Avoid PCBway

[rx8pilot]

That is a very good question. I'd be interested to hear what happens after some time has transpired.

This is for a product with a number of PCB's, and this is the least worrisome. Mainly interface boards and an LCD display. Maybe for the more proprietary boards, I should remove the company name, part number or any other marks that will identify it's final destination and usage. Possibly only giving one company, one design at a time. Using a different vendor for each PCB? Overkill or self-preservation? Not sure how much trust I should put into this. If my designs get into the wrong hands, the cost savings will be wiped out instantly.

[helius]

I don't think it's overkill at all. Considering the possible economic value, I'd be surprised if major hacking groups or state actors haven't placed persistent malware in all of the PCB manufacturers already, and that goes for the US and Europe not only China. If you want design security you need to stay in-house or remain as obscure as possible.

[bitseeker]

That is a very good question. I'd be interested to hear what happens after some time has transpired.

This is for a product with a number of PCB's, and this is the least worrisome. Mainly interface boards and an LCD display. Maybe for the more proprietary boards, I should remove the company name, part number or any other marks that will identify it's final destination and usage. Possibly only giving one company, one design at a time. Using a different vendor for each PCB? Overkill or self-preservation? Not sure how much trust I should put into this. If my designs get into the wrong hands, the cost savings will be wiped out instantly.

That would pretty much be my approach. If I kept the company name on it, I might assign a different part number when sending to different PCB house.

I don't think it's overkill for proprietary designs. Unless you're doing open source, it's good to be a bit paranoid.

[mrpackethead]

If you leave your design in the USA, the russians will get it.

[rx8pilot]

I received my first PCBway order yesterday. It looks reasonable so far.

It is a relatively simple design: 4 layer FR4, 8/8, 1oz, 10mil holes, green mask, irregular routing. The holes are precise and the registration of copper to hole and copper to mask are reasonable. The silk is legible but not amazing. In general, I don't really care about the silk being an art project as long as it is legible.

The order was an experiment to see how they do. So far (before assembly) it looks good. The schedule was met - shipped in about 5 days, arrived 3 days later. The cost was ~60% less than a USA based option. After I assemble and test, I will know for sure - but the outer layers look good with 8/8 trace space. Assuming all goes well electrically, I will decide if it seems safe enough to send my more critical designs with tougher features and expensive IP. I am not terribly surprised that they can make PCB's, but I am definitely worried about my designs making the rounds. It would not be too challenging for anyone to figure out what this is used for, copy my firmware and slash the cost.

I am far too small to implement a security scheme to outwit copycats.

[mrpackethead]

I received my first PCBway order yesterday. It looks reasonable so far.

It is a relatively simple design: 4 layer FR4, 8/8, 1oz, 10mil holes, green mask, irregular routing. The holes are precise and the registration of copper to hole and copper to mask are reasonable. The silk is legible but not amazing. In general, I don't really care about the silk being an art project as long as it is legible.

The order was an experiment to see how they do. So far (before assembly) it looks good. The schedule was met - shipped in about 5 days, arrived 3 days later. The cost was ~60% less than a USA based option. After I assemble and test, I will know for sure - but the outer layers look good with 8/8 trace space. Assuming all goes well electrically, I will decide if it seems safe enough to send my more critical designs with tougher features and expensive IP. I am not terribly surprised that they can make PCB's, but I am definitely worried about my designs making the rounds. It would not be too challenging for anyone to figure out what this is used for, copy my firmware and slash the cost.

I am far too small to implement a security scheme to outwit copycats.

PCBway is way too busy to be reverse engineering pcbs.

[wraper]

PCBway is way too busy to be reverse engineering pcbs.

Some of the employees might be not that busy or honest. Although I won't be too much concerned about bare PCBs. Full assembly certainly would be a valid concern.

[Macbeth]

PCBway is way too busy to be reverse engineering pcbs.

Some of the employees might be not that busy or honest. Although I won't be too much concerned about bare PCBs. Full assembly certainly would be a valid concern.

Perhaps get your PCBs made in Shenzhen and your assembly in Taiwan, or vice versa and then finally the international despatch from Hong Kong? (Maybe the secure firmware flashing too)

[mrpackethead]

PCBway is way too busy to be reverse engineering pcbs.

Some of the employees might be not that busy or honest. Although I won't be too much concerned about bare PCBs. Full assembly certainly would be a valid concern.

ANd then you sell your product.  Complete, functioning with all the bits..   If I wanted to copy it..  I'd buy a finsihed one. SO much easier. I'd know what its function was i could make some educated guess's about how it works...
Trust me if they were going to have copied your idea, they would have done it by now.,

[kcbanner]

I placed my order on the 23rd and have my boards in hand today. They shipped on the 26th via DHL. Show me a registered air parcel that gets to my door (Canada) in 3 days and I'll happily use it.

