Cleaning solder iron tip

[james_s]

Well like I said, I use a cheap kitchen sponge from the dollar store and it works fine. All I did was cut a hole in the middle to make an edge to wipe the tip against and a spot for the excess solder to fall.

[Ian.M]

You need a CELLULOSE sponge - when overheated they char but don't melt.   Plastic foam sponges are totally unsuitable - unless you keep them far far wetter than is safe for the soldering bit, some of the surface will melt slightly as you wipe the tip, leaving it contaminated with burnt plastic which will corrode the plating if left on the tip.

[james_s]

That's a good point. I don't know about elsewhere, but cellulose sponges are pretty much ubiquitous here. Other types are available, but the cheapest most readily available types are cellulose. They come in a wide range of colors and have a soft squishy feel when moist and get rock hard when they dry out.

[tooki]

Next friday I'll buy a proper sponge and maybe some container to rest it there and be able to use it without the need of being constantly holding the one I have in place because I have no proper place to have it secured!

Why even bother with a sponge, since you have the brass wool? It's superior to the sponge in every way, and causes less damage to the tip.

I have no idea what kind of tip the Ersa has. If the cold spot isn't affecting your soldering, then don't worry about it. If it is causing problem, then it doesn't work, anyway. Order a new one. And feel free to try w/e it takes.

The iron in the pic you posted looks like a cheapo iron that takes copper tips electroplated in a very thin iron layer. They do not last long no matter what you do to them.

It's an Ersa tip. They're extremely high quality, known for long tip life. Ersa describes them as "ERSADUR LF soldering tips have an increased layer of iron, which increases tip life." (No idea what about the pic makes it look cheap to you. It looks nothing like the el-cheapo irons. Or did you accidentally confuse the thumbnail of the youtube video showing how not to fix a gnarly iron? Cuz that's not the OP's iron…)

The OP told you what iron and tip it is: the Ersa 0102CDLF12.

[KL27x]

Or did you accidentally confuse the thumbnail of the youtube video showing how not to fix a gnarly iron? Cuz that's not the OP's iron…)

I purposely associated the pic/link the OP posted as the one he used to show that sanding a tip is necessarily a bad idea. 

I have no idea what kind of tip the Ersa has... The iron in the pic you posted looks like a cheapo iron that takes copper tips electroplated in a very thin iron layer.

Where does it sound like I'm confused about what iron the OP is using?

I am sure I could research the exact tip OP is using, but I'm not that interested in solving this earth-shattering mystery. And having no firsthand knowledge/experience with Ersa, I don't think that my googling

"ERSADUR LF soldering tips have an increased layer of iron, which increases tip life."

Would have been helpful, considering this is just a marketing quip with no quantification, nor even any attempt to define the thing to which this relative, un-quantified comparison is being made.

Since you have firsthand experience (presumably), your post has more weight to it.

I have no opinion or guess as to how thick the iron layer is in OP's specific Ersa tip, now what he should attempt to use to clean it. And the thickness of the iron layer is not a direct judgement on the quality/value/usefulness of the tip. JBC advertises a thin iron layer for the purpose of better thermal conduction. That's a selling point for their market.

[tooki]

I have no idea what kind of tip the Ersa has... The iron in the pic you posted looks like a cheapo iron that takes copper tips electroplated in a very thin iron layer.

Where does it sound like I'm confused about what iron the OP is using?

Well, when you say "I have no idea…", that kind of gives that impression!

"ERSADUR LF soldering tips have an increased layer of iron, which increases tip life."

Would have been helpful, considering this is just a marketing quip with no quantification, nor even any attempt to define the thing to which this relative, un-quantified comparison is being made.

Aye. The OP's iron is from a series that only uses lead-free tips, but on older models, some tips existed as normal or lead-free, so I assume it's a thicker iron layer vs. the standard type.

This PDF (the source of the quote, because it was from when they were just beginning the lead-free (LF) type tips) goes into it more: http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/40705.pdf

This PDF is their current catalog. Pages 38-39 say a few other things about the tips, but less actual specs about the plating. https://www.kurtzersa.com/fileadmin/medien/members_final/Electronics/9_Medien/9.5_Kataloge/9.5.1_Tools/Ersa_Werkzeugkatalog_eng_web.pdf

[KL27x]

When I say I have no idea what kind of tip the ERSA has, it pretty much implies I know what kind of iron he is using. How else would I know he's using an Ersa if I didn't read his posts? ... but I don't know enough about the tip it uses to recommend he go at it with sandpaper or not. 

 

but less actual specs about the plating.

JBC is the only company I know that had published the thickness of their tip iron layer. The only reason I have offered opinion on Hakko 900M/T18 tips is because of firsthand knowledge. And I also know that if they published a thickness, it would have a huge tolerance. It's not a plating just thick enough to follow the surface irregularities of the copper underneath. It starts out thick enough that it can be machined from the outside. A little sandpaper or stoning is not a big deal.***added: If you see any sanding marks on a T18 tip, they're from the post-machining on the iron layer, itself. Those aren't the marks on the copper underneath; you could sand those marks out, if you wanted to (on the IRON layer, only. NOT the chrome).*** On the really thin platings, you cannot sand like that; but you can judiciously buff/polish. "Cleaning" in any shape or form is removing material, whether you use an aggressive flux or a mechanical method. I imagine only the cheapo firebrands have plating thin enough to polish away, accidentally. But I'm hardly going to tell OP that it's definitely OK to do something which might make the tip worse.

[tooki]

When I say I have no idea what kind of tip the ERSA has, it pretty much implies I know what kind of iron he is using... but I don't know enough about the tip it uses to recommend he go at it with sandpaper or not. 

 

The OP provided the part number of the tip. Not hard to figure out what it is, google search, ya know? And you implied the OP was using a cheapo iron, which means you didn't know anything about the product, never mind that they're very high quality soldering stations. Hence why I assumed you'd confused the pix.

but less actual specs about the plating.

JBC is the only company I know that had published the thickness of their tip iron layer. The only reason I have offered opinion on Hakko 900M/T18 tips is because of firsthand knowledge. And I also know that if they published a thickness, it would have a huge tolerance. It's not a plating just thick enough to follow the surface irregularities of the copper underneath. It starts out thick enough that it can be machined from the outside. A little sandpaper or stoning is not a big deal. On the really thin platings, you cannot sand like that; but you can judiciously buff/polish. "Cleaning" in any shape or form is removing material, whether you use an aggressive flux or a mechanical method. I imagine only the cheapo firebrands have plating thin enough to polish away, accidentally. But I'm hardly going to tell OP that it's definitely OK to do something which might make the tip worse.

Well, you said all sorts of things based on the assumption that it was cheap junk, which it ain't… (No, these aren't gonna wear out quickly "no matter what you do to them". On the contrary, they have the reputation of very long life.)

[KL27x]

Well, you said all sorts of things based on the assumption that it was cheap junk, which it ain't

I would wager you're in a small minority to have inferred this from any post I've made in this or any other thread. 

[eKretz]

Well, you said all sorts of things based on the assumption that it was cheap junk, which it ain't

I would wager you're in a small minority to have inferred this from any post I've made in this or any other thread. 

Really?

The iron in the pic you posted looks like a cheapo iron that takes copper tips electroplated in a very thin iron layer. They do not last long no matter what you do to them.

Sooo....you weren't actually saying the iron looked like cheap junk? I use an Ersa iron that has had the same tip since I bought it. That "cheapo" thin plating has lasted almost 10 years now. Of frequent use also, not once a month. Shows no signs of wearing out yet. I should add that I don't do much lead-free soldering, which wears tips much more rapidly.

[eKretz]

I appreciate the tips but last thing I'll do is sand paper my iron tips. I've already seen videos saying not to sand paper iron tips because it's an huge mistake!

If the iron layer is oxidized and doesn't hold solder, those oxides have to be removed one way or another... IF you want that spot to wet, again. And mechanical removal is one of the best ways to do it.

There is a huge difference between different soldering iron tips. Some have only a very thin plating. Those should never be sanded with a rigid abrasive surface. But buffing with a soft material, like pencil eraser or cloth/leather with buffing compound might be ok if you keep away from chrome layer.

The iron layer on some irons is very thick and a new one could be filed quite a bit with a bastard file before you erode all the way through. The extra thickness is there so they last longer. Of course, you would want to remove as little good iron as possible. Sanding with fine grit paper might be perfectly fine. The paper goes up to 3k grit, ya know. But no matter how thick the iron layer, the chrome is typically very thin and can be damaged very easily. 

