Whatever Happened to Ham Radio?

[Kalvin]

<snip>
It is no wonder that linear power supplies are popular among hams although the efficiency may not be that good. It will keep your coffee hot during QSO, too.

<snip>
When you look on my oversized box and cooler I would say that I need to keep my coffee warm elsewhere ...

Yes, your box looks good enough for the purpose. I was just regarding to linear power supplies in general used by hams to power their +100W rigs.

[Wolfgang]

Agreed, for a 100W rig you would need about 150-200W rig input power at 13,8V.
Passive cooling at such a power level is not pratical. You need a fan, definitively, and then its get loud, I dont like that.
But then, also the coffee problem could be solved

[bd139]

Problem is operating at 100W out in the summer 

[Wolfgang]

The invention of the day would be a combination of a refrigerator and a 100W ham radio unit. 
I once say something like this, look here:

[bd139]

I wonder if SWMBO will let me make that a kitchen feature

[Wolfgang]

Just dont tell her about the hidden functionalities ...

[bsfeechannel]

In German, fridge is Kühlschrank, or "cool cabinet". Knowing that peculiarity of the German language, I converted an unrecoverable kaputt fridge into an electronics parts cabinet. In this new life it's still a cabinet and now really cool.

[vk6zgo]

Agreed, for a 100W rig you would need about 150-200W rig input power at 13,8V.
Passive cooling at such a power level is not pratical. You need a fan, definitively, and then its get loud, I dont like that.
But then, also the coffee problem could be solved

The linear supply (a Chinese one) I use at 100watts does have a fan, but most of the time it isn't on.
If you stretch your overs a bit, it will eventually, kick in.

Remember, SSB has a fairly low duty cycle, as does "CW"(Morse).
With AM or FM, it would probably be on a lot more.

[vk3yedotcom]

Some fun with a lecher line (measuring UHF frequencies to 2% accuracy with scraps)

[m3vuv]

A chineese linear good god bet its multi band,ie dc to daylight but all at the same time !! 73 m3vuv.

[cdev]

If youre using a receiver and an un-tuned piece of wire to scan the ham bands and don't hear anything at all, try a better antenna that actually resonates at or near the frequency you're listening to. This has been my experience with my RTLSDR, etc.

Still, there seems to me much less activity now than I would wish.

Also the time of year. Foliage eats up a lot of RF where I am and when its gone that makes a noticeable improvement. Altitude too. Getting any antenna up higher helps a lot, especially the higher you go in frequency.

[coppercone2]

a good reason why its not popular is the scary 'at will station inspection' clause in ham license ownership.

Normal telecom is protected by search warrants. There is nothing quite so bad as giving the government a signed paper that says we can come enter your house at will for invisible technical crap.

[bd139]

Think that's just paranoia there. At best it's used to eventually, after much complaining, get the FCC to find some fucking prick jamming stuff or broadcasting.

That doesn't even happen here at all. Ofcom don't really care.

[coppercone2]

Think that's just paranoia there. At best it's used to eventually, after much complaining, get the FCC to find some fucking prick jamming stuff or broadcasting.

That doesn't even happen here at all. Ofcom don't really care.

try selling that to someone. the only other thing comparable in terms of intrusion is a class 3 weapons license, for owning a machine gun, or a license for explosives (magazine inspection). Quite a bit different then a radio. Quite a bit of undertaking for a home owner, usually you need to own a factory or something for even OSHA visits. If its actually interfering with something important, a warrant would be signed quickly. Its an outdated non effective anti-spy policy* (like in The Americans, they would setup a little remote transmitter in the woods, even when it was 'hot' that became totally outdated somewhere around 1970 with easy international telecom and strong encryption. Even back then it probably made more sense to go to a pay phone place or something (like the movie American Gangster).

*Do you think they would some how justify warrentless peremesis inspections WITHOUT a 'scary' reason beyond interfering with stupid car radio talk shows?

