Cheap smoke absorber

[toli]

Hi Guys,

Lately I've been soldering more than usually, and its really about time I've got myself one of these smoke absorbers. I don't want to spend lots of money for a Hakko branded unit, the way I see it its just a fan with a  carbon filter, and I shouldn't have to pay more than 50$ delivered for such a thing.

Anyway, I've seen this one on eBay. Its 40$ delivered, and seems to be similar to the Hakko 493 physically, so getting replacement filters will probably be easy. Anyone has any experience with that unit? Is the fan very loud? Is it any good? Should I avoid it? Any better recommendation for a reasonable price?

BTW, I know I can just make one myself, but I don't really have the time right now, and it probably won't save me that much money anyway.

Thank you for your help

[StubbornGreek]

I know you just said you didn't want any DIY solution because it will take up time and be just as expensive but a 120mm pc case fan will only cost you a few dollars and it runs off of 12V.

[toli]

I'm aware of that, but I simply don't have the time to play with that right now. If 40$ gets me a reasonably good smoke absorber which also allows tilting and looks like a well made product (instead of something I've put together with very limited time and will looks like cr*p) I don't mind spending the extra $'s. I have lots of projects on my queue so that time is better spent there.

[notsob]

I don't see any details of it's physical size or power connection  - does it need an AC cable or what - all it has is wattage at 50 or 60Hz

[amyk]

It's a fan with a filter on it.

If you already have the pieces, it'll take much less time to make one than buy that one and wait for it to arrive.

[toli]

thank you all, but as I already mentioned, I won't build one of these. I was hopping someone will have some thoughts about the unit I linked to, or a different unit that is reasonably good and won't cost much.

notsob, the size of he filter and the package is listed, so I can guess the size of the unit itself
The filter is listed as 13x13x1 which is exactly the same as the Hakko A1001 (the filter used in the 493). So it would be safe to assume the size of the unit is similar to the Hakko 493 (which looks the same from pictures).

[Psi]

I've seen large sheets of black charcoal filters for AC units for quite cheap. ( like 600mm x 600mm x 10mm for $5 )
Maybe you could adapt one of those with a PC fan.

[Rick]

I know you just said you didn't want any DIY solution because it will take up time and be just as expensive but a 120mm pc case fan will only cost you a few dollars and it runs off of 12V.

I have never used one before so I don't know its construction. How would you place the carbon filter? Just behind the fan (adhering to it) or do you leave a space between the fan and the carbon filter?

[StubbornGreek]

I know you just said you didn't want any DIY solution because it will take up time and be just as expensive but a 120mm pc case fan will only cost you a few dollars and it runs off of 12V.

I have never used one before so I don't know its construction. How would you place the carbon filter? Just behind the fan (adhering to it) or do you leave a space between the fan and the carbon filter?

If you'd like to use a filter, you can place one on the 'outside' of the fan (the face closest to you). Most case fans have a little directional arrow on their frame to note which way the air is channeled (not that you couldn't tell by just running it), you'd want the filter on the backside of those arrows (i.e. the intake, not the exhaust).

[Rick]

If you'd like to use a filter, you can place one on the 'outside' of the fan (the face closest to you). Most case fans have a little directional arrow on their frame to note which way the air is channeled (not that you couldn't tell by just running it), you'd want the filter on the backside of those arrows (i.e. the intake, not the exhaust).

That's interesting... Thanks.
I would think the filter would be placed behind because if you put it before the fan, it would limit the air flow, the air suction capacity, wouldn't it?
When you hold it before your face and if it blows air towards you, then the side facing you is the exhaust side right? I have an 8 cm PC fan, I have just tested it. Otherwise there is no arrow whatsoever on it... 

[SeanB]

Best with a filter is to use one a little larger than the fan ( as it is a restriction) with a flange to adapt the dimensions of the filter to that of the fan and to space the filter at least the fan thickness away so that the air flow into the fan can be more laminar.  So with an 80mm fan a 120mm filter and a box to match them dimension wise, or a box with the fan on one wall and the filter on the other, box otherwise sealed.

