was a reason for them to start doing it again.

[Macbeth]

I would get free samples myself too. What got me was instead of them just sending a few dollars (or even cents) worth of chips, the companies insisted on sending them in ridiculous over the top ESD packaging, plastic flip boxes, acoustic foam and UPS or DHL next day international delivery!!! 

Clearly it's some marketing knob jockey that decides to send the free samples out with all the bells and whistles. All I could see when my 2 x $1.50 IC's or whatever turned up in this elaborate package, complete with uniformed courier expecting a signature for delivery, rather than it just turning up in regular post in my letterbox a couple of days later, is a company that is going down the drain. 

[miguelvp]

They are not setup for one offs, it will cost them more in changing their infrastructure than to just ship those big packages where filling up an order is probably automated. Put actual hands on and it gets costly to send samples.

[sacherjj]

I never really understood the point of free samples. They primarily target businesses, yet in a business,  the time and money (possible custom PCB etc.) required to evaluate a sample is orders of magnitude greater than the cost of just ordering the sample from a distributor. And for really expensive parts where it would make a difference, samples aren't offered.

What's the point?

TI sends samples fulfilled by Digikey.  I may not be the norm, but I've requested many of them.  They arrive very fast.  In a day, I've been able to route out a quick proto board on the mill.  THe chip arrives a day or two later and validated if the chip will work for what we want.  I've thrown out one TI chip that by the datasheet seemed like it would work for us and added two more to our design that actually will.  At least on my instance, it will have paid for itself for TI.

I've seen no difference in time from Digikey order or TI sample order, with normal shipping.  I've found it very helpful.

[miguelvp]

If they come from the Dallas area in TX, then they are not fulfilled by Digikey.

Edit: There is a facility (other than the Headquarters)  on I-635 between I-35 and I-75. All my TiStore orders seem to come from there.

[Bored@Work]

I know many will disagree, but IMO, "hobbyist use" was a bit of an abuse of the system, unless they specifically advised otherwise.

One manufacturer in the past told me they stopped giving out samples altogether, because they found "hobbyists" abusing the system and reselling samples on eBay. Fortunately I am not affected by such policy changes. I don't use samples in my job and I don't use them as a hobbyist.

[chickenHeadKnob]

I never really understood the point of free samples. They primarily target businesses, yet in a business,  the time and money (possible custom PCB etc.) required to evaluate a sample is orders of magnitude greater than the cost of just ordering the sample from a distributor. And for really expensive parts where it would make a difference, samples aren't offered.

What's the point?

I think the point is to by-pass the cumbersome and byzantine purchase order approval bureaucracy in some large companies.  If one chip maker  obliges with free samples quickly and the other doesn't  guess who gets the multimillion design-win and subsequent order.

[westfw]

they found "hobbyists" abusing the system and reselling samples on eBay.

Someone who resells samples on eBay is not a "hobbyist"...

[tszaboo]

I would get free samples myself too. What got me was instead of them just sending a few dollars (or even cents) worth of chips, the companies insisted on sending them in ridiculous over the top ESD packaging, plastic flip boxes, acoustic foam and UPS or DHL next day international delivery!!! 

Clearly it's some marketing knob jockey that decides to send the free samples out with all the bells and whistles. All I could see when my 2 x $1.50 IC's or whatever turned up in this elaborate package, complete with uniformed courier expecting a signature for delivery, rather than it just turning up in regular post in my letterbox a couple of days later, is a company that is going down the drain. 

No, the packaging and the speed and the price totally makes sense if you are an engineer at business.
Speed: If you are making a prototype, it does matter if you get your stuff tomorrow, two days later or a week later. If it is there tomorrow, you actually do something, and you dont need to start doing something else to avoid raised eyebrows.
Packaging: sending a sample which got damaged by ESD is the wors that could happen. The engineer will evaluate a chip based on that 1 or 2 sample hes got. If it is damaged, he will use a different chip, and TI doesnt want that.
Free: There is a huge difference between free and 1 cent, and that is because how companies work. Engineers almost never have money at their discretion. Which means, if you have to spend 1 cent, you need to turn to your supervisor, you need to write a purchase order, maybe a purchase requisition, plan the requirement in the project, make feasibility. Accounting has to process the payment. Money needs to be transferred. If you need to pay, that can delay the whole process by days, and the overhead cost will be a magnitude bigger, because the work is bigger. Free samples are free to kick the whole business process in the ass (as it should be).