 Who would bother now when you have a ultra reliable feed going into a spy masters house with full encryption and ultra high $ $ $ $ $ telecom reliability?? And then if someone needs to tap that, you basically NEED to announce yourself. Its so much better. A spy can.. literally complain to the telephone company when his stolen data is not uploading, damn the weather. Lol going into the woods and adjusting antennas for rain, now its like make a angry phone call to the teleco and have another shot of vodka, comrade. They will send out a repair man or dive 1000's of feet into the ocean or even launch a satellite so that system works. This kind of reliability and promptness was not imaginable otherwise when these laws were drafted. I even get warnings from the phone company that there might be an outage sometimes. Try getting that from the ionosphere or the weatherman!

These KGB radio men might have been a serious threat to some installation in 'middle of nowhere' Kansas when they were counting (nuclear missile) truck deliveries to an air base (it was HUGE to know where and what the enemy had so you can adjust your finances accordingly, i.e. plan the next years missile budget in the secret committee meeting), but now you can probably get an app to send ultra high definition encrypted video directly to the FSB from your phone with the push of a button, all through ultra reliable civilian infrastructure, and have it analyzed by AI to estimate the trucks weight in 5 seconds. Back then the same little town might have had 'downed phone line, est 2 week repair' as a bimonthly regularity and have been 60 miles away from anything with like 5 cars passing through per day. I'd say this law became outdated as soon as they made the Eisenhower interstate roads.. now you can get from the bottom of california to the tip of maine in like 2 days. Its even 'less secure' now given that you car won't break down after 500 miles.

[bd139]

But that’s irrelevant when they just shoot you anyway (apparently)

[coppercone2]

But that’s irrelevant when they just shoot you anyway (apparently)

well its relevant because people read to the end of a HAM manual and decide not to take the test

[bd139]

I think it's mostly other hams who stop people wanting to take the test from experience 

[bson]

I think the only concern is that people can agree away their constitutional rights (as explicitly spelled out in but not created by the 4A).  For whatever is serious enough to warrant a search, the investigating party can easily obtain a warrant.  But the FCC thankfully has zero interest in fishing expeditions.  (Of course, if they did they'd soon find they no longer have that power.)

[coppercone2]

I think the only concern is that people can agree away their constitutional rights (as explicitly spelled out in but not created by the 4A).  For whatever is serious enough to warrant a search, the investigating party can easily obtain a warrant.  But the FCC thankfully has zero interest in fishing expeditions.  (Of course, if they did they'd soon find they no longer have that power.)

I think its more of a budget thing, if the budget is increased someone in the organization that likes travel will likely justify it because it pays and seems 'useful'. Kinda like cops trolling for tickets come quota. Easy money making scam 'hey boss, you know how many busts I made this year?'. Or if its decreased too much someone is gonna think that they can fund the organization with stupid fines. Thats why its good to have the judicial system involved (usually independent, or more so). Judges that do it too much will eventually be investigated if enough complaints are made, and usually there will be a corruption investigation.

I am not sure having a transmitter and a call sign is enough justification to be treated like someone with a machine gun or explosives, now that the spies have moved else where. There is like no reason to do espionage with it anymore, especially with other more advanced anti espionage and terrorism laws (patriot act, etc) which make it MUCH easier for the FBI to spy on spies. Interfering with aircraft or police communications could easily be considered a national security issue, so you don't need the FCC to investigate it, and the cops are way more advanced now.

Most of this stuff is based on a 1912 law! And I think it was all made with broad band spark gap transmitters in mind! I think the only reason it stayed so draconian is because of sabotage during the world wars and the cold war. Now you do all that over the internet. They did not even have security cameras and taking a suspects photograph was a highly planned team effort up to the 60's (sneaking up on people with flash powder illuminators and giant cameras LOL).

Keep in mind congress makes sure things are cheap and the FCC is so ridiculous that you likely cannot align with them too well in a political sense as a congress member without being considered a turncoat in some regard (does not pay to work with the FCC) so they might just never be able to get the power, even if it is some how loosely justified. The congressmen would really need to be scared to give them power because dealing with the FCC likely makes you choose some kind of side on a very sticky issue and then you lose elections or people stop doing favorable deals with you. It may be something thats generally frowned upon but allowed to exist and not funded well (impolitely called a red headed step child, think the simpsons episode with Bart's brother in the attic).  Think about the ridiculousness of English "tv van". You just DONT want to be associated with that. I imagine its like a stupid office group detail of some sort that you have at work at some places that makes some kind of decisions that no one cares about, effect nothing and for some reason take up alot of resources. Like deciding on what kind of binders will be used in the physical storage cabinet that has not been opened for 20 years and getting everyone to agree on it. A buisness can mostly override these things by yelling at people, but congress is based on strict adherance to paperwork so you end up needing something. It might be as simple as it takes up too many sessions to change anything so they just let it be and keep it small.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_detector_van 

