Author Topic: The Death of Analog  (Read 24546 times)

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Offline c4757p

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #75 on: June 10, 2013, 11:59:39 am »
Then I hit signal integrity issues, welcome back analogue... but hang on a minute, why on earth is nearly all the text on this subject alluding to it as some kind of "black magic"?

For the same reason many of the rest of us think RF is black magic. Lack of interest combined with the perception that it doesn't matter as long as someone gets it done.
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Offline Psi

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #76 on: June 10, 2013, 12:03:19 pm »
I think it's true to say that in the future digital will play a bigger and bigger role in the task of an engineer building a product.
Where as analog will be more concentrated in the R&D, design and manufacturing of those digital components.

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Online Mechatrommer

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #77 on: June 10, 2013, 12:24:22 pm »
Where as analog will be more concentrated in the R&D, design and manufacturing of those digital components.
hence analog will not die. if analog die, digital will die. btw, the claim that the world is analog is questionable. what if its actually digital? in super miniscule scale (alot lot smaller than a quark) that we are unable to perceive? that we can only perceive that this world is an "apparent analog" ;)
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Offline Psi

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #78 on: June 10, 2013, 12:53:03 pm »
Yep, it cant die, but from the perspective of an engineer working in a company building products it may die if they no longer work with analog.

It's not all that surprising that as the field of electronics matures various areas will separate and stand on their own.
We could easy end up with analog and digital becoming totally separate in qualifications and people working in just that area.
The same way other things have separated, like computers into programming, networking, databases, web.

If there is enough scope for people to specialize then that specialization will push the areas further apart.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2013, 12:54:42 pm by Psi »
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Online Mechatrommer

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #79 on: June 10, 2013, 01:08:08 pm »
thats not dying, thats branching, the point that i was trying to highlight. each area will be localized, but not dead. just like religion and science once was (not again). more and more people think that science is "entirely" separated from religion (no i'm not talking about religions that made lies). and btw, no we cannot equate between (vacuum-tube vs transistor) and (analog vs digital) transistor tries to do what vacuum did, so vacuum is superceeded and obsolete. but digital is not trying to do what analog do, this ee disciplines just, "branches".
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Offline Psi

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #80 on: June 10, 2013, 01:25:21 pm »
but digital is not trying to do what analog do,

Not yet, but maybe.. if new semiconductor technology (maybe graphene) make cheap 32bit ADC, DAC, MCUs that can run in the many GHz's range you could make an opamp that works digitally inside and overcomes some of the annoying properties of analog opamps.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2013, 10:56:24 am by Psi »
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Offline lewis

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #81 on: June 10, 2013, 06:19:15 pm »
This whole thread is moot
Since one meaning of moot is "subject to debate", that's very true.

Quote
there is no such thing as digital.
That rather depends on the domain of discourse, doesn't it?

I don't know enough about Planck time and elementary charge to comment. But what's a logical 1?
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Offline rolycat

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #82 on: June 10, 2013, 07:26:06 pm »
there is no such thing as digital.
That rather depends on the domain of discourse, doesn't it?
I don't know enough about Planck time and elementary charge to comment.
Me neither  ???

Quote
But what's a logical 1?
The negation of a logical 0?


 

Offline AlfBaz

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #83 on: June 10, 2013, 08:28:48 pm »
Can you punctuate this so it makes sense? Alan while John had had had had had had had had had had had the better effect on the teacher
This has been bothering me for a while, so here's my attempt
"Alan while John had had had had had had had had had had had the better effect on the teacher", he stuttered...
 

Offline lewis

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #84 on: June 10, 2013, 09:35:49 pm »
Can you punctuate this so it makes sense? Alan while John had had had had had had had had had had had the better effect on the teacher
This has been bothering me for a while, so here's my attempt
"Alan while John had had had had had had had had had had had the better effect on the teacher", he stuttered...

Haha! You're the first to bite. It's: Alan, while John had had "had", had had "had had". "Had had" had had the better effect on the teacher.

Alan and John are both writing essays at school. Both John and Alan are describing a divorce. John wrote "the man had a wife but she left him" in his essay, Alan wrote 'the man had had a wife but she left him'. The teacher prefers Alan's version because it is grammatically more correcterer.

Edit - there's actually a wiki page for this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_while_John_had_had_had_had_had_had_had_had_had_had_had_a_better_effect_on_the_teacher
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Offline AlfBaz

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #85 on: June 11, 2013, 12:36:30 am »
arghh it's doing my head in  :)
 

Offline airiclenz

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #86 on: June 11, 2013, 12:43:00 am »
Maybe this is OT (ON topic) but in my opinion analog will never die because as long as we have ears and will generate music with electronics, I guess analog is pretty safe.
Also is digital just a "high-contrast" version of analog ( :blah: ... I know).

Just my 2 cents.
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Offline SLJ

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #87 on: June 11, 2013, 05:59:14 am »
Sine wave or square wave? That is the question...

