So old to learn? Serious problem

[001]

Hi!

I`m 58 years old electric technitian. I`m not an university grade engineer
I can professionaly kraft all kinds of electric distributions at my work and can fix any electronics in my house
I.e. I`m not a newbee with electricity: I can solder and I`m understand how to repair analog radio and TV-sets.

But new times come. I see teenagers what can`t fix simple electric troubles but can build some beautiful things from "modern electronic scrap" (actually ten years old routers, pc, etc). They buids some linux-based trakers from coffemachines and it is fantastic for me

Can I learn? I want to realise few my simple and funny projects. but how to begin?
All info in the internet is not complex/ But how schoolboys do it?

I see electronix not a circuit design now. I want to understand how to connect PC to any ADCs (for example how to buid PC-based voltmeter and write some simple logger for it)
How to convert COM to bluetooth etc. How to read information from COM port and convert it to LCD with microcontroller 

(Sorry for my english)

[aiq25]

I would recommend starting with Arduino. Buy some cheap boards from China (depending on the country your in I suppose). Arduino has tons of examples and community support.

The first microcontroller project is always blinking an LED. So try that then read an ADC, serial communication (its simple using an Arduino). That's all you need to read a voltage and display it on a PC.

YouTube is also very helpful!

I can make projects within hours using Arduino modules versus designing the hardware and writing software which can take days.

Plus I just want to say, I really appreciate the value more experienced people have. I'm an engineer but I have a lot from people who have analog experience. Digital circuitry can't replace everything analog.

[hexreader]

If you have plenty of money, I would highly recommend mikroElekctronika products:

EasyPIC7 bundle such as maybe https://shop.mikroe.com/mikrolab-pic

Then Bluetooth and serial click boards to add on.

At least that is what worked for me at current age 59.

I know of no cheap way to learn modern electronics in an easy way, but maybe the previous post gives other ideas

[001]

Thanx You for quick response!

It is not a problem to buy some of this "lego style" electronix kits
But "bricks" is a sort of "Black box". isnt`it? How to make compete project with bricks? How to trace my own PCB if I can`t see what brick is? I can`t understand this abstraction

[ogden]

It is not a problem to buy some of this "lego style" electronix kits
But "bricks" is a sort of "Black box". isnt`it?

MikroLAB/EasyPIC7 seems to be huge overkill for purpose, kind of frustating too. Arduino is de facto #1 choice for beginner. Do some research first - search "arduino projects" on internet - there are tons of information. Find some projects that are doing what you like, preferably with detailed description how it is done (there are many blogs around). Then for starters just copy some projects. After few you will see how to make changes or even create new designs.

Get something like this:
http://www.elegoo.com/product/elegoo-uno-project-super-starter-kit/

Or this (there are many alike, on amazon too):
http://www.elegoo.com/product/elegoo-uno-r3-project-complete-starter-kit/

10x lower cost and IMHO 10x value than mentioned kinda overpriced PICkit.

[NivagSwerdna]

I would define a problem... and then solve it.  IMHO it is always easier to learn when there is a reason to learn.

[Gyro]

It is not a problem to buy some of this "lego style" electronix kits
But "bricks" is a sort of "Black box". isnt`it? How to make compete project with bricks? How to trace my own PCB if I can`t see what brick is? I can`t understand this abstraction

An  Arduino really isn't a Black box in the way you're thinking. If you look at the board, it's only has an Atmel microcontroller IC, a Crystal, voltage regulator, a USB-Serial chip a couple of LEDs and a few Rs and Cs. You could easily make one (or the parts of it that you need) on your own PCB, with a through hole chip you could even do it on stripboard. It's just a convenient board for people prototyping, or Artists etc. who can't solder.

You can program an arduino through the USB interface, or take it off and directly connect though a serial port or through an ISP adaptor (also cheap on ebay). You can remove the Arduino bootloader s/w and put you own code if you want to - it's a convenience feature again, but nothing special to make it a Black box.

[rstofer]

The reason the kids are so smart is that a) they use Google and b) they keep poking at things until they work.

You can go a long way using just the Arduino UNO and Google.  There are literally thousands of projects (actually, 16,700,000 hits on Google to 'arduino projects').

You will need to become proficient at C programming and may need/want to dabble in C++.  I skip the C++ bit myself but I'm a lot older.  And it isn't necessary (or even useful, in my view) for embedded systems.  And that's what we're talking about - embedded systems.

Next step is the Raspberry Pi because we can do some low level stuff (UART, SPI, I2C) and push commands off to the Arduino.  But we have the power of a full-blown Linux system to take care of high level stuff like networking, GUI, file system, robot vision and so on.

Then we head toward ARM chips.  My favorite is the original mbed (I like the 'stamp' form factor) or any of a number of STM32F chips/boards.  Here we get back to talking directly to hardware (like with the Arduino) but with much more capable chips.  When you get to this point, buy "Mastering the STM32" and follow along.

https://leanpub.com/mastering-stm32

That ought to keep you busy for a while...