[Wolfgang]

Here in Germany I only know of visits of the BNA guys in cases where neighbors complained massively about RFI.
I dont think they have a huge travel budget

[vk6zgo]

A chineese linear good god bet its multi band,ie dc to daylight but all at the same time !! 73 m3vuv.

I know this is an ancient posting, but it niggles at me every time I am unfortunate enough to encounter it, so now the thread has been dragged kicking & screaming back into the daylight, I will answer it.

The term "linear" in my posting referred to the mode in which the power supply operated, in other words it is not a "switchmode power supply".
That was quite apparent in the context, had you applied more then 0.0005% of a brain cell!

[vk6zgo]

a good reason why its not popular is the scary 'at will station inspection' clause in ham license ownership.

Normal telecom is protected by search warrants. There is nothing quite so bad as giving the government a signed paper that says we can come enter your house at will for invisible technical crap.

Oh bollocks!
In 43 years as a ham  I have been visited just once!

The guys, all hams, just had a look at my station, read my logbook (not a requirement any more)  & were on their way.
If I had important other things to do, they would have gone away & come back at a more convenient time.

Commercial stations also had visits, back in the day, but successive governments in all countries have reduced funding for any real engineering work, so visits to anyone are "rare as hens teeth".

It is mostly non-technical clerical people with computers these days, who can, & do, stuff up!
Their  main job is "allocating frequencies", & in the 1990s, the Oz ones double allocated a Studio/transmitter link frequency, so the new link could interfere with a long standing one.

When we pointed out the problem, they didn't have an engineer to verify it with, & had to find, & employ an outside one.(apparently our "tame" EEs didn't count!)

The "spy" stuff was never part of a Radio Inspector's function--they were Technicians (real ones), & Engineers, who knew damn all about espionage.
Their main function was to ensure stations were not emitting signals outside their licenced allocation.

Broadcast Stations had one licenced frequency they had to rigidly stick to, instead of the large bands hams have, but also transmitted much higher power levels.
Imagine a 50kW transmitter having a 3rd or 4th harmonic, out of spec----- this may radiate tens of watts, whereas a ham's similar harmonics would be much lower.
The level of inspection was accordingly, much more intensive.

It is pretty much a given that if you do something a bit out of the ordinary in your house, rather than just eating, watching TV, then off to bed, you will run up against some regulatory authority or other.
The radio licencing authorities only lightly brushed against most ham's lives, leaving barely a flurry.

Back to the spies---most countries have a dedicated intelligence signals organisation to detect communications possibly associated with espionage, rather than further loading down a handful of overstressed Radio Inspectors.

Further, if I was running a spy network, I would make sure my agents stayed well away from critical radio services who might "kick up a stink" about interference.
It would probably be better to "pirate" on amateur radio frequencies, knowing the authorities will pretty much ignore ham complaints.

[coppercone2]

I don't think you see the disconnect of keeping an old hobby alive with government distrust rising in young people. The fact that they have a capability is enough to alienate alot of smart young people that just go by what others are doing. I think that there is a chilling effect. You need teenagers (I say that with a grain of salt, people are teenagers until 30-40 now, with what older people can renember) that think hacking is cool to want to get this license. Its like contrary to what most young people think is cool. I see tons of people in defund the police protests and police brutality protests and all sorts of stuff and I think basically every one of them would have a reservation with that clause. There is probobly 100x more then what you see out on the streets that are either too scared or incapable of attending that agree with that view. Now, if you wanna keep em out, thats why the air is not popping. It is literary a head count issue. Its not very useful now adays AND you have a rather pesky clause in place making people wary.. not inviting at all. Maybe we can get republican kids to get Ham radio licenses to show alliance for order parties or something, because the democrats are lawless criminals 

Compare it to discord, which is the closest online real time service thing that is similar to radio communications and popular.. basically no laws save for stuff that gets international attention.. the groups can make their own rules on what is allowed, but usually its extremely lax. Howard stern looks like a choir boy in comparison (and he bought a sybian (sex toy) on air with porn stars).

