Author Topic: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?  (Read 2070 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline trevwhite

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 718
  • Country: gb
Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« on: October 28, 2017, 12:30:01 am »
I just lost hours of work because CS does not autobackup an open file. It locked up on me and that was that. It's really disappointing that this could be avoided if they implemented autobackup. It is the kind of feature that spoils a decent package.

Maybe Orcad might be the way forward. Does that autosave?
 

Online Mr. Scram

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4117
  • Country: 00
  • Display aficionado
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2017, 12:33:22 am »
I just lost hours of work because CS does not autobackup an open file. It locked up on me and that was that. It's really disappointing that this could be avoided if they implemented autobackup. It is the kind of feature that spoils a decent package.

Maybe Orcad might be the way forward. Does that autosave?
I've just taught myself to hit Ctrl + S all the time in every application.
 

Offline trevwhite

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 718
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2017, 12:35:35 am »
I just lost hours of work because CS does not autobackup an open file. It locked up on me and that was that. It's really disappointing that this could be avoided if they implemented autobackup. It is the kind of feature that spoils a decent package.

Maybe Orcad might be the way forward. Does that autosave?
I've just taught myself to hit Ctrl + S all the time in every application.
It's not right. It's been decades since I had to worry about cad not autosaving.

And they probably will read this and just stay quiet. Frustrating because CS has a lot of positives 

Thanks

Trev

 

Online voltsandjolts

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 539
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2017, 07:10:11 am »
Yeah, that is a real bummer when it happens  :--

We did discuss this already:

http://www.eevblog.com/forum/circuit-studio/autosave-90934/msg1244993/#msg1244993

...and James agreed with us and promised to pass it on to developers. However, I'm guessing the big new release of Altium Designer is taking up all developer time at the moment. Maybe we'll get some attention after that happens...pleeeease  :-\

Edit:

Of course that code is already written, it should have been copied across from the Designer code base.

Poor alternative: Look at 3rd party auto-backup options. I might check that out myself...
« Last Edit: October 28, 2017, 07:16:47 am by voltsandjolts »
 

Offline trevwhite

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 718
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2017, 07:12:24 am »
Yeah, that is a real bummer when it happens  :--

We did discuss this already:

http://www.eevblog.com/forum/circuit-studio/autosave-90934/msg1244993/#msg1244993

...and James agreed with us and promised to pass it on to developers. However, I'm guessing the big new release of Altium Designer is taking up all developer time at the moment. Maybe we'll get some attention after that happens...pleeeease  :-\
What I do not understand is that there is a history folder that saves previous versions. All they need is a timer to implement that feature.

Thanks

Trev

 

Online voltsandjolts

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 539
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2017, 07:20:36 am »
Yeah, it's even mentioned somewhere in the CS global options, a checkbox for "include in Autosave" or something like that.
So it was deliberately removed already, poor decision.
 

Offline trevwhite

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 718
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2017, 07:22:17 am »
Yeah, it's even mentioned somewhere in the CS global options, a checkbox for "include in Autosave" or something like that.
So it was deliberately removed already, poor decision.
Maybe we can edit a config file somehow 

Thanks

Trev

 

Offline Macbeth

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2412
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2017, 07:52:53 am »
Does Altium Designer have autosave? (I hope so - even every Microsoft Office product has autosave, web browsers will recover tabs after a crash, etc. It's pretty much just expected).

If AD has this "feature" and it has been removed from Circuit Studio which is just a cut down AD then that implies malice on the part of Altium. It's one thing not being able to have advanced stuff like FPGA pin swap or impedence matched squiggly wiggly track routing. But to deliberately remove a data recovery feature is disgusting.

I can't imagine any of the developers OK'd this, but pointy headed MBA's actually thought "Haha - if the stupid nerds didn't back up their CS stuff, maybe they will look at paying out for AD instead." Good Idea!  :palm:

ETA: "Hell, it will make them go for our Cloud backup stuff and Internet of Shit!"

