Author Topic: WAVE: A cell phone that charges battery with wifi signal. (Read 27314 times)

rthorntn · « **on:** March 28, 2015, 05:57:56 am »

Another one:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/945803481/wave-a-cell-phone-that-charges-battery-with-wifi-s/description

A modest $300K target!

zapta · « **Reply #1 on:** March 28, 2015, 06:46:03 am »

Three of the 4 rewards are very feasible.

Mechatrommer · « **Reply #2 on:** March 28, 2015, 06:47:29 am »

great! but $499 to get a working unit? i'll wait mass production $15/pop. since charging time is not stated, i must assume it will be infinity...

AlfBaz · « **Reply #3 on:** March 28, 2015, 06:53:35 am »

He'll never get the research done if he's going to piss away valuable time cooking swirly pastry

rthorntn · « **Reply #4 on:** March 28, 2015, 07:15:11 am »

The $300K will be used for the final stages of R&D, lawyer fees, and marketing:

R&D $10K
Lawyer fees $280K
Marketing $10K

He has factored in lots of legal action coming his way

Dubbie · « **Reply #5 on:** March 29, 2015, 09:21:34 am »

Considering the limit for wifi power output is a watt if you're lucky, he's going to need to buy a u-current from Dave to measure the tiny amount of power this thing will collect. I wonder if he plans to add solar panels to collect the power from the LEDs on the wifi router as well?

EEVblog · « **Reply #6 on:** March 29, 2015, 09:28:08 am »

Dubbie · « **Reply #7 on:** March 29, 2015, 09:42:55 am »

Haha! Couldn't get more relevant.

The thing that made me laugh on his site is how his prototype aerial is huge, yet he talks about building an IC version of the thing.

SaabFAN · « **Reply #8 on:** March 31, 2015, 03:01:13 am »

All he has to do, is to chose a different frequency-band: Radio-Transmitters in the long-wave to short-wave band. Haven't done any math on it, but several Transmitters in the Kilowatt (87,5 to 108Mhz), and a few at about 4 Megawatts should provide a large enough energy density to acutally do stuff.
I remember building a radio once with a Kosmos Electronics Learning Kit (probably 20 years ago), which was completely powered by the energy it received via the antenna.
You probably couldn't market such a device on Kickstarter though, because you couldn't use such words as "WiFi" and "Bluetooth" in the advertising^^

AG6QR · « **Reply #9 on:** March 31, 2015, 04:08:29 am »

Quote from: SaabFAN on March 31, 2015, 03:01:13 am

All he has to do, is to chose a different frequency-band: Radio-Transmitters in the long-wave to short-wave band. Haven't done any math on it, but several Transmitters in the Kilowatt (87,5 to 108Mhz), and a few at about 4 Megawatts should provide a large enough energy density to acutally do stuff.

Only if you're really close. The inverse square law makes it tough to extract significant power at a distance, especially if you have an antenna of reasonable size. To a first approximation, the percentage of the transmitter's output power which you can receive is no greater than the percentage of a full sphere which your antenna would cover, as viewed from an observer at the transmitter's antenna site. Directional antennas pointed straight at you will change things a bit, but the inverse square law still causes serious problems if you're trying to harvest broadcast radio waves.

Quote

I remember building a radio once with a Kosmos Electronics Learning Kit (probably 20 years ago), which was completely powered by the energy it received via the antenna.

Yeah, crystal diode radios do work, but they only produce enough output power to drive a small and efficient earphone, and they normally require a pretty long wire antenna and a pretty powerful nearby station to do even that.

Nerull · « **Reply #10 on:** April 02, 2015, 12:00:26 am »

Crystal radios operate on microwatts to nanowatts. Apparently a good modern one can receive at 50 picowatts. Good luck charging a phone with that. Unless you're standing next to it, even a MW transmitter isn't outputting useful amounts of energy into an area the size of a phone. Certainly not an IC.

For a 4MW transmitter operating at 100MHz, you're looking at energy densities of under 1mW/cm² at a distance of only 400m. There are transmitter towers taller than that (not many, but some).

FM transmitters are limited to 100kW in the US, unless grandfathered in. Digital TV is 1MW, and most don't that high.

Muxr · « **Reply #11 on:** April 05, 2015, 03:14:59 pm »

The best part of the video is that he admits stealing his neighbor's Wifi haha.

Trust me with your $300k funding folks!

codeboy2k · « **Reply #12 on:** April 06, 2015, 06:28:37 am »

The thing is with many of these guys doing similar things (including all the free energy guys) is they do something that harvests some volts from the sky (or some spinning device), and when they see the volts they think they can do meaningful work with it, without understanding the power equation.

The problem is, 90% of the world also doesn't understand the power equation, so their willing to throw money at these guys.

Kickstarter needs independant review teams that can comment directly on the project page, regarding the viability of a project and the risks of completion or non-completion, especially the technical ones. Of course, that won't happen, since KS would not get as much income then.

Gavin Melville · « **Reply #13 on:** April 13, 2015, 04:41:30 am »

I invested $5 to become a backer. The guy is a little sensitive to any suggestion it's not going to work.

