Author Topic: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here  (Read 41821 times)

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Offline nickoe

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #75 on: July 02, 2015, 06:23:56 pm »
I keep trying to learn it as I eventually want to make PCBs and it's one of few programs that run in Linux, but I have a few gripes myself:

1: Navigating is just so awkward.  Like any other program you'd be able to right click and drag and scroll to zoom in and out or what not, but it seems you HAVE to use the scroll bars.  It just feels unintuitive
You don't HAVE to ues the scroll bars. You can navigate by zooming out and in, I use that quite a lot. Very easy. Also you can use the shift and ctrl modifiers for the scrollwheel to pan, as you can in almost all applications with such a canvas.
2: Mass operations are hard.  I want to be able to just select a bunch of parts, drag them somewhere else, or delete them etc.   On similar note, if I want to make an array of say, 10 parts by adding one, then pressing control and dragging it to create copies.  Lot of standard stuff like this that lot of other graphic/editing type programs have that kicad does not have.
This is also possible. Use the array tool. (Only in pcbnew and the footprint editor, not ported to eeschema yet)
3: Too many shortcut keys that you have to just know.  Those options should be in menus, and the shortcut keys should be specified within the menu for each option like most programs do like office programs etc.  This is something a lot of open source programs suffer from.  Why do they expect people to learn all these shortcut keys by heart? It should still have menu options and specify the shortcut so you can learn them as you're using the program, without needing to have a cheat sheet on a secondary monitor at all times.
This comment is very useless as is. What hotkeys do you think is not mapped to the menu? Please list them all.
 

Offline krivx

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #76 on: July 02, 2015, 07:09:27 pm »
I keep trying to learn it as I eventually want to make PCBs and it's one of few programs that run in Linux, but I have a few gripes myself:

1: Navigating is just so awkward.  Like any other program you'd be able to right click and drag and scroll to zoom in and out or what not, but it seems you HAVE to use the scroll bars.  It just feels unintuitive
You don't HAVE to ues the scroll bars. You can navigate by zooming out and in, I use that quite a lot. Very easy. Also you can use the shift and ctrl modifiers for the scrollwheel to pan, as you can in almost all applications with such a canvas.


The scrolling mechanism is inconsistent between normal and GAL views though.
 

Offline madworm

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #77 on: July 02, 2015, 07:48:14 pm »
The scrolling mechanism is inconsistent between normal and GAL views though.

What nonsense!

Panning with middle mouse button works the same for classical view and GAL. Scrolling left/right (ctrl+mouse-whell) works the same, Scrolling up/down (shift+mouse-wheel) works the same.

Either you guys are trolling deliberately, or use terribly outdated versions.
 

Offline krivx

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #78 on: July 02, 2015, 07:57:28 pm »
The scrolling mechanism is inconsistent between normal and GAL views though.

What nonsense!

Panning with middle mouse button works the same for classical view and GAL. Scrolling left/right (ctrl+mouse-whell) works the same, Scrolling up/down (shift+mouse-wheel) works the same.

Either you guys are trolling deliberately, or use terribly outdated versions.

I'm using a recent build from here, the About windows says BZR 5754 (http://www2.futureware.at/~nickoe/). I am using a laptop trackpad that has a button for activating a mousewheel. In standard mode dragging with the mousewheel pans. In GAL it does nothing.
 

Offline madworm

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #79 on: July 02, 2015, 08:27:03 pm »
Works on my laptop just fine. Of course I don't use windows.

Maybe mouse wheel emulation is broken on your system.
 

Offline krivx

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #80 on: July 02, 2015, 08:35:54 pm »
Mouse wheel emulation works in standard view, not in GAL (it also works in all the other software I use). This is clearly an inconsistency between renderers. I have no idea why input handling would be coupled to graphical code but it seems to be the case. Different keyboard shortcuts in different views seems to confirm this e.g. F1/F2 for zooming in standard but ALT+F1/F2 in GAL.

I don't have linux installed on this machine to compare, I may have to try it on a livedisk or VM. I did look into fixing this a couple of weeks ago but the winbuilder project was broken and apparently has been for a couple of months.
 

Offline madworm

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #81 on: July 02, 2015, 08:41:00 pm »
This must be a windows thing. Zooming is just F1/F2 for me here, no matter what renderer I choose.
 

Offline krivx

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #82 on: July 02, 2015, 08:49:16 pm »
This must be a windows thing. Zooming is just F1/F2 for me here, no matter what renderer I choose.