How on earth do you compete with that.. when you get basically the same thing BUT with the government able to come to your house after 1 signature. I'd say that alot of young people see that like signing a deal with the devil. I think the spirit of the laws pertaining to ham licensing had the espionage act in mind (USA President Woodrow Wilson signed it).

[janoc]

But that’s irrelevant when they just shoot you anyway (apparently)

well its relevant because people read to the end of a HAM manual and decide not to take the test

That's the first time I have ever heard about someone citing this as the motive to not take the test. If you have said that morse code requirements (not mandatory anymore in most countries) were off-putting or the pathetic HF band privileges for the novice classes were, I would believe you more.

Nobody is forcing you take the test and become licensed. HAM radio license is a privilege you have to earn and it comes with its own set of conditions (same as the driving license, pilot license, licensed engineers, licensed electricians, physicians, lawyers needing a bar exam, etc.). If you don't like them, don't take the test, it is that simple.

The inspection requirement has been there pretty much since the start of the HAM radio and it is not really any different than anything else you might be doing - e.g. police can also stop you and require an on the spot technical check of your vehicle if they suspect a serious problem (in some countries, at least - and you pay for it too!). In some countries you could get an unannounced visit from the firemen to inspect your chimney and furnace or from the municipal employees if you have a mess on your property that is causing problems for neighbors (smells, waste, rodents, etc.). And that doesn't seem to prevent people from getting driving licenses or owning houses, despite these things being often much more onerous (and with a lot more expensive fines and remediation work required) than anything a HAM radio regulator will ever want to see.

In practice the inspections are extremely rare, they happen only when someone complains - typically a neighbor about RFI or some other HAM about your behavior on the bands. The first situation they have to investigate because of the law, the latter is very rare unless you do something really egregiously illegal. And neither of this is any secret, just ask any licensed HAMs how many times they were inspected during their career - the only contact with the regulator for most is when renewing/updating their license. The government bureaucrats have better things to do than to chase people for messy logbooks or a missing filters, the clerks don't deal only with HAM radio agenda in most countries.

This sounds more like finding an excuse why not to take the test than an actual good reason, IMO. And that "spy stuff" - that's just incoherent paranoia bullshit, sorry.


EDIT: Re that "think of the children" bit in the post above (youngsters being reportedly put off HAM radio because of this obscure condition) - nonsense. If you, instead of making up conspiratorial nonsense, took a radio to the nearest school, set it up and showed the kids how you can talk around the world with just "a box and piece of wire", especially if using a computer or using a satellite, you would have got several kids interested in the thing on the spot, pretty much guaranteed. And at least one or two would end up taking the test later as well.

The reason why youngsters are not interested in this hobby is simply because:

a) It is technical, geeky = nerds are "not cool", lawyers, athletes and various "celebrities" are, not engineers (when did you last time see a TV show featuring engineers in some meaningful capacity and not nerdy socially awkward laughing stock?)
b) Most kids have never had a chance to see it, the clubs are few and far between and HAMs are only a few around. Most "radio" thing that lay people will imagine is a police-style walkie-talkie, because that's what they see on the TV. That's the same like showing a today's teen an original Sony Walkman - they will probably think it is a toaster.

This anti-government nonsense comes nowhere into play - youngsters certainly don't have issues getting driving licenses, which are also government issued, do they?

[cdev]

There are a lot of possibilities for interesting hybrid AR/voice/text digital modes.  For a great many reasons which should be obvious to people, these should be an open platform and not a corporate possession.

The shift could be great for ham radio, and a great way to meet people, or not. Its up to us.


Also, we may be living in the Golden Age of driving. Young people spend so much time online and often cant afford cars these days. Also the shift to autonomous vehicles will probably push older non-autonomous cars off the roadws, at least the bigger ones.

The cost of the conversion will likely be used to justify privatizing the highways and feeder streets.