Author Topic: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts  (Read 1281 times)

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Offline Macbeth

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I have to admit I am still an old fart of the Big Clive era and make my PCB's with all the ghastly chemicals, and tools, and spare FR4, (but not that PCB guillotine - so jealous).

My FeCl3 is like a Spaniards sherry bodega. It really needs to be disposed of in some kind of hazardous waste at some point. So I keep recycling it instead.

I know once I get a stack of PCB's from China I will be addicted like crack, but in the meantime I am amazed I can make double sided boards with household chemicals and yet all my clothes and work surfaces are stained in a sick brown and orange colour.  :-DD
« Last Edit: June 13, 2018, 11:53:45 am by Macbeth »
 
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Offline bitseeker

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2018, 02:23:26 pm »
That was a cool tour. JLC sure is doing a lot to build mindshare.
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Offline ar__systems

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2018, 08:58:23 pm »
Looks interesting, but I can't watch it. The guy annoys the hell out of me. :)
 
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Offline Macbeth

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2018, 05:06:39 am »
You just have to ignore the StrangeWarts and maybe ignore the ginger beard, but he's a nice guy. His content is not his face. :wtf:

I imagine with some youtube income and a Chinese wart remover he will become far more presentable. Have you noticed how many youtubers now have perfect white teeth?
 

Online Towger

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2018, 05:43:11 am »
Have you noticed how many youtubers now have perfect white teeth?

I think we can do without another 'Dave visits the Dentist' video. :-)

Dave, when is 'Dave visits the Optician' going to be released?
 

Offline ar__systems

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2018, 06:29:47 am »
You just have to ignore the StrangeWarts and maybe ignore the ginger beard, but he's a nice guy. His content is not his face. :wtf:

It's not the beard... It's his over the top excitement that gets me :)
 

Online chris_leyson

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2018, 06:58:40 am »
Nice video. I couldn't see how the films were aligned for top and bottom copper and solder mask. It was all done by hand and very fast. Edit: Spotted it now, fiducals on the corners.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2018, 07:00:54 am by chris_leyson »
 

Offline hayatepilot

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #7 on: June 17, 2018, 06:02:03 am »
Very cool video.
But I always wonder how they keep track of all the different board designs. I don't think JLC puts manufacturing marks on the pcbs.
Before the boards are routed out it's easy because a barcode or something can be on some unused space on the board. But how do they do it after routing?
 

Online blueskull

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2018, 06:27:24 am »
Nice video. I couldn't see how the films were aligned for top and bottom copper and solder mask. It was all done by hand and very fast. Edit: Spotted it now, fiducals on the corners.

Top and bottom films are carefully aligned and fixed on the exposure jig, and when a PCB is loaded in, it's sandwiched between 2 fixed films.

Per panel alignment is only required for multi layer boards, not for 2 layer boards.
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Offline gowithyourself

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2018, 10:15:14 pm »
But I always wonder how they keep track of all the different board designs. I don't think JLC puts manufacturing marks on the pcbs.

They do, or at least they have done so in the past. I think the serial number might only be on one of the boards though.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2018, 10:22:01 pm by gowithyourself »
 

Offline rx8pilot

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2018, 07:55:34 am »
I can safely rule out PCB fab as my next business.

This video was very hard to watch overall....but I really wanted to see behind the scenes. It is so hard to understand how the prices can be so low in such a complex process. It must take years to get it all dialed in and make it remotely profitable.
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Online blueskull

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2018, 08:15:00 am »
It is so hard to understand how the prices can be so low in such a complex process.

The machinery is cheap. You can easily buy Chinese equipment for 1/10~1/5 the price of western equivalent -- just without the bells and whistles.

Chinese equipment design philosophy is different from the very beginning -- to automate the repeated parts, and to manually do the parts that are not very repeated, but require high level of flexibility.

On the other hand, western automation, particularly Swiss and German tools, are designed to automate everything, which leads to much higher overnight cost and little reduction in labor cost. 80/20 rule applies again here.

The downside of the Chinese way is lack of repeatability, that's why most Chinese fabs only certify 4mil minimum and 6mil nominal process -- you won't see 2 mil ultrafine, laser drills or 2 mil dielectric and the likes.
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Offline TSL

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2018, 01:14:48 pm »
Gota say I'm impressed. I've had a few boards made and its nice to see the end-to-end on such a large scale.
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Offline Richard Crowley

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2018, 01:44:31 pm »
I was a bit surprised by the method of applying the mask and screen layers. Couldn't they simply apply using direct positive screen-print?  Instead they coat the boards solid and then use photolithogaphy to image and then etch to pattern the layers.   :-//
 

Online blueskull

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #14 on: June 20, 2018, 02:27:10 pm »
I was a bit surprised by the method of applying the mask and screen layers. Couldn't they simply apply using direct positive screen-print?  Instead they coat the boards solid and then use photolithogaphy to image and then etch to pattern the layers.   :-//

They have a post on their Chinese website. Basically, it's for quality.
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Offline gowithyourself

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #15 on: June 20, 2018, 09:58:54 pm »
It is presumably also for the same reason they are printing the silkscreen on the prototype designs i.e. it probably doesn't make sense to make and change the silk screen for each, or every tenth, panel.

Code: [Select]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljOoGyCso8s&t=1180
 

Offline coppice

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Re: Very interesting look into a Chinese PCB fab by StrangeParts
« Reply #16 on: June 20, 2018, 10:32:38 pm »
I was a bit surprised by the method of applying the mask and screen layers. Couldn't they simply apply using direct positive screen-print?  Instead they coat the boards solid and then use photolithogaphy to image and then etch to pattern the layers.   :-//
For volume production they silk screen print any low resolution layers, and use photolithography for the high resolution layers. For chunky boards, like a lot of power boards, people usually silk screen all the layers.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2018, 10:34:32 pm by coppice »
 


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