Lets see your Nixie Tube equipment

[bitseeker]

Yeah, I've seen that on some listings. Nothing like a thermonuclear detonation to inspire confidence in the item being sold.

[Cubdriver]

I've seen that one before.  He's on crack if he thinks he's getting $250 for a 5233L, especially with no photo.  I don't care if it DOES include the oval power cord.

-Pat

[bitseeker]

You can get quite a collection of vintage power cords going for that kind of margin, indeed.

[bd139]

Thought this belongs here as well as the TEA thread...



Heathkit IC-2108 in restoration.

[Cubdriver]

Mmmmm...  Panaplex. 

-Pat

[bitseeker]

Yes! Here's wishing you a good deal on a replacement for the left-most module, bean.

[TERRA Operative]

Here is my Nixie Tube equipment. An Heathkit IM-1202 Multimeter and two Frequency counter : Monsanto 100B & Philips PM 6607   

That Philips PM 6607 is a Takeda Riken (Advantest) Digipet-60.
I have one I restored that is exactly the same except for the brand name.
I wonder who rebadged who....

Here's a link to the Japanese manuals (with schematics) and restoration video.

https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=1RzIU3xREXrsWJas6RXYgoC3eI_5fkioY

https://youtu.be/amwk4wN4zY4

[Enigma-man]

Looking back, I see my last posting was December 31, 2016.  It is not due to anything or anyone on the site. What has prevented me is life in
general.  Without going into detail, let me say multiple deaths in the family, six within a year starting with my wife in Feb. 2016 and in late January, 2017
my brother-in-law.  Also my mother suffered a life changing stroke two weeks before my brother-in-law died.  My life was in turmoil and still is but not as bad as
it was.  My hobbies pretty much ended as there were more pressing matters to deal with which many of you have already experienced and for the younger folk, your turn
will come eventually.
Recently, my generous friend who has given me practically all my 'Nixie' test equipment, has decided to downsize and his vision of a rack full of Nixie gear has now
fallen to me. I have four pieces to show in the upcoming posts.  Three are fairly rare and one is not.
Let me start with the rarest of the bunch.  A Systron Donner Model 1032 frequency counter.  It was working until the power supply blew.
The unit is 100 per cent Germanium devices and has four Nuvistor tubes in the front end.  In its day, somewhere in 1963 according to date stamps on
the transistors, it was state of the art. Nuvistors were new on the scene and everyone was eager to incorporate them in their designs.
That was all great way back then.  Enter the year 2019, fifty-seven years after it left the factory... Try and repair it.  No service data and all hopes of it
returning to life are currently left to someone's years of knowledge... or lack thereof.
What is noteworthy is, my buddy was sending it to e-waste for recycling had I not shown up to have a look at something else he was giving away.
As soon as I saw the forward facing Nixie's it was mine. Condition wise it is nearly pristene considering its age.  It was once in a technical
institute, (Northen Alberta Institute of Terchnogogy... NAIT) it was spared.  I'm guessing Edmonton, ALberta.  I've never heard of the place and I
live in Canada a few provinces east.  Back to the Sys Don...  It needed a Hubbel twist lock power connector which my buddy had. 
He was also giving me two HP 5340's.  One with the usual blown part that would switch over at 250MHz, but big deal, I'm not doing anything at
the moment that needs 18GHz.  We search through a LOT of equipment but can't find them.  I spot something in a large plastic bag and ask what it
is. He don't know.  It turns out to be something he was going to give me two years ago...
It's a Dana Model 5330 5 1/2 digit Nixie readout voltmeter which will be seen next post. 
After that it is a Vidar Model 500  four digit Nixie voltmeter with frequency counter.
The last one is the HP 5340, no big deal as there are a lot of them around and I've been following the previous posts of the attempts to get one working.
Anyway, here are a couple of pictures of the Systron Donner.  Sorry about the quality of them.  The second one is a capture from a small video and the lighting
was not a priority, but it was working and will again.

[Enigma-man]

Hmmm... First pic didn't show up, so here we go again.