[rstofer]

One reason for using a standard Arduino board, like the UNO R3, is the availability of 'shields' to add functionality.  Motor drivers, networking, enhanced IO and so on.  It is odd to see the number of non-Arduino boards that come with Arduino headers.  It's become a standard interface.

One of the Arduino learning kits might not be a bad idea.  There are plenty of gadgets to play with.

Another advantage of the Arduino is that everything that can possibly be done with an Arduino has already been done and documented on the Internet.  Google is your friend!

In the end, the ATmega328 chip used on the Arduino boards is a fairly slow processor with limited resources.  The Arduino Mega2560 is a much larger chip but the UNO R3 is still the place to start.

[abraxa]

From my point of view, it's easiest to build on top of what you already know and are familiar with. Start there and go in the direction you want to go.

For anything digital, it's crucial to understand how logic circuits work. So, if you're an electrician, begin with building simple logic gates: AND, OR, NAND, NOR, XOR with just switches and bulbs. Then, build the same with buttons and LEDs. Learn how to calculate the resistor values you need for the LEDs to work. Then, build the same circuit using a 7400-series IC that has the logic gates inside that you built with switches. Read up how it's done inside (i.e. how transistors work). Then, build the same logic gates using transistors. Learn how flip-flops work and build/use them.

Build a simple counter with LEDs. Build a 7-segment countdown timer with only 7400 ICs. When you understand how basic logic circuits work (oscillators, counters, memory, multiplexers, decoders, etc.), you understood the parts that make up any microcontroller and logic IC in general. With that knowledge, you will have an easy time understanding the assembly language because it's easy to see what happens on a hardware level. The Arduino is usually programmed in C but you can also write programs for it in assembly.

Once you wrote a few simple programs in assembly (blink a LED connected to the Arduino, a 7-segment clock, whatever) then you can learn C. You'll see that it's more abstract than assembly but still lets you access the hardware directly. Again, write some programs on the Arduino in C. When you did this and you actually know what you're doing, you've reached a major milestone. Knowing C is very good because the concepts used are very common in other programming languages as well. At that point, you can learn other programming languages more easily.

My approach is bottom-up: starting with the basic elements and building bigger and bigger things out of them. Other people may suggest going the other way: top-down. That approach would be done by e.g. learning python and using a Raspberry Pi to blink an LED. Sure, you get quick results but you never really understand what you're actually doing. From what you write, it seems that this approach may frustrate you because you can't connect this new knowledge to anything you already know.

[001]

Thanx. I`m not engineer but not a total newbie too. I understand how trigger works and can fix TV etc. 
But using programmable components is so difficult to understand. I read now what the same pin of atmega may be configured to Input or output mode. It is fantastic!

[cdev]

I would put a vote in for the RaspberryPi 3, which is a real Linux computer which you can then use with its own GPIOs and SPI, i2c, etc. or with Arduino HW connected to them.

[ogden]

I would put a vote in for the RaspberryPi 3, which is a real Linux computer which you can then use with its own GPIOs and SPI, i2c, etc. or with Arduino HW connected to them.

I would vote against. RaspberryPi requires so much more (unnecessary for beginner) knowledge of computers and operation systems. RPi is clearly "advanced" tool for someone who needs more than Arduino can do. You start with basics (Arduino), then proceed further. Before you run - you learn how to walk.

[cdev]

Research over the past few decades has revealed that the brain is plastic and never stops growing. Old dogs can learn new tricks. It helps if we improve the permeability of cell membranes and the mitochondria.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26481404

[Mr. Scram]

Thanx You for quick response!

It is not a problem to buy some of this "lego style" electronix kits
But "bricks" is a sort of "Black box". isnt`it? How to make compete project with bricks? How to trace my own PCB if I can`t see what brick is? I can`t understand this abstraction

Arduino can be a black box, but it's up to you to unbox it. Find a datasheet, pick up a multimeter and see how the ISP header is connected to the chip. Now you can build your own circuit and program an AVR chip via ISP. After figuring out just a few basic things, you can build your own Arduino board. Another route would be to look at libraries and the stuff the Arduino IDE adds to your programs. You don't have to mess with them if you don't want to, but you can and will learn a lot.

Some people are happy with the black box Arduino presents, but it's easy to dive deeper and deeper without really having to suddenly dive into the deep end.

[Mr. Scram]

Thanx. I`m not engineer but not a total newbie too. I understand how trigger works and can fix TV etc. 
But using programmable components is so difficult to understand. I read now what the same pin of atmega may be configured to Input or output mode. It is fantastic!

Yes, if you're coming from the strictly analogue side of things, you'll need to learn a new way of "thinking". It's great fun to learn, though, and opens up a huge landscape of possibilities if you do.

[ogden]

I read now what the same pin of atmega may be configured to Input or output mode. It is fantastic!

