EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
Products => Test Equipment => Topic started by: evava on June 29, 2017, 12:05:29 pm
-
Hi, recently I saw new meter on ebay - less then half the price of UT61e, 1uV instead of 10uV resolution, interesting.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-Voltage-Ammeter-/282496420913?epid=0&hash=item41c6194c31:g:7SAAAOSwi7RZKRTd (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-Voltage-Ammeter-/282496420913?epid=0&hash=item41c6194c31:g:7SAAAOSwi7RZKRTd)
Although without logging..
Who will be first to teardown?
-
Is that a new model of those cheapo meters?
Looks intriguing, does it have a square wave output?
Update: Yes it does - read the description (duh!)
"*Square Wave Output:50Hz/100Hz/200Hz/300Hz/400Hz/500Hz/600Hz/700Hz/800Hz/
900Hz/1000Hz/2000Hz/3000Hz/4000Hz/5000Hz"
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=327865;image)
The AN8001 has been analyzed to death here, I assume it's quite similar inside.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/aneng-an8001-6000-count-true-rms-multimeter/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/aneng-an8001-6000-count-true-rms-multimeter/)
-
It has a uA range, which the AN8001 is lacking. And 9999 counts.
I bet all the people who rushed out to buy the AN8001 a few months ago will be upset by that. :popcorn:
-
Pretty impressive, if safety is not a concern.
Apparently, does temperature too:
(http://olxua-ring05.akamaized.net/images_slandocomua/489958368_5_1000x700_tsifrovoy-multimetr-true-rms-zt109-an8008-9999-otschetov-bonus-harkovskaya-oblast.jpg)
-
Pretty impressive, if safety is not a concern.
Yep.
I was thinking about getting an AN8001 for Arduino club but lack of uA bothered me. This is much better, I might have to take the plunge.
All the review videos show decent autorange speed, fast continuity test, etc. It even does true RMS up to 1kHz and comes with lots of accessories and a bag. :P
-
Regarding safety: The AN8001 was badly designed. It has an "OFF" position right next the the "mA" position. I bet the person who put in two "OFF" positions thought he was being clever, but... :palm:
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=327884;image)
In this new AN8008 the "OFF" position is far from the low impedance ranges - which is as it should be, especially for places like Arduino club. :)
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=327882;image)
-
Apparently, does temperature too:
It even displays '°C' ... ?
-
Regarding safety: The AN8001 was badly designed. It has an "OFF" position right next the the "mA" position. I bet the person who put in two "OFF" positions thought he was being clever, but... :palm:
You mean like the 121GW? ;D
-
Regarding safety: The AN8001 was badly designed. It has an "OFF" position right next the the "mA" position. I bet the person who put in two "OFF" positions thought he was being clever, but... :palm:
You mean like the 121GW? ;D
The 121GW doesn't share the mA socket with the V socket, but yes, it's still bad design. Even if the leads are in the right place you have to switch past a bunch of other ranges (eg. Ohms) to get to the voltage ranges. Not ideal if the leads are connected to something at the time.
Comments, Dave?
-
Regarding safety: The AN8001 was badly designed. It has an "OFF" position right next the the "mA" position. I bet the person who put in two "OFF" positions thought he was being clever, but... :palm:
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=327884;image)
Not an issues when the mA range is on it's own socket.
Only the uA range shares the V jack.
-
The 121GW doesn't share the mA socket with the V socket, but yes, it's still bad design. Even if the leads are in the right place you have to switch past a bunch of other ranges (eg. Ohms) to get to the voltage ranges. Not ideal if the leads are connected to something at the time.
Comments, Dave?
I like having the 2nd OFF position. Having only one in the traditional position makes your meter Voltage range racist 8)
If you do a lot of current measurement then the right hand off position can be handy.
Of course you can simply ignore the extra OFF position if it bugs you or doesn't suit your usage.
I kinda like the look of this cheap meter for basic budget low level electronics work, but if it's like the 8001 inside then it's your typical cheapie, albeit a bit more useful than most with those extra ranges.
-
Out of curiosity I've ordered one.
-
Not an issues when the mA range is on it's own socket.
It's still a small issue, IMHO.
I like having the 2nd OFF position. Having only one in the traditional position makes your meter Voltage range racist 8)
If you do a lot of current measurement then the right hand off position can be handy.
Of course you can simply ignore the extra OFF position if it bugs you or doesn't suit your usage.
If you want to add value, get rid of both of them and put in a proper mechanical on/off switch. :)
I kinda like the look of this cheap meter for basic budget low level electronics work, but if it's like the 8001 inside then it's your typical cheapie, albeit a bit more useful than most with those extra ranges.
These new ones seem to have really good performance for auto-ranging, continuity, etc. The previous generation were horrible for that.
I really like the look of this one. I'm not sure what I'd use the square wave output for though.
(Can it flash a LED? Will it make a speaker buzz?)
Out of curiosity I've ordered one.
Me, too.
-
If you do a lot of current measurement then the right hand off position can be handy.
I can use the meter to switch my device on and off, it's a feature!
-
I've ordered one too out of interest.
Ordered from a cheaper seller, here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-Multifunctional-Digital-LCD-Display-Multimeter-with-Combination-Wires-/152592869605?epid=0&hash=item23873e68e5:g:1D4AAOSwd~RZSLmV (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-Multifunctional-Digital-LCD-Display-Multimeter-with-Combination-Wires-/152592869605?epid=0&hash=item23873e68e5:g:1D4AAOSwd~RZSLmV)
Approx $20 (aud) inc shipping after conversion.
-
Ordered from a cheaper seller, here:
Neener, neener. I hope yours takes longer to arrive.
Snif.
-
you can find it as low as $15 ...
-
you can find it as low as $15 ...
RedSky got his for even less than that. :popcorn:
-
you can find it as low as $15 ...
Is there some specialized site for Chinese multimeters we're not aware of, or perhaps deals simply differ from country to country?
-
With just one current probe position is there but one highest range current fuse?
-
you can find it as low as $15 ...
Is there some specialized site for Chinese multimeters we're not aware of, or perhaps deals simply differ from country to country?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-Multifunctional-Digital-LCD-Display-Multimeter-with-Combination-Wires-/152592869605?epid=0&hash=item23873e68e5:g:1D4AAOSwd~RZSLmV (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-Multifunctional-Digital-LCD-Display-Multimeter-with-Combination-Wires-/152592869605?epid=0&hash=item23873e68e5:g:1D4AAOSwd~RZSLmV)
or more generaly :
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&LH_BIN=1&_nkw=an8008&_sop=15 (https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&LH_BIN=1&_nkw=an8008&_sop=15)
-
Nice, addition of uA makes it a lot better. I bet it will still have those silly little 10mm fuses though :-/ I ended up buying leaded ones from RS and cutting the leads off.
-
http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144 (http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144) :)
-
you can find it as low as $15 ...
Is there some specialized site for Chinese multimeters we're not aware of, or perhaps deals simply differ from country to country?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-Multifunctional-Digital-LCD-Display-Multimeter-with-Combination-Wires-/152592869605?epid=0&hash=item23873e68e5:g:1D4AAOSwd~RZSLmV (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-Multifunctional-Digital-LCD-Display-Multimeter-with-Combination-Wires-/152592869605?epid=0&hash=item23873e68e5:g:1D4AAOSwd~RZSLmV)
or more generaly :
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&LH_BIN=1&_nkw=an8008&_sop=15 (https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&LH_BIN=1&_nkw=an8008&_sop=15)
Ah, okay, the price diff is because shipping is country specific (so some will see better deals than others).
-
casinada beat me too it, but following the info from the 8001 thread ( https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/aneng-an8001-6000-count-true-rms-multimeter/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/aneng-an8001-6000-count-true-rms-multimeter/) ) and searching kazus.ru for 8008 gets us to this thread ( http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135) ) which mentions it as the Zotek ZT109 / Aneng 8008 / Autotool DM700 as what appear to be the most recent ones added to the list
Zotek ZT109 (Aneng AN8008, Autool DM700).
For sure the list is not complete and as information is received it will be supplemented.
The newest modification of the DTM0660 chip is DM1106EN
(references to the new version of this chip are viewed from the end of the 16th year).
It seems it has been around since at least mid-may when this post was made : http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?p=1122373 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?p=1122373)
This post I think has the EEPROM dump from the 8008, google translation isn't so helpful "By the way, since the speech went for innovations, I can say that the AN8008-go (ZT109) on the arena all the same. And the problems of 9999 are also present, but there it is possible to select ranges manually."
http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126917&postcount=1827 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126917&postcount=1827)
First couple posts in this page
http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135&page=184 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135&page=184)
I'm not quite grokking the machne translation totally but I think they are taking about some issues
Note that the temperature mode is not enabled, it needs to be added by reprogramming the eeprom.
Teardown photos on this post are of the 8008
http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1127606&postcount=1854 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1127606&postcount=1854)
-
Teardown photos on this post are of the 8008
http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1127606&postcount=1854 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1127606&postcount=1854)
It's got a PTC in it! :popcorn:
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=327989;image)
-
There is absolutely no way that this thing could meet its CAT rating. When a company lies about one part, the important part, what else are they lying about. It might be an OK meter for the bench, but being marked with a lie about its safety rating means I would never buy nor recommend it to anyone. People have died using equipment that didn't meet its claimed safety rating.
I know that people are probably rolling their eyes, but I don't care. If this meter is lying around with its false ratings and someone picks it up to use it where they need the real protection because they see the marks, it could kill them or injure them severely. These falsely rated meters should be exposed here and ridiculed as the dangerous lies they are.
I have made a couple of videos that I think contribute to the problem. It is time for me to correct some things I have said in those.
-
If this meter is lying around with its false ratings and someone picks it up to use it where they need the real protection because they see the marks, it could kill them or injure them severely.
It shouldn't be too difficult to alter the rating to something more realistic.
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=328075;image)
All fixed! You can leave it lying around now. :popcorn:
-
Old Fluke 27 has two OFF positions. One on top, one on the bottom. So yes, the designers are being clever, but this feature has been around since late 80s, at least on Flukes.
-
If this meter is lying around with its false ratings and someone picks it up to use it where they need the real protection because they see the marks, it could kill them or injure them severely.
It shouldn't be too difficult to alter the rating to something more realistic.
All fixed! You can leave it lying around now. :popcorn:
Why do you troll so much?
-
If this meter is lying around with its false ratings and someone picks it up to use it where they need the real protection because they see the marks, it could kill them or injure them severely.
It shouldn't be too difficult to alter the rating to something more realistic.
All fixed! You can leave it lying around now. :popcorn:
Why do you troll so much?
Who's trolling?
If somebody's likely to use that meter "where they need the real protection" based only on the numbers printed on the front then it means they know what a CAT rating is. Lowering the rating 'manually' will solve the problem.
In real life it's more likely that don't know what the numbers mean. In that case don't leave that meter lying around. Get a Fluke 101 and leave it in a prominent place.
-
The 8002 was pretty nice for the price. For low voltage, low energy it's way ahead of the free meters from HR.
Because it failed at a low enough level, it made it a prime candidate to run on my half cycle generator. Still not a lot of energy with this setup.
https://youtu.be/HrcxnbkkhYg?t=1793
-
I do not like the small non-standard size fuses in AN8008. :-- :--
-
I do not like the small non-standard size fuses in AN8008. :-- :--
Just wondering, what is the disadvantage of the smaller fuses? Does the fuses being smaller make arcs more likely and would that be an issue?
-
I do not like the small non-standard size fuses in AN8008. :-- :--
Just wondering, what is the disadvantage of the smaller fuses? Does the fuses being smaller make arcs more likely and would that be an issue?
breaking capacity will definitely be affected.
HRC fuses are filled with powder to dissipate excess energy when you severely overload the fuse.
those little guys can't possibly even have 5kA breaking capacity. Maybe not even 1kA.
obviously, if you're only on low energy circuits, this won't be an issue. just don't poke anything that might dump more than 1kA into your meter. I probably wouldn't even risk 250A
Bussmann has some videos (others probably do too) to show you how HRC fuses explode when you overload them to >100kA
-
Interesting. I wonder what features can be added.
I ordered 3pcs of AN8002 for adding logging output and extra buttons.
-
When they want to use non-HRC fuses, at least they should use standard 5mm × 20mm fuses as most chinese DMMs do.
-
Interesting. I wonder what features can be added.
I ordered 3pcs of AN8002 for adding logging output and extra buttons.
Logging output sounds attractive, I wonder how difficult the mod is (I'm sure it was mentioned here somewhere, well worth a search or two).
-
Interesting. I wonder what features can be added.
I ordered 3pcs of AN8002 for adding logging output and extra buttons.
Logging output sounds attractive, I wonder how difficult the mod is (I'm sure it was mentioned here somewhere, well worth a search or two).
IIRC it requires editing I2C ROM content. Then UART TX is enabled. I planned to add an optocoupler and a cheap CP2102 board. Also range and delta buttons would be good.
-
I do not like the small non-standard size fuses in AN8008. :-- :--
Just wondering, what is the disadvantage of the smaller fuses? Does the fuses being smaller make arcs more likely and would that be an issue?
Yes, arcover wittstanding voltage, smaller breaking energy rating, they are also likely non-branded and unrated, and also the non standardness of them might be bothersome. But they are better than M205 glass fuses.
-
those little guys can't possibly even have 5kA breaking capacity. Maybe not even 1kA.
obviously, if you're only on low energy circuits, this won't be an issue. just don't poke anything that might dump more than 1kA into your meter. I probably wouldn't even risk 250A
Bussmann has some videos (others probably do too) to show you how HRC fuses explode when you overload them to >100kA
I think even 20A will be very unlikely where I'm going to use mine.
If you're poking anything into undiagnosed devices with 1kA+ available then you'll need more than just a "safe" multimeter. I suggest gloves, face shield, hearing protection and somebody else standing 10 yards away with a 'phone in their hand.
When they want to use non-HRC fuses, at least they should use standard 5mm × 20mm fuses as most chinese DMMs do.
If I ever blow a fuse I'd look at replacing the socket before I tried to find those little fuses for replacement.
-
I do not like the small non-standard size fuses in AN8008. :-- :--
Just wondering, what is the disadvantage of the smaller fuses? Does the fuses being smaller make arcs more likely and would that be an issue?
breaking capacity will definitely be affected.
HRC fuses are filled with powder to dissipate excess energy when you severely overload the fuse.
those little guys can't possibly even have 5kA breaking capacity. Maybe not even 1kA.
obviously, if you're only on low energy circuits, this won't be an issue. just don't poke anything that might dump more than 1kA into your meter. I probably wouldn't even risk 250A
Bussmann has some videos (others probably do too) to show you how HRC fuses explode when you overload them to >100kA
It is going to take a lot more than a CAT rating to get me poking probes into something with capability to source 5kA for more than milliseconds. In fact anything I work on would need to have a couple of protective devices fail to support 250A.
Those that actually have to do this better be doing more than glancing at a label on a meter.
Those that don't have to do this should stop and think for a long time why they think it is a good idea before proceeding.
-
Interesting. I wonder what features can be added.
I ordered 3pcs of AN8002 for adding logging output and extra buttons.
Logging output sounds attractive, I wonder how difficult the mod is (I'm sure it was mentioned here somewhere, well worth a search or two).
IIRC it requires editing I2C ROM content. Then UART TX is enabled. I planned to add an optocoupler and a cheap CP2102 board. Also range and delta buttons would be good.
Do you get access to the TX-pin on AN8002? It's easy to enable TX on the VC-921, but the TX-pin is not visble on the AN8002 as far as I know.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/)
-
The big question is: Will Dave use this chipset in his next meter?
If they can sell meters this complete for $17, how much would it cost to put in some MOVs, proper fuses, etc.?
Could somebody make a super-meter and sell it for $50?
How many UT-61Es are sold every year? That's the potential market size. :popcorn:
-
IIRC it requires editing I2C ROM content. Then UART TX is enabled. I planned to add an optocoupler and a cheap CP2102 board. Also range and delta buttons would be good.
Do you get access to the TX-pin on AN8002? It's easy to enable TX on the VC-921, but the TX-pin is not visble on the AN8002 as far as I know.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/)
I quickly checked the Russian forum and it looks like no one has added TX output to this model. I guess I have to decap one to check the connections.
-
Bought two for general purpose low voltage measurement stuff out of curiosity. Suitable for those measurement scenarios when one runs out of multimeters :)
-
Did anyone's meter arrive yet? Any experiences? :)
-
Did anyone's meter arrive yet? Any experiences? :)
Still waiting for mine....
-
Did anyone's meter arrive yet? Any experiences? :)
Still waiting for mine....
I guess a couple of weeks is minimum. Although for some it will surely be faster than others (maybe some even paid extra for premium shipping?). Well, I'll be happy when someone does get a chance to share a few things about it - hopefully there's no unexpected disappointments.
-
Did anyone's meter arrive yet? Any experiences? :)
Still waiting for mine....
I guess a couple of weeks is minimum. Although for some it will surely be faster than others (maybe some even paid extra for premium shipping?). Well, I'll be happy when someone does get a chance to share a few things about it - hopefully there's no unexpected disappointments.
I just checked eBay and this is what I get for delivery estimate:
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=330998;image)
(I got a tracking number, woohoo!)
eBay stuff's been taking 2 to 3 weeks to arrive recently. Maybe it'll be here next week. :popcorn:
-
I just checked eBay and this is what I get for delivery estimate:
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=330998;image)
(I got a tracking number, woohoo!)
eBay stuff's been taking 2 to 3 weeks to arrive recently. Maybe it'll be here next week. :popcorn:
Awesome. Be prepared to share some photos. :-+
-
IIRC it requires editing I2C ROM content. Then UART TX is enabled. I planned to add an optocoupler and a cheap CP2102 board. Also range and delta buttons would be good.
Do you get access to the TX-pin on AN8002? It's easy to enable TX on the VC-921, but the TX-pin is not visble on the AN8002 as far as I know.
Looks like the TX pin is not wired. I got the pin visible and edited the I2C ROM. No signal.
-
Mine arrived today. Ordered 1st July.
A few months back I picked up an AN8002, and have been quite impressed with it. But this is even better. This is a bit of an 8002-8008 comparison review, useful to anyone who already has the AN8002
If you don't already have either, it's worth mentioning that the case is hard plastic - no holster or similar. But it's light and seems to bounce well enough. A bit slippery on a hardwood bench. I much prefer the red of the AN8008 to the murky blue of the AN8002.
The AN8008 came with a bunch of accessories. The AN8002 didn't, but looking now, I see that they often do (though it adds a couple of £ to the price).
I can't image what use the square wave output will ever be. The AN8002 has temperature instead of square wave out, which is probably more useful. The square wave is fixed at 3V pk-pk. I haven't checked to see if that changes with battery voltage yet, nor have I tried to determine the source impedance and Zout is around 2k. It appears to be AC coupled, or at least, it's symmetrical either side of 0V.
The AN8008 has a manual ranging button - the AN8002 lacks that (unless you take it apart).
The millivolt ranges are better than most - 10mV and 100mV. Resolution in the 10mV range is 1uV, which is very impressive for a hand-held DMM, let alone one so cheap. Looking at my Fluke collection, you need to stretch to a 187/9 for that.
Away from mV, the lowest Volts range is 1V (0.1mV resolution). For comparison, the AN8002 does 60mV (10uV resolution) and 600mV (100uV resolution) in mV, and the lowest range in Volts is 6V (1mV resolution) - the same as an 87V in normal mode.
They've fixed a minor "bug" that the AN8002 has. When pressing the yellow button in Volts mode, the modes are DC, AC, Hz and % - but according to the silk-screen, it's only DC and AC. With the AN8008, the silk-screening shows all 4 options. Not a big deal, but at least someone was paying attention to detail there...
The AN8008 has uA. The ranges are 100uA (10nA resolution) and 1mA (100nA resolution). The Fluke 87V can do 10nA resolution if you put in in hi-res mode. The Brymen BM235 only does 100nA resolution.
The AN8002 lacks uA. The milliamp range has 10uA resolution.
Both have a separate jack for 10A. The AN8002 shares the main Volts, etc, jack for milliamps. In the case of the 8008, the 10A jack also does milliamps, and the main Volts jack is used for microamps.
In A/mA mode, there are 2 ranges: 1000mA (100uA resolution) and 10A (1mA resolution).
The AN8008 uses a separate ICL8069 voltage reference IC. No sign of anything like that in the AN8002 - presumably using a reference in the main IC?
I've initially compared the two models to my BM235 and 87V, using various DC voltage references, and the accuracy of both seems to be very good indeed. Will be interested to see if they hold their calibration over time.
I've not had a chance to do more detailed testing, so those are first impressions only. Forgive any errors - it's late!
For £15 delivered, it's astonishing.
All the best,
Mark
EDIT: Link to what looks like the OEM: http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144 (http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144)
-
I received my AN8008 today. It was ordered on June 29 from http://www.ebay.com/itm/282496420913 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/282496420913)
I just made some quick accuracy tests. The first attachment shows 10 volts from my upgraded AD688BQ voltage reference feeding both the AN8008 and my 34401A. The second attachment shows the 34401A connected to the AD688BQ the same way and the AN8008 connected between the AD688BQ's negative 10 and positive 10 volt outputs. The negative voltage from the AD688BQ precisely matches the positive voltage.
The shunt resistance of the AN8008 was 100.561 ohms when the meter was in the uA position and 0.0301 ohms when the meter was in the mA/A position.
Also attached are pictures of the meter's square wave output. I included both the lowest (50 Hz) and highest (5 kHz) frequencies as well as the 500 Hz center frequency.
I'll complete my accuracy tests later.
-
Neat images guys. Good to know about the accuracy too.
About the "True RMS" thing written, is it real or is it there just to look nice?
It seems they like to add it on a lot of meters, including this sub $10 one:
(http://i.imgur.com/T7svKUg.png)
-
Neat images guys. Good to know about the accuracy too.
About the "True RMS" thing written, is it real or is it there just to look nice?
It seems they like to add it on a lot of meters, including this sub $10 one:
(http://i.imgur.com/T7svKUg.png)
It is real, all these cheap DMM are based on Hycon HY12P65 DMM chipset.
datasheet
http://www.hycontek.com/wp-content/uploads/DS-HY12P65-EN.pdf (http://www.hycontek.com/wp-content/uploads/DS-HY12P65-EN.pdf)
T-RMS Bandwidth ~ 1.5kHz
-
Thanks crazyguy, good to know it's real for better AC reading.
-
It is real, all these cheap DMM are based on Hycon HY12P65 DMM chipset.
datasheet http://www.hycontek.com/wp-content/uploads/DS-HY12P65-EN.pdf (http://www.hycontek.com/wp-content/uploads/DS-HY12P65-EN.pdf)
T-RMS Bandwidth ~ 1.5kHz
Neat multimeter IC and.. it has UART pins...
AC measurement bandwidth is lower than I thought:
AC sine wave 0.5% error 20-1,500Hz and -3dB at 6kHz.
Square wave 0.5% error max. 100Hz
Triangle wave 0.5% error max. 1.2kHz
But the IC's filter settings can maybe tweaked in app firmware to do better.
-
I received my AN8008 today. It was ordered on June 29
Mine arrived today. Ordered 1st July.
>:(
-
Neat images guys. Good to know about the accuracy too.
About the "True RMS" thing written, is it real or is it there just to look nice?
It seems they like to add it on a lot of meters, including this sub $10 one:
Spend some time here:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/)
As you can see from the images AN8203 and VC921 looks slightly different. Don't know about the internal of the AN, but you can find some useful info around regarding the VC921. If you stay away from mains, it is certainly worth the price. Especially if you hack it and enable serial out and 6000 or 8000 scale lenght. Seems like the Chinese have come up with some really interesting chipsets for small money.
-
Anybody measure the open circuit voltage in diode test mode yet? Neither the eBay listings nor the specs on the Zotek site seem to give a value for that.
-
Anybody measure the open circuit voltage in diode test mode yet? Neither the eBay listings nor the specs on the Zotek site seem to give a value for that.
The diode test voltage is 3.223 volts.
The short detect voltage is 1.0070 volts.
The k ohm resistance measurement voltage appears to be the same 1.0070 volts.
The M ohm resistance measurement voltage is 0.5309 volts.
-
The M ohm resistance measurement voltage is 0.5309 volts.
I was going too fast on that one--the M ohm resistance measurement voltage is also 1.0070 volts unloaded. I forgot to use my high impedance electrometer for that...
-
The M ohm resistance measurement voltage is 0.5309 volts.
I was going too fast on that one--the M ohm resistance measurement voltage is also 1.0070 volts unloaded. I forgot to use my high impedance electrometer for that...
Thanks. I was kind of scratching my head about that, wondering why a DMM would output a lower voltage for a M ohm range than for a k ohm range. I don't know enough to know whether or not you'd expect that in a DMM, but it seemed counterintuitive.
-
How noisy is the meter when measuring microvolts? say shorting the leads what does the display read?
I'd like to see the accuracy comparison with a high end bench or hand held multimeter at the microvolts level. I mean i'm not expecting much considering its a $20 meter, but a bit of fun to see.
-
With the talk of True-RMS validity and accuracy I considered a good way to verify that feature. I thought that the simple way with a known result would be to measure the RMS voltage of a square wave. I chose a 3 volt peak-peak square wave. It has a computed RMS value of 2.1213203 volts. My measurements were:
V % Error
Agilent 34401A 2.12037 -0.04
Keithley 2015 2.1197 -0.08
Keysight U1252B 2.1208 -0.02
Aneng AN8008 2.112 -0.44
Uni-T UT210E 2.112 -0.44
Uni-T UT61E 2.1233 0.09
Mastech MS8218 2.1216 0.01
Fluke 96B 2.120 -0.06
Fluke 77 2.331 9.88
Circuit Sp CSI2010 2.35 10.78
RShack 22-186A 2.373 11.86
Triplett 60 2.14 0.88
I think that I can spot the meters without True-RMS. But, check out the reliable old Triplett 60 analog meter. Not bad!
Based on the readings above, is the Aneng AN8008 using the same IC as the UT210E?
Shorting the input jacks produces the following readings:
0.000 mV DC with a rare jump to 0.005 mV (nothing in-between)
0.000 mV AC
00.00 ohms
00.00 to 00.01 uA DC
00.00 uA AC
The above is with a 2 cm wire between the input jacks.
-
I'd like to see the accuracy comparison with a high end bench or hand held multimeter at the microvolts level.
The AN8008 uV accuracy is limited due to it just having 1 uV resolution. I can easily make mV comparisons:
34401A AN8008
2.4689 mV 2.477 mV (2.476 - 2.478)
4.9503 4.957
7.4172 7.423
9.8978 9.902
Those are actually uV readings with the most resolution possible--not bad.
Additional tests later.
-
Shorting the input jacks produces the following readings:
0.000 mV DC with a rare jump to 0.005 mV (nothing in-between)
Thanks for doing those tests, much appreciated.
I believe this is the first meter that I know of that can read down to the 1uV level less than around $100, apart from the Holdpeak HP-770d (which there isn't much information about around and dubious on the quality front) for $20 it's a bargain. Mind you those meters up around the $100 range are of course 50,000 count as well, which this isn't.
0.33% off your 34401A at worst on the mV level to 3 decimal places is impressive for a meter this cheap.
Looking forward to seeing if my unit (still on it's way) is this accurate, could be a very useful little meter.
-
I give the AN8008 an A+ for its low DC current readings. It had the same 0.01 uA resolution as my 34401A and U1252B have and the 0.25, 0.5, 0.75 and 1.0 uA readings were almost identical between the three. The AN8008 had the same stability for the 0.25 uA reading as the U1252B had. Both had a little better stability there compared to my 34401A.
I made a quick DC voltage reading comparison between the three and saw 5.00378V from my 34401A, 5.0043 from the U1252B and 5.001 V from the AN8008. <<< Corrected!
While it is rated to measure the frequency up to 10 MHz I had problems above 5 MHz. After getting a reading at 6 MHz with a bit larger signal level I stopped trying. The frequency measurement accuracy was good. I really liked the 1 mHz resolution below 10 Hz and 10 mHz resolution from there up to just below 100 Hz. Frequency readings below 1 Hz were difficult to make and only intermittently appeared. I didn't see much of a sensitivity change between sine and square waves.
Its low value capacitance measurement was limited by just having a nF scale as its lowest with the lack of a zeroing control.
It has passed my tests for good performance from a low cost meter.
I'll probably do a complete accuracy verification test over the weekend but that generally amounts to a lot of numbers which won't reveal much more.
-
... 5.00378V from my 34401A, 5.0043 from the U1252B and 5.001 V from the U1252B.
I'm guessing one of those U1252Bs was supposed to be AN8008? :)
-
Any hacks yet like extra buttons, UART etc.?
In the AN8002 model the UART pin was without bonding wire.
-
And what about swiftness of autoranging (Volts) - for example comparison with UT61e or Fluke 87V or Brymen BM235 ?
On a scale: very slow - slow - moderate - fast - very fast ...
And how long it takes to show value of resistor 1 Ohm, 10 Ohm, 1kOhm, 1MOhm ?
And the same with capacitance.
And REL button can be found on printed board?
-
I just did a 20min review video of the AN8008
-
I just did a 20min review video of the AN8008
How come everybody got their meter except me? :(
(will your next meter be using this chipset?)
-
I just did a 20min review video of the AN8008
Shorten it to two minutes and post it in the thread linked below, you might be in with a shot, you never know. ;) :D ;D
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/contests/giveaway-rohde-schwarz-rtb2004-oscilloscope/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/contests/giveaway-rohde-schwarz-rtb2004-oscilloscope/)
-
I just did a 20min review video of the AN8008
Shorten it to two minutes and post it in the thread linked below, you might be in with a shot, you never know. ;) :D ;D
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/contests/giveaway-rohde-schwarz-rtb2004-oscilloscope/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/contests/giveaway-rohde-schwarz-rtb2004-oscilloscope/)
:-DD
Good to see you back on form Muttley. :-+
-
If they can sell meters this complete for $17, how much would it cost to put in some MOVs, proper fuses, etc.?
Could somebody make a super-meter and sell it for $50?
How many UT-61Es are sold every year? That's the potential market size. :popcorn:
That would be something ;)
-
I intended too but completely forgot to put mains up its clacker.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdGQEVdxmQQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdGQEVdxmQQ)
-
It is supposed to have a hidden range for temperature on the mV selector. Is that true?
(http://olxua-ring05.akamaized.net/images_slandocomua/489958368_5_1000x700_tsifrovoy-multimetr-true-rms-zt109-an8008-9999-otschetov-bonus-harkovskaya-oblast.jpg)
-
It is supposed to have a hidden range for temperature on the mV selector. Is that true?
(http://olxua-ring05.akamaized.net/images_slandocomua/489958368_5_1000x700_tsifrovoy-multimetr-true-rms-zt109-an8008-9999-otschetov-bonus-harkovskaya-oblast.jpg)
I think you have to enable that in the EEPROM, not enabled from factory for that model.
( See my post on a previous page with links - https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us- (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-)$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1245000/#msg1245000 )
-
That makes sense. It is advertised as a bonus on a Russian site. Feature not available on the standard model:
http://www.olx.ua/obyavlenie/tsifrovoy-multimetr-true-rms-zt109-an8008-9999-otschetov-bonus-IDsPpev.html (http://www.olx.ua/obyavlenie/tsifrovoy-multimetr-true-rms-zt109-an8008-9999-otschetov-bonus-IDsPpev.html)
-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdGQEVdxmQQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdGQEVdxmQQ)
You paid $25?
You can get them for a lot less than that.
I intended too but completely forgot to put mains up its clacker.
Doesn't matter in the slightest.
-
Nice video. It definitely does seem like a nice meter.
That makes sense. It is advertised as a bonus on a Russian site. Feature not available on the standard model:
http://www.olx.ua/obyavlenie/tsifrovoy-multimetr-true-rms-zt109-an8008-9999-otschetov-bonus-IDsPpev.html (http://www.olx.ua/obyavlenie/tsifrovoy-multimetr-true-rms-zt109-an8008-9999-otschetov-bonus-IDsPpev.html)
Do you think we can expect a more expensive model with just this feature factory enabled? Or with some other small addons.
-
Do you think we can expect a more expensive model with just this feature factory enabled? Or with some other small addons.
Lets hope so!
-
Do you think we can expect a more expensive model with just this feature factory enabled? Or with some other small addons.
Lets hope so!
If you're considering value for the money, a temperature option has nice value (at least that's my personal opinion).
It appears also under the name "RM109", but the price is a bit high, about $30 on Ali and $50 on eBay right now.
-
I did some more basic testing last night - the write-up is here: http://golbornevintageradio.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?tid=5501&pid=69844#pid69844 (http://golbornevintageradio.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?tid=5501&pid=69844#pid69844)
As you'll see, I found a bug when measuring frequency when the selector is set to V (not a problem on the AN8002). It's OK on Hz though. It's not as sensitive as the AN8002. In terms of frequency, it goes out to 80MHz. It might go further, but my RF generator tops out at +17dBm. Joe Smith got 200MHz from the AN8002, but the level wasn't stated.
The amplitude of the square wave is very much equal to the battery voltage.
The AC -3dB point is 3kHz. I did some testing at 100Hz to see how good the RMS converter is. As good as a Fluke 87V, in short. Obviously the Fluke is better at higher frequencies - the AN8002/8 is specified to 200Hz.
As far as I can tell, before these Aneng/Zotek meters came along, this sort of money only got you 2000-count meters, and certainly no sign of true-RMS. These really have shook up the £10-15 market. My AN8002 has been flawless over the last few months, and despite the expected lack of safety features, it appears to be pretty rugged according to Joe Smith's tests. Indeed, it appeared to pass tests that the Fluke 87V didn't. OK, more sampling would be required before anyone reached any conclusions, but first impressions are very positive indeed.
Does anyone know anything about the internal switch? On the AN8002, it's range.
-
Well, after watching Daves video I just.... bought another one :popcorn:
-
Well, after watching Daves video I just.... bought another one :popcorn:
I'd be interested to see how well they compare. With everyone buying these and putting them through various tests, it's still somewhat of an open question whether the results are repeatable from one unit to the next. I ordered one yesterday, and was almost tempted to buy a second, just for an extra measure of confidence. Especially with the uV/uA resolution being so rare for meters at this price level.
-
Does anyone know anything about the internal switch? On the AN8002, it's range.
it was tried in a utube review, it is fully funtional manual range override.
more interesting question is why it's there - is it used in the calibration process??
-
just arguing with someone here,
the fuse in a meter is to save the user - not the meter.
person here had mA range selected and accidentally probed a 1.5A 5v supply - blew the fuse and the switch-pad off the board. :palm:
now he says the meter is shit - LOL :-DD
-
now he says the meter is shit - LOL :-DD
Well, I like to believe that everyone here knows what we are buying, at least I do, the merits and limitations of the meter.
-
my point is, if you exceed the spec and it blows - that does not mean it's shit, the specs are there for a reason!
-
person here had mA range selected and accidentally probed a 1.5A 5v supply - blew the fuse and the switch-pad off the board.
Aneng is making an educational product. For merely $20 that person will now be much more likely to remember what not to do next time...
-
i doubt that, we was complaining that his fluke could handle 20A pulses on the 10A range, therefore any meter that cant must be shit.
makes me wonder what that fluke has in it's fuse clips!!!
-
A 10A fuse SHOULD be able to handle 20A pulses, if the pulse is very short.
-
just arguing with someone here,
the fuse in a meter is to save the user - not the meter.
person here had mA range selected and accidentally probed a 1.5A 5v supply - blew the fuse and the switch-pad off the board. :palm:
now he says the meter is shit - LOL :-DD
This guy is full of it, how do you blow a 10A fuse when the burden resistor (on mA) is kinda high, and on 5V?!
-
Well, after watching Daves video I just.... bought another one :popcorn:
I'd be interested to see how well they compare. With everyone buying these and putting them through various tests, it's still somewhat of an open question whether the results are repeatable from one unit to the next.
Are you saying Dave just got lucky? On all ranges?
-
just arguing with someone here,
the fuse in a meter is to save the user - not the meter.
person here had mA range selected and accidentally probed a 1.5A 5v supply - blew the fuse and the switch-pad off the board. :palm:
now he says the meter is shit - LOL :-DD
This guy is full of it, how do you blow a 10A fuse when the burden resistor (on mA) is kinda high, and on 5V?!
read it again,
he blew the aneng8002 with 1.5A on the mA setting,
the 20A on the 10A range was on a fluke.
he's a meter-abuser!
-
Oh, I was trying to figure out how the person wrecked it.
On that note, I don't see these tiny fuses for sale or a name for the series?
-
i'v seen them for sale, no idea on the spec though.
on the bright side, looking at the meter i think if you move the bottom clip down to the terminal you can use 20mm fuses.
-
My meter came in from AliExpress ANENG store (https://www.aliexpress.com/store/919484). Price has gone up since I ordered it now USD $24.18 and supposedly 29% off the regular $USD 34.
Took it apart and did the usual ritual IPA + Q-tip clean of flux, slag, solder balls. I resoldered the fuse clips, they had no solder on the top layer. Overall the build quality is good and seems a new level for china. Next I'll run it.
Replacement fuses in North America... I have 10A for current and 200mA for input.
Littelfuse 3.6x10mm fuses (http://www.littelfuse.com/products/fuses/cartridge-fuses/3-6x10mm-fuses.aspx) and Bussmann/Eaton (http://www.cooperindustries.com/content/dam/public/bussmann/Electronics/Resources/product-datasheets/bus-elx-ds-10404-c310t-sc.pdf), Schurter SPT 3.67x10; This size is 250VAC interrupt-rated...
But all have pigtails :(
So either never blow the fuse, or I'll try the 20mm mod. instead of waiting for fuses from china.
-
Well, after watching Daves video I just.... bought another one :popcorn:
I'd be interested to see how well they compare. With everyone buying these and putting them through various tests, it's still somewhat of an open question whether the results are repeatable from one unit to the next.
Are you saying Dave just got lucky? On all ranges?
Not at all. I'm saying maybe Dave just got a generally high quality unit. You wouldn't expect that a meter that's dead on at 5V would be WAY off at 5mV, although I suppose it's possible. But with such a cheap meter, I wouldn't be at all surprised if there's some significant variation in quality from one unit to the next. Maybe he gets one AN8008 that measures 5.000V with his voltage reference set to 5V, but then he orders a second AN8008 and it reads 4.986V. Would that really surprise you for a $19 meter? Even Fluke, Agilent, etc, don't have perfect production processes, QC, etc. So maybe one out of every 10,000 Fluke units is not up to snuff, or something like that. What's your guess as to what Aneng's percentage is? That's all I was getting at. A sample size greater than N=1 (using the same set of references, verified with the same high quality bench meter, etc) would be interesting to see.
Edit: Given that one horribly bad solder joint that Dave showed in the video, I don't see why one would expect consistent high quality on every AN8008 unit.
-
But all have pigtails :(
So either never blow the fuse, or I'll try the 20mm mod. instead of waiting for fuses from china.
I bought replacements from RS with pigtails, flushcutters fixed that.
-
Does anyone know anything about the internal switch? On the AN8002, it's range.
it was tried in a utube review, it is fully funtional manual range override.
more interesting question is why it's there - is it used in the calibration process??
Yes, it's a range button on the AN8002 - as I say. I tried it myself months ago.
However, what about the AN8008? Nothing happens when you short it. It's also connected to one of the test pads (PT1.1, which is the same in the AN8002) - so yes, perhaps it is part of the calibration procedure? Looking at the DTM0660 data sheet, you need 3 keys to operate the calibration procedure, and I guess it seems likely that the IC is in the AN8008 works in a similar way...
The datasheet states that "PT1.1" is pin 23 of the IC, which is described as "Data input/output, SPI communication port (SCE), OTP read/write port (PSDI), interrupt source (INITI)".
-
Greetings all,
has anybody tested the burden voltage on the low current ranges?
-
However, what about the AN8008? Nothing happens when you short it.
Not that I could see.
-
has anybody tested the burden voltage on the low current ranges?
The burden voltage is dependent on the current.
The shunt resistance of the AN8008 was 100.561 ohms when the meter was in the uA position and 0.0301 ohms when the meter was in the mA/A position.
-
As somewhat referred to previously, the AN8008 is a poor meter to use between 1 - 100 mA. I just completed my detailed accuracy verification of the lower current readings. For an approximately 1 mA current reading I had the choice of 989.8 uA (1.01% low due to the 100.561 meter insertion resistance) or 1.0 mA. Yes, that's two digits, 10% error represented by the least significant digit. That's the best resolution possible just above 1 mA. The -1% uA error continued down to around 200 uA. When the reading was corrected for the added resistance, the uA accuracy was typically below 0.1%.
The DC voltage reading accuracy was typically 0.06% The resistance reading accuracy was typically below 0.3%. Most of my resistors used for accuracy verification were rated at 0.01% accuracy.
More tests tomorrow.
-
Experimenting with DCV using a homemade precision DC reference, I find the readings are a bit quirky.
-ve input always reads a few counts less than flipping the leads.
I see the (long-term) averaging algorithm has hysteresis of at least +/- one count, and you can get it to "stick" either way. (If you've ever written code to average A/D readings, you know how hard it is to react to fast changes and also filter out noise).
The meter seems to jump to a reading based on the first (fast) voltage sample, then after 2-4 seconds the long-term average adjusts the reading. Since the long-term average has hysteresis, it may or may not correct. It seems to depend on the difference between the samples, or if the sign changed.
What I am saying is if the meter reads 5.000V right away, it stays there.
If the meter reads 4.997V initially, it may slowly move to 4.998V or 4.999V.
If the meter reads 4.964V initially, after 2 seconds it corrects to 4.998V
You can try making glitches- connect/disconnect the leads quickly and notice the readings are inconsistent by about 3 counts. Not a big deal, I 'm used to getting the same number regardless.
-
what I don't understand - considering any DMM based on DTM0660L chipset can be hacked just with changing few bytes in the EEPROM from 6000 to 9999 counts and that is widely known, is there any real difference in accuracy between AN8008 (ZT109) and for example AN8002 (ZT102) hacked to 9999 counts? or hacked HoldPeak HP890CN (the OEM revision of HoldPeak HP-770HC)?
-
what I don't understand - considering any DMM based on DTM0660L chipset can be hacked just with changing few bytes in the EEPROM from 6000 to 9999 counts and that is widely known, is there any real difference in accuracy between AN8008 (ZT109) and for example AN8002 (ZT102) hacked to 9999 counts? or hacked HoldPeak HP890CN (the OEM revision of HoldPeak HP-770HC)?
For those not aware of the hack that matura713 is referring to, which is for the AN8002 ZT102, and it's various other BM0660L based meters, the translated datasheet here http://www.kerrywong.com/2016/04/03/dtm0660-datasheet-translated/ (http://www.kerrywong.com/2016/04/03/dtm0660-datasheet-translated/) details the EEPROM data amongst other stuff, which happens to include the # of counts. This post http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1130725&postcount=1874 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1130725&postcount=1874) has a link to a (java) program which supposedly allows changing the eeprom settings in an easy manner, I have not tried it (err, run random executable linked from Russian website... might do that in a virtual machine) so I have no idea how it works.
Note that this is for the DTM0660 based meters, this new AN8008 is supposedly DM1106EN based I think, Google hasn't revealed a datasheet for it.
-
Note that this is for the DTM0660 based meters, this new AN8008 is supposedly DM1106EN based I think, Google hasn't revealed a datasheet for it.
yes, but isn't the chipset/hardware difference only that "square wave output" feature on AN8008 (ZT109)? and everything else is exactly the same? I mean (AN8002 + EEPROM hack to 9999 counts) is equal to (AN8008 - digital square wave feature) or there is real difference in accuracy? (BTW, on first glance even both PCBs of AN8008 and AN8002 looks very very similar).
in any way, I am sure soon people will release EEPROM dumps from AN8008 and there are such from AN8002 for a long time, as well everyone having any of those DMMs can make EEPROM dumps very easy.
in any way, what I would be interested to see is comparison with any of the previous DTM0660-based meters hacked to 9999 counts and AN8008, because for example for only several USD more you can get UT139C, hack it to 9999 counts and that has adequate quality and input protection as well.
This post http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1130725&postcount=1874 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1130725&postcount=1874) has a link to a (java) program which supposedly allows changing the eeprom settings in an easy manner, I have not tried it (err, run random executable linked from Russian website... might do that in a virtual machine) so I have no idea how it works.
you can always use hex-editor and modify your EEPROM dump manually, but in general I guess for most people here it's ultra simple hack: dump the EEPROM of your DTM0660 based DMM, modify it, write it back to the EEPROM chip in your DMM.
-
in any way, I am sure soon people will release EEPROM dumps from AN8008
http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126917&postcount=1827 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126917&postcount=1827)
-
in any way, I am sure soon people will release EEPROM dumps from AN8008
http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126917&postcount=1827 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126917&postcount=1827)
haha, yeah, the Russians already did it and Google translates the comment in Russain there to "that this is a complete analog DTM0660, well or some advanced version."
which is exactly my point and suspicion, either the same or maybe the same + square wave generator. So, for me the only question - is there any real difference in accuracy compared to DTM0660 hacked to 9999 or not. Because if not, then there are much better DMM for basically the same money than AN8008.
[EDIT] I Google translate more from the Russian forum: what I got is adding temperature hack to AN8008 is the same as for DTM0660, i.e. the same bytes in the EEPROM.
also, a note was made there that EEPROM of DMM model "BSIDE ADM08" has in its EEPROM data for the mode setting that are not consistent with and described in the datasheet, but i believe "BSIDE ADM08" is DTM0660-based and they mentioned that to make a point DTM0660 datasheet that is floating around is simply not complete.
-
I'm also interested in any differences between a modded AN8002 and this. I also don't know if the lower models that look the same on the outside perhaps also use the chip (e.g. AN8000/8004).
in any way, I am sure soon people will release EEPROM dumps from AN8008 and there are such from AN8002 for a long time, as well everyone having any of those DMMs can make EEPROM dumps very easy.
