Author Topic: PIC32MZ available  (Read 18172 times)

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Offline Sal Ammoniac

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #25 on: September 30, 2014, 05:25:36 pm »
Interesting I was always under the impression that the Java IDE Netbeans is responsible for these issues.

I've used Netbeans and Eclipse-based IDEs and Netbeans is much faster than Eclipse in the examples I've used.

My development machines have 32-64GB of RAM, so speed of the disk or SSD doesn't matter too much once everything is in the cache. The first built of the day takes a little longer, but then everything runs very fast.

The biggest speed differences I see are the code download time and single-stepping times in the debugger. The ICD 3 I use with PIC32 just isn't as fast as J-TAG on the ARM Cortex-M4 parts that I use. Downloading 40K of code to a board is 3-4x slower on the ICD 3.
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Offline true

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #26 on: October 01, 2014, 02:45:48 am »
I am on the opposite end - I primarly develop on a Lenovo X120e for some reason with 8GB RAM, and Eclipse is far faster than Netbeans. MPLABX specifically is extremely slow, but Eclipse is managable. Why the slow machine? It's small and I don't have much room to carry anything bigger, and it doesn't take much of a machine to type... When I am home I can work / debug on a faster machine but I am not nearly as available to write code there. (And even when I am I often still use the subnotebook with an E-350 @1.6GHz in it...)

Code load times crawl on this machine with ICD 3; ARM loading is way faster.
 

Offline dannyf

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #27 on: October 01, 2014, 10:18:34 am »
Quote
Eclipse is far faster than Netbeans. MPLABX specifically is extremely slow,

My experience as well. I run a few instances of eclipse (hi-tide, coide, kds and ccs for example) and they are all fairly fast (on my computer). maplab x is a dog in comparison.
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Offline NiHaoMike

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #28 on: October 01, 2014, 03:38:12 pm »
What disappoints me the most is that the 64 pin version is not the same pinout as the 64 pin version of the PIC24. I was looking forward to swap the PIC24 on my Digilent Atlys board in order to give it USB 2 host.
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Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #29 on: October 01, 2014, 04:43:50 pm »
What disappoints me the most is that the 64 pin version is not the same pinout as the 64 pin version of the PIC24. I was looking forward to swap the PIC24 on my Digilent Atlys board in order to give it USB 2 host.
The PIC32MX is only barely compatible with PIC24, due to the much less flexible I/O remapping. You can often make a footprint that will take PIC24 or PIC32MX but you need to be very careful about which pins you use for which peripheral functions.
You're much more likely to get a PIC24 to fit an existing PIC32MX footprint than vice versa, which is unfortunate as you usually want to go up, not down in capability!
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Offline NiHaoMike

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #30 on: October 02, 2014, 12:06:19 am »
It was incompatible to the extent that some of the power pins were in different locations. Which means the only way to put in a PIC32 with USB 2 is to hack up the board, at which point I might as well just disable the existing PIC and wire in a small ARM SoC on an additional board attached to the underside.
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Offline tszaboo

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #31 on: March 07, 2016, 11:59:35 am »
So, a year later, the PIC32MZ EF is available. By the looks of it, they fixed most of the Errata. Do you think it is actually fixed, or they just didnt report all the issues so far? Because I would not dare to touch the old MZ in a hazmat suit?
 

Offline BloodyCactus

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #32 on: March 07, 2016, 01:05:52 pm »
Ill wait a year and see what shakes out of the EF tree ;) My MX projects will stay on MX.
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Online forrestc

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2016, 07:09:02 am »
So, a year later, the PIC32MZ EF is available. By the looks of it, they fixed most of the Errata. Do you think it is actually fixed, or they just didnt report all the issues so far? Because I would not dare to touch the old MZ in a hazmat suit?

The EF is much better (as in it behaves like you'd expect a microchip PIC to behave - i.e. a few, well documented, but not show-stopping bugs).   I haven't bumped into anything which hasn't worked right yet.   I'm pretty close to shipping a new product with the EF in it and don't have any microcontroller concerns at this point.   The EC, well that was an entirely different story.