I had the same feeling when I "discovered" microcontrollers. Thou it was after I got familiar with computers (mainframes at that time) and C programming language. To succeed in modern embedded electronics you need both - understanding of microcontrollers (fluently reading/understanding datasheets/manuals) and know C language. Apart from electronics as such. Definitely skip assembly if you even consider that. In case you ask about C++ - it's ok, but only when you see that C is too limited for you.

[001]

?? C++? C#? 

[A Hellene]

But "bricks" is a sort of "Black box". isnt`it? How to make compete project with bricks? How to trace my own PCB if I can`t see what brick is? I can`t understand this abstraction

I would recommend what exactly abraxa suggested, above: Begin with basics and go all the way up; the only way to master any subject matter! And, all you have to fear is fear itself...

For example, try to teach someone, starting with Infinitesimal Calculus and Functional Analysis, and look where it will lead to: Nowhere! Starting with them, however, with the natural numbers and the four basic arithmetic operations you can lead them wherever you wish to. So, for beginning from the basics, you wll have to deal with logic gates and boolean algebra; then, you will realise that these are the building blocks of even the most complex digital microcontrollers.

The best possible microcontroller unit to begin with is, in my opinion, the Atmel (now Microchip) AVR ATMega328P because there are countless open (public) projects based on it; it is one of the most powerfull 8-bit ones (see the AVR vs. PIC comparison or a sample of what this little chip can do ALONE!) and one of the easiest one to understand because its instruction-set is very easy to learn, quite comprehensive and its architecture helps in fast execution. Read extensively its data sheet, the AVR Instruction Set Manual and all the assosiated application notes. Then, try to talk to its hardware directly, by learning its assembly language with the aid of the (free but bloated) Atmel Studio and its simulator, because the assembly language is the more efficient way to comprehend what's exactly happening within the chip; then you can choose to move to C language (even though some timing intensive tasks might be needed to be written in assembly, too, even there, in C!). And the best way to learn is to read programs written by other developers. There also is the famous AVR Freaks community to be answering any kind of questions you might ask.

The next step would be the even more advanced and powerfull 8-bit AVR XMega family or the 32-bit world of microcontrollers, with the ARM Cortex-M family being my personal recommendation.


-George

[ogden]

?? C++? C#? 

Not C++ or for gods sake C#. Just plain C. Arduino is based on C. Start with easy to replicate projects and you will become used to C programming language. Sorry, you cannot build modern electronics w/o learning how to code it.

[edit] http://www.dummies.com/store/product/C-For-Dummies-2nd-Edition.productCd-0764570684.html

Obviously there's ton of more books... and google too.

[Mr. Scram]

?? C++? C#? 

Not C++ or for gods sake C#. Just plain C. Arduino is based on C. Start with easy to replicate projects and you will become used to C programming language. Sorry, you cannot build modern electronics w/o learning how to code it.

http://www.dummies.com/programming/c/beginning-c-programming-for-dummies-cheat-sheet/

Obviously there's ton of more books.

Besides, if you understand the basics of one language, you pretty much know the basics of all the languages. The exact syntax, or words used, may change, but the mechanism is the same in almost all of the higher languages. Just like in electronics, there are basic building blocks that get used everywhere. As soon as you understand the concept behind them, learning them in any language is fairly trivial.

[hermit]

Some great advice given above.  I read a study once that said memory loss as you age is probably a misnomer.  You care less about the details and more about the 'big picture'.  That may be where your problem lies.  If I want or need to learn something I generally can but getting into the details requires a strong desire of both need and want.

I like this page and I think it might help as a starting point.  It shows you how to breadboard the basic Aruduino chip and then program it.
https://www.arduino.cc/en/Main/Standalone

Instead of the breakout board I used something like this instead:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-USB-To-TTL-PL2303HX-Serial-Cable-Converter-Adapter-Module-For-arduino-US-/172748865422

The Arduino forum is pretty active and a good place to slog through some of the basics with other beginners.

[Gyro]

The Arduino forum is pretty active and a good place to slog through some of the basics with other beginners.

Any of us can sit in the beginners class in a new subject. The only difference is that some of us have more nose and ear hair and find the seats a bit tighter. 

[bson]

You're never too old to learn, that's just a myth!

[Mjolinor]

Some great advice given above.  I read a study once that said memory loss as you age is probably a misnomer.  You care less about the details and more about the 'big picture'.  That may be where your problem lies.  If I want or need to learn something I generally can but getting into the details requires a strong desire of both need and want.

Well as a fact I can tell you that 10 years ago at 54 years old I could hold 27 moves in a 9x9 sudoku in my head. I could hold a full 6x6 Sudoku without writing anything down for any 6x6. I can now only hold around 17 for a 9x9 and cannot hold all 6X6 though I can do most of them.

I don't give a rats ass what research says. I know my brain does not work as well as it did ten years ago. Above is just an example, there are other things I can't do particularly to do with visualisations like vector diagrams / phase shifts etc.