Author Topic: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA  (Read 12668 times)

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Offline hendorogTopic starter

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New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« on: June 06, 2017, 08:07:16 pm »
New 20GHz real time SA announced from Signal Hound. Still a way from being ready I expect.

Phase noise spec (@1GHz) 10kHz: -130dBc/Hz
40MHz bandwidth - but maybe more with compression later.

They are demoing it at IMS.
https://signalhound.com/ims-2017/

No doubt out of my price range though. Edit: yep - $11900 USD

« Last Edit: June 06, 2017, 08:23:31 pm by hendorog »
 

Offline chriswebb

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2017, 08:32:31 pm »
According to the site it looks like August 2017 release date.
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Offline technogeeky

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2017, 02:11:02 am »
Pretty nice looking, if a little bit sharp:

 

Offline hendorogTopic starter

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2017, 02:12:48 am »
Here's some more details on timing:

"As of right now we’re on target for sales availability around September of 2017, with units shipping in October.

Pricing is $11,900.00 USD. It’s a bit more than our other devices, but it’s competing with stuff priced north of $80,000.00. Stay posted for news. We’ll be keeping you updated as the device moves along. We currently have only one working device, but it’s working really well 🙂 I mean, really well. This thing’s pretty cool. Oh, and we only have one working device, but we’ve got stock for full production. Just perfecting it a bit more before sending it out the door 😉

We should have a video or two posted with some more info soon. "
 
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Online Bud

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2017, 01:17:12 am »
It appears Signal Hound follows their established tradition to not specify the input port impedance / return loss. I applaud their prolonged persistence to keep it a well guarded secret for some unknown reason.
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Offline hendorogTopic starter

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2017, 08:34:54 am »
It appears Signal Hound follows their established tradition to not specify the input port impedance / return loss. I applaud their prolonged persistence to keep it a well guarded secret for some unknown reason.

Its just a preliminary datasheet, hopefully it will be in the full datasheet when it comes out.

Return loss was average for the SA devices at least. They recommend using an external attenuator when it matters:
https://signalhound.com/support/forums/topic/calibration-for-measuring-return-loss/
 

Offline hendorogTopic starter

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2017, 08:36:41 am »
Maybe there is a teardown in our future...

https://signalhound.com/news/ims-day-3-wrapping-it-all-up/
 

Offline CopperCone

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2017, 03:25:35 pm »
What is the POI in the RTBW of this device?
 

Offline hendorogTopic starter

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2017, 07:36:55 am »
What is the POI in the RTBW of this device?

No idea, but this might be an interesting read about how US export regulations forced a change to the BB60C:
https://signalhound.com/news/how-we-implemexport-controls/
 

Offline CopperCone

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2017, 03:27:09 pm »
lmfao I almost bought that piece of shit.

sales bowed to the govt and nerfed the features..  disgusting

That article makes me feel that this is done to ALL units, not just units meant for sale outside of the country. I guess I should talk to sales before I talk too much shit.

I hate stuff like that, because it makes buying second hand goods difficult (now you need to find out what software revision it is, etc) Does anyone know for sure?

Anyone hacked it? Fucking military.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2017, 03:31:23 pm by CopperCone »
 

Offline hendorogTopic starter

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2017, 07:02:25 pm »
lmfao I almost bought that piece of shit.

sales bowed to the govt and nerfed the features..  disgusting

That article makes me feel that this is done to ALL units, not just units meant for sale outside of the country. I guess I should talk to sales before I talk too much shit.

I hate stuff like that, because it makes buying second hand goods difficult (now you need to find out what software revision it is, etc) Does anyone know for sure?

Anyone hacked it? Fucking military.

Yeah artificial limitations are pretty suck. The limitation only applies when you are using frequency mask triggering.

There is a comment below that story which says its for all devices.
Not SH specific as obviously other companies are playing by the same rules - but maybe have a different implementation.

Not sure how feasible it would be to sell products for the US only - I'm guessing the US government would stomp on that due to the ease of redirecting the products out of the country.
 

Offline technogeeky

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2017, 07:55:37 pm »
lmfao I almost bought that piece of shit.

sales bowed to the govt and nerfed the features..  disgusting

That article makes me feel that this is done to ALL units, not just units meant for sale outside of the country. I guess I should talk to sales before I talk too much shit.

I hate stuff like that, because it makes buying second hand goods difficult (now you need to find out what software revision it is, etc) Does anyone know for sure?

