Twenty passengers on missing flight 370 worked for Freescale Semiconductors

[echen1024]

Looking at it from any angle, it is pretty hard to hide a 777. The only place I can think of is North Korea.

[pickle9000]

Pinger life:

Assuming it's the 30 day variant of the pinger. Full output pings for the 30 days and then dropping off with the maximum expected around 7 days and the minimum 3 days, ping range diminishes as battery power lowers after the 30 day mark.

[pickle9000]

Looking at it from any angle, it is pretty hard to hide a 777. The only place I can think of is North Korea.

I think it's technically possible but would take some serious effort and money.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Azorian

[IanB]

Another important point is that air pressure sensitive bombs could be set to operate at high altitude in an unpressurised cargo area,but it is not so easy to make one which will trigger in the small difference between sea level & 2000ft,or whatever aircraft pressurise to the equivalent of.

I don't think this is the case. Apart from the fact that aircraft cabins are pressurized to an altitude of between 6000 - 8000 ft, it is trivial for the humble barometer in your home to measure much smaller differences than that when giving a fine/fair/rain/storm indication.

[pickle9000]

Timers seem to be the preferred method for bombs in a cargo hold.

[vk6zgo]

Another important point is that air pressure sensitive bombs could be set to operate at high altitude in an unpressurised cargo area,but it is not so easy to make one which will trigger in the small difference between sea level & 2000ft,or whatever aircraft pressurise to the equivalent of.

I don't think this is the case. Apart from the fact that aircraft cabins are pressurized to an altitude of between 6000 - 8000 ft, it is trivial for the humble barometer in your home to measure much smaller differences than that when giving a fine/fair/rain/storm indication.

I stand corrected!

I just seem to remember reading the figures 2000-2500ft many years ago.

Question is,how well would a domestic barometer survive being bounced around during the  loading procedure?
Usually,the more rugged a device is,the less sensitive it is.

Also, if the aircraft doesn't pressurise till 6000 ft or so,it would still be fairly close to the airport,so may survive.
Saboteurs would probably prefer it to be further away,which suggests a high altitude setting.

[Kjelt]

And again they have re-calculated the crash site to be more to the north/east due to the fact that the plane was flying faster then anticipated.
https://www.amsa.gov.au/media/documents/28032014MH370Update23.pdf

But now I am totally confused, they are re-targeting the satelites, so does this mean that the 130 pieces of debris first found are not from the plane? And what are they now actually going for, the plane it self on the bottom or the debris that was earlier found on the satellite images?

[digsys]

... they are re-targeting the satelites, so does this mean that the 130 pieces of debris first found are not from the plane?

Those were NOT the droids they were looking for. I'm already on my 4th bag of popcorn !!

[EEVblog]

Saboteurs would probably prefer it to be further away,which suggests a high altitude setting.

Why?
Anyone who wanted to blow up a plane obvious wants to kill as many people as possible and make as a big statement as possible, and have the least risk possible.
So going higher and further before detonating lessens the effectiveness of all three of those things.
If you detonate just after takeoff then:
a) The plane is likely over a populated area and hence more chance of collateral damage on the ground
b) There is more likelihood it will get filmed, thus maximising your public and hence political exposure.
c) Less chance that the plane can recover and land. You can land a flying wreck when you have enough altitude.

[pickle9000]

And again they have re-calculated the crash site to be more to the north/east due to the fact that the plane was flying faster then anticipated.
https://www.amsa.gov.au/media/documents/28032014MH370Update23.pdf

But now I am totally confused, they are re-targeting the satelites, so does this mean that the 130 pieces of debris first found are not from the plane? And what are they now actually going for, the plane it self on the bottom or the debris that was earlier found on the satellite images?

Basically they are racing against the clock, going wherever the leads take them.

All of the images have the potential to be correct. The Tai image sounds to be radar and should be easier to find due to the size. If they find the field and it turns out to be incorrect on to the next one. Looking at large fields can help eliminate areas faster and thus cover a larger area. Re-targeting the satellites will cover more ground but also give a better idea of the current flow in that area. Current flow information is needed to help locate any items that have sunk.

Even though it seems like a large area consider how much it has been reduced. It's like searching a beach for a single grain of sand compared to what is now probably a sandbox. Next will be getting that down to a bucket.



 

[Alexei.Polkhanov]

I started to think of another plausible theory - plane was diverted to remote area by pilots in order to steal some very important cargo aboard. It is compatible with clues about someone turning off tracking device.

Not plausible. It would require the government of the country you land in to be in on it, and those to dispose of the plane and people on board. Not going to happen.
And of course doesn't fit in the almost-fact it's been found in the middle of the Indian ocean, headed nowhere.

Most likely you are right.