 

Offline Howardlong

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #34 on: March 08, 2016, 08:44:38 am »
So, a year later, the PIC32MZ EF is available. By the looks of it, they fixed most of the Errata. Do you think it is actually fixed, or they just didnt report all the issues so far? Because I would not dare to touch the old MZ in a hazmat suit?

The EF is much better (as in it behaves like you'd expect a microchip PIC to behave - i.e. a few, well documented, but not show-stopping bugs).   I haven't bumped into anything which hasn't worked right yet.   I'm pretty close to shipping a new product with the EF in it and don't have any microcontroller concerns at this point.   The EC, well that was an entirely different story.

100% agreed. Assuming you are using Harmony how are you finding it nowadays?
 

Offline dannyf

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #35 on: March 08, 2016, 12:15:04 pm »
With atmel giving end of life notices on some avr32, I assume the pic32 isn't too far behind.
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Offline BloodyCactus

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #36 on: March 08, 2016, 02:56:53 pm »
With atmel giving end of life notices on some avr32, I assume the pic32 isn't too far behind.

I would not assume that at all. avr32 always felt DOA. pic32 is used lots. I cant see there being EOL on pic32 models.
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Offline andersm

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #37 on: March 08, 2016, 03:30:11 pm »
The PIC32MZ fills a gap beneath Atmel's SAMA5. If Microchip actually start exploiting the virtualization extensions in the PIC32MZ EF there's no current corresponding product on the ARM side. The Cortex-M8 and A35 were just recently announced, and the A53 is in a higher performance class.

Offline Sal Ammoniac

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #38 on: March 09, 2016, 12:40:28 am »
The Cortex-M8 and A35 were just recently announced, and the A53 is in a higher performance class.

Cortex-M8? When was this announced? Do you mean the R8?
« Last Edit: March 09, 2016, 12:42:34 am by Sal Ammoniac »
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Offline dannyf

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #39 on: March 09, 2016, 01:23:36 am »
Quote
Cortex-M8? When was this announced?

PIC32 is so good that it is better than some unknown chip to be announced in the future.

Beat that, :)
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Offline andyturk

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Offline dannyf

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #41 on: March 09, 2016, 11:49:53 am »
"ARMv8-M Architecture"

If you even had a rudimentary understanding of those chips, you might have realized that there is this tiny difference between arm artechitecture, like armv8-m, and arm core designation, like cortex m4 or the not-yet-exiatent cortex m8.
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Online forrestc

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #42 on: March 09, 2016, 11:52:43 am »
Assuming you are using Harmony how are you finding it nowadays?

Tolerable.  Still a few issues, but mostly I'm using it for the TCP/IP stack which I'm familiar with from it's 8 bit legacy.

Still not so sure about some of the implementation choices, such as for timers, and most importantly async serial.   I've pretty much written my own interrupt-driven drivers using PLIB for async since I have timing-critical protocols I work with (modbus RTU as an example, among others).
 

Online forrestc

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #43 on: March 09, 2016, 11:56:21 am »
With atmel giving end of life notices on some avr32, I assume the pic32 isn't too far behind.

Microchip doesn't EOL anything.   Well very much of anything.

The PIC32MZxxxxEF is drop-in compatible with the PIC32MXxxxxEC.  I would expect most designs which are in progress would just drop the EF in instead of the EC when timing is appropriate.   I do understand that there are some high volume EC applications out there.

From my FAE and others, I understand that those parts of the EC which work, work well.  It was just all of the errata issues which affected such a wide variety of peripherals that made the EC relatively useless for many applications.   

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Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #44 on: March 09, 2016, 12:05:19 pm »
With atmel giving end of life notices on some avr32, I assume the pic32 isn't too far behind.

Microchip doesn't EOL anything.   Well very much of anything.

Farnell still stock the PIC16C54 - Microchip are one of the few manufacturers that keep stuff in production long term. What they do tend to do is introduce newer (usually pin compatible) parts and increase prices on the older ones.
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Offline dannyf

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #45 on: March 09, 2016, 02:11:19 pm »
"Microchip doesn't EOL anything.   Well very much of anything."

