OT: New video camera for the blog

[Rasz]

I always thought it was because of the directory structure it set up. But It might be to avoid Windows setting file attributes the camera isn't able to deal with.

its deeper than that, its about the structure of a filesystem (fragmentation, order of fields, size limits)

There is some info in this video about problems with firmwares (subject is forensics and exfat, but Scott talks about it in a broad way)



edit: I actually remembered it wrong, deleting files in the camera can corrupts filesystem
good stuff is at 43 minutes, he even mentions Canon by name
http://youtu.be/J-R0T5B0lac?t=43m28s

[MJR]

I imagine that Canon do not redevelop the filesystem firmware from one model to the next. So I really would expect a popular brand like Canon if it has an obscure firmware bug to have had some user experiences in posts all over the internet. I can't find any other user reporting a similar problem.

From my experience with their still cams, it appears that they are loathe to redevelop their file system code/circuits even if there *ARE* lots of user complaints about it. I think the conversation may go like this:

Program Manager: We are getting lots of complaints about files getting lost because the buffer doesn't flush before powering off.

Lead Engineer: We took care of that in Rev 2.

Program Manager: There is a Rev 2 of the firmware???!!

Lead Engineer: No, Rev 2 of the User Manual.

[BeJay]

I shot some stuff, took the card to the PC to check I had some things right (just read the card), put it back in and then it didn't record all the material after that point.

Did you "safely remove your hardware" ? So many times Windblows is trying to delay write to the card (even on read if you have indexing on) or Antivirus is still sniffing it when you rip it out expecting it's only reading it....

[RyanAMT]

To boil this down you are looking for:

-High end consumer - lower end "prosumer"
-Records to SD cards
-No need for professional and high bit rate codecs
-No need for XLR inputs (some models come with them anyway)
-Compact in size

In case I missed it - Do you have a brand preference and or brands to avoid and a rough budget range?

[EEVblog]

To boil this down you are looking for:
-High end consumer - lower end "prosumer"
-Records to SD cards
-No need for professional and high bit rate codecs
-No need for XLR inputs (some models come with them anyway)
-Compact in size
In case I missed it - Do you have a brand preference and or brands to avoid and a rough budget range?

No, not really.
But it ain't that easy. Small things make a huge difference that can make or break a decision.
For instance the shitty toy consumer audio level bargraph on the Sony units instantly rules them out. I live by my proper dB level meter in the Canon.
Ability to mix internal and external audio my Canon is a big deal.
WiFi remote control and clip playback would be very nice.
The LCD screen must be big and high res. My canon is 920K pixels and I won't want anything less.
Battery life is important. The Panasonics for example suck at this, double the consumption of other brands.
I would like (and currently do not have) an easy way to play back video clips after I have shot them, without having to go into playback mode and back again. The Canon I have (and the new ones) suck at this, they can only play the last 4 seconds, without audio!
Dual SD cards and backup recording modes would be nice.
Assignable buttons for things like the auto exposure mode, and a control wheel to set value, if I have to go into a menu to do this then my productivity drops massively. Can't imagine living without that.
Must work with a suitable macro lens attachment. This might be impossible to know unless you actually test it.
Must be at least 30mm wide angle, preferably better.

And probably other things I can't think of at 1am in the morning...

[EEVblog]

From the Canon XA 20 manual:

Inserting or removing the memory card with the camcorder on may result in permanent data loss

 

[free_electron]

A hdr xv550 is barely two years old. Uses h264 compression and delivers excellent video.

What's the advantage of that? It's got built in flash, so does my current one.
I thought you were talking about hard drives?

It is a harddisk based camera. Xr550v. 240 gigabyte diskdrive.
There is a little brother with 120 and one with 80 as well.

You don't hear the drives , neither spin nor head movement.

.
Also, Micro SD != SD
I can't see how you can say SD cards are inherently unreliable based on this one example?

Three harddisk camera's, on boats, thrown i. The water , or i'm jumping off the boat with them. Bumping around in rinse buckets while the boat plows through waves. Zero problems in the 3 years i've had em.