Also, surely the reason for the data recovery is because AD or CS crashed due to Altiums bugs to begin with!
« Last Edit: October 28, 2017, 08:14:51 am by Macbeth »
 

Online Mr. Scram

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4117
  • Country: 00
  • Display aficionado
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2017, 09:21:32 am »
Yeah, it's even mentioned somewhere in the CS global options, a checkbox for "include in Autosave" or something like that.
So it was deliberately removed already, poor decision.
It's arguably better to have people expect nothing, so they save files themselves, rather than expecting a solution that turns out to be flawed.
 

Offline trevwhite

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 718
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #9 on: October 28, 2017, 07:06:25 pm »
It's not about expectations. I would say it's a basic required feature. What if you have a power failure. A hardware fault. I can't see how it looks good for Altium to have removed this feature. Also they did so many good things with CS.

 

Offline Mjolinor

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 235
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #10 on: October 28, 2017, 08:30:27 pm »

I find any autosave to be a real PITA and I am sure I am not alone.

If I want to save something then I will save it, if I want it and don't save it then it is my fault.

Maybe my position is made easier as I don't use any Windo$e products so don't have a falling over and losing work problem, it doesn't happen with Linux.
 

Offline trevwhite

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 718
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #11 on: October 28, 2017, 09:38:16 pm »
CS crashes a bit now and then. It is not often and maybe its related to interaction with other applications. I have Dropbox running for example. I have 3 screens on. I have other applications running. There is a lot going on and its impressive to me all this stuff works 99% of the time anyway.

Windows 10 has been reliable. I forget I am using it whereas with Vista I always knew I was using it because of how shite it was.

 

Online b_force

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1012
  • Country: 00
    • One World Concepts
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #12 on: October 28, 2017, 10:27:42 pm »
My left hand is glued to CTRL+S, but yes autosave should be a at least a feature you can turn on/off in every decent bit of software.
"If you can't explain it simply (or at all), you don't understand it well enough." A. Einstein

http://www.oneworldconcepts.com/
 

Online voltsandjolts

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 539
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #13 on: October 28, 2017, 10:37:59 pm »
The Autosave feature which is in Altium Designer (and should be in CS) is better than pressing Ctrl-S because:

(1) It doesn't forget

(2) It doesn't simply overwrite your previously saved work. It builds a history. That helps not only when the software crashes but also when you make a mistake.
 

Offline T3sl4co1l

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 10958
  • Country: us
  • Expert, Analog Electronics, PCB Layout, EMC
    • Seven Transistor Labs
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #14 on: October 28, 2017, 10:43:37 pm »
Yeah, it's even mentioned somewhere in the CS global options, a checkbox for "include in Autosave" or something like that.
So it was deliberately removed already, poor decision.
It's arguably better to have people expect nothing, so they save files themselves, rather than expecting a solution that turns out to be flawed.

Ah, yes, you're one of those people who'd like cars to be designed with the driver's seat on the front bumper...

Tim
Seven Transistor Labs, LLC
Electronic Design, from Concept to Layout.
Need engineering assistance? Drop me a message!
 

Online Mr. Scram

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4117
  • Country: 00
  • Display aficionado
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #15 on: October 29, 2017, 01:19:06 am »
It's not about expectations. I would say it's a basic required feature. What if you have a power failure. A hardware fault. I can't see how it looks good for Altium to have removed this feature. Also they did so many good things with CS.
Again, I can see an argument for removing something that's not functioning predictably altogether. Now you know not to expect something, rather than being caught with your pants down when things go awry.

Don't get me wrong, I think it is a valuable addition to any software used in production environments.


 

Offline trevwhite

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 718
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #16 on: October 29, 2017, 01:21:58 am »
The software is there as a tool to make me productive. Being trigger happy with Ctrl S  means I am thinking about the wrong things when working 



Thanks

Trev

 

Online Mr. Scram

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4117
  • Country: 00
  • Display aficionado
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #17 on: October 29, 2017, 01:24:16 am »
Ah, yes, you're one of those people who'd like cars to be designed with the driver's seat on the front bumper...

