Chinese cable manufacturers - know any?

[DTJ]

I'm looking for a Chinese cable manufacturer.

I'm trying to source some ~22AWG multi-stranded, 3 or 4 core foil shielded water submersible (up to say 20m) cable.
I'm thinking of polyethylene (PE) or polyurethane (PU) sheath. Jelly or water-blocking tape would be OK but not critical.
See image below.


I'm thinking of similar cable to buriable phone cable except its foil shielded and had multi-strand conductors instead of solid.
It'd be nice if the cable was more flexible than the polyethylene sheathed phone cable usually is.
I imagine I'd probably purchase say 500m as an initial test buy.






Element14/Mouser/Digikey etc have it for between $4 and $10 per meter which is about 4 times what the BOM will allow.


I've looked on Alibaba and found a couple of Chinese cable factories (among hundreds) but I've had difficulties progressing due to communications problems.
I'll ask for specifications/MOQ/delivery options and cost and they will reply with "US$0.64/m do you want to buy it?" without answering my questions.


Has anyone dealt directly with Chinese cable manufacturers with success?
I wouldn't mind paying a little more and dealing with a cable supplier, as long as we can understand each other!

[DTJ]

Maybe I've picked the wrong sub-forum!

Alternatively has anyone purchased via Alibaba?

[Kean]

Yes, Alibaba or AliExpress is a good place to start if you don't have direct manufacturer contacts.  I've had success there with many components, but not yet with cable.

I have tried a few times for some similar construction cable, and other custom cable (like figure 8 but 3 core low voltage, black, and 20AWG).  I got a few samples which were all close but not quite right, and a custom manufacturing run wasn't viable at the time.  So in the end I had no luck sourcing it myself, but the contacts at the factory in China I was working with was able to source it.  They didn't want to share details on where they were getting it though.  But through some research I believe it was http://www.bma-tech.com/

Still looking for a 4-core cable with similar specs to yours for submersible sensors, but my volume is probably only a couple of hundred metres per year.  So I'm interested in hearing what you may come up with.

[Koen]

Have you looked at IGUS (filtered as flexible, shielded and ordered by price) ?

[Kean]

I'm sure the IGUS cable quality is great (German quality), but that comes at a cost - a cost which may be appropriate in many cases.
That isn't really what the OP was looking for - they specifically asked about Chinese cable manufacturers.

[Koen]

Element14/Mouser/Digikey etc have it for between $4 and $10 per meter which is about 4 times what the BOM will allow.
I wouldn't mind paying a little more and dealing with a cable supplier, as long as we can understand each other!

So IGUS prices seem reasonable. Especially for 500m.

Anyway and more to the point then, when I order from Alibaba, I always contact a wide range of possible suppliers (30, sometimes more) and follow with three or four based on the first reply quality. It's a numbers game.

[mikeselectricstuff]

Many Aliexpress sellers are just resellers - look at their product range to get an idea.
Alibaba may be a better option.

[Kean]

I agree re Alibaba & AliExpress.  The big difficulty is finding someone who can communicate helpfully, and not just say yes to everything.  Or sell you 20AWG specified wire which is actually 24AWG.

Dealing with a reseller/trading company is not a bad thing if they handle things well.  Their margins are generally nothing like Western businesses.  Once you get samples or the first shipment you'll most likely be able to identify the true manufacturer and decide if you want to try dealing direct.  In general, a lot of Chinese businesses will not sell direct to overseas, and want you to work through a trading company.  I'm not sure if this is for commercial/legal reasons, the complexities of freight, or just their traditional way of business.

@Koen I will follow up re IGUS though - may be of interest to one of my clients who was looking for high quality cable.

[mikeselectricstuff]

A good tip when dealing with any supplier or subcontractor, never ask a question that can be answered "yes"

e.g. "What spec can you offer", not "can you supply this spec"

With Chinese suppliers, probably best to try to find someone offering pretty close to what you want, and not confuse them by asking about possible alternatives. Keep everything to simple, short sentences.

[DTJ]

.................But through some research I believe it was http://www.bma-tech.com/

Still looking for a 4-core cable with similar specs to yours for submersible sensors, but my volume is probably only a couple of hundred metres per year.  So I'm interested in hearing what you may come up with.

Thanks Kean, I'll post whatever I find back here. I might email bma-tech and see what they have.

A good tip when dealing with any supplier or subcontractor, never ask a question that can be answered "yes"

e.g. "What spec can you offer", not "can you supply this spec"

Thanks Mike, I've tried that after I read a few pages people have put up with tips on dealing with Chinese suppliers. I resorted to using a few pictures as well.

Have you looked at IGUS (filtered as flexible, shielded and ordered by price) ?

I hadn't looked at them, they look expensive. They have a distributor up the road from me so I'll see what they have. Thanks.



Lots of good ideas in there guys. Thanks for the replies, you've motivated me to go searching again.

[Koen]

Does the IGUS website not show prices for you ? CF891 4x0.5mm² is 1.1 EUR / m for 1m.

[moz]

A good tip when dealing with any supplier or subcontractor, never ask a question that can be answered "yes"

I would be more specific: Chinese are used to building to a price, so if you say "can you make X for $Y" the answer will almost always be 'yes'. What you get for $Y might not be X or even a passable imitation. Finding someone who can do what we're used to can be tricky ("how much would it cost for X") because they often assume you want the cheapest near-enough alternative.

Most of them seem to be garage-scale manufacturers. Which is why the ones bigger than that go to such pains to emphasise the scale of their factory.

With Chinese suppliers, probably best to try to find someone offering pretty close to what you want, and not confuse them by asking about possible alternatives. Keep everything to simple, short sentences.