I have no idea what kind of tip the Ersa has. If the cold spot isn't affecting your soldering, then don't worry about it. If it is causing problem, then it doesn't work, anyway. Order a new one. And feel free to try w/e it takes.

The iron in the pic you posted looks like a cheapo iron that takes copper tips electroplated in a very thin iron layer. They do not last long no matter what you do to them.

** edit:
A lot of people like to cite the iron is just a plating over the copper. This is not necessarily true. One of the most popular soldering iron is Hakko 936/888. The iron shell is cast/molded. The copper is swaged into the shell with a bit of silver solder dust between. Then a second iron piece is pressed into the back. Then the tip is heated to ~1000C to melt the silver solder and fuse the 3 pieces together. The tip undergoes some machining of the outside of the tip for final dimension and smoothness/finish. The only part that is electroplated and super thin is the chrome layer, where solder doesn't stick. This is obvious if you ever cut one apart. And you can find Hakko patent info describing this process, albeit in more technical terminology and with a bit of vaguery.

I would like to see some reference on this. I find it very hard to believe that there would be any machining done on a soldering iron tip. There isn't room in the price. I would also find it very hard to believe that the iron layer on any tip is more than a very thin layer. Certainly not thick enough to be machined or even filed on without removing it. Aside from the fact that it would seriously hurt heat conductivity.

[KL27x]

Sooo....you weren't actually saying the iron looked like cheap junk?

I actually said the iron in the vid/thumnail that OP posted in his reply #14 looked like cheap junk. OP and I are both fully aware that this is not an Ersa and is not the iron that he uses, nor did OP seem to take any offense seeing as he thanked my post.

I would like to see some reference on this. I find it very hard to believe that there would be any machining done on a soldering iron tip.

My source is firsthand experience. So my post is "some reference on this."
The actual soldering iron tips on which I have observed (and sanded out) coarse machine marks on are T12 clone tips from China. My genuine Hakkos are finished fine enough I have not seen any obvious marks (but they are obviously machined, too). If you want to actually see these machine marks on the iron portion, see Ian's post about wiping off all the solder and being sure to re-tin it, and whatnot. He went into pretty good detail, and I don't want to repeat it. Once the solder is removed, I can see what I'm gonna call 60-80 grit linear sanding marks on the flats of both the T12 tips I actually use: 3mm BCF and the knife.

On the knife tips, which have a more complex shape, you can also clearly see these obvious linear sanding/grinding marks under the chrome in the flats in the intermediate section between the wettable tip and where the shaft becomes round, again. And on the BCF3, of which I have had 3 and some are worse than others, there are ridges in the shaft under the chrome which are obviously sanding/grinding marks put on there while the tip was spinning, at some point. One looks like a Campbell's soup can. For a variety of reasons I have already discussed and which should be obvious to anyone who has one of these tips, these marks were put in the iron layer before the chrome was plated on. They were not put in the copper... you are correct that machining copper would be needlessly expensive when it could be swaged in a press.

I would also find it very hard to believe that the iron layer on any tip is more than a very thin layer. Certainly not thick enough to be machined or even filed on without removing it. Aside from the fact that it would seriously hurt heat conductivity.

This is all highly automated. If you are curious how Hakko makes these tips, you might be interested to read my actual response to OP's post #14 rather than Tooki's misinterpretation.

I don't know whether this is good or bad to Ersa fanbois, but I would wager Ersa (and most other manufacturers') tips are made exactly the same way as Hakko tips. Hakko's patent should have expired in the 90's, and it's the obvious way to make a good soldering iron tip, if you know anything about soldering, machining, and manufacturing. Assuming you are using a common, good quality iron, the iron layer in your tip is probably a lot thicker than you think it is.

I'm not holding my breath, but a "say thanks" would be appreciated.