[Cubdriver]

E-man, I'm very sorry to hear of your misfortune - it has obviously been a rough couple of years.  My deepest condolences on your losses, and I sincerely hope that better days are ahead - it sounds like you're way overdue in that regard.

Here's hoping that you have time to resume your hobbies once again and that your serendipitous arrival to save that beautiful SD counter from the dump is a sign of things to come!

I have an SD of similar vintage waiting to be shipped home from CA, but the one I got looks like ten miles of bad road (or, perhaps more precisely, like it was dragged down ten miles of bad road behind a truck) compared to yours.  I look forward to seeing more photos and getting this thread reignited.

Welcome back!

-Pat

[Enigma-man]

Thanks for that, Pat. What model is yours, newer or older.  Maybe we can trade info and save each other time.  I know the Model 1035 uses IC's so some boards will be
different from the pictures I saw. 

Concerning the Sys Don 1032, Germanium devices are not easy to come by and what a cross reference shows as a substitute didn't work for me.
There is also the problem with the Tin plating on aluminum can devices that you most likely aware of concerning "tin whiskers" forming and shorting out devices.
My unit worked for a short time after I swapped the two Nuvistors in the A side with ones from the B side and fed in an external 1 MHz clock. The xtal in the oven was
no good and there was problems with the oscillator plug in as well.  It only worked when you pressed the reset button.  Obviously a reset problem.   On the reset and
display board was a 2N1671 UJT which was open. On the time base board there are five of them.  I took the 10Khz one out and put it on the other board.
No dice. It still didn't work.  About a half hour later the power supply died.  A 2N2138 date code 2-24 (62-24) was shorted. I have ZERO PNP Germanium power devices
so I subbed a silicon.  The supply came back but I had no +6 volts. The +30, -30 and -6 were okay.  I must have spent 20 hours on and off and to this day can't find anything
wrong.  A few days ago the -6 disappeared.  The 2 remaining power Germaniums are okay and so is the silicon one.  I swapped out the germanium drivers and still no dice.
It isnt't a cap problem since it was the first thing I suspected.  This makes no sense to me and refreshing what I learned decades ago about Germanium, they are leaky devices.
If it comes down to what I think will be inevitable, I will run an external +30 -30 +6 -6 volt switching supply.  The internal +250 won't be bypassed since it doesn't need
regulation.  100% restoration to original may not be possible and beyond my control.  As long as it works is the main thing.
Another tidbit... A 2N2646 UJT is not a substitute for the 2N1671 no matter what you read.  The circuit will have to be modified.
Also a 2N1305 is not a substitute for any low power PNP Germanium.  I found an old Radio Shack Transistor Cross Reference book dated 1986.
Every low power PNP Ge device was referenced to the only one thery sold and it was the, you guessed it, 2N1305.  I call BULLSHIT !!!!! and loudly...
I tried it on the time base board and it wasn't a suitable replacement.  The frequency is not high enough, there is too much or too little leakage.
Back in the 60's and 70's it would be no sweat to find the devices you would need to get the unit back up and running.  Today is a different story.
I will post a few pics of the boards next post.


 

[bitseeker]

Welcome back, Enigma-man! Sorry to hear about the tumultuous times you've gone through these past few years. So good to see you back.

That 1032 is cool. I have never seen one before. Thanks for rescuing it from recycling! It'd be great to have a thread dedicated to its restoration, which will also be a way to start building a repository of knowledge about it.

[Enigma-man]