[Yaksaredabomb]

Poor toli, haha.  We're absolutely determined to convince you to diy.

I can understand something prebuilt that you can throw in a box and not worry about it coming apart would be more appealing.  PC fans also don't tend to be all that powerful and there may not be enough suction to really pull the smoke over through the filter with one of them anyhow unless you have one specifically made for higher CFM vs to be quiet.

I don't know anything about the smoke absorber you linked to but want to say good luck anyhow.  Hopefully all the diy advice will be helpful for other people.

Jacob

[StubbornGreek]

Rick, yes, the side blowing air at you is the exhaust. The airflow is restricted (pretty much equally) no matter which side of the fan you use the filter on (personally, I don't bother with the filter as the fumes are blowing away from with with the fan.

SeanB mentions a very useful technique of allowing a small distance between the fan and the filter which restricts less cfm. Add a shroud to this arrangement and you're in business.

jneumann, some pc fans are more effective than others. Something other than cfm to consider is air pressure. 120mm x 38mm generally give better air pressure even though their cfm rating may be lower.

@toli, your question isn't being answered within the parameters you mentioned (no diy). If you have an extra $40 burning a hole in your pocket, I don't see why the ebay listing wouldn't suit your needs. It does look a bit like the Hakko but looks don't mean much.

[T4P]

Well, actually. These clones only cost 10 bucks
Higher static pressure is good in sucking air away from filters but they are more useful for trying to push air through a filter
That's what centrifugal fans are for but hey, they just use a Sunon 120mm x 38mm 220-240VAC fan and get the job done
I had in the past crafted my own, with a 30CFM 75x30 squirrel fan as the exhaust fan and a 80mm x 25mm 41CFM fan as the intake fan but it went well but eventually it did look like crap because it was done with cloth tape and some cardboard with a little bit of sliver spray paint but eventually it became useless from being clogged and thus i took out of the fans, pity i did actually bodge my own PWM fan controller into it
Still, good lesson.
I wouldn't bother with smoke absorbers anymore, just need a fan to blow it from one side - like dave says, but i eventually saw a FA-400 (clone, duh) for about 12 bucks

But these are china prices, not elsewhere

[Rick]

PC fans also don't tend to be all that powerful and there may not be enough suction to really pull the smoke over through the filter with one of them anyhow unless you have one specifically made for higher CFM vs to be quiet.

That's true I think, but I am planning to buy a 120, 140 or 200 mm one (the 80 mm one was just from an old PC for testing) and I shall inquire about the blowing force...

I shall give it a try when I am free, for fun.

Actually the cost of the fan+the filter+the box would be about  $40 or may be more...  + the time spent building it.

[SLJ]

I just use a 12V DC fan from an old PC power supply.  I put banana jacks on it and use a bench power supply to control the speed and airflow.  Old dead PCs aren't hard to find to pull the fans out of.

[Astroplio]

Hi guys!

Since a couple of people are interested in building their own fume extractor, I would like to show you my project and offer some tips:

As you can see, I used some scrap wood I had in the basement (screwed and nailed it in a rush, glue can work also but I didn't want to wait for it to harden ), a power PC fan 12cm (do not use a "silent" PC fan), a repurposed AC/DC supply, and the only thing I bought was the carbon filter 13cm x 13cm.

Pros this design: the filter can be removed for easy replacement/cleaning from dust and hair if needed
Cons: it needs more elevation; a pair of legs H-shaped would be nice about 2-2.5 inches high so you can work more comfortably with PCB's

I had no problem with airflow whatsoever but I should point out that my DC source is closer to 13VDC, so a bit higher than the rated 12VDC for these PC fans.
Also from my experience working with this DIY fume extractor I should point out that IMHO it is only sufficient for hobbyists working with small PCB's. If you plan to work with PCBs double the size of the fan, yeah you should probably get a better more powerful extractor, or you will need to move it around all the time so it will catch the fumes. But again... I haven't had the chance to test it under these conditions yet, seems logical anyway

George

[JuKu]

I have the fan linked in the first post; different brand, but the same unit. It runs on mains voltage, as guessed. It is loud enough that you'd turn it off when you don't need it, but tolerable. The hood around is good, the sucking range is surprisingly good, you don't need to have it right at the iron tip, some 20-30cm is sufficient. For any fan, having a base is important; you want the fan at arms reach, so when you grab your iron, you just turn the fan on, lift it by your work and tilt it as needed. Any more than that, and it is more a nuisance than help. I wouldn't bother with DIY, YMMV.