I really dont like the change TI made with their support. First they stopped answering emails, now the samples might be crippled. What is next? Going the Maxim route?

[tom66]

I never really understood the point of free samples. They primarily target businesses, yet in a business,  the time and money (possible custom PCB etc.) required to evaluate a sample is orders of magnitude greater than the cost of just ordering the sample from a distributor. And for really expensive parts where it would make a difference, samples aren't offered.

What's the point?

If you've ever been in a company fraught with bureaucracy you'll know how hard it is to even get the company to spend a single cent without going through a huge tangle of paperwork.

Being free  eliminates this issue.

[G0HZU]

If you've ever been in a company fraught with bureaucracy you'll know how hard it is to even get the company to spend a single cent without going through a huge tangle of paperwork.

Being free  eliminates this issue.

So true... 

Where I work it has recently become a nightmare to buy stuff because it takes so long to get the purchase authorised. Free samples are sometimes the only route to getting things quickly.

I've probably spent £300 in the last year of my own money on Farnell orders when I need some 'next day' parts at work. The bureaucracy is so bad I'd rather spend/lose my own money than try and claim it back via the various business forms and the required authorisations and then suffer the inevitable inquisition as to 'why' I did it this way.

I'm not the only one who does this. 5 years ago I could fill in a purchase request, sign it myself and then hand it to someone in purchasing and I'd have the bits next day.

The whole thing would take a few minutes. Now it can take weeks and I mean WEEKS to buy something as simple as a bag of capacitors and the cost to the company in terms of time/money is huge.

[dannyf]

TI's move makes perfect sense to me.

Other than for students, free sampling makes no sense as the reps / distributors would be on the case of a potential customer.

For students, it is an investment into TI's future.

So the policy of requiring a commercial address or an educational account is the right one for them.

[G0HZU]

The other thing that complicates the sample process is the modern (ethical) issue of 'kickbacks and gratuities'

google it if you don't know what it means.

But, for example, I'm not allowed to accept anything extra from a sales rep from any company that isn't a 'requested' sample. eg I'm not allowed to accept a free calendar or pencil or even allow them to buy me a sandwich or provide me transport to/from a sample request meeting.

It's a serious issue if I do any of the above. Even accepting a free pencil would get me in deep trouble if the wrong person found out about it.

I'm not surprised that companies are tightening up on sample requests because in my experience a rep will be tasked with following up the sample request to see what they were used for or if they were good enough. i.e. I think the manufacturers use reps and sample requests as a basic gateway to allow them to mine information about how companies use the sample components and also what the companies are doing in terms of technology.

So they are not normally 'free' samples 

[David Hess]

It is not like Texas Instruments has to compete with National Semiconductor anymore.

[GreyWoolfe]

I'm with Nandblog.  For large purchases, we have to go through a purchase requisition.  That can take a month or more.   When I was a student at ITT Technical Institute, we did the free samples a few times for class projects as students.  After I graduated, though, that was the end of asking for free stuff-just me personally.

[Rufus]

I never really understood the point of free samples. They primarily target businesses, yet in a business,  the time and money (possible custom PCB etc.) required to evaluate a sample is orders of magnitude greater than the cost of just ordering the sample from a distributor. And for really expensive parts where it would make a difference, samples aren't offered.

A. Distributors may not have stock.
B. Distributors may have whole reel MOQs
C. Distributors may have minimum order values.
D. For many companies the cost of raising an order, processing it and subsequent payment is significant.

For a few cheap parts it is just all round faster and more economical for the supplier to give you them.

If one of my customers needs a cheap spare part I just stick one in the post - it isn't worth generating the paperwork on both sides.

As for TI's actions it was probably being abused by people selling the parts on ebay, Microchip restricted their sample program a few years ago for that reason.

[Rufus]

But, for example, I'm not allowed to accept anything extra from a sales rep from any company that isn't a 'requested' sample. eg I'm not allowed to accept a free calendar or pencil or even allow them to buy me a sandwich or provide me transport to/from a sample request meeting.

It's a serious issue if I do any of the above. Even accepting a free pencil would get me in deep trouble if the wrong person found out about it.

I used to work with a guy who previously worked for a large TV manufacturer (before everything moved to China). He said he missed all the freebies from reps which extended as far as sexual favours.

[ShawnD]

Being free  eliminates this issue.
[/quote]

I was once told I should have created a purchase order for a free sample, because otherwise receiving didn't know who it went to (It had my name on the box!).  They are much better now, but some people still get samples sent to their homes to save the day or two it takes to get through receiving.