A dedicated thread may be the way to go, but might not get to full restoration thus letting down thread followers.  I'll think about it.
In the mean time here are some board pics.  The time base needed repair as the 1Hz wasn't working.  I replaced the 100K trim pot
as it was quirky when adjusted. The 100Khz still isn't working and is a transistor issue. Two transistors were open and my subs don't work.
The cap on the far right is temporary. I wanted to see how the 1Hz section was affected and it's just a matter of readjusting the 100K trim pot.
No big deal. This board has a marked slot and won't work in any other slot. It is slightly different than the 250KHz and 25KHz boards due to using high speed
Germanium devices.  The 25K board also has different transistors.  The four 25K boards can be in any of their marked slots as they are all the same.
I`m pretty sure any Ge PNP would work as a flip-flop.  I'll try it when it's up and running again.  Only the high voltage transistors are the same on
all six counter/display boards.  If one of them dies, it's a silicon or nothing sub.
I think it is possible to get this unit functional, but 100% original maybe not.  My buddy is looking for some Germanium devices or a beyond hope of
restoration donor. Fingers crossed and hopefully I won't have any more "Whiskey Tango Foxtrot" (WTF) with the "F" bomb dropped so many times I could fill
several swear jars (big ones) to capacity...  
Here's the pics...

[Enigma-man]

Ooops. Forgot the time base board.

[bitseeker]

Hopefully, you'll go for the dedicated thread. It could help with sourcing donor parts, too.

Those boards are so beautifully done (and shiny!).

[vk6zgo]

Thanks for that, Pat. What model is yours, newer or older.  Maybe we can trade info and save each other time.  I know the Model 1035 uses IC's so some boards will be
different from the pictures I saw. 

Concerning the Sys Don 1032, Germanium devices are not easy to come by and what a cross reference shows as a substitute didn't work for me.
There is also the problem with the Tin plating on aluminum can devices that you most likely aware of concerning "tin whiskers" forming and shorting out devices.
My unit worked for a short time after I swapped the two Nuvistors in the A side with ones from the B side and fed in an external 1 MHz clock. The xtal in the oven was
no good and there was problems with the oscillator plug in as well.  It only worked when you pressed the reset button.  Obviously a reset problem.   On the reset and
display board was a 2N1671 UJT which was open. On the time base board there are five of them.  I took the 10Khz one out and put it on the other board.
No dice. It still didn't work.  About a half hour later the power supply died.  A 2N2138 date code 2-24 (62-24) was shorted. I have ZERO PNP Germanium power devices
so I subbed a silicon.  The supply came back but I had no +6 volts. The +30, -30 and -6 were okay.  I must have spent 20 hours on and off and to this day can't find anything
wrong.  A few days ago the -6 disappeared.  The 2 remaining power Germaniums are okay and so is the silicon one.  I swapped out the germanium drivers and still no dice.
It isnt't a cap problem since it was the first thing I suspected.  This makes no sense to me and refreshing what I learned decades ago about Germanium, they are leaky devices.
If it comes down to what I think will be inevitable, I will run an external +30 -30 +6 -6 volt switching supply.  The internal +250 won't be bypassed since it doesn't need
regulation.  100% restoration to original may not be possible and beyond my control.  As long as it works is the main thing.
Another tidbit... A 2N2646 UJT is not a substitute for the 2N1671 no matter what you read.  The circuit will have to be modified.
Also a 2N1305 is not a substitute for any low power PNP Germanium.  I found an old Radio Shack Transistor Cross Reference book dated 1986.
Every low power PNP Ge device was referenced to the only one thery sold and it was the, you guessed it, 2N1305.  I call BULLSHIT !!!!! and loudly...
I tried it on the time base board and it wasn't a suitable replacement.  The frequency is not high enough, there is too much or too little leakage.
Back in the 60's and 70's it would be no sweat to find the devices you would need to get the unit back up and running.  Today is a different story.
I will post a few pics of the boards next post.

Back when I worked at a TV Studio, we had some books with very extensive equivalents lists.
The ones with abridged specs were reasonably good, but those with just straight side by side listings of devices with their "equivalents" were pretty much a waste of paper.

The funny thing, is those books were around for years, even going into multiple editions of completely misleading crap!

If I couldn't find an equivalent using the books with specs, I looked at equipment which did the same job, with similar circuit layouts to see what devices they used.
Of course, this is easy enough to do in a place with a lot of service manuals, & when looking for silicon devices!

[Cubdriver]

E-man, I have no idea what model mine is - I've only been able to find a couple of crappy cell phone pictures taken in my hotel room, and the model number can't be seen.  I hope to find time to box it up and ship it back the next time I make it out to CA.  My recent visits have been too hectic to get packing materials together and box it up.