Anyone hacked it? Fucking military.

To be fair, if you read the penalties for ignoring these export restrictions, then this situation is less of a collaboration between a company and a government and more of a business protecting itself against catastrophic action which could shut down their entire business for just a few individual violations.

I'm not sure which penalty applies where, but it looks like it could be $20,000,000 per violation plus 20 years in jail. considering that is 1000x the rough cost of the device (plus 20 years in jail)... I think they have no choice.

I agree that it's absurd though. I'm sure any bad guys could get this equipment elsewhere.
 

Offline CopperCone

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2017, 11:21:08 pm »
proboboly means the CIA uses espionage devices that use ultra fast pulse transmission.
 

Offline D3f1ant

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #13 on: July 18, 2017, 06:03:21 am »
BB60C

Edit: Sorry, posted accidentally when was searching [emoji6]
« Last Edit: July 19, 2017, 07:49:24 am by D3f1ant »
 

Offline hendorogTopic starter

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Offline chriswebb

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2017, 08:32:38 am »
Found this on their site: https://signalhound.com/sm200a/ says retail in January.
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Offline Dubbie

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New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2017, 10:43:47 am »
ITAR is no joke. In 2007 several Mitutoyo execs went to jail for selling precision measuring equipment that eventually ended up in Libya or Syria or something. Large precision machine tools will lock you out of the controls if you move the machine even to the other side of the shop. You need to get an unlock code from the factory to get it going again. Companies don’t add these restrictions for a giggle, they do it because their executives face prison time if they don’t.
 

Online Mechatrommer

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #17 on: December 06, 2017, 02:06:59 pm »
and then what? any other country who can build such restriction deserves an military invasion? or an advertisement/entitlement as a terrorist? only america can build WMD.. oh wait, russia can too, not because they can, but because their clinging balls are no smaller than america the military...
« Last Edit: December 06, 2017, 02:15:45 pm by Mechatrommer »
Nature: Evolution and the Illusion of Randomness (Stephen L. Talbott): Its now indisputable that... organisms “expertise” contextualizes its genome, and its nonsense to say that these powers are under the control of the genome being contextualized - Barbara McClintock
 

Offline Dubbie

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New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #18 on: December 06, 2017, 07:40:48 pm »
It’s called non proliferation. It doesn’t stop people building whatever they want, it just slows them down. Imagine trying to build an advanced radar or something without access to digikey or decent test gear
 
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Offline chriswebb

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #19 on: February 08, 2018, 08:23:42 pm »
New update I got from their mailing list (site was also updated to Feb 2018 shipping before this):

https://signalhound.com/news/adventures-in-hardware-design-the-case-of-our-missing-20-ghz-spectrum-analyzer-the-sm200a


Quote
Adventures in hardware development: the case of our “missing” 20 GHz spectrum analyzer, the SM200A
Editor’s note— This is a rather high-level article explaining the major setbacks in the launch of our SM200A 20 GHz spectrum analyzer. In addition to being transparent about the delay, we hope to offer some valuable technical information for those planning or troubleshooting their own electronics manufacturing processes.

We’ve got some ‘splainin’ to do
Okay, okay. We’re a little behind schedule with our new 20 GHz spectrum analyzer, and it’s probably time to explain a few things.

I believe we once stated that our new SM200A spectrum analyzer would be available for retail in July of 2017. This was probably around the end of 2016. And if we didn’t state it, we certainly (at least internally) thought we would have it for sale by then.

As time pressed on, though, things started to slip a little. That July target turned to August, and then August turned to September.

We thought September 2017 was a lock. After all, it had been nearly three years since development officially started on our new 20 GHz Spectrum Analyzer, and with the progress made during the summer months, we were pretty sure we were good to go.

Perfection seemed so close. With just a little more time… we could… have… it… even more… perfect. We took the loose shipping deadlines as an opportunity to tweak the hardware and software in an effort to make first version of the SM200A even better.

However, some early discussions with potential clients started locking us into shipping timelines, and people were seriously starting to look for a defined delivery date for the spectrum analyzer. The proverbial “cat” was inching its way out of the bag.

By the time we hit the IMS tradeshow in Honolulu in June of 2017, we were sure October would be the time we could start shipping SM’s. So sure, in fact, that we started publishing the October date in print and on our website.