F1 in GAL is "find footprint".

This is a little annoying, I had assumed that the Windows version was as mature as the Linux one. I hadn't read anything to recommend the Linux version over Windows, though I guess the GAL developers are running Linux as their youtube demos look like it. I'll have to try a VM.

In case you have a copy open, are any of the other GUI bugs isolated to Windows? For example, I can't select the "Delete" tool in GAL, I get a "Not implemented yet" dialog. I can just delete things by using the delete key though.
 

Offline madworm

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #83 on: July 02, 2015, 08:57:36 pm »
"Edit, delete"? That works. I use BZR5872.

"delete" from a context menu works too (after having selected a footprint).
 

Offline krivx

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #84 on: July 02, 2015, 09:00:15 pm »
"Edit, delete"? That works. I use BZR5872.

"delete" from a context menu works too (after having selected a footprint).

Sorry - I meant the sidebar, where the trashcan icons is. Like on the right side of this image:
 
 

Offline c4757p

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #85 on: July 02, 2015, 09:01:20 pm »
krivx - the CERN / GAL developers are indeed using Linux - but Windows is popular among the other devs, so any Windows issues should probably get attention if reported.
No longer active here - try the IRC channel if you just can't be without me :)
 

Offline krivx

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #86 on: July 02, 2015, 09:05:40 pm »
krivx - the CERN / GAL developers are indeed using Linux - but Windows is popular among the other devs, so any Windows issues should probably get attention if reported.

I'll throw in some reports so.
 

Offline Red Squirrel

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #87 on: July 02, 2015, 09:23:56 pm »
Edited my post.  2013 seems kind of old... is there a newer version?  I wonder if the issues I mentioned actually got fixed.  I recently did an apt-get upgrade though but apt repositories can be far behind sometimes.
 

Offline timofonic

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #88 on: July 04, 2015, 01:12:59 pm »
Edited my post.  2013 seems kind of old... is there a newer version?  I wonder if the issues I mentioned actually got fixed.  I recently did an apt-get upgrade though but apt repositories can be far behind sometimes.

There's a PPA...

https://code.launchpad.net/~js-reynaud/+archive/ubuntu/ppa-kicad
 

Offline Icchan

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #89 on: July 08, 2015, 06:39:51 pm »
WHEN GRIPING:

Please indicate which version of Kicad you are using.

Some of the complaints here are based on the old so-called "stable" releases, and a lot of them have been addressed in newer revisions.

Thank you.

I would recommend that with greatest of urgency, update the web pages to tell the people going there, that the old stable is "deprecated" or something those lines, and they should use nightly builds if possible.

Offline nickoe

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #90 on: July 08, 2015, 07:11:47 pm »
WHEN GRIPING:

Please indicate which version of Kicad you are using.

Some of the complaints here are based on the old so-called "stable" releases, and a lot of them have been addressed in newer revisions.

Thank you.

I would recommend that with greatest of urgency, update the web pages to tell the people going there, that the old stable is "deprecated" or something those lines, and they should use nightly builds if possible.

Is this good enough?
Quote
DISCLAIMER: [...] Also note that the old stable is deprecated and a new release is imminent.
 

Offline timofonic

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #91 on: July 08, 2015, 10:58:17 pm »
WHEN GRIPING:

Please indicate which version of Kicad you are using.

Some of the complaints here are based on the old so-called "stable" releases, and a lot of them have been addressed in newer revisions.

Thank you.

I would recommend that with greatest of urgency, update the web pages to tell the people going there, that the old stable is "deprecated" or something those lines, and they should use nightly builds if possible.

Is this good enough?
Quote
DISCLAIMER: [...] Also note that the old stable is deprecated and a new release is imminent.

Where's that? I can't see it at the top of the site...
 

Offline nickoe

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #92 on: July 09, 2015, 05:43:00 am »
WHEN GRIPING:

Please indicate which version of Kicad you are using.

Some of the complaints here are based on the old so-called "stable" releases, and a lot of them have been addressed in newer revisions.

Thank you.

I would recommend that with greatest of urgency, update the web pages to tell the people going there, that the old stable is "deprecated" or something those lines, and they should use nightly builds if possible.

Is this good enough?
Quote
DISCLAIMER: [...] Also note that the old stable is deprecated and a new release is imminent.

Where's that? I can't see it at the top of the site...
On the installing page.
 

Offline timofonic

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #93 on: July 09, 2015, 01:48:47 pm »
WHEN GRIPING:

Please indicate which version of Kicad you are using.

