How do people pack delicate instruments properly?

[Cerebus]

There's a neat technique I've seen using two elastic membranes that works well for lighter items up to a few Kg. I haven't any old packaging that uses this technique to photograph so I'll just have to try and describe it.

I've seen that suspension system several times including for shipping a laptop back to the factory for warranty repair. It's pretty neat, but seems a bit unnerving. If the membrane failed, the device would be mostly free inside the box (much like Amazon's default packaging method).

I thought it unnerving on my first encounter with it. So much so that I had a good hard tug and tear at it all. I couldn't apply enough force to tear the film or dislodge it from its carrier. Eventually the cardboard box itself gave way. I'd be pretty confident that if the outside box was strong enough for the mass of the packed item the membrane would be stronger.

[helius]

Bubble wrap/film is a great packing product, but it seems that few know how to use it correctly. When used loose it's pretty shit and that leads to a lot of items breaking.
The correct way is to use multiple tightly taped layers, like an onion skin. The bubbles face inwards, and the wrap axis of each layer is different so all 6 faces receive equal protection. Some of the best packaging on items I've received was done this way. The one way that bubble wrap is kind of weak is in preventing punctures/intrusion into the package, so it's complemented by heavy "eggcrate" foam sheets around the edges of the box, and by floating an inner box inside the outer one. You can also use peanuts to fill in any extra space, or use them between multiple bubble-wrapped units. When used by themselves they have a lot of drawbacks.

[Cerebus]

It might be ethafoam https://www.efoam.co.uk/ethafoam-packaging-foam.php or conceivably https://www.efoam.co.uk/zotefoam-plastazote.php

A question is whether it is possible for an amateur to mould it around the corners or, if not, how to deal with them, e.g. cutting with a knife or gluing multiple layers together

Ethafoam and Plastazote are just trade names for particular brands of polyethylene closed cell foam.

I've used it for quite a few things over the years. It's tough as old boots, waterproof, and quite a good thermal insulator. If you buy it in 1 inch sheets it's easy to cut with a Stanley knife and can be laminated up with a hot melt glue gun but there are specialist water based adhesives if you want to do a deluxe job. I made a cold box out of some, custom fitted to my MG's rather awkward boot, for ferrying stuff home from the supermarket. With a stitched nylon fabric outer cover and a hardboard base plate it's as good as new about 100 shopping trips later. Bum sized offcuts make very comfy mats to sit on hard surfaces with and, according to the cat, a very comfy bed too.

[bitseeker]

I thought it unnerving on my first encounter with it. So much so that I had a good hard tug and tear at it all. I couldn't apply enough force to tear the film or dislodge it from its carrier. Eventually the cardboard box itself gave way. I'd be pretty confident that if the outside box was strong enough for the mass of the packed item the membrane would be stronger.

Yes, all the ones I've seen were quite robust. Just be sure you're getting a good one. Of course, the way the sheeting is attached to the cardboard matters too.

[bitseeker]

Bubble wrap/film is a great packing product, but it seems that few know how to use it correctly. When used loose it's pretty shit and that leads to a lot of items breaking.
The correct way is to use multiple tightly taped layers, like an onion skin. The bubbles face inwards, and the wrap axis of each layer is different so all 6 faces receive equal protection.

Thanks for summarizing this. It is indeed the right way to use the stuff. In addition, you have to be sure to tape the bubble wrap so that it stays snugly wrapped around its contents.

All the equipment I've received from bona fide used test gear vendors has always been wrapped like this or completely encased in the insta-foam stuff.

[Cubdriver]

I've seen that suspension system several times including for shipping a laptop back to the factory for warranty repair. It's pretty neat, but seems a bit unnerving. If the membrane failed, the device would be mostly free inside the box (much like Amazon's default packaging method).

What, are you suggesting that two deflated six inch square plastic pillows in a 4 cubic foot box is not adequate packaging for, ohhh, say a pristine Tektronix 465B?   

  Ain't that the truth!  Sadly, it seems many ebayers look to the likes of Amazon as a source for packaging inspiration.

-Pat

[bitseeker]

Ha! The best was when Amazon shipped potato chips (crisps) and crackers (biscuits) in the same package with a six-pack box of soy milk using their usual sad packing process.

[Cubdriver]

So they arrived pre-chewed.  They were doing you a favor.  Much more efficient and time saving when you don't need to chew them yourself.  It was accomplished during what otherwise would have been wasted time during transport...   




 

-Pat

[bitseeker]

It's a feature!

[tggzzz]

We've all seen bone-headed packaging, both over packaged and under packaged.

This thread is a really useful discussion of how to do it properly -and why.

Thanks for all such suggestions and observations.

[bitseeker]

Thanks for starting the thread, tggzzz. Good stuff.

[tggzzz]

Thanks for starting the thread, tggzzz. Good stuff.

My pleasure. I'm in debt to everybody that has contributed.

When the time comes, I may try to repay the debt by documenting what I do - and the consequences.

[bitseeker]

and the consequences.

It'll be the Mythbusters of Shipping & Handling.

[vk6zgo]

The ideal method is Aluminium or Wooden Roadcases specially tailored for the instruments.
Back in the day,we used to ship whole test setups for TV & Radio sites around the State with minimal problems.