But if it is possible to "re-label" plane in mid flight so that it reappear as completely different plane and lands at some remote airport without any government noticing. And why do anything to passengers?  Just say "ops emergency stop" and let them go few weeks later. It is easier to steal what is already on plane this way than steal and then find way to transport it.

If it was a malfunction then most likely there would be enough means to send emergency signals out.
If tracking system was in fact tempered with then it was probably intentional and in that case - "follow the money!". That is my logic anyway.

If plane crashes and falls apart wouldn't those emergency flotation devices activate as soon as they fall into water sending beacon signals to satellites? If I recall even small boats often have those orange "save me" beacons aboard.

[pickle9000]

I assume the lifeboats have beacons but have no idea if they inflate / activate in the event of a crash (I would assume they do not inflate). No signal would probably mean they are submerged.

[mikeselectricstuff]

I started to think of another plausible theory - plane was diverted to remote area by pilots in order to steal some very important cargo aboard. It is compatible with clues about someone turning off tracking device.

How many places are there which have the space to land a 777 and not be seen by spy satellites or local observers?

[echen1024]

I started to think of another plausible theory - plane was diverted to remote area by pilots in order to steal some very important cargo aboard. It is compatible with clues about someone turning off tracking device.

How many places are there which have the space to land a 777 and not be seen by spy satellites or local observers?

A hangar in North Korea comes to mind.

[Alexei.Polkhanov]

I started to think of another plausible theory - plane was diverted to remote area by pilots in order to steal some very important cargo aboard. It is compatible with clues about someone turning off tracking device.

How many places are there which have the space to land a 777 and not be seen by spy satellites or local observers?

Why would you try to hide it? Everyone can look at it as long as they want - it is just another 777 as thousands of others.
It is not that easy to determine exact type/model by looking at satellite images as you may think - pattern recognition software often fails to do a match.

Here is a Google maps - What airline?

[tom66]

A new hypothesis I've heard recently suggests the pilot has (deliberately or accidentally) crashed the plane - in the Diamantina Trench. It's near the area they are searching, about 50km across. The depth there is beyond the rating of the black box (~4,500m rated, up to 8,000 m deep) - the data may be lost forever.

[pickle9000]

A new hypothesis I've heard recently suggests the pilot has (deliberately or accidentally) crashed the plane - in the Diamantina Trench. It's near the area they are searching, about 50km across. The depth there is beyond the rating of the black box (~4,500m rated, up to 8,000 m deep) - the data may be lost forever.

I believe the cockpit voice recorder only lasts 2 hours, so even if it is found it may have limited usefulness. Finding the main fuselage will probably be more important. The FDR is probably more critical.

[Towger]

So much speculation, next there will be sightings of it by the Mars rovers.
Anyway, it is not unknown for 777s to burst into flames: http://avherald.com/h?article=44078aa7

So how does your modern 'fly by wire' aircraft work? Are the 'controls' in the cockpit no more than computer screens, buttons and joysticks connected to the brains in the avionics bay? An O2 fuelled fire
as per the photo below would takeout the 'controls' in seconds, the smoke and eventual lack of O2 from burning through the skin would soon kill the people on board. Leaving the aircraft as the Mary Celeste of the sky, continuing on her way until the fuel ran out.

[Wytnucls]

Yep, something as lethal as that particular failure is the most plausible explanation.
Explosive de-pressurization combined with severe cockpit fire and smoke and compromised O2 system. Doesn't get much worse than that!

[Macbeth]

It's funny, but since this incident I had a look online for flight trackers. My mum and aunt went for a 3 day break to Budapest, Hungary from Manchester, UK a few days ago. I could track the flights and even see the plane making flight corrections in 3D using http://www.flightradar24.com. It relies on enthusiasts uploading data to their server.

Some places are lacking coverage - so they will send you a low power beaglebone box to plug into your router for free! http://www.flightradar24.com/free-ads-b-equipment. Of course you need to erect a decent aerial too.

ETA: They even provide the aerial and cable too!

[TerraHertz]

So far, lots of satellite photos of what could be just sea ice. Still not one single actual aircraft piece picked up by the multiple ships in the area. The more days this goes on, the stranger it gets.

Speaking of strange, why has Israel had an identical looking 777, in the exact same paint scheme as the missing MH370, warehoused in Tel Aviv since November 2013? That's a lot of cash to leave sitting idle for 'no reason'.
  http://www.bollyn.com/are-the-israelis-planning-another-9-11-using-the-missing-777/

It's also fascinating to see how Inmarsat can issue estimations of where the plane was when last heard, then later there's a new 'last estimated area' for whatever reason and no one mentions the previous Inmarsat diagrams again.
This makes three times now. First it was 'somewhere on these two arcs', then the southern ocean site shown with a couple of flight paths to it (none of which are anywhere near the original 'two arcs'). Now it's "the plane was going faster than we thought, so must have run out of fuel sooner, giving a location more to the NE."  But wait... isn't fuel efficiency the determinant of distance possible on a tank? Faster & sooner doesn't necessarily mean shorter distance.

