UK forum members, BREXIT?

[Brumby]

Is it just me - or does the current EU structure operate not too dissimilarly to the USSR of old.  Member states become part of the union (this time with carrot, not stick) and then central wisdom gets dispensed 'for the common good'.

To date, implementations of communism have been somewhat of a failure - but is the EU an attempt to roll it out once more in a new wrapper?

Are those in control there to oversee fair and equitable governance, or merely satisfy their lust for power?  The grumblings of the member states and the people seem rather familiar.


There could be a million holes in that idea ... but it's one that seemed to naturally present itself to my simplistic view.

[Kalvin]

UK can get out from this current situation quite easily by setting up another round of the same vote. Of course the "winners" will say that the new round is not needed as the dice has already cast. But the winners should not be afraid of the new vote, if the vote result is real as the outcome of the new vote should be the same. The basis for the new vote is quite clear:

How many 'do-overs' should there be?  Just one to counteract the first vote?  Maybe a third in case the second doesn't get the right answer?  Best 3 out of 5 or 4 out of 7 - like the playoffs?  Maybe somebody should just print up the ballots with the right answer already marked.  The counting will go faster!

One is enough The current 52 - 48 is very tight so it could be considered as "tie". For example, it was estimated that the weather during the voting day could affect the result +/- few per cent, so should the weather really decide the future of the Great Britain. I have also listed three other points why the new vote might be in order. With better margin, the result can be more reliable and reflect better the voter's will.

You should also keep in mind that the current vote result is not obligatory, so UK may still decide not to resign from the EU if the parliament decides so. With the current small margin, it would be quite tempting not to file Article 50. Arranging a new vote, the people's voice would be heard better.

[vodka]

My local supermarket has an entire "Polish" aisle, yet I couldn't find any Mr. Sheen, Kiwi, nor Cherry Blossom there!  What's the point in that?

Police meet with Polish community leaders after hate-fuelled leaflets are posted through doors in Huntingdon

http://www.huntspost.co.uk/news/police_meet_with_polish_community_leaders_after_hate_fuelled_leaflets_are_posted_through_doors_in_huntingdon_1_4592837?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=dlvr.it

https://twitter.com/hashtag/PostRefRacism?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

Hate crime reports investigated in wake of Brexit result (VIDEOS)

For when are the brown shirts  patroling?

[Tepe]

Maybe somebody should just print up the ballots with the right answer already marked.  The counting will go faster!

It also reduces the problem of people not knowing how they ought to cast their vote. Much easier. Hey, the whole process could be optimized further by not requiring people to go to the polling stations at all.

[continuo]

They should provide a voting "App" for smartphones. Young people obviously never heard of "polling stations" and "pencils" which are used to draw "crosses" into "boxes" printed onto small pieces of "paper" 

The silence from the Brexit Camp is deafening. They haven't any clue how to proceed now.

[Simon]

The silence from the Brexit Camp is deafening. They haven't any clue how to proceed now.

of course, this was my biggest complaint about the campaign. It is not for the leave camp to have a plan, it was for the government to negotiate for both options with the EU before the vote. The article 50 rule is back to front, we should have spent 2 years negotiating the alternative and then voted and then trigger an article that said "chierio" if the vote had gone that way. Fact is we had no idea what we were voting on which is why I concluded that really it didn't matter which way I voted as we are voting on something not decided yet.

[SteveyG]

My local supermarket has an entire "Polish" aisle, yet I couldn't find any Mr. Sheen, Kiwi, nor Cherry Blossom there!  What's the point in that?

Police meet with Polish community leaders after hate-fuelled leaflets are posted through doors in Huntingdon

http://www.huntspost.co.uk/news/police_meet_with_polish_community_leaders_after_hate_fuelled_leaflets_are_posted_through_doors_in_huntingdon_1_4592837?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=dlvr.it

https://twitter.com/hashtag/PostRefRacism?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

Hate crime reports investigated in wake of Brexit result (VIDEOS)

For when are the brown shirts  patroling?

  The worry is that the more outspoken who have issues against immigrants will now feel they have 52% of the population to back them up if they decide to pick on someone.
It just goes to show that people honestly have no clue and somehow thought we would just send back all immigrants to their home countries.

[Simon]

people in the UK are ignorant. And that normally suits the government, this time it has backfired.

[G7PSK]

David Cameron always said he would start article 51 straight away after a leave vote came in. He has now weasel'd on that and announced his resignation to take place in 2 months time. This has kyboshed the leave group particularly Boris Johnson. The Brexit will now most likely never happen as the referendum was advisory only and the next government will ignore it even if that government is led by Boris Johnson, being prime-minister is now a poison chalice to him.