Tim
I would appreciate it if you wouldn't mangle my words because you don't agree with the point brought forward. Obviously, I said I could see them having a point. I haven't quite said I agree with that point.

Comparing it to strapping people to the front bumper also seems a bit odd. It's more like removing seatbelts altogether, rather than having people drive around with solid looking ones that might snap when anything happens. Though I'm not quite fond of car comparisons, because they generally go awry, as has been demonstrated here.
 

Online Mr. Scram

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4117
  • Country: 00
  • Display aficionado
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #18 on: October 29, 2017, 01:25:33 am »
The software is there as a tool to make me productive. Being trigger happy with Ctrl S  means I am thinking about the wrong things when working 

Thanks

Trev
Again, I think it's a nice addition to any software. It quickly becomes a reflex to save your work, but it would be better to not needing the reflex at all.
 

Offline trevwhite

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 718
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #19 on: October 29, 2017, 01:30:43 am »
The software is there as a tool to make me productive. Being trigger happy with Ctrl S  means I am thinking about the wrong things when working 

Thanks

Trev
Again, I think it's a nice addition to any software. It quickly becomes a reflex to save your work, but it would be better to not needing the reflex at all.
I don't consider it a nice feature. I consider it a standard feature.

Thanks

Trev

 

Online voltsandjolts

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 539
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #20 on: October 31, 2017, 05:50:18 am »
I just wanted to point out the ironic title of this thread:

"Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?"

The answer is of course they think its a great feature, too good for CS so they removed it!  :--
 

Offline Macbeth

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2412
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #21 on: October 31, 2017, 09:50:57 am »
I just wanted to point out the ironic title of this thread:

"Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?"

The answer is of course they think its a great feature, too good for CS so they removed it!  :--

Like I said, malice. Altium know that their own software crashes - which is why a total band aid is automatic periodic backups - much the same as Microsoft Office, etc. It has no impact whatsoever on the user (I mean we aren't using 3.5" floppies and worrying about a few 100k of space anymore).

Altium removing this "feature" which costs them nothing and indeed must have cost something to deliberately remove seems to me something that could be challenged in court if a customer loses their work and I'm pretty sure they would win. (At least if they got my favourite youtube lawyer Leonard French on the case  ;) )
 

Online Mr. Scram

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4117
  • Country: 00
  • Display aficionado
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #22 on: October 31, 2017, 09:58:07 am »
Like I said, malice. Altium know that their own software crashes - which is why a total band aid is automatic periodic backups - much the same as Microsoft Office, etc. It has no impact whatsoever on the user (I mean we aren't using 3.5" floppies and worrying about a few 100k of space anymore).

Altium removing this "feature" which costs them nothing and indeed must have cost something to deliberately remove seems to me something that could be challenged in court if a customer loses their work and I'm pretty sure they would win. (At least if they got my favourite youtube lawyer Leonard French on the case  ;) )
This is becoming awfully speculative. There are plenty of reasons why software that's not properly functioning would be removed from the release version and that would be perfectly defensible in court.

People need to take some responsibility of their own too.
 

Offline buck converter

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 158
  • Country: us
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #23 on: October 31, 2017, 10:03:25 am »
 :)Just a reminder that even Fritzing has auto-save. :)
Just me and my scope.
 

Offline Macbeth

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2412
  • Country: gb
Re: Why doesnt CS believe autosave is a good feature?
« Reply #24 on: October 31, 2017, 10:58:13 am »

I find any autosave to be a real PITA and I am sure I am not alone.

If I want to save something then I will save it, if I want it and don't save it then it is my fault.

Maybe my position is made easier as I don't use any Windo$e products so don't have a falling over and losing work problem, it doesn't happen with Linux.

It most definitely happens in Linux - it's the shitty apps that crash all the time, fucking hell have you tried KiCAD?... you wonder why it is in permanent beta? and we are talking about apps not the OS.

"Windo$e" ... ahh, obvious troll is obvious.
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf