FTDI driver kills fake FTDI FT232??

[KPR8]

But, to be clear, bricking third-party hardware is malicious.  This driver is malware by any reasonable definition of the term.

For what value of malicious? I'm really OK with FTDI bricking clone HW but I source my FTDI chips from sustainable sources (ie the genuine parts from the genuine mfr and that revenue goes to creating cool new chips for the next generation of angry butt hurt neckbeard makers)

I dont see how you can complain if your knock off hardware gets killed

Troll

User has been banned - no more reports please

[KPR8]

what facts do you dispute or question?

today, after reading this, I uninstalled  the ftdi update on my win7 box, but it was too late.  the driver was still mem-resident and when I plugged in a test dongle that I bought from amazon, it zeroed out the pid.  I confirmed it by plugging it into a linux box and looking at /var/log/syslog.  sure enough, the pid is all 0's and was NOT all 0's before (I had used that dongle on both win and linux just recently).

none of that is opinion.  not sure what else you need, but people are not making this up..

I'd like to see the driver reprogramming the chip to set all 0's and/or the chip read before AND after that reveals the internal contents. Just because a driver for some as yet unknown reason fails to read the PID from the chip correctly and hence is unable to set the value in the OS control blocks from something other than the initialised 0's, doesn't leave the only remaining possibility that the chip is bricked.

I have a few more ftdi 'fakes' that came from the same amazon vendor.

I guess, for those doubting thomas' out there, I could create a video of a 'clean' win7 box working with the fake chip, then doing a win update, plugging the dongle in again, viewing its properties dialog and showing the vendor/product id's.  even taking that dongle out, moving it to a linux box and capturing the /var/log/syslog.

but that's a lot of effort and honestly, I'm not sure anyone really doubts that this is what is really happening.

the moon landing, that was fake. but this chip bricking is real, mate.

(semi lol)

Name the vendor, complain to Amazon, get rid of the cloned crap (report me to a mod while you're at it!)

[Carrington]

New Hit: FTDI driver killed the FTDI clone.
Album: The age of silicon.
I'm sorry, but I couldn't resist. 

[nctnico]

That MY point. No-one is collecting actual evidence. It is easier to just take up massive amounts of threadspace with opinions and speculation.

The possible cause of the problem I saw was quite clear to me and the 6th reply points to a thread on another forum where people have discovered the productid gets programmed to 0. What else is there to proof after my previous post which shows the productid is suddenly 0 after the device has been connected to Windows machine which uses the latest FTDI drivers (V2.12).

[linux-works]

possible link to older firmware and some instructions on use:

http://www.reddit.com/r/arduino/comments/2iktoz/how_to_fix_arduino_knockoffs_serial_port_driver/

I will probably try this on my own win7 box (after doing a full backup, first, of course.  wish I had a full backup of my win7 system BEFORE I accepted the MS update, sigh)

[ve7xen]

I dont see how you can complain if your knock off hardware gets killed

Would you feel the same way if the chip didn't say FTDI on it, but implemented their interface? Because this is legitimate reverse engineering. It's the only reason we have a commodity PC market, and it's something that should be encouraged. FTDI is of course not required to support such efforts, nor are they expected to be happy about it. However it certainly doesn't give them the legal or moral right to intentionally break their competitor's implementation permanently.

Bottom line, this is trademark infringement, and trademark infringement alone. Well perhaps copyright infringement as well, as they might ship the driver, but since it comes with Windows I'm not so sure about that... Either way it certainly doesn't warrant a malicious approach. This is Sony Rootkit levels of unjustified, malicious overkill.

Also, maybe wait a few minutes between posts rather than responding directly to every. single. post. Do you have nothing better to do than hang around this thread?

[linux-works]

New Hit: FTDI driver killed the FTDI clone.
Album: The age of silicon.
I'm sorry, but I couldn't resist. 

(in chechen voice)

"joker-man was right.  we must fix real problem.  we must kill the ftdi chips!"

[linux-works]

That MY point. No-one is collecting actual evidence. It is easier to just take up massive amounts of threadspace with opinions and speculation.

the moon landing, that was fake. but this chip bricking is real, mate.

Not helping make your argument persuasive.

it seems your sense of humor has been uninstalled.  please do an update and return to the forum.

[krater]

New Hit: FTDI driver killed the FTDI clone.
Album: The age of silicon.
I'm sorry, but I couldn't resist. 

Fish for the masses !!!!!

<°)))))><  <°)))))><  <°)))))><  <°)))))>< <°)))))>< <°)))))>< <°)))))>< <°)))))>< <°)))))>< <°)))))>< <°)))))>< <°)))))>< <°)))))>< <°)))))><

[nctnico]

I dont see how you can complain if your knock off hardware gets killed

Would you feel the same way if the chip didn't say FTDI on it, but implemented their interface? Because this is legitimate reverse engineering. It's the only reason we have a commodity PC market, and it's something that should be encouraged. FTDI is of course not required to support such efforts, nor are they expected to be happy about it. However it certainly doesn't give them the legal or moral right to intentionally break their competitor's implementation permanently.

Bottom line, this is trademark infringement, and trademark infringement alone.

It is just trademark infringement because the counterfeiters stamp the FTDI logo on their chips. If they put IDFT on it or something else and called the part number FT232 then they would operate in a perfectly legal way. There is a completely different chip inside which just mimics an existing chip. Much like AMD does with Intel. What if Intel would release a software update which kills all AMD CPUs?