Those are quite contradictory to each other.

Try to get a pic1650, 1654, 1656, 1663, 1664, 1670, etc. From Microchip would be quite difficult, I assume, :)
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Online westfw

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #46 on: March 09, 2016, 07:49:22 pm »
Quote
Try to get a pic1650, 1654, 1656, 1663, 1664, 1670
those were never Microchip products.  (General Instruments, perhaps?)
 

Online forrestc

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #47 on: March 10, 2016, 08:55:11 am »
"Microchip doesn't EOL anything.   Well very much of anything."

Those are quite contradictory to each other.

Try to get a pic1650, 1654, 1656, 1663, 1664, 1670, etc. From Microchip would be quite difficult, I assume, :)

Let's try to clarify.

Microchip tends to not 'EOL' any part that they're actually still selling - as opposed to other vendors who discontinue when they aren't selling 'enough'.  There are few exceptions, AFAIK usually related to acquisitions and fab capabilities.

Based on my understanding, if they can still make it in their current FAB, you can still order it.  You may have to buy a wafer full of the parts, or meet some other minimum order (i.e. if it uses a non-standard leadframe or similar).   

If you look at the EOL list at: 

http://www.microchip.com/mymicrochip/Reports.aspx?type=eol

You'll find they almost all fall under the category of:

1) Discontinuation of parts they acquired from someone else and can't make in-house and don't have volume to continue making them.
2) A discontinuation where there is a direct replacement which requires no design changes.  For instance, a SPI memory where they're discontinuing the 10Mhz part and only continuing to sell faster parts which are 100% drop in compatible.
3) Discontinuations necessitated by no longer being able to make a given type of part - for instance, some of the rfPIC's were discontinued because the outside fab which were making these for them quit being able to do the RF process that was needed.

I also didn't see a single 'normal' PIC microcontroller on the list as far as I could go back.  The only exception was a dsPIC that they said they were going to discontinue, then a couple months later said 'sorry, we changed our minds, and we're going to continue making it'.   (I don't count weird things like the dsPIC and the integrated PIC and MEMS accellerometer as 'normal'.  I'm talking a normal processor using normal processes).

Compare that with other vendors...


 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: PIC32MZ available
« Reply #48 on: March 10, 2016, 06:36:26 pm »
"Microchip doesn't EOL anything.   Well very much of anything."

Those are quite contradictory to each other.

Try to get a pic1650, 1654, 1656, 1663, 1664, 1670, etc. From Microchip would be quite difficult, I assume, :)

Let's try to clarify.

Microchip tends to not 'EOL' any part that they're actually still selling - as opposed to other vendors who discontinue when they aren't selling 'enough'.  There are few exceptions, AFAIK usually related to acquisitions and fab capabilities.

Based on my understanding, if they can still make it in their current FAB, you can still order it.  You may have to buy a wafer full of the parts, or meet some other minimum order (i.e. if it uses a non-standard leadframe or similar).   

If you look at the EOL list at: 

http://www.microchip.com/mymicrochip/Reports.aspx?type=eol

You'll find they almost all fall under the category of:

1) Discontinuation of parts they acquired from someone else and can't make in-house and don't have volume to continue making them.
2) A discontinuation where there is a direct replacement which requires no design changes.  For instance, a SPI memory where they're discontinuing the 10Mhz part and only continuing to sell faster parts which are 100% drop in compatible.
3) Discontinuations necessitated by no longer being able to make a given type of part - for instance, some of the rfPIC's were discontinued because the outside fab which were making these for them quit being able to do the RF process that was needed.

I also didn't see a single 'normal' PIC microcontroller on the list as far as I could go back.  The only exception was a dsPIC that they said they were going to discontinue, then a couple months later said 'sorry, we changed our minds, and we're going to continue making it'.   (I don't count weird things like the dsPIC and the integrated PIC and MEMS accellerometer as 'normal'.  I'm talking a normal processor using normal processes).

Compare that with other vendors...
and then scale based on the number of different parts Microchip make, many of which are pin-compatible and at least very nearly object code compatible.
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