Some of the complaints here are based on the old so-called "stable" releases, and a lot of them have been addressed in newer revisions.

Thank you.

I would recommend that with greatest of urgency, update the web pages to tell the people going there, that the old stable is "deprecated" or something those lines, and they should use nightly builds if possible.

Is this good enough?
Quote
DISCLAIMER: [...] Also note that the old stable is deprecated and a new release is imminent.

Where's that? I can't see it at the top of the site...
On the installing page.

Oh. Nice. Why not put it in the home page too?

Another "gripe":

I know I'm not so polite and sometimes a bit asshole, sorry (I'm working on tuning my broken brain)...

But that 2012 date in the site makes people think the project is outdated too.

I know maintaning a website is hard and you are all busy doing the very much needed code polishing, but the site gives the feeling of an outdated project.

Is it easy to put a top frame feeded from the RSS of the code commits with something like "We are busy coding to provide you a new stable release soon"? I think that would make people understand this great project is still active ;)
« Last Edit: July 09, 2015, 01:50:31 pm by Circuiteromalaguito »
 

Offline Bassman59

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #94 on: July 13, 2015, 04:41:51 pm »
WHEN GRIPING:

Please indicate which version of Kicad you are using.

Some of the complaints here are based on the old so-called "stable" releases, and a lot of them have been addressed in newer revisions.

Thank you.

I would recommend that with greatest of urgency, update the web pages to tell the people going there, that the old stable is "deprecated" or something those lines, and they should use nightly builds if possible.

Is this good enough?
Quote
DISCLAIMER: [...] Also note that the old stable is deprecated and a new release is imminent.

Where's that? I can't see it at the top of the site...
On the installing page.

Oh. Nice. Why not put it in the home page too?

Another "gripe":

I know I'm not so polite and sometimes a bit asshole, sorry (I'm working on tuning my broken brain)...

But that 2012 date in the site makes people think the project is outdated too.

I know maintaning a website is hard and you are all busy doing the very much needed code polishing, but the site gives the feeling of an outdated project.

Is it easy to put a top frame feeded from the RSS of the code commits with something like "We are busy coding to provide you a new stable release soon"? I think that would make people understand this great project is still active ;)

For the record, the devs know that the website is outdated. Some of the discussion on the dev mail list today was  specifically about updating the front page of the website to reflect the upcoming stable release, its features and all of that.
 

Offline c4757p

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #95 on: July 13, 2015, 05:46:28 pm »
Indeed, in fact one of the CERN guys had a nice-looking demo that I was rather fond of. Seems it'll be replaced soon. :-+
No longer active here - try the IRC channel if you just can't be without me :)
 

Offline Watth

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #96 on: September 19, 2016, 02:09:55 pm »
Quote
3: Too many shortcut keys that you have to just know.  Those options should be in menus, and the shortcut keys should be specified within the menu for each option like most programs do like office programs etc.  This is something a lot of open source programs suffer from.  Why do they expect people to learn all these shortcut keys by heart? It should still have menu options and specify the shortcut so you can learn them as you're using the program, without needing to have a cheat sheet on a secondary monitor at all times.
This comment is very useless as is. What hotkeys do you think is not mapped to the menu? Please list them all.

Many are not mapped nor mappable; still true for the current version (4.0.3).
One simple example: "Cleanup Tracks an Vias" I often use it and wish I could do something in PReferences>Hotkeys>Edit Hotkeys. But nope.

EDIT: Same thing in 4.0.4
« Last Edit: September 26, 2016, 02:21:18 pm by Watth »
Because "Matth" was already taken.
 

Offline Wilksey

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #97 on: September 19, 2016, 05:14:09 pm »
FYI KiCad is now on 4.04
 

Offline technotronix

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #98 on: September 23, 2016, 02:02:22 pm »
Last I have used is Kicad 4.0
 

Offline Tibby

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Re: KiCad gripes list - post gripes here
« Reply #99 on: September 26, 2016, 02:12:44 pm »
I have not read through all on this post so don't know if mine is here or not. I tried Ki Cad as an alternative as it is really really time to get away from my old Tango which I can drive blindfolded and with one hand behind my back.

However the first project, a simple board, required cutouts in the corners. I was damned if I could do this easily on the board outline. Short of actually calculating each corner co-ordinates and then tracing the outline accordingly. No tool to drag and drop a line, introducing a corner ? I asked on various forums and got no reply. So I quit as I had a job to do.

To me that was PCB cad 101, any improvements in this area ?
 


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