But, I'd also like to add that not everyone (as in 100%) here can easily dump and flash EEPROMs. Maybe it's almost everyone, but perhaps someone who is not so experienced with flashing also bought the multimeter? :)
I don't even have a dumping and flashing tool (I guess those might be cheap and USB based these days), and if I did, wouldn't know the procedure (e..g. if I have to desolder/resolder the chip, or attach some jumper wires, or even do it in circuit without disconnecting things). Someone did mention a bit about it here, and there might be tutorials either for the specific multimeter or just general procedure, so it might be possible, but anyhow still seems like a risky prospect unless you're experienced.
That said, I'm carefully reading and considering all of the info here. To me, most of the AN models seem pretty great, even the 6000 count ones (with temperature -8002).
-
Because if not, then there are much better DMM for basically the same money than AN8008.
Again for the curious, the first post of that russian thread ( http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135) ) has a fairly comprehensive list of the meters, and various reverse engineering and hacks of the 0660 based meters.
-
But, I'd also like to add that not everyone (as in 100%) here can easily dump and flash EEPROMs. Maybe it's almost everyone, but perhaps someone who is not so experienced with flashing also bought the multimeter? :)
so it might be possible, but anyhow still seems like a risky prospect unless you're experienced.
if you look at some of my posts in this forum, you will see i am complete amateur, my knowledge of electronics is below what i would consider a very basic level. however, dump/modify/flash EEPROMs I consider very easy, but maybe because I can program in several programing languages and thus reading and writing memory feels like something more natural to me than other common electronic tasks.
anyway, if you have no experience, I believe the easiest is to get cheap USB EEPROM programmer like CH341A, it's about 3 USD delivered and 10 x EEPROM chips - they cost less than 1 USD delivered - 24C02N is EEPROM chips compatible with DMMs we're discussing here like AN8002 and AN8008.
so, you can even prepare few 24C02N with EEPROM dumps available online, then desolder from the DMM you're hacking and keep your original EEPROM chip and its content as backup and just solder the new EEPROM chip you prepared with your programmer to your DMM - that makes the risk to minimum or basically no risk, assuming you can solder.
-
Because if not, then there are much better DMM for basically the same money than AN8008.
Again for the curious, the first post of that russian thread ( http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135) ) has a fairly comprehensive list of the meters, and various reverse engineering and hacks of the 0660 based meters.
and just for completeness as that is good 0660 list, the known DMMs with the "new" DM1106EN, which so far looks like slightly modified version of 0660 chipset is:
* BSIDE ADM08
* PeekMeter PM18
* AN8008 (ZT109) --> discussed in the forum thread here
oh and BTW, in case someone don't know 0660 chipset is cheap Chinese clone of HYCON HY12P65 and I believe HY12P65 is in very reputable DMMs including the one that is EEVBlog branded.
-
if you look at some of my posts in this forum, you will see i am complete amateur, my knowledge of electronics is below what i would consider a very basic level. however, dump/modify/flash EEPROMs I consider very easy, but maybe because I can program in several programing languages and thus reading and writing memory feels like something more natural to me than other common electronic tasks.
anyway, if you have no experience, I believe the easiest is to get cheap USB EEPROM programmer like CH341A, it's about 3 USD delivered and 10 x EEPROM chips - they cost less than 1 USD delivered - 24C02N is EEPROM chips compatible with DMMs we're discussing here like AN8002 and AN8008.
so, you can even prepare few 24C02N with EEPROM dumps available online, then desolder from the DMM you're hacking and keep your original EEPROM chip and its content as backup and just solder the new EEPROM chip you prepared with your programmer to your DMM - that makes the risk to minimum or basically no risk, assuming you can solder.
IIRC the calibration parameters are in the EEPROM. So you need the meters original dump for modifications.
-
I used a modified PicKit 3 clone to read and write the EEPROM in the AN8002.
-
IIRC the calibration parameters are in the EEPROM. So you need the meters original dump for modifications.
good reminder, it's correct, but from my point of view it's another advantage - if you want to calibrate it better by yourself.
-
My meter came in from AliExpress ANENG store (https://www.aliexpress.com/store/919484). Price has gone up since I ordered it now USD $24.18 and supposedly 29% off the regular $USD 34.
Ooooh, they make a cute miniature multimeter (https://es.aliexpress.com/store/product/ANENG-Mini-Digital-Multimeter-with-Buzzer-Overload-protection-Pocket-Voltage-Ampere-Ohm-Meter-DC-AC-LCD/919484_32810069923.html?spm=a219c.12010108.1000016.1.RFQf7H&isOrigTitle=true) as well. :) (with teardown pic in the store!)
Edit1: Reading the small print, that meter needs a weird 12V battery. And ... what the hell is this? I never saw that on a meter before.
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=332116;image)
Edit2: I also found/ordered something else they make that's very interesting but I'm keeping it secret for a while seeing as how everybody else gets their stuff a week ahead of me. (no my AN8008 didn't arrive yet >:( )
Replacement fuses in North America... I have 10A for current and 200mA for input.
Littelfuse 3.6x10mm fuses (http://www.littelfuse.com/products/fuses/cartridge-fuses/3-6x10mm-fuses.aspx) and Bussmann/Eaton (http://www.cooperindustries.com/content/dam/public/bussmann/Electronics/Resources/product-datasheets/bus-elx-ds-10404-c310t-sc.pdf), Schurter SPT 3.67x10; This size is 250VAC interrupt-rated...
But all have pigtails :(
Can't you just cut them off? :-//
-
For an approximately 1 mA current reading I had the choice of 989.8 uA (1.01% low due to the 100.561 meter insertion resistance) or 1.0 mA. Yes, that's two digits, 10% error represented by the least significant digit. That's the best resolution possible just above 1 mA. The -1% uA error continued down to around 200 uA. When the reading was corrected for the added resistance, the uA accuracy was typically below 0.1%.
I can live with that. I don't think I need to measure 10mA with two decimal places very often.
Besides, nobody around here owns just one multimeter. I'm sure you own other meters if you need that particular reading.
(or use a shunt)
-
I don't think I need to measure 10mA with two decimal places very often.
You set a low standard to meet. My accuracy verification tests showed that the AN8008 current reading accuracy ranged from 2.1 - 6.6% for readings between 2 - 10 mA. Many economy analog meters can do better than that! While you can't expect perfection from a $20 meter, one which can provide an accurate 20 uA reading should be able to read 2 mA accurately. Being required to get a different meter when a reading which you are peaking goes above 1 mA doesn't make sense.
I'm glad that I purchased the meter. It's a handy small meter for certain tasks.
-
Fungus you are not alone! I have also been waiting patiently,enviously and increasingly jealously for this electronic dream since ordering on 30th June! Hopefully both ours will arrive very soon!
-
Did someone measure temperature stability of the meter? Will it be within specs at say 0C or +40C?
Although I think it is possible to just put in better resistors if you really need it. The reference seems to be OK.
Square wave generator is useful for checking different speakers and buzzers. I'm surprised nobody pointed it out.
P.S. It's funny to see people here discussing a thread on kazus.ru. But yeah, their discussion seems to be the most comprehensive one on that matter. I can try to translate something for you if google fails.
-
Being required to get a different meter when a reading which you are peaking goes above 1 mA doesn't make sense.
True, but owning a second meter is almost a requirement anyway and this one measures everything else] about as well a a 7.5 digit bench meter (according to Dave's video).
For $17-18? Owning one of these is a no-brainer. I'd almost go as far as saying "it's a UT61E killer for a quarter of the price".
(until the next one comes along - this is ANENG's third meter this year based on this chipset)
Square wave generator is useful for checking different speakers and buzzers. I'm surprised nobody pointed it out.
I did, in the main thread. :popcorn:
-
yes, but isn't the chipset/hardware difference only that "square wave output" feature on AN8008 (ZT109)? and everything else is exactly the same? I mean (AN8002 + EEPROM hack to 9999 counts) is equal to (AN8008 - digital square wave feature) or there is real difference in accuracy? (BTW, on first glance even both PCBs of AN8008 and AN8002 looks very very similar).
You can't get a 9999 reading of AC voltage with the DTM0660 chipset. Around 8500 seems to be the limit, depening of the crest factor.
Reading and writing the PROM in DTM0660 is easy. Even I have managed that.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/)
-
And ... what the hell is this? I never saw that on a meter before.
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=332116;image)
The datasheet says battery test for 9V and 1.5V. I guess 40mA load for 1.5V and 24mA for 9V.
-
You can't get a 9999 reading of AC voltage with the DTM0660 chipset. Around 8500 seems to be the limit, depening of the crest factor.
thanks, that means DM1106EN is really upgraded version of DTM0660...
-
The datasheet says battery test for 9V and 1.5V. I guess 40mA load for 1.5V and 24mA for 9V.
More useful than a square wave output! :)
(Now I need one of those as well. :scared: )
PS: Do you think I should send one to Batteroo for their test lab?
-
The datasheet says battery test for 9V and 1.5V. I guess 40mA load for 1.5V and 24mA for 9V.
More useful than a square wave output! :)
(Now I need one of those as well. :scared: )
PS: Do you think I should send one to Batteroo for their test lab?
That is the cheapest meter I see with battery tester ($3.7).
I just wonder where do you install the fuse as suggested:
(http://i.imgur.com/QYHk9Mb.jpg)
Edit: Maybe the little spot below the screw on the right? - Looks like a diode sign.
Speaking of small meters, this one has a nicer (larger) display:
(http://i.imgur.com/cdBuC9G.png)
But otherwise it's has no battery testing.
-
I just wonder where do you install the fuse as suggested:
(http://i.imgur.com/QYHk9Mb.jpg)
The PCB trace goes up under the buzzer. I expect that's where it is. ;)
I like the way you can take the back off without stressing the wires going to the buzzer. A buzzer holder costs money, it's good to see they aren't cutting any corners. :popcorn:
-
They probably could get the complete piezo with the casing and leads cheaper than the cost of the bare piezo, the added mouldings in the case dies along with the 3 stakes or drops of glue and the 2 springs.
-
As somewhat referred to previously, the AN8008 is a poor meter to use between 1 - 100 mA. I just completed my detailed accuracy verification of the lower current readings. For an approximately 1 mA current reading I had the choice of 989.8 uA (1.01% low due to the 100.561 meter insertion resistance) or 1.0 mA. Yes, that's two digits, 10% error represented by the least significant digit. That's the best resolution possible just above 1 mA. The -1% uA error continued down to around 200 uA. When the reading was corrected for the added resistance, the uA accuracy was typically below 0.1%.
The DC voltage reading accuracy was typically 0.06% The resistance reading accuracy was typically below 0.3%. Most of my resistors used for accuracy verification were rated at 0.01% accuracy.
More tests tomorrow.
I got slightly better results from mine.
In uA, the error varied between -0.25% and -0.47%.
In mA, mine met the 1.5% spec. The worst error was at 5mA, where I got 4%, but of course, 1 count is 2% at 5mA. Factor in the "3 counts" part of the specification, and 5.2 is indeed OK for 5.0mA. Elsewhere, it was comfortably within 1%.
Down at the sub-10mA end of the scale, the voltages from the 0.01 ohm shunt are tiny, resulting in 10uV per milliamp - so they're really taking advantage of the high voltage resolution/sensitivity to achieve this. The AN8002 certainly does better in the 1-10mA range, but of course lacks uA.
Personally, I would have preferred it if they'd not bothered with the square wave output, and used the switch position for mA, with a different shunt.
-
Square wave generator is useful for checking different speakers and buzzers. I'm surprised nobody pointed it out.
Sadly not as useful as you might think...
As I mentioned earlier, the square wave comes from quite a high source impedance (about 2k). So by the time you've fed that into an 8 ohm loudspeaker, there's hardly any voltage there. I tried a very sensitive 15 ohm speaker, and you have to hold it to your ear to hear anything from it.
However, it does work on piezo sounders :-+
-
Square wave generator is useful for checking different speakers and buzzers. I'm surprised nobody pointed it out.
Sadly not as useful as you might think...
As I mentioned earlier, the square wave comes from quite a high source impedance (about 2k). So by the time you've fed that into an 8 ohm loudspeaker, there's hardly any voltage there. I tried a very sensitive 15 ohm speaker, and you have to hold it to your ear to hear anything from it.
However, it does work on piezo sounders :-+
Noob question: I seem to recall reading somewhere that square waves are bad for speakers because the flat parts look like DC, and DC ruins speakers. And supposedly that's why clipping is bad as well, because it starts to look like a square wave, which is too much like DC. Not being an electronics guy, I just thought, hmm, well sounds plausible. Granted, I'm guessing it probably doesn't matter much for tiny piezo speakers and such. Also, I'm guessing this little multimeter square wave doesn't have nearly enough power to ruin a speaker, regardless.
But is there some truth to this, or is this just one of those audiophile myths that get thrown around?
-
P.S. It's funny to see people here discussing a thread on kazus.ru. But yeah, their discussion seems to be the most comprehensive one on that matter. I can try to translate something for you if google fails.
That is great offer, really! What would be nice for us non-russian speaking people is if you could give a hint when something interesting is discussed there. Google translate is usually OK if you know what you are translating, but quite often interesting things are "hidden" in a lot of text so it goes under the radar. One thing is that the language is different, but when the alphabet is different too, it becomes difficult to spot such things.
-
It's just to bad for the current, which blows my mind because the voltage ranges are fine.
I was just wondering, wouldn't be an idea to develop a small daughter board to provide the correct input protection and maybe some extra extra tweaks to get a better current range?
-
It's just too bad for the current...
Place a 1 ohm resistor across a Pomona 1330-2 (or similar), plug that into the AN8008 ground and voltage inputs, connect the current measurement wires to the top of the 1330-2 and the mV reading = mA.
It would be nice if that wasn't required, however.
Adding a battery test function could be done the same way.
-
If this meter is lying around with its false ratings and someone picks it up to use it where they need the real protection because they see the marks, it could kill them or injure them severely.
I seriously never understand this statement?? :-//
Worst thing that could happen is a spark inside a plastic case (= multimeter).
That's absolutely not enough to "KILL" someone.
In my whole professional career I have blown up many things, have seen sparks everywhere and have been shocked more times than my hands can count.
It hurts, but for normal healthy human beings, not walking bare foot on wet soil and not being pinched close to the heart, it's absolutely nonsense to say that this is "super dangerous".
The most dangerous part is that scare up people when it happens and in that moment maybe fall off a ladder.
That could even happen with a decent professional meter.
Only thing you can say, is that it's very inconvenient and 'dangerous' in a sense that you simply don't know what you can rely on.
For someone who is using this multimeter behind a fused line (like at home or a desk), it's not much of a deal.
For someone who is working professionally with high power high voltage lines, which aren't always directly fused, it's a whole different story.
But in these situations you're only allowed to use certified gear anyway.
-
I finally got inside of the meter since the AC current measurements don't seem very stable. I haven't seen a poor connection yet which might be causing that. Regarding:
Place a 1 ohm resistor across a Pomona 1330-2...
There is already a 1 ohm resistor inside of the meter ready to serve that purpose. The 100 ohm shunt resistance for uA current measurement actually consists of a 99 ohm resistor in series with a one ohm resistor. With a little rewiring...
The meter must have been changed from mA current to uA, robbing the full resolution mA measurement capability. On the switch side of the circuit board the voltage, uA, etc input is labeled "V/R/F/mA/Hz/C." Yes, that is mA and C, not uA and square wave.
The board is labeled ZT109 on the switch side. See: http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144 (http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144)
I'll have to look for other secrets.
-
I finally got inside of the meter since the AC current measurements don't seem very stable.
While the two digit ammeter for 1 - 10 mA DC readings might have limited value, it is of no use for AC readings in that range.
While I had reasonable accuracy on the AC uA readings from 10 to 1000 uA, things fell apart when I tried to read 1000 uA as 1 mA AC. The AN8008 showed zero mA for that measurement. My next test measurement was at 3.3 mA. The AN8008 generally stayed at a reading of zero with an occasional jump up only to soon return to zero.
My next step is at 10 mA. By then I had a steady reading which was 8% low. At 30 mA the meter became useful with a reading which was only 1% low. By 75 mA and above the meter's surprising accuracy returned with the accuracy typically below 0.2%.
-
I finally got inside of the meter since the AC current measurements don't seem very stable.
While the two digit ammeter for 1 - 10 mA DC readings might have limited value, it is of no use for AC readings in that range.
While I had reasonable accuracy on the AC uA readings from 10 to 1000 uA, things fell apart when I tried to read 1000 uA as 1 mA AC. The AN8008 showed zero mA for that measurement. My next test measurement was at 3.3 mA. The AN8008 generally stayed at a reading of zero with an occasional jump up only to soon return to zero.
My next step is at 10 mA. By then I had a steady reading which was 8% low. At 30 mA the meter became useful with a reading which was only 1% low. By 75 mA and above the meter's surprising accuracy returned with the accuracy typically below 0.2%.
IMHO, it is very common that TRMS measurement at most multimeters works only at about >5% of the range.
It is usually stated in manual.
Only exception is thermo TRMS converter at some precision meters.
This is the very problem of this meter AC current measuring in these missing current ranges. If only this TRMS converter could be switched off sometimes manually, that would help.
-
The true RMS error is usually due to a DC offset in the RMS converter. This offset disappears at higher values because sqrt(ACV^2 + offset^2) tends to ACV if ACV >> offset (which is also why you can not subtract the offset by measuring the output with shorted inputs). So I would indeed not expect good performance near the bottom of the range.
Bypassing the TRMS converter is rarely supported (exception: some meters for the military since they still have old procedures that require an average-responding meter). I guess you could take out the TRMS chip and replace it by a precision rectifier, but that would destroy any TRMS ability and seems like an awful lot of work for this cheap meter.
-
In mA, mine met the 1.5% spec. The worst error was at 5mA, where I got 4%, but of course, 1 count is 2% at 5mA. Factor in the "3 counts" part of the specification, and 5.2 is indeed OK for 5.0mA. Elsewhere, it was comfortably within 1%.
I'd be happy with that.
Personally, I would have preferred it if they'd not bothered with the square wave output, and used the switch position for mA, with a different shunt.
Or move the lower ranges up by a factor of 10. How many people really need to measure nanoamps?
As I mentioned earlier, the square wave comes from quite a high source impedance (about 2k). So by the time you've fed that into an 8 ohm loudspeaker, there's hardly any voltage there. I tried a very sensitive 15 ohm speaker, and you have to hold it to your ear to hear anything from it.
Something else I won't have to bother to check when mine finally arrives. >:(
(I should have stopped reading this thread a few pages ago)
Noob question: I seem to recall reading somewhere that square waves are bad for speakers because the flat parts look like DC, and DC ruins speakers.
Only true if there's a lot of amps available. In this case there isn't, there's a 2k resistor between the battery and the speaker.
It can be a good idea to add a capacitor in series with the speaker to prevent long periods of DC from damaging the speaker (the capacitor will charge up after a short period of time and block the DC).
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=332361;image)
(image chosen randomly from google)
-
Edit1: Reading the small print, that meter needs a weird 12V battery.
I have a similar unit, it uses a 12V battery, same used in many car remotes. Wouldn't call this an issue, but battery costs like half of DMM. I replace it every two-three years or so. It's only 2000 counts, but this is good-enough for most my purposes.
-
Edit1: Reading the small print, that meter needs a weird 12V battery.
I have a similar unit, it uses a 12V battery, same used in many car remotes. Wouldn't call this an issue, but battery costs like half of DMM. I replace it every two-three years or so. It's only 2000 counts, but this is good-enough for most my purposes.
On eBay, the cheapest I could find is about $1 for 1 or $2 for 5 batteries (I guess shipping comes into play). That said, I guess it shouldn't be far too much more expensive locally, if you search around. So, even the cheapest is probably about 1/4 of the meter. But 9v batteries are not much cheaper (if not more expensive) and with these cheap meters, a battery is always a good part of the price of the meter. What can you do. Maybe you could modify it to work with a cheap 3.7v Lipo, but I'm not sure if that's a good idea or not.
-
It's just to bad for the current, which blows my mind because the voltage ranges are fine.
It's always a good idea to own more than one meter anyway, so that:
a) You can take measurements that need two meters (eg. power)
b) You can see two values in a circuit simultaneously (can be useful, eg. with batteries so you can watch the battery voltage under load)
c) You can occasionally check meter readings against each other. If you see a weird reading, how do you know the problem isn't the meter? There's no substitute for a second opinion, even if you own a Fluke 87V (in fact I'd have more overall confidence in my readings if I owned two of these than if I owned a single Fluke)
I was just wondering, wouldn't be an idea to develop a small daughter board to provide the correct input protection and maybe some extra extra tweaks to get a better current range?
Or ... if this is super-important to you then make sure your second/third meter has a suitable mA range. It's simply not worth building "daughter boards" when an AN8002 costs $15.
-
I finally got inside of the meter since the AC current measurements don't seem very stable.
While the two digit ammeter for 1 - 10 mA DC readings might have limited value, it is of no use for AC readings in that range.
While I had reasonable accuracy on the AC uA readings from 10 to 1000 uA, things fell apart when I tried to read 1000 uA as 1 mA AC. The AN8008 showed zero mA for that measurement. My next test measurement was at 3.3 mA. The AN8008 generally stayed at a reading of zero with an occasional jump up only to soon return to zero.
My next step is at 10 mA. By then I had a steady reading which was 8% low. At 30 mA the meter became useful with a reading which was only 1% low. By 75 mA and above the meter's surprising accuracy returned with the accuracy typically below 0.2%.
Mine is better than yours here as well. I wonder if I'm lucky, you're unlucky, or this is just the sort of sample-to-sample variation we have to expect at this price point?
On uA AC, mine was spot-on when compared with a Fluke 87V. Really, no more than 2 or 3 counts away in both ranges, right down to the smallest signals. That impressed me, to be honest.
On mA AC, then yes, it's not brilliant at very small currents:
| Fluke 87V | AN8008 | Error |
| 1.03mA | 0.0mA | - |
| 3.00mA | 0.0mA | - |
| 4.01mA | 2.0mA | -50.1% |
| 5.06mA | 3.6mA | -28.6% |
| 6.06mA | 4.8mA | -20% |
| 7.07mA | 6.1mA | -13.7% |
| 8.05mA | 7.3mA | -9.3% |
| 10.08mA | 9.5mA | -5.8% |
| 15.01mA | 14.6mA | -2.7% |
| 20.11mA | 19.7mA | -2% |
| 30.56mA | 30.2mA | -1.2% |
So mine comes into spec at 30mA, and seems to hold it pretty well above that. I didn't try very high currents as that would have meant plugging up an amplifier, etc...
I tested with a 100Hz sine wave from an old Wavetek 162 function generator. My readings were stable within a count at all points - I wonder if noise was an issue for you?
Instinctively, I would treat all AC readings with suspicion when so near to the bottom of the range, but for beginners who pick up this meter, it's good to highlight this. Obviously the AN8002 is the one to buy for measuring currents in this region - buy one of each :-+ The fact they're different colours helps (well, me at least) when doing something involving multiple meters, which is why if I bought a second BM235, I'd get the "vanilla" version with the red holster...
Oh, earlier I mentioned 1.5% for the current spec. That's for the AN8002 - I'd picked up the wrong manual. Sorry :palm: The AN8008 is a bit tighter, at 1%+3 (and 0.8%+3 on uA) on DC. However, I don't think that changes anything I said earlier. Meanwhile, on AC, it's 1.2%+3 on mA and A, and 1%+3 on uA.
-
It's always a good idea to own more than one meter anyway, so that:
To me this meter (for low level measurements) plus a sturdier 3.5 digit meter seem like a sensible combination. You could use the other meter in case you would have to measure dangerous voltages, would need mA ranges or just would need a second meter. Oh, and when you need the relative function :P.
c) You can occasionally check meter readings against each other. If you see a weird reading, how do you know the problem isn't the meter? There's no substitute for a second opinion, even if you own a Fluke 87V (in fact I'd have more overall confidence in my readings if I owned two of these than if I owned a single Fluke)
This I do not understand. This is not because I think the Fluke 87V is perfect, but because I expect two meters with the same basic design and manufacturer to behave very similar. For example, if it had a design or manufacturing flaw that made it drift (or excessive temperature coefficient), that flaw may very well be in both meters. So I do not think having two of the same provides much improvement in confidence. In statistics terms, I expect the data from the two meters to be highly related, so averaging would gain very little.
On uA AC, mine was spot-on when compared with a Fluke 87V. Really, no more than 2 or 3 counts away in both ranges, right down to the smallest signals. That impressed me, to be honest.
I am pretty sure that the Fluke 87V has also its AC specs only apply for more than 10% of range or something like that. So I would not trust the 87V measurements at the bottom of its range either. It may just be that both are similarly off :P. The only way to compare is to measure something that is near full scale on the 87V, but near the bottom of a scale on the AN8008.
-
I ordered an AN8008 from Amazon (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072JMBLJS/ref=od_aui_detailpages00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) 2 days ago for $22.59 which includes shipping.
I own several meters that are on my main bench but, as an EE designer, I now keep running into situations where very low (tens of nA) readings are needed and the small size means that I can add it into a workbench test setup without it overpowering the whole setup.
After watching Dave's video, I looked at the Fluke 101 and, while small, I can't see that it is worth the extra money. Like others here I will test/calibrate the ranges I'm interested in - mainly low DC volts and current - against my Agilent U1252B (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Agilent-U1252b-Digital-Multimeter-/292173362048?hash=item4406e3b380:g:160AAOSwfRdZFQ-X) and Keysight 34461A. (http://www.tequipment.net/Agilent/34461A/)
I will take the back off it to check for bad soldering and maybe replace a shunt resistor or two if I get poor accuracy but making custom daughter boards for it seems more effort than it's worth.
Has anyone looked at which components might be prime candidates for upgrades yet?
-
c) You can occasionally check meter readings against each other. If you see a weird reading, how do you know the problem isn't the meter? There's no substitute for a second opinion, even if you own a Fluke 87V (in fact I'd have more overall confidence in my readings if I owned two of these than if I owned a single Fluke)
This I do not understand. This is not because I think the Fluke 87V is perfect, but because I expect two meters with the same basic design and manufacturer to behave very similar.
It tells you if one of them is broken. Meters break, probe leads break, meters get dirt inside them, etc.
You can also own different brands/models, that's OK. :popcorn:
-
Edit1: Reading the small print, that meter needs a weird 12V battery.
I have a similar unit, it uses a 12V battery, same used in many car remotes. Wouldn't call this an issue, but battery costs like half of DMM. I replace it every two-three years or so. It's only 2000 counts, but this is good-enough for most my purposes.
I think I know the one, it's used in garage door openers, etc. If you open one up it's 8 LR44 button cells in a plastic tube to get 12V.
I found a pic of that meter with the leads attached. It gives a better idea of how tiny it really is.
It looks quite well built for the price. I'm not imagining it's a good meter but it has a continuity buzzer (unlike most DT830B) and it might be $4-worth of fun to pull one out at Arduino club. :popcorn:
(the transistor tester kinda spoils the looks though)
-
I interpreted alm's statement to mean that two same meters could both share a vulnerable or blind spot on a particular range, measurement or environment, using a different meter or meters to verify or compare against in my view would be a logical approach in the context of equipment that had not yet proven itself to be trustworthy. :-DMM :-DMM :-// :phew:
-
Ahh, so those little 12 volt batteries are just 8 LR44 button cells in a plastic tube eh? My cottage garage door openers use those and they are expensive, I can buy 10 LR44s shipped from China for <$1 so it seems that buying those and adding some heatshrink might make for a cheapskate replacement.
-
Ahh, so those little 12 volt batteries are just 8 LR44 button cells in a plastic tube eh?
Something like LR44s. Check actual size before ordering.
My cottage garage door openers use those and they are expensive, I can buy 10 LR44s shipped from China for <$1 buying those and adding some heatshrink might make for a cheapskate replacement.
Yep.
-
On uA AC, mine was spot-on when compared with a Fluke 87V. Really, no more than 2 or 3 counts away in both ranges, right down to the smallest signals. That impressed me, to be honest.
I am pretty sure that the Fluke 87V has also its AC specs only apply for more than 10% of range or something like that. So I would not trust the 87V measurements at the bottom of its range either. It may just be that both are similarly off :P. The only way to compare is to measure something that is near full scale on the 87V, but near the bottom of a scale on the AN8008.
Yes:
AC conversions for Model 87 are ac coupled, true rms responding, and valid from 3 % to 100 % of range, except 400 mA range (5 %
to 100 % of range) and 10 A range (15 % to 100 % or range).
Most of my spot-checks on the uA ranges were not at the bottom 3% of the range, but those that were were fine. Fluke's specifications are very conservative :-+
I've just double-checked with a 187 added to the series chain, which has a tighter spec, along with the BM235 (just out of interest); all good :-+
Still, I suppose that if you can measure AC millivolts well, it's not much of a leap to get to uA ;)
-
Ahh, so those little 12 volt batteries are just 8 LR44 button cells in a plastic tube eh? My cottage garage door openers use those and they are expensive, I can buy 10 LR44s shipped from China for <$1 so it seems that buying those and adding some heatshrink might make for a cheapskate replacement.
They're smaller than a stack of LR44's and there's a couple of common 12V sizes, the most common being:
23A 8 x 28mm
27A 10.3 × 28.5mm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_battery_sizes
-
They're smaller than a stack of LR44's and there's a couple of common 12V sizes, the most common being:
23A 8 x 28mm
27A 10.3 × 28.5mm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_battery_sizes
Thanks, glad I read this before ordering a container full of LR44s on a slow boat from China :D
-
I'm not imagining it's a good meter but it has a continuity buzzer (unlike most DT830B) and it might be $4-worth of fun to pull one out at Arduino club. :popcorn:
Well, voltage readings were spot-on (+-1 count) after 8 years without any calibration (guess it's not too hard make an accurate 2000 counts DMM). Actually, after my own calibration it become worse :(. So, a totally usable device to me when resolution is not needed (most of the time for me). And yes, I used it on mains as well, although I hesitated holding it in my hands. But it did the job well.
-
Wow, that's too good to pass up. Ordered one. Of course this means I'll have to select something of my own to donate to a hacker/maker space.
-
They're smaller than a stack of LR44's and there's a couple of common 12V sizes, the most common being:
23A 8 x 28mm
27A 10.3 × 28.5mm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_battery_sizes
Thanks, glad I read this before ordering a container full of LR44s on a slow boat from China :D
You can also check the prices of the original type in your stores and on eBay. They don't seem any more expensive than 9v.
-
This would be the perfect base for a cheaper EEVblog branded multimeter.
His official BM235 meter is a whopping AU$150.00, who knows how much that's in real money.
And it doesn't even come with a cool pouch! Doesn't that violate Australian law?
-
Ahh, so those little 12 volt batteries are just 8 LR44 button cells in a plastic tube eh?
Something like LR44s. Check actual size before ordering.
My cottage garage door openers use those and they are expensive, I can buy 10 LR44s shipped from China for <$1 buying those and adding some heatshrink might make for a cheapskate replacement.
Yep.
Under 50c US retail here, and if I buy the Energiser version they are $1.50 each at Wallyworld. I buy them in strips of 5, and in a remote control they last around a year, just like the name brand ones. The expensive ones are the 7V5 5 cell ones that are used in certain remotes, or the CR1620 that car OEM fobs use, that are integrated into the key itself.
The A23 packs are a lot cheaper than a 9V pack here, which are at least $3 each retail, and if you want Energiser or duracell they will knock you back $5 or more each. You can get the OHL versions of the 9V brick, but they are more sawdust and air than active chemical, and are around the same capacity as the A23 pack in use. you really want to pay buy a PM3 brick, those are often over $5 for the cheapest ones, I got the branded radio which uses them for $3, no battery but I found a used 9V wall wart to power it instead.
-
Mine is better than yours here as well. I wonder if I'm lucky, you're unlucky... On uA AC, mine was spot-on when compared with a Fluke 87V.
Perhaps I rate current measurement accuracy in a different way. Putting two meters in series makes the limitations of both meters influence the other.
I connect a 0.01% accuracy resistor in series with a voltage measured with 0.0015% accuracy and measure the current with a single meter to see how that compares with the current based on Ohm's Law. That's what I call real world current. Good meters are accurate without any correction required. A current to voltage converter using a ADA4530-1 IC which I made doesn't need any correction. I have tested it on measuring the current from a 1,000 volt power supply without having any problems.
I realize that $20 meters can't meet that standard. However, we are at the point where maybe a $500, definitely $1,000+ meters should. After making the above measurement, I correct it by taking the meter's shunt resistance into account. That produces a figure which should at least meet the manufacturer's specifications. But, if the meter is measuring a current which doesn't have a linear voltage to current relationship, it may be impossible to translate a measured current to the actual one. The same is true if accurate voltage regulation is required.
While all of this isn't that important for a $20 meter, I still evaluate equipment the same way. The manufacturers will keep making meters with compromised accuracy until meter reviews start measuring real world current which doesn't require you get out your slide rule to translate.
Back to the AN8008--while a 2 uA AC current measurement with reasonable accuracy is possible, 2 mA is not.
-
I'm not imagining it's a good meter but it has a continuity buzzer (unlike most DT830B) and it might be $4-worth of fun to pull one out at Arduino club. :popcorn:
Well, voltage readings were spot-on (+-1 count) after 8 years without any calibration (guess it's not too hard make an accurate 2000 counts DMM). Actually, after my own calibration it become worse :(. So, a totally usable device to me when resolution is not needed (most of the time for me). And yes, I used it on mains as well, although I hesitated holding it in my hands. But it did the job well.
OK, I'm getting one. Just for the LOLs.
-
I'm not imagining it's a good meter but it has a continuity buzzer (unlike most DT830B) and it might be $4-worth of fun to pull one out at Arduino club. :popcorn:
Well, voltage readings were spot-on (+-1 count) after 8 years without any calibration (guess it's not too hard make an accurate 2000 counts DMM). Actually, after my own calibration it become worse :(. So, a totally usable device to me when resolution is not needed (most of the time for me). And yes, I used it on mains as well, although I hesitated holding it in my hands. But it did the job well.
OK, I'm getting one. Just for the LOLs.
Good luck. I'm sure you will be happy (considering the expectations, not much can go wrong).
If buying, check it on Ali, I see a really good price right now (better than eBay, but this changes every moment).
Still, it has some tough competition such as DT 383 for $4 with K-type probes included and temperature measurement (no battery stuff though) and the DT700D with a large display and no temperature or battery stuff. Going further with price, a lot of things appear, but then we're getting closer and closer to AN8002.
-
Still, it has some tough competition such as DT 383 for $4 with K-type probes included and temperature measurement (no battery stuff though) and the DT700D with a large display and no temperature or battery stuff. Going further with price, a lot of things appear, but then we're getting closer and closer to AN8002.
Both huge compared the ANENG. ::)
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=332441;image)
-
Still, it has some tough competition such as DT 383 for $4 with K-type probes included and temperature measurement (no battery stuff though) and the DT700D with a large display and no temperature or battery stuff. Going further with price, a lot of things appear, but then we're getting closer and closer to AN8002.
Both huge compared the ANENG. ::)
True.
(http://i.imgur.com/kXqYjri.png)
It's a bit huge. Who would have considered 830D to be huge? :)
Maybe it's similar size to this expensive UYIGAO? $10, that's almost AN8002 price league.
(http://i.imgur.com/1wMPdIn.png)
-
Putting two meters in series makes the limitations of both meters influence the other.
Howcome? :-//
I connect a 0.01% accuracy resistor in series with a voltage measured with 0.0015% accuracy and measure the current with a single meter to see how that compares with the current based on Ohm's Law. That's what I call real world current.
So how do you account for the resistance of the shunt, fuse, wiring and connectors?
I make no claims here - I just want to know how it compares to my existing meters...
-
Putting two meters in series makes the limitations of both meters influence the other.
Howcome? :-//
Instead of just the shunt resistance of the "tested" meter limiting the current, you will have the two shunt resistances in series limiting the current. I want a meter which won't change the actual current when it is inserted. The added shunt resistance will lower the current unless you are measuring a constant current. I don't often measure that when I am using the meter for repairs or alignment. That's when I want it to be accurate.
So how do you account for the resistance of the shunt, fuse, wiring and connectors?
The AN8008 has a 100 ohm shunt resistor (99 & 1 ohm in series) for measuring uA currents. I don't use that figure when correcting for its insertion. I use the 100.561 ohms which I measured across the AN8008's two terminals. I add the resistance of any connecting wires if that is significant. Similarly, while there is a 0.01 ohm resistor for mA/A currents on the AN8008, I use the 0.0301 ohms which I measured across its terminals.
I don't need to play these correction games when I'm using my ADA4530-1 current to voltage converter or my electrometers.
-
The AN8008 looks great except the two missing mA ranges. Does anyone know if the AN8002 suffers from the same fault?
-
There was a young man named Kirchoff
Who said there's something I'm sure of
Two meters in series
Carry current the same as
Cos the current flowing onto one node is the same as the current in the other of
Caveat <I just got back from the bar> :popcorn:
-
The AN8008 looks great except the two missing mA ranges. Does anyone know if the AN8002 suffers from the same fault?
take a look
-
interesting thing in the manual for people who bitch about the fuses,
the maximum voltage for current readings is 36v DC or 25v AC.
-
Two meters in series Carry current the same
Yes, but Ohm's Law says that the current through both will down from what it was before the meters were inserted. Again, I'm talking about the typical currents which I measure during repair and alignment. Those are almost always not constant currents.
The attachment shows how I label all of my similar meters.
-
Putting two meters in series makes the limitations of both meters influence the other.
Howcome? :-//
Instead of just the shunt resistance of the "tested" meter limiting the current, you will have the two shunt resistances in series limiting the current. I want a meter which won't change the actual current when it is inserted. The added shunt resistance will lower the current unless you are measuring a constant current. I don't often measure that when I am using the meter for repairs or alignment. That's when I want it to be accurate.
That isn't the "limitations of both meters influencing the other". Rather, that's the extra resistance of the measurement meter slightly reducing the current in the circuit to the DUT.
But how is that a problem when the other meter is telling you the test current?
I've no idea what the voltage is, and I've no idea how accurate the 50 ohm resistance of my Wavetek 162 is. But it doesn't matter. As I said, I simply want to see how the DUT compares to my existing meters.
I adjust the amplitude of the Wavetek until the measurement meter says something close to the sort of current I want. Then I write down both numbers, and calculate how close they are. Simple. I'm aware of the limitations, but I'm no voltnut.
BTW, how does your method account for the non-linear resistance of the fuse?
-
That isn't the "limitations of both meters influencing the other". Rather, that's the extra resistance of the measurement meter slightly reducing the current in the circuit to the DUT.
Let's take a specific example. I took my voltage reference which has a 5.00377 volt output and connected my 100 ohm 0.005% resistor (Y1453100R000V9L) in series with it. On my Agilent 34401A meter I measured 47.4017 mA. Under identical circumstances my AN8008 measured 49.9 mA! That's because the shunt resistance on the 34401A is 5.022 ohms as compared to 0.0301 ohms on the AN8008. If you put both meters in series I would expect both meters to read about 47.4 mA due to the 34401A's shunt resistance. Which method is more meaningful and/or accurate? I want to know how accurate the current measurement is compared to the current without the meter inserted (50.0377 mA).
In the above situation the AN8008 was more accurate than my relatively expensive 34401A. However, if you correct the 34401A's reading, its accuracy is -0.016% as compared to the AN8008's accuracy of
-0.2452%. I'm trying to find the meter which has the best accuracy without requiring me to use my "slide rule."
-
The AN8008 looks great except the two missing mA ranges. Does anyone know if the AN8002 suffers from the same fault?
take a look
Many thanks, looks like no missing ranges.
- 0-60mA (10u)
- 0-600mA (100u)
- 0-6A (1m)
- 0-10A (10m)
I'll probably pick up a couple of these as giveaways for my next course at work.
-
That isn't the "limitations of both meters influencing the other". Rather, that's the extra resistance of the measurement meter slightly reducing the current in the circuit to the DUT.
Let's take a specific example. I took my voltage reference which has a 5.00377 volt output and connected my 100 ohm 0.005% resistor (Y1453100R000V9L) in series with it. On my Agilent 34401A meter I measured 47.4017 mA. Under identical circumstances my AN8008 measured 49.9mA! That's because the shunt resistance on the 34401A is 5.022 ohms as compared to 0.0301 ohms on the AN8008. If you put both meters in series I would expect both meters to read about 47.4 mA due to the 34401A's shunt resistance. Which method is more meaningful and/or accurate? I want to know how accurate the current measurement is compared to the current without the meter inserted (50.0377 mA).
In the above situation the AN8008 was more accurate than my relatively expensive 34401A. However, if you correct the 34401A's reading, its accuracy is -0.016% as compared to the AN8008's accuracy of
-0.2452%. I'm trying to find the meter which has the best accuracy without requiring me to use my "slide rule."
Sorry, I feel like I'm clearly missing something really obvious.
Why does the actual current matter? Why go to the effort of using a precise voltage and a precise resistance in the hope of achieve a particular current when the total resistance added by the meter will be affected by the fuse (which is non-linear) and connectors/wires in addition to the shunt?
Or to put it another way, what is wrong with what I'm doing?
As I say, I don't care about the actual value of current - I just want to see how it compares to my known-good meters at certain approximate points, and to achieve that goal, I can't see any flaws with putting two or more meters in series. No slide rule required.
A current meter is specified in terms of the current passed through it, not the reading that results when some arbitrary voltage source is connected to it via some arbitrary resistance, no matter how precise those might be.
Obviously any current meter will have a shunt (and fuse, etc), so the current will be affected when you insert it into a circuit. The value of this resistance is just a fact of life, and is hardly a "figure of merit" given that all current meters must have a shunt to work. Just about any measurement will change things to a small extent; it's up to the operator to consider the effect of the particular shunt given the context: often it simply doesn't matter; other times, the burden voltage might indeed be a problem. But all that is quite separate from determining the basic accuracy of a current meter.
-
The AN8008 looks great except the two missing mA ranges. Does anyone know if the AN8002 suffers from the same fault?
No, it suffers from completely different ones.
-
interesting thing in the manual for people who bitch about the fuses,
the maximum voltage for current readings is 36v DC or 25v AC.
You mean the maximum 10 amps will pass at 36V?
That's how Ohm's law works, yes, and you'll find similar values for other meters, even Flukes!
The usual workaround is to put something else in series with the multimeter. That way the voltage drop across the multimeter will only be a tiny fraction of the total voltage from the supply and (hopefully) much less than 36V. ;)
-
Or to put it another way, what is wrong with what I'm doing?
I thought that my example made it obvious. Doing it your way both of my meters connected in series read about 47.4 mA. Doing it my way one meter reads 49.9 mA while the other reads 47.4 mA. It's clear which one is more accurate in measuring current when you do not want to go to the trouble of correcting for the meter's shunt resistance.
Let's say that my 5.00377 is a critical voltage supply which can't dip below 5.0 volts. Connecting the 34401A will lower the voltage to about 4.7658 volts while the AN8008 insertion will only cause the voltage to drop to 5.00227 volts.
While my expensive electrometers can measure current with insignificant insertion resistance (or burden voltage), my relatively inexpensive ADA4530-1 current to voltage converter can do the same thing. Because of that I want the manufacturers to start adding that feature in more moderately priced meters. If you shrug your shoulders and say that you are happy the way things are nothing will change.
-
interesting thing in the manual for people who bitch about the fuses,
the maximum voltage for current readings is 36v DC or 25v AC.
You mean the maximum 10 amps will pass at 36V?
That's how Ohm's law works, yes, and you'll find similar values for other meters, even Flukes!
The usual workaround is to put something else in series with the multimeter. That way the voltage drop across the multimeter will only be a tiny fraction of the total voltage from the supply and (hopefully) much less than 36V. ;)
It has everything to do with the voltage rating of the fuse, if the fuse fails the voltage that is across your supply now also is across the both ends of the fuse, just a couple of millimeters won't hold back a high-voltage.
That is why high voltage fuses are physically larger, and have a higher burden voltage.
-
interesting thing in the manual for people who bitch about the fuses,
the maximum voltage for current readings is 36v DC or 25v AC.
...
It has everything to do with the voltage rating of the fuse, if the fuse fails the voltage that is across your supply now also is across the both ends of the fuse, just a couple of millimeters won't hold back a high-voltage.
Sure, but 37V isn't a high voltage. It's not going to jump that fuse.
FWIW most of those 10mmx3mm fuses are rated at 250V. In theory they'll stop 240V AC mains.
http://www.newark.com/c/circuit-protection/fuses-fuse-accessories/fuses/cartridge-fuses?fuse-size-metric=3.6mm-x-10mm (http://www.newark.com/c/circuit-protection/fuses-fuse-accessories/fuses/cartridge-fuses?fuse-size-metric=3.6mm-x-10mm)
(not that I'd use this meter for mains work, and do we really have to keep laboring that point?)
-
Or to put it another way, what is wrong with what I'm doing?
I thought that my example made it obvious. Doing it your way both of my meters connected in series read about 47.4 mA. Doing it my way one meter reads 49.9 mA while the other reads 47.4 mA. It's clear which one is more accurate in measuring current when you do not want to go to the trouble of correcting for the meter's shunt resistance.
Let's say that my 5.00377 is a critical voltage supply which can't dip below 5.0 volts. Connecting the 34401A will lower the voltage to about 4.7658 volts while the AN8008 insertion will only cause the voltage to drop to 5.00227 volts.
While my expensive electrometers can measure current with insignificant insertion resistance (or burden voltage), my relatively inexpensive ADA4530-1 current to voltage converter can do the same thing. Because of that I want the manufacturers to start adding that feature in more moderately priced meters. If you shrug your shoulders and say that you are happy the way things are nothing will change.
Yes, obviously, a current meter has a burden voltage (or resistance, if you prefer). And sometimes we have to take it into account... And yes, it would be lovely if manufacturers could minimise it somehow. I'm not shrugging my shoulders or otherwise; I'm simply not worrying about it right now because it's a completely different issue to the question of how closely a DUT meets its published specification for current accuracy.
To validate the manufacturer's specifications, you have to measure the way they did. So do you think they did what you're doing? I'm pretty sure that a DMM calibrator uses a current source for this, not a voltage source and low value resistor. Just a thought experiment: how about trying 1000V and 20k - what would that do for your numbers?