Here's one of the pics; it's upside-down in this photo.  It's unusual in my experience because it's a bottom loader - I'm used to cards plugging in from the top side of the instrument.  My suspicion is that it may be older than yours is, but could be wrong.



I will have to look at the memory cards for my DSLR - I can't believe I got a new toy that I wouldn't get to ship home right away and wouldn't have taken more than three pictures with the cell phone...

Edit to add a pic of the nixies beginning to awaken from their long slumber:


-Pat

[Enigma-man]

Any info on older Systron Donner equipment is virtually non existent.  I saw a reference to a Model 1035 a few weeks ago. Today my search shows zippo...

I think yours might be newer since it has seven readouts, mine has six and the cards are tiny compare to the 12.5 inch long ones in my 1032. Yours
may have IC's and if it does, it's definitely newer. Pull a card and check the date code on devices.  That will tell you.
Older or newer, regardless of model, not many are around.
Once you get it back home and clean it up, it will be a fine addition to your collection. Nice find, man.

Wait a second, this looks like it might be Australian... Upside down boards...
Just kidding. No offense meant to the fine people waaaaay down undah.

Edit:
The unit I came across was a 1037-5 not a 1035 and probably why it doesn't show up on a search. The 1037-5 is a 50MHz unit, still with 12.5 inch plug in boards, but uses IC's

 

[Enigma-man]

Here is the next piece of gear for show and tell.  As I mentioned yesterday, I was given a Dana 5330 5 1/2 digit voltmeter by my buddy. He never turned the unit on and it sat in his basement stored away for probably close to twenty years.  As I was carrying it in, tucked under my arm, I thought I heard something move around inside the unit.  I gave it a gentle shake and there was definitely something loose inside.  I figured some component fell out somewhere.  I was curious and removed the top cover which was held by a single Phillips screw.  At first I didn't see anything obvious, then noticed a vacuum tube box in the far left corner.  Whiskey Tango Foxtrot ?
What's a tube doing in here ?  Then I noticed another Westinghouse tube box on the right rear corner. ??
I picked up the box and nearly fell over.  Two brand new ZM1000 replacement Nixie tubes in never opened boxes !
Never have I come across spare components inside any unit other than fuses.  Whatever I had planned for the afternoon was "I'll get to it tomorrow"...
After further examination, I could not see any signs of repair.  Either it never was repaired, or if it was, the repair person was very honest and left the tubes.  They could easily
have been expropriated.  I found a power cord and plugged it in.  It powered up, but the display was jumping around. I set it to autorange and it settled down.
I was hoping it was a true multimeter, but it is just a voltmeter. That's okay, it's 5 1/2 digits.  The next question was, how accurate is it at the moment.  I hooked up
my AD688 precision +10.0000 and -10.0000 reference to it and it showed +9.9988 and -9.9852. Not too bad.  Back in February this year, my good buddy gave me a
Weston Standard Cell.  Up until the mid 90's the Weston Cells were the worldwide voltage standard.  They were replaced by the Josephson Junction.  You can read up on this stuff
on the net.  A new Weston Cell was 1.01830 volts.  The cell is only supposed to be guaranteed accurate for a number of years but I have read some are still good after many decades.
I don't know how old my cell is but I made the adjustment to 1.01830  as quickly as possible.  The cell needs recovery time and the longer you pass current through it the longer it
takes to recover. If it shorts, it may take 5 weeks to get back to 1.01830 volts. Since I don't use it regularly, the next time it's used it will be okay.
I know this isn't the best way to calibrate the unit, but it is accurate enough for my purposes. 
All in all, this was a good find. Cosmetically it is not great.  The display bezel took a hit somewhere along the line and has a large crack in it.  I will get some tinted plexi and
with a heat gun remove the Dana plate and reglue to the new one.  A flat black paint job and maybe one for the top cover and its fully restored.
I am glad that it didn't need repair.  It's old RTL technology. Repairable yes, but even the RTL devices are rare.
Here's a few pics.  The inside is just RTL chips and normal stuff and the input module won't show you anything so I didn't take any pictures.