I'm extremely pleased with how fast I got my boards.

I had to pay duty and higher shipping costs but if you are trying to argue on timing then there really isn't much to be said.

[kiran_shrestha]

I am also going to defend... cos I have made tons of PCB from PCBWay, and I think there service and response are very great, but I admit their silkscreen is not much fine.

[PeterL]

I'm sorry but I think this thread doesn't deserve to be kept alive.

The title suggest that there is something wrong with PCBWay, but no arguments are given to support this.
Instead there is just a shameless plug of elecrow.

And the high freight costs is no argument if you ask me. These are things you can see and compare upfront, so I see no reason why people should be warned about this.

And only if you read the thread you'll find out that that the general opinion is that people are actually happy with PCBWay.
But in the mean time there is this thread that keeps coming up in the top of the thread list saying "Avoid PCBWay"

So I would suggest to not reply to this thread any more, unless you have a real reason to indeed avoid PCBWay.
Or maybe put a lock on it..

[mrpackethead]

In a strange kind of way, this is the best advertising that PCBWay could have ever hoped for.

BTW, i'm a very happy customer.

[Koen]

Did anyone notice a recent improvement in soldermask accuracy ? I ordered boards a few weeks ago (green) and they were much better than all those I received before (black). I do not know if it is due to the colour difference or an overall improvement of their work.

Thank you, Koen

[mrpackethead]

Did anyone notice a recent improvement in soldermask accuracy ? I ordered boards a few weeks ago (green) and they were much better than all those I received before (black). I do not know if it is due to the colour difference or an overall improvement of their work.

Thank you, Koen

They have apparently recently done some major plant upgrades

[Alex Eisenhut]

Did anyone notice a recent improvement in soldermask accuracy ? I ordered boards a few weeks ago (green) and they were much better than all those I received before (black). I do not know if it is due to the colour difference or an overall improvement of their work.

Thank you, Koen

They have apparently recently done some major plant upgrades

Can they do Bezier rivets? If not, they are dismissed. Out of hand.

[Bud]

Actually solder mask was worse on the boards i received in December compare to earlier boards from a few months back.

[timb]

Did anyone notice a recent improvement in soldermask accuracy ? I ordered boards a few weeks ago (green) and they were much better than all those I received before (black). I do not know if it is due to the colour difference or an overall improvement of their work.

Thank you, Koen

They have apparently recently done some major plant upgrades

Can they do Bezier rivets? If not, they are dismissed. Out of hand.

You're nom-sequonor is diss-missed!

[mrpackethead]

No.   No. No ahh

[TheDefpom]

I used them, was very happy with the service, had them in my hand within a week.

However, a couple of weeks later they asked me to pay an extra US$50 shipping, because dhl charged them more, I ignored it, as I chose that option based on the prices stated on their site.

[rx8pilot]

I have recently sent 3 separate designs to PCBway. 2 of them are 4 layer, 6/6, with .2mm holes and ENIG finish. Not exotic at all. Great price, fast fabrication, reasonable shipping with DHL to USA. The quality is reasonable, but not as good as Sunstone or RushPCB here in the US. The routing a little rough, soldermask alignment not amazing - but nothing that would stop them from working.

The third one was a simple 2 layer interface PCB that needed to be panelized. I had them do the panel layout and they made wise choices with no changes needed. I just sent 2 additional designs to them today. One of them is a very small PCB that will be embedded in a cable assembly - the smallest PCB I have ever done. Curious if that will cause any issues. 21mm x 8mm.

Anyway - the experience has been positive so far. The website is easy to use.

[digsys]

Yup, pretty much similar experiences. I normally do 2oz, it's a bigger jump in price, but still very good value. Just sent off 4 designs as well.
I have some 4oz stuff to do, and the price jump is really big, but again, well under what he had locally (OZ). I wonder if they in fact do the 4oz themselves or
have an exchange deal with someone else? I'd guess the marked price differences from 1oz to 4oz is purely QTY produced.
The one good thing about local was, the difference was bugger all, but then our labour / overheads would make it insignificant. Any other reasons?

[mrpackethead]

ll PCB that will be embedded in a cable assembly - the smallest PCB I have ever done. Curious if that will cause any issues. 21mm x 8mm.

They make a board for me that is 6x9mm and its been just fine.

[bitseeker]

The was this thread has been going, I'm going to have to try PCBWay. 

[Buriedcode]

Worth it, but expect extra charges to be added after it has been shipped if you go DHL.  It's an unpleasant surprise but as others have said, even when you include this in the total price - still works out very cheap for quality boards shipped fast.

I'm just wondering the best way to get 1/2 piece of several different designs made without being stung.