[eKretz]

*SMH* Dude. Your tips may have been sanded at some point. I guarantee it was NOT after plating. Sanding marks or any other mechanical defects will show right through plating, even if it's quite thick. And you are totally wrong about the thickness of the iron layer. Ersa tips are plated with a thickness of iron between 100 and 300 microns. That's .004" - .012" thick. That is considered quite thick for a soldering tip. Thickness depends on the tip type and geometry. It's purposely made thicker on certain tips with certain shapes as they are more prone to wear. Heat conductivity of iron is 500% worse than copper, which is why it's never used in a very thick layer. A file will remove more than .012" in one swipe. So can coarse sandpaper. Neophytes, do NOT do this to your modern plated tips. Even a pinhole in the iron layer if you use lead-free solder will lay waste to the tip very rapidly, as the copper will be dissolved by the free tin in the lead-free solder and leave you with a hollowed out tip that does not conduct heat worth a darn.

Regarding knowing anything about soldering, machining and manufacturing, I'd lay a wager that I have way more experience than you do. I worked as a machinist, toolmaker, millwright, welder, estimator and owner of a machine shop for about 2 decades. What's your experience level? What about your age? At this point, your "firsthand experience" is worth naught in terms of value as a reference. Show us some actual reference material that backs up what you say (you mentioned a patent that describes everything you said) and I will be very surprised and even apologize. Until then, I feel like you're just blowing smoke.

Here are some instead straight from Ersa regarding plating thickness. The regular tips are 100-300 microns, the tips specifically for lead-free can be "up to" 600 microns, or .024" thick iron plating. As Ian noted, if hit on a corner, even this can easily be removed with one swipe of a file or coarse sandpaper.

[eKretz]

Also, for those actually interested in the facts, here are some straight from Hakko:

https://www.hakkousa.com/lead-free/

See also:

https://www.google.com/amp/blog.okinternational.com/metcal/how-to-remove-oxidation-from-your-solder-tips%3Fhs_amp%3Dtrue?source=images

[Ian.M]

Sandpaper that isn't on a rigid backing and any sort of flexible sheet or pad abrasive will always take more off the edges.  Files and stones etc. are very difficult to keep perfectly flat to the surface so will tend to take more off one edge.   *NEVER* use any of them on a plated bit unless its already FUBARed because it has pitted and you just need to dress it back to reasonably flat bare copper to keep it going for a day or so while your replacement bit order comes in.

If a plated bit is suffering from severe dewetting failure (and you should never have let it get so bad to start with), beyond what a block of tip tinner cleaner can cope with, you may be able to save it by gently abrading the working surface with a fiberglass pencil while hot, and immediately using the tip tinner cleaner.  OTOH you are at risk of going through the plating while chasing that last spot that doesn't wet, so its best to settle for 90% wetting + order a spare anyway, as any pinhole will lead to failure within a few days.

[eKretz]

Another method that does not endanger the iron plating is simple mechanical scraping with a piece of steel like a flat screwdriver tip. Let the iron reach normal operating temperature and apply some solder (preferably flux-core) and gently scrape the tip with the screwdriver, in the process wiping the liquid solder around as well. The scraping will remove oxidation and then immediately wiping the liquid solder over the scraped area will re-wet the tip. This same method can be used to solder to metals considered very difficult to solder with electrical solder alloys (aluminum, steel, etc.).

[Zucca]

I had very bad experience with kitchen sponge. Even if soaked wet it was melting.... Imagine the iron tip. Never again.

[Ian.M]

Yes, as I explained back in reply #26, that's what happens if it isn't cellulose sponge.  For identification, if it doesn't say on the packet, once you've washed the plasticiser out, cellulose sponge gets rock hard (and shrinks a bit) when fully dried out.  Rubber and plastic sponges stay about the same softness regardless of whether they are dry or wet.

[KL27x]

*SMH* Dude. Your tips may have been sanded at some point. I guarantee it was NOT after plating. Sanding marks or any other mechanical defects will show right through plating, even if it's quite thick. And you are totally wrong about the thickness of the iron layer. Ersa tips are plated with a thickness of iron between 100 and 300 microns. That's .004" - .012" thick.