Edit for another typo...
 

[GreyWoolfe]

Here is my contribution.  Fluke 8400A bought for $2 at a ham radio tail gate party.  Not sure what to do with it because of its size.  Voltage readings aren't bad, resistance is all over the park.  I haven't decided if I want to try to recap it yet because I really don't have a place for it.  Plus, the service manual is 5X the cost of the meter!!!  It is nixies though.

[Enigma-man]

Not bad for 2 bucks.  Recapping probably won't make the ohms problem go away. Sounds like a board problem .
A saw a thread where a member here named neo had or has a manual for the 8400A. He's in the US like you. Maybe contact him and see if he's
willing to help.

[Enigma-man]

The last one I have to show, for now, is this rare Vidar 500 Voltmeter with frequency option built in.  Late 60's or early 70's. Initially, I was going to use it as a donor for my Systron Donner 1032 as a source of
Germanium devices.  That was until my buddy shows up this last Thursday "with something for me".  Along with an HP 5340A  Frequency Counter and two diesel locomotive speedometers
with Beckman Panaplex displays, he pulls out what's in the second picture.  ARE YOU KIDDING ME ?  The service manual for one of the most obscure pieces of equipment.  It looked like it
never was opened.  I could not, in good conscience, not give the Vidar a chance to be functional. 
I had a go at it this weekend and even with the manual, it will be a challenge.  Some boards have that polyurethane or whatever coating on them and a probe can't be easily placed where you need to take measurements.   The unit has had several repairs.  The auto range board has two different relays, the two main boards have seen repair as was another board with a USAF 2N404 as a replacement dated 1967.  I poke around and the voltages were okay, but a 10 ohm resistor was discoloured from overheating so I just replaced. There was nothing coming out of the 60Hz time base section and two 2N2925's were open.  2N3904's made that section work again, but it still didn't indicate nothing but 0000
There is a reset pulse but no count pulse from either the voltmeter section or frequency counter even though all sections seem to be working.
This thing has both Germanium and Silicon devices.  Making board extenders isn't going to happen because the plug in scheme is like you see.
I will likely leave this for another time.  Anyway, here is what it looks like.

When this gets working, I'm calling it Darth Vidar...

[Cubdriver]

Here is my contribution.  Fluke 8400A bought for $2 at a ham radio tail gate party.  Not sure what to do with it because of its size.  Voltage readings aren't bad, resistance is all over the park.  I haven't decided if I want to try to recap it yet because I really don't have a place for it.  Plus, the service manual is 5X the cost of the meter!!!  It is nixies though.

Damn, man, you STOLE that for $2!  Buy the manual and MAKE space for it!

-Pat

[bitseeker]

The last one I have to show, for now, is this rare Vidar 500 Voltmeter with frequency option built in.  Late 60's or early 70's. Initially, I was going to use it as a donor for my Systron Donner 1032 as a source of
Germanium devices.  That was until my buddy shows up this last Thursday "with something for me".  Along with an HP 5340A  Frequency Counter and two diesel locomotive speedometers
with Beckman Panaplex displays, he pulls out what's in the second picture.  ARE YOU KIDDING ME ?  The service manual for one of the most obscure pieces of equipment.  It looked like it
never was opened.  I could not, in good conscience, not give the Vidar a chance to be functional. 
...

Wow, lots of interesting things, E-man. That Vidar has an unusual looking enclosure, too.

Looking forward to seeing the Panaplex train speedos, too.

[bitseeker]

Here is my contribution.  Fluke 8400A bought for $2 at a ham radio tail gate party.  Not sure what to do with it because of its size.  Voltage readings aren't bad, resistance is all over the park.  I haven't decided if I want to try to recap it yet because I really don't have a place for it.  Plus, the service manual is 5X the cost of the meter!!!  It is nixies though.

Damn, man, you STOLE that for $2!  Buy the manual and MAKE space for it!

No kidding! Holy smokes.

Well, Woolfie, if you really, really don't want it, neo probably does.