[David_AVD]

There's no shame in not being interested in a DIY solution.  Spending the $40 and getting on with life is perfectly valid.

I have a similar unit to the first one linked to and it works fine.  Picked it up for $25 off Gumtree (new in box).

[toli]

JuKu and David,

Thank you both for these replies. I'm glad to hear it a reasonable quality unit, I'll order one this weekend

[T4P]

I had no problem with airflow whatsoever but I should point out that my DC source is closer to 13VDC, so a bit higher than the rated 12VDC for these PC fans.

Not a issue for the fan, slightly better ones can run up to 14v forever or most of them are rated to 13.2V

[HooRide]

I was recently playing with the idea of making a fume extractor and while researching table top units I stumbled upon commercial grade units with tubes and a vacuum/filter unit which seems nice when you have limited work surface area.

They don't seem terribly hard to make and don't seem like they're worth $750+ USD http://www.practicaltool.com/catalog/images/wfe2eskit1.jpg

Here's a source for the tubing: http://www.mcmaster.com/#duct-hose (any of the bend-and-stay tubing)

[nanofrog]

I was recently playing with the idea of making a fume extractor and while researching table top units I stumbled upon commercial grade units with tubes and a vacuum/filter unit which seems nice when you have limited work surface area.

They don't seem terribly hard to make and don't seem like they're worth $750+ USD http://www.practicaltool.com/catalog/images/wfe2eskit1.jpg

Here's a source for the tubing: http://www.mcmaster.com/#duct-hose (any of the bend-and-stay tubing)

I've been thinking about the same thing, as I have an old Honeywell HEPA Air Purifier I could use to make it (if it's not too big, as it was the largest they made at the time). Stopped using it years ago due to the filter cost (over $100USD back in the '90's), but a recent check on Amazon for pricing shows they've come down quite a bit (~half the cost for the one I need).

Using the link you gave, I like the idea of using this as the hose, and they even have a round nozzle (funnel shape). http://www.mcmaster.com/#duct-hose/=jy6hsd

[reagle]

I've tried using these cheap units in the past and anything over a few solder joints is basically going right in your lungs. What I did find much more effective was a  Metcal tabletop units http://www.okinternational.com/product_fume_bvx/bvx_100
That's a bit more $$, but may give you an idea of what does work

[prenato]

I just use a 12V DC fan from an old PC power supply.  I put banana jacks on it and use a bench power supply to control the speed and airflow.  Old dead PCs aren't hard to find to pull the fans out of.

I've posted this before, but here's my "PC-supply-based" implementation:)

http://paulorenato.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=84:fume-extractor&catid=4:projects&Itemid=4

Paulo

[Rick]

I was recently playing with the idea of making a fume extractor and while researching table top units I stumbled upon commercial grade units with tubes and a vacuum/filter unit which seems nice when you have limited work surface area.

They don't seem terribly hard to make and don't seem like they're worth $750+ USD http://www.practicaltool.com/catalog/images/wfe2eskit1.jpg

Here's a source for the tubing: http://www.mcmaster.com/#duct-hose (any of the bend-and-stay tubing)

The problem is how to adapt a fan to a hose... Unless you get a special plastic part manufactured by a mould maker or something which should not be too expensive here, but I need to check.. and would it work ? The hardest part of it is finding a suitable box for the fan and a hose adaptor, you also need to make a power supply to be able to plug it to 220V.
I also doubt that the cheap Chinese version will not be very efficient.

[T4P]

Huh? You can get a hose onto a fan. Simple. No mould no nonsense
Power supply? Do you need that? Get a 220V fan!

On another note i have seen ducts meant for PCs, that's interesting now.