The Ersa iron layer is 4 to 12 mil thick.... so? Do you know how long it would take to remove 4 mils of hard iron by hand, with say 1K+ grit sandpaper? Heck, try it with aluminum foil, which is less than 1 mil thick and quite soft. Stick it to glass with spray adhesive, and sand til you're through, without ripping it. Now imagine how dumb you would have to be to do even that much sanding to an iron... at least IF your goal is to just remove surface oxides. FWIW, 3-10+ mils is what I would estimate the thickness of the iron in a hakko clone tip, last I cut one in half.. quite a bit of variation, actually. Do you have any idea of how thick 10 mils is? Bandsaw blades are as thin as 20 mils. 10 mils is the thickness of the mouth of a common brass bullet case, just as a for instance. This 10 mil is thick enough to be structural material all by itself, not plated on anything. (Sometimes this is plated with nickel, lol.) You can sand a case until your arm falls off. Shoot it, reload it, and do it again. You can use a reamer/turning tool if you want to appreciably thin it in this lifetime, rather than just shine it up.

Example more people here might be familiar with, pcb traces. 10 mil is amateur stuff. Turn that trace on its side. For that matter take an SSOP gullwing pin and turn that on its side. Hell, don't turn it on its side. Take a 1 oz copper pour board and sand the copper through. Tell us how easy that was. This is only 1.4 mils of pure, soft copper. Then try hand sanding through a soda can. That's 4 mils aluminum. If you don't have tendonitis yet, try 32 gauge sheet steel to get an idea of what you're really talking about.

Your tips may have been sanded at some point. I guarantee it was NOT after plating.

When using a surface grinder, you are taking tenths. With hand sanding you do that order or two of magnitude finer. For all the reasons I already posted, it is quite obvious the marks on my tips were made to the iron layer. I already answered this. Your tips might be different, of course.

If you don't know how to do things, then Ian is right. NEVER use sandpaper. That is the only advice a company could ever give to the lowest common denominator. I forget how much like magic it is to one person what is ordinary and easily understood to other people. If you want to learn things beyond consumer level marketing wank made for the reading comprehension of the lowest common denominator, well, nevermind. Most people are quite happy with that.

Wikipedia: "Hard chrome tends to be thicker than decorative chrome, with standard thicknesses in nonsalvage applications ranging from 0.02 to 0.04 mm (20 to 40 μm" This is a thin plating. The super thin platings that you will accidentally buff away with even fine compound on leather can be thinner than a hundredth of one mil.

[helius]

Removing iron is not the only reason to avoid sanding. More important is that sandpaper transfers grit particles onto the surface and those can contaminate the solder or cause poor heat transfer.

Soldering equipment companies actually sell and recommend "sanding" tools, so it certainly isn't the case that they think the tips cannot withstand abrasives:
https://www.hakkousa.com/products/accessories/tip-cleaners/hakko-ft-700-tip-polisher.html
https://www.hakkousa.com/products/accessories/tip-cleaners/hakko-ft-710-tip-cleaner.html

They use both brass and abrasive polymer polishing wheels. The use of a softer material than iron (brass) minimizes damage. Using steel screwdrivers for this is not a good idea.

[james_s]

It's important to remember that 1000 grit sandpaper is almost more like lapping compound. When most people hear "sandpaper" I suspect they think of something a lot more aggressive, like the sort of thing you'd use to sand varnish off a table.

I've never had to use something so aggressive myself though, for ~30 years I've been using a moist sponge.

[KL27x]

I have never had to either. I did it to my (brand new perfectly functional) clone tips because I was pretty sure I could. I wanted to satisfy my own curiosity and put my own understanding to the test. And Fwiw, it took 400 grit to get the deepest marks out in reasonable time. I have never yet had a Hakko tip fail for wetting. Chrome layer on a CF tip, OTOH, does wear thru where u drag it over pins.

Other people want to share their knowledge of how to read consumer level directions they found with Google and claim these as "the real facts,", that is fine with me. But I don't put words in their mouths. It would be nice if they extended the same courtesy, but reading comprehension is not universal.

[eKretz]

I have never had to either. I did it to my (brand new perfectly functional) clone tips because I was pretty sure I could. I wanted to satisfy my own curiosity and put my own understanding to the test. And Fwiw, it took 400 grit to get the deepest marks out in reasonable time. I have never yet had a Hakko tip fail for wetting. Chrome layer on a CF tip, OTOH, does wear thru where u drag it over pins.

Other people want to share their knowledge of how to read consumer level directions they found with Google and claim these as "the real facts,", that is fine with me. But I don't put words in their mouths. It would be nice if they extended the same courtesy, but reading comprehension is not universal.