One state of the art 'removable media' device (costs as much as my bought-used 520). One pothole , car has an air-ride. Glitches and falls out during recording. Then there is the memory type problem. They number the cards these days. Number 4 is such and such speed, number 10 is such and such speed. Camera maker requires a specific number to guarantee throughput. Well i had to try 3 cards before one would work . Card makers lie. Oh it fits 10 in reading only, in writing it's more like a 6... Well the camera is writing ...

I prefer factory installed memory. It will be right.

But it's not as flexible. I know. My current HF G10 has 32GB of inbuilt flash memory but I hardly ever use it, why? Because it's not as convenient or as flexible as removable SD cards.

I would try using the built in flash. Instead of taking out card, inserting i. Card reader, copying , taking out card of reader putting it back in camera. You plug in cable, copy, unplug.
I know if you want to take the card home it is more conve ient.

Anyway. Just my thoughts and experiences. Ymmv ...

[RyanAMT]

I'm taking a look at a number of cameras from various manufacturers and one question that I don't think has been addressed yet is weight.  Is there a max weight?  For instance there are a few that with a battery weigh in around ~1.7kg.

[EEVblog]

I'm taking a look at a number of cameras from various manufacturers and one question that I don't think has been addressed yet is weight.

I don't care about weight, it's already hard enough to find any camera that does most of the stuff I want.

[EEVblog]

Well, looking for a new camera is as disappointing as it's always been. Every camera has some form of showstopper that prevent me from jumping on it.
It seems that the Canon HF G30 / XA20 is the best bet at present. But to jump on a 16month old camera that still has some really annoying limitations, albeit no worse than what I have, is not appealing.
At present I'm using the HF G10 with its internal memory. I get by... 

[IanJ]

G10 / G30 comparison vid.



Interestingly the batteries are not interchangeable [7:09].

Ian.

[RyanAMT]

One reason to consider sticking with Canon is if you plan to use the new camera and at the same time capturing additional B-Roll with the older Canon as their images will be similar in look, tone, and coloring.  The only other brand that comes close to the "Canon Look" is JVC - but their current offerings aren't impressive.

If you are fine with another brand then I suggest the Panasonic AG-AC90AEN (50Hz version).  It seems to have most of what you are looking for - simultaneous recording to both SD slots, a high res LCD  at 1,152 k dot,  audio input mixing, a decently wide lens at 2.84mm which on this camera is equal to a 35mm format equivalent of 29.8mm and the ability to use macro adapters.  You may be able to use your current macro lenses by using step-up/down rings but that will require some experimentation.  The only drawback is the power consumption is quite high at 12.9W, however they include a 5,400mAh battery that is stated to give up to 6 hours of recording time.  Realistically with lots of zooming and using the best recording quality you are looking at around 5 hours.  From experience with Panasonic's professional cameras their battery life is actually decent.  I know it's not a big deal for you but it also has XLR inputs and a removable shotgun mic holder.  Personally, I really like the look of Panasonic's images.

As far as life-cycle goes for camera models it varies between a year and two years.  Most professional cameras will run for 2 years before they announce the next version.  The camera I mentioned above was just released so I wouldn't expect a new model for 2 years.  As for the Canon's that are 16 months old you would have to wait for the industry trade shows that take place in February through April before any new cameras will be announced and then several months beyond that before they start shipping.  So realistically you could be waiting another year.

It is frustrating researching cameras and pro AV gear.  We go through it every May when we are told within a few days that we need to spend the remaining budget.

[cloudscapes]

Shot in the dark - did you get the SD card on ebay?

I've had really bad luck with ebay cards. And so has a local smallish computer store a couple months ago. They bought cheap SD cards and resold them locally, not knowing they were fakes. The problems I had were the card seeming to function, files being copied. But closer inspection revealed it only created folders and a few files on the card. It was a 2GB card tricked into thinking it was 32GB.

[nixfu]

- 3.5" screen instead of 3" screen, with increased resolution (super important for a technical blogger looking at boards etc through the lens)

 Dave, have you thought about adding a larger external monitor screen?

You could watch yourself from a distance and see much more detail when doing those close-ups. 

Examples:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/On-Camera-Monitors/ci/1984/N/4028759510

[Eliminateur]

Scratch the Sony HDR-CX900
http://youtu.be/vG8bI7BJ0ko?t=1m59s

That audio level meter is a consumer level joke. I need a proper professional dB level meter like my Canon has.
The canon can also mix internal and external audio which has proven invaluable.
Slow autofocus too it seems.
Add in the proprietary shoe mount and multi-USB connector and it's not very appealing.

urgh, i had no idea about hte sound level meter
propietary stuff.. yeah, it's sony, you either get used to  it or go to another brand.

quite the issue with not finding the right combination of features

[EEVblog]

Dave, have you thought about adding a larger external monitor screen?

Yes, I'm going to get one of those for the new bench camera position and teardown tuesday (camera about 4m away).

[EEVblog]

So, here is a big question, should I move to 30fps/60fps (NTSC) shooting, or stay with the aussie PAL 25fps/50fps shooting?
All my material up until this point has all been shot in 25fps.

The youtube standard seems to be 30fps, and I think youtube actually re-encodes to 30fps if you upload 25fps?
And of course an extra 5/10fps is always better, right?
Any potential issues with 50Hz lighting?
Opinions please...

[Legit-Design]

Any potential issues with 50Hz lighting?

Yes, with 30fps or 60fps you might/will get banding on some situations. So you will need to keep an eye on the shutter speed.

http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/280/7346

I'd guess your shutterspeed doesn't match the frequency of the lights you're using. When shooting in a country that uses 60Hz always use shutterspeed of multiples of 60. So when using 24p, 30p or 60i use 60, when shooting 60p use 120.
When shooting in a country that uses 50Hz, use multiples of 50. For 24p, 25p or 50i use 50 and for 50p use 100.

just some example I found quick, more examples of this can be found via magical google I used words "50hz shutter speed banding"

EDIT: better explanation http://www.red.com/learn/red-101/flicker-free-video-tutorial

So, here is a big question, should I move to 30fps/60fps (NTSC) shooting, or stay with the aussie PAL 25fps/50fps shooting?

I think you should do what you know works the best.

[DoDaMaffs]

Greetings All,
I'm surprise that the big guns at Cannon Austraila have yet to
get on board with some support.

Also has anyone mentioned a multiplexed  DVR CCTV system
incorporating " floating" camera's ie; batteries and av senders
on the tripods. in addition to fixed location PTZ's or zoom
camera's.

I can send you some gear if you want (FREE)

Regards Pete

PS; your not in a race car 25 fps is fine.

[EEVblog]

I'm surprise that the big guns at Cannon Austraila have yet to
get on board with some support.

I'm a nobody 

[EEVblog]

Also has anyone mentioned a multiplexed  DVR CCTV system
incorporating " floating" camera's ie; batteries and av senders
on the tripods. in addition to fixed location PTZ's or zoom
camera's.

No need for that complexity, it doesn't really add any value for my work.

[DoDaMaffs]

I've been a follower for a long while and I think your
under estimating your super powers.

With your approval if all members sent a
" I want to see dave though a canon" email,

Then it shall be granted I'm sure.

Pete

[DoDaMaffs]

PS: were do buy those " traps for young players"
The footy club has nominated me to round up
some more participants in the junior league.

Pete

[DoDaMaffs]

On second thought that " I want to see dave through a canon "
comment could get out of hand and feel free to delete it if you so wish.

Additionaly it could end up a trap for experienced players.

I'm in CCTV & Electronic Security and CCTV could work if done well.

Pete

[EEVblog]

I think you should do what you know works the best.

Yep I think so. Just want to make sure I'm not missing something by not having 30fps. I don't think I am.