[Rick]

Ok for the 220 V fan. But I do not quite see how you adapt a duct to a fan... The fan is 14 X14 xm or something like that and the duct has may be a diameter of 5 cm. Unless you don't want a sealed connection and lose most of the air flow of the fan.

[LaurenceW]

Seems to me there is mixed talk of smoke absorption Vs smoke extraction, Vs smoke dispersion here.

I defy anyone of reasonable means to show how effective a smoke absorption filter really is, let alone when it is "full" and needs replacing. So I think we can knock that one on the head as an aim.

Smoke extraction is the most ideal, of course, whereby the fumes are moved outside of the work room, and so no longer an issue (to the worker, at least!). But this can involve a degree of bulky ducting, and ideally a permanent installation.

Smoke dispersion is what any fan blowing across the operators' desk is most easily going to achieve - same as a $40 made up "filter" would do, I proffer. Merely moving the smoke away from the operator and then relying on some degree of ventilation in the room will significantly reduce (through dilution) the concentration of any fumes that might otherwise by breathed in directly from a soldering iron, operating maybe 300mm from the operator's face.

Yes, a fancy box will look nice on the desk. But I cannot see it outperforming a PC fan and the crudest of air guides, if even necessary.

[Circuitous]

To cut the desk space needed, I made a built-in fume extractor using Loc-line segmented tubing, a little PVC, and a $10 bathroom exhaust fan.
The fan is mounted behind the countertop, and exhausts the fumes 6 feet away, blowing it behind another rack of equipment.  It's reasonably quiet, running at about 62db.  I plan to get a quieter(more expensive) fan.
The loc-line tubing is available directly from them, Amazon, and other sites.
http://www.loc-line.com/vacuum.php

The tubing is attached to a PVC elbow, 2.75 inch O.D. and is just friction fit into the connector installed in the counter top.

[SLJ]

About as cheap as you can get and it works for me.  $0



I just used the 12 Volt fan and half the case from an old PC power supply. The fan is already mounted and sits in the bench just fine.  Add banana leads cut from a pair of crappy test probes you don't like. I just plug it into one of my bench power supplies and adjust the speed.  At 12 VDC it blows too much air across the entire bench.  This one is perfect for my use at around 9-10 volts.  you can barely hear it.  Eventually I'll add a fan guard to the back side.  I see no need to spend money on an extractor/filter. If I was soldering all day on a production line maybe but for a hobby bench it would be a waste of money.

[NiHaoMike]

PC fans also don't tend to be all that powerful and there may not be enough suction to really pull the smoke over through the filter with one of them anyhow unless you have one specifically made for higher CFM vs to be quiet.

The fans out of most P4s are quite powerful. (Same goes for high end i7 fans, but you probably won't find one of those for cheap...) It's not uncommon nowadays to find a PC fan that spins faster than 3000 or 3600 RPM, giving them more power than a same sized fan based on a mains induction motor.

A cheap and effective solution is to set up your soldering equipment near a window and put a box fan blowing out the window, then open another window to let fresh air in.

[David_AVD]

Don't larger, slower moving blades cause much less noise while moving the same amount of air though?

[SLJ]

My PC fan above works best at about half speed (whatever that is).  It does not move as much air at lower RPMs but all I need to do is have enough movement to blow the smoke moving away from the work and my face.  If your in a small enclosed space you might want to try an evac system but as stated before they can be a pain to set up and the hose can be cumbersome.  I would think the filter systems would have to be cleaned frequently to keep them working properly.  Again, I'm not in a production environment so I'm not soldering eight hours a day. Keeping the resin smoke out of my face is all I'm looking for.

[T4P]

Don't larger, slower moving blades cause much less noise while moving the same amount of air though?

While having more static pressure at the same time, they can move more air AND create less noise.
Static pressure is totally awesome for placing the fan in FRONT of the filter, having more CFM but less static pressure is better for placing it behind the filter
But still, PC fans run so silently for the sake of people who complain about noise left and right, thus have poor static pressure but decent CFM
I think a server fan fits or being simply overkill a delta FFB1212EH (A 50W fan!)