Of course,idiot proof packing underestimates the ingenuity of idiots.
On two occasions,Polyskops had heavy internal parts come loose & break more fragile bits.

We discovered that the transport company was ignoring the warnings on the Roadcase:-

"This unit weighs more than 60kg--obtain assistance to lift!"

One person could lift the case,but when they put it down,they dropped it the last couple of inches.
This was enough to do the damage.

Then there was the US company that shipped us two Broadcast Transmitters fully assembled:-
One actually made it OK,in the other,the Modulation Transformer came loose & wreaked havoc inside.
Moral---If your equipment has very large heavy bits inside that can be readily removed,do so,& pack them separately!

[tggzzz]

The ideal method is Aluminium or Wooden Roadcases specially tailored for the instruments.
Back in the day,we used to ship whole test setups for TV & Radio sites around the State with minimal problems.
...
One person could lift the case,but when they put it down,they dropped it the last couple of inches.
This was enough to do the damage.

They sound less than ideal

More importantly, they are yet another illustration why the details are critical. Hence my request for detailed suggestions, and the pleasing number of detailed responses.

[vk6zgo]

The ideal method is Aluminium or Wooden Roadcases specially tailored for the instruments.
Back in the day,we used to ship whole test setups for TV & Radio sites around the State with minimal problems.
...
One person could lift the case,but when they put it down,they dropped it the last couple of inches.
This was enough to do the damage.

They sound less than ideal
More importantly, they are yet another illustration why the details are critical. Hence my request for detailed suggestions, and the pleasing number of detailed responses.

No impact damage was transferred through the case,but there were large,insufficiently secured,bits inside the instrument,which were dislodged by the "G" forces involved.

Polyskops are very big & occupied most of the real estate in the Roadcase,being surrounded by quite firm padding.
To make the padding deep enough to absorb a "jolt" of that nature, as was done with smaller instruments,would have yielded a Roadcase of quite unreasonable dimensions.

The thickness & firmness of the padding was based on what R & S would have us believe,which is that Polyskops could be transported "as is".
Prior to making the Roadcases,this was done from time to time,but it would seem that their internal construction wasn't quite up to rough handling.

None of the other test equipment was damaged over years of transportation in Roadcases.

[bitseeker]

No impact damage was transferred through the case,but there were large,insufficiently secured,bits inside the instrument,which were dislodged by the "G" forces involved.

Exactly. As with my variac example, equipment that wasn't designed for mobile use can suffer greatly from G forces alone.

[Cerebus]

No impact damage was transferred through the case,but there were large,insufficiently secured,bits inside the instrument,which were dislodged by the "G" forces involved.

Exactly. As with my variac example, equipment that wasn't designed for mobile use can suffer greatly from G forces alone.

Dave's violent and unreasonable assaults on various multimeters are quite instructive in this regard. Even quite light components - in this case surface mount inductors - can become the weak point if enough G force is involved.

Perhaps we could test various packing techniques by sending several identical instruments to Dave, packaged different ways and he could take the packages out on a road trip 'a la multimetre' only this time the rule would be "Don't turn it on, don't even open it - throw the bugger off an overpass!".

[tggzzz]

Let us learn from other people's experience and mistakes. There is a wealth of solid experience out there.

While it is fun to do experiments, there's nothing to be gained by confirming things that don't work. While we are unlikely to advance the art of packing, at least let's make new mistakes!

[Cerebus]

Let us learn from other people's experience and mistakes. There is a wealth of solid experience out there.

While it is fun to do experiments, there's nothing to be gained by confirming things that don't work. While we are unlikely to advance the art of packing, at least let's make new mistakes!

Err, that wasn't a serious suggestion, just as Dave's multimeter hurling isn't really serious product reliability testing.

[SeanB]

I have sent glass lamps via post, including heavy steel and copper ballasts, and packing in multiple layers of bubble wrap, taped up around the object, and with more filling up empty space in the box, worked the best to prevent damage. I have even posted hard drives, though I did use a plastic case with a foam inner liner to hold each drive, and made sure that the outer was well padded, so the drives arrived intact. Modern drives will not survive in transit, but the old ST 225 drives survived with no problems.

[Marco]

One thing I haven't seen mentioned is silica gel.

The boat anchor scope I ordered came with large corners he cut to size from foam to make it fit snug in the heavy duty cardboard box supported at the 4 corners and some extra foam inserts he cut to keep modules securely in place, then filled up the rest with foam peanuts and used what looked like an entire roll of packing tape to strengthen the box. Far more effort than I expected and got it mechanically sound from the US to me.

It took ages for it to dry out and function though ... so a plastic bag around the scope and a handful of gel packets would have been nice.

[tggzzz]

Any idea of the cause of the "dampness"?

[helius]

Silica gel is recommended for items that are especially susceptible to moisture, like camera lenses or film. I haven't seen it used for electronics, and I'm also curious how that moisture could have appeared: was the scope delivered by sea? Was it shipped across the Equator?
The most common cause of condensation is moving a parcel from a very warm to a very cold environment, or vice versa.

[bitseeker]

So much moisture does sound odd. Was it being shipped from a warm, high-humidity climate?

I've seen really large humidity control packs that can be rejuvenated in an oven. I'm not sure if they would've been enough for what sounds like really excessive moisture.