"The real facts" are that you earlier posted that it would be fine to do "quite a bit" of filing with a bastard file on a new iron plated tip. Now you've changed your tune to using only very fine abrasives. I'm guessing you're a young kid who just doesn't know what he doesn't know yet. You'll learn.

[KL27x]

"The real facts" are that you earlier posted that it would be fine to do "quite a bit" of filing with a bastard file on a new iron plated tip. Now you've changed your tune to using only very fine abrasives.

I didn't change my tune. You never had any reading comprehension.

If the file were all you had, and your iron didn't work, you could clean a Hakko* tip many times with that bastard file before you ruined the tip. In fact, it could potentially live a full life and die of other causes... the chrome flaking off or wearing through. Or the insert in the back falling out. I continue to stand by this point.  What I actually said was:

The iron layer on some irons is very thick and a new one could be filed quite a bit with a bastard file before you erode all the way through. The extra thickness is there so they last longer. Of course, you would want to remove as little good iron as possible. Sanding with fine grit paper might be perfectly fine.

You say:

A file will remove more than .012" in one swipe.

Sure, if you want to kill the tip, you could file it like that with a nice sharp file. You could put the tip in a vice, put all your weight into it, and even dig in the corner of the file for good measure. With a good enough technique you could cut the tip right in half with one good stroke!!!  If that's what you think the OP would do to clean microscopic surface rust after reading the comment, above, then I thank you for pointing out my mistake of assuming at least few IQ points of the OP. If you can't do sub 1 mil work with a file, I just don't know... Heck, if I had a file that automatically took 12 mil on every stroke, I might not need an angle grinder. But I sure as hell would need a finer file.

I'm guessing you're a young kid who just doesn't know what he doesn't know yet. You'll learn.

We all don't know what we don't know.

But you're the guy that is refuting my statements based on marketing literature... of which you don't even have a grasp of the numbers you are arguing about. The fact you think it contradicts anything I said shows me what you don't know.  That is your great contribution to the thread, and for that we all owe you a big thanks! 

By all means continue to twist my words. The posts are there if anyone cares to read them in context. Go 'head and cherry pick. String 'em up however you like. What I shared here, I know because I have BTDT, and I stand by everything I posted, here.

*Ersa users, this has nothing to do with your iron of choice. I'm sure Ersa tips are exceptionally well made, and I bet they taste great, too. I hear they last ten years with heavy use. 

I find it very hard to believe that there would be any machining done on a soldering iron tip. There isn't room in the price. I would also find it very hard to believe that the iron layer on any tip is more than a very thin layer. Certainly not thick enough to be machined or even filed on without removing it.

If it would satisfy your curiosity, I could show you this is the case. Pics through a USB microscope of a new clone T12 tip showing the obvious and huge machine marks under the chrome and on the wettable area of the tip. Then another pic after filing the tip and through the chrome until the areas are covered in new files marks in a different direction. And a third pic after finish sanding totally smooth. And there will be no copper pinholes. Even you state the layer (on an Ersa tip) is 4-12 mils thick, and you, a professional machinist, find it hard to believe this could have been machined? First off, that would be what's left AFTER the machining. Second, to hell with the bastard file. I reckon I could resurface a 4 mil layer of iron with a die grinder and a carbide burr, completely freehand. Maybe more than once. This is why I call it the iron layer. Because 4-12 mils is really, really thick for something called a plating. Think about it. You read "plating" and make assumptions about what you can or can't do to it. You read 4-12 mil, and you have no grasp of that as a machinist? If anyone should want to backtrack, it is you, my friend. Just say the word, and I'll make you eat yours.

[eKretz]

Ok I'm done with this, kid. You're trying my patience. I'm tired of reading and responding to your disrespectful drivel. It is clear that you're a young pup and you have gone to great lengths to avoid admitting that and that your relevant experience level - though claimed to be extensive - is nil. I'm sure the other members who actually manage to read all of this will be able to easily make their own judgements on who is more trustworthy and who is backtracking like crazy. Again, DON'T use a file or coarse abrasive on plated soldering tips guys.

One last thing though. Posting information from actual manufacturers (wow, one can find that kind of thing with Google? Who knew!?) is called a REFERENCE. People who aren't trying desperately to act like they know it all post REFERENCES to prove their assertions.