Ty Williams says:
Ok, so what's the point of your spam? And why would you pledge to back a project if you think it's a scam? I have clearly stated I'm in beginning R&D, and posted a video of the project. Time us too valuable to waste. If you don't like a project, that's why there is the option to not back it.

BlueBill · « **Reply #14 on:** April 13, 2015, 04:53:05 am »

Quote from: Gavin Melville on April 13, 2015, 04:41:30 am

I invested $5 to become a backer. The guy is a little sensitive to any suggestion it's not going to work.

Ty Williams says:
Ok, so what's the point of your spam? And why would you pledge to back a project if you think it's a scam? I have clearly stated I'm in beginning R&D, and posted a video of the project. Time us too valuable to waste. If you don't like a project, that's why there is the option to not back it.

Nice. Kickstarter is becoming a joke.

rthorntn · « **Reply #15 on:** April 13, 2015, 05:05:06 am »

Where did he "pluck" the $300,000 figure from, I wonder

BlueBill · « **Reply #16 on:** April 13, 2015, 02:13:21 pm »

Quote from: rthorntn on April 13, 2015, 05:05:06 am

Where did he "pluck" the $300,000 figure from, I wonder

Maybe more financial sense than electronic savvy.

Gavin Melville · « **Reply #17 on:** April 13, 2015, 10:55:55 pm »

The other little issue that he has not considered, is that most Wifi versions are DSSS. You can't even see the signal without reversing (demodulating) the spreading process - it just looks like noise. The coding gain for 802.11b (for example) is 10 odd dB. 802.11n is OFDM, but spreading the TX power across many low powered carriers is making recovering energy harder, not easier. Those little carriers are not in phase....

While recovering usable power from a non modulated single frequency RF source is hard, it might, with gain antennas, short range and careful management of losses be possible to get a little power transmitted.

Spread spectrum, 2.4 GHz, low gain transmit antennas (you can't choose that one) and all sorts of path losses, simply impossible.

There's possibly a reason that all wireless charging schemes use modulated magnetic fields.

zerorisers · « **Reply #18 on:** April 15, 2015, 04:13:30 pm »

Quote from: Muxr on April 05, 2015, 03:14:59 pm

The best part of the video is that he admits stealing his neighbor's Wifi haha.

Trust me with your $300k funding folks!

Maybe thats what his mass lawer budget is for!

Gavin Melville · « **Reply #19 on:** April 20, 2015, 10:11:50 pm »

Yes!!

This is a message from Kickstarter’s Integrity team. We’re writing to notify you that the WAVE: A cell phone that charges itself, using wifi signal., project has been suspended, and your $5.00 USD pledge has been canceled. A review of the project uncovered evidence that it broke Kickstarter's rules. We may suspend projects when they demonstrate one or more of the following:
Accordingly, all funding has been stopped and backers will not be charged for their pledges. No further action is required on your part.
We take the integrity of the Kickstarter system very seriously. We only suspend projects when we find strong evidence that they are misrepresenting themselves or otherwise violating the letter or spirit of Kickstarter's rules. As a policy, we do not offer comment on project suspensions beyond what is stated in this message.

rthorntn · « **Reply #20 on:** April 21, 2015, 06:40:33 am »

Cool at least one example of common sense at play in the Kickstarter integrity team!

codeboy2k · « **Reply #21 on:** April 21, 2015, 03:48:42 pm »

Quote from: Gavin Melville on April 20, 2015, 10:11:50 pm

This is a message from Kickstarter’s Integrity team....

Just for kicks, they should change their group name to the The Kickstarter Gravity Integrity Team. It would be so much more applicable to the free energy guys... Keeping the world safe from violations of the Laws of Physics and the inadvertent and untimely creation of large, scary black holes.

bitwelder · « **Reply #22 on:** April 21, 2015, 05:27:45 pm »

Quote from: mojo-chan on April 21, 2015, 09:00:21 am

I recently backed Nextion on IndiGoGo, and they sent me a survey about it. When asked why I wouldn't recommend them I listed the shear number of projects that are impossible as the main reason. Free energy, dark light projection, that sort of thing. If people keep complaining it may eventually get through their thick skulls.

I've done the same. As I backed so far on 3 IGG campaigns, I received as many request for feedback to IGG.
In every one of them I replied my wish that IGG would not accept campaigns for freaking solar roadways and the likes, as they reduce their own reputation and those of seriously designed projects. I doubt it will have an effect but anyway...

Richard Crowley · « **Reply #23 on:** April 21, 2015, 05:32:52 pm »

Now if only someone would invent a car that would re-fuel by driving by a gas station (or a gasoline truck).

JimRemington · « **Reply #24 on:** April 21, 2015, 06:02:35 pm »

Funding was suspended for this project a few hours ago! https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/945803481/wave-a-cell-phone-that-charges-battery-with-wifi-s/description

Does anyone know if it is possible to learn the reasons?


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Author Topic: WAVE: A cell phone that charges battery with wifi signal. (Read 27314 times)

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