It was at this point that things were all coming together. In the summer of 2017 all signs were pointing to a definite October launch. The integration of SM200A-specific code into Spike’s codebase was going smoothly. The early beta versions of the analyzer were working reasonably well. All in all, the device and timeline were looking solid.

But believing we were close to done was our mistake. Up until now things were more-or-less in our hands and under our control. It was when we started ordering the final production quantities of parts that the notion of shipping the device on time became suspect.
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Offline chriswebb

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #20 on: March 01, 2018, 09:01:24 pm »
Looks like they released it:

https://signalhound.com/products/sm200a-20-ghz-real-time-spectrum-analyzer/

Pre-orders right now are expected to be released in April.

Quote
The SM200A is a high-performance spectrum analyzer and monitoring receiver. Tuning from 100 kHz to 20GHz, the analyzer has 160 MHz of instantaneous bandwidth (IBW), 110 dB of dynamic range, 1THz/sec sweep speed at 30kHz RBW (using Nuttall windowing), and phase noise performance that is low enough to contribute less than 0.1% error to EVM measurements and rival even the most expensive spectrum analyzers on the market.

Signal processing is distributed between a very powerful Altera FPGA and an external PC having an Intel Core i5 processor. The Signal Hound SM200A can be readily interfaced, using its local API, to an automated monitoring system or to automated test equipment. The SM200A API provides customers the access needed to insert their own DSP algorithms into a calibrated stream of I/Q data.

FREQUENCY

  • Range: 100 kHz to 20.0 GHz
  • RF Input Impedance (type-N connector): 50?
  • Calibrated Streaming I/Q: 5 kHz to 40 MHz of selectable I/Q
    bandwidth.
  • Sparse Spectrum I/Q Streaming: Users may load a mask, baseline,
    or threshold to reject signals below User-Defined Amplitude Leve ls
    (UDAL) and stream signals that are above the UDAL. The aggregat e
    total of active streaming bandwidth is maintained at 20 MHz of the 160
    MHz stare, or IBW (Instantaneous Bandwidth). The quantity of active
    segments selected are regulated with a dynamic UDAL offset to en sure
    aggregate system bandwidth does not exceed the 20 MHz limit.
  • Resolution Bandwidths (RBW): 0.1 Hz (<=200kHz span) to 3 MHz (any
    span) using 40 MHz IBW; 30 kHz to 10 MHz using 160 MHz IBW
  • Timebase Accuracy: GPS disciplined OCXO remains within
    ±5 x 10-10 when locked to GPS;
    holdover of ±5 x 10-9 per day for aging;
    holdover of ±1 x 10-8 for temperature over -40°C to 60°C

SYSTEM NOISE FIGURE (typical)
13 dB from 700 MHz to 2.7 GHz;
16 dB from 2.7 GHz to 4.5 GHz;
19 dB from 4.5 GHz to 15.2 GHz

IP2
+68dBm from 100 kHz to 2 GHz;
+78dBm from 2 GHz to 10 GHz;
+75 dBm from 10 GHz to 15 GHz;
+60 dBm from 15 GHz to 20 GHz

IP3
+28dBm from 100 kHz to 3 GHz;
+24dBm from 3 GHz to 6 GHz;
+20dBm from 6 GHz to 20 GHz

Datasheet: https://signalhound.com/download/sm200a-data-sheet/
« Last Edit: March 01, 2018, 09:05:13 pm by chriswebb »
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Offline hendorogTopic starter

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #21 on: March 01, 2018, 09:21:04 pm »
Pretty damn fine.

Really hoping that Shahriar gets one.
 
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Offline Alegor

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #22 on: March 21, 2018, 10:22:33 pm »
Artificial limitations are easy to overcome by using appropriate software. RadioInspector, for instance. Any type of thresholds and triggering, furthermore, IQ analyzis and demodulation of digital communication standards.
 

Offline Alegor

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #23 on: March 21, 2018, 10:26:02 pm »
Pretty damn fine.

Really hoping that Shahriar gets one.
We are also still waiting for his review of our software. It looks like he is very-very busy, and once again very.
 

Offline w2aew

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Re: New: Signal Hound SM200A 20GHz SA
« Reply #24 on: March 22, 2018, 09:19:28 pm »
Artificial limitations are easy to overcome by using appropriate software. RadioInspector, for instance. Any type of thresholds and triggering, furthermore, IQ analyzis and demodulation of digital communication standards.

I see that your RadioInspector now supports the Tek USB-RSAs - very cool.
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