[ryanblace]

This is ~$25 and it has a speed knob.

 http://www.thermaltakeusa.com/Product.aspx?C=1295&ID=1914#Tab0

[Rick]

The best solution I have seen so far is the "bathroom fan" (with or without  duct) or whatever it is called, it must be in another thread because I cannot find it. I shall try to see if such systems are available locally. In the meantime I got the cheap Chinese one mentionned in this thread

[David_AVD]

The best solution I have seen so far is the "bathroom fan" (with or without  duct)

One of my guys at work uses a 100mm ducted fan kit on his bench.  The inlet end of the flexible duct is suspended (with a bit of wire) from one of those positionable work lamps (pictured below).  This way he can position the inlet along the back edge of a PCB loading frame, or anywhere on his bench.

I think he has some sort of filter on the the outlet side which is on a shelf above (and to the back of) the bench.  The motor is mounted pretty much at the outlet end of the duct.

[TinkeringSteve]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/XYtronic-426DLX-Small-Personal-Desolder-Fume-Smoke-Exhaust-Vent-extrator-/350571843797?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item519fb5d0d5

(mine doesn't have that brand name... just enter "426DLX" into ebay, without the brand name, to search for better prices...)

I have that one, and it does its job, if you have it standing directly on the bench (not on e.g. a PSU on a croded tiny "bench" like mine ^^ ) and the PCB you're working on not much further than a hand's width or two away, at about the height where the coal filter starts (bottom), i.e. in some PCB holder with croco clamps or something.

I have tried stuff like just using an old PSU fan hung from a microphone stand, but that's not really working :-D
The way that device is designed makes sure the smoke gets drawn through the filter, and cleaned air exits on its top opening.

It's probably not the strongest device of tat sort, but also not the noisiest one!
I'm happy with it.

Btw, bought new, it comes with a few extra coal filters.

[saturation]

Nice, I will build this!  That's an Ikea lamp and I have fans lying around, a little zip ties and my unit should be up in 15min!  Thank you [ currently I just use a deskfan ].

I just use a 12V DC fan from an old PC power supply.  I put banana jacks on it and use a bench power supply to control the speed and airflow.  Old dead PCs aren't hard to find to pull the fans out of.

I've posted this before, but here's my "PC-supply-based" implementation:)

http://paulorenato.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=84:fume-extractor&catid=4:projects&Itemid=4

Paulo

[Rick]

Hi Guys,

Lately I've been soldering more than usually, and its really about time I've got myself one of these smoke absorbers. I don't want to spend lots of money for a Hakko branded unit, the way I see it its just a fan with a  carbon filter, and I shouldn't have to pay more than 50$ delivered for such a thing.

Anyway, I've seen this one on eBay. Its 40$ delivered, and seems to be similar to the Hakko 493 physically, so getting replacement filters will probably be easy. Anyone has any experience with that unit? Is the fan very loud? Is it any good? Should I avoid it? Any better recommendation for a reasonable price?

BTW, I know I can just make one myself, but I don't really have the time right now, and it probably won't save me that much money anyway.

Thank you for your help

Hi Toli,

I don't know if you bought the smoke absorber form that HK guy wfei-shop or whatever. I also bought it and he sent it to my address. But when I opened the box I realized he sent an Australian plug instead of the European one I had asked for 3 TIMES. I had a universal adaptor so I plugged it into the wall socket... It doesn't work. I attached another power cord directly to the terminals to make sure that it is not the plug adaptor doing that. Again it did not work. It is out of order. How do you call it? DOA (Death on Arrival?). Sending it back costs $28 for an item which costs $39.99. I suppose he had a broken item with an Australian plug and he sent that particular one because he knows it is faulty, despite my 3 reminders that I want a European type plug.
Now the worse of all: he turned the original packaging inside out and sent it directly in that packaging so that you have to tear it open to get it out of the box therefore you destroy the packaging, despite Hakko mentioning on the original packaging to ship it inside another outer box. On ebay his refund policy states (I repeat with all the grammatical errors): "for any exchange or refund, we need the product must be in its original condition, including the box".
Many other people said on ebay feedback, he sells faulty products.
What to do?