I have had good luck several times asking for exactly what I want, and indicating what tests it needs to pass. But simple language is very important. Diagrams are better.

Some battery packs I sourced were great, the guy had an aluminium extrusion with end caps etc, and could put 2S, 3S, 4S or 5S packs in it with similar Wh but obviously AH varying inverse to V. I got the first 50 just as 3S "12V" packs to drive LED globes with built-in regulators and they were fine. When I found an AliExpress seller of waterproof switches that fit the enclosure I asked if he could fit them if I supplied and within a week he was selling packs on AliExpress with "waterproof" claims and those switches that he had sourced direct. Just the outcome I wanted

With a custom wiring harness I ended up sending a sample over, complete with glue-lined heat shrink tubing and so on. The best bit was that somehow they sourced a plastic moulding (a 15mm disk with three fig-8 cable exits and a momentary button) that did what the heat shrink did and was much more reliable. I did have issues with wire size on the first samples but we got through those.

We have just talked an Alibaba seller down from 150 to 50 minimum order. Now we have to see what the thing is like (they will not send samples at any price, but we have ~20 photos of them testing one in an alleyway that appear to be a response to our request for more details). I doubt they have faked the meter readings but we will have to wait and see. Fun and games.

[DTJ]

Does the IGUS website not show prices for you ? CF891 4x0.5mm² is 1.1 EUR / m for 1m.

Hi Koen, no it does not show me the price. It wants to push me to get a quote.
Initially it pushed me to the .com.au site. Swapping to the .com site I can find a CF891 3x0.5mm² but no direct pricing.

I've used that type of cable before and the quality is very high.
I have two issues,
Is it good for continuous water immersion (up to maybe 20m)? Oil is mentioned but not water.
Also the customer will be terminating the cables to their equipment so its desirable to have clearly colour coded wires (red/black or blue/yellow or white) etc.

Cheers.

[DTJ]

I have had good luck several times asking for exactly what I want, and indicating what tests it needs to pass. But simple language is very important. Diagrams are better.

Yep that's what I've resorted to using.

Your other comments are interesting. I'm going to keep following up on the Alibaba option as well. I'm sure what I want is available I just have to find it.

[tycz]

DTJ,
Your diagram has the wire size in American AWG units. It might be a better idea to use mm2 instead, which is how wire is usually specified in China.

Whenever I order electronic components (connectors, potentiometers, switches, etc) from Chinese factories. I've always had my broker do the communication and payment. It makes it so much easier. I generally haven't had any problems getting questions answered and samples supplied.

[DTJ]

DTJ,
Your diagram has the wire size in American AWG units. It might be a better idea to use mm2 instead, which is how wire is usually specified in China.

Good point Tycz. I've had mm^2 and AWG in the emails but I'll update the drawing to mm^2 too.

Whenever I order electronic components (connectors, potentiometers, switches, etc) from Chinese factories. I've always had my broker do the communication and payment. It makes it so much easier. I generally haven't had any problems getting questions answered and samples supplied.

I know a couple of people who have either Chinese background or business experience in China. I might have to see if they can help.

[ansonbao]

If you need large volume,you can try Alibaba,but as they said,you may receive so many emails and meet the communication problem.If you need low volume,you can try aliexpress. If you think it is still difficult,please PM to me and we will purchase for you.

[DTJ]

If you need large volume,you can try Alibaba,but as they said,you may receive so many emails and meet the communication problem.If you need low volume,you can try aliexpress. If you think it is still difficult,please PM to me and we will purchase for you.

Thanks for your kind offer Ansonbao.

I ended up buying some expensive cable from Element14. I am going to see how sales go before I try again to source it from China.
I'll have another look at Aliexpress. I gave up on Alibaba due to the communications problems.
If I get stuck I'll send you a PM. Thanks!

[ansonbao]

Thanks for your kind offer Ansonbao.

I ended up buying some expensive cable from Element14. I am going to see how sales go before I try again to source it from China.
I'll have another look at Aliexpress. I gave up on Alibaba due to the communications problems.
If I get stuck I'll send you a PM. Thanks!

No problem

[zeqing]

for small quantity, try to contact some PCB Assembly house for prorotyping and small batch, such as makerfabs that i have had good experence, although they are not the final cable producer, but they have stable vendors for cables, to meet the final customer turn key requests...so , believable.  the advantage is the communication would be good as they knows the electronic request well.  but the price maybe higher as their work on the transitting the info back and forth.

of course , for mass production contact the vendor on alibaba directly to save money...

[floobydust]

I would deal direct with a wire/cable distributor like Anixter as I also find electronic component distributors like Digikey and Mouser charge crazy prices for wire, extra markup there.

But I see an old price-fixing action so maybe your industry is off?

The quality of copper and plastics can be very low off-shore. I wouldn't do it, depending on your product warranty.

[DTJ]

Thanks for pointing me at  Anixter. They don't have suitable cable but they do sell other interesting stuff.

[SVFeingold]

If you need proper submersible cable, IGUS won't cut it. Far as I know there aren't too many underwater cable manufacturers. If by "submersible" you just meant "can get wet" that's a different story. If you get a nick in your igus cable that's submerged in 20m of water, you'll get water injected under pressure into whatever housing you're using.

Is this a custom cable? Tooling to make a custom molded connector will probably eat up your entire budget for that 500m.

[DTJ]

By 'submersible' I mean it can stay submerged for perhaps years on end.

As long as the sheath does not get damaged I'm happy to for-go gel or water block tape cable fillers.
 
I've found a communications cable with a reasonably thick PE sheath that I'm trying out. I'd love to find a PE sheath with the thin nylon overlay that's used on some telecoms cables but I can't find it in the cable style I need.


It's pretty cost sensitive and custom cable is out of the question.