As I say, burden voltage, is quite separate from the basic accuracy as quoted in the spec. By all means complain about burden voltage - it's a noble cause - but you can't conflate the two ;)
I appreciate your time here, but in the context of reporting whether or not the AN8008 meets its specification, I think I'm happy with what I'm doing :-+
-
interesting thing in the manual for people who bitch about the fuses,
the maximum voltage for current readings is 36v DC or 25v AC.
...
It has everything to do with the voltage rating of the fuse, if the fuse fails the voltage that is across your supply now also is across the both ends of the fuse, just a couple of millimeters won't hold back a high-voltage.
Sure, but 37V isn't a high voltage. It's not going to jump that fuse.
FWIW most of those 10mmx3mm fuses are rated at 250V. In theory they'll stop 240V AC mains.
http://www.newark.com/c/circuit-protection/fuses-fuse-accessories/fuses/cartridge-fuses?fuse-size-metric=3.6mm-x-10mm (http://www.newark.com/c/circuit-protection/fuses-fuse-accessories/fuses/cartridge-fuses?fuse-size-metric=3.6mm-x-10mm)
(not that I'd use this meter for mains work, and do we really have to keep laboring that point?)
There is a big difference between breaking ac or dc as ac (mains) inherently goes to o volts 100 or 120 times each second and therefore will remove the arc, after that there is enough space and material to prevent another arc-over.
DC on the other hand is much harder to brake, as the first arc doesn't die out by itself there is much more space and material needed to prevent it.
Also switches and relays have much lower dc than ac ratings.
I couldn't find a dc rating at all for the fuses you've linked to, not surprising as they are intended for ac mains only. :)
-
I'll probably pick up a couple of these as giveaways for my next course at work.
If you do that, at the very least put a label over the CAT ratings indicating not for use over 50 V or something like that.
-
The 8002 was pretty nice for the price. For low voltage, low energy it's way ahead of the free meters from HR.
Because it failed at a low enough level, it made it a prime candidate to run on my half cycle generator. Still not a lot of energy with this setup.
https://youtu.be/HrcxnbkkhYg?t=1793
That's the one I bought, the ZT102, same as the 8002. This 8008 looks good too for the price.
-
Let's take a specific example. I took my voltage reference which has a 5.00377 volt output and connected my 100 ohm 0.005% resistor (Y1453100R000V9L) in series with it. On my Agilent 34401A meter I measured 47.4017 mA. Under identical circumstances my AN8008 measured 49.9 mA! That's because the shunt resistance on the 34401A is 5.022 ohms as compared to 0.0301 ohms on the AN8008. If you put both meters in series I would expect both meters to read about 47.4 mA due to the 34401A's shunt resistance. Which method is more meaningful and/or accurate? I want to know how accurate the current measurement is compared to the current without the meter inserted (50.0377 mA).
In the above situation the AN8008 was more accurate than my relatively expensive 34401A. However, if you correct the 34401A's reading, its accuracy is -0.016% as compared to the AN8008's accuracy of
-0.2452%. I'm trying to find the meter which has the best accuracy without requiring me to use my "slide rule."
I think you have many people here mystified and scratching their heads.
For one thing, how do you know that your voltage source is stable when subjected to a 50 mA load?
The correct thing to do in this situation is to measure the voltage across the 100 ohm resistor. Firstly this is an accurate and already inserted current shunt. Secondly this minimizes any influence the meter has over the circuit under test. And thirdly this will indicate whether the voltage reference is maintaining its specified value.
-
The AN8008 looks great except the two missing mA ranges. Does anyone know if the AN8002 suffers from the same fault?
take a look
Many thanks, looks like no missing ranges.
- 0-60mA (10u)
- 0-600mA (100u)
- 0-6A (1m)
- 0-10A (10m)
I'll probably pick up a couple of these as giveaways for my next course at work.
For clarity: AN8002 suffers from the "opposite" problem, no µA-ranges. 10µA is the lowest resolution (as you see in your table). Just pointing that out because it's easy to assume that even an el cheepo meter has like a 600 µA-range.
-
For one thing, how do you know that your voltage source is stable when subjected to a 50 mA load?
I measure it as you suggest. I have either 0.005% or 0.01% resistors with values of 10, 50, 100, 1k, 2.5k, 9k, 10k, 49.9k, 100k, 1M and 10M. When using the higher resistances for lower current verification there's not much need to worry about voltage drop. Voltage drop is a serious concern with the lower resistances/higher currents. That is why my 10 ohm resistor is a four terminal resistor. The same resistors can be used for resistance measurement accuracy.
My method confirms current measurement accuracy for the way that I typically measure current. By accounting for the meter's shunt resistance the same reading will show compliance with the manufacturer's ratings. The resistors are not inexpensive but my method can better point to which meter will be more accurate for a particular task. As past pointed out, there can be times when the AN8008 will provide a more accurate current measurement than my 34401A will when I only want to look at the meter's display.
-
Or instead of going through all that, just feed it close to the maximum current of the range and measure the voltage across the terminals. This measures the actual burden voltage, which is the specification you are comparing here (and something you can compare to the datasheet value). It is well known that even expensive high-resolution meters do not necessarily have a low burden voltage. That is why Dave developed the µCurrent, and why there are instruments with feedback ammeters that reduce the burden voltage to almost zero. See the the Keithley low level measurements handbook (http://www.tek.com/sites/tek.com/files/media/document/resources/LowLevelHandbook_7Ed.pdf) for details.
-
The AN8008 looks great except the two missing mA ranges. Does anyone know if the AN8002 suffers from the same fault?
take a look
Thanks, interesting I could never find that manual online!
-
Or instead of going through all that, just feed it close to the maximum current of the range and measure the voltage across the terminals.
I don't understand why people like to refer to the burden voltage. There are an infinite number of actual burden voltages which obviously depend on the actual current being measured rather than the maximum current of the range. There are typically two or three shunt resistances. That's why I have their values listed on the meter. With those two or three figures you can calculate the actual burden voltage. For the lower currents where one of the resistors is used, it probably has a relatively insignificant burden voltage. However, at the high current limit of that one resistor the readings may have an accuracy way out of its rated specification. Some lower price meters have protection diodes across those resistors which start to conduct even when measuring a current within its ratings. I find that in my tests.
I already own two of the Keithley electrometers for low current measurement with insignificant shunt resistance/burden voltage. I've made my own version of Dave's uCurrent using an ADA4530-1 (which I don't believe was available when Dave designed his circuit). My circuit can measure femtoamps with an accuracy exceeding my ability to guarantee its accuracy. While a commercial equivalent would need greater protection than my design, it should not add that much to the price of the mid to upper level multi-meters.
-
I've made my own version of Dave's uCurrent using an ADA4530-1 (which I don't believe was available when Dave designed his circuit). My circuit can measure femtoamps with an accuracy exceeding my ability to guarantee its accuracy. While a commercial equivalent would need greater protection than my design, it should not add that much to the price of the mid to upper level multi-meters.
Even if it had been available, that one chip seems to cost several times the uCurrent BOM ;)
-
Even if it had been available, that one chip seems to cost several times the uCurrent
There are currently 67 ADA4530-1's available for $23.49 each from Mouser as compared to $69.66 USD for a uCurrent. That was Google's translation for AU$89.00
-
I don't understand why people like to refer to the burden voltage. There are an infinite number of actual burden voltages which obviously depend on the actual current being measured rather than the maximum current of the range.
Well yes, the burden voltage is a maximum per range. A worst case that you can take into account as you design your setup. It will likely be very close to 0 V at 0 A ;). You can quantify it for intermediate values if you are so inclined, but no need to confuse it with accuracy.
There are typically two or three shunt resistances.
Which is why there may be a burden voltage spec per current range.
However, at the high current limit of that one resistor the readings may have an accuracy way out of its rated specification.
Is that rated specification for a current source with such a low output impedance? Are you also measuring voltage with a 1 MOhm series resistor? Then your electrometer would definitely be much more accurate :P.
Some lower price meters have protection diodes across those resistors which start to conduct even when measuring a current within its ratings. I find that in my tests.
The effect at full scale currents should be included in the burden voltage specs.
While a commercial equivalent would need greater protection than my design, it should not add that much to the price of the mid to upper level multi-meters.
The fuses will still represent a significant resistance, so I am not so sure how much you would gain by reducing the shunt resistance. This is also why the µCurrent does not have a fuse (and is not marked CAT III ;)).
Even if it had been available, that one chip seems to cost several times the uCurrent
There are currently 67 ADA4530-1's available for $23.49 each from Mouser as compared to $69.66 USD for a uCurrent. That was Google's translation for AU$89.00
You left off the word BOM in the quote. If the µCurrent sold for US$ 70, then I would expect US$ 23 to be close to the BOM costs.
-
I express burden voltage as volts-per-amp, or millivolts-per-milliamp, or whatever.
However, it can only be approximate because - as I've mentioned at least once already - the fuse is non-linear.
Take a typical 20mm 500mAT fuse - the sort found in cheap multimeters for the mA range - and measure the voltage across it for a range of currents. Last time I did this, the value of resistance at ~500mA was practically double what it was at ~100mA. I've no idea if "proper" HRC fuses are better or worse; at ~£15 a go, that's a lot to risk if something goes wrong. Someone else can run that experiment ;)
-
Guys, calm down.
I like all your answers, they explain many things.
But, IMHO the strongest point of this $19 meter is 1uV resolution, not any of his Amp range. No need to discuss Amp ranges so deeply.
When you look at Wytnucls multimeter spreadsheet, you find just few meters with 1uV resolution.
What I am missing at this meter is logging (whatever RS232, USB, BT) and I think that somebody already enabled logging on this chipset.
That would be something, 1uV resolution meter with logging for $19 - that would become surely UT61e killer.
If there is someone who can do it, please do it!
-
.......
What I am missing at this meter is logging (whatever RS232, USB, BT) and I think that somebody already enabled logging on this chipset.
That would be something, 1uV resolution meter with logging for $19 - that would become surely UT61e killer.
If there is someone who can do it, please do it!
In the AN8002 model the UART TX signal was not bonded. I'll check the AN8008 when I receive it.
-
I'll chip in on the how best to compare the current reading of 2 meters, one of known accuracy, and the other being compared. Kirchoff's second law (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirchhoff%27s_circuit_laws) says that sum of currents flowing into a node is equal to the sum of the currents flowing out of that node; if you only have 2 meters in series then the law says that whatever current flows is the same in both meters.
The only way to do a comparison test (IMHO) is to connect the 2 meters in series. Then I would connect a supply from a power supply and use current limit to get close to the value I want to test, say 1 Amp. Now wait until the readings are steady and record both values. Next do the math to say how accurate is the one under test compared to the good one.
You can't set up the constant current supply and then test, switch meters around, and test again (unless you have a calibrated current source like a Druck). The resistances presented to the supply by a current meter are so low that the resistance of the test lead and banana connectors is very significant and it will likely change just by disconnecting and reconnecting. You can talk about burden voltages all day but, as Mark says, who cares? We're measuring current. An expensive meter will have a lower burden voltage than a cheap one but so what? What matters is that I'm measuring the same current that flows through both meters.
-
Guys, calm down.
I like all your answers, they explain many things.
But, IMHO the strongest point of this $19 meter is 1uV resolution, not any of his Amp range. No need to discuss Amp ranges so deeply.
The poor mA resolution is only a problem if your life plan is "own exactly one multimeter".
We all know this is 100% impossible so why argue?
-
Guys, calm down.
I like all your answers, they explain many things.
But, IMHO the strongest point of this $19 meter is 1uV resolution, not any of his Amp range. No need to discuss Amp ranges so deeply.
The vast majority of electronics works on mA, not uA.
This meter fails to cover the most common current ranges in electronics design with any degree of decent resolution.
-
If anything, skipping the amps range would make more sense to me. Circuits where you need both µA/nA and µV are unlikely to need amps ranges. The exception might be HVAC, but for some reason this does not strike me as an HVAC meter ;).
I guess they wanted to claim 10 nA to 10 A in their marketing material.
-
Guys, calm down.
I like all your answers, they explain many things.
But, IMHO the strongest point of this $19 meter is 1uV resolution, not any of his Amp range. No need to discuss Amp ranges so deeply.
The vast majority of electronics works on mA, not uA.
This meter fails to cover the most common current ranges in electronics design with any degree of decent resolution.
Maybe they're planning to release another one in a couple of months* with 10mA range and temperature.
Double the sales! :popcorn:
(*) Or after the sales of this one die down.
-
The vast majority of electronics works on mA, not uA.
This meter fails to cover the most common current ranges in electronics design with any degree of decent resolution.
I'm with Dave on this one, I'd much rather see the 10A range replaced by a usable mA range. Can't this meter be hacked to do that, maybe with a shunt resistor change?
-
Sure, if you spend another $20 on a new shunt :P.
-
Sure, if you spend another $20 on a new shunt :P.
OK, the challenge has been made! All I have to do is wait for my meter to arrive on the slow boat from China... :=\
[EDIT] What's the resistance of the 1A shunt? If it was 0.001 Ohms then I'm thinking it would be way less than $20 for a 1 Ohm 0.1% resistor.
-
[EDIT] What's the resistance of the 1A shunt? If it was 0.001 Ohms then I'm thinking it would be way less than $20 for a 1 Ohm 0.1% resistor.
You can calculate it by looking at the burden voltage in the specs.
Normally it won't be a high precision resistor though. It will be medium-precision and the calibration process will cancel out the error. You'll have to rewrite the calibration in the flash memory after you swap the resistor.
-
Guys, calm down.
I like all your answers, they explain many things.
But, IMHO the strongest point of this $19 meter is 1uV resolution, not any of his Amp range. No need to discuss Amp ranges so deeply.
The vast majority of electronics works on mA, not uA.
This meter fails to cover the most common current ranges in electronics design with any degree of decent resolution.
I only wanted to say, that when someone pointed out this meter has only two shunts, 100 ohms and 0.1 ohms, in that moment was clear some Amps ranges are missing. And then you showed that in your video. Thank you! Then someone pointed out even worse behaviour when measuring AC Amps, which was explained by TRMS conversion. And from that moment on we all know everything about stock AN8008 Amps ranges. We now have no need to discuss stock Amps ranges any more IMHO (except to replace highest Amps range shunt with bigger(more Ohms) shunt to lose 10Amp range for gaining other ranges which are now missing - it might be doable, for $$ obviously))
But me (and others) have other meters for that Amps ranges.
I for example have no reliable and usable meter with 1uV resolution (Fluke 289 failed entirely in that regard despite its price - next time I should read manuals more carefully - 50.000mV 0.05%+20 - ridiculous! Where is LSD digit? And really behaves in this manner! LSD changes itself randomly in the scale +-20 counts!)
I was looking forward to Dave's (Your) 121GW and now this "little gem" appeared :)
I would like to move on to next topic, and that could be logging in my opinion.
-
Guys, calm down.
I like all your answers, they explain many things.
But, IMHO the strongest point of this $19 meter is 1uV resolution, not any of his Amp range. No need to discuss Amp ranges so deeply.
The vast majority of electronics works on mA, not uA.
This meter fails to cover the most common current ranges in electronics design with any degree of decent resolution.
Maybe they're planning to release another one in a couple of months* with 10mA range and temperature.
Double the sales! :popcorn:
(*) Or after the sales of this one die down.
I'm with evava!! If this nice toy will have serial output and temp measurement I'll buy 2 ;D
I don't want wait the next model, where is the hack!!! :popcorn:
Mauro
-
In the AN8002 model the UART TX signal was not bonded.
has that been verified on more than one meter??
-
If this nice toy will have serial output and temp measurement I'll buy 2 ;D
go back to my previous posts here where with few other members we were discussing information from a Russian forum : temp measurement is simple EEPROM hack - already made and confirmed as working by the Russians - there are even Russian sellers that already sell AN8008 hacked with the temp measurement enabled. As far as the Serial Output goes - if pin 20 of DM1106EN is not used (not connected) on AN8008 board, then it's EEPROM hack to enable the output plus maybe 3 USD for parts (photo-diode, photo-transistor, 100R resistor, 1K2 resistor and UART to RS232 board that are available cheaply). in fact, at least to me the only known DM0660/DM1106EN-based DMM that is not hack-able to add Serial Output is UT139C, as they use pin 20 of the chipset for another purpose.
[EDIT] and for completeness as i am sure someone will ask, here are more details. All credits goes to respective users in "kazus.ru" who shared the information:
* EEPROM address 0xFA, bit 1 is the UART enable/disable bit - that's documented in the datasheet as well:
link click here (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1256787/#msg1256787)
as it's activated/deactivated with "a long press on REL button" and there is no such button on AN8008, i guess adding REL button would be similar process of how that is done on VC921:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hacking-the-victor-vc-921/)
* EEPROM address 0xAF changed to 0x13 adds Celsius to mA range
* EEPROM address 0xBF changed to 0x15 adds Fahrenheit to mA range
that means, when on mA range and press SELECT, it goes DC, AC, Celsius, Fahrenheit, see the picture here:
link click here (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1244596/#msg1244596)
on the picture in Russian it says "BONUS: temperature measurement".
-
Guys, calm down.
I like all your answers, they explain many things.
But, IMHO the strongest point of this $19 meter is 1uV resolution, not any of his Amp range. No need to discuss Amp ranges so deeply.
The vast majority of electronics works on mA, not uA.
This meter fails to cover the most common current ranges in electronics design with any degree of decent resolution.
In some of the latest microcontroller projects I have been involved we have needed to be able to measure the standby current consumption in 5uA - 10uA range with 100nA resolution in order to be able to observe how the average current consumption changes when we change something in the circuit or in the software. However, when the device wakes up, the current consumption will be around 10 mA - 20 mA. This is typically a problem related to the burden voltage as the device fails to operate due to the voltage drop caused by the sense resistor inside the DMM. However, placing a low leakage and low Vf diode across the DMM inputs will take care of that problem quite nicely and limit the burden voltage to few hundred millivolts. Of course the current measurement is not accurate any more at higher currents when the diode starts conducting, but this arrangement has worked quite nicely in practice.
-
[...]
But, IMHO the strongest point of this $19 meter is 1uV resolution, not any of his Amp range. [...]
I totally agree with that. This meter might not be entirely practical if it is your only one due to the missing ranges (and other quirks), but it has some unique features that might complement other meters if you don't have a lot to spend. Yeah, if you already have a 7,5 digit Keysight lying around you might not be especially impressed, but now I can add a µV resolution measuring option to my "lab" for just ~US$20. I have got one on its way! ;D It looks however like the designers had no good idea if they wanted it to be an electrical or electronical measurement device. Its square wave output sounds interesting, but I could not think of one single way I could implement it practically in an actual circuit due to the lack of flexibility and range. Personally, I would have inserted a third shunt in the meter and I would have used the position on the knob to select it. With dedicated temperature meters available I don't really need that as an option, but one could argue in its favour.
I already own an AN8002, and I do like it in a number of respects. It has relatively high counts for a €13 meter (this one's even better) and is quite accurate and has no pots in it. I had an old Uni-T which did, and it changed over time to be out by as much as 10% (in every range) until I found the proper pot to tweak (cause there's no documentation on that). :palm: The capacitance goes down to pF resolution and is quite fast. It is also high impendance in mV range, which can be useful for some applications. It mV range also allows for measuring current with in-circuit shunts (but you'll have to design these in, which I sometimes do), because when doing electronic work breaking the circuit open and inserting a meter with its sometimes high shunt resistances and/or long inductive leads might very well interfere. The AN8008 does have an option the AN8002 does not: manually changing ranges. I often find myself wanting to do so, but this feature lacks on the AN8002. I would have considered that a more useful feature than the present "Hold" function.
BTW with my AN8002 the diode check voltage is above the battery voltage. It puts out 3,25V while I use Ni-MH rechargable batteries that are at 2,6V (these values were measured with my unit, but might differ with other ones). It must have some kind of small charge pump in it. I must note it only delivers very low currents at this voltage, but I could light two red LEDs in series very faintly and see their forward voltage (some meters seem to put out the voltage, but just not measure it above a certain level, don't know why).
-
.....
The AN8008 does have an option the AN8002 does not: manually changing ranges. I often find myself wanting to do so, but this feature lacks on the AN8002. I would have considered that a more useful feature than the present "Hold" function....
You can add REL, RANGE & MIN/MAX buttons to AN8002.
-
I modified my AN8008 to provide single digit mA readings with 3 digit resolution. I replaced the regular mA/A readings with the ability to measure currents below 100 mA with a XX.XX mA display. Currents below 1A are measured with the same XXX.X mA display. 1A is now the maximum current which can be measured.
I replaced the 0.01 ohm shunt resistor for the A/mA jack with a 0.10 ohm 0.5% resistor which I had in stock. Attached is a picture of the upgraded meter measuring 2.5000 mA current. On the left the meter is in the uA position, the test lead is in the A/mA jack and the meter reads 2.59 (uA) [3.6% high]. On the right I've switched to the mA position but the reading has gone down to 21.9 (mA) [12.4% low]. I obviously haven't corrected the position of the decimal. Remember, the actual current through the meter is 2.5 mA is both cases.
About a 0.12 ohm resistor will correct the magnitude of the of the reading when the meter's switch is in the mA position. But, I prefer having the decimal point in the correct position. Being in the A/mA jack will remind me that mA is the actual display units. I might purchase some 0.10 ohm resistors with less precision hoping to get one a bit low in value which will improve the mA reading's accuracy when the meter's switch is in the uA position.
-
I'm quite tempted by this meter as my old MasTech doesn't have a uA range but now in two minds due to the lack of low mA ranges.... tricky!
... however I really do need something to measure in the 10uA type area MCU in standby for battery applications.... what to do! |O
-
I'm quite tempted by this meter as my old MasTech doesn't have a uA range but now in two minds due to the lack of low mA ranges.... tricky!
... however I really do need something to measure in the 10uA type area MCU in standby for battery applications.... what to do! |O
Buy both AN8002 and AN8008 :)
-
Assuming your current meter has decent mV resolution, you can use an external shunt resistor between the power supply (battery) and micro. A 1 kOhm resistor would give 1 V/mA, or 1 mV/µA, resolution, and should have a low burden voltage at that current.
-
I'm quite tempted by this meter as my old MasTech doesn't have a uA range but now in two minds due to the lack of low mA ranges.... tricky!
... however I really do need something to measure in the 10uA type area MCU in standby for battery applications.... what to do! |O
You are hereby officially granted the right to keep your old Mastech meter, and chose between that one and the AN8008 depending on your application. :P
Having two meters (at least! ;)) is good anyway, for those situations where you want to monitor two separate voltages, or voltange and current, or...
-
You are hereby officially granted the right to keep your old Mastech meter, and chose between that one and the AN8008 depending on your application. :P
:-+
Thanks for the permission. it was enough to get me to click on ebay... £14.95 spent, it should be on the slow boat now.... probably arrive whilst I am away on hols.
-
Maybe irrelevant but the DTM0660 chipset (used in the AN8002) only has calibration data for 3 different current ranges.
eg. https://github.com/pingumacpenguin/DTM0660-flasher-arduino-sketch/blob/master/STM32-DTM0660-24c02-Updater.ino
/*
* DTM0660 Memory Contents and Jumper settings as follows.
00H -
01H J1A, J1BDCmV: 60.00mV/600.0mV
02H J1A, J1BACmV: 60.00mV/600.0mV
03H X,DCV (without mV): 6.000V/60.00V/600.0V/1000V
04H X,ACV (without mV): 6.000V/60.00V/600.0V/750V
05H X,DCVmV (with mV): 600.0mV/6.000V/60.00V/600.0V/1000V
06H X,ACVmV (with mV): 600.0mV/6.000V/60.00V/600.0V/750V
07H J1A, J1B,600.0?/6.000k?/60.00k?/600.0k?/6.000M?/60.00M?
08H --
09H J1A, J1B,Cont
0AH J1A, J1B,Diode
0BH J1A, J1B,Cap: 9.999nF/99.99nF/999.9nF/9.999uF/99.99uF/999.9uF/9.999mF/99.99mF
0CH J4(or J5),DCuA 600.0uA/6000uA ( DCA 600.0A/6000A)
0DH J4(or J5),ACuA 60.00uA/600.0uA ( ACA 60.00A/600.0A)
0EH J3(or J5),DCmA 60.00mA/600.0mA ( DCA 60.00A/600.0A)
0FH J3(or J5),ACmA 60.00mA/600.0mA ( ACA 60.00A/600.0A)
10H X(or J5),DCA 6.000A/60.00A ( DCA 6.000A/60.00A)
11H X(or J5),ACA 6.000A/60.00A ( ACA 6.000A/60.00A)
12H J1A and J2, J2 Hz/Duty
13H J1A,Temp (°C)
14H J6 HFE
15H J1A,Temp (°F)
16H J1A,DCA 6.000A
17H J1A,ACA 6.000A
18H J1A,DCA 60.00A
19H J1A,ACA 60.00A
1AH J1A,DCA 600.0A
1BH J1A,ACA 600.0A
1CH J1A,DCA 6000A
1DH J1A,ACA 6000A
1EH X,NCV
*/
If the chipset in the AN8008 is similar then maybe this is the reason it has no intermediate mA ranges - the chipset only supports three ranges and they chose 1A, 1mA, 1uA.
(I can't find the same info for the DM1106EN chipset used in the AN8008 - anyone?)
-
The Bside ADM08A appears to use the same DM1106 chip, and has 4 current ranges...
-
The Bside ADM08A appears to use the same DM1106 chip, and has 4 current ranges...
I think DM1106EN and DTM0660 are the same chip, someone reported that Uni-T UT210E already changed the chip to DM1106EN last year.
(http://image.shoudian.org/data/attachment/forum/201701/17/113250csrdaamr5grzs4ga.jpg)
The real name of the chip should be Hycon HY12P66. Hycontek just sell the customized chips to their customers.
-
I think DM1106EN and DTM0660 are the same chip, someone reported that Uni-T UT210E already changed the chip to DM1106EN last year.
(http://image.shoudian.org/data/attachment/forum/201701/17/113250csrdaamr5grzs4ga.jpg)
the common opinion is that DM1106EN is actually improved new version of DTM0660, at least based on what i read in the Russian forum "kazus.ru" using Google translate, as it was pointed out here several posts back - while DTM0660 can be patched via EEPROM hack to 9999 counts it works reliable only when it's patched up to 8500 counts. yeah, the EEPROM for DTM0660 is fully compatible with DM1106EN, i don't know if they are pin-to-pin compatible, but in any way no any significant changes are needed to do what UNI-T did with UT210C - update it from DTM0660 to DM1106EN, as it's sold as 6000 counts meter and they did not even need EEPROM update.
so, the EEPROM structure and almost all the settings are the same for DTM0660 and DM1106EN, there are already available EEPROM dumps from AN8008 and ADM08A in the aforementioned Russian forum and it's easy to figure out EEPROM settings considering their features and the available DTM0660 datasheet, the one translated in English is not very full, but there is one in Chinese. most good source is EEPROM of ADM08A as it contains some settings that cannot be explained via the DTM0660 datasheet, i.e. those are new bits for DM1106EN new features.
The real name of the chip should be Hycon HY12P66. Hycontek just sell the customized chips to their customers.
again, the common opinion is DTM0600 and DM1106EN are cheap clones of Hycon HY12P66, that's why there are so cheap DMMs with them compared to the one that has original Hycon HY12P66 inside.
[EDIT] and here are EEPROM dumps:
* ADM08A EEPROM:
http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126912&postcount=1825 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126912&postcount=1825)
* AN8008 EEPROM:
http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126917&postcount=1827 (http://kazus.ru/forums/showpost.php?p=1126917&postcount=1827)
BTW, ADM08A sells for 18-19 USD and it's much solidly build than AN8008:
(http://remont-aud.net/_bd/413/15093354.jpg)
but at least I cannot find anyone who patched ADM08A to 9999 counts via modifying the EEPROM and evaluate its work. that would be definitely interesting.
-
I modified my AN8008 to provide single digit mA readings with 3 digit resolution. I replaced the regular mA/A readings with the ability to measure currents below 100 mA with a XX.XX mA display. Currents below 1A are measured with the same XXX.X mA display. 1A is now the maximum current which can be measured.
I replaced the 0.01 ohm shunt resistor for the A/mA jack with a 0.10 ohm 0.5% resistor which I had in stock. Attached is a picture of the upgraded meter measuring 2.5000 mA current. On the left the meter is in the uA position, the test lead is in the A/mA jack and the meter reads 2.59 (uA) [3.6% high]. On the right I've switched to the mA position but the reading has gone down to 21.9 (mA) [12.4% low]. I obviously haven't corrected the position of the decimal. Remember, the actual current through the meter is 2.5 mA is both cases.
About a 0.12 ohm resistor will correct the magnitude of the of the reading when the meter's switch is in the mA position. But, I prefer having the decimal point in the correct position. Being in the A/mA jack will remind me that mA is the actual display units. I might purchase some 0.10 ohm resistors with less precision hoping to get one a bit low in value which will improve the mA reading's accuracy when the meter's switch is in the uA position.
how about calibrating it instead ? the eeprom holds calibration data. These machines do not bank on the precision of the resistors. they apply mathematical compensation.
-
BTW, ADM08A sells for 18-19 USD and it's much solidly build than AN8008....
I've got the Peak Meter branded version of that (the PM18C) and it's a pretty nice meter that works well. But I doubt it would appeal at all to the AN8002/8008 audience; it's about four times the size and manual ranging.
-
Maybe irrelevant but the DTM0660 chipset (used in the AN8002) only has calibration data for 3 different current ranges.
eg. https://github.com/pingumacpenguin/DTM0660-flasher-arduino-sketch/blob/master/STM32-DTM0660-24c02-Updater.ino
dont trust that script, i can see a blatant error in it without even trying.
the endian'nes is backwards on a pair of bytes in the count mod section.
-
My AN8008 finally arrived today! I did a few simple tests to see how well it performed. I do not have any precision voltage/current standards or supplies but in comparison with another meter it seemed to be pretty accurate and others have already confirmed these meters accuracy.
The Hz position seems to need typically 100mV input to reach 1.8 Mhz. To reach 9.99 Mhz a 900mV input just made it. I did not want to increase the input level further and find it difficult to see how it could reach the 80Mhz that Mark Hennessy referred to. The lowest frequency I could reach reliably was 1.1 Hz with an 80mV input. Higher input levels didn't affect the latter.
The Hz position Duty cycle seemed OK to approx. 1% although 2% was more stable. I used 200mV input at 150Khz.
The AC Frequency spec. of the V input achieved 1.6 Khz to 10 Hz with a 400mV Sine wave input. With a 10 Volt input the upper frequency dropped back to 1.1Khz. Both True RMS volts readings matched my oscilloscopes RMS readings which is good.
On this V input I noticed that changing the Sel from AC TRMS to the subsidiary Hz setting flashed up the true AC frequency for ~2sec before going to 0.000. I believe Mark Hennessy found this as well and it does seem to be a range change bug as Mark mentioned earlier. I also never saw any Duty cycle % reading. Perhaps others have seen this?
Capacitance measurement is most impressive providing one spaces the leads well apart. I measured 12pfd and 10pfd capacitors easily. Even more amazing it displayed 2 pfd for a 2.2pfd capacitor. (No more digits in display!)
Summing up a very useful little meter especially for electronic use and at the price fantastic. I agree with others that High voltages and Currents are not really suitable for this meter. Also the sockets are rather poorly made and may give some problems in the long term.
-
BTW, ADM08A sells for 18-19 USD and it's much solidly build than AN8008....
I've got the Peak Meter branded version of that (the PM18C) and it's a pretty nice meter that works well. But I doubt it would appeal at all to the AN8002/8008 audience; it's about four times the size and manual ranging.
Personally, I wouldn't mind manual ranging, but then - I haven't had an auto ranging meter yet. Functionality wise, for a 6000 count, it is more expensive than you can get the AN8002 (which is about $13-14 lowest price). None of them have a huge price difference though.
-
The Hz position seems to need typically 100mV input to reach 1.8 Mhz. To reach 9.99 Mhz a 900mV input just made it. I did not want to increase the input level further and find it difficult to see how it could reach the 80Mhz that Mark Hennessy referred to. The lowest frequency I could reach reliably was 1.1 Hz with an 80mV input. Higher input levels didn't affect the latter.
Just to add a bit more detail, I'm using an old HP8656A for this. The highest signal level this produces is +17dBm, which translates to ~1.6V. Pretty sure that's the highest I can easily achieve here, but if we have something else at work that is louder, I'll try it and report back.
I'm not sure what signal level Joe used to get 200MHz from an AN8002 - it's not mentioned in the video. Joe, if you're reading this, can you remember?
Hope that helps,
Mark
-
probably 3.3 or 5v
if i was testing frequency, i would be using logic to generate it.
-
probably 3.3 or 5v
if i was testing frequency, i would be using logic to generate it.
Fair comment, but in the video - at 15:50 - he says "RF generator" :-+
-
BTW, ADM08A sells for 18-19 USD and it's much solidly build than AN8008....
I've got the Peak Meter branded version of that (the PM18C) and it's a pretty nice meter that works well. But I doubt it would appeal at all to the AN8002/8008 audience; it's about four times the size and manual ranging.
have you opened it? i mean have you confirmed it's DM1106EN based and not DTM0660? ADM08A is using DM1106EN for sure. [EDIT] I found review in Russian here:
https://mysku.ru/blog/taobao/49127.html
and it's DM1106EN - also they list price of 13 USD [EDIT]
from my understanding for what main purposes people here want to use AN8008, i don't see manual ranging as an issue.
Personally, I wouldn't mind manual ranging, but then - I haven't had an auto ranging meter yet. Functionality wise, for a 6000 count, it is more expensive than you can get the AN8002 (which is about $13-14 lowest price). None of them have a huge price difference though.
IMHO, that's unfair comparison, because at least ADM08A, (which outside design is the same as Peak Meter PM18C, but I don't know if they are the same inside) is using the same chipset as AN8008 (DM1106EN) and it cost less than 19 USD delivered.
counts for those chipsets are just setting in the EEPROM, you can set those meters to any count up to 9999 with changing 2 bytes in their EEPROM, but DTM0660-based meter like AN8002 cannot go more than 8500 counts. so, what I am wondering and interested to see, someone who has the necessary equipment to make tests - hack the EEPROM of DM1106EN-based ADM08A to 9999 counts and compare it against AN8008. in fact AN8008 EEPROM dump I posted above can be used as reference for such hack.
price-wise AN8002 is the cheapest, then it's ADM08A and then AN8008, but both ADM08A and AN8008 has same new DM1106EN chipset and ADM08A has better overall build quality and if EEPROM hack to 9999 counts is reliable then ADM08A is better choice.
-
if DM1106EN is a replacement for the 0660 then it could even be in some 8002's like it seems to be in newer UT-210e's
-
The datasheet says battery test for 9V and 1.5V. I guess 40mA load for 1.5V and 24mA for 9V.
More useful than a square wave output! :)
(Now I need one of those as well. :scared: )
PS: Do you think I should send one to Batteroo for their test lab?
That is the cheapest meter I see with battery tester ($3.7).
That one and the free-with-coupon-but-still-really-cheap Harbor Freight/Cen-Tech meter.
-
have you opened [the Peak Meter PM18C]? i mean have you confirmed it's DM1106EN based and not DTM0660? ADM08A is using DM1106EN for sure.
I've opened it, but I didn't check the chip. (I think it may have been under a blob of epoxy.) The interior, BTW, looks ok, especially for a cheap meter; it's got much larger fuses than the AN8002. I worry about the circuitry that brings inputs up to the transistor test socket at the top, though; I don't know much about this but that doesn't seem like such a good idea to me from a safety point of view.
from my understanding for what main purposes people here want to use AN8008, i don't see manual ranging as an issue.
No, but the selection of ranges might be. My PM-18C has different holes in the amps ranges; instead of 100?A/1000?A/1000mA/10A (.01/.1/1000/100k ?A resolution) it's got 60?A/60mA/600mA/20A (i.e. .01/10/100/1000k ?A resolution). So it drops a bit off the bottom to give a bit more in the middle, as far as the low current stuff goes, and high current is less precision. That sounds better to my mind for general purpose stuff (again, I'm a noob), but maybe the .01 ?A resolution is useful for some stuff. (I would think when you get down that low you'd probably want to be measuring voltage across a known resistance already in the circuit, wouldn't you, in which case the meters are the same because same lowest voltage resolution?)
-
BTW, ADM08A sells for 18-19 USD and it's much solidly build than AN8008....
I've got the Peak Meter branded version of that (the PM18C) and it's a pretty nice meter that works well. But I doubt it would appeal at all to the AN8002/8008 audience; it's about four times the size and manual ranging.
See the PM18A I noted in the 8001 thread (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/aneng-an8001-6000-count-true-rms-multimeter/msg1247748/#msg1247748), appears to be a new meter, auto ranging version of the 18C
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PEAKMETER-Multimeter-Voltmeter-Ammeter-PM18A-with-True-RMS-AC-DC-Voltage-Resistance-Capacitance-Frequency-Temperature-NCV/32817940143.html (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PEAKMETER-Multimeter-Voltmeter-Ammeter-PM18A-with-True-RMS-AC-DC-Voltage-Resistance-Capacitance-Frequency-Temperature-NCV/32817940143.html)
-
I modified my AN8008 to provide single digit mA readings with 3 digit resolution. I replaced the regular mA/A readings with the ability to measure currents below 100 mA with a XX.XX mA display. Currents below 1A are measured with the same XXX.X mA display. 1A is now the maximum current which can be measured.
I replaced the 0.01 ohm shunt resistor for the A/mA jack with a 0.10 ohm 0.5% resistor which I had in stock. Attached is a picture of the upgraded meter measuring 2.5000 mA current. On the left the meter is in the uA position, the test lead is in the A/mA jack and the meter reads 2.59 (uA) [3.6% high]. On the right I've switched to the mA position but the reading has gone down to 21.9 (mA) [12.4% low]. I obviously haven't corrected the position of the decimal. Remember, the actual current through the meter is 2.5 mA is both cases.
About a 0.12 ohm resistor will correct the magnitude of the of the reading when the meter's switch is in the mA position. But, I prefer having the decimal point in the correct position. Being in the A/mA jack will remind me that mA is the actual display units. I might purchase some 0.10 ohm resistors with less precision hoping to get one a bit low in value which will improve the mA reading's accuracy when the meter's switch is in the uA position.
how about calibrating it instead ? the eeprom holds calibration data. These machines do not bank on the precision of the resistors. they apply mathematical compensation.
according to HoldPeak HP890CN calibration procedures :
short the calibration jumper, enter the calibration mode, connect the probes to the specified reference DC/AC voltage/current/resistor... press the SELECT [function]/HOLD [-]/Other buttons - ... repeat for other ranges ... restore the jumper to it's normal position (eeprom write protected position).
-
again, the common opinion is DTM0600 and DM1106EN are cheap clones of Hycon HY12P66, that's why there are so cheap DMMs with them compared to the one that has original Hycon HY12P66 inside.
I don't think DTM0660L/DM1106EN are clones. You can see from the DTM0660L photo
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-trms-uni-t-ut139c-dmm-is-available-now/?action=dlattach;attach=60031;image)
there are two logos on the chip, DreamTech / HyconTek.
(http://www.dreamtechintl.com.cn/templates/en2014/images//in_02.gif)
(http://www.hycontek.com/wp-content/themes/hycon/images/logo/logo.png)
Dream Tech International Ltd is just a trading company import the chips from Taiwan, and export the chips to the manufacturers in China. They do not produce any semiconductors.
HyconTek is just provided a DMM solution to the customers. You can order your customized chips from them.
Dream Tech International Ltd
http://www.dreamtechintl.com.cn/en/about/about-108.html (http://www.dreamtechintl.com.cn/en/about/about-108.html)
-
With regard to the Hz input level and Mark's comment about using up to ~ 1.7 volt input. I became a bit more courageous and upped the level to a 4 volt sine wave and managed to get to 19 Mhz. A 4 volt Square wave gave a similar result. I am definitely stopping at this level as I don't wish to possibly kill the meter or at least the Hz function. It is not a function I expect to use but you never know it may be useful at some time in the future.
Edit: I checked my signal generator it was not a 4 volts level but a 3.7 pp Sine and the Square was also a Sine! Just goes to prove one cannot believe the output levels on a cheap signal generator and one should always double check with a more professional instrument!
-
My PM-18C has different holes in the amps ranges; instead of 100?A/1000?A/1000mA/10A (.01/.1/1000/100k ?A resolution) it's got 60?A/60mA/600mA/20A (i.e. .01/10/100/1000k ?A resolution).
i don't think that's an issue (as far as not some external components to DM1106EN are crucial for the resolution), because what to measure on what position depends on the EEPROM settings - the same how C/F temperature measurement are added to mV position on AN8008. basically, you should be able to re-arrange what position measures what just with changing bytes in the EEPROM.
BTW, ADM08A sells for 18-19 USD and it's much solidly build than AN8008....
I've got the Peak Meter branded version of that (the PM18C) and it's a pretty nice meter that works well. But I doubt it would appeal at all to the AN8002/8008 audience; it's about four times the size and manual ranging.
See the PM18A I noted in the 8001 thread (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/aneng-an8001-6000-count-true-rms-multimeter/msg1247748/#msg1247748), appears to be a new meter, auto ranging version of the 18C
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PEAKMETER-Multimeter-Voltmeter-Ammeter-PM18A-with-True-RMS-AC-DC-Voltage-Resistance-Capacitance-Frequency-Temperature-NCV/32817940143.html (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PEAKMETER-Multimeter-Voltmeter-Ammeter-PM18A-with-True-RMS-AC-DC-Voltage-Resistance-Capacitance-Frequency-Temperature-NCV/32817940143.html)
that's interesting, but there are no any photos of PM18A inside, that I can find - is it DM1106EN or not?
again, the common opinion is DTM0600 and DM1106EN are cheap clones of Hycon HY12P66, that's why there are so cheap DMMs with them compared to the one that has original Hycon HY12P66 inside.
I don't think DTM0660L/DM1106EN are clones. You can see from the DTM0660L photo
there are two logos on the chip, DreamTech / HyconTek.
Dream Tech International Ltd is just a trading company import the chips from Taiwan, and export the chips to the manufacturers in China. They do not produce any semiconductors.
HyconTek is just provided a DMM solution to the customers. You can order your customized chips from them.
Dream Tech International Ltd
http://www.dreamtechintl.com.cn/en/about/about-108.html (http://www.dreamtechintl.com.cn/en/about/about-108.html)
interesting observation, you seems to be correct! I just doubt anyone else until now noticed that!!
[EDIT] HyconTek posted all kinds of information and tools on their website:
www.hycontek.com/en/products-en/3256 (http://www.hycontek.com/en/products-en/3256)
-
My PM-18C has different holes in the amps ranges; instead of 100?A/1000?A/1000mA/10A (.01/.1/1000/100k ?A resolution) it's got 60?A/60mA/600mA/20A (i.e. .01/10/100/1000k ?A resolution). So it drops a bit off the bottom to give a bit more in the middle
IIRC there's an expensive Agilent that jumps from 600uA to 6A.
-
i don't think that's an issue (as far as not some external components to DM1106EN are crucial for the resolution), because what to measure on what position depends on the EEPROM settings - the same how C/F temperature measurement are added to mV position on AN8008. basically, you should be able to re-arrange what position measures what just with changing bytes in the EEPROM.
the measurement function not only depends on the eeprom settings. It also requires external components with proper wiring.
in the DTM0660L reference design, it uses 3 shunt resistors (0.01ohm, 0.99ohm, 99ohm) with a combination of eeprom settings (#1 change the gain of the amplifier; #2 control the decimal place), to cover all the current ranges from 60uA to 20A. (60uA, 600uA, 6mA, 60mA, 600mA, 6A, 20A).
in the AN8008 design, it seems that it only use 2 shut resistors, I would guess you cannot simply change the eeprom settings to achieve your goal.
-
IIRC there's an expensive Agilent that jumps from 600uA to 6A.
The U1230 series? It is low-end for Keysight (Agilent).
I think this is done as they're using the V terminal, and taking the uA circuitry from there. They can't allow many mA through as this low impedance pathway would then compromise the safety. (And the A path can't deliver accurate mA indications.) You can only get uA 'for free' from the V terminal.
Having separate A and uA/mA terminals resolves this.
-
are there any schematics about for 0660 based meters with the NCV function?
i'm curious what components are involved and the only meter i have here is an 8002.
-
are there any schematics about for 0660 based meters with the NCV function?
i'm curious what components are involved and the only meter i have here is an 8002.
NCV measurement schematic
the antenna pickup the AC signal
0 - 50mV, display shows "EF"
50 ~ 100mV, "-" 1 bar
100 ~ 150mV, "- -" 2 bars
150 ~ 200mV, "- - -" 3 bars
> 250mV, "- - - -" 4 bars
the sensitivity can be programmable
-
any chance of the rest of the schematic?
i'm curious about the star on the resistor and the function of the jumper.
-
any chance of the rest of the schematic?
i'm curious about the star on the resistor and the function of the jumper.
RLD is the signal input pin, i.e. short the jumper in NCV measurement
I think the resistor value (10M) is not that critical. It just connect the antenna to the ground.
-
I received my AN8008 21 days after buying it on Ebay. Shipped from China. I paid $10.00 for it plus $4.34 for shipping, or a total of only $14.34. For that price, it is a remarkable meter. I checked it on most ranges and functions and it easily meets its specifications, usually much better. It comes with 2 sets of test leads and a wide range of tip adapters. The built-in stand is flimsy but usable.
-
NCV measurement from the AC voltage signal into the RLD IC, the measurement results show five grades, 0 ~ 50mV display EF, 50 ~ 100mV / 100 ~ 150mV / 150 ~ 200mV / 250mV or more to 4 show a '-' character (adjustable) and with(?) the rhythm buzzer sound.