Offline c4757p

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #88 on: June 11, 2013, 06:56:57 am »
Sine wave or square wave? That is the question...

Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The microvolts and megohms of analog design,
Or to just whack in a bigass FPGA,
And by abstraction avoid them? To digitize;
No more; and by a microcontroller to say we end
The measurement and the thousand electric shocks
That flesh is heir to, 'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish'd. To digitize;
To develop: perchance to code: ay, there's the rub;
For in that programming what debugging may come
When we have shuffled off this SMPS coil,
Must give us pause: there's the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;
For who would build the power supplies,
The transmission lines, the test gear,

... oh, I give up, it's dinner time.
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duskglow

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #89 on: June 11, 2013, 08:14:52 am »
Oh ohmeo, ohmeo, wherefore art rhou, ohmeo... deny thy current and refuse thy gain...
 

Offline lewis

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #90 on: June 11, 2013, 09:14:46 am »
Sine wave or square wave? That is the question...

Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The microvolts and megohms of analog design,
Or to just whack in a bigass FPGA,
And by abstraction avoid them? To digitize;
No more; and by a microcontroller to say we end
The measurement and the thousand electric shocks
That flesh is heir to, 'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish'd. To digitize;
To develop: perchance to code: ay, there's the rub;
For in that programming what debugging may come
When we have shuffled off this SMPS coil,
Must give us pause: there's the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;
For who would build the power supplies,
The transmission lines, the test gear,

... oh, I give up, it's dinner time.

Brilliant!
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Offline Strada916

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #91 on: June 11, 2013, 09:24:05 am »
Well if a sine wave is analogue and the square wave is digital. Then Digital can not exist without analogue as a square wave is multiple harmonics of a sine wave.  :phew: :blah: :clap:
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Offline AlfBaz

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #92 on: June 11, 2013, 09:37:02 am »
Being a far more common man, limericks seem the order of the day

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Whos value determined by ohmage
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Offline onlooker

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #93 on: June 11, 2013, 09:37:52 am »
Quote
Well if a sine wave is analogue and the square wave is digital. Then Digital can not exist without analogue as a square wave is multiple harmonics of a sine wave.

But, this is only one of the man-made choices for understanding the nature. The alternative is "equally" true. A sine wave can be decomposed as superposition of a series of square waves. Actually it is more intuitive. In essence, that is what a DAC tries to do anyway. If you want to think about it, this is the delta function/Greens function approach.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2013, 09:41:40 am by onlooker »
 

Offline AlfBaz

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #94 on: June 11, 2013, 09:44:49 am »
Quote
Well if a sine wave is analogue and the square wave is digital. Then Digital can not exist without analogue as a square wave is multiple harmonics of a sine wave.

But, this is only one of the man-made choices for understanding the nature. The alternative is "equally" true. A sine wave can be decomposed as superposition of a series of square waves. Actually it is more intuitive. In essence, that is what a DAC tries to do anyway.
But a pure sine wave has no harmonics and is the underlying premise for a very large part of fundamental math for understanding electronics in the first place
 

Offline c4757p

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #95 on: June 11, 2013, 09:47:59 am »
Being a far more common man, limericks seem the order of the day

The analog style's a way
To build a circuit today
But some day soon to come
We'll hear from some bum
That digital is here to stay.


(Yeah, it's not perfectly accurate, but it rhymes! Just pretend you heard it in 1965...)
« Last Edit: June 11, 2013, 09:52:53 am by c4757p »
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Offline c4757p

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #96 on: June 11, 2013, 09:52:18 am »
But, this is only one of the man-made choices for understanding the nature. The alternative is "equally" true. A sine wave can be decomposed as superposition of a series of square waves. Actually it is more intuitive. In essence, that is what a DAC tries to do anyway. If you want to think about it, this is the delta function/Greens function approach.

Sine is more useful. First, an ideal square wave can't even exist in an ideal world (it's non-differentiable), but the purity of a sine wave is limited only by the precision with which it can be generated. Second, try working out RF harmonics and whatnot in the "square frequency domain". It's mathematically valid, but it just doesn't work practically.
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Offline AlfBaz

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #97 on: June 11, 2013, 10:05:08 am »
an ideal square wave can't even exist in an ideal world
When dealing in digital, we wish analog was dead  :)
 

Offline SLJ

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #98 on: June 11, 2013, 10:06:03 am »
The analog style's a way
To build a circuit today
But some day soon to come
We'll hear from some bum
That digital is here to stay.

That day was yesterday...

Offline c4757p

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Re: The Death of Analog
« Reply #99 on: June 11, 2013, 10:07:50 am »
That day was yesterday...

(Yeah, it's not perfectly accurate, but it rhymes! Just pretend you heard it in 1965...)

I took a bit of artistic license in the name of a couple lazy rhymes.
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