[mikeselectricstuff]

That MY point. No-one is collecting actual evidence. It is easier to just take up massive amounts of threadspace with opinions and speculation.

the moon landing, that was fake. but this chip bricking is real, mate.

Not helping make your argument persuasive.

it seems your sense of humor has been uninstalled.  please do an update and return to the forum.

After the update it turns out the sense of humour had been surgically removed. 

[krater]

Breaking News: FTDI removes humor of makers through bad update !!!

[KPR8]

I dont see how you can complain if your knock off hardware gets killed

Would you feel the same way if the chip didn't say FTDI on it, but implemented their interface? Because this is legitimate reverse engineering. It's the only reason we have a commodity PC market, and it's something that should be encouraged. FTDI is of course not required to support such efforts, nor are they expected to be happy about it. However it certainly doesn't give them the legal or moral right to intentionally break their competitor's implementation permanently.

Bottom line, this is trademark infringement, and trademark infringement alone. Well perhaps copyright infringement as well, as they might ship the driver, but since it comes with Windows I'm not so sure about that... Either way it certainly doesn't warrant a malicious approach. This is Sony Rootkit levels of unjustified, malicious overkill.

No, it's deliberate theft. The cloners are benefiting from the investment FTDI made without bearing any of the costs. Chips don't design themselves, drivers don't write themselves, drivers don't put themselves thru M$ approval, marketing doesn't do its self. Bottom line is FTDI invested huge amounts of money in the FT232 and Chinese fly-by-nights are benefiting from that without paying a penny.   

Also, maybe wait a few minutes between posts rather than responding directly to every. single. post. Do you have nothing better to do than hang around this thread?

Who are you? The thread Police?

I am honest enough to name myself the 'FTDI annoy neckbeard makers thread' troll and I have a reasoned argument (I hand out full on rudeness too). You are just another butt hurt wannabe maker who feels he deserves something for nothing

[(*steve*)]

And in the Chinglish instruction manual - step 3: click 'ignore' when whiny driver complains your product is a fake :S

Firstly, I have *real* FTDI chips.  I am unaffected by this unless I have some device that I've not used for a while that (unbeknownst to me) contains a fake ftdi chip. (I often turn it on rather than take it apart -- sorry).

Second, I am well aware of intellectual property issues.  We rely on them to protect our income and *yes* we have been the target of a Chinese attempt to "piggyback" on our success via piracy.

However, it's not our customers that we punished.  I would be completely alright if the driver displayed a message that I could not dismiss for 30 seconds.  It would make me well aware that I had a fake, make long term operation impossible, but it would not completely cripple me in the time it took to rectify the problem.

What did we do to affected customers?  We offered them a valid licensed product at the normal price.  I'm almost completely sure that none of them knew they had a knockoff.  What we didn't do is penalise them for a mistake that they probably shouldn't have made, but did.

[KPR8]

Breaking News: FTDI removes humor of makers through bad update !!!

Oooh, Krater, be careful, seems you are coming over to the dark side

User is banned - please no more reports

[gibbled]

FTDI

For Treacherous Driver Installation

 

[linux-works]

reminder: don't feed the trolls.

the forum has an 'ignore user' feature.  I suggest it be used here to good effect.

(oops, I accidentally ignored myself.  did I actually post, or did I just dream it?)

[zapta]

Oooh, Krater, be careful, seems you are coming over to the dark side

KPR8, no school today?

[linux-works]

FTDI

For Treacherous Driver Installation

 

Fear The Duff Installation

[mikeselectricstuff]

If nothing else this sets a very dangerous precedent.
Crap like DRM is bad enough, but if this sort of behaviour is allowed (e.g. by Microsoft including it in updates), and is considered "acceptable", what next?
Printer bricked after using knock-off cartridge?
Hard disk wiped if MS discovers your license number is a copy?
Phone bricked after using a fake battery?

I would really like someone to get a comment from Microsoft on this, in particular whether or not they knew about it.

My guess is MS could end up at least, if not more legally liable than FTDI, as they didn't give the user any warning that their update would damage hardware.
Why would MS risk legal action to help a 3rd-party "protect" their own interests...? My guess is they didn't know, in which case all colours of crap may be hitting the fans soon.

[KPR8]

Oooh, Krater, be careful, seems you are coming over to the dark side

KPR8, no school today?

Nothing more pressing than baiting freetards that's for sure

Bed time in Troll-land and I wont be back (if you like you can pretend you won the argument)

Try and understand these basic facts tho:

-FTDI have been very 'maker' friendly in the past, releasing DIP adapter versions of their early chips
-If you chose unbelievably cheap versions of their products you can't complain when they turn out to be fake. Buy all 5 f your FTDI chips from RS
-FTDI have a right to protect their IP (I suspect they screwed this up tbh and it will be reversed shortly)
-If you buy cheap copies the IP provider _will_ go out of business == no more cool chips in the future
-2-3 dozen butt hurt neckbeards whining on a forum makes fuck all difference to a multi million dollar company
-Your Tarduino project is NOT going to be a product despite what Hackaday tell you

[krater]

Breaking News: FTDI removes humor of makers through bad update !!!

Oooh, Krater, be careful, seems you are coming over to the dark side

No ! Never ! The Force is strong with my one !

[Lightages]

All the moderators must be asleep.

[HackedFridgeMagnet]

Pls wake up.

[krater]

Breaking News: FTDI removes humor of makers through bad update !!!

Oooh, Krater, be careful, seems you are coming over to the dark side

No ! Never ! The Force is strong with my one !

We have cake....

But I rather like pizza...