Well, I just keep saving local copies of all this stuff. The more tangled the stories get, the easier it is to see who is lying. Especially if anyone starts redacting online articles to cover their arses.
So much disinformation!

For instance, all that stuff about the MH370 right after final spoken contact climbing to above rated altitude, then descending, and passing back over Malaysian airspace and landmass without showing up on radar.
I've concluded it's all bollocks. For starters, the claimed climb rate is impossible, even for fighter planes. Also MH370 was at the very limits of the Malaysian radar, and had just turned off its transponder. It's the transponder that gives ATC computers the craft's true altitude, bearing and speed. Suddenly that data feed stopped, and the ATC systems were left with just the raw radar echo (and faint at that.) So I think the 'rapid climb' was just a radar system processing artifact.

As for the 'evaded radar on the westerly return over Malaysia', I now think that is just the Malaysian government flat out lying to save face. MH370 very likely flew over them at a normal altitude, but with no transponder data it was just an unidentified dot on radar screens. At around 1am in the morning. I think the Malaysian air traffic control were just asleep on the job, or incompetent, and the government is unable to admit their ATC is a joke. Notice how the Malaysian air force commander who broke the story that in fact they _had_ seen MH370 on radar, got stomped on hard in just a few hours, and was forced to claim on camera that he'd never said that (which he had, the day before, on camera.) Nonetheless the official search area was switched to where he said it had been last detected, off the SW coast of Malaysia.

[EEVblog]

So far, lots of satellite photos of what could be just sea ice. Still not one single actual aircraft piece picked up by the multiple ships in the area.

Are the ships even in the area yet?
If so, hundreds of objects reported and they can't find one?

[EEVblog]

Speaking of strange, why has Israel had an identical looking 777, in the exact same paint scheme as the missing MH370, warehoused in Tel Aviv since November 2013? That's a lot of cash to leave sitting idle for 'no reason'.
  http://www.bollyn.com/are-the-israelis-planning-another-9-11-using-the-missing-777/

I see no links to credible data that says the plane is stored there. Just some entry in some plane spotters database?
If it is, then there is almost certainly some technical reason for it, who has investigated that possibility? probably no-one, because some conspiracy theory is always much more exciting than reality. Who wants the boring truth?

[pickle9000]

Here is my understanding of the Inmarsat situation.

Inmarsat originally gave the arc information saying "The data indicates this" (no direction) . The direction (north south) was determined by comparing the signals to other aircraft, this was probably more than a guess but I wouldn't go to court with it. The suspected direction was given early on but probably in the form "We think it went south". The range was determined by expected fuel consumption, not done by Inmarsat.

[TerraHertz]

So far, lots of satellite photos of what could be just sea ice. Still not one single actual aircraft piece picked up by the multiple ships in the area.

Are the ships even in the area yet?
If so, hundreds of objects reported and they can't find one?

Yes, there have been several ships on location for days now. This is why the Oz search aircraft were dropping smoke markers near 'possible objects'. No point unless there's a ship in range to go look. Or, just doing it for the reporters on the plane.
Google 'ships MH370'. For eg:
March 28
http://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/thai-satellite-spots-300-objects-possibly-part-of-missing-malaysia-airlines-flight-mh370/story-fnizu68q-1226865929215
"However, five vessels including the HMAS Success and four Chinese ships continued to visually scour the waves."
March 29
http://www.smh.com.au/world/11-objects-spotted-in-search-for-malaysia-airlines-flight-mh370-20140329-zqobk.html
"A Chinese ship has arrived at the new search area to relocate objects thought to be part of the missing Malaysia Airlines plane. Another five ships, including Australia's HMAS Success, are enroute and expected to arrive in the search zone later today."
Also there's supposed to be a US warship, but no mentions of that recently.

So, why is there so little media mention of the ships on site? How about because that would make too many people wonder about the lack of actual pieces found.

Having said that, maybe any moment now someone will find an aircraft piece with a 'Property of Malaysian Airlines'  tag. Though my paranoid tinfoil-encased mind suspects that won't happen till after the flight recorder acoustic pinger batteries are definitely dead, just so there's no chance at all of having any idea where the wreckage on the bottom may be. If there is any.
That's pretty soon, apparently.

If any of this is related to the ex-Malaysian Airlines 777 sitting in a hangar in Israel since Nov 2013, or the 777 that a few days ago tried to fly into the Dutch protected airspace around the nuclear summit meeting with it's transponder turned off, then this pic someone did about magic tricks comes to mind. Because a good disappearing act requires the object to reappear somewhere very unexpected.