Applications need to be adjusted according to the value of Rx and the induction line. NCV measurement and the minimum resolution that can be set E2 (In 0.1mV): 25h (H) & 24h (L) set in base NCV measurements, 27h (H) & 26h (L) NCV resolution setting,
Calculated as the measured value :( - in base) / = 0 ~ 4 Resolution (rounded result), the count is greater than 4. 4. Such as:
25h (H) & 24h (L) = 0064h, 27h (H) & 26h (L) = 0096h, measuring the induced signal = 50.0mV, then LEVEL = (50.0-10.0) /15.0~=2, the display section 2 '- -. "
Optional PT1.2 NCV function as a control indicator (E2 provided F9h.bit0 = 1). When no signal PT1.2 = 0, a letter.
When the number PT1.2 with buzzer output, buzzer PT1.2 = 1, and 0 otherwise. This setting has no effect on other functions, PT1.2 = 1.
-
I spent time reverse-engineering and figured out the schematic but the IC (die) pinout a bit different than DTM0660. The actual MCU must be the same family but with better A/D resolution and external Vref.
My guess is Dream Tech International writes the firmware for the multimeter MCU.
From Russian AN8008_1715xxxxx EEPROM dump I can see unused functions- such as temperature measurement, hFE, middle current, non-contact AC voltage detection (NCV) etc.
Should be possible to enable some eggs.
I could not find a UART TX line. I think the die-bonding wire is not brought out :(
-
GBP 8.99 including shipping. Wonder how much profit is left from that?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-Voltage-Ammeter-AC-DC-/162596699062 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-Voltage-Ammeter-AC-DC-/162596699062)
-
GBP 8.99 including shipping. Wonder how much profit is left from that?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-Voltage-Ammeter-AC-DC-/162596699062 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-Voltage-Ammeter-AC-DC-/162596699062)
Isn't that one possibly a fraud? Considering the price, not the seller.
-
GBP 8.99 including shipping. Wonder how much profit is left from that?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-Voltage-Ammeter-AC-DC-/162596699062 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-Voltage-Ammeter-AC-DC-/162596699062)
This doesn't work with PayPal.
-
Have not bought myself, but I get a choice of paypal or creditcard at checkout when I try. Isn't payment options handled by ebay? :-//
-
Have not bought myself, but I get a choice of paypal or creditcard at checkout when I try. Isn't payment options handled by ebay? :-//
After selecting PayPal as payment option and logging in, there was an error saying the payment option isn't available.
And now the product has been removed from seller's listings. Either the payments were disabled because of possibility of that listing being a fraud, or the item was removed earlier and it took a while until that got synchronized across the servers :-//
-
Sounds like a "deal breaker", at least now you can afford a sandwich!
-
Quote from: crazyguy on Yesterday at 19:15:29 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=90929.msg1260476#msg1260476)
>Quote from: stj on Yesterday at 18:46:34 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=90929.msg1260458#msg1260458)any chance of the rest of the schematic?
i'm curious about the star on the resistor and the function of the jumper.
Here is the translated datasheet into english, with automated software help.
-
I got better stability and accuracy after changing the big bypass cap.
I found 3VDC rail has ~30mVpp of noise, low freq. (1kHz) and high freq. from DMM IC charge-pump.
The PCB has places for four 22uF 1206 decoupling capacitors C10, C14, C15, C16 but what's populated is one through-hole 100uF 16V YXA electrolytic that has poor ESR.
Changed to 47uF+two of 22uF X7R 6.3V (total measures 84uF) and 1/3 the noise now. Readings are more consistent and repeatable. Before I always had 2-5 counts variation.
The ICL8069DCZQ 1.2Vref is pretty quiet, C11 0.1uF across it but datasheet gives 4.7uF so you could upsize.
-
hardware mods - nice.
i need to check my 8002 board - it uses a YXA, maybe stuff a polymer cap in instead. :)
-
Ordered one on ebay from China. Almost 16€, but had a 15€ coupon for a 20€ order so I added a magnetic usb and paid less than 6€.
Let's see when arrives...
Enviado desde mi Jolla mediante Tapatalk
-
I wonder what the MOQ would be for a slightly customized AN8002 or AN8008. Bonded TX pin and remove the fake CAT markings.
-
There's another suspicious listing on eBay, I guess this model is becoming very popular?
-
Got my 2 today. Nice and small. Useful when one runs out of DMMs and still need to measure something.
-
I wonder what the MOQ would be for a slightly customized AN8002 or AN8008. Bonded TX pin and remove the fake CAT markings.
i wouldnt call the CAT markings fake without checking the detail - the fuses dont count.
-
I got better stability and accuracy after changing the big bypass cap.
I found 3VDC rail has ~30mVpp of noise, low freq. (1kHz) and high freq. from DMM IC charge-pump.
The PCB has places for four 22uF 1206 decoupling capacitors C10, C14, C15, C16 but what's populated is one through-hole 100uF 16V YXA electrolytic that has poor ESR.
Changed to 47uF+two of 22uF X7R 6.3V (total measures 84uF) and 1/3 the noise now. Readings are more consistent and repeatable. Before I always had 2-5 counts variation.
The ICL8069DCZQ 1.2Vref is pretty quiet, C11 0.1uF across it but datasheet gives 4.7uF so you could upsize.
Nice job.
These are easy hacks that everyone can do and are very affordable :)
-
i wouldnt call the CAT markings fake without checking the detail - the fuses dont count.
Sure they do. A meter with a CAT rating has to live or die safely at that rating with the selector switch in any position.
If the fuses are stamped "250V" then they can't possibly claim it's 1000V CAT rated. Simple as that.
-
Got my 2 today. Nice and small. Useful when one runs out of DMMs and still need to measure something.
Still didn't get mine. >:(
-
If the fuses are stamped "250V" then they can't possibly claim it's 1000V CAT rated. Simple as that.
Especially since that 250 V is likely only applicable to AC. A 1000 V rating requires the fuses to also work at 1000 VDC.
-
Quick test:
Took a 1.5V battery and measured the battery voltage with two AN8008 and one UT61E simultaneously: AN8008s displays 1.565 +/- 0.001 and UT61E 1.5655 +/- 0.0001.
Current measurement test with the three DMMs in series in uA range: 3.37 uA +/- 0.01 uA.
-
fuses are only for reading current, the CAT ratings are only for reading voltage.
*and i'm pretty sure they dont cover the ability to do something stupid like spining the rotary switch while the leads are hot.
-
fuses are only for reading current
That part's true.
the CAT ratings are only for reading voltage.
*and i'm pretty sure they dont cover the ability to do something stupid like spining the rotary switch while the leads are hot.
This part? You made it up.
CAT ratings do cover doing stupid things like spining<sic> the rotary switch while the leads are hot.
-
fuses are only for reading current, the CAT ratings are only for reading voltage.
*and i'm pretty sure they dont cover the ability to do something stupid like spining the rotary switch while the leads are hot.
Do you have a reference for your definite statement? IEC 61010-1 2nd edition is directly contradicting your statement (see attachment). I do not have access to the third edition, so feel free to post a quote if they relaxed that requirement. I do not believe the impulse voltage tests have to be applied at the current inputs, only the maximum rated voltage (i.e. 1000 V DC and AC in this case).
-
alm:
What is the full title of the document you have?
I have found the general part of 61010-1, 3rd ed, but there are several parts.
http://www.china-gauges.com/download/IEC-61010-1-2010-06.html (http://www.china-gauges.com/download/IEC-61010-1-2010-06.html)
-
ANSI/ISA-61010-1 (82.02.01)
CSA C22.2 No. 1010.1
ANSI/UL 61010-1
Formerly ANSI/ISA-82.02.01-1999 (IEC 61010-1 Mod)
Safety Requirements for Electrical Equipment for Measurement, Control and Laboratory Use Part 1: General requirements
[...]
This standard is based on IEC 61010-1, Second Edition (2001).
In the second edition, the test and measurement section was still part of 61010-1. In the third edition, it was moved to IEC 61010-2-030 (https://webstore.iec.ch/publication/59784), so it would not be included in the document you linked. IEC 61010-2-033 (https://webstore.iec.ch/publication/4288) may also be relevant.
-
In the case of the CAT markings on the AN8008, the ratings are clearly not claimed for the fused A/mA input jack, so there's no requirement for fuses to meet that rating. I think you're arguing about a moot point.
-
In the case of the CAT markings on the AN8008, the ratings are clearly not claimed for the fused A/mA input jack, so there's no requirement for fuses to meet that rating. I think you're arguing about a moot point.
a) There's a fuse in the uA input path, shared with the voltage ranges.
And ... (b) I'm fairly sure the CAT rating doesn't only apply to specific input jacks no matter how they draw it on the front.
The standard doesn't seem ambiguous: "The maximum voltage for any function is applied to each pair of terminals..."
-
Found Russian edition of IEC 61010-2-030-2013 and IEC 61010-2-033-2013
Google translate seems to make sense, and it seems like both standards are identical to the original text according to translate.
61010-2-030
http://docs.cntd.ru/document/1200110355 (http://docs.cntd.ru/document/1200110355)
61010-2-033
http://docs.cntd.ru/document/1200107023 (http://docs.cntd.ru/document/1200107023)
Maybe some of our Russian speaking members can take a look at it and tell us what they think?
A IEC site:docs.cntd.ru/document/ search reveals other standards as well.
-
Guys, It's a $20 meter FFS! If I had to test a 1,000V system or a 15kA supply, I wouldn't be happy using my Fluke or Agilent meters. I bought an AN8008 so I could measure mA, uA, and a few volts on small embedded systems. For $20 they could write anything they like on the case.
-
Two more from Russia worth looking at
IEC 61010-2-032-2014
Safety of electrical equipment for measurement, control and laboratory use. Part 2-032. Particular requirements for hand-held and hand-manipulated current sensors for electrical tests and measurement
http://docs.cntd.ru/document/1200114258 (http://docs.cntd.ru/document/1200114258)
IEC 61010-031-2013
Safety requirements for electrical equipment for measurement, control and laboratory use. Part 031 Safety requirements for hand-held probe assemblies for electrical measurements and tests
http://docs.cntd.ru/document/1200110262 (http://docs.cntd.ru/document/1200110262)
-
Searched the Internet, could not find a PDF manual for this "AN8008 True-RMS Digital Multimeter". Anyone know of a download link? Thanks!
-
here:
-
they seem pretty proud of it. (the meter)
http://www.szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144 (http://www.szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144)
-
Searched the Internet, could not find a PDF manual for this "AN8008 True-RMS Digital Multimeter". Anyone know of a download link? Thanks!
ANENG AN8008 is re-branded model of the Shenzhen ZOTEK Instruments ZT-109
ZOTEK ZT-109
http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144 (http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144)
-
Searched the Internet, could not find a PDF manual for this "AN8008 True-RMS Digital Multimeter". Anyone know of a download link? Thanks!
ANENG AN8008 is re-branded model of the Shenzhen ZOTEK Instruments ZT-109
ZOTEK ZT-109
http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144 (http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144)
The funny thing is that the ZT-109 is a lot more expensive than the AN8008 :-//
-
I can hardly understand, what current someone can measure on the cat III or IV equipment with 500 mA and 10 A ranges. Wire up a kettle for test purposes? Short probes across the phases?
-
I can hardly understand, what current someone can measure on the cat III or IV equipment with 500 mA and 10 A ranges. Wire up a kettle for test purposes? Short probes across the phases?
LOL, VERY funny :-DD How about - test the control rod mechanism in a nuclear power plant?
Mine is still in transit - I ordered an AN8008 from Amazon on July 16th thinking that it was shipping from the USA. It says "Package received by carrier CHINA" as of July 19th and is supposed to arrive with me in the US between 4-25 August! I paid a couple of dollars extra at Amazon but they don't specifically make it clear when something is coming from China which eBay does >:( but my experience is that stuff often arrives much sooner than estimated when coming from China.
-
Searched the Internet, could not find a PDF manual for this "AN8008 True-RMS Digital Multimeter". Anyone know of a download link? Thanks!
ANENG AN8008 is re-branded model of the Shenzhen ZOTEK Instruments ZT-109
ZOTEK ZT-109
http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144 (http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144)
The funny thing is that the ZT-109 is a lot more expensive than the AN8008 :-//
Are they totally identical inside? I wonder if the TX pin is bonded in the more expensive Zotek version.
-
LOL, VERY funny :-DD How about - test the control rod mechanism in a nuclear power plant?
Too much exotic thing.
My imagination on these categories ends on the simple substation stuff. Large busbars, high current, etc.
-
I can hardly understand, what current someone can measure on the cat III or IV equipment with 500 mA and 10 A ranges. Wire up a kettle for test purposes? Short probes across the phases?
I agree that the risk of disrupting a conductor sounds strange for a high-energy circuit. There are some adapters (https://www.gossenmetrawatt.com/gmc/english/produkte/pma16.htm) that allow interruption of mains conductors without exposed wiring. In addition, some AC current clamps have an output of 1 mA/A, so they require a mA jack to use.
There is also the current that flows if you accidentally leave it set to current and connect it across a voltage source (or even set it to voltage with the leads in the current jacks for meters that do not have a jack alert)? Humans make mistakes, and a good safety systems are there to prevent people from getting injured/killed by those mistakes.
If you want to prevent those mistakes, then you can use meters without current jacks like the Fluke 101 (http://www.fluke.com/fluke/vnen/digital-multimeters/Compact-Multimeters/Fluke-101.htm?PID=77003) or Fluke T5-600/1000 (http://www.fluke.com/fluke/caen/electrical-testers/Electrical-Testers/Fluke-T5-1000.htm?PID=55986). No expensive fuses to blow either ;).
-
some AC current clamps have an output of 1 mA/A, so they require a mA jack to use.
Didn't know that. Thanks for clarification.
If you want to prevent those mistakes, then you can use meters without current jacks like the Fluke 101 or Fluke T5-600/1000. No expensive fuses to blow either ;).
Thanks, but I never had a problem with the choice of dmm.
Also those type of adapters is great. I use this: http://www.pinsonne-elektronik.de/media/images/ut71_poweradapter.jpg (http://www.pinsonne-elektronik.de/media/images/ut71_poweradapter.jpg) with the ut71e for a couple of years.
-
Searched the Internet, could not find a PDF manual for this "AN8008 True-RMS Digital Multimeter". Anyone know of a download link? Thanks!
ANENG AN8008 is re-branded model of the Shenzhen ZOTEK Instruments ZT-109
ZOTEK ZT-109
http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144 (http://szzotek.com/en/col.jsp?id=144)
The funny thing is that the ZT-109 is a lot more expensive than the AN8008 :-//
Are they totally identical inside? I wonder if the TX pin is bonded in the more expensive Zotek version.
don't expected too much
In Dave's teardown video, the PCB version already exposed the true identity of the Aneng AN8008.
The PCB version is ZT109 V0.4 170213
7:59
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdGQEVdxmQQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdGQEVdxmQQ)
Zotek VC17B+, it is much easier to add the RS232 connection
http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135&page=171# (http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135&page=171#)
-
Zotek VC17B+, it is much easier to add the RS232 connection
http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135&page=171# (http://kazus.ru/forums/showthread.php?t=112135&page=171#)
Aneng rebrand model is AN860B+. The non plus version AN860B had a bug when switchin from DC to AC. I don't know if it is fixed in the + model.
-
I can hardly understand, what current someone can measure on the cat III or IV equipment with 500 mA and 10 A ranges. Wire up a kettle for test purposes? Short probes across the phases?
LOL, VERY funny :-DD How about - test the control rod mechanism in a nuclear power plant?
Mine is still in transit - I ordered an AN8008 from Amazon on July 16th thinking that it was shipping from the USA. It says "Package received by carrier CHINA" as of July 19th and is supposed to arrive with me in the US between 4-25 August! I paid a couple of dollars extra at Amazon but they don't specifically make it clear when something is coming from China which eBay does >:( but my experience is that stuff often arrives much sooner than estimated when coming from China.
I did exactly the same Amazon order. Thought I might get it quicker, not the case.
-
Just be careful if buying from eBay for a suspiciously low price. From time to time, they pop up. I guess you can get the money back, but still.
-
Just be careful if buying from eBay for a suspiciously low price. From time to time, they pop up. I guess you can get the money back, but still.
Indeed, EBay is my last choice when shopping, though at times it's the only place to find "odd" items.
-
Lifted the 24C02 EEPROM's SDA, SCL pins and attached wires. Used an Arduino and 3V level translator.
Bytes match a Russian AN8008 dump, aside from the CAL factors.
The DMM IC is full featured but the multimeter's hardware (rotary switch, die-bonding PCB) prevents their use. LCD has all annunciators though. I don't have the exact datasheet for the DMM IC, just its predecessors.
RS-232 output - I can't see the IC TXD pin bonded.
hFE test - needs transistor socket and 3 resistors but could be done from the front banana jacks.
Mid-range amps - not possible as rotary switch does not bypass 99R (uA) shunt. I still hear Dave yelling about this gyp. Could add a switch, lol.
Temperature - I enabled in EEPROM on the mV function, works °C/°F and factory CJC CAL is already set at 25°C fixed.
NCV - could be used with antenna 10MEG resistor added.
Clamp-on CT - could add if you enter CAL factors.
Presently only two buttons: SEL/HOLD and RANGE/BL.
To add MAX/MIN & RELATIVE buttons- I haven't checked if that MCU pin available; they are muxed.
So you can enable the temp function (although shown here (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1244596/#msg1244596) it's advertised in Russia; my meter did not have the function).
Also you can change timer settings for BL and power off etc. or change calibration.
Factory alarms set to 1,000VDC and 750VAC. OL at 1,100VDC and 800VAC.
It was a fun adventure.
-
Flooby, seems like you're much deeper into the guts of the AN8008 than most of us - well done! I'd like to make a couple of mods when mine gets here so I'm interested in your thoughts:
1. Change Amps to mA - I know you've stated that it can be done by changing shunt resistors but can the EEPROM also be hacked to give the correct display? I don't want to measure Amps, just mA and uA.
2. Take out the elCheapo electrolytic Cap on the 3 volt rail and put in 1206 caps as suggested by you a couple of pages back (search he thread for "1206")
Any other low-hanging fruit?
-
RS-232 output - I can't see the IC TXD pin bonded.
How did you check this?
For one AN8002 unit I removed die potting epoxy to reveal pin 20 pcb pad. I added a pull-up resistor and measured the signal. Nothing was visible. I sacrificed this unit and removed the potting epoxy to reveal the bonding wires and the die. The pin was unbonded.
-
1. Change Amps to mA - I know you've stated that it can be done by changing shunt resistors but can the EEPROM also be hacked to give the correct display? I don't want to measure Amps, just mA and uA.
+1 Seems the best mod for electronics use.
Any other low-hanging fruit?
Temp? I wasn't sure if that really worked. Some posts said yes, I think one said it didn't.
-
1. Change Amps to mA - I know you've stated that it can be done by changing shunt resistors but can the EEPROM also be hacked to give the correct display? I don't want to measure Amps, just mA and uA.
I changed the 0.01 ohm shunt resistor for the AmA jack to 0.095 ohms and now with the leads in the COM and AmA jacks, but the AN8008 rotary switch in the uA position, I measure mA current up to 99.99 mA with 0.01 mA resolution and 0.1 mA resolution up to 999.9 mA with the decimal in the correct location. 999.9 mA is the maximum current which can be read now. The mA readings are now typically 0.35% high. I haven't tried to change the meter's software yet. Others might need a slightly different value shunt resistor.
-
1. Change Amps to mA - I know you've stated that it can be done by changing shunt resistors but can the EEPROM also be hacked to give the correct display? I don't want to measure Amps, just mA and uA.
I changed the 0.01 ohm shunt resistor for the AmA jack to 0.095 ohms and now with the leads in the COM and AmA jacks, but the AN8008 rotary switch in the uA position, I measure mA current up to 99.99 mA with 0.01 mA resolution and 0.1 mA resolution up to 999.9 mA with the decimal in the correct location. 999.9 mA is the maximum current which can be read now. The mA readings are now typically 0.35% high. I haven't tried to change the meter's software yet. Others might need a slightly different value shunt resistor.
Thanks, what size is that 0.095 Ohm resistor? (my AN8008 hasn't arrived yet).
-
Thanks, what size is that 0.095 Ohm resistor?
While a resistive wire resistor like a 0.1 ohm IRC OAR1R100FLF would be best due to its 20 PPM/C temperature coefficient, they are not available in odd values. Because of that I went with two 0.0475 ohm Vishay RCWH080547L5FNEA 200 PPM/C 1/3W resistors in series. With the one amp current maximum with that modification they would each dissipate 0.0475 watts and would have a collective burden voltage of 0.095 volts. You need remove some solder mask to conveniently install the new resistors.
You would probably end up with a lower temperature coefficient using the mentioned 0.1 ohm resistor with a 2 ohm resistor in parallel with it. This might make it easier to fine tune the resistance to "calibrate" it. A 10% value change in the 2 ohm resistor value will only change the parallel resistance by 0.43%. I might try that.
-
Missing are the 9.999mA and 99.99mA ranges.
Right now, it has 10mR and 100R shunts only. The hardware (range switch) needs to switch in R24 1R shunt (J4/R14 in the generic schematic) to the input jack. If you look at the PCB you will see nothing connected to R23/R24 junction.
Then you need the MCU firmware to enable this function, and it has separate CAL factors for the ranges. The MCU firmware probably supports this- the predecessor 6,000 count DMM IC has those ranges under function code 0EH, 0DH which is not used in my AN8008 EEPROM dump. The predecessor IC has no 60.00uA (99.99uA) range but the new IC does.
I haven't had time to try it.
Notice the meter has Hz/%duty cycle twice on the rotary switch. I think they screwed up on the design a bit.
-
RS-232 output - I can't see the IC TXD pin bonded.
How did you check this?
For one AN8002 unit I removed die potting epoxy to reveal pin 20 pcb pad. I added a pull-up resistor and measured the signal. Nothing was visible. I sacrificed this unit and removed the potting epoxy to reveal the bonding wires and the die. The pin was unbonded.
For lowest cost, I assumed unused pins would not be bonded out. TXD would be very useful for testing.
Here is the region on the PCB I guessed TXD would be brought out. I do not see any traces there, however I do not have the exact die pinout. I'm not using the QFP pinout.
What are you using for a solvent on the encapsulant? TXD may very well be accessible.
-
RS-232 output - I can't see the IC TXD pin bonded.
How did you check this?
For one AN8002 unit I removed die potting epoxy to reveal pin 20 pcb pad. I added a pull-up resistor and measured the signal. Nothing was visible. I sacrificed this unit and removed the potting epoxy to reveal the bonding wires and the die. The pin was unbonded.
For lowest cost, I assumed unused pins would not be bonded out. TXD would be very useful for testing.
Here is the region on the PCB I guessed TXD would be brought out. I do not see any traces there, however I do not have the exact die pinout. I'm not using the QFP pinout.
What are you using for a solvent on the encapsulant? TXD may very well be accessible.
There is a IC (QFP) footprint under the encapsulant. The die is bonded to the inner end of the pads. So you can carefully remove the encapsulant to reveal the outer end of the pads without harming the bonding wires. I just used hot air to soften the encapsulant and removed it carefully with a surgical knife. The TX pad is the fourth from the top on the left side in your image. Check the DTM0660 datasheet pinout.
-
Missing are the 9.999mA and 99.99mA ranges.
Changing to the 0.01 ohm resistor to 0.095 ohms adds the 9.99 mA (yes, 9.999 would be better) and 99.99 mA to the 999.9 mA range while removing the 9.999A range with the decimal point in the correct position when the meter switch is left in the uA position but the AmA jack is used instead.
Right now, it has 10mR and 100R shunts only.
My AN8008 does not have a 100 ohm resistor. It has a 99 ohm resistor in series with a 1 ohm resistor. The 1 ohm resistor is there for use (with some switching).
-
There is a IC (QFP) footprint under the encapsulant. The die is bonded to the inner end of the pads. So you can carefully remove the encapsulant to reveal the outer end of the pads without harming the bonding wires. I just used hot air to soften the encapsulant and removed it carefully with a surgical knife. The TX pad is the fourth from the top on the left side in your image. Check the DTM0660 datasheet pinout.
Ok sounds good, maybe post a pic I have no idea what it looks like under the blob.
Part two to getting serial data output is hitting the RS-232 button. Oh wait we don't have one :palm:
The button matrix is 2x3 mux and "REL/RS-232" button should be PT1.0 pin 42 to EEPROM SDA, both traces are available.
The AN8008 has oddball button assignments in firmware.
-
There is a IC (QFP) footprint under the encapsulant. The die is bonded to the inner end of the pads. So you can carefully remove the encapsulant to reveal the outer end of the pads without harming the bonding wires. I just used hot air to soften the encapsulant and removed it carefully with a surgical knife. The TX pad is the fourth from the top on the left side in your image. Check the DTM0660 datasheet pinout.
Ok sounds good, maybe post a pic I have no idea what it looks like under the blob.
Part two to getting serial data output is hitting the RS-232 button. Oh wait we don't have one :palm:
The button matrix is 2x3 mux and "REL/RS-232" button should be PT1.0 pin 42 to EEPROM SDA, both traces are available.
The AN8008 has oddball button assignments in firmware.
Here is a picture of the AN8002 IC.
(http://i.imgur.com/smtnXFr.jpg)
-
Thanks for the pics of what is under there 8) For some reason the LQFP-64 and die versions have different pinouts :-//
I notice the max. counts is programmable with some people changing upper limit 4000, 6000, 9999 counts etc. in the EEPROM for the 8002, 210, 890's etc.
That means you can crank up the A/D counts, although the Vref on 8002 is not super good.
Some guy's Arduino sketch to change EEPROM (https://github.com/pingumacpenguin/DTM0660-flasher-arduino-sketch). I did my own sketch, not pretty enough to post.
-
Why do you think the pinout is different? The Victor VC921 is based on DTM0660 and it is die based. It also has visible pads (they used less epoxy than on the AN8002). The pin numbers matches the data sheet.
The DTM0660 chip is sold as 4000/6000 counts with 9999 for capacitance and frequency. You can increase the counts, but it seems like the AC/DC converter fails above some 7500 counts because of the crest factor. 9999 seems to be OK for DC-only.
I guess the main difference between DTM0660 and the new chip in AN8008 is how they implemented the AC/DC converter. It is believed to be a digital signal processor.
The picture of the VC921 is from kazus.ru
-
The DTM0660 datasheet gives two schematics for a 3V multimeter; 13.1 QFP and 13.2 with die pinout. The pin numbers are much different, some pins are joined 2-1, at the corners or power pins.
HY12P65 has simple true-RMS DSP built-in as in the block diagram; the MCU at 4MHz cannot do much math on its own, and only 6KB code space.
AN8008 true RMS is rumored to not work with a DC bias on a sine-wave. I have not checked this.
-
The DTM0660 datasheet gives two schematics for a 3V multimeter; 13.1 QFP and 13.2 with die pinout. The pin numbers are much different, some pins are joined 2-1, at the corners or power pins.
They don't differ that much. The numbers are different, yes, but they follow the same sequence on both. The die has three more pads, but three pins on the 64-pin is connected to two pads each on the die. Else they look similar.
-
Now, I have got the meter.
Continuity slower than I expected, uV resolution has unneeded gap around zero (shows only 0 or -5uV or +5uV - nothing between), toy like.
No competitor to UT61e IMHO.
Price corresponds fully to usefulness.
Not very happy, wasted money for me.
Thank you all who have been trying in direction data logging, I read your contributions like detective story ;)
-
I changed my replacement for the AN8008 0.01 ohm current shunt resistor to a better option. I put an IRC OAR1R100FLF 0.1 ohm resistor in its place and added a KOA SR733ATTE2R10F 2.1 ohm resistor it parallel with it. The metric 6332 size of the resistor fits nicely with the existing trace after a bit of trace mask is removed. Using the meter's AmA jack with the meter's switch in the uA position MY meter now reads XXX.X and XX.XX mA readings better than 0.1% accuracy. Slightly less accuracy is available due to the resolution limit for X.XX mA readings. Using the meter that way has the decimal point is in the correct position with a maximum current reading of 999.9 mA.
Due to the 1% resistors involved, other meters might require that a 2.2 or 2.0 ohm resistor be used in place of the mentioned 2.1 ohm resistor to achieve similar accuracy on your meter. The approximately 5% change in resistor value will only change the parallel resistance by about 0.23%. So, an even greater change in the value of the 2.1 ohm resistor might be needed.
-
MY meter now reads XXX.X and XX.XX mA readings with less than 0.1% accuracy.
Less than 1% accuracy? You mean more than 1% error?
Due to the 1% resistors involved, other meters might require that a 2.2 or 2.0 ohm resistor be used in place of the mentioned 2.1 ohm resistor to achieve similar accuracy on your meter. The approximately 5% change in resistor value will only change the parallel resistance by about 0.23%. So, an even greater change in the value of the 2.1 ohm resistor might be needed.
How about usiing a 2 Ohm, 25 turn trimmer (http://www.vishaypg.com/docs/63055/Accutrim-1202.pdf)? That should do the trick. :popcorn:
-
The 0.01R shunt takeoffs include the (high-current) copper trace on the PCB :rant:
So I would expect drift at high currents are the trace heats up, as it is part of the shunt resistance.
Next time they could try for pseudo 4-wire on that...
-
Less than 1% accuracy? You mean more than 1% error?
Sorry, my mind was locked into the per cent figure being lower which is obviously greater accuracy. I have corrected that to:
"better than 0.1% accuracy."
And, yes I mean better than 0.1% accuracy using a hand selected 1% resistor to provide the best accuracy. I don't think that this model meter warrants any effort for better accuracy than that.
-
And, yes I mean better than 0.1% accuracy using a hand selected 1% resistor to provide the best accuracy. I don't think that this model meter warrants any effort for better accuracy than that.
My comment was a bit of a joke, those 2 Ohm trimmers cost as much as the meter.
-
I wonder if that 8uV gap around zero (meter doesnt show values +-1uV +-2uV +-3uV +-4uV, instead of it only shows 0 or +-5uV or more) could be eliminated or at least reduced?
Is that set in EEPROM, or is it invariably written in firmware?
Is it possible to find out?
Otherwise it seems to be stable enough, I see no need to hide these small values (+-1uV +-2uV +-3uV +-4uV).
-
uV resolution has unneeded gap around zero (shows only 0 or -5uV or +5uV - nothing between), toy like.
I have two of these meters and the other one shows some intermittent fluctuating 5 uV - 10 uV offset voltage in DC mV range when the probes are short-circuited at room temperature. Now that I test this, the offset voltage displays 0uV, 5uV, 6uV, 7uV and 8uV, but no values between 1uV - 4uV. I guess there is some numerical hack so that the display is rounded down to 0 if the measurement value is below 5uV in order to hide this tiny offset voltage and avoid customer complaints. I can live with this, but it is good thing to keep in mind when measuring these tiny voltages.
-
I received one of these meters about a week ago and feel rather indifferent about it. The first thing that hits you is that it is tiny. If you are used to holding a chunky Fluke in your hand, this thing feels minuscule .Dave's video on this meter is bang on. For the money it is a great meter with surprisingly accurate DC measurements, but I definitely won't be sticking any of its probes into a wall socket. The square wave generator setting does a great job and produces very nice patterns on my 2000 series scope right up to 5000khz with no overshoot or distortion. At the moment Aldi is selling a 6000 count meter that does a ton of things. Even for $25, I haven't done any rudimentary tests on the thing, but I can't see it being too impressive.
-
I received one of these meters about a week ago and feel rather indifferent about it. The first thing that hits you is that it is tiny. If you are used to holding a chunky Fluke in your hand, this thing feels minuscule .Dave's video on this meter is bang on.
Take a look at the ANENG DT850B+. It's as big as a Fluke and has all the features that are missing on the AN8008 for only $20.
(https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1bi5XQXXXXXXEaXXXq6xXFXXXS/AN850B-LCD-6000-conteos-DMM-Mult-metro-Digital-con-NCV-Detector-DC-Voltaje-AC-Corriente-Tester.jpg) (https://es.aliexpress.com/store/product/AN850B-6000-counts-LCD-Digital-Multimeter-DMM-with-NCV-Detector-DC-AC-Voltage-Current-Meter-Resistance/919484_32799614071.html?spm=a219c.12010608.0.0.HaaiDo)
(but not real input protection...)
-
AN8008 problem - bias current on mV range is too big:
When meter in mV range, connected 10.1MOhm resistor causes 0.101mV reading - non of my other meters does that to such an extent - it means input bias current is about 10pA!
Smaller resistors cause proportionally smaller value on display and vice versa.
Can be used for measuring resistors up to 9999MOhms on 99.99mV range, thats nice ;D
Can someone check, whether it is just my meter this bad/nice?
-
Temperature - I enabled in EEPROM on the mV function, works °C/°F and factory CJC CAL is already set at 25°C fixed.
Cold Junction Temperature fixed to 25°C?
Does that mean there is no thermistor or other means in the ic to measure the temperature inside the multimeter to have a somewhat proper cold junction temp? Or is it just that you calibrate the proper cjc at 25°C?
-
AN8008 problem - bias current on mV range is too big:
When meter in mV range, connected 10.1MOhm resistor causes 0.101mV reading - non of my other meters does that to such an extent - it means input bias current is about 10pA!
Smaller resistors cause proportionally smaller value on display and vice versa.
Can be used for measuring resistors up to 9999MOhms on 99.99mV range, thats nice ;D
Can someone check, whether it is just my meter this bad/nice?
I also measure 0.100mV across a 10MEG resistor, for 10pA or 0.01nA leakage current. Second try it hones in on -0.135mV. Using no leads and Faraday shield.
Johnson-Nyquist noise of a 10MEG resistor is significant here. Try add a disc cap in parallel ;)
-
Temperature - I enabled in EEPROM on the mV function, works °C/°F and factory CJC CAL is already set at 25°C fixed.
Cold Junction Temperature fixed to 25°C?
Does that mean there is no thermistor or other means in the ic to measure the temperature inside the multimeter to have a somewhat proper cold junction temp? Or is it just that you calibrate the proper cjc at 25°C?
The DMM IC has an internal temperature sensor (diode?), but needs to be calibrated.
The EEPROM comes with default values and I'm not sure how accurate they are:
0BH, 0CH: 00FAH: Ambient temperature (25.0°C)
0DH~0FH: 03BE00H: Ambient temperature Default ADC value
A one-point CAL is supported (offset?), you basically tell the meter what the ambient temperature is (25C).
-
AN8008 problem - bias current on mV range is too big:
When meter in mV range, connected 10.1MOhm resistor causes 0.101mV reading - non of my other meters does that to such an extent - it means input bias current is about 10pA!
Smaller resistors cause proportionally smaller value on display and vice versa.
Can be used for measuring resistors up to 9999MOhms on 99.99mV range, thats nice ;D
Can someone check, whether it is just my meter this bad/nice?
I tried with my two AN8008 meters with 10 Mohm and 1 Mohm resistors in mVDC range. The meters were too sensitive to how I held the probes in order to make any definitive conclusions.
However, when I first short-circuit the probes (display shows 0uV) and then let the probes hang in the air freely, the display shows increasing negative offset voltage. With 10 Mohm resistor I can get fluctuating readings around -125 uV ... -150 uV and with 1 Mohm around -10 uV ... -18 uV. I repeated the tests with my other AN8008 and obtained about similar results: Open leads increasing negative offset voltage, 10 Mohm resistor giving around -130 uV, 1 Mohm resistors giving around -10uV ... -15 uV.
So, I can repeat your findings. Whether or not this is an issue - it depends on what you are measuring. If you are measuring a circuit with an impedance of 100 kohm or less, this will not be an issue. However, if you are measuring very high impedance circuits (with impedance > 100 kohm) and want to get accurate uV measurements this may be an issue.
-
AN8008 problem - bias current on mV range is too big:
When meter in mV range, connected 10.1MOhm resistor causes 0.101mV reading - non of my other meters does that to such an extent - it means input bias current is about 10pA!
Smaller resistors cause proportionally smaller value on display and vice versa.
Can be used for measuring resistors up to 9999MOhms on 99.99mV range, thats nice ;D
Can someone check, whether it is just my meter this bad/nice?
I also measure 0.100mV across a 10MEG resistor, for 10pA or 0.01nA leakage current. Second try it hones in on -0.135mV. Using no leads and Faraday shield.
Johnson-Nyquist noise of a 10MEG resistor is significant here. Try add a disc cap in parallel ;)
There can also be the issue with a big resistor that the AC pickup is saturating the DC amplifier causing an apparent voltage. A better way to test for offset current is probably to use a capacitor such as a 10nF capacitor and measure the time constant. At 10pA, you should get -1mV/second voltage.
I tested my Richmeter 101 (Aneng AN8001) and got -18mV over 60 seconds with a 360pF capacitor. That corresponds to 360pF x -0.018/60 = -0.1pA offset current on the mV range. I put the capacitor directly in the multimeter socket to eliminate any additional effect of the leads and to minimize AC pickup.
Edit: looks like there may be a capacitance inside the meter and 360pF is not enough. Definitely need a much bigger capacitor. Repeated the test with a good quality 2.68uF capacitor. The meter shows 0000 until the count gets to 0005 - I think that quirk has been mentioned before. After 60 seconds, the voltage was -0.18mV. That is a current of 2.68uF x 0.00018 / 60 = 8pA.
-
Repeated my test with an AN8001 type meter over 5 minutes and the result was -5.7pA. Looks like the mV range input impedence is pretty high - well over 1G ohm. Probably hard to measure with the offset current present.
-
You have to be careful measuring uV at high-Z (10MEG)
Many effects you would not normally notice come to surface, such as contact potential and thermal EMF from dissimilar metals, AC hum and RFI.
You need a shielded, grounded work area. You need symmetric metallurgy on the leads and plugs etc. otherwise you get a net thermocouple.
The Metrology boyz surely have more guidance :-/O
Connect your scope (10:1 10MEG) to the multimeter with both on lowest mV scale.
Notice you can see on the scope the DMM analog input circuit pulses, I about 1mVpp at 3.3kHz
The DMM IC has CAZ chopper before the input buffer op-amps, so I guess this is making some noise that shows up at 10MEG ohm. Can't see it at 1MEG though.
Adding 820-1,000pF eliminates most of it; with 10nF it is all gone. The readings shift maybe 10uV adding the cap.
So some of the displayed uV offset is resistor noise, DMM IC leakage current and CAZ noise, with high source resistance.
It is not entirely picoamps of leakage.
-
Yes, I almost forgot: when you dont understand whats going on, look at it with scope ;)
Thank you all for explanation!
P.S. no such behavior with my UT61e - maybe it has something with high input impedance (>3GOhm supposedly on 220mV range, so 10MOhm is negligible probably)
-
I tried the 10M test with my 8008 with the following results.
10 M carbon film resistor on mV range and resistor connected directly between the sockets on the 8008. The meter was freestanding well away from any other equipment.
Initially reading cycled between -108 mV and -111mV after a few minutes it cycled around -114/116 mV.
Interestingly if one held the resistor's connection to the COM socket between finger and thumb the reading dropped to ~74 mV.
Heating just the resistor a few degrees, as expected, increased the mV reading quite rapidly 200mV plus.
None of this really matters too much for normal everyday use of course. Still a very useful, versatile meter for low voltage/current electronics work. Especially for the price.
John
-
There is a new model look a like : SURPEER AV4 it is a 20000 counts model ???? maybe worth checking ? sure it is not a 20$ meter ...
on Ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/digital-multimeter-true-rms-4-1-2-voltmeter-with-auto-range-multi-meter/112444656128?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D41376%26meid%3Dbdba934ac7de4c11bf5d7231a7c8164c%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D152355178736 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/digital-multimeter-true-rms-4-1-2-voltmeter-with-auto-range-multi-meter/112444656128?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D41376%26meid%3Dbdba934ac7de4c11bf5d7231a7c8164c%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D152355178736)
-
There is a new model look a like : SURPEER AV4 it is a 20000 counts model ???? maybe worth checking ? sure it is not a 20$ meter ...
Not an AN8008 competitor, due to the price and the larger form factor. But it looks somewhat promising -- might even have proper fuses?
Although the 600V CAT IV rating and the claim that it is "FDA certified" do not instill confidence... ::)
-
Although the 600V CAT IV rating and the claim that it is "FDA certified" do not instill confidence... ::)
FDA certified! Never saw that before. Apparently, True RMS by Amazon. Excellent. Covering as many bases in one product as possible. ::)
-
Not sure if anyone cares but fyi i just received a Tougs M103 from amazon germany, from a german seller for 23€ delivered and it appears to be the exact same meter. Just in case you live in the eu and don't wan't to go through all the china hassle.
-
Not sure if anyone cares but fyi i just received a Tougs M103 from amazon germany, from a german seller for 23€ delivered and it appears to be the exact same meter. Just in case you live in the eu and don't wan't to go through all the china hassle.
With a black case. Nice :)
-
My meter finally turned up. 31 days after purchase.
-
I ordered one on Amazon, knowing it would be slow from China. But this was a 1st for me, kind of a time buying scam, I assume they lied about it being in stock. I'm pasting the sellers response when after tracking the package from China, I received a tiny envelope with a "free" shrink wrap sleeve for a remote control, worth about 10 cents. Along with a business card saying the real package would still be coming. I then put in for a refund, and Amazon lets the seller contact me via email. See if this response is logical!
"We sent it out on Jul 17, 2017, normally it would take 10-25 workdays from China to US,
As the item is electric product, it would take more days to complete the customs clearance.
we are afraid it could cause a delay, so a free case for remote controls goes to you first and the real package is after. Normally you can receive the item you oredered within 12 working days, would you please wait for it?"
So I then said, just give me a tracking number for the REAL meter, a few days later, they send it, only shows as "label created". So I'm assuming the meter was NOT in stock, so they send something to buy time, and then ship it when it's in stock.
Just thought I'd share this odd story, another reason I mostly avoid buying directly from China. Hopefully, in another 2-3 weeks it will arrive.
-
I wonder if that 8uV gap around zero (meter doesnt show values +-1uV +-2uV +-3uV +-4uV, instead of it only shows 0 or +-5uV or more) could be eliminated or at least reduced?
Is that set in EEPROM, or is it invariably written in firmware?
Is it possible to find out?
Otherwise it seems to be stable enough, I see no need to hide these small values (+-1uV +-2uV +-3uV +-4uV).
I see that deadband on the uV range centered around zero. Readings start at ±5uV up. Input from -4 to +4uV reads zero.
This would be done in firmware to mask noise. With this meter, to read uV that low, I think a preamp is needed. In other words, AN8008 gives 1uV resolution at 4uV up.
DMM's don't have specs for their reading deadbands and hysteresis.
The other "stickiness" people are seeing in readings I think are due to the averaging and filtering of A/D readings done by firmware - within the product spec of ±3 counts.
This got better after I did the capacitor mods on Vss and Vref to lower H/W noise.
Other uV effects are thermocouple EMF with test leads and probably AC hum and noise.
-
I ordered one on Amazon, knowing it would be slow from China. But this was a 1st for me, kind of a time buying scam, I assume they lied about it being in stock. I'm pasting the sellers response when after tracking the package from China, I received a tiny envelope with a "free" shrink wrap sleeve for a remote control, worth about 10 cents. Along with a business card saying the real package would still be coming. I then put in for a refund, and Amazon lets the seller contact me via email. See if this response is logical!
I ordered mine from eBay and got the same shrink wrap sleeve and a similar message. My guess is that they are collecting orders so they can do their volume buy to get volume discounts. Anyway, I only bought the meter out of curiosity and to reduce wear and tear on my "better" meters.
-
As far as the AN8008 readings around µV are concerned...
I have a Uni-T UT70D (80,000 count) and a Brymen 867s (up to 500,000 count) both can read down to a resolution of 1 µV
Both have trouble at around the 0 mark at either staying on 0 when leads are shorted or reading accurately in the -10 to +10 µV range, no matter the source of the measurement. When the reading goes up substantially they read very close to one another.
Someone will probably get their Brymen out now and try it and it will show a perfect 0 when leads are shorted and yes that happens to me a fair amount but not always, sometimes it might just count up or down very slowly as well or show an off 0 measurement. Both meters do the same thing and they use different chipsets.
Basically if two several hundred dollar meters have trouble at near 0 µV this AN8008 is still doing very well.. Not that i have mine yet, ordered a month ago now, still waiting doh!
As others have already noted, it's probably either the averaging algorithm used or an attempt to hide some noise near zero in firmware. Virtually no chance this thing has a 13+bit ADC in it... yet it's trying to do 10,000 resolution has to be a fair amount of averaging going on.
-
It sounds like many multimeter customers want the meter to read 0.000mV if the leads are shorted. The manufacturers do not want to have to explain offset voltages and thermal voltages to complaining customers I guess.
It would be great if there is a way to turn this dead zone off.
-
I added RANGE and REL buttons to my AN8002. Let see if button modification is possible with the AN8008.
(http://i.imgur.com/3bAXv4T.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/K2s2fVC.jpg)
-
I added RANGE and REL buttons to my AN8002. Let see if button modification is possible with the AN8008.
What kind of switches have used? Isn't the rubber buttons to soft for normal push buttons?
-
I added RANGE and REL buttons to my AN8002. Let see if button modification is possible with the AN8008.
What kind of switches have used? Isn't the rubber buttons to soft for normal push buttons?
I used these switches
https://www.arrow.com/en/products/evp-ayf1ba/panasonic
I used 1mm thick PCB for the button separator. I'll take more pictures when I modify my second unit and the AN8008.
-
Wow, that's briliant! (https://www.circuitsonline.net/images/smilies/worshippy.gif) Well done. Please do share the information on how you did this, I think a lot of people would be thankful. :-+
-
Slighty off topic. I note what looks like the AN8002 meter on the front of the new Altronics Engineering Catalogue.. it's going mainstream ;D
-
There is a new model look a like : SURPEER AV4 it is a 20000 counts model ???? maybe worth checking ? sure it is not a 20$ meter ...
on Ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/digital-multimeter-true-rms-4-1-2-voltmeter-with-auto-range-multi-meter/112444656128?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D41376%26meid%3Dbdba934ac7de4c11bf5d7231a7c8164c%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D152355178736 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/digital-multimeter-true-rms-4-1-2-voltmeter-with-auto-range-multi-meter/112444656128?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D41376%26meid%3Dbdba934ac7de4c11bf5d7231a7c8164c%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D152355178736)
I received an HY-19E from China (Banggood - 39.99 USD) that appears to be the same model (except in green). Haven't tested it yet, but will soon. Build quality is on par with the larger Aneng meters - which means just slightly below average.