I am attaching the pics of the famous box taken by my phone.

I wonder if the power cord is faulty or the fan itself.

[T4P]

Australian plug ... i think you mean china plug. Where it is reversed!

[Rick]

Australian plug ... i think you mean china plug. Where it is reversed!

Right! It is like the one on your pic, a China one then...  The plug is not a problem. The device does not work...

[M. András]

cheap one from unreliable source what do you expect?

[Rick]

Not much but not that much!
His poor score on ebay says something.
Now I shall ask him to send the fan at least so that I can replace it myself. I wonder if there is any circuit inside or if it is directly connected to the mains.

[madires]

I don't know if you bought the smoke absorber form that HK guy wfei-shop or whatever. I also bought it and he sent it to my address. But when I opened the box I realized he sent an Australian plug instead of the European one I had asked for 3 TIMES. I had a universal adaptor so I plugged it into the wall socket... It doesn't work. I attached another power cord directly to the terminals to make sure that it is not the plug adaptor doing that. Again it did not work. It is out of order. How do you call it? DOA (Death on Arrival?). Sending it back costs $28 for an item which costs $39.99. I suppose he had a broken item with an Australian plug and he sent that particular one because he knows it is faulty, despite my 3 reminders that I want a European type plug.

Reichelt offers a similar smoke absorber for 25 Euros (2 replacement filters for 3 Euros). It's a ZhongDi ZD-153. Looks like those HK sellers starting to join the we-rip-you-off sellers over here. Few good bargains from garage sales, but tons of power sellers with insane prices, especially for vintage electronics.

[Rick]

I wish I had known them before... thanks. This one is more powerful: 23W. Mine is 15W only.

[ElectroElvis]

Same as author of topic I have encountered problems with lots of smoke from soldering, flux and solderwick usage. Since those purpose use smoke absorbers come with price tag of 30€+ I have decided to make one as my next little project. From Conrad I can get 3 aktive charcoal filters for 5.5€, I allready have 80mm fan. What I am going to do is take tobaco can which is perfet for 80mm fan, cut of bottom part and on one end install filter on other end fan with voltage regulation.

Hope that it helps a little bit. Only problem I see is that I should install filter right behind or infront of fan, since I dont know if smoke will be held inside tube because of the 20cm space between fan and filter.

[David_AVD]

I'm pretty sure all the commercial ones I've seen have the filter in front of the fan (inlet side).

[T4P]

If you have a high static pressure fan like a Delta FFB1212EHE, install it at the back but if it's low just install it upfront

[pigrew]

I just purchased a 493-clone smoke absorber. The parts looks nearly identical to the actual Hakko model, though I have a few issues with it:

• Strain relief is a zip-tie that isn't tightened enough.
• Sharp wood-screws used to hold the fan in place are placed with their threads touching wires.
• The neutral wire was switched, not the hot wire. (Not that it really matters since there is no exposed metal).
• Why did they use a three-prong power-plug? The ground-wire is floating. An unpolarized two-prong plug would be nicer, and they could have used two thicker wires instead of the three 0.5mm^2 wires they used (for the same price).
• The fan is Sumom. Why do they have to call it something so similar to a name brand? Upsetting. Does CE mean chinese-export? Somehow I can't believe that it's actually meets CE standard. Since it's sold in the USA, I'd expect it have the UR mark, too.
• There are no marking on the exterior of the unit to state its required voltage or current, or that it's UL certified.
• I doubt it's actually ESD-dissipative plastic, but I don't know how to verify that.
• The power cord is a little bit short, especially after redoing the strain relief.
• The labels on the unit's top are just stickers. I really don't understand why the put the on/off stickers on the unit, as it'd look more professional without them.

Do I regret buying it? Somewhat, it seems to be false advertising, and unsafe as sold. The major remaining issue is if the plastic is ESD-safe. But, for $22 after shipping, I can't complain too much.

I've redone the strain-relief and made the unit a bit safer, as shown in the attached photos. I'd suggest that others do the same.