New lug crimper not crimping properly?

[drummerdimitri]

So i bought a Rigid RE 60-MLR to crimp lugs to welding wire (high strand count) but for some reason when I choose the 50 mm2 die to crimp a 50 mm2 lug to a 50 mm2 wire, it fails to crimp properly and the wire slips out with no friction.

Could it be that I bought the wrong set of dies? I am not an electrician so please bare with me.

What am I doing wrong here? does the number of strands make any difference as building wire has a lot less strands?

[wraper]

Are you sure it's a true 50 mm² wire?

[drummerdimitri]

Are you sure it's a true 50 mm² wire?

It's a quality Italian welding wire so I think so yes

[T3sl4co1l]

I did this some months ago, the problem I had was the wire was too "poofy" and wouldn't fit inside a nominal gauge lug so had to use the next size up.

The crimp tool I used (a proper T&B something-or-other, the big bolt cutter looking one) is adjustable and applies more than enough force to get a proper swage here.

This was #00 I think.  Whatever that is in mm^2.

If that tool isn't adjustable, you might simply try the next size smaller die.  It should be color or number matched, and just work, but who knows..?

If you need an industrial grade "do it right" answer, ditch Rigid and follow the manufacturer's recommendations to the tee.

Tim

[drummerdimitri]

I did this some months ago, the problem I had was the wire was too "poofy" and wouldn't fit inside a nominal gauge lug so had to use the next size up.

The crimp tool I used (a proper T&B something-or-other, the big bolt cutter looking one) is adjustable and applies more than enough force to get a proper swage here.

This was #00 I think.  Whatever that is in mm^2.

If that tool isn't adjustable, you might simply try the next size smaller die.  It should be color or number matched, and just work, but who knows..?

If you need an industrial grade "do it right" answer, ditch Rigid and follow the manufacturer's recommendations to the tee.

Tim

I tried using the 35 mm2 die and the cable still wouldn't crimp! I'm starting to question if I bought the correct dies for my lugs?

[ConKbot]

There can be different styles of lugs, I've noticed that mains electrical wiring lugs (the kind for electricians) are pretty thin-wall compared to some connector lugs. I.e. An Anderson powerpole 0Awg lug gets over crimped by a pair of crimpers meant for 0Awg 'electrician lugs' (for lack of better description of them)

Perhaps you have the reverse going on?

https://cdn2.ridgid.com/resources/media?countrycode=US&key=3dcd851f-d401-499e-9ac5-fcb3575f2183&languagecode=en&type=document is a compatibility chart and it explains the die part numbers and at the end has the charts for the 4 different lug types. I.e. A RDK-60 CU50 would be for 'klauke' style lugs. RDD-60 CU50 would be for DIN style lugs. They also give some lug part numbers.

If your lug isn't a standard type. (I.e. Part of a connector) find the closest you can in terms of OD and wall thickness, and get the appropriate die for that.

[drummerdimitri]

There can be different styles of lugs, I've noticed that mains electrical wiring lugs (the kind for electricians) are pretty thin-wall compared to some connector lugs. I.e. An Anderson powerpole 0Awg lug gets over crimped by a pair of crimpers meant for 0Awg 'electrician lugs' (for lack of better description of them)

Perhaps you have the reverse going on?

https://cdn2.ridgid.com/resources/media?countrycode=US&key=3dcd851f-d401-499e-9ac5-fcb3575f2183&languagecode=en&type=document is a compatibility chart and it explains the die part numbers and at the end has the charts for the 4 different lug types. I.e. A RDK-60 CU50 would be for 'klauke' style lugs. RDD-60 CU50 would be for DIN style lugs. They also give some lug part numbers.

If your lug isn't a standard type. (I.e. Part of a connector) find the closest you can in terms of OD and wall thickness, and get the appropriate die for that.

Thanks for the clarification I needed that!

So my dies are for the Klauke style lugs.

Now how can I tell what type of lugs I have?

I tried crimping my 50 mm cable with a 50 mm lug with the 25 mm dies and it finally crimped properly

Question is how come it doesn't work with the 50 mm die I'm still confused...

[ConKbot]

With the "rdk" dies the 6d6 would be compatible http://katalog.klauke.com/en/1r5-tubular-cable-lugs-cu-standard-type/

So 10mm ID, 14mm OD. If your lug differs from this by more than a little bit, it won't work correctly.

For comparison, the DIN spec lugs,
http://katalog.klauke.com/en/101r5-compression-cable-lugs-acc-to-din-cu/ I.e. 106R8  is 10mm ID and 14.5mm OD. So 1/2mm different, and a different die is required.

However, having to go to the 25mm2 cross section die definitely seems like something is very wrong.

Fine stranded welding wire of the same copper cross section area is usually a bit bigger in OD compared to normal 7 or 19 strand wire. Especially of it is rope-wound. Like said above, it can puff up a bit when stripped and make it difficult to go into normal lugs.  Find all the datasheets you can, and take some measurements to sanity check that the wires and lugs are the right size for what they are supposed to be.

Even better would be if you could find a final "across the flats" measurement for what the lugs are supposed to be crimped with, and you can figure out real easy if your dies are correct. But sometimes that's hard to find.

[drummerdimitri]

Just measured the lugs I've been using and they are 10 mm ID but only 12.5 OD so that might be why they wont crimp properly.

[Siwastaja]

Crimping is either pure horror or an expensive, carefully managed time-consuming sourcing process:

You need to get the exact tool with exact specified dies, and the exact lugs/connectors, from the same exact manufacturer, to make sure they are compatible.

Anything else, and you are completely within your own experimentation.

Now, the problem is that even if you wanted to, and even if you had no budget limits, it can be hard as hell to actually find, let alone be able to buy the exactly right set of everything. Lugs are very often sold without any specification whatsoever regarding what kind of lugs they are, so they are useless for anything but hobby experimentation.

[drummerdimitri]

Crimping is either pure horror or an expensive, carefully managed time-consuming sourcing process:

You need to get the exact tool with exact specified dies, and the exact lugs/connectors, from the same exact manufacturer, to make sure they are compatible.

Anything else, and you are completely within your own experimentation.

Now, the problem is that even if you wanted to, and even if you had no budget limits, it can be hard as hell to actually find, let alone be able to buy the exactly right set of everything. Lugs are very often sold without any specification whatsoever regarding what kind of lugs they are, so they are useless for anything but hobby experimentation.

Thanks for the reassurance 

I went back to the showroom today and showed the salesman that my dies are not compatible with the lugs being sold on the market.

Will see what they will do. Only options I can see is to either replace my dies for other ones or give me a refund.