[Simon]

indeed I was duped into thinking this was a vote on the EU it seems it was just a vote on david cameron.

[Kjelt]

Is it just me - or does the current EU structure operate not too dissimilarly to the USSR of old.  Member states become part of the union (this time with carrot, not stick) and then central wisdom gets dispensed 'for the common good'.

You could just as well take the US as example, the federal laws go above the state laws, but states do have some self saying, but perhaps an american could explain it better than me.
My case is, small countries can better join together to form a pact of some size against other large countries as India, China, Russia, US in order to stay in business.
But there should be some time for quality, not expanding for the sake of expansion but also keep on guaranteeing the quality and stability of the pact. I hope the brittish message was clear enough for them.

[Kalvin]

indeed I was duped into thinking this was a vote on the EU it seems it was just a vote on david cameron.

Probably so, as he didn't remain but has already left.

[Simon]

Quality is my problem with the EU. why did we admit countries like poland ? and no I am not saying that I don't want them to immigrate here, I am saying why do they feel the urge to emmigrate from poland ? so much for the EU being made up of equal countries, this was replicated with the euro.

[Simon]

indeed I was duped into thinking this was a vote on the EU it seems it was just a vote on david cameron.

Probably so, as he didn't remain but has already left.

I think it's called politics, you are given the impression you are helping to make a certain decision when in reality you are just dealing with petty party politics. so we now have created a second political party with the tory ins and the tory outs, next will follow the labour party with the party members backing their leader and the party MP's not giving a shit about what the people voted for (the leader).

This is why we needed a plan before the vote. we now have to sort the mess the country is in before we can talk to the EU and negotiate. This s the biggest mess in history. If the tories want to keep blaming labour for the financial crash they can go down in history as the party that caused this mess.

[continuo]

I think it's called politics, you are given the impression you are helping to make a certain decision when in reality you are just dealing with petty party politics. so we now have created a second political party with the tory ins and the tory outs, next will follow the labour party with the party members backing their leader and the party MP's not giving a shit about what the people voted for (the leader).

This is why we needed a plan before the vote. we now have to sort the mess the country is in before we can talk to the EU and negotiate. This s the biggest mess in history. If the tories want to keep blaming labour for the financial crash they can go down in history as the party that caused this mess.

Nice. Holding an entire continent hostage while you slowly start to sort out your internal petty party politics, before you are ready to decide if you leave or not or if you come up with something totally different. As if we don't have any other problems 

[Kjelt]

Quality is my problem with the EU. why did we admit countries like poland ? and no I am not saying that I don't want them to immigrate here, I am saying why do they feel the urge to emmigrate from poland ? so much for the EU being made up of equal countries, this was replicated with the euro.

Those "problems" are just starting up problems, as wealth equals out over all connected countries the movement of labour from one to the other countries will disappear.
The biggest problem however are the businesses that take advantage of the situation, a polish worker has the same rights as a native worker and should get equal pay and pension etc.
The problem is not the system that allows the migration of work, but the people taking advantage of this and don't be mistaken a lot of big companies take advantage and earn from this, so the economy also improves, however "Joe Average" does not see this, he can only see that he is out of a job or gets less paid since his new colleagues are also taking less as granted and do not complain, which is completely understandable from his point of view.

[grumpydoc]

Nice. Holding an entire continent hostage while you slowly start to sort out your internal petty party politics, before you are ready to decide if you leave or not or if you come up with something totally different. As if we don't have any other problems 

It's actually quite hard to argue this is not the case.

Cameron wanted a referendum to silence Tory Eurosceptics. He thought that it would be blocked by the Liberals, then he thought that Remain would win I don't think it entered anyone's head (except UKIP's) that the vote would actually go the way it did.

[Simon]

I think it's called politics, you are given the impression you are helping to make a certain decision when in reality you are just dealing with petty party politics. so we now have created a second political party with the tory ins and the tory outs, next will follow the labour party with the party members backing their leader and the party MP's not giving a shit about what the people voted for (the leader).

This is why we needed a plan before the vote. we now have to sort the mess the country is in before we can talk to the EU and negotiate. This s the biggest mess in history. If the tories want to keep blaming labour for the financial crash they can go down in history as the party that caused this mess.

Nice. Holding an entire continent hostage while you slowly start to sort out your internal petty party politics, before you are ready to decide if you leave or not or if you come up with something totally different. As if we don't have any other problems 

Exactly, its disgusting and shows how petty politics is.

[Simon]

Quality is my problem with the EU. why did we admit countries like poland ? and no I am not saying that I don't want them to immigrate here, I am saying why do they feel the urge to emmigrate from poland ? so much for the EU being made up of equal countries, this was replicated with the euro.

Those "problems" are just starting up problems, as wealth equals out over all connected countries the movement of labour from one to the other countries will disappear.
The biggest problem however are the businesses that take advantage of the situation, a polish worker has the same rights as a native worker and should get equal pay and pension etc.
The problem is not the system that allows the migration of work, but the people taking advantage of this and don't be mistaken a lot of big companies take advantage and earn from this, so the economy also improves, however "Joe Average" does not see this, he can only see that he is out of a job or gets less paid since his new colleagues are also taking less as granted and do not complain, which is completely understandable from his point of view.

You are right, we have a surplus of labour and so the price of it falls, good for big business bad for the individual. the problem is that we are not an ever expanding country, the land we have is not going to increase so along with a lowering of wages we have an increase in house prices. I can't afford my house in todays prices, why I struggled to buy 6 years ago and only afforded with help is now 50% up in value while my wages have risen by just 23% and half of that was due to promotion not natural wage rises to counteract inflation. so today I am in the same position i was 6 years ago if not worse, the only good thing is that having bought cheap my house would sell for more should i move so it would be not too dificukt to buy again but essentially I can't get anything nicer I can still only afford the very cheapest of houses. Too many people can;t afford a house and many companies are using people in apprentiships to get cheap labour.

Meanwhile the house builders are buying up all te farm land to build the smallest houses you can get at the highest prices.

[3db]

You describe us as a "small" country, true, but as I said we can be a potent country as well. It is all about the make up and attitude of the population, not the square metre area of the turf We are a centre of excellence in technology and engineering. If we are as insignificant as some would like to believe, why has our decision spread shock waves across the World markets and political arena ?

Well the situation in Greece send similar shock waves through the world markets and political arena.
BTW I used to work for a company in the NL which obliterated an entire branch of the telecom industry in the UK within a couple of years. So how does that work for excellence in technology and engineering?

Edit: name one thing the UK is better at nowadays than all the other countries in the EU! Englisch breakfast and oldest Queen don't count 

Defense and aerospace.
Have you heard of Rolls Royce 

[Kjelt]

  I can't afford my house in todays prices, why I struggled to buy 6 years ago

Well at least you have a house, I must not think about those that rent an apt or something and seeing the rent go up with 5-8% each and every year (maybe more in the UK?) while the salaries remain about frozen.
It is a rat race, and I for one do not want to live in a big city with those extreme prices, I rather live somewhere in a small village where things are reasonably normal, however if you depent on your work of the large city you have less choice except to quit and work somewhere else. I wonder how long this can continu, people will move away when they realize that there is no gain anymore.

[StuUK]

Defense and aerospace.
Have you heard of Rolls Royce 

And they are global as well....

[Kjelt]

Have you heard of Rolls Royce

The motorcars division is a german company? (Bought by BMW if I am not mistaken).

The airplane division is not doing well

Rolls-Royce has issued five profit warnings in less than two years, and its share price has fallen by almost half since last April.

[Simon]

  I can't afford my house in todays prices, why I struggled to buy 6 years ago

Well at least you have a house, I must not think about those that rent an apt or something and seeing the rent go up with 5-8% each and every year (maybe more in the UK?) while the salaries remain about frozen.
It is a rat race, and I for one do not want to live in a big city with those extreme prices, I rather live somewhere in a small village where things are reasonably normal, however if you depent on your work of the large city you have less choice except to quit and work somewhere else. I wonder how long this can continu, people will move away when they realize that there is no gain anymore.

I would never rent. At least in buying I end up with something and I made shure it was on land i own not a bloody flat where even after buying I scarely own the bricks forget the land.

Live in some village in normality ? you know very little about the UK. Everyone would love to live in a village so prices in villages are sky high, just travel 2 miles out of this small town I am in and find a village and prices are already 2-5 times what my house/land is worth.... london ? i'd never live in london. villages are for posh people that don't like us "riff raff"

[Kjelt]

I would never rent. At least in buying I end up with something and I made shure it was on land i own not a bloody flat where even after buying I scarely own the bricks forget the land.

Well good for you, sell it and you can buy a castle in Poland, it is pretty empty I heard 
But yeah houseprices are also in our country rediculous high since half 90's when banks came up with the briljant plan that both spouses income could be used for the mortgage, bammm houseprices doubled 
I did not own a house back then so I also drew the shortest stick.