-
Those meters may have a different IC like in AN8004. 6000 count is usually the clue for the DTM0660 IC.
-
plazma, I'm not sure you can access the other pushbutton switch lines on AN8008. Let us know how it's going.
When I looked at the AN8008 circuit, the pushbuttons go to GND instead of a matrix.
The DMM IC/MCU supports a scanned 2x3 matrix for up to 6 pushbuttons + BL to GND for total 7 buttons as per pic.
The AN8008 firmware might still allow the other pushbuttons but I could not see one or two MCU lines for them.
RANGE/BL goes to GND. Is PT1.0? Not sure about PT3.7 I did not see it.
SEL/HOLD goes to GND; Is PT3.5? Not sure about PT1.1 I did not see it.
REL/RS232 and HOLD/Backlight we have PT1.5 from the EEPROM pin 5.
-
Just got back home after travelling, my "AN8008" was a stupid plastic junk item and a BS Chinglish note - I'll be complaining to Amazon tomorrow I think.
-
Just got back home after travelling, my "AN8008" was a stupid plastic junk item and a BS Chinglish note - I'll be complaining to Amazon tomorrow I think.
Read my post and others response on previous page concerning the same issue.
-
Just got back home after travelling, my "AN8008" was a stupid plastic junk item and a BS Chinglish note - I'll be complaining to Amazon tomorrow I think.
Read my post and others response on previous page concerning the same issue.
Yeah, I saw that - Allouete was the shipper - I have complained and asked for a refund - we will see what happens; if I get a refund, I think I'll order the Tougs M103 instead, it could be here as soon as Sunday if I order it today and it looks like it's the exact same meter although it only comes with basic leads.
-
It sounds like many multimeter customers want the meter to read 0.000mV if the leads are shorted. The manufacturers do not want to have to explain offset voltages and thermal voltages to complaining customers I guess.
It would be great if there is a way to turn this dead zone off.
Yup, same with most of the Chinese digital panel meters, making them useless for many applications.... :(
This is part of the reason I am making my own panel meter of sorts, for a power supply, using an arduino, a display, and the awesome INA226. mV resolution full-scale at 120Hz update rate on the slowest speed, and agrees within 3 counts of a keithley 2015 bench meter!
-
There is a new model look a like : SURPEER AV4 it is a 20000 counts model ???? maybe worth checking ? sure it is not a 20$ meter ...
on Ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/digital-multimeter-true-rms-4-1-2-voltmeter-with-auto-range-multi-meter/112444656128?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D41376%26meid%3Dbdba934ac7de4c11bf5d7231a7c8164c%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D152355178736 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/digital-multimeter-true-rms-4-1-2-voltmeter-with-auto-range-multi-meter/112444656128?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D41376%26meid%3Dbdba934ac7de4c11bf5d7231a7c8164c%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D152355178736)
I received an HY-19E from China (Banggood - 39.99 USD) that appears to be the same model (except in green). Haven't tested it yet, but will soon. Build quality is on par with the larger Aneng meters - which means just slightly below average.
Let us know how it is. 20000 count. :)
-
... Virtually no chance this thing has a 13+bit ADC in it... yet it's trying to do 10,000 resolution has to be a fair amount of averaging going on.
The resolution is already here for DMM's.
The Hycon HY12P65 DMM IC (http://www.hycontek.com/en/products-en/3256) has ?? A/D 18-bit at medium sample rate for 99,999 counts( bi-polar) capability.
Dream Tech's firmware is chopping this down, because crippling features is needed I guess. The 4-digit LCD display is the limiting factor to 9,999 counts.
That built-in MCU limiting factor is its 4MHz clock and 6KB code-space is pretty tight, although what's a little assembly language...
I'm tempted make a DMM with HY3131 (http://www.hycontek.com/en/products-en/3413) the analog front end with 24-bit A/D. HY3130 is 16-bit A/D for 50,000 count applications.
I'll bet the AN8002, AN8004 use the same DMM IC and firmware. People have upped the "max. counts" EEPROM number and accessed the higher resolution.
But you have to recalibrate and tronde says some True-RMS hassles. There's a few other EEPROM settings to play with.
Probably the internal voltage reference is poor and so the AN8008 went to an external Vref IC.
-
... Virtually no chance this thing has a 13+bit ADC in it... yet it's trying to do 10,000 resolution has to be a fair amount of averaging going on.
The resolution is already here for DMM's.
The Hycon HY12P65 DMM IC (http://www.hycontek.com/en/products-en/3256) has ?? A/D 18-bit at medium sample rate for 99,999 counts( bi-polar) capability.
Dream Tech's firmware is chopping this down, because crippling features is needed I guess. The 4-digit LCD display is the limiting factor to 9,999 counts.
That built-in MCU limiting factor is its 4MHz clock and 6KB code-space is pretty tight, although what's a little assembly language...
I'm tempted make a DMM with HY3131 (http://www.hycontek.com/en/products-en/3413) the analog front end with 24-bit A/D. HY3130 is 16-bit A/D for 50,000 count applications.
I'll bet the AN8002, AN8004 use the same DMM IC and firmware. People have upped the "max. counts" EEPROM number and accessed the higher resolution.
But you have to recalibrate and tronde says some True-RMS hassles. There's a few other EEPROM settings to play with.
Probably the internal voltage reference is poor and so the AN8008 went to an external Vref IC.
In practical, due to the noise and distortion in the ADC circuity, the ENOB (effective number of bits) must be less than ADC specified number of bits.
Resolution vs. ENOB – Still Hazy After All These Years
http://www.analog.com/en/analog-dialogue/raqs/raq-issue-90.html (http://www.analog.com/en/analog-dialogue/raqs/raq-issue-90.html)
HY12P65 ENOB Test Tool User Manual
http://www.hycontek.com/wp-content/uploads/APD-DMM004_EN.pdf (http://www.hycontek.com/wp-content/uploads/APD-DMM004_EN.pdf)
-
HY12P6x ENOB is given as 19-bit and Eval board has 6-digit LCD. I think the test software is to verify performance, do FFT of the noise.
Hard to know what the signal/noise ratio of the input amp, A/D, reference etc. will be and what you can improve with digital filtering and over-sampling, noise shaping.
I guess that can improve ENOB. (http://www.analog.com/media/en/training-seminars/tutorials/MT-022.pdf)
So how many usable A/D bits do we have?
-
HY12P6x ENOB is given as 19-bit and Eval board has 6-digit LCD. I think the test software is to verify performance, do FFT of the noise.
Hard to know what the signal/noise ratio of the input amp, A/D, reference etc. will be and what you can improve with digital filtering and over-sampling, noise shaping.
I guess that can improve ENOB. (http://www.analog.com/media/en/training-seminars/tutorials/MT-022.pdf)
So how many usable A/D bits do we have?
you modified the decoupling capacitors on your meter, already improved the SNR -> improved the ENOB a little bit.
-
I got a reply from Allouete after I asked them to refund my money for the AN8008 ordered July 15th, they say the meter is in transit and sent me a tracking number that USPS tracking says...
Your item arrived at our USPS facility in LOS ANGELES CA INTERNATIONAL DISTRIBUTION CENTER on August 3, 2017 at 1:45 pm. The item is currently in transit to the destination
with an expected delivery date of Aug 8th.
Allouete has asked me to wait 4 more days which seems worth doing as long as the tracking number is actually for my meter; they won't be getting a 5-star rating or any other business from me though.
-
I got a reply from Allouete after I asked them to refund my money for the AN8008 ordered July 15th, they say the meter is in transit and sent me a tracking number that USPS tracking says...
Your item arrived at our USPS facility in LOS ANGELES CA INTERNATIONAL DISTRIBUTION CENTER on August 3, 2017 at 1:45 pm. The item is currently in transit to the destination
with an expected delivery date of Aug 8th.
Allouete has asked me to wait 4 more days which seems worth doing as long as the tracking number is actually for my meter; they won't be getting a 5-star rating or any other business from me though.
My seller "EasyDeal88", asked me to wait, I asked for an actual shipping tracking number, and was promptly sent one, guess what, just a "label created", that was days a go. I'm not in a hurry, and I can always get a refund from Amazon if I don't get it, for $23 the sellers know this as well.
-
My seller "EasyDeal88", asked me to wait, I asked for an actual shipping tracking number, and was promptly sent one, guess what, just a "label created", that was days a go. I'm not in a hurry, and I can always get a refund from Amazon if I don't get it, for $23 the sellers know this as well.
Interesting, I'm not worried about the refund, I know Amazon will intervene if I ask them too, I'm giving the seller a few more days because the original listing said it could arrive between Aug 4-25 but it is annoying that you can't see from the Amazon web site that the item will ship from China. It's dopey that they shipped a plastic bag to me as a 'gift', better to send me the item I ordered a few days later.
Also, I can see the AN8008 listed on banggood.com right now for $17 shipped.
-
I tested some button options for the AN8008.
SET/HOLD is PT1.0 - BAT-
RANGE/BackLight is PT1.2 - BAT-
These did not have any effect.
PT1.0 - PT1.1
PT1.0 - PT1.2
PT1.0 - SDA
PT1.1 - BAT-
PT1.1 - PT1.2
PT1.1 - SDA
PT1.2 - SDA
So no button hacks found. There are still some possible pins but I think all other button options are disabled in FW.
Only temperature probe is hackable.
IMHO AN8002 is a better option for general use and AN8008 is only better in those small ranges.
-
IMHO AN8002 is a better option for general use and AN8008 is only better in those small ranges.
Yep.
And the AN860B+ has all the features of both of those plus a few more (e.g. REL, MIN/MAX) for about $2 more
-
IMHO AN8002 is a better option for general use and AN8008 is only better in those small ranges.
Yep.
And the AN860B+ has all the features of both of those plus a few more (e.g. REL, MIN/MAX) for about $2 more
I paid 12€ each for my AN8002 units. AN860B+ got more features but is regular size.
-
I tested some button options for the AN8008.... ... no button hacks found....
No "eggs" as the chinese say in the AN8008 :(
Only simple hack is to enable the temperature function.
I put a scope on the pushbutton scan lines and no pulses. They are only on/off so the AN8008 has unique firmware. I thought it would be the same as the generic DMM IC family, with EEPROM enabling more digits.
The AN8002 is the mother of the AN8008, look at the PCB.
Should be able to add external reference IC to AN8002 and not sure how it would do at 9,999 counts.
-
Can someone point me to where the information is on how to get temperature added to the AN8008?
Mine is apparently in Michigan now, about 40 miles away from me as of 10:51pm yesterday EST. Might arrive today but more likely Monday; maybe never.
-
Can someone point me to where the information is on how to get temperature added to the AN8008?
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1258876/#msg1258876 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1258876/#msg1258876)
-
Can someone point me to where the information is on how to get temperature added to the AN8008?
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1258876/#msg1258876 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1258876/#msg1258876)
I think that post is wrong, he did not add it the "mA" function but V function.
Instead I added it to the mV function:
* EEPROM address 0xAC changed from 0x00 to 0x13 adds °C to mV function
* EEPROM address 0xBC changed from 0x00 to 0x15 adds °F to mV function
Purple highlight in attached partial EEPROM (feature map) dump.
The rotary switch also supports temp measurement but that position is missing.
-
ANENG upped the price to USD $32, what is this capitalism lol
-
They learn everything quickly. ;D
-
ANENG upped the price to USD $32, what is this capitalism lol
Where did you see that price? Just spot-checked the link in this thread's OP, and the AN8008 is still available for $18.90 there.
-
ANENG upped the price to USD $32, what is this capitalism lol
Which model did they increase the price on? I still see the AN8008 on eBay for $13 $23 from China.
My AN8008 just arrived in the mail, so far I've put batteries in it and checked that it seems to operate as expected.
-
I just bought it for US $16.99 from Banggood.
Mauro
-
Instead I added it to the mV function:
* EEPROM address 0xAC changed from 0x00 to 0x13 adds °C to mV function
* EEPROM address 0xBC changed from 0x00 to 0x15 adds °F to mV function
Can you read/write the EEPROM in circuit?
I've tried reading it in-circuit (using a SOIC-8 clip... which tend to be rather iffy) with a TL866 but all I get back is all 00 or all FF. I tried with the meter off and on... same thing. I think the FF's indicate a bad clip connection. I once got a connection where a few of the read values were non-zero, but obviously were wrong. A re-read gave different values.
-
I don't think you can work with the EEPROM in-circuit as you get bus contention with the DMM IC. TL866 fighting with the DMM IC probably.
I solder-wicked and then lifted up the two 24C02 EEPROM legs SDA SCL and tack-soldered tiny wires, along with GND (3 wires total) and ran them to a programmer.
Used Arduino sketch with 3V level-translator (resistors/diode clamp) to read/write the EEPROM. #define DEVADDR 0x50 // I2C device address of 24C02 EEPROM
DMM write-protect WP jumper JP2 must be in to allow EEPROM writes. Using DMM 3V power on to run the EEPROM. DMM will give "Err03" I think if it can't see EEPROM.
This is my EEPROM contents with temp. function added. Yours will differ due to CAL coefficients. Do not overwrite yours.
So read your EEPROM, save that then edit the two bytes to allow temperature.
Attached .HEX file is from Russian forums on kazus.ru; Has 600V alarm voltage instead of 750V I think, and no temperature enabled.
You can change auto-power off time, backlight timer, LCD contrast, alarm voltages etc.
Many people changing EEPROM contents on DMM's using the same IC like ZT101, ZT102, AN8001, AN8002, HP-890CN, HP-770HC, UT139C etc.
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F
00: FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF 52 00 FA 00 00 BE 03
10: 10 17 0F 27 52 03 6E 50 64 4B 3C 3C 0A FF 40 FF
20: 3C 98 81 81 64 00 96 00 00 80 8D 80 00 80 FE 69
30: 4E 02 09 9C FB 09 8C 01 0A 18 FC 09 36 FC 09 00
40: 00 01 00 01 00 07 98 00 64 00 64 00 64 00 00 00
50: 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80
60: 7B 7E EE 7F 0A 00 99 2A 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
70: 8B 82 00 80 AC 82 E0 7C 18 01 00 00 00 00 00 00
80: 00 00 00 00 00 16 00 10 00 0C 00 07 13 01 12 03
90: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 11 00 0D 00 09 15 02 00 04
A0: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0A 00 00 00 00
B0: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0B 00 00 00 00
C0: 0D 00 02 10 0D 00 03 20 20 00 03 20 20 00 03 10
D0: 1F 80 FF 7F 00 80 00 80 41 00 03 05 0D 00 02 20
E0: 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80 00 80
F0: 0F 80 FF FF FF FF FF FF 5A C7 CC 0F 0F A2 00 00
Kerry Wong has some info on his site where he was into the EEPROM. (http://www.kerrywong.com/2016/03/19/hacking-dtm0660l-based-multimeters/)
-
ANENG upped the price to USD $32, what is this capitalism lol
Which model did they increase the price on? I still see the AN8008 on eBay for $13 $23 from China.
My AN8008 just arrived in the mail, so far I've put batteries in it and checked that it seems to operate as expected.
Top # orders USD $32.30 now. But other vendors have original communist pricing.
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-counts-Square-Wave-Backlight-AC-DC-Voltage-Ammeter-Current/ (https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-counts-Square-Wave-Backlight-AC-DC-Voltage-Ammeter-Current/919484_32810125781.html?spm=2114.12010608.0.0.18bdb2a1N4mcqY)
-
Instead I added it to the mV function:
* EEPROM address 0xAC changed from 0x00 to 0x13 adds °C to mV function
* EEPROM address 0xBC changed from 0x00 to 0x15 adds °F to mV function
Can you read/write the EEPROM in circuit?
I've tried reading it in-circuit (using a SOIC-8 clip... which tend to be rather iffy) with a TL866 but all I get back is all 00 or all FF. I tried with the meter off and on... same thing. I think the FF's indicate a bad clip connection. I once got a connection where a few of the read values were non-zero, but obviously were wrong. A re-read gave different values.
When I read or write to the EEPROM in the DTM0660 based VC921 I clamp down the oscillator with a 1kohm resistor across the xtal. Don't know if it OK to short it with a wire. I use a cheap CH341-based programmer and a clip.
-
ANENG upped the price to USD $32, what is this capitalism lol
Which model did they increase the price on? I still see the AN8008 on eBay for $13 $23 from China.
My AN8008 just arrived in the mail, so far I've put batteries in it and checked that it seems to operate as expected.
Top # orders USD $32.30 now. But other vendors have original communist pricing.
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-counts-Square-Wave-Backlight-AC-DC-Voltage-Ammeter-Current/ (https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-counts-Square-Wave-Backlight-AC-DC-Voltage-Ammeter-Current/919484_32810125781.html?spm=2114.12010608.0.0.18bdb2a1N4mcqY)
It sure received a lot of attention lately. Price did not rise on eBay (yet) but maybe all vendors might increase it in time? Well, I thought about this meter for a long time and in the end I got a rebranded an860b+ for less than an8008 and personally think it will provide more utility. But then, most people here are using it as their second-third-tenth meter, so being smaller is better.
-
Not everything is cheaper on AliExpress. Sometimes eBay listings have much better prices (and more vendors to choose from), other times not so much. It's always good to shop around.
-
...in the end I got a rebranded an860b+ for less than an8008 and personally think it will provide more utility. But then, most people here are using it as their second-third-tenth meter, so being smaller is better.
I looked at the AN860B and it looks like a nice meter for the money. I already have a great bench meter and 3 regular-sized (Fluke 177) meters, I bought the AN8008 because it is small - I want to be able to have an accurate meter for low voltage/power tests while I'm travelling without the worry that someone might steal, or I might break, a $500 piece of test gear. The AN8008 is smaller than an iPhone 7+ (except for thickness). Going all the way down to a true pocket meter removes the 'real' meter feel and my eyes are getting old too.
-
...in the end I got a rebranded an860b+ for less than an8008 and personally think it will provide more utility. But then, most people here are using it as their second-third-tenth meter, so being smaller is better.
I looked at the AN860B and it looks like a nice meter for the money. I already have a great bench meter and 3 regular-sized (Fluke 177) meters, I bought the AN8008 because it is small - I want to be able to have an accurate meter for low voltage/power tests while I'm travelling without the worry that someone might steal, or I might break, a $500 piece of test gear. The AN8008 is smaller than an iPhone 7+ (except for thickness). Going all the way down to a true pocket meter removes the 'real' meter feel and my eyes are getting old too.
Fortunately, they make them with larger displays than some older models (e.g. DT830):
(http://i.imgur.com/Xuvy4nQ.png)
Of course, Aneng also has a large display and more functionality.
Even Victor has a large enough display:
(http://i.imgur.com/assFsWn.png)
Of course, this is all relative. I guess that most high end meters all have a large display to show all the parameters.
-
I bought mine from this eBay seller:-
13proteamonline
It took 11 days to arrive in the UK. Cost was £14.89
-
Buyers Beware
I bought my AN8008 from easydeal88 on Amazon - they sent me a 'gift', some kind of 5 cent plastic bag that covers remote controls, and that arrived late July. After I complained and asked for my money back, they sent me the actual item. I ordered July 15th, the AN8008 arrived Aug 5th.
Amazon don't make it clear that the item ships from China and I feel conned because I paid more than it was listed for on eBay because I thought I'd get better service - I was VERY wrong. I would probably buy from eBay if I bought another one.
All that said, the AN8008 that I eventually received seems like it is a keeper.
-
Buyers Beware
I bought my AN8008 from easydeal88 on Amazon - they sent me a 'gift', some kind of 5 cent plastic bag that covers remote controls, and that arrived late July. After I complained and asked for my money back, they sent me the actual item. I ordered July 15th, the AN8008 arrived Aug 5th.
Amazon don't make it clear that the item ships from China and I feel conned because I paid more than it was listed for on eBay because I thought I'd get better service - I was VERY wrong. I would probably buy from eBay if I bought another one.
All that said, the AN8008 that I eventually received seems like it is a keeper.
After going through that trouble, hopefully it will serve you well for a long time. :)
-
ANENG upped the price to USD $32, what is this capitalism lol
Looks like there might be a world shortage after Dave's video.
-
After going through that trouble, hopefully it will serve you well for a long time. :)
Thanks Kalel :D
Looks like there might be a world shortage after Dave's video.
:-DD maybe Dave's in cahoots with the cheap Chinese meter factory? We'll know soon if he gets one of those posh Oz hats with the wine corks hanging from it ;)
I changed my 100 uF electrolytic to 2 x 1206 47uF Tanceram caps (fancy ceramics) that I had in a sample box, I can't seem much difference before and after when scoping the 3.3 volt rail, still looks noisy - I did screen captures if you guys want to see them. I also fixed some dry looking joints on the fuse holders.
Tested volts and current against my calibrated Keysight 34461A, volts are spot on, amps are slightly low: 34461A = 3.02 A, AN8008 = 2.98 A. 34461A = 301 mA, AN8008 = 299 mA. Maybe I messed up the calibration some when I improved the soldered joints on the fuse holders as now there will be less input resistance. Maybe it was like this before I started it may even be in spec - I didn't check before getting out the soldering iron, I 'fixed' it when I saw they looked dry. Anyone know how to calibrate the AN8008? I guess I could try to tweak cal when/if I swap the shunt resistors out.
-
It's been nearly a month since Dave's video and I still can't find anyone selling them that's located in the US. I guess I'll have to buy one from China.
-
Anyone know how to calibrate the AN8008? I guess I could try to tweak cal when/if I swap the shunt resistors out.
Simple: You just have to reprogram the little external EEPROM with new values!
-
I did a few quick checks on my units. Voltage was dead on (I checked mostly in the 1.0 .. 10V area) using a Valhalla DC calibrator and a Fluke 732B. At 5V there was a 1 mV offset when swapping the lead polarity.
Frequency was dead on at 5 and 10 MHZ (HP-5071A cesium beam oscillator). Counter goes to at least 20 MHz (limit of the pulse generator I had handy).
SR-104 resistor was dead on at 10 K. Readings of a ESI DB877 decade box were pretty much spot on. Lead resistance was 0.06 ohms. The meter takes a few seconds to settle to a final value.
Capacitance agreed quite well with a Genrad 0.1% decade box. it would be nice if you could null out the lead capacitance...
My current and AC calibrators were in use elsewhere, so I did not check those.
All in all, not to shabby for a $15 pocket meter. From posts in this thread, the only real wart on these meters if the low milliamp readings. I'd like to modify my eeprom to add temperature and turn off the backlight timeout.
-
there is still a lot available on ebay btw.
-
there is still a lot available on ebay btw.
I'm sure there's a lot of eBay sellers who'll be happy to take your money then go down to the Shenzhen Market to see if they can find one, yes.
Can't find one? Never mind, the customer can wait a few days, just blame it on the postal system... :popcorn:
-
there is still a lot available on ebay btw.
I'm sure there's a lot of eBay sellers who'll be happy to take your money then go down to the Shenzhen Market to see if they can find one, yes.
Can't find one? Never mind, the customer can wait a few days, just blame it on the postal system... :popcorn:
If you want fast shipping, simply don't order on Ebay/overseas. :-//
-
there is still a lot available on ebay btw.
If you want fast shipping, simply don't order on Ebay/overseas. :-//
It's almost as if you haven't been reading the last two (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1270803/#msg1270803) pages (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1272644/#msg1272644) of this thread... :-//
But yes, I'm sure one will turn up eventually if you order today.
-
there is still a lot available on ebay btw.
If you want fast shipping, simply don't order on Ebay/overseas. :-//
It's almost as if you haven't been reading the last two (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1270803/#msg1270803) pages (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1272644/#msg1272644) of this thread... :-//
But yes, I'm sure one will turn up eventually if you order today.
I did, but my general experience is that Ebay/China takes somewhere between 2 - 5/6 weeks.
So I don't get all the complains to be very honest.
-
So I don't get all the complains to be very honest.
That's true.
-
I think if you re-solder the 0.01R shunt or fuse, you risk changing the Amps calibration. It's not the greatest PCB layout.
There is a calibration procedure, poorly translated: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/cheap-aneng-meter-calibrationreset-procedure/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/cheap-aneng-meter-calibrationreset-procedure/)
You can cal only one function and skip others. I haven't tried it.
-
It's been nearly a month since Dave's video and I still can't find anyone selling them that's located in the US. I guess I'll have to buy one from China.
Sounds like an opportunity. Buy a boatload at a discount and be the first US reseller. ;D
-
I'm willing to attempt a recalibration but the instruction linked above are pretty vague, can anyone give detailed steps on how to calibrate the AN8008 specifically?
-
It's been nearly a month since Dave's video and I still can't find anyone selling them that's located in the US. I guess I'll have to buy one from China.
Sounds like an opportunity. Buy a boatload at a discount and be the first US reseller. ;D
I did consider it, but instead just ordered one from China. Supposedly it has shipped and will be here in two or three weeks.
I've sold quite a bit of stuff on ebay and in general I think it's more trouble than it's worth. I have a large pile of stuff right now I should sell, but I just can't seem to convince myself to make the effort.
-
It's been nearly a month since Dave's video and I still can't find anyone selling them that's located in the US. [snip]
[snip] Buy a boatload at a discount and be the first US reseller. ;D
I did consider it, but instead just ordered one from China. [snip]
I've sold quite a bit of stuff on ebay and in general I think it's more trouble than it's worth. [snip]
It is troublesome and I was being facetious, hence the smiley. The margins wouldn't be worth the headache, fees, etc., and domestic shipping cost would blow the deal out of the water. So, everyone still has to buy directly from China.
-
I have a large pile of stuff right now I should sell, but I just can't seem to convince myself to make the effort.
Just take a photo of the pile and post it in the "for sale" section.
-
I wouldn't bother if the stuff is worth little, usually you'll just wind up having unreliable or picky customers and wasting a ton of time satisfying their needs (or arguing with them about how you won't). I recently tried to sell some perfectly fine stuff (mainly electronics) for low prices, and wound up with customers wanting me to bring it over for free. You may want to add a very explicit comment about what you are and are not prepared to do. Another buyer asked me to send a bench meter over (which I did), but this added more packaging costs and work than I initially expected. In the end I wasted quite some time to get the proper packaging materials and getting the thing arranged, eroding the advantage over just binning stuff. I came to accept I'll have to hand in most stuff I lost a use for to the 2nd hand store for free for it to have a future use.
I got my AN8008 in about 3 weeks from China to The Netherlands, I have no issues with that. When stuff comes over from China it just takes time. Took me $19 from seller qualityzoneonline. It seems to be as accurate as any of yours (but I don't have any reference standards, but it somehow agrees with most other meter I have). I am kind of happy with the functionality of the meter. An extra digit of resolution in the low Ohms is quite useful too for measuring shunts and the likes. Up to now the only meter I had that could do that was a Gossen Metrawatt Metrahit One, which is actually more of an electricians meter than an electronics meter. The Aneng seems to have its track/contact resistances pre-nulled because it actually shows a short as 0.00Ohm. I especially like how it complements the AN8002. Together they can measure almost every common quantity with an appropriate accuracy and resolution.
-
AN8008 CALIBRATION BASICS
I've figured out how to do calibration although I don't have the finer details worked out. Here's what I know...
1. Short out J1 on the PCB (it's at the top right corner as you look at the PCB from the back of the meter)
2. Get your calibration reference ready and connected - in my case a 300 mA DC feed through the mA/A terminal and Common
3. Turn rotary control from off to the resistance position and CAL will appear on the display
3. Now WAIT until you hear a beep and then move the rotary control to the mA/A position - if you turn the rotary control away from resistance too quickly it doesn't show the values you've selected but moving the rotary switch around corrects that
4. Press [Set/Hold] (orange) button repeatedly until you see DC mA and a value will be displayed
5. Now you should see a value close to what you're providing the meter with, around 300 mA DC in my case
6. Press the [Range] (blue) button (quick press) to range down (but it only does it in 0.1 A increments)
7. Press and hold the [Range] (blue) button (long press) to range up (but it only does it in 0.1 A increments)
8. Press [Set/Hold] (orange) button to move off that setting (I think this is when the cal change just made is saved)
9. Move the rotary switch to off
10. Clear the link on J1 and power back on and test
As far as I can tell, the trick is to set the input to an exact value like 300 mA so you can set that value on the display during cal because you can't adjust the display to 303 mA so, for my slight discrepancy, I saw 298 mA displayed, I ranged down - I saw 200 mA, and then ,with a long press of [Range], ranged up and then I saw 300 mA displayed, pressed the orange button again and I was done. Other parameters can be set by pressing the [Set/Hold] (orange) button repeatedly but you'll only see values corresponding to the rotary position selected so you'd leave it in the resistance position to cycle through the measurements associated with that position including resistance.
What I'm not clear about is when it actually stores a new calibration value, I guess that, once you use the [Range] (blue) button, it changes the calibration for that setting, and I think it saves it when - having got the display to show the value you want, you press the orange button once more.
At first I did my above procedure providing 300 mA but ranged down to display 100 mA and couldn't change that value because I hadn't figured out that a long press ranges up by that point. So when I then switched off and removed the link, it had calibrated the meter to display 100 mA when 300 mA was supplied which it did. I had to re-calibrate after I figured out that the long press increases the displayed value.
-
It is troublesome and I was being facetious, hence the smiley.
...
Yeah, I realized that. I just thought I'd mention that, for a moment at least, I had seriously considered it. Luckily I came to my senses. Anyway, mine has apparently shipped. The tracking number shows it in transit with delivery next Wednesday.
-
Hehe, it's all good. Enjoy the meter!
-
I calibrated my AN8008's DC uA range today after finding it was way off - it read 89 uA when actual was 100 uA - the error may have been because a) I re-soldered the fuse holders and shunts on the PCB b) I may have messed it up by calibrating the other DC current ranges or c) both a and b.
I used a 9V battery fed through a decade box and then my Keysight 34461A in series with the AN8008, I was able to set 90 uA with the 34461A reading 90.001 uA and then used my calibration process above to set 90 uA (it wouldn't do 100 uA) on the AN8008. Comparison tests after doing this showed perfect alignment between the 2 meters, even at 2 uA DC.
-
I might be dumb and have just missed it reading through all the pages, but what is the burden voltage on this meter as far as a mV/mA estimate?
-
There are just two shunts, 100Ohm and 0.01Ohm (about 0.03Ohm across the terminals because of fuse), which meter uses for 99.99uA(lowest range) resp. 9999mA(highest range).
If I calculate it correctly, that means 10mV/0.1mA resp. 100mV/10000mA (300mV/10000mA across terminals) ;)
There are other ranges, but they use one of these two shunts.
-
For those concerned about stock, I ordered 7/20 and received 8/14 http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-AC-DC-Volt-Am-550V/322593677450?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-9999-Counts-Square-Wave-AC-DC-Volt-Am-550V/322593677450?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649)
Of course they did the whole "We have arranged a small gift to appreciate your order" trick with tracking to cover their backs if late, but all worked out. I did send them an "if you send a package of a useless gift without the meter I will file claim with paypal and leave 1-star review" pre-emptive message so YMMV.
About 0.3mV high at 3.3v compared to my calibrated 189 so certainly more than good enough to replace my bulky (by comparison) 70iii for my field toolbox with a nice little resolution upgrade. Signal generator feature is humourous but 1040z shows it's pretty sharp. Maybe if Trump starts a nuke war with N. Korea while I'm out at Burningman, I might have to build a switchmode PS out of junk on the side of the road, and that feature might come in handy :-DMM
-
Why is everyone so worried about stock? I ordered the very cheapest I could find on Ebay and received my multimeter in eight days. That might be one of the fastest deliveries I've ever had the pleasure of receiving when ordering from The Far Off Lands.
First impressions are decent. The biggest surprise is the size, or the lack of it. It's so tiny! When I opened the package I didn't expect it to be the multimeter, due to the small size of the parcel, even though I knew it's not a big multimeter.
The construction seems okay. Though the plastic is nothing special, the case is very sturdy. I've had much more expensive items with much more creaky cases. A metal insert is used for the battery compartment screw, which is a nice detail. However, the tilting bale does not instil a lot of confidence. It might do the job, but it is thin, flexible and rattly and feels like it might break easily. Interestingly, it looks like there was text on the bale which got removed from the mould later. It looks like the remnants of a "C" can be seen on the left of the bale. You cannot use the rotary switch with one hand when it's on the tilting bale. The rotary knob is half decent. Not the worst, but certainly also not the best feeling one I've come across.
Both normal and modular leads are supplied. Even though the regular leads won't be mistaken for expensive ones, they are fairly flexible and therefore usable. Probe sharpness also seems to be good. The modular leads are cheap and nothing special.
Confirming what I have read on the forums, the backlight of the LCD does turn off after a minute or so. Not ideal, but it will prevent the batteries from running down too quickly. The LCD itself has a good contrast when looking at it from below. However, contrast starts to fade when perpendicular to the screen and quickly fades to nothing when looking at it from above.
So far, I'm not disappointed. It could use a nice boot and a better tilting bale, but what are you going to do.
-
I like your comments on the AN8008. I suspect this won't last more than a few years at best. If you want robust try the MF-47 in kit form. The bale will break and probabily the leads will come apart. For sure there are tons of these available and probabily the price will come down. Hasta luego.
-
I recieved mine a week ago and its fine for me to work win 3.3 and 5v. It matches my very old UNI-T, from when I was in secondary, even at capacity.
I like it for the price.
Enviado desde mi Jolla mediante Tapatalk
-
I received mine today. It was ordered through ebay on August 6, so just two weeks to arrive. I've only given it a quick check so far, but a 9 volt battery read 9.312 which my Fluke 87-III read as 9.31 volts. I'm thinking this will become my main bench top meter, since it's so much smaller and less clunky than the Fluke.
-
Who the hell actually holds a multimeter in one hand?
I'm gonna make a stand for it, it's just hell to prop up and keeps falling down and the LCD glare is means you have to keep moving it around to read the display.
I think a 60 degree wood block and coat-hanger wire to fit into the bail? Or maybe slide it into a mount.
Any ideas?
-
Who the hell actually holds a multimeter in one hand?
I'm gonna make a stand for it [...]
This being a very compact meter, adding a bulky stand would defeat the purpose for me. I expect to use this when travelling, or when working outside or in the garage.
I might glue a magnet to the back to allow for hands-free operation when working on the car or bike. Or I might actually hold it in one hand (which is much preferred over holding it in two hands). ;)
-
Who the hell actually holds a multimeter in one hand?
I'm gonna make a stand for it, it's just hell to prop up and keeps falling down and the LCD glare is means you have to keep moving it around to read the display.
I think a 60 degree wood block and coat-hanger wire to fit into the bail? Or maybe slide it into a mount.
Any ideas?
Putting it on the bag or adding some rubber feet should allow you to operate it with one hand. The screen contrast is excellent when looking at it from below, so putting it on the table without the tilting bale should work fine. If you want to do a measurement and just need to look at it, you can always put it up.
-
Lets face it the AN8008 just another piece of junk. Why split hairs over this?
-
Lets face it the AN8008 just another piece of junk. Why split hairs over this?
Why do you think it is a piece of junk? If you forget about mains voltages and the tilting bale, it does things that only much more expensive multimeters do.
Even the most expensive tools have their limitations. It is up to the workman to use them wisely.
-
Lets face it the AN8008 just another piece of junk. Why split hairs over this?
Still beats EXPENSIVE junk!
-
In my opinion, the AN8008 is hands down the best value in multimeters available. Everyone should have two. Just don't use it for anything that might blow you up.
-
In my opinion, the AN8008 is hands down the best value in multimeters available. Everyone should have two. Just don't use it for anything that might blow you up.
If you're going to get two meters, I would probably add AN860B+ to that list. Or at least 8002. When combined, you get more features than just a single 8008. :)
Of course, if you already have expensive meters, might be a different story.
-
If you're going to get two meters, I would probably add AN860B+ to that list. Or at least 8002. When combined, you get more features than just a single 8008. :)
Of course, if you already have expensive meters, might be a different story.
The benefit of having two is that you can do relatively accurate power measurements in one go.
-
Lets face it the AN8008 just another piece of junk. Why split hairs over this?
Because it fits the needs of some people. And I dont see any evidence provided by you, wy you think its junk for you.
I dont like it, because I do work from time to time on vacuum tube gear and I woudnt feel safe using this meter. Plus I preffer used Fluke meters from ebay, that I get cheap. Sub 50€.
So just live and let live.
Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk
-
Who the hell actually holds a multimeter in one hand?
I'm gonna make a stand for it, it's just hell to prop up and keeps falling down and the LCD glare is means you have to keep moving it around to read the display.
I think a 60 degree wood block and coat-hanger wire to fit into the bail? Or maybe slide it into a mount.
Any ideas?
How about designing a new piece that fits in place of the existing 'stand', then we could 3D print them?
-
For the next 5 days, bang-em-good has it for $17.77 w/Free Slow Boat From China Shipping or add 56¢ and get 7-12 day ePacket. https://www.banggood.com/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-AC-DC-Current-Voltage-Resistance-Frequency-Capacitance-Test-p-1157985.html (https://www.banggood.com/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-AC-DC-Current-Voltage-Resistance-Frequency-Capacitance-Test-p-1157985.html)
I buy a lot of cheap RC electronics from them; they're slow but they have better-than-average customer service for China-direct. I got one of these on the way since I was already on there buying some brushless micro-motors; at that price, if it gives its all and saves my Fluke or my HP from my own fumble-fingers just once it has paid for itself a dozen times over.
Cheers and don't git any on ya,
mnem
This is where I usually put some pithy remark.
-
I preffer used Fluke meters from ebay, that I get cheap. Sub 50€.
I wish I were that lucky too....
-
I preffer used Fluke meters from ebay, that I get cheap. Sub 50€.
I wish I were that lucky too....
Get bidding: http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483)
-
I preffer used Fluke meters from ebay, that I get cheap. Sub 50€.
I wish I were that lucky too....
Get bidding: http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483)
And does not ship outside USA.
-
I preffer used Fluke meters from ebay, that I get cheap. Sub 50€.
I wish I were that lucky too....
Get bidding: http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483)
And does not ship outside USA.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/142482772035 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/142482772035)
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/112530073448 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/112530073448)
-
For the next 5 days, bang-em-good has it for $17.77
Thanks, I was about to order some stuff from Banggood for my RC models so I may add an extra AN8008 to the package. I too have had good experiences ordering from BG.
Just ordered some 0.1 Ohm resistors from Digikey so I'm gonna mod mine for the mA ranges. I also won a Druck DPI 832 a week ago on eBay although the seller wrote me saying he hasn't shipped yet because he's short of cash! He actually won't get paid until the item gets delivered, I suspect he'd like me to cancel the order as it went for lower than I expected.
-
I figured that I have enough meters which will do mA nicely, and that I'd give up a bit of mA resolution for the low burden of the 10A shunt if I needed it.
This meter has already been useful due to the 1uV resolution, but I have seen comments about it jumping from +/-5uV straight to zero. This hasn't impacted me yet but may in the future - is anyone aware if this can be fixed via EEPROM, or is it hard coded in the firmware?
Thanks to everyone for the tip-off and reviews in this thread - I'm quite happy with it as a special-purposes meter which is also nice and small, though I'll be sticking with my Fluke 87V for most stuff!
-
Get bidding: http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483)
Huh, I expected to see fluke 87, or a scopemeter... 187 would also be fine... Preferably in the EU... I think I'm asking for impossible.
Thanks for help anyway!
-
I preffer used Fluke meters from ebay, that I get cheap. Sub 50€.
I wish I were that lucky too....
It takes daily looking at ebay, but its worth it. Got my Fluke 25 and 75 for around 35€ delivered each.
-
Get bidding: http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483)
Huh, I expected to see fluke 87, or a scopemeter... 187 would also be fine... Preferably in the EU...
Did the other guy say he was getting nice Fluke 87s for $50? Maybe he's into really old, beat up meters.
Even in the USA people still bid for meters like this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/232453443364 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/232453443364)
(I like how the screen protector plastic is still hanging on - that's a quality screen protector, right there! :-DD )
I think I'm asking for impossible.
On eBay, yes.
You're not going to get "lucky" and grab a nice condition, modern, high-end Fluke for $50 on eBay. There's hundreds of people searching for them every day so nothing will slip past. It's even worse in Europe where supply/demand is much lower.
-
It takes daily looking at ebay, but its worth it. Got my Fluke 25 and 75 for around 35€ delivered each.
There you go...not Fluke 87s!
That does seem a little cheap, when was this? Prices have gone up in the last few years.
I linked to a Fluke 25 earlier, 55 Euros with shipping. They're very solid, reliable meters (if a little basic).
-
You're not going to get "lucky" and grab a nice condition, modern, high-end Fluke for $50 on eBay. There's hundreds of people searching for them every day so nothing will slip past. It's even worse in Europe where supply/demand is much lower.
It can be done. I paid less than $150 for a like new Fluke 289 a couple of years ago. I never really use it and the batteries barfed in it. Had to pay $40 for a new battery compartment last month.
-
It takes daily looking at ebay, but its worth it. Got my Fluke 25 and 75 for around 35€ delivered each.
There you go...not Fluke 87s!
That does seem a little cheap, when was this? Prices have gone up in the last few years.
I linked to a Fluke 25 earlier, 55 Euros with shipping. They're very solid, reliable meters (if a little basic).
I think I got them both one years ago, with one month apart
Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk
-
Get bidding: http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/112533380483)
Huh, I expected to see fluke 87, or a scopemeter... 187 would also be fine... Preferably in the EU...
Did the other guy say he was getting nice Fluke 87s for $50? Maybe he's into really old, beat up meters.
Even in the USA people still bid for meters like this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/232453443364 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/232453443364)
(I like how the screen protector plastic is still hanging on - that's a quality screen protector, right there! :-DD )
I think I'm asking for impossible.
On eBay, yes.
You're not going to get "lucky" and grab a nice condition, modern, high-end Fluke for $50 on eBay. There's hundreds of people searching for them every day so nothing will slip past. It's even worse in Europe where supply/demand is much lower.
I'd bid that meter to ~$120; it's a 87V, and it still has current calibration costing ~$80-150 depending on what was actually calibrated. Yes, that calibration expires soon, but 98% of the Flukes in service have NEVER been calibrated, and we still trust them (in general). That screen costs ~$9, last I checked.
I wonder whose truck that meter "fell" off of... so conveniently WITHOUT the bag of leads. ;)
Cheers,
mnem
I am not my pants. No, I am not your pants either.
-
I'd bid that meter to ~$120; it's a 87V, and it still has current calibration costing ~$80-150 depending on what was actually calibrated. Yes, that calibration expires soon, but 98% of the Flukes in service have NEVER been calibrated, and we still trust them (in general). That screen costs ~$9, last I checked.
I wonder whose truck that meter "fell" off of... so conveniently WITHOUT the bag of leads. ;)
Cheers,
mnem
I am not my pants. No, I am not your pants either.
You'd have to be a special kind of stupid if you were to sell stolen goods that have so many identifying properties. The previous owner should recognize the marker text and the screen protector at first glance.
Then again, people selling stolen goods aren't quite known for their ability to make good choices.
-
I'd bid that meter to ~$120; it's a 87V, and it still has current calibration costing ~$80-150 depending on what was actually calibrated. Yes, that calibration expires soon, but 98% of the Flukes in service have NEVER been calibrated, and we still trust them (in general). That screen costs ~$9, last I checked.
I wonder whose truck that meter "fell" off of... so conveniently WITHOUT the bag of leads. ;)
Cheers,
mnem
I am not my pants. No, I am not your pants either.
You'd have to be a special kind of stupid if you were to sell stolen goods that have so many identifying properties. The previous owner should recognize the marker text and the screen protector at first glance.
Then again, people selling stolen goods aren't quite known for their ability to make good choices.
Well, erm...
Given that I'm from the Finger Lakes region, where that auction is from, I can think of several major sources for a calibrated meter of that sort. There's 3M chemical, a massive plastics manufacturing facility, and any of a dozen huge custom-fab electronics manufacturers in Newark, and then 6 or 7 HVAC companies big enough to have fleets, all in the city or due North. Then of course, about 40 minutes South, there's Philips Lighting; one of the biggest lighting manufacturers in the country.
Of course the game they're playing is one of whether they get caught before they collect the money; the property owner still has to get Law Enforcement involved. If they have insurance to cover, or like many large Corporations, such a loss may take weeks or even months to show on inventory, the auction can come & go and never be noticed.
But yeah... that :-DMM auction rings a few alarm bells, at least for me. Of course, there's every possibility that meter was EOLed and is spoils of a dumpster dive; and that's probably the story I'd tell myself as I eagerly place my bid and hope for the best. :P
Cheers,
mnem
:bullshit:
-
I got mine today after about a month ! Looks like there has been a run on these meters after daves review.
I'm surprised the unit was not damaged in the post because it just came in its pouch and put in a bubble wrap bag along with the accessories :palm: In fact there is not a mark on it and it works perfectly :phew:
Did anyone else get there's delivered like this ?
cheers
-
I got mine today after about a month ! Looks like there has been a run on these meters after daves review.
I'm surprised the unit was not damaged in the post because it just came in its pouch and put in a bubble wrap bag along with the accessories :palm: In fact there is not a mark on it and it works perfectly :phew:
Did anyone else get there's delivered like this ?
cheers
Just like that. From chinese ebay vendor to Spain.
Enviado desde mi Jolla mediante Tapatalk
-
Did anyone else get there's delivered like this ?
cheers
Yeah, that's how mine was packaged. It's the pouch that protected it.
Mine came in a box.
-
I'd bid that meter to ~$120; it's a 87V, and it still has current calibration costing ~$80-150 depending on what was actually calibrated.
I like the description:
"2 small cracks in upper right screen. Other than that, near-new condition. No cables or accessories. "
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=344388;image)
-
I'd bid that meter to ~$120; it's a 87V, and it still has current calibration costing ~$80-150 depending on what was actually calibrated.
I like the description:
"2 small cracks in upper right screen. Other than that, near-new condition. No cables or accessories. "
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=344388;image)
That one looks like it's been through the wringer !!
-
I'd bid that meter to ~$120; it's a 87V, and it still has current calibration costing ~$80-150 depending on what was actually calibrated.
I like the description:
"2 small cracks in upper right screen. Other than that, near-new condition. No cables or accessories. "
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=344388;image)
That one looks like it's been through the wringer !!
Nah, It's just that some meters have to make a living. Not like some hobbyist meters
that just sit on the shelf and look pretty. :-+
-
I got mine today after about a month ! Looks like there has been a run on these meters after daves review.
I'm surprised the unit was not damaged in the post because it just came in its pouch and put in a bubble wrap bag along with the accessories :palm: In fact there is not a mark on it and it works perfectly :phew:
Did anyone else get there's delivered like this ?
cheers
Mine finally came too; and no, mine did not even have the bubble wrap. Just the typical white Chinese plastic bag. I was expecting a cracked screen, but it all seems fine.
-
Nah, It's just that some meters have to make a living. Not like some hobbyist meters
that just sit on the shelf and look pretty. :-+
Meters do not have to look that way, just because they are used. Some of my DMM's probably has many times the hours on them, compared to that meter, they still look nearly new (They have been used with a computer connections for logging).
-
Nah, It's just that some meters have to make a living. Not like some hobbyist meters
that just sit on the shelf and look pretty. :-+
Sure, I'm just wondering what that seller would describe as "some signs of wear".
-
Seller interpretations of wear is the source of many chuckles and :palm: when reading auction listings.
-
I bought two on ebay from "excellbay" on August 3rd for US $33.54 + US $3.98 shipping.
They were delivered on August 18th. Not too bad. Packaging was non existent as already mentioned several posts before.
Just bubble-wrap around them and in a plastic shipping pouch.
One will be in my electronics lab, the other one goes into the truck.
All in all, I'm pretty happy with them.
Michael
-
Mine came in bubble wrap too. No box. It seems to be fine.
-
BTW it does come from the factory in a protective cardboard box (and mine came double-boxed and with newspaper padding when I ordered from a China-internal seller), but the International sellers will remove that to reduce the shipping cost. Can't really complain I guess, shipping cardboard & air is rather expensive! ;D
-
BTW it does come from the factory in a protective cardboard box (and mine came double-boxed and with newspaper padding when I ordered from a China-internal seller), but the International sellers will remove that to reduce the shipping cost. Can't really complain I guess, shipping cardboard & air is rather expensive! ;D
The important part is that none so far seem to have suffered from the lack of a box. I really don't mind shipping it like that.
-
It's free physical ruggedness testing prior to receipt. :-+
-
That's not nearly as good as the JQS Robustness index rating...
-
Ah, well. You get what you pay for. :horse: :-DD
-
I dropped it off my bench once. It's so light, it floated to the floor like a bird feather. :-DD
-
I dropped it off my bench once. It's so light, it floated to the floor like a bird feather. :-DD
Reminds me of DT830. :) I think it would be difficult to damage it from short falls.
This an860b+ is a bit heavier, and the display scratches easily, so I'd rather not drop it.
-
I got mine today after about a month ! Looks like there has been a run on these meters after daves review.
I'm surprised the unit was not damaged in the post because it just came in its pouch and put in a bubble wrap bag along with the accessories :palm: In fact there is not a mark on it and it works perfectly :phew:
Did anyone else get there's delivered like this ?
cheers
Mine finally came too; and no, mine did not even have the bubble wrap. Just the typical white Chinese plastic bag. I was expecting a cracked screen, but it all seems fine.
Yesterday I noticed some bits of cracked black plastic in the bubble wrap bag. Trying to work out where they came from it looks like one of the plastic knobs for the cord puller on the protective bag that comes with the meter took a direct hit and disintegrated. It's sheer luck that more of these meters aren't damaged :scared:
-
Mine came in a plastic bag with one layer of bubble wrap around it, no box. It survived.
Has anybody else used it for any length of time with the auto power off disabled? Mine beeps all the time. It's supposed to beep as a warning when it's about to shut off, but apparently disabling the auto power off doesn't disable those beeps.
-
The AN8002 :-DMM I bought a few months ago when BG had them for $12 & change came in its pouch with one layer of bubble wrap inside one of those gray film mailers. Arrived in perfect condition, then it got a big old scar across the LCD minutes after I opened it up when I turned around and knocked it off the bench while tossing the screen protector in the trash due to some annoying bubbles I couldn't get rid of. :palm: No, the irony of this event is not lost on me. :P
I expect similar shipping care will be applied to my AN8008. :-DD
mnem
i have too many bolts, not enough volts.
-
I'd bid that meter to ~$120; it's a 87V, and it still has current calibration costing ~$80-150 depending on what was actually calibrated. Yes, that calibration expires soon, but 98% of the Flukes in service have NEVER been calibrated, and we still trust them (in general). That screen costs ~$9, last I checked.
I wonder whose truck that meter "fell" off of... so conveniently WITHOUT the bag of leads. ;)
Cheers,
mnem
I am not my pants. No, I am not your pants either.
You'd have to be a special kind of stupid if you were to sell stolen goods that have so many identifying properties. The previous owner should recognize the marker text and the screen protector at first glance.
Then again, people selling stolen goods aren't quite known for their ability to make good choices.
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=345154;image)
You know, I just realized... and maybe I picked up on it subconsciously when I first thought it was stolen... but if you look carefully, you can see that the writing on the bottom of the meter has been altered.
The original writing is a bit faded... something like " VALVE PROTO " I think. Looks like our fleaBay pirate won his little game of Russian Roulette; it sold for $128. ::)
[EDIT]
(https://www.google.com/maps/@42.9107014,-76.8107722,3a,75y,90t/data=!3m8!1e2!3m6!1sAF1QipPGC9wvP9hWU6cyuzl0EMk6pCkujEhxXJg_6y7T!2e10!3e12!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipPGC9wvP9hWU6cyuzl0EMk6pCkujEhxXJg_6y7T%3Dw203-h114-k-no!7i5312!8i2988)
Sonuvacrap... I think I know where it came from. The VALVE PROTOTYPING department of Goulds Pumps; they have a manufacturing complex in Seneca Falls, about 15 minutes east of Geneva, NY.
[/EDIT]
mnem
We sell only fleas of the highest quality.
-
You know, I just realized... and maybe I picked up on it subconsciously when I first thought it was stolen... but if you look carefully, you can see that the writing on the bottom of the meter has been altered.
The original writing is a bit faded... something like " VALVE PROTO " I think. Looks like our fleaBay pirate won his little game of Russian Roulette; it sold for $128. ::)
mnem
We sell only fleas of the highest quality.
Good catch. Looks like you may very well be right. The thief of fence must still be liking roulette, to post a picture of stolen goods that easily identifiable online. Even if he has taken some half assed precautions, putting photo evidence online forever and anyone to see is, let's say, daring. It's certainly not going to convince anyone if they catch on. Law enforcement loves being handed photo evidence.
Looking at the state of it, the owner at least got some good use out of it. A quick Google search doesn't turn up anyone obviously named or related to "VALVE PROTO".
-
The screen protector on my 8008 had a few bubbles. I was able to squeeze most of them out, so I left it on.
I've had it running non-stop for 5 days now measuring the voltage of a battery with the auto power off disabled. That seems like pretty good battery life. The never ending beeping is annoying though. I may have to open it up and fix that.
-
You know, I just realized... and maybe I picked up on it subconsciously when I first thought it was stolen... but if you look carefully, you can see that the writing on the bottom of the meter has been altered.
The original writing is a bit faded... something like " VALVE PROTO " I think. Looks like our fleaBay pirate won his little game of Russian Roulette; it sold for $128. ::)
mnem
We sell only fleas of the highest quality.
Good catch. Looks like you may very well be right. The thief of fence must still be liking roulette, to post a picture of stolen goods that easily identifiable online. Even if he has taken some half assed precautions, putting photo evidence online forever and anyone to see is, let's say, daring. It's certainly not going to convince anyone if they catch on. Law enforcement loves being handed photo evidence.
Looking at the state of it, the owner at least got some good use out of it. A quick Google search doesn't turn up anyone obviously named or related to "VALVE PROTO".
Yeah, I think I know where it came from; the VALVE PROTOTYPING department of Goulds Pumps. They have a manufacturing complex in Seneca Falls, about 15 minutes East of Geneva, NY.
I went back and edited my earlier post when I realized, but by then the topic had rolled over to a new page.
I sent them an eMail through their web portal pointing to the listing but I doubt I'll hear back from them.
mnem
meh.
-
Yeah, I think I know where it came from; the VALVE PROTOTYPING department of Goulds Pumps. They have a manufacturing complex in Seneca Falls, about 15 minutes East of Geneva, NY.
I went back and edited my earlier post when I realized, but by then the topic had rolled over to a new page.
I sent them an eMail through their web portal pointing to the listing but I doubt I'll hear back from them.
mnem
meh.
Good job. Even though it might be cheaper for the company the have insurance deal with the cost or simply treat is at a write off, it will help to community to put the pressure on theft.
Mind you, there's still a chance that the thing was legally acquired somehow. Maybe buying new was the better option, so this got thrown out or sold. The altered markings don't quite fit that story, but I've seen stranger things happening.
-
Mind you, there's still a chance that the thing was legally acquired somehow. Maybe buying new was the better option, so this got thrown out or sold. The altered markings don't quite fit that story, but I've seen stranger things happening.
It's quite possible that somebody at the company altered that label.
The alteration seems quite sophisticated for the average thief IMHO. Normally they'd rub it off, cover it up, or simply not show it in the photos. Playing clever word games? Not so much.
-
Mind you, there's still a chance that the thing was legally acquired somehow. Maybe buying new was the better option, so this got thrown out or sold. The altered markings don't quite fit that story, but I've seen stranger things happening.
It's quite possible that somebody at the company altered that label.
The alteration seems quite sophisticated for the average thief IMHO. Normally they'd rub it off, cover it up, or simply not show it in the photos. Playing clever word games? Not so much.
:-DD LOL... That feels like more of a rationalization to me; just like when I said this a while back:
...Of course, there's every possibility that meter was EOLed and is spoils of a dumpster dive; and that's probably the story I'd tell myself as I eagerly place my bid and hope for the best. :P
Cheers,
mnem
:bullshit:
If they were going to alter it at the company, I'd expect them to just black it all out, unless it was somebody pranking somebody else.
Of course, anybody who's ever tried to clean Sharpie off the rubber bootie on their Fluke knows that NOTHING will get it off if it's been there more than a few hours; the ink/dye/daemon ichor they use leeches into the material and nothing short of grinding off a layer of rubber will make the writing go away. I think that's deliberate on Fluke's part.
mnem
*Toddles off to ded*
-
If they were going to alter it at the company, I'd expect them to just black it all out, unless it was somebody pranking somebody else.
I don't mean officially altered according to a policy, I mean 'bored engineer' altered.
-
If they were going to alter it at the company, I'd expect them to just black it all out, unless it was somebody pranking somebody else.
I don't mean officially altered according to a policy, I mean 'bored engineer' altered.
Yeah, that tangent kindof falls under the "pranking" umbrella. :P
There nothing wrong with an engineer being bored... that is how we got electronic bird ornaments on our Christmas trees, therumins, The Wheeze, and XKCD. ;D
(https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/drone_training.png)
mnem
I used to sort all my resistors according to color... then came SMDs. |O
-
The AN8008 is a bar of soap - smooth plastic, rounded edges that @#^@#!$ thing leaps out of my hand everytime I try grab it. It's so slick.
I had an idea to glue Velcro to the backside which is really nice as it gives some friction and cush there.
Other side, put mating Velcro on a prototype stand out of scrap wood. It has some weight on the base to stop it falling over.
But next rev I will make the whole thing wider from 55mm -> ~65mm. The multimeter's rounded corners make it still wobble.
Just trying to get the shape right, not make a beauty contest entry ::)
-
I actually considered hot gluing mine to the front of a shelf, but it would get in the way of other stuff too much I think.
-
I actually considered hot gluing mine to the front of a shelf, but it would get in the way of other stuff too much I think.
How will you change the battery?
-
I actually considered hot gluing mine to the front of a shelf, but it would get in the way of other stuff too much I think.
How will you change the battery?
Telekinesis, of course!
-
I actually considered hot gluing mine to the front of a shelf, but it would get in the way of other stuff too much I think.
How will you change the battery?
Telekinesis, of course!
Ah, good! I thought you were going to try and use something useless like a Batteriser.
-
How accurate are everybody's AN8008s?
Mine seems to be about 4 or 5 counts high on most readings. Within spec, but not impressive.
Even my AN860B+ is much better than that.
eg. For 5V DC: AN8008 reads 5.004V, AN860B+ reads 5.000V
For 1kOhms: AN8008 reads 1003 \$\Omega\$, AN860B+ reads 1001 \$\Omega\$
-
Ordered mine on 11th, received yesterday on 29th, not too bad. Like other mentioned, it came only in bubblewrap without any box but it's fine. The slow autoranging together with the flimsy probes with poor contact can be annoying. I guess in this price category I can't complain. :-DMM
-
My experience with the probes is that a light brush with a fiberglass pen help a lot.
-
How accurate are everybody's AN8008s?
Mine seems to be about 4 or 5 counts high on most readings. Within spec, but not impressive.
Even my AN860B+ is much better than that.
eg. For 5V DC: AN8008 reads 5.004V, AN860B+ reads 5.000V
For 1kOhms: AN8008 reads 1003 \$\Omega\$, AN860B+ reads 1001 \$\Omega\$
You are seeing +/- 0.1% accuracy on a DMM with +/- 0.5% specifications. I would say that it is pretty good for a sub $20 multimeter.
-
You are seeing +/- 0.1% accuracy on a DMM with +/- 0.5% specifications. I would say that it is pretty good for a sub $20 multimeter.
Yes, but there's been a lot of people saying how accurate it is and the AN860B+ is also a $20 meter but it does much better.
I guess if you watch Dave's video closely he's not getting much better results than me.
-
You are seeing +/- 0.1% accuracy on a DMM with +/- 0.5% specifications. I would say that it is pretty good for a sub $20 multimeter.
Yes, but there's been a lot of people saying how accurate it is and the AN860B+ is also a $20 meter but it does much better.
I guess if you watch Dave's video closely he's not getting much better results than me.
If you happen to have an excellent AN860B+ and an average AN8008, then the AN8008 may appear to be inferior.
-
If you happen to have an excellent AN860B+ and an average AN8008, then the AN8008 may appear to be inferior.
That's why I asked what everybody else is seeing.
(I noted in my original post that I'm aware that the meter is in spec)
-
Just received mine. A very nice device.
Although I'm using 2 rechargeable AAAs the diode tester has more Oomph than my Fluke. I only did a few quick tests, e.g. I tested the frequency tester quickly against my new frequency generator and it is spot on over the full frequency range it support (seems so be up to around 27MHz here).
-
If you happen to have an excellent AN860B+ and an average AN8008, then the AN8008 may appear to be inferior.
That's why I asked what everybody else is seeing.
(I noted in my original post that I'm aware that the meter is in spec)
My AN8008 and AN860B+ agree to within +/-1 count on DC volts, and those are within +/-2 counts of the Fluke 187 and BM235 that I've just checked them against. Just a quick test, but earlier, more exhaustive testing didn't raise any concerns. Quite the opposite...
-
Although I'm using 2 rechargeable AAAs the diode tester has more Oomph than my Fluke.
The voltage for diode test is generated by a charge pump and regulator circuit, so is independent of the battery voltage. In a way, it's a shame they didn't make it fractionally higher - say, 3.3V - so people wouldn't assume they're seeing the battery voltage.
On the other hand, the square wave output is a function of the battery voltage.
-
Although I'm using 2 rechargeable AAAs the diode tester has more Oomph than my Fluke.
The voltage for diode test is generated by a charge pump and regulator circuit, so is independent of the battery voltage. In a way, it's a shame they didn't make it fractionally higher - say, 3.3V - so people wouldn't assume they're seeing the battery voltage.
Doesn't matter how they do it. My point is it's better than the Fluke despite operating under worse conditions. ;)
-
Quick test: My AN860B+ shows 1.553V, my two AN8008s show 1.555V and 1.554V.
-
Quick test: My AN860B+ shows 1.553V, my two AN8008s show 1.555V and 1.554V.
So at 5V the AN8008s would average about 5 counts higher, just like mine. :popcorn:
(do you have a voltage reference or a third meter to see which of the two is correct?)
-
Quick test: My AN860B+ shows 1.553V, my two AN8008s show 1.555V and 1.554V.
So at 5V the AN8008s would average about 5 counts higher, just like mine. :popcorn:
(do you have a voltage reference or a fancy third meter to see which of the two is correct?)
Sorry, I do not have a fancy meter or voltage reference available. My best meter at the moment is UT-61E. Actually I did made a quick test previously against the UT-61E when I received the AN8008s:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1261915/#msg1261915 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1261915/#msg1261915)
Quick test:
Took a 1.5V battery and measured the battery voltage with two AN8008 and one UT61E simultaneously: AN8008s displays 1.565 +/- 0.001 and UT61E 1.5655 +/- 0.0001.
Current measurement test with the three DMMs in series in uA range: 3.37 uA +/- 0.01 uA.
Modify message
All meters seem to agree pretty well.
-
Although I'm using 2 rechargeable AAAs the diode tester has more Oomph than my Fluke.
The voltage for diode test is generated by a charge pump and regulator circuit, so is independent of the battery voltage. In a way, it's a shame they didn't make it fractionally higher - say, 3.3V - so people wouldn't assume they're seeing the battery voltage.
Doesn't matter how they do it. My point is it's better than the Fluke despite operating under worse conditions. ;)
Surely it's interesting to know what's happening?
Anyway, my point is that there is a misconception that the diode test voltage is equal to the battery voltage. Even Dave says so in his review. It's an easy mistake to make, given that the chosen voltage is so very close that given by a pair of fresh alkaline AAAs, but it's a mistake nonetheless. Meanwhile, I've checked a handful of Fluke meters here, and the only one I've found that can't light a white LED is the Fluke 101. But the others run from 4 AAs or a PP3.
Similarly, others have claimed that the square wave output comes from the charge pump supply, but that is also incorrect. Just trying to get accurate information out there :-+
-
Quick test: My AN860B+ shows 1.553V, my two AN8008s show 1.555V and 1.554V.
So at 5V the AN8008s would average about 5 counts higher, just like mine. :popcorn:
(do you have a voltage reference or a third meter to see which of the two is correct?)
I've done a bit more checking, and the biggest error does seem to occur at 5V. I'm not sure why.
Having said that, the AN860B+ is the least accurate of them all - the AN8002 and AN8008 all agree nicely with whatever Fluke I happen to compare them to. But still, we're talking about very small numbers of counts at worst - nothing to worry about IMHO. As you say, they are all meet their spec by quite some margin - how they do in a year or two is the really interesting question :-+
-
Although I'm using 2 rechargeable AAAs the diode tester has more Oomph than my Fluke.
The voltage for diode test is generated by a charge pump and regulator circuit, so is independent of the battery voltage. In a way, it's a shame they didn't make it fractionally higher - say, 3.3V - so people wouldn't assume they're seeing the battery voltage.
Doesn't matter how they do it. My point is it's better than the Fluke despite operating under worse conditions. ;)
Surely it's interesting to know what's happening?
Anyway, my point is that there is a misconception that the diode test voltage is equal to the battery voltage. Even Dave says so in his review. It's an easy mistake to make, given that the chosen voltage is so very close that given by a pair of fresh alkaline AAAs, but it's a mistake nonetheless. Meanwhile, I've checked a handful of Fluke meters here, and the only one I've found that can't light a white LED is the Fluke 101. But the others run from 4 AAs or a PP3.
Similarly, others have claimed that the square wave output comes from the charge pump supply, but that is also incorrect. Just trying to get accurate information out there :-+
Agreed if you don't care "how they do it", you're on the wrong website!
-
I actually considered hot gluing mine to the front of a shelf, but it would get in the way of other stuff too much I think.
How will you change the battery?
At the moment, it's been running non-stop (auto power off disabled) for over 10 days. I'd estimate that when used normally I could easily get 3-6 months before needing to recharge the batteries. While it wouldn't be much trouble to peel it off and re-glue it that infrequently, I decided it would be impractical for other reasons.
-
Doesn't matter how they do it. My point is it's better than the Fluke despite operating under worse conditions. ;)
Surely it's interesting to know what's happening?
Thanks for free education, I guess. But it's not like I haven't implemented my own LED testers before. ;) There was also a LED tester as a Boldport project a short while ago: https://www.boldport.com/products/ligemdio/ (https://www.boldport.com/products/ligemdio/)
Anyway, my point is that there is a misconception that the diode test voltage is equal to the battery voltage.
I never claimed that. I only said it works better than my Fluke (17B+) despite running on a lower input voltage.
Just FYI, I just measured the current (using a third DMM of course), the Fluke allows 0.165mA while the Aneng will supply 0.765mA; the Aneng also shows a higher Forward voltage of 1.95V which should be closer to reality than the Fluke which reads 1.83V but I'm too lazy to really measure that LED right now.
Anyway, I can't (easily) change the internal implementation so I have to accept it as it is.
So far I found the Aneng to be a remarkable device for what it is. I've also tested the speed of the continuity tester now and it is a lot quicker than the Fluke (using the same Brymen probes) as well; with this little device I can swipe swiftly over pads on the board without missing the connection(s) where the Fluke needs a much slower motion. It would be great if it would unlatch a bit quicker though...
-
Thanks for free education, I guess. But it's not like I haven't implemented my own LED testers before. ;) There was also a LED tester as a Boldport project a short while ago: https://www.boldport.com/products/ligemdio/ (https://www.boldport.com/products/ligemdio/)
I like the project. Maybe you could implement a DIY continuity checker as well?
The "LED tester" I use is a 9v battery (improvised holder) with 2 resistors (one on positive and one negative which slightly distributes the minimal heating). That is the simplest to make, and works with "dead" 9v batteries well enough.
This limits the 'maximum current', but does not provide equal current at different forward voltage, so a constant current is always more optimal (but not always necessary to see if an LED works).
-
I like the project. Maybe you could implement a DIY continuity checker as well?
I've thought about this a few times. I'd want one with a light on the probe.
The multimeter seems like a fundamentally wrong way to test continuity IMHO. The only we do it that way is that there's already a battery powered device with two wires attached to it on our workbench.
I never bothered building one because I don't really spend much time swiping along rows of contacts.
-
Anyway, my point is that there is a misconception that the diode test voltage is equal to the battery voltage.
I never claimed that. I only said it works better than my Fluke (17B+) despite running on a lower input voltage.
I thought it was clear enough from what I wrote, but for the sake of clarity, I never said that you made the claim, or even that you believed it. I simply said "there is a misconception", meaning that some people believe it, possibly as a result of watching Dave's review...
Thanks for telling us which Fluke you have. I don't have one of those, but have been considering picking one up to review for some time now. Or perhaps the 18B+, which has a dedicated LED test function that sources rather more than 3V, so will have an internal step-up converter of some type. Obviously, the 17B+ does not, though of course there will be something in there for the LED backlight, but they've obviously decided to keep that separate.
As for dedicated LED tester projects, I don't see any point upgrading from a resistor to a current source frankly. If you want to go beyond a simple resistor, then something like this is far more useful and interesting: http://robotroom.com/LED-Tester-Pro-1.html (http://robotroom.com/LED-Tester-Pro-1.html) :-+
-
I thought it was clear enough from what I wrote, but for the sake of clarity, I never said that you made the claim, or even that you believed it. I simply said "there is a misconception", meaning that some people believe it, possibly as a result of watching Dave's review...
Fair enough. ;)
Thanks for telling us which Fluke you have. I don't have one of those, but have been considering picking one up to review for some time now. Or perhaps the 18B+, which has a dedicated LED test function that sources rather more than 3V, so will have an internal step-up converter of some type. Obviously, the 17B+ does not, though of course there will be something in there for the LED backlight, but they've obviously decided to keep that separate.
I do find REL/MIN/MAX measurements and temperature much more important than a dedicated LED testing function (I already have dedicated testers, I'm just too lazy to pull it for quick checks while working on a circuit) but YMMV of course.
-
I do find REL/MIN/MAX measurements and temperature much more important than a dedicated LED testing function (I already have dedicated testers, I'm just too lazy to pull it for quick checks while working on a circuit) but YMMV of course.
Personally, I just use a bench power supply and a resistor :-+
The PSU is always there on the shelf, as is a range of chunky resistors and other passives that get used for lots of assorted jobs like this. A dedicated tester would take up space, require battery changes and occasional testing, calibration, etc... Overkill really, especially for such a simple task.
Certainly, I've never attached great importance to a DMM being able to light an LED in diode-test mode, especially as the test current varies so much from meter to meter, and is generally only a couple of milliamps at best. But, some reviewers do, which is why I feel I should mention it in my reviews. But then, I see a lot of folk using DMMs when really they should be using a 'scope - it sometimes feels like we're going back to the old days when many people couldn't afford a 'scope :)
But the dedicated LED test function on the Fluke 18B+ is interesting to me. But not for the obvious reason, however. Instead, I'm keen to see what safety precautions they've taken - because an LED tester socket on the front of a DMM is arguably no better than the transistor tester on a DT830 :-DMM
-
The multimeter seems like a fundamentally wrong way to test continuity IMHO.
Could you elaborate on that please? ???
-
The multimeter seems like a fundamentally wrong way to test continuity IMHO.
Could you elaborate on that please? ???
As I said earlier, I'd like one with a LED or two in the thing I'm holding in my hand. The LEDs could give much more information than a beep somewhere in the background and would be very easy to focus on as you work. Vision is much faster than sound.
-
As I said earlier, I'd like one with a LED or two in the thing I'm holding in my hand. The LEDs could give much more information than a beep somewhere in the background and would be very easy to focus on as you work. Vision is much faster than sound.
OK -- a matter of taste, I'd say. I typically like the fact that I can fully concentrate my vision on small PCB contacts, shine a bright light on the PCB etc., and rely on the audio signal when checking for contact.
Having been a radio operator during my navy service (a while ago...), I doubt the "vision is faster than sound" bit as a general statement. Humans can certainly receive and decode morse code via audio at much faster speeds than visually!
-
Doesn't matter how they do it. My point is it's better than the Fluke despite operating under worse conditions. ;)
Surely it's interesting to know what's happening?
Thanks for free education, I guess. But it's not like I haven't implemented my own LED testers before. ;) There was also a LED tester as a Boldport project a short while ago: https://www.boldport.com/products/ligemdio/ (https://www.boldport.com/products/ligemdio/)
Anyway, my point is that there is a misconception that the diode test voltage is equal to the battery voltage.
I never claimed that. I only said it works better than my Fluke (17B+) despite running on a lower input voltage.
Just FYI, I just measured the current (using a third DMM of course), the Fluke allows 0.165mA while the Aneng will supply 0.765mA; the Aneng also shows a higher Forward voltage of 1.95V which should be closer to reality than the Fluke which reads 1.83V but I'm too lazy to really measure that LED right now.
Anyway, I can't (easily) change the internal implementation so I have to accept it as it is.
So far I found the Aneng to be a remarkable device for what it is. I've also tested the speed of the continuity tester now and it is a lot quicker than the Fluke (using the same Brymen probes) as well; with this little device I can swipe swiftly over pads on the board without missing the connection(s) where the Fluke needs a much slower motion. It would be great if it would unlatch a bit quicker though...
Actually... I'd been thinking about this very thing myself; and I came to the contusion that it was worth taking a $13 gamble to see if my AN8002 could be powered by a small LiPo. I even bought a few of these: http://www.ebay.com/itm/322600343728 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/322600343728) to make it a complete solution with LVP and convenient charging in one board; just cut the divider out of the battery box and hack it all in there. Now I'll probably do it as a pretest against using the same circuit in my AN8008.
(http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x462/mnemennth/DSC00415.jpg)
That said... after keeping the AN8002 in my little bag of dirty tricks for a while, I think the funky shape and "bar of soap" thing is a for real issue... but something best resolved with some 3D Printing abuse and a decent set of modular leads. Maybe an oversized jacket printed out of TPU with a cord-wrap and nacelles for the probes and an oversized flip-out stand... or even just cut the pretense and make it a big wedge so when you knock it off the bench it bounces... :P
Cheers,
mnem
*toddles off to ded*
-
How accurate are everybody's AN8008s?
Mine seems to be about 4 or 5 counts high on most readings. Within spec, but not impressive.
Even my AN860B+ is much better than that.
eg. For 5V DC: AN8008 reads 5.004V, AN860B+ reads 5.000V
For 1kOhms: AN8008 reads 1003 \$\Omega\$, AN860B+ reads 1001 \$\Omega\$
You can calibrate the AN8008 like I did using this process (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1276843/#msg1276843). I don't know if I caused my inaccuracies as I 'fixed' the poor soldering around the fuse holders as soon as I got mine and that almost certainly changed the current readings, probably less so the voltage readings.
-
I don't know if I caused my inaccuracies as I 'fixed' the poor soldering around the fuse holders as soon as I got mine and that almost certainly changed the current readings, probably less so the voltage readings.
It shouldn't do, otherwise you'd need to recalibrate every time you changed the fuse.
-
Bang-em-good has them on sale again for $17.77 for the next 9 days (actually, until they sell out, which took about 10 hours last time) with free "Slow boat From China" shipping or 7-12 day Priority shipping for an additional 56¢.
https://www.banggood.com/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-AC-DC-Current-Voltage-Resistance-Frequency-Capacitance-Test-p-1157985.html?p=GI031609948520121218 (https://www.banggood.com/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-AC-DC-Current-Voltage-Resistance-Frequency-Capacitance-Test-p-1157985.html?p=GI031609948520121218)
This URL has my affiliate code; it costs you nothing but I get a few affiliate points I can use to buy stuff a little cheaper. Full disclosure, etc.
https://www.banggood.com/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-AC-DC-Current-Voltage-Resistance-Frequency-Capacitance-Test-p-1157985.html (https://www.banggood.com/ANENG-AN8008-True-RMS-Digital-Multimeter-AC-DC-Current-Voltage-Resistance-Frequency-Capacitance-Test-p-1157985.html)
This URL is completely unsullied for those purists out there. ;)
Cheers,
mnem
Honey, where are my pa-a-a-ants?
-
I ordered one on Amazon, knowing it would be slow from China.
There are several Amazon sellers. You can find one that has them in the Amazon warehouse and can get one in a few days (Prime member). Mine took 3 days. This comes from the warehouse:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072JMBLJS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072JMBLJS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
-
I ordered one on Amazon, knowing it would be slow from China.
There are several Amazon sellers. You can find one that has them in the Amazon warehouse and can get one in a few days (Prime member). Mine took 3 days. This comes from the warehouse:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072JMBLJS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072JMBLJS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
Wasn't an option a month a go.
-
I ordered one on Amazon, knowing it would be slow from China.
There are several Amazon sellers. You can find one that has them in the Amazon warehouse and can get one in a few days (Prime member). Mine took 3 days. This comes from the warehouse:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072JMBLJS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072JMBLJS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
I (and others) fell into that trap, I ordered my AN8008 from Amazon (from the seller, 'Alloete'), thinking it would ship from the US but it came from China - and took 4 weeks to get here.
[EDIT] It looks like that particular one will ship from the US... you can see this... "In Stock.. Sold by whitelotous and Fulfilled by Amazon."
At least when you order from eBay, it tells you clearly where it will ship from. Buyer beware!
-
At least when you order from eBay, it tells you clearly where it will ship from. Buyer beware!
I agree. I carefully read the ad trying to figure out where it comes from. If from China then I try Aliexpress. But sometimes I mess up. Amazon makes it hard to figure this out.
-
Forgive my naivety, but what's wrong if it comes from China? Mine took about 2.5 weeks, but no problems so far with the meter. just no box. Don't they all basically come from the same
place?
-
Maybe its the shipping time ? :-//
-
Forgive my naivety, but what's wrong if it comes from China? Mine took about 2.5 weeks, but no problems so far with the meter. just no box. Don't they all basically come from the same
place?
2 days versus 2-3 weeks. In my case 3.5 weeks.
-
Forgive my naivety, but what's wrong if it comes from China? Mine took about 2.5 weeks, but no problems so far with the meter. just no box. Don't they all basically come from the same
place?
2 days versus 2-3 weeks. In my case 3.5 weeks.
In my case 2 days but I was warned by this forum so I looked hard and found some in the US
-
Forgive my naivety, but what's wrong if it comes from China? Mine took about 2.5 weeks, but no problems so far with the meter. just no box.
Some people want it NOW, DAMMIT!
-
Forgive my naivety, but what's wrong if it comes from China? Mine took about 2.5 weeks, but no problems so far with the meter. just no box.
Some people want it NOW, DAMMIT!
I wait since 5 weeks to get mine from Bangood. |O
I think they use the cheapest way to ship. :horse:
-
i get banggood stuff in under 2 weeks, maybe belgian customs/post is sitting on it to create extra delays.
use the tracking number next-time to see.
-
Forgive my naivety, but what's wrong if it comes from China? Mine took about 2.5 weeks, but no problems so far with the meter. just no box.
Some people want it NOW, DAMMIT!
The more you want something, the more impatient you are. On the "bright side", if it takes more time to arrive, you might be even happier to receive it (if everything goes well with the package and meter). Generally it is easier if things do arrive quickly. I wouldn't pay more, however (maybe a very small reasonable difference).
That said, I'm glad you recommended the AN860B+. Not that bigger is better in this case (smaller is more handy), but I do like the added functionality.
-
i get banggood stuff in under 2 weeks, maybe belgian customs/post is sitting on it to create extra delays.
use the tracking number next-time to see.
Belgian customs are slow but in this case since it is less than 22€ it bypass customs actions.
From time to time I get stuff from China in less than 2 weeks.
I track every days what I order, in this case it is just indicated “China, Departure to country of destination”
-
Banggood is a Chinese vendor that typically delivers to me, in Michigan USA, in 2 weeks or less; I use them a lot and would recommend them.
My annoyance was that, as an Amazon Prime customer, where shipping is free, I'm used to seeing an item listed as 'Prime', clicking on it, and having it a less than a week later. The Prime price may be a couple of dollars more but with free shipping that is often the better deal. When I went on Amazon to buy the AN8008, I clicked on a Prime vendor for about $23 and then waited a month to get it. I could have paid less to order it from Banggood (or an eBay seller in China), and got it in 2 weeks.
I don't mind buying from China but I do mind buying from Amazon, probably paying a few dollars more, and then finding that the item was shipped from China and took a month to get here.
-
Banggood is a Chinese vendor that typically delivers to me, in Michigan USA, in 2 weeks or less; I use them a lot and would recommend them.
My annoyance was that, as an Amazon Prime customer, where shipping is free, I'm used to seeing an item listed as 'Prime', clicking on it, and having it a less than a week later. The Prime price may be a couple of dollars more but with free shipping that is often the better deal. When I went on Amazon to buy the AN8008, I clicked on a Prime vendor for about $23 and then waited a month to get it. I could have paid less to order it from Banggood (or an eBay seller in China), and got it in 2 weeks.
I don't mind buying from China but I do mind buying from Amazon, probably paying a few dollars more, and then finding that the item was shipped from China and took a month to get here.
That's exactly what happened to me, not sure how that supplier got listed as "Prime", I pay yearly for that 2-day shipping perk. As someone hypnotized earlier in this thread, they 1st shipped me a dollar item with a card saying the meter would be shipped later. I waited two weeks just for that "free" gift, then a few more weeks to get what I really ordered, the meter. I reported this to Amazon, I hope these mini scams don't get popular, I'll try and be a lot more careful from now on.
-
MacMeter, yes, I too got the prophylactic for remote-controls, I guess if I ran a pay-by-the-hour motel, they may have been useful... but Ii don't... and they aren't.
But now I have me AN8008 and all is right with the world :-DMM
-
AN8008 CALIBRATION BASICS
I've figured out how to do calibration although I don't have the finer details worked out. Here's what I know...
1. Short out J1 on the PCB (it's at the top right corner as you look at the PCB from the back of the meter)
2. Get your calibration reference ready and connected - in my case a 300 mA DC feed through the mA/A terminal and Common
3. Turn rotary control from off to the resistance position and CAL will appear on the display
3. Now WAIT until you hear a beep and then move the rotary control to the mA/A position - if you turn the rotary control away from resistance too quickly it doesn't show the values you've selected but moving the rotary switch around corrects that
4. Press [Set/Hold] (orange) button repeatedly until you see DC mA and a value will be displayed
5. Now you should see a value close to what you're providing the meter with, around 300 mA DC in my case
6. Press the [Range] (blue) button (quick press) to range down (but it only does it in 0.1 A increments)
7. Press and hold the [Range] (blue) button (long press) to range up (but it only does it in 0.1 A increments)
8. Press [Set/Hold] (orange) button to move off that setting (I think this is when the cal change just made is saved)
9. Move the rotary switch to off
10. Clear the link on J1 and power back on and test
As far as I can tell, the trick is to set the input to an exact value like 300 mA so you can set that value on the display during cal because you can't adjust the display to 303 mA so, for my slight discrepancy, I saw 298 mA displayed, I ranged down - I saw 200 mA, and then ,with a long press of [Range], ranged up and then I saw 300 mA displayed, pressed the orange button again and I was done. Other parameters can be set by pressing the [Set/Hold] (orange) button repeatedly but you'll only see values corresponding to the rotary position selected so you'd leave it in the resistance position to cycle through the measurements associated with that position including resistance.
What I'm not clear about is when it actually stores a new calibration value, I guess that, once you use the [Range] (blue) button, it changes the calibration for that setting, and I think it saves it when - having got the display to show the value you want, you press the orange button once more.
At first I did my above procedure providing 300 mA but ranged down to display 100 mA and couldn't change that value because I hadn't figured out that a long press ranges up by that point. So when I then switched off and removed the link, it had calibrated the meter to display 100 mA when 300 mA was supplied which it did. I had to re-calibrate after I figured out that the long press increases the displayed value.
After I posted a video where I had modified the KZ102 (AN8002) to the capacitance readings were off about 100pF. Someone had wrote me about modifying the contents of the PROM to realign it. Seems like a lot of work. Does anyone know if the above procedure applies to the AN8002 (and others) as well? For capacitance and current, what are the standard values that are required?
-
My annoyance was that, as an Amazon Prime customer, where shipping is free, I'm used to seeing an item listed as 'Prime', clicking on it, and having it a less than a week later. The Prime price may be a couple of dollars more but with free shipping that is often the better deal. When I went on Amazon to buy the AN8008, I clicked on a Prime vendor for about $23 and then waited a month to get it. I could have paid less to order it from Banggood (or an eBay seller in China), and got it in 2 weeks.
I don't mind buying from China but I do mind buying from Amazon, probably paying a few dollars more, and then finding that the item was shipped from China and took a month to get here.
Prime is irrelevant. Please tell whether the item was listed as "In stock and sold by Amazon" or "Sold by X and fulfilled by Amazon"?
If either of those were stated and the item was not promptly packed and shipped from an Amazon warehouse you have a complaint against Amazon for false listing information.
-
After I posted a video where I had modified the KZ102 (AN8002) to the capacitance readings were off about 100pF. Someone had wrote me about modifying the contents of the PROM to realign it. Seems like a lot of work. Does anyone know if the above procedure applies to the AN8002 (and others) as well? For capacitance and current, what are the standard values that are required?
i imagine it's the same, the newer chip is evolved from the DM0660
great video btw, after watching your mods i had to open mine again.
not for electronics, i never thought to grease the switch detents the first time - very nice positive action now i put some lithium grease in it! :-+
-
This "Ragu 17B+ (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06X1H3NQR)" was very recently brought to my attention. $10 at Amazon, with Prime 2-day shipping available.
I do not have one. But by looks alone, I'm guessing this is another DMT0660-based meter somewhat like the AN860B+, trading the temperature function for non-contact voltage.
Sure is cheap! Not sure how long the sale price will last.
-
This "Ragu 17B+ (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06X1H3NQR)" was very recently brought to my attention. $10 at Amazon, with Prime 2-day shipping available.
I do not have one. But by looks alone, I'm guessing this is another DMT0660-based meter somewhat like the AN860B+, trading the temperature function for non-contact voltage.
Sure is cheap! Not sure how long the sale price will last.
Looks good. Might get to $20 or so.
(https://i.imgur.com/3pziAdh.png)
Couldn't find it on eBay except from 2 US sellers, $14 and 26 without shipping.
-
Ragu: Makes me think of spaghetti. ;D
-
Ragu: Makes me think of spaghetti. ;D
And the 17B+ makes me think of copy pasta. :P
-
Pasta with ragu. omnomn :clap:
-
... i never thought to grease the switch detents the first time - very nice positive action now i put some lithium grease in it! :-+
Don't forget a warning - there are two steel balls and spring in the rotary switch detent, if you take it apart to lube it the balls want to shoot across a room! ::)
[edit: there's two of them!]
-
yes, good warning - there are 2 actually, but i released it nice & slow. :phew:
-
Couldn't find it on eBay except from 2 US sellers, $14 and 26 without shipping.
I got more than 2 sellers but they were all from USA or UK. No Chinese.
I wonder if it's a rebrand.
-
Couldn't find it on eBay except from 2 US sellers, $14 and 26 without shipping.
I got more than 2 sellers but they were all from USA or UK. No Chinese.
I wonder if it's a rebrand.
It might be a good deal for those in the US. Especially at the Amazon price.
But of course it's difficult to tell anything unless someone was to take it and make a review. :)
-
Got mine on Banggood and took only 1.5 weeks to arrive for only 15 euro.
-
It was a Santa Claus day today :-DD
It finally arrived and got my Infiniium scope as well :-+
-
It was a Santa Claus day today :-DD
It finally arrived and got my Infiniium scope as well :-+
Let me guess which one of the two got the larger share of your attention... :P
Congrats on two nice toys!
-
It was a Santa Claus day today :-DD
It finally arrived and got my Infiniium scope as well :-+
Let me guess which one of the two got the larger share of your attention... :P
Congrats on two nice toys!
This might depend on whether or not a person in this situation already has a scope.
If not, a scope might get more attention at start as it's something new to learn how to use, explore, and hopefully avoid damaging with improper use.
Now, if someone was to get their first multimeter and scope at the same time (I'm sure this doesn't happen every time), it would be interesting to see which tool is more fun to explore.
-
It was a Santa Claus day today :-DD
It finally arrived and got my Infiniium scope as well :-+
Let me guess which one of the two got the larger share of your attention... :P
Congrats on two nice toys!
Yep :popcorn:
Tomorrow Santa is coming again and will bring me the calibrator that was sleeping 3 weeks in customs :-DD
-
This "Ragu 17B+ (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06X1H3NQR)" was very recently brought to my attention. $10 at Amazon, with Prime 2-day shipping available.
I do not have one. But by looks alone, I'm guessing this is another DMT0660-based meter somewhat like the AN860B+, trading the temperature function for non-contact voltage.
Sure is cheap! Not sure how long the sale price will last.
Looks good. Might get to $20 or so.
(SNIP)
Couldn't find it on eBay except from 2 US sellers, $14 and 26 without shipping.
Ten clams for a 6000 count True RMS :-DMM... holy Bleep!ing Bleep!crackers!!!
I couldn't help m'self... I had to get myself a shiny red spaghetti meter, even though they're evidently not going to be back in Amazon's Warehouse until 9/10-9/12 or so; no matter what delivery option I chose it was "Delivery by 9/14". So I picked the "No Rush" option and got $5 to spend in Amazon Pantry... probably get me some BBQ spices or somesuch.
This is getting down to the realm of the Horror Fraught "Drop Dead Red" little boxes of Damifino with test leads on 'em I used to get for free just so I could give 'em away. :-DD
One time, they had a month-long thing going with a new special item every day; every time I brought in the freebie coupon for one of those meters, sometimes from both stores in my neighborhood if teh special of the day was a really good item. At the end of the month, I donated a box full of 'em to my Model Airfield to give out to members who needed a meter. :-/O
mnem
Did I get something on my shoe?
-
3. Safe, Quick and Complete Systems: A perfect combination of a super sensitive electric field detection, an amazing measuring speed of 3 times in 1 second and complete overload protection, RAGU 17B • 5. Compact Design: The refined design conforms to IEC1010,
Well there you go. $10 gets you a lot now days.
-
I couldn't help m'self... I had to get myself a shiny red spaghetti meter [...] I picked the "No Rush" option and got $5 to spend in Amazon Pantry... probably get me some BBQ spices or somesuch.
Spaghetti meter, but no pasta? No spaghetti sauce? Missed opportunity. :-DD
-
Hello,
I has been a long time since I have been here :P
So I've bought an AN8008 (15€) and 2x UT210E (2x 24€) from banggood (which I like very much).
I've received my AN8008 yesterday and I have a calibration problem with it on the V DC (about 0.1V over).
I have tried with the calibration process without success: it's impossible to have something stable from a 500mV source.
So I have extract my 24C02A with my CH341A and only 3 wires, and I have put some jumpers to switch between program mode(CH341A) and read mode(DM1106EN mode), it works very well:
(http://morpheus.stigmata.free.fr/elec/24C02A_0.jpg)
(http://morpheus.stigmata.free.fr/elec/24C02A_1.jpg)
I have changed some options like adding Temperature in °C (only), changing backlight time and power saving time, and it seems that calibrate with changing manually values works, but a little long to do.
I would like to disable annoying beep sound when changing mode, and slow down a little the display refresh because it seems that it updates too fast and then slowly stabilize the mesured value.
Also I find that the buzzer has a fixed delay which is too long and slow down the bip-mode + add some lag; I can't find if this delay is created by a capacitor or by the DM1106EN (EEPROM?)
And I don't understand why there is a 9.99MOhms limit (whereas the AN8002 has 60MOhms), so I can't check my other DMM input impendance with this one :-DD
Last thing is about the mA mode, why it lacks a range ?
I will continue to follow this topic, thanks for all informations in it ! 8)
Hoping that someone will post the DM1106 datasheet in english :-+
-
i see eneloops - did you try alkaline batteries?
i dont think the meter works properly at 2.4v
-
i see eneloops - did you try alkaline batteries?
i dont think the meter works properly at 2.4v
Hello,
Yes, after unboxing, I have put 2 fresh alkaline batteries and I have had this little calibration problem on V-DC.
Since, I use Eneloop to do the testing and flashing of the 24C02A, and I have the same calibration problem.
I try to correct this by changing values on the 22&23H adresses: it works but not easy.
Edit: After many mod tries on the 22&23 adresses, I have a good calibration now on VDC (my actual values are 22H= FF 23H=80 , original values were 8D and 81 so a little too high in mesurement).
-
I couldn't help m'self... I had to get myself a shiny red spaghetti meter [...] I picked the "No Rush" option and got $5 to spend in Amazon Pantry... probably get me some BBQ spices or somesuch.
Spaghetti meter, but no pasta? No spaghetti sauce? Missed opportunity. :-DD
*Puts on best deadpan* They don't carry my brand. :bullshit:
mnem
I put BBQ spices in my spaghetti. Doesn't everybody?
-
I'm running mine on a couple of older Energizer NiMH batteries (non-eneloop type). Every measurement comparison I made to my Fluke 87-III was spot on. It wasn't exhaustive testing, just spot checks here and there, but it does seem to work okay with that type of battery.
-
I received a Ragu 17B+ multimeter today. I see that Amazon raised its price to $11.99 while it is going for around $15 from several American eBay sources.
While its specifications reminded me of the AN8008, the 17B+ is about the regular multimeter size rather than the small size of the AN8008. Naturally, its circuit board looks entirely different (see the attachment). They would have a hard time putting that 10 amp fuse inside of the AN8008. The added relative/zeroing and MAX/MIN buttons are nice. But its disappointing to have the 1 microvolt digit missing compared to the AN8008.
The DC voltage accuracy (about 0.1% high) came close to the matching my AN8008. The Ragu's AC voltage readings were about 0.12% high and it maintained 1% accuracy or better from 8 to 1600 Hz. It was 1 dB down at 2240 Hz (-3 dB at 3050 Hz). The 17+ properly measured the RMS voltage of a square wave signal. It measured frequency up to 54 MHz with a 1 volt RF input. 200 mV and less was adequate at lower frequencies. It displayed 54.00 MHz with a much more precise frequency input.
The resistance measurement was very precise (close to 0.00%) near 1.XXX, 10.XX and 100.X readings. Between those points the readings were typically 0.10 - 0.15% high. The only thing not fitting that description was my 10M 0.01% resistor being read as 10.04M (+0.04%). The resistor test voltage was 1.00 volts while the diode check voltage was 3.28 volts. The continuity alarm sounded with resistances below 50 ohms.
The uA DC current readings were about 0.1% low, the mA readings were around 0.3% high, and the A DC readings were about 0.15% low. The three shunt resistances were 100.385, 1.4962 and 0.03253 ohms respectively. Due to those resistances, the real world accuracy reading current of a regulated voltage without paying attention to those resistances was up to 1.1% low for uA readings and 9.2% low for mA readings. I have yet to test the AC current accuracy, but I would expect it to be similar.
I'm not sure what happened to the capacitance measurement calibration. It was as if the meter was zeroed with a negative 73 pF capacitor connected. If you add that amount to all of the readings, it has pretty good accuracy. Without that correction its accuracy is pretty bad until that amount of capacitance is insignificant. The zeroing button didn't function in the capacitance mode.
The non-contact voltage detector set off its alarm when its display end was 2.5"/6.3cm away from a 120 VAC wire.
It's a nice meter and doesn't have the missing current ranges like the AN8008 does. But, it doesn't have the ANENG's nice small size. It will be useful for some tasks.
-
My AN8008 arrived today; it spent the last week being bounced around several Post Offices due to the confusion and delay caused by Harvey. I'm with the other posters here; that extra lead kit is almost worth the cost of the meter. While quality of the fittings isn't the greatest, I'm pretty certain I can make them all quite reliable with a little careful resoldering. The assortment of end fittings does just SCREAM useful.
ocw, thanks for the quick Tech Teardown of the Spaghetti Meter... I was beginning to have second thoughts; after spending my $10 in my mind it was beginning to feel more and more like actually spending money for another of the Horror Fraught "Little Red Boxes"...
Cheers,
mnem
This space for rent.
-
Nice big fuse on that Ragu. I guess it compares with AN860B+? But the fuse seems better. At least looks the part.
-
Nice big fuse on that Ragu. I guess it compares with AN860B+? But the fuse seems better. At least looks the part.
Looks impressive, yes, but notice that the fuse is only rated for 380V yet the meter claims "MAX 1000V DC" and "CAT IV 600V" on the front. :popcorn:
I'm also not sure about the track spacing around it. Would it have killed them to bring this track down at a slightly different angle to gain a couple of mm more gap? There's plenty of space on the PCB! To me it looks as if that fuse might as well not be there if the voltage goes up high enough, it could simply arc across from the base of the fuse to that track.
Just looking at the picture I'd I'd say it's more like CAT II 300V than CAT IV 600V, CATIII 300V at best.
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=348784;image)
-
Nice big fuse on that Ragu. I guess it compares with AN860B+? But the fuse seems better. At least looks the part.
Looks impressive, yes, but notice that the fuse is only rated for 380V yet the meter claims "MAX 1000V DC" and "CATIV 600V" on the front. :popcorn:
I'm also not sure about the track spacing around it. Would if have killed them to bring this track down at a slightly different angle to gain a couple of mm extra?
Still, if everything else was the same as an860b+, and it cost 10-12 USD, a great deal (a shame it's not int with free shipping). It would be interesting to see a comparison.
-
I received a Ragu 17B+ multimeter today. I see that Amazon raised its price to $11.99 while it is going for around $15 from several American eBay sources.
....
It's a nice meter and doesn't have the missing current ranges like the AN8008 does. But, it doesn't have the ANENG's nice small size. It will be useful for some tasks.
Larger fuses but looks like the same basic problem with the input. I would be more concerned with mA fuse arch to return. In your picture, it looks like the input it directly tied to common. :-DD
-
Still, if everything else was the same as an860b+, and it cost 10-12 USD, a great deal
No argument there. The $20 multimeter market is on fire right now (figuratively).
The Ragu does look a slightly better bet than the 860B+ for the sort of people who want to poke at household mains. $15 more will get you a Fluke 101 though*, so... :-//
(a shame it's not int with free shipping). It would be interesting to see a comparison.
I only see USA/UK sellers selling them so shipping costs will double the price. I don't think I could get one for under $27.
Plus I really don't think I need another meter right now.
(*) $27+$15 = a Fluke 101 delivered to your door.
-
I forgot to mention, the Ragu 17B+ display is 6200 count in the voltage, current and resistance modes. In the capacitance mode it is 10000 count as shown by a 9.982 nF reading that I obtained.
-
I forgot to mention, the Ragu 17B+ display is 6200 count in the voltage, current and resistance modes. In the capacitance mode it is 10000 count as shown by a 9.982 nF reading that I obtained.
Exactly the same as the AN8002/AN860B+
Everything screams DTM0660/DM1106EN chipset except one detail - the HF performance on AC volts. On every DTM0660/DM1106EN meter I've tested so far, the -3dB point is 3kHz. But this one is only 1dB down at 2.6kHz?
-
The Ragu sauce/measure unit is now up to $14.99 at amazon this morning.
-
The Ragu sauce/measure unit is now up to $14.99 at amazon this morning.
The cheap ones seem to have gone from eBay, too. With shipping there's no way I could get one for less than about $50 now.
Three times the cost of the meter this thread is supposed to be discussing and more than a Fluke 101? No thanks.
-
it would be interesting if they used the 1106 chip,
someone should bump it to 10,000 count in the eeprom and then see if the AC true-rms readings still look o.k.
-
On every DTM0660/DM1106EN meter I've tested so far, the -3dB point is 3kHz. But this one is only 1dB down at 2.6kHz?
I double checked that. The Ragu 17B+ -1% voltage figure again was 1.6 kHz. However the -1dB figure was 2.24 kHz this time. I repeated the process several times--2.24 kHz is the correct figure. I will correct my other message. The voltage measurement was -3dB at 3.05 kHz.
I completed my accuracy verification of the 17B by measuring its AC current accuracy. The uA AC readings were +/-0.1% while the mA readings were around +0.6%. The A readings were about -0.3%.
Similar to my voltage accuracy tests, I tested the current at 1X, 2X, 4X, 6X, 10X, 20X, 40X, 60X... points. I precisely measure the output voltage of my audio generator and set the current by the proper choice of a 0.01% current limiting resistor. This simulates the way that I most frequently use to meter to measure current--measuring the current from a voltage regulated power supply. I mathematically correct that reading to see if it then matches the manufacturers specifications. But, more importantly is how accurate the meter is without correction. I feel that at least the moderate and higher price meters should not use an outdated VOM current measurement accuracy standard.
For higher current evaluations I measure the voltage drop across four terminal precision resistors to determine the current being measured. I make the tests at 60 Hz. The current measurements most frequently have frequency response similar to that for voltage measurements.
-
What's weird is how the factory CAL is done. You'd think it was automated.
But I can't see any calibration/test points on PCB, other than a soldered 0805 CAL jumper.
No serial data in/out. So not sure how data is being written to the EEPROM.
For the capacitance (null) calibration, it is funny the EEPROMs copy the "Uni-T" or "Brymen" number and use that for the stray capacitance value. Nobody seems to actually come up with the real value, only copying it.
This is what I have on the capacitance CAL:
Capacitance correction (500.0nF, 50.00uF)
The measurement function of the calibration table switch is placed in the capacitor position (or the resistance level (J1A, J1B short circuit)).
Calibrator output 500.0nF, wait for the display is stable, press +/- to adjust to 500.0 nF;
Can be used for the correction of the output value: 200nF ~ 600nF (100nF integer times), the recommended value of 500.0nF.
Calibrator output 50.00uF, wait for the display is stable, press +/- to adjust the display to 50.00 uF. If it has been adjusted, Press SELECT to skip this adjustment.
The capacitance value that can be used for correction: 20uF to 60uF (10uF integer multiple), the recommended value is 50.00uF.
Note: The capacitor needs to adjust the above two points, directly output the corresponding range capacitor value, the program will automatically switch the range. "
----------------------------------
Note there is an 6/9V ACV high-frequency correction factor in EEPROM at 28H, 29H
-
No serial data in/out. So not sure how data is being written to the EEPROM.
The same way it's read out on power-up...
-
I meant the DMM MCU external serial data in/out, as I thought that the MCU firmware does a bulk write to EEPROM.
The EEPROM SPI port cannot be shared with the DMM IC, you get bus contention if you try to communicate with the EEPROM, unless the DMM IC is held in RESET.
-
I found similar capacitor test frequencies on the Ragu 17B+ and the ANENG AN8008:
17B+ auto-selection of 0.58 Hz - 29.4 kHz
AN8008 auto-selection of 0.59 Hz - 27.5 kHz
Installing the 9 volt battery is confusing on the 17B+. I didn't see anything on which way to install it. The battery positive terminal goes to the left (the MAX/MIN button side).
-
I received a Ragu 17B+ multimeter today. I see that Amazon raised its price to $11.99 while it is going for around $15 from several American eBay sources.
....
It's a nice meter and doesn't have the missing current ranges like the AN8008 does. But, it doesn't have the ANENG's nice small size. It will be useful for some tasks.
Larger fuses but looks like the same basic problem with the input. I would be more concerned with mA fuse arch to return. In your picture, it looks like the input it directly tied to common. :-DD
I bought the Ragu, mostly because it was only $10, and I can just leave it on the work truck, and when I make a battery eliminator for it, I can leave it on in FREQ mode to monitor the 1800a mobile tractor generator. Useful sometimes having a meter you don't care about as long as does the job.
While I will never use it for current readings, would it still be wise if "possible" to put one of my spare BM235 fuses in there?
-
I found similar capacitor test frequencies on the Ragu 17B+ and the ANENG AN8008:
17B+ auto-selection of 0.58 Hz - 29.4 kHz
AN8008 auto-selection of 0.59 Hz - 27.5 kHz
Installing the 9 volt battery is confusing on the 17B+. I didn't see anything on which way to install it. The battery positive terminal goes to the left (the MAX/MIN button side).
I had to look closely deep inside with a flashlight to see the tiny mold marks for battery orientation. Then used a silver sharpie to make a legible mark. On mine the "Select" button does not seem to function as expected in some modes. If you to turn off the "Auto 15 minute shutdown" you have to hold the select button down before turning the meter on. In "Hz" mode further up the dial, the select button did nothing, but clicking on the Hz button itself cycled through the options. I suspect there are other user interface issues that were not fully tested before this was released, but for $10, I didn't have high expectations to begin with.
-
I meant the DMM MCU external serial data in/out, as I thought that the MCU firmware does a bulk write to EEPROM.
The EEPROM SPI port cannot be shared with the DMM IC, you get bus contention if you try to communicate with the EEPROM, unless the DMM IC is held in RESET.
the meters i'v looked at have programming pads for the mcu, it's possible they have a passthrough mode, or a generic table they write to a blank eeprom.
-
No serial data in/out. So not sure how data is being written to the EEPROM.
The same way it's read out on power-up...
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=349076;image)
My guess would be with something like this.
As for my earlier concerns about "wasting" $10; since everybody is rushing to "correct that pricing error", I feel much more sanguine about the whole deal. :phew:
I agree with MacMeter... having a meter you don't give a damn about can be a useful thing; it's part of how I still have the same 1st gen 87 almost 30 years later.
I made sure every time I had me a "Here, hold my beer and watch this... :-/O :-BROKE " moment, I was using a cheapie meter as a sacrificial element, not my Fluke. :-DD
Cheers,
mnem
I am MOOP.
-
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=349076;image)
My guess would be with something like this.
As for my earlier concerns about "wasting" $10; since everybody is rushing to "correct that pricing error", I feel much more sanguine about the whole deal. :phew:
I agree with MacMeter... having a meter you don't give a damn about can be a useful thing; it's part of how I still have the same 1st gen 87 almost 30 years later.
I made sure every time I had me a "Here, hold my beer and watch this... :-/O :-BROKE " moment, I was using a cheapie meter as a sacrificial element, not my Fluke. :-DD
Cheers,
mnem
I am MOOP.
I tend to feel the same way, but am well aware of how silly that is. You have a meter that's built to withstand serious abuse and you protect and baby it. Instead, you use another meter that's much more likely to die in the line of fire and to do so in a spectaculair and possibly dangerous fashion.
-
i see eneloops - did you try alkaline batteries?
i dont think the meter works properly at 2.4v
I'm also using Eneloops in mine. Works astonishingly well. If you put load on Alkalines they'll also drop below 1.2V rather quickly even with plenty of charge in them. I think it is considered good design being able to work with a cell voltage of 1.2V and quite a bit below to make use of the as much charge as possible. Also nowadays voltage regulation is cheap and quite good so there's little reason not to use the capacity properly.
-
i see eneloops - did you try alkaline batteries?
i dont think the meter works properly at 2.4v
I'm also using Eneloops in mine. Works astonishingly well. If you put load on Alkalines they'll also drop below 1.2V rather quickly even with plenty of charge in them. I think it is considered good design being able to work with a cell voltage of 1.2V and quite a bit below to make use of the as much charge as possible. Also nowadays voltage regulation is cheap and quite good so there's little reason not to use the capacity properly.
Damn. I was hoping to find a use for Batteroo.
-
but isnt 2.4v the threshold for low battery warning & shutdown?
-
After reading all the forum's threads about ANENG 8008 I said myself: "You do NOT need another multimeter, you already have 7 of them" but at this price I could not resist: I ordered one.
It was delivered today.
A first check against my UT-61e showed that is was working as specified.
Opened it for a quick check of soldering quality, and I was pleasantly surprised: no problems or defects.
The only dislike is the display contrast and wiew angle: it is clear only when reading from below, with the meter placed horizontally.
I made some photos of my 8 multimeters, to post in the appropropriate thread: the best display was the one on the Wavetek (a.k.a. Meterman ) 5XL, a 3.5 digits, 15 years old basic meter using the standard 7106 chip.
Best regards
-
After reading all the forum's threads about ANENG 8008 I said myself: "You do NOT need another multimeter, you already have 7 of them"
What kind of silly thought process is that?
Just because you only have two hands (I suppose you follow the general mold) is no reason to restrict the number of DMM's. If the DMM is interesting and/or it has a special function it is a very good reason to get it (I have a bit more than 7 or 8 DMM's).
:)
-
After reading all the forum's threads about ANENG 8008 I said myself: "You do NOT need another multimeter, you already have 7 of them"
What kind of silly thought process is that?
Just because you only have two hands (I suppose you follow the general mold) is no reason to restrict the number of DMM's. If the DMM is interesting and/or it has a special function it is a very good reason to get it (I have a bit more than 7 or 8 DMM's).
:)
It's true, I did not realize this.
After an accurate search in the lab I found another one, so I have 9 multimeters.
Nine is an odd number, so today I ordered one AN8002 (I thought that I needed another multimeter that could measure temperature) :-+
I also realize that this is my 500th post in the Forum.
I want to thank every member for the help that they offered me when needed.
Best regards
-
damn i feel unequiped - i only have 4 multimeters. :o
-
Wow, only 4? :o :-DD Well, I guess you've lucked out with the recent growth in inexpensive DMMs. :-DMM
-
damn i feel unequiped - i only have 4 multimeters. :o
Hmmh...if you use clips for ground, you can hold one 1 probe in your left hand, 1 in your right hand and maybe 1 in your mouth? That 3 concurrent measurements, so 4 multimeters should be sufficient?
:-DMM :-DMM :-DMM
-
i do have 3 scopes - maybe i need an equal number of scopes!
oh wait, i also have a Tektronix waveform/vector analyser - maybe that counts as a 4th scope? >:D
-
i do have 3 scopes - maybe i need an equal number of scopes!
I think there's some catching up to do in that department: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/why-does-everyone-have-twenty-oscilliscopes/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/why-does-everyone-have-twenty-oscilliscopes/) :o
-
I could probably round up around 40 scopes. I really only use three... for analog a Tek SC504 (sold my 475+DMM... probably a mistake... they were probably one of the best general purpose analog scopes ever made).
For digital a (fully optioned) Tek 3054B and a THS730 handheld. I probably use the THS730 the most... about the size of a book, 2 GS/sec, battery operated, fully isolated channels. I have fancier scopes, but they seldom get used.
A friend of mine bought a pallet of "defective" 475's. He thought he was bidding on only one scope. The defect in all of them... the voltage selector was set to 220V.
-
Wow, only 4? :o :-DD Well, I guess you've lucked out with the recent growth in inexpensive DMMs. :-DMM
After a few weeks living with them, my favorite is the ANENG AN860B+.
Normally I'm in the "smaller is better" camp but I definitely prefer using it over the AN8008 for some reason, ie. If both meters are within reach then the 860B+ is the one I'll grab. :-//
YMMV
-
Wow, only 4? :o :-DD Well, I guess you've lucked out with the recent growth in inexpensive DMMs. :-DMM
After a few weeks living with them, my favorite is the ANENG AN860B+.
Normally I'm in the "smaller is better" camp but I definitely prefer using it over the AN8008 for some reason, ie. If both meters are within reach then the 860B+ is the one I'll grab. :-//
YMMV
I don't have 8008 or 8002, but I prefer to take the DT830D sometimes over the AN860B+. Simply because it's smaller, I can do continuity checks faster and don't have to worry as much about the meter.
But for resistance or other measurements (other than some rough quick checks), auto ranging seems to be helpful.
-
My AN8008 finally shut off after running non-stop for over 16 days. I never saw the low battery indicator appear on screen. I had just checked it late yesterday afternoon and there was no low battery warning, but this morning it was dead. So it must not appear until only a few percent of battery life remains. I checked the two batteries when I took them out for recharge and they were at 1.219 and 1.225 volts. The batteries used were regular (non-eneloop type) Energizer brand NiMH rated 850 mAH.
-
that depends on how much you hacked it,
normally you only get the low-battery warning for 6 seconds - then it shuts off.
options are, warning 1-15 seconds then off, or warnings but no power-off.
atleast i think it's that - maybe it suppresses the warning too - i'v not tried setting that to 0.
-
What? You don't get any warning until just seconds before it goes dead? That's useless. My other meters will run for hours with the low battery indicator on.
-
What? You don't get any warning until just seconds before it goes dead? That's useless.
It's going to depend on the battery type.
All batteries have a moment where the voltage suddenly falls off a cliff. If your battery type does this above the cutoff voltage of the meter then you won't get much warning.
Somebody with a fancy power supply could determine the cutoff voltage... :popcorn:
-
it's down to the settings in the eeprom - that's why we change them a bit.
my aneng (and ut210e) both run for an hour before any warnings, and the backlight stays on till i decide otherwise.
my ut210e is now 10,000 count too!! >:D
-
(SNIP)
I agree with MacMeter... having a meter you don't give a damn about can be a useful thing; it's part of how I still have the same 1st gen 87 almost 30 years later.
I made sure every time I had me a "Here, hold my beer and watch this... :-/O :-BROKE " moment, I was using a cheapie meter as a sacrificial element, not my Fluke. :-DD
Cheers,
mnem
I am MOOP.
I tend to feel the same way, but am well aware of how silly that is. You have a meter that's built to withstand serious abuse and you protect and baby it. Instead, you use another meter that's much more likely to die in the line of fire and to do so in a spectaculair and possibly dangerous fashion.
Well... the difference is that you pay the big bucks for when you HAVE TO GET the measurement, and so that when you ACCIDENTALLY do something stupid, it doesn't kill you or the meter. The times when you KNOW you're doing something stupid... that's when you want a "burner" instrument. ;)
i do have 3 scopes - maybe i need an equal number of scopes!
oh wait, i also have a Tektronix waveform/vector analyser - maybe that counts as a 4th scope? >:D
*Hangs head in shame* :palm:
I had to clear out my storage and parted with a number of my babies... I now "only" have my first Tek, a 465 which still has the ubiquitous intermittent HV fault... A 2230 that is on the bench for its 3rd rebuild of the voltage doubler/flyback... A 2465 bought on fleaBay that I can trace back to NASA and a 2465B inherited from my last corporate gig... and my new DS1054... oh, and a "parts" 2465. And an old Hitachi V-212 I keep just because it has a curve tracer hooked up to it... No, REALLY... that's ALL... :-DD
Sonufacrap... wait... I have a Clone 16-CH logic analyzer too... Dammit, whatever you've got, it's contagious!!! |O
Cheers,
mnem
And yet, I STILL can't find my pants.
-
well space is an issue for a lot of us, i really couldnt get any more scopes of the classic type - something like a rigol,yes.
but no space for any more crt scopes. :(
-
So, both of these meters have 1000V CAT II, 600V CAT III on the front panel :o
(https://i.imgur.com/XKbhZ79.jpg)
On a side note, bought three of the AN8008 meters off ebay and they arrived within 1 week, fairly well packaged too (meter itself in bubble wrap, then bubble wrapped again with the accessories). Seems to do the business for non-mains work.
-
On a side note, bought three of the AN8008 meters off ebay ... seems to do the business for non-mains work.
...unless you want to measure milliamps.
-
My AN8008 finally shut off after running non-stop for over 16 days. I never saw the low battery indicator appear on screen. I had just checked it late yesterday afternoon and there was no low battery warning, but this morning it was dead. So it must not appear until only a few percent of battery life remains. I checked the two batteries when I took them out for recharge and they were at 1.219 and 1.225 volts. The batteries used were regular (non-eneloop type) Energizer brand NiMH rated 850 mAH.
I tested one of the meters (AN8002 or AN8008, I forgot which one) and it seemed to work down to 2,2V without loss of accuracy. A NiMH is pretty much depleted by 1,1V, so I'm not worried. Given the fact the unit uses about 1,2mA your 16 days seems to be in the same rough ballpark using (as I do) 500mAh LSD cells. I use these brown Ikea cells, they are not overly expensive and they are said to be rather good. Just make sure you have a spare set of batteries lying around (if not I'll just open a remote while charging the ones from the meter). To be honest I was more annoyed by the fact it keeps on beeping when turning off the APO then by it's depleting batteries in "just" 16 days of continuous use.
-
...unless you want to measure milliamps.
I thought the milliamps range was supposed to be good on the AN8008.
-
...unless you want to measure milliamps.
I thought the milliamps range was supposed to be good on the AN8008.
The higher mA is good, the lower mA is missing.
-
wouldnt lower mA readings be covered by the uA range, given it's a 10,000 count meter?
-
wouldnt lower mA readings be covered by the uA range, given it's a 10,000 count meter?
You can do up to 1mA in the uA range, the mA range only has a 1000mA range with 0.1mA resolution, i.e. worst case mA is with one digit after the decimal point.
-
wouldnt lower mA readings be covered by the uA range, given it's a 10,000 count meter?
You can do up to 1mA in the uA range, the mA range only has a 1000mA range with 0.1mA resolution, i.e. worst case mA is with one digit after the decimal point.
That doesn't sound too bad on paper but I often have things which wobble around the 1-2mA range, sometimes dipping below 1mA. That would be impossible to measure with this meter.
It's a good meter for the money but you better have another meter with better milliamp range, eg. AN8002.
-
That's one reason why I bought both.
what's the worst case? 999.9uA jumps to 001.0mA?
I don't have it handy and haven't used it much there yet.
-
what's the worst case? 999.9uA jumps to 001.0mA?
You have to turn the range switch between uA and mA
-
what's the worst case? 999.9uA jumps to 001.0mA?
More like 999.9uA jumps to 0L
-
what's the worst case? 999.9uA jumps to 001.0mA?
More like 999.9uA jumps to 0L
What would you expect this meter to do when set to uA?
I agree the A range should be one decade lower, if that is what is required for this chipset.
-
They ran out of positions on the rotary switch for 9mA and 99mA ranges. You have to switch to a mid-shunt (R24, 1R) which is already on the PCB.
Right now its 0.010 \$\Omega\$ or 100 \$\Omega\$ shunt only. The DMM IC supports these ranges, have to hack the rotary switch and add CAL factors to EEPROM.
-
well space is an issue for a lot of us, i really couldnt get any more scopes of the classic type - something like a rigol,yes.
but no space for any more crt scopes. :(
LOL... space IS an issue for me too. That's why I'm down to these absolutely ESSENTIAL few from *mumblety-seven* that I USED TO have. :-DD
in other news... my spaghetti 17B meter arrived today, along with a brand-new new radiator for my Franken-Cruiser. Both delivered to my door a day early, and a total cost of less than $65. How the hell is that even POSSIBLE?!? :-//
In all honesty, the spaghetti 17B has quite a bit more "quality" feel than even my old "backup" $99 Sperry; that cheap vinyl boot makes a helluva difference. Large, crisp numbers, but not the broadest viewing angle... however, still easy to read even with my glasses off. I'd like a longer BL timer; but then, I'd prefer 4 AA power to support that with tolerable battery life. It's rated 1000VDC/600V Cat IV on the front with a 250V rated Fuse inside; I suppose if you stuck the leads up 4 cats' arses and probed with their noses you might could measure that with some theoretical measure of safety. :bullshit:
Anyhoo... my only regret now is that I didn't buy 10 more to sell; guess I'll have to fund my soldering station habit some other way. :palm:
Cheers,
mnem
If we save the whales, where will we keep them?
-
If we save the whales, where will we keep them?
Yes, space would definitely be an issue.
-
You have to switch to a mid-shunt (R24, 1R) which is already on the PCB.
Do you know where can I find the full AN8008 circuit diagram?
-
There are no formal schematics, I traced one out and it is pretty much the datasheet with an external Vref IC:
Some are translated, if you search the web.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-aneng-multimeter/msg1279811/#msg1279811 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-aneng-multimeter/msg1279811/#msg1279811)
-
I got in a Ragu 17B+ and it has a problem. The volts range reads 10% low... 5V in says 4.546 B out. Seems to read OK when manual ranging on the other ranges. Looks like somebody at the factory screwed up the calibration.
-
I got in a Ragu 17B+ and it has a problem. The volts range reads 10% low... 5V in says 4.546 B out. Seems to read OK when manual ranging on the other ranges. Looks like somebody at the factory screwed up the calibration.
I bought the Ragu to leave on a work truck to monitor an 1800 amp diesel generator. Same issue I reported earlier, voltage readings seem fine. Hertz readings seem accurate, but I've had problems in both hertz dial positions. So far I can't reliably reproduce the problems. In the first dial position for hertz and voltage, I get no readings for hertz at times, but can get a reading in the dedicated hertz dial position, then at times this behavior is just the opposite. The "select" button does not work as expected in these modes as well. I guess for $10, it's workable, but obviously the firmware/software as well as button modes was not well tested.
-
I've had problems in both hertz dial positions. So far I can't reliably reproduce the problems. In the first dial position for hertz and voltage, I get no readings for hertz at times, but can get a reading in the dedicated hertz dial position, then at times this behavior is just the opposite.
The AC mode "Hertz" function is probably only for low frequencies (mains AC).
The dedicated Hz function will probably go much higher.
If you don't get a reading, try swapping the leads around. These meters often need a zero crossing to work. eg. My AN860B+ only measures the frequency of Arduino pins when the leads are connected "backwards".
-
I've had problems in both hertz dial positions. So far I can't reliably reproduce the problems. In the first dial position for hertz and voltage, I get no readings for hertz at times, but can get a reading in the dedicated hertz dial position, then at times this behavior is just the opposite.
The AC mode "Hertz" function is probably only for low frequencies (mains AC).
The dedicated Hz function will probably go much higher.
If you don't get a reading, try swapping the leads around. These meters often need a zero crossing to work. eg. My AN860B+ only measures the frequency of Arduino pins when the leads are connected "backwards".
All my tests have been on 60 Hz sources, the Geny is a 3-phase crystal sync. However, come Monday I'll try your suggestion of reversing the leads. Thanks.
-
it's in the "manual", each Hz setting has different voltage and frequency limits.
the one on the voltage position has a very limited frequency range 40Hz-1KHz - probably intended for testing power sources,
the dedicated range is only supposed to work upto about 35v if i remember right.
-
it's in the "manual", each Hz setting has different voltage and frequency limits.
the one on the voltage position has a very limited frequency range 40Hz-1KHz - probably intended for testing power sources,
the dedicated range is only supposed to work upto about 35v if i remember right.
First, I'm reading both power company mains at 120 volts AC at 60 cycles, and a generator that delivers the same. Secondly, I don't believe the link for the manual you posted is for the Ragu meter. In that PDF, it's mentioned it uses AA batteries, the Ragu uses a 9volt battery, and it does not come with a temp probe. The manual I found was very skimpy and very few specs!
This is the link for the Ragu 17B manual I copied from the Amazon page:
https://www.crenova.net/Uploads/Product/Manual/59a3ee4283015.pdf (https://www.crenova.net/Uploads/Product/Manual/59a3ee4283015.pdf)
-
First, I'm reading both power company mains at 120 volts AC at 60 cycles, and a generator that delivers the same. Secondly, I don't believe the link for the manual you posted is for the Ragu meter. In that PDF, it's mentioned it uses AA batteries, the Ragu uses a 9volt battery, and it does not come with a temp probe. The manual I found was very skimpy and very few specs!
You use this meter on mains?
-
First, I'm reading both power company mains at 120 volts AC at 60 cycles, and a generator that delivers the same. Secondly, I don't believe the link for the manual you posted is for the Ragu meter. In that PDF, it's mentioned it uses AA batteries, the Ragu uses a 9volt battery, and it does not come with a temp probe. The manual I found was very skimpy and very few specs!
You use this meter on mains?
Yes, both 120 and 240 volts, I have a clamp meter for amps.
-
First, I'm reading both power company mains at 120 volts AC at 60 cycles, and a generator that delivers the same. Secondly, I don't believe the link for the manual you posted is for the Ragu meter. In that PDF, it's mentioned it uses AA batteries, the Ragu uses a 9volt battery, and it does not come with a temp probe. The manual I found was very skimpy and very few specs!
You use this meter on mains?
And on a 1800 amp diesel generator, apparently.
Yes, both 120 and 240 volts, I have a clamp meter for amps.
Is there any reason that you didn't buy something like a Fluke 101 for $42 delivered? It has a genuine CAT III 600V rating and is perfect for this sort of work, especially in combination with your clamp.
-
First, I'm reading both power company mains at 120 volts AC at 60 cycles, and a generator that delivers the same. Secondly, I don't believe the link for the manual you posted is for the Ragu meter. In that PDF, it's mentioned it uses AA batteries, the Ragu uses a 9volt battery, and it does not come with a temp probe. The manual I found was very skimpy and very few specs!
You use this meter on mains?
And on a 1800 amp diesel generator, apparently.
Yes, both 120 and 240 volts, I have a clamp meter for amps.
Is there any reason that you didn't buy a Fluke 101 for $42 delivered? It has a genuine CAT III 600V rating and is perfect for this sort of work, especially in combination with your clamp.
My best trusted meter is the BM235. I bought this Ragu at $10, to simply keep plugged in to monitor the voltage and frequency of the generator all day, I plan on making a battery eliminator. I have access to co-workers Flukes as well, but in 36 years of basic electric work, and reading voltage up to 240 AC with Radio Shack meters if that's what I had at hand. I've never had an issue in the specific applications I'm using them for.
-
I've had problems in both hertz dial positions. So far I can't reliably reproduce the problems. In the first dial position for hertz and voltage, I get no readings for hertz at times, but can get a reading in the dedicated hertz dial position, then at times this behavior is just the opposite.
The AC mode "Hertz" function is probably only for low frequencies (mains AC).
The dedicated Hz function will probably go much higher.
If you don't get a reading, try swapping the leads around. These meters often need a zero crossing to work. eg. My AN860B+ only measures the frequency of Arduino pins when the leads are connected "backwards".
All my tests have been on 60 Hz sources, the Geny is a 3-phase crystal sync. However, come Monday I'll try your suggestion of reversing the leads. Thanks.
I'm thinking this may be the cause of your erratic readings. The meter may not be properly designed to count 3-phase AC; only single-phase.
As for those worrying about using it on mains... I could see if you were talking 440 or even 240VAC; but 120VAC? Hell... one of the old codgers (admittedly, a bit off in general, but still) I used to work with at the Ding & Dent Appliance store would use two fingers of one hand to test for presence of live AC when puttering around inside of microwaves and the like. 120VAC really still qualifies as "low-voltage" IMO; hell I've seen 12VDC powered amplifiers with +80V and -80V rails.
Cheers,
mnem
"Electrons may be very, very tiny; but when they gang up on you they always win." ~ me
-
I'm thinking this may be the cause of your erratic readings. The meter may not be properly designed to count 3-phase AC; only single-phase.
As for those worrying about using it on mains... I could see if you were talking 440 or even 240VAC; but 120VAC? Hell... one of the old codgers (admittedly, a bit off in general, but still) I used to work with at the Ding & Dent Appliance store would use two fingers of one hand to test for presence of live AC when puttering around inside of microwaves and the like. 120VAC really still qualifies as "low-voltage" IMO; hell I've seen 12VDC powered amplifiers with +80V and -80V rails.
Cheers, mnem
"Electrons may be very, very tiny; but when they gang up on you they always win." ~ me
I'm only reading a single phase at a time, voltage readings are accurate on each phase to neutral. It's the two "hertz" settings that act oddly, it could be the contacts in the meters "switch". I'll try to document the behavior in more detail this week, for those that like a good mystery.
And yes, I've heard the stories of the "old timers" using their fingers to detect voltage, never felt compelled to do it myself. Almost all of electrical readings I do are outside or in a studio, open air settings, temporary installations typical of most film and TV sets and locations. The few times I have to read a mains box in an electric closet or room, I would only probe with a "SAFE" meter. Most of the voltage we are exposed to is 120v. AC, and 220v AC measured between the generator phases. There are times when more power is needed in an underpowered studio, and the they rent one or two MegaWatt CAT generators that put out 480v AC, step down transformers are then used.
-
I'm thinking this may be the cause of your erratic readings. The meter may not be properly designed to count 3-phase AC; only single-phase.
As for those worrying about using it on mains... I could see if you were talking 440 or even 240VAC; but 120VAC? Hell... one of the old codgers (admittedly, a bit off in general, but still) I used to work with at the Ding & Dent Appliance store would use two fingers of one hand to test for presence of live AC when puttering around inside of microwaves and the like. 120VAC really still qualifies as "low-voltage" IMO; hell I've seen 12VDC powered amplifiers with +80V and -80V rails.
Cheers,
mnem
"Electrons may be very, very tiny; but when they gang up on you they always win." ~ me
I know of plenty of smokers who could tar a ship with what went in their lungs each week and still died of old age, but I still wouldn't recommend it to anyone. MacMeter does seem to use it on 240V.
However, I'm not trying to be a safety nanny here. It's not criticism as such. I'm just interested in real life use I would consider a bit beyond the hardware. Even though I do things differently, it's an interesting opportunity to learn. I have been wondering whether anyone uses the AN8008 on mains on a regular basis and how that works out.
-
I know of plenty of smokers who could tar a ship with what went in their lungs each week and still died of old age, but I still wouldn't recommend it to anyone.
I'm sure there's plenty of people using DT830Bs on mains AC on a daily basis but I'd like to think that not many of them reside here.
I have been wondering whether anyone uses the AN8008 on mains on a regular basis and how that works out.
a) If it's always used correctly on the AC setting then probably nothing spectacular will happen. Safety features are for when you mess up, right?
b) If it simply dies a quiet death then "Crappy China" will be blamed, not the person who chose the meter.
-
I'm thinking this may be the cause of your erratic readings. The meter may not be properly designed to count 3-phase AC; only single-phase.
As for those worrying about using it on mains... I could see if you were talking 440 or even 240VAC; but 120VAC? Hell... one of the old codgers (admittedly, a bit off in general, but still) I used to work with at the Ding & Dent Appliance store would use two fingers of one hand to test for presence of live AC when puttering around inside of microwaves and the like. 120VAC really still qualifies as "low-voltage" IMO; hell I've seen 12VDC powered amplifiers with +80V and -80V rails.
Cheers, mnem
"Electrons may be very, very tiny; but when they gang up on you they always win." ~ me
I'm only reading a single phase at a time, voltage readings are accurate on each phase to neutral. It's the two "hertz" settings that act oddly, it could be the contacts in the meters "switch". I'll try to document the behavior in more detail this week, for those that like a good mystery.
And yes, I've heard the stories of the "old timers" using their fingers to detect voltage, never felt compelled to do it myself. Almost all of electrical readings I do are outside or in a studio, open air settings, temporary installations typical of most film and TV sets and locations. The few times I have to read a mains box in an electric closet or room, I would only probe with a "SAFE" meter. Most of the voltage we are exposed to is 120v. AC, and 220v AC measured between the generator phases. There are times when more power is needed in an underpowered studio, and the they rent one or two MegaWatt CAT generators that put out 480v AC, step down transformers are then used.
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=351994;image)
Ummm... okay... so tell me, exactly how are you measuring individual phases with just a meter?
Last I knew, we still needed a 'scope for that. All 3 phases are still present on each leg; you can't ever get away from that. If your meter is made with a simple rectifier and notch filter designed for measuring single-phase AC, it's going to be totally out to lunch measuring 3-phase. This is one of the big differences between a Radidio Shack cheapie and a decent industrial meter; I suspect you may be falling into a similar trap here, especially after reading elsewhere about how all the clone meters are doing away with every last component they can get away with "...just to save 0.0001 per unit".
As for the old-timers doing stuff we'd consider daft; I never said I thought it was a good idea. But measuring an AC source you know to be 120V? I certainly wouldn't be afraid to use even the HFT "Little Red Box of Damifino" for that. Smeesh.
What's the best meter in the world? The one you have WHEN YOU NEED IT.
Good hunting,
mnem
In other news...
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=351999;image)
-
Is the "value" of the HF free meter inflating?
-
Is the "value" of the HF free meter inflating?
:-DD :-DD :-DD
-
Is the "value" of the HF free meter inflating?
Clearly, the "Lil' Red Box of Damifino" is feeling the pressure of the "'Sghetti Meter"... :bullshit: :-DD :-DD :-DD
mnem
The older I get, the better I used to be.
-
Does anybody have the calibration procedure for the Ragu 17B? Mine is reading around 10% low on the DC volts (< 6V) and resistance range.
I thought I saw it somewhere in this thread, but can't seem to find it...
-
I thought I saw it somewhere in this thread, but can't seem to find it...
If you saw anything it would have been for the meter this thread is about. :-//
-
I thought I saw it somewhere in this thread, but can't seem to find it...
If you saw anything it would have been for the meter this thread is about. :-//
Yes, but this is the only thread that even mentions the Ragu meters...
-
Yes, but this is the only thread that even mentions the Ragu meters...
Time for a dedicated one, I guess :)
-
Ummm... okay... so tell me, exactly how are you measuring individual phases with just a meter?
Last I knew, we still needed a 'scope for that. All 3 phases are still present on each leg; you can't ever get away from that. If your meter is made with a simple rectifier and notch filter designed for measuring single-phase AC, it's going to be totally out to lunch measuring 3-phase.
This is of course not true!
If you measure between two legs of a three phase supply, or between one leg and neutral in a star system, then you will see a single phase AC voltage waveform. If this wasn't true then the whole electrical distribution system in the UK would be impossible, since nearly all homes and business premises in the UK are supplied from three phase distribution transformers, and all homes have a single phase AC supply.
So yes, you can easily get away from three phases in a three phase system. Just measure a single phase.
-
Mmmokay... I know I've seen it demonstrated otherwise; all 3 phases visible in a single trace at the same time on a single leg. Is this a Delta vs Wye thing, or perhaps a 3-phase transformer thing that I've just mis-remembered?
I know that with a Wye-wound load you have an artificial neutral; perhaps that was related to the transform between Delta wound source and Wye-wound load. Dammit... now you've got me wondering what the hell it was they were showing when I saw that... I remember being amazed when they showed how it was connected.
mnem
I think I'm gonna declare this one a case of temporary stupidity and move on with my life.
-
Forgive my naivety, but what's wrong if it comes from China? Mine took about 2.5 weeks, but no problems so far with the meter. just no box.
Some people want it NOW, DAMMIT!
I wait since 5 weeks to get mine from Bangood. |O
I think they use the cheapest way to ship. :horse:
Just a data point, I ordered one from banggood for $17.77 on Sep 3, it shipped the next day, and was delivered yesterday on the 18th, 2 weeks on the dot.
-
I just received my second AN8008 and it seems to have taken 8 days. In both cases, delivery was ridiculously quick. Both came from the same seller. The serial numbers are only twohundredsomething apart, which doesn't seem too unlikely coming from the same source with only three weeks between them. What surprised me a bit is that the beep or buzzer of the new unit isn't by far as loud as the one of the first unit. I have taken them both apart to check for any differences, but there isn't anything visible that would explain why one is much louder than the other. The boards look exactly identical, with the lone exception being the oscillator packages that are installed rotated a 180 degrees with respect to each other. The hand soldered joiints don't seem to look as neat as the machine soldered ones, with some component legs having very little solder.
Calibration hasn't been checked. That will be something to do in the near future.
-
Cheap piezo buzzers can have quite some tolerance in them.
-
Did you exchange the test leads? Cleaning the tips of my 830 test Leeds with some sanding and alcohol made the buzzer louder.
-
Did you exchange the test leads? Cleaning the tips of my 830 test Leeds with some sanding and alcohol made the buzzer louder.
It's not just in the continuity mode, but also when operating the switch when no leads are involved.
-
Did you exchange the test leads? Cleaning the tips of my 830 test Leeds with some sanding and alcohol made the buzzer louder.
It’s a (surprisingly good) latching continuity mode, the contact resistance of the test leads has no relation to the loudness.
-
Did you exchange the test leads? Cleaning the tips of my 830 test Leeds with some sanding and alcohol made the buzzer louder.
It shouldn't make any difference to the buzzer volume. The buzzer will be triggered by a comparator (or something similar).
-
Did you exchange the test leads? Cleaning the tips of my 830 test Leeds with some sanding and alcohol made the buzzer louder.
It shouldn't make any difference to the buzzer volume. The buzzer will be triggered by a comparator (or something similar).
Not only that, but in the AN8008 it’s latched, so it’s the MCU driving the buzzer.
-
It occurred to me that the battery voltage might play a role in this, even though I put what I thought to be fresh batteries in both. I just swapped the batteries of the two units, but that doesn't make a difference.
I also already encountered the gap between the milliamp and microamp range, which is a bit disappointing. I got confused by the different readings for a while, until I realised the AN8008 actually shows a consistent change in readings when you have plugged the leads into the wrong sockets. You get perfectly consistent but incorrect readings when you use the microamp scale, but plug the leads for the milliamp scale. It doesn't help that both units show the exact same wrong reading.
-
I just received my second AN8008 and it seems to have taken 8 days. In both cases, delivery was ridiculously quick. Both came from the same seller. The serial numbers are only twohundredsomething apart, which doesn't seem too unlikely coming from the same source with only three weeks between them. What surprised me a bit is that the beep or buzzer of the new unit isn't by far as loud as the one of the first unit. I have taken them both apart to check for any differences, but there isn't anything visible that would explain why one is much louder than the other. The boards look exactly identical, with the lone exception being the oscillator packages that are installed rotated a 180 degrees with respect to each other. The hand soldered joiints don't seem to look as neat as the machine soldered ones, with some component legs having very little solder.
Calibration hasn't been checked. That will be something to do in the near future.
I too bought a second unit (gave the first to a friend) about a month apart but from a second seller on e-bay. My buzzer is barely audible. I too took mine apart to investigate. Found putting some tape over the hole made it twice as loud but still weak for my old hearing. Kind of a bummer but I don't rely on the buzzer much anyway and I still think this a nice cute DMM.
-
Could someone compare the frequency the buzzers are running at? Loud vs Quite. Perhaps they started using different batch of buzzers that require a different frequency, even 500Hz off make a huge difference.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRJLrUSjcmo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRJLrUSjcmo)
-
Could someone compare the frequency the buzzers are running at? Loud vs Quite. Perhaps they started using different batch of buzzers that require a different frequency, even 500Hz off make a huge difference.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRJLrUSjcmo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRJLrUSjcmo)
The frequency seems to be exactly the same, with the main frequencies being slightly under 2 KHz and 4 KHz. The first figure shows both waveforms overlaid. This shows the frequencies to be the same, but the amplitude very different. The waveform may be slightly different too, but to my ear with voided calibration, they sound very close. The two other plots show the spectrum of both beeps separately.
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=352869;image)
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=352871;image)
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/?action=dlattach;attach=352873;image)
-
@Mr. Scram, nice work! Then the problem is lack of power. Perhaps they've used a higher value current limiting resistor for the buzzer, if there is one.
-
@Mr. Scram, nice work! Then the problem is lack of power. Perhaps they've used a higher value current limiting resistor for the buzzer, if there is one.
I've put a 39 Ohms in series with the buzzer, because it was too loud for me ;D
The buzzer is driven by Q2 directly from the MCU, at a fixed frequency of 1.95kHz (datasheet of the DTM).
My buzzer has 50 Ohms impedance - Maybe the impendance can be a little different from DMM to DMM.
I have also put another 39 Ohms in series with backlight Led.
So I think my mod are a little battery-saver :-+
Also I've done all my calibrations manually in the Eeprom (moving the hexa values) and now I find it nearly perfect for me 8)
-
[...]
a) If it's always used correctly on the AC setting then probably nothing spectacular will happen. Safety features are for when you mess up, right?
b) If it simply dies a quiet death then "Crappy China" will be blamed, not the person who chose the meter.
I wouldn't be too sure about that.
a) Yes and no, when you are measuring mains, there is probably something going on there. Let's say a contactor is malfunctioning intermittently and creates inductive peaks upon disconnecting. Despite the high voltages possible these are usually quite innocent in energy content. They may however be able to initiate an arc within your meter (if the internal clearances are too small) that is then fed by the mains current which is capable of 1000s of Amps before any safety trips. That is why the CAT ratings require testing with voltage transients way beyond the voltage rating they test for (8kV for a CAT IV 600V meter for example). These occurrences aren't actually that likely, but only one such an event is able to kill you so I'd try to prevent it when feasible. Fluke has published a document (http://content.fluke.com/promotions/promo-dmm/0518-dmm-campaign/dmm/fluke_dmm-chfr/files/safetyguidelines.pdf) with a simplified explanation of the things that can go wrong. You might like the explanation of mjlorton (https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=TL3NqkzvZ8o) too.
b) If not, you will die a loud one, and then it might be less relevant who is to blame. You should watch the older videoblogs of Dave's if you have the time. I can recommend EEVblog #6 part 2 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=8cNc5An0DLw). I do disagree with Dave in his crusade against anything cheap, but in this episode he does elaborate quite well (but not too long) about why a cheap multimeter would not suffice and makes some excellent points that hold today (8 years later). There was one with him emphasising about the UL listing, but I could not find it in the 1220 odd blogs he made. Bottom-line is that a CAT rating is only worth anything if it is independently tested, else it is no more than a claim of the manufacturer.
-
Sorry if I annoy anyone with this question, but I don't have the patience to delve into 27 pages. What I am looking for is a cheap meter for some low resistance measurements. I need to fairly reliably measure 15 \$\Omega\$ and less than 1 \$\Omega\$ on an FRU for a piece of deployed company equipment. My cheap Velleman meter(with Brymen leads) does it but it is bigger than I want to carry in my toolbag and I would rather not pay $50 for a Fluke 101 if this meter will do what I need. This isn't going to be a constant use meter but just for this specific field application. I have better meters at home when I rebuild the FRU. It won't even be used for V or A measurement of any kind, just the resistance measurements. If anyone can test their AN-8008 and let me know, that would be awesome. It's even cheap enough, if it works, to buy 2 in case I leave one behind on a service call and don't get it back and it would still be cheaper than a 101.
-
GreyWoolfe,
I asked a related question in the other Aneng thread last month and evava did some test measurements. They're not quite as low as you want to go, but look promising. Have a gander at https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-aneng-multimeter/msg1276004/#msg1276004 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-aneng-multimeter/msg1276004/#msg1276004) to see if it might fit your needs.
-
My AN8008 measures those sorts of resistances just as well as my Fluke 87V does. In fact, you have to put the 87V into hi-res mode to match the 10 milli-ohm resolution of the AN8008. The only downside of the AN8008 is no relative mode, so you have to account for the resistance of the test leads manually. And the 87V is a touch faster to auto-range, but for your use, you could always go for manual ranging.
Of the range of tests I just did, the two meters agreed within a couple of counts of each other. No complaints from me :-+
Oh, and the Fluke 101 is only 0.1 ohm resolution...
-
GreyWoolfe,
I asked a related question in the other Aneng thread last month and evava did some test measurements. They're not quite as low as you want to go, but look promising. Have a gander at https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-aneng-multimeter/msg1276004/#msg1276004 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-aneng-multimeter/msg1276004/#msg1276004) to see if it might fit your needs.
I see what you posted. 1 \$\Omega\$ resistor measured .98 \$\Omega\$. That is just what I need. 15-18 \$\Omega\$ is good, 30 \$\Omega\$ is bad, according to the service manual. I think it will work just fine. Mark, I don't believe relative mode is necessary for my use. The Velleman doesn't have it and the measurements are very close between it and my GW Instek GDM 8251A. The Velleman is manual ranging so no big deal to put the Aneng in manual mode. The 30 second wait to stabilize is no big deal, I can turn it on and remove the FRU and by the time it's out, the meter will be good enough. I will grab one and if I like it, I will grab another. I have a couple more sets of the Brymen leads from Frankie coming, I will use those instead of what the meter comes with, which will also help.
-
For this kind of measurements it might be advisable to clean (the metal of) your test probes with acetone and then with contact spray, I found low value resistances to become quite a lot more consistent. I have a bargraph meter too and you can definitely tell the difference (btw continuity on a fast meter is a good indicator of probe cleansiness too).
-
Hi, I just bought both models an8008 and an8002 I think both are a good complement. Modify the an8008 eeprom to add the temperature measurement function.
Direction 0xAD = 0x13 and 0xBD = 0x15 to add the functions ° C and ° F respectively in the mV position.
Copy calibration data from an8002 to an8008, addresses from 0x0B to 0x0F
Both measure the same temperature now
-
I ended up ordering 1 yesterday. I will put it through it's paces when it gets here. If it works as I need, I will order another one. When it comes in, I will do a comparison test under the exact circumstances that I will use it with my other hand held DMMs and post my results.
-
Hi, I just bought both models an8008 and an8002 I think both are a good complement. Modify the an8008 eeprom to add the temperature measurement function.
Direction 0xAD = 0x13 and 0xBD = 0x15 to add the functions ° C and ° F respectively in the mV position.
Copy calibration data from an8002 to an8008, addresses from 0x0B to 0x0F
Both measure the same temperature now
How do you modify the AN8008 EEPROM? I've been searching in the thread, but all I've found so far is that you need a PICkit programmer. It'd be great to add a temperature option to it.
-
no, any programmer that handles 24'series eeproms or an arduino board.
-
[...] but all I've found so far is that you need a PICkit programmer. It'd be great to add a temperature option to it.
Where did you find that? ??? As said, it is an EEPROM, and there are more suited programmers for that. I don't think a PICKit will work (but it might, the 'C' versions are EEPROM too).
-
a pk2 may work with AVRdude software.
maybe.
-
One way to reprogram the EEPROM seems to be using an SOIC-8 clip, around $2 on Ali.
Then holding the DMM IC in reset, so it does not drive the EEPROM lines. So you don't have to lift the data/clk pins.
Then use the use the programmer of your choice. Like Bus Pirate etc.
I use an Arduino with SPI 3.3V level-translator and bit-bang.
-
[...] but all I've found so far is that you need a PICkit programmer. It'd be great to add a temperature option to it.
Where did you find that? ??? As said, it is an EEPROM, and there are more suited programmers for that. I don't think a PICKit will work (but it might, the 'C' versions are EEPROM too).
PicKit works. I used a modified clone.
-
I have just got to grips with the EEPROM programming and this may be of some help to someone else who is new to it. I used the programmer based on the CH341A chip that is available from various Chinese sources. I connected this to the AN8008 with one of those SOIC8 clips that comes with a ribbon cable and adapter board that plugs directly into the programmer ZIF socket.
These are the items I am talking about:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CH341A-24-25-Series-EEPROM-Flash-BIOS-USB-Programmer-SOIC8-Clip-On-Board-UK-/162557028178?epid=1390692406&hash=item25d9276752:g:vG8AAOSwCQZZCi3S (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CH341A-24-25-Series-EEPROM-Flash-BIOS-USB-Programmer-SOIC8-Clip-On-Board-UK-/162557028178?epid=1390692406&hash=item25d9276752:g:vG8AAOSwCQZZCi3S)
...but this is just an example that shows both together, not necessarily the best deal.
I followed the procedure given in the Russian thread mentioned several times in this thread in connection with the AN8008. I have attached (I think) the instructions to save you looking them up, along with an English translation of the words. Between the two you can work it out. They are actually for the ZT101/102 but the relevant bits are equally valid for the ZT109=AN8008. They used the PICKIT2. So, that's definitely an option.
I use Linux mostly and tried the software available for the CH341A but it didn't work very well. So, I ended up having to use Windows software. There is a description of what to do here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0ChYNwunUE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0ChYNwunUE)
There is also useful information here:
https://onetransistor.blogspot.com/2017/08/ch341a-mini-programmer-schematic.html (https://onetransistor.blogspot.com/2017/08/ch341a-mini-programmer-schematic.html)
That's about it. You can look through this thread to see what bytes to change for adding/changing functions.
It took me a while to get there. I haven't invented anything new and these are just some of the more useful resources that I came across. So, hopefully this might speed up the process for someone else who is new to this.
On a private off topic note to Plazma, did you see my questions in the "Pocket Multimeter Shootout! ANENG AN101 vs. Uni-T UT120C vs. Victor VC921" thread? Have you any comments?
-
Does anybody have the locations for the WP and RESET connections on the AN8008?
I have a couple of nice thermocouple calibrators. They let you select a thermocouple type and will output a voltage the simulates what that thermocouple would output for any specified temperature.
-
They are in the attachments I just posted!
-
I've received the AN8002 I've ordered some weeks ago, to pair with my AN8008.
Nice instrument, but:
It seems the manufacturer is having some problems with the front panel artwork (see attache photo):
The second switch position is labeled V (DC in white), Vac, Hz and % duty cycle (yellow), but pushing the SEL (yellow) button switches only between V dc and V ac.
To measure Hz and % duty cycle you must rotate the switch to the fifth position, again labeled Hz and %.
The funny thing is that the photos on the supplier's site (Banggood) and other sites show a correct panel.
I'll solve the problem with a little piece of masking tape...
I remember another post reporting the same problem, but I could not retrieve it.
A quick test showed that the meter worked as specified. I like it very much.
Another problem (but my big, heavy and more expensive Meterman 33XR has the same) is that a broken thermocouple will show ambient (or cold junction) temperarure, and not an overrange, as any industrial thermometer will do. A simple pull-up resistor could do the trick.
-
Mine is the opposite - the artwork doesn't include Hz and % on the voltage position, but the yellow button does. Ideally, you and I should swap cases :)
I've heard reports of meters where the yellow button only toggles between DC and AC, but yours is the first AN8002 I've seen with Hz and % printing on the case.
From what I can tell, there's no way to predict which version you'll get. There's pros and cons of each - at least it's quicker to switch between AC and DC for you.
-
In effect I do not pressed hard fo use the meter (it was bpught just for curiosity).
Before I'll decide to use masking tape, please PM me to organize the excange of the cases.
UK and Italian postages will be very cheap.
Best regards
-
I was joking about the cases - given how cheap these meters are, it's hardly worth the effort of posting parts of them around :)
Thanks again for posting your pictures. It's interesting to see how these meters are evolving over time :-+
Mark
-
maybe the differences are controlled by the eeprom - the documentation on the eeprom content is not exactly complete.
-
Do the meters actually work differently or is it just a misprint on the range selector?
-
Reading Mark Hennessy post above they work differently, and from my post, my photo and the photos usually found about everywhere there are at least two different silk screens.
I think that what happened may be:
1) they design the correct multimeter with correct firmware and front panel graphics and they sell the first batch,
2) later, somebody make a mistake in programming a lot of said meters, enabling Hz and Duty Cycle on V position,
2b) they sell them , including one to Mark Hennessy,
3) customers complain and the Boss call Enginereing
4) two decisions are taken: a: program new boards with correct firmware and b: design and print modified panels for already programmed boards in stock
5) somebody in production mixes everything.
I've seen similar stories many times
-
My AN8002 measures frequency in the "VDC" position but only up to 99.99Khz (I do not know why!), to measure further I need to change to the Hz% position.
To add the Hz% function to the "VDC" position, write in the direction 0xAF = 0x12
-
My AN8002 measures frequency in the "VDC" position but only up to 99.99Khz (I do not know why!), to measure further I need to change to the Hz% position.
To add the Hz% function to the "VDC" position, write in the direction 0xAF = 0x12
The AN8008 "manual" (the folded bit of paper that comes with it) describes the difference between the two positions as "high voltage low frequency" and "low voltage high frequency". Presumably it's the same if enabled on the AN8002.
-
I received my Aneng An-8008 today. Since I am only interested in low\$\Omega\$ measurement and I didn't have an FRU handy, I checked with some low \$\Omega\$ resistors I had. Here is the result:
1R1 measured 1R13
5R1 measured 5R13
9R1 measured 9R18
All the resistors are 5% tolerance and I didn't use the OEM probes. I replaced them with a set of Frankie's Brymen leads. For my use, 15R is good, 30R isn't. The meter is more than capable. As I previously posted, this meter will never see voltage of any kind. If the device on site will not power up, because of SLAs, it will be immediately replaced and repaired at home where I have much better meters that aren't afraid of mains voltage. The other huge plus is the small size. It is about 1/2 the size of my Velleman meter. I find the stand is good enough, I can press the buttons without it falling over. I really like the back light. It is quite bright. The leads are more flexible than one would think for the price. They are almost as flexible as the Brymen leads. There was a difference in measurement with them, however. I only checked the 1.1\$\Omega\$ resistor and it measured 2.2\$\Omega\$. That was out enough for me. I never had any intention of using the original probes, Dave got me hooked on gold plated and I really like the Brymen leads, especially for the price.
-
Hi!
I was annoyed that the meter took several seconds to stabilize when doing measurements, so I knocked down the noise on the DC rail from 30.8 mV P-P to 3.6 mV P-P. Now the meter stabilizes immediately. Here's the modifications I did. https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8008-modify-for-better-accuracy-faster-readings/ (https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8008-modify-for-better-accuracy-faster-readings/). I've seen people mentioning problems with measuring low mA values. I didn't try ampere metering on my meter, only DC before modifying it, but when using an electronic load, I can go step by step in 0.1 mA up from zero without problems. No problems with µA either. How does the problem manifest itself?
-
Same cap mods I did back in July https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1261300/#msg1261300 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/an8008-us-$19-10000count-1uv-0-01ua-0-01ohm-resolution-meter/msg1261300/#msg1261300)
-
Hi!
I was annoyed that the meter took several seconds to stabilize when doing measurements, so I knocked down the noise on the DC rail from 30.8 mV P-P to 3.6 mV P-P. Now the meter stabilizes immediately. Here's the modifications I did. https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8008-modify-for-better-accuracy-faster-readings/ (https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8008-modify-for-better-accuracy-faster-readings/). I've seen people mentioning problems with measuring low mA values. I didn't try ampere metering on my meter, only DC before modifying it, but when using an electronic load, I can go step by step in 0.1 mA up from zero without problems. No problems with µA either. How does the problem manifest itself?
I have bookmarked your page. I have one and am planning on getting another. I have no smd caps here so it's time for a Mouser order as I need some other stuff also. It's a shame that the local surplus store only sells SMD passives in full reels. I don't want that many if they even have the proper values.
-
you could use a broken harddrive.
they usually have 10 or 22uf ceramics on them.
-
In a fit of enthusiasm I decided to add extra decoupling to my AN8008 3v rail. Thanks to Jackenhack I decided to progressively add a 1000pfd, a 0.01ufd, a 0.1ufd and finally a 4.7ufd. With each addition I observed the impact on the 3v rail with a scope. The first 2 capacitors had very little effect but adding the 0.1ufd definitely improved things. Finally adding the 4.7ufd really improved the stability of readings and startup on the volts range was an almost immediate to zero (This was with no probe leads attached as pickup in the leads has an impact on the readings). I left all the additional capacitors in place as well as the untouched original 100ufd and the meter is now much more stable than before. A very worthwhile modifcation.
-
In a fit of enthusiasm I decided to add extra decoupling to my AN8008 3v rail. Thanks to Jackenhack I decided to progressively add a 1000pfd, a 0.01ufd, a 0.1ufd and finally a 4.7ufd. With each addition I observed the impact on the 3v rail with a scope. The first 2 capacitors had very little effect but adding the 0.1ufd definitely improved things. Finally adding the 4.7ufd really improved the stability of readings and startup on the volts range was an almost immediate to zero (This was with no probe leads attached as pickup in the leads has an impact on the readings). I left all the additional capacitors in place as well as the untouched original 100ufd and the meter is now much more stable than before. A very worthwhile modifcation.
Great to hear. All props goes to floobydust who put me on the right track.
The 0.1 µF capacitor definitely improved the high frequency noise, but to knock down the 1.1 KHz spike, I had to replace the 100 µF cap with a 1000 µF one. I guess the voltage reference have more problems with the higher frequency noise than the big ones at 1.1 KHz. Anyway, the voltage rail looks like when a CPU is doing micro-sleeps to save power, something is definitely injecting noise to the 3 V rail.
-
you could use a broken harddrive.
they usually have 10 or 22uf ceramics on them.
The couple of hard drives I have floating around here are still good and are company property. The only bad ones I had were also company property and I had to ship them to our main office for destruction. The caps are cheap enough and I have other stuff i need for another couple of projects, so I will have an order that's worth it for the shipping.
-
a quick cross-link to a discovery of interest in the 8001/2 thread.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/aneng-an8001-6000-count-true-rms-multimeter/msg1322321/#msg1322321 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/aneng-an8001-6000-count-true-rms-multimeter/msg1322321/#msg1322321)
-
progressively add a 1000pfd, a 0.01ufd, a 0.1ufd and finally a 4.7ufd.
I think it's better not to mix more than two types of caps on the rail as they resonate. Detailed explanation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjFLN6B0wVU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjFLN6B0wVU) .
I ended up installing one 1uF polyester cap in addition what was already installed in my DMM. HF-noise mostly gone, still, there are dips 6.3mV p-p. I don't have a good electrolytic at hand :(.
One thing I don't understand is how this charge pump works. I'd expect to see two big caps, not one. So, it could worth upgrading another cap as well.
-
One thing I don't understand is how this charge pump works. I'd expect to see two big caps, not one. So, it could worth upgrading another cap as well.
Why two big caps? You need just one big cap to maintain the output voltage (as I understand it is connected to pin 51 and ground) and one small cap to "pump" the big one (it is connected between pins 52 and 53). Since this pump capacitor is quite small, you can charge and discharge it very quickly with relatively low current. On the other hand, if you change the pump capacitor to a bigger one, the charge current increases too and it can generate more interfernce for the ADC. So I don't think it's a good idea to increase its value. Although it could be quite harmless to increase the other (big) one.
Regarding the principle of operation itself, I think it first charges the pump capacitor to the battery voltage, then IC re-connects it so that it's voltage is added to the battery and charges the result capacitor with this doubled voltage. Then the process repeats.
-
Why two big caps?
Ah, last time I designed a charge pump the frequency was 50Hz (from mains)... I see, in this case this is not necessary.
-
Thanks to floobydust, jackenhack and JohnPen for their information on decoupling capacitors.
I notice you did your tests on the voltage measurement. Did you see any improvements on the resistance ranges? For instance, when you short the probes it normally takes several seconds to settle to the nominal value for zero resistance. Does this improve on your meters now that you have upgraded the decoupling?
-
Thanks to floobydust, jackenhack and JohnPen for their information on decoupling capacitors.
I notice you did your tests on the voltage measurement. Did you see any improvements on the resistance ranges? For instance, when you short the probes it normally takes several seconds to settle to the nominal value for zero resistance. Does this improve on your meters now that you have upgraded the decoupling?
I'm almost afraid of saying it, because it could be wishful thinking, but I think the continuity tester is quicker. Could be that I also cleaned the test probes with isopropanol.
Haven't tried the resistance.
Edit
Tested shorting the lead and it takes around 10 seconds to stabilize at 70 milliOhm.
-
Unfortunately I didn't check the before settling time for the resistance range. However now a short of the probe leads, the one's supplied with 8008, resulted in a reading of 60 milliohms after 5-6 seconds. It was rather critical on how well one shorted the leads together as the probe plating tends to cause some contact variability affecting the final reading. With regard to the continuity, again not checked before, but it does seem virtually instantaneous now. Sadly my continuity check sound level is one of the quieter ones but it is usable so I will leave that alone.
-
Does this improve on your meters now that you have upgraded the decoupling?
I'd done the same mod and I say no, it does not improve resistance at all for me. The measurement on shorted probes takes 10 - 15 seconds to settle down. Although it may depend on the batteries condition - I put a couple of new duracells in the meter, so they could be good enough with stock decoupling capacitors.
-
So, those results show that improving the decoupling doesn't speed up the response when measuring resistance.
I tried measuring a 390 ohm resistor using the AN8008 and at the same time measured the voltage across the resistor using another meter. As soon as I connected the AN8008, the voltage across the resistor settled in less than one second to 32.60mV while the resistance value slowly converged towards 389.9 ohms. So, the reference current through the resistor clearly settles quickly and has a value in this case of about 0.085mA. That means the delay must be in the ADC measurement process. Now, if another meter can read the voltage quickly and it the AN8008 can measure other voltages quickly, why would there be such a lag in the resistance measurement?
-
That means the delay must be in the ADC measurement process. Now, if another meter can read the voltage quickly and it the AN8008 can measure other voltages quickly, why would there be such a lag in the resistance measurement?
What if they average several successive ADC readings to get the final value? Some kind of software LPF.
-
The DMM firmware has several digital filters with algorithm for the LCD displayed value.
If the input signal is moving around, the "fast" average is used.
Once the signal settles down, the "slow" average is used, for high accuracy. Takes a few seconds.
Both quantities are always being acquired, and the "slow" average" is primed (i.e. filter does not start from 0) by the "fast" value to speed response.
The "volatility" of the measured value determines which value to display. There is also hysteresis to avoid the LSD or rollover bouncing around.
It's one of the main reasons this meter has 9,999 count resolution - the firmware filters out a lot of A/D noise.
-
NEW MODEL 8009 RELEASED JUST NOW :clap:
New tread here https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/latest-aneng-9999-dmm-invented (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/latest-aneng-9999-dmm-invented)!-an8009-now!/
-
The multi-million $ question is, is the new AN8009 just another model in the Aneng lineup or the successor to the AN8008, replacing it ?
-
NEW MODEL 8009 RELEASED JUST NOW :clap:
New tread here https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/latest-aneng-9999-dmm-invented (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/latest-aneng-9999-dmm-invented)!-an8009-now!/
Link fails
-
Link fails
Try copying then pasting the entire link into the browser. When you see the link color change part way through, it's almost a sure sign that you will need to paste the link in manually....
-
Link fails
Try copying then pasting the entire link into the browser. When you see the link color change part way through, it's almost a sure sign that you will need to paste the link in manually....
First thing I did. Found it manually.
-
Here's the link to the other thread to save people searching:
Latest 9999 counts dmm released! AN8009 for $24 now! (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/latest-aneng-9999-dmm-invented!-an8009-now!/)
-
Guys, I have a problem never seen reported before. I cannot disable auto powerdown. Even if I do as manual says (hold select button when switching it on) it beeps 5 times and auto power downs after 15 minutes. This is really annoying... Any ideas how could I fix this? Or may be I'm doing it wrong as both AN8008 and ZT102 behave the same way for me.
-
I did not know you could disable it. Thanks!
-
I added RANGE and REL buttons to my AN8002. Let see if button modification is possible with the AN8008.
What kind of switches have used? Isn't the rubber buttons to soft for normal push buttons?
I used these switches
https://www.arrow.com/en/products/evp-ayf1ba/panasonic (https://www.arrow.com/en/products/evp-ayf1ba/panasonic)
I used 1mm thick PCB for the button separator. I'll take more pictures when I modify my second unit and the AN8008.
This is probably the best buttons modification I've seen.
Could you share more detailed description for this modification?
How the PCB separator is attached?
How the button rubber is cut - all the way in two separate pieces or partially?
-
I check "kazus" forum
And I`m anxious now
Few users sad what stock linearity of readings is not linear
i.e. AN800# use some firmware trick to avoid last count jitter and to indicate "beautiful" zero at shorted leads and low (i.e. noisy?) levels :-//
What about more tricks?
-
I added RANGE and REL buttons to my AN8002. Let see if button modification is possible with the AN8008.
What kind of switches have used? Isn't the rubber buttons to soft for normal push buttons?
I used these switches
https://www.arrow.com/en/products/evp-ayf1ba/panasonic (https://www.arrow.com/en/products/evp-ayf1ba/panasonic)
I used 1mm thick PCB for the button separator. I'll take more pictures when I modify my second unit and the AN8008.
This is probably the best buttons modification I've seen.
Could you share more detailed description for this modification?
How the PCB separator is attached?
How the button rubber is cut - all the way in two separate pieces or partially?
I found the AN8008 does not have the IC pin bonded out for the extra switches. So this mod I believe did not work out.
-
Hi, I recently bought the AN8008 tester at Banggood, I've made some changes to the tester, as recommended at
https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8008-modify-for-better-accuracy-faster-readings/ (https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8008-modify-for-better-accuracy-faster-readings/) .
I did some measurement tests on low currents: in DC current there are no problems, the measurements are correct, both on mA DC and on uA DC, then I tried to measure in AC current at 50Hz network and 230VAC, using a resistor in series with the tester, in the uA AC range there are no problems, but in the mA AC range the measurements start from 7 - 8 mA AC with errors even 50%, then as I increase the current, it becomes more and more precise.
When I try to measure currents of 1, 2 or 3mA AC, the tester remains on 0 mA AC.
I ask if you have also found the same defect of the tester and if you have a solution about it. I have other multimeters and the problem with these obviously does not show up but they work properly, thanks for the help.
-
I did not know you could disable it. Thanks!
Mine beeps 5 times (and this is annoyng) but does not power off... but mine has a different silkscreen and mybe different firmware (see my previous post).
-
just differnt settings in the eeprom.
-
Does anyone know whether this thing uses fast or slow blow fuses?
-
i know they are not fast enough! :palm:
you need to adapt it to 20mm FF rated fuses.
-
I opened a fuse previously, and there are just copper wires in it and no sand whatsoever. I guess these are unlikely to have been checked for breaking speed. You might be able to use these, they claim to be quick blow, but I wouldn't hold my breath:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/290754775264 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/290754775264)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/300757393643 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/300757393643)
-
Even if they're quick blow they're not going to save you from anything.
a) Stick to low voltage work with this meter
b) Think twice before selecting a range with a fuse in it (unfortunately these meters don't require you to move the cable to a different connector to get a fused range).
-
Very true, it is unlikely to help when using mains, but it might just save you a cascading failure in the DUT when probing around, so I would recommend trying to buy a new set of fuses rather than bridging them. That is why I gave the links. I goofed when measuring a NiCd battery for a cordless drill, these are known to be capable of some serious currents.
-
Very true, it is unlikely to help when using mains, but it might just save you a cascading failure in the DUT when probing around, so I would recommend trying to buy a new set of fuses rather than bridging them.
One of the real weak points of these meters (IMHO) is that the fuses are a non-standard size and it's almost impossible to find replacements.
-
that's not true, 10mm is a standard size, just not one that should be in a meter!
-
One of the real weak points of these meters (IMHO) is that the fuses are a non-standard size and it's almost impossible to find replacements.
I had no trouble finding replacements on eBay. You might need to buy leaded ones, but that shouldn't really be a problem.
-
I just replaced the fuse holders and fuses in my ANENG AN-8008.
I got 1808 SMD fuse holders which cost around 0.20$ each, 250mA fuses cost around 0.40$ each and 10A fuses around 0.25$ each...
Total cost to replace the original fuses was around 1$ total....
Fuse holders sit nicely in the old holders spot and i soldered them from the sides with soldering iron, no need to even bother with a hot air gun etc. Just made sure to remove old (lead free?) solder which also smelled funny
-
I doubt those are rated for high voltages ..... not enough physical distance
-
the fuses are only used for current reading, and current range is limited to 36v - so no problem.
-
current range is limited to 36v - so no problem.
Limited by what?
Is there something preventing me from applying more than 36V to the current input? :popcorn:
-
current range is limited to 36v - so no problem.
Limited by what?
Is there something preventing me from applying more than 36V to the current input? :popcorn:
The specifications says 36V, you are not allowed to make mistakes like leaving the probes in the current holes when measuring mains!
-
From the user manual: "Do not input voltage exceeds 36VDC or 25VAC when you are at the setting of measuring current."
That number I believe is from the fake 61010 ratings.
-
current range is limited to 36v - so no problem.
Limited by what?
Is there something preventing me from applying more than 36V to the current input? :popcorn:
The instructions (the folded bit of paper that should have come with your meter) say "Do not input voltage exceeds 36V DC or 25V AC when you are at the setting of measuring current." Typical chinglish grammar, but the meaning is clear.
But no, there's nothing stopping you from applying more than 36V to the current input.
-
the fuses are only used for current reading, and current range is limited to 36v - so no problem.
If you only do what the manual tells you to do you won't ever need those fuses in the first place. They are there so that when something goes wrong, either due to a fault in what you are measuring or because of you being a human and making a mistake, the meter literally doesn't blow up in your face. Such mistakes could for instance be probing the wrong points and instead of measuring the current you suddenly put a large voltage across your meter.
-
Is there something preventing me from applying more than 36V to the current input? :popcorn:
Yes. It's verboten! 8)
-
if your going to ignore the manual then nothing is stopping you from checking the ignition voltage at your spark plugs or taking it to a railway line to see if the extra rails are live!!
-
btw, fun aside.
if you take the piss with the input voltage in current-mode you dont need to worry about the fuse because the Transorb suppressor will clamp-on and take the track off the switch.
i know this because i was given an 8002 for free after it happened to someone else!
-
Hi, I'm a new user and I would like to say a big thanks to everyone since the pages of this forum are a goldmine for electronics enthusiasts like me.
That aside, I bought a new aneng 8008 and did the hardware updates suggested by jackenhack which really improved the meter.
Then I went on to modify my eeprom. Basically the only thing I needed was temperature, so I went on and added that to the mV range.
However, I don't have the calibration data (eeprom addresses 0x0B to 0x0F) and my meter is overshooting temperature. I know how I can modify addresses 0x0B, 0x0C to make the meter read lower, but since there's also the ADC value at addresses 0x0D to 0x0F, I'd rather copy these from an ANENG 8002 or ANENG 8009. Problem is, I looked everywhere for the eeprom contents of these meters and found nothing!
Could anyone help please?
-
Limited by what?
Is there something preventing me from applying more than 36V to the current input? :popcorn:
Dave gon' get you.
-
Hi, I'm a new user and I would like to say a big thanks to everyone since the pages of this forum are a goldmine for electronics enthusiasts like me.
That aside, I bought a new aneng 8008 and did the hardware updates suggested by jackenhack which really improved the meter.
Then I went on to modify my eeprom. Basically the only thing I needed was temperature, so I went on and added that to the mV range.
However, I don't have the calibration data (eeprom addresses 0x0B to 0x0F) and my meter is overshooting temperature. I know how I can modify addresses 0x0B, 0x0C to make the meter read lower, but since there's also the DAC value at addresses 0x0D to 0x0F, I'd rather copy these from an ANENG 8002 or ANENG 8009. Problem is, I looked everywhere for the eeprom contents of these meters and found nothing!
Could anyone help please?
8002 (3 different ones)
FA 00 C0 CE 03
E6 00 00 BD 03
F0 00 48 CE 03
8008
FA 00 00 BE 03 < this is the default value in the datasheet.
-
Thank you so much stj, I will use these data to calibrate my meter and let you know how it went. Interesting thing though how you have three different versions of data for the same meter (hardware).
-
that's why it's called "calibration" :-DD
-
All right, my meter is now calibrated temperature-wise.
FYI, I used "FA 00 C0 CE 03" . "F0 00 48 CE 03" works as well. "E6 00 00 BD 03" results in overshoot +5 degrees C.
Once again, thank you very much stj for your kind interest.
-
There is one last thing I want to do before I leave my AN8008 alone.
There is some missing functionality button-wise:
RANGE - There already is a range button but it doesn't work as it should, I want a separate button.
MIN/MAX - That's very useful to have.
REL - This is necessary to turn on serial communication. I've already set eeprom address 0xFA to value 0xCE to allow that.
I will need to make a few holes to add these buttons as well as one for the comm. wires (I don't want infrared leds) but I've already figured out the best way to do that on the meter case thanks to our friends in the various Russian forums.
Now, this is were I get confused and need your help.
This is the diagram I use to understand how the DMM processor is connected to the pcb:
https://media.licdn.com/mpr/mpr/AAIA_wDGAAAAAQAAAAAAAAqmAAAAJDA3Nzc5MDhiLTliZjMtNGY0Zi05OTcwLWExZjY2ZjU4YTczYg.jpg (https://media.licdn.com/mpr/mpr/AAIA_wDGAAAAAQAAAAAAAAqmAAAAJDA3Nzc5MDhiLTliZjMtNGY0Zi05OTcwLWExZjY2ZjU4YTczYg.jpg)
Questions:
- I notice how the buttons are connected to the processor and I come to the conclusion that if for example I want to let the processor know that MIN/MAX was pressed all I have to do is to temporarily connect PIN 23 (PT1.1) to PIN 26 (PT3.7). Is it that simple or is there something else I'm missing?
- I can see that PIN 20 is my TX PIN which I can use to send data to my PC. But I can also see that PIN 21 is an RX PIN. Do I need that?
- Finally, is there anyone who knows where the PTx.x PINS that have to do with the aforementioned buttons are located on the 8008 PCB? Since this is a COB chip, I reckon it's a bit of a guessing game to locate the pins you are interested in. I will also need to locate the TX PIN.
This button issue is confusing to me because for example on the top right of the PCB there are contacts for a button (I think it's supposed to be a RANGE button?) and all it does is nothing (connects PT1.1 to BATT-). Why do they have contacts for a button that seems to do nothing? Is there something I'm missing with the whole button setup?
I have also watched this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFUTGubdvlQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFUTGubdvlQ)
It's a Russian guy who mods a ZT102 (AN8002) meter to add buttons. The points on the PCB he marks on his video to get specific button functionality, don't do anything on my AN8008 but work fine on his meter. This confuses me even more!
I would appreciate any response to help clarify these things.
-
As far as I know additional buttons hack on AN8008 is not possible.
You can find more info on the topic reading previous posts in this thread.
I tested some button options for the AN8008.
SET/HOLD is PT1.0 - BAT-
RANGE/BackLight is PT1.2 - BAT-
These did not have any effect.
PT1.0 - PT1.1
PT1.0 - PT1.2
PT1.0 - SDA
PT1.1 - BAT-
PT1.1 - PT1.2
PT1.1 - SDA
PT1.2 - SDA
So no button hacks found. There are still some possible pins but I think all other button options are disabled in FW.
Only temperature probe is hackable.
IMHO AN8002 is a better option for general use and AN8008 is only better in those small ranges.
-
Thank you stroma (in Greek, this name means mattress!)
If the quote from plazma stands, this is great!
It means we can hack the eeprom to reactivate the disabled button functionality.
But all I have, is the translated (by Kerry Wong) datasheet of DTM0660 and in the eeprom analysis, I can't find anything that refers to enabling/disabling such buttons!
EDIT: I wonder if it's the DM1106EN (used in an8008, improved DTM0660) that allows enabling/disabling button functionality. The ZT102 uses the DTM0660. I could find no datasheet for DM1106EN anywhere.
EDIT2: I spent many hours bombarding undocumented eeprom addresses with all sort of data to see if that changes anything towards making the various TPx.x points behave like in the ZT102 model. Nothing! If they limit the use of extra buttons, they must have done it in a different way. I don't know if this meter's CPU contains a firmware or not. I don't know if the limitation is in that firmware or there is something else on the PCB that makes the meter behave this way.
-
Anyone know of a source for the 200mA 250V ceramic 10mm fast fuses for this meter?
I've ordered 10A spare fuses from ebay. Only found them with axial leads, to be cut off when needed:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/300757393643?ViewItem=&item=300757393643&ppid=PPX000608&cnac=ES&rsta=en_ES(en_ES)&cust=4R9279867B836642B&unptid=1c4da7f6-1c88-11e8-a9c9-441ea1479d80&t=&cal=7baed6587cd5&calc=7baed6587cd5&calf=7baed6587cd5&unp_tpcid=email-receipt-auction-payment&page=main:email&pgrp=main:email&e=op&mchn=em&s=ci&mail=sys (https://www.ebay.com/itm/300757393643?ViewItem=&item=300757393643&ppid=PPX000608&cnac=ES&rsta=en_ES(en_ES)&cust=4R9279867B836642B&unptid=1c4da7f6-1c88-11e8-a9c9-441ea1479d80&t=&cal=7baed6587cd5&calc=7baed6587cd5&calf=7baed6587cd5&unp_tpcid=email-receipt-auction-payment&page=main:email&pgrp=main:email&e=op&mchn=em&s=ci&mail=sys)
...but I cannot find the 200mA fuses anywhere except in Aliexpress:
https://es.aliexpress.com/store/product/10A-600uA-fuse-for-RM101-102-multimeter/909123_32811804077.html (https://es.aliexpress.com/store/product/10A-600uA-fuse-for-RM101-102-multimeter/909123_32811804077.html)
but unfortunately they only sell them to you if you've bought the meter from them. Otherwise they won't sell the fuses. I bought the meter elsewhere...
-
You can get the fuses from the Richmeters store (exactly the same meters as Aneng), but ONLY if you have bought a multimeter from them:
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/10A-600uA-fuse-for-RM101-102-multimeter/909123_32811804077.html (https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/10A-600uA-fuse-for-RM101-102-multimeter/909123_32811804077.html)
-
Yeah, the same story... I bought the meter from banggood and they have no fuses for it >:(
-
Wasn't there some option for a through hole fuse which was perfect if you cut the wires?
-
If you read carefully three posts above yours, that's exactly what I've ordered for the 10A fuses. The problem is that I cannot find them in a 200mA value...
-
Wasn't there some option for a through hole fuse which was perfect if you cut the wires?
Yep.
If you read carefully three posts above yours, that's exactly what I've ordered for the 10A fuses. The problem is that I cannot find them in a 200mA value...
So get 250mA or whatever's the closest.
A 200mA fuse doesn't blow at exactly 201mA.
-
Can't find 250mA either!
I find them in Slow Blow (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ceramic-Fuse-Slow-Blow-250V-3-6x10mm-5x20mm-6x30mm-0-1A-15A-Various-Options/122046319382?hash=item1c6a870b16:m:m9rhz5Dx0iFKjf0a6KU6t6A) version but not Fast Blow as required.
-
I just noticed this meter has a bug |O
AC mA reads zero until over 3.5mA and then reads 20% low, until over 10mA where it starts to read accurately. This is with 60Hz AC sine.
-
Can't find 250mA either!
May be there is enough space for a regular fuse?
I think I saw these fuses on AliExpress, although the price was quite high.
-
Here is a brute force method that I randomly came across in the LT1011 datasheet. The LT1011 is an improved 311 but a couple of FET buffers and a better comparator could be used for even greater performance.
-
the aneng meters can be modded for 20mm fuses.
and you can get ceramic 20mm FF rated fuses - so that's the way to go.
-
I've read a good 20 or so pages of this. While it's not the best DMM on the planet, for the price it's perfect for what I need it for. Better than anything in that price range a few years back.
And after doing this mod to it, and getting better probes, it works even better.
https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8008-modify-for-better-accuracy-faster-readings/ (https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8008-modify-for-better-accuracy-faster-readings/)
-
Welcome to the forum, Zimphire.
Interesting how much noise was in the meter and how much better performance was after Jack made those cap mods.
Looks like he recently fixed up the AN8009 as well. https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8009-improve-accuracy-response/ (https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8009-improve-accuracy-response/)
-
Welcome to the forum, Zimphire.
Interesting how much noise was in the meter and how much better performance was after Jack made those cap mods.
Looks like he recently fixed up the AN8009 as well. https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8009-improve-accuracy-response/ (https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8009-improve-accuracy-response/)
Zimph, from MacNN forums, is that you?! :P Blast from the past!!!
-
Zimph, from MacNN forums, is that you?! :P Blast from the past!!!
Ack! PLZ don't ban me!
-
Zimph, from MacNN forums, is that you?! :P Blast from the past!!!
Ack! PLZ don't ban me!
Hahaha I’m not an admin here. And you deserved it! ;) Anyway, nice to see a familiar face (well, username!).
-
Wasn't there something very common missing on these like mA ability, just Amps ?
-
Wasn't there something very common missing on these like mA ability, just Amps ?
Full featured DMM's using this chipset have a fouth input jack: COM, V, mA/uA, A
AN8008 has three and is missing the low mA range, it has uA, high mA + A. So it reads:
0-99.99uA at the V jack with 100R shunt.
0-999.9uA at the V jack with 100R shunt.
0-999.9mA at the A jack with 0.01R shunt
0-9.999A at the A jack with 0.01R shunt
Missing is the 9.999mA/99.99mA range with 0.99R shunt.
So you can only get 0.1mA resolution on mA measurements.
Also, it cannot measure past 9.999MEG ohms :--
-
Wasn't there something very common missing on these like mA ability, just Amps ?
Yes. They don't have a range in the 10mA area. They jump straight from uA to A.
-
I like having only three jacks -- that's convenient for me. But I'd love to have an audible warning if plug not in the right socket.
-
I like having only three jacks -- that's convenient for me. But I'd love to have an audible warning if plug not in the right socket.
you do, it makes a bang or large crack sound! >:D
-
you do, it makes a bang or large crack sound! >:D
Considering the DMM itself costs just a bit more than a good HRC fuse, that's fine with me :). A single-use DMM...
PS could you remind me why it should bang? I thought it has fuses on all ranges...
-
How long does it take before a 99.999 counts meter is to be released for this price ?
-
How long does it take before a 99.999 counts meter is to be released for this price ?
You mean a 5-digit DMM for $15? Well, if you only care about number of digits it's not a problem at all :D. A 16-bit sound DAC with some oversampling will do it... But precision will suffer.
-
I want to make the mods to my AN8008 according to the info at:
https://hackaday.com/2017/11/24/a-few-caps-for-a-faster-multimeter/ (https://hackaday.com/2017/11/24/a-few-caps-for-a-faster-multimeter/)
It's the first time that I re-solder SMD, but a do have a lot of experince in soldering.
I use a solder ATTEN ST-80 station with temp setting, so what temp should I use for the 0805 caps?
Is the tip (attached pic) OK for that job?
Thanks for your advise in advance!
-
It's the first time that I re-solder SMD, but a do have a lot of experince in soldering.
I use a solder ATTEN ST-80 station with temp setting, so what temp should I use for the 0805 caps?
Is the tip (attached pic) OK for that job?
That tip looks like something my dentist would use... ;)
If you have a pencil or fine chisel tip for your normal through-hole soldering, there is no need to buy a special one for soldering 0805 SMDs. The same considerations apply as for through-hole soldering: The tip needs to be fine enough to touch the desired solder joint only, but shold not be thinner than necessary (for good heat transfer). Just hold your pencil or chisel tip into the angle beween PCB and the side wall of the 0805, and you will be fine.
Also, your temperature setting should be the same as for small through-hole components.
-
you do, it makes a bang or large crack sound! >:D
Considering the DMM itself costs just a bit more than a good HRC fuse, that's fine with me :). A single-use DMM...
PS could you remind me why it should bang? I thought it has fuses on all ranges...
that's a common miss-understanding.
meters only have fuses on the current inputs.
-
that's a common miss-understanding.
Oh I think I met her once.
("miss-understanding"? Really? You guys invented the language, not sure what you're doing with it these days, though.)
-
Buying better test leads also makes this DMM alot better..
-
that's a common miss-understanding.
Oh I think I met her once.
("miss-understanding"? Really? You guys invented the language, not sure what you're doing with it these days, though.)
shouldnt you be speaking french? >:D
-
Buying better test leads also makes this DMM alot better..
+1 for this. I replaced the leads on my Aneng 8009 in my toolbag with Brymen gold plated leads. Much more accurate for the low resistance measurements I will be using it for. I threw the OEM leads out.
-
Welcome to the forum, Zimphire.
Interesting how much noise was in the meter and how much better performance was after Jack made those cap mods.
Looks like he recently fixed up the AN8009 as well. https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8009-improve-accuracy-response/ (https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8009-improve-accuracy-response/)
I've got a lot of responses from people doing the upgrade on the AN8009 and not getting any significantly better results. I did on my unit, but maybe they've improved later batches.
-
Buying better test leads also makes this DMM alot better..
One thing that lets the Anengs down compared to "real" multimeters is the wobbly lead sockets.
-
strange, i have 2 and they arent wobbly or loose in any way.
-
strange, i have 2 and they arent wobbly or loose in any way.
The sockets are only attached on the bottom and soldered to the PCB through a long springy connector. It's inevitable that leads that don't neatly fill the gap produce a lot of force on that bottom bit due to them essentially being levers. The supplied leads and maybe the often used Brymen leads seem to fill the gap between the socket and the case and stabilise the whole affair that way, though you can still wiggle the leads from side to side a bit. With the original leads the range of motion is much closer to higher end meters, though.
It should be said that higher end leads also don't seem to be firmly held inside the socket.
-
Welcome to the forum, Zimphire.
Interesting how much noise was in the meter and how much better performance was after Jack made those cap mods.
Looks like he recently fixed up the AN8009 as well. https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8009-improve-accuracy-response/ (https://www.jackenhack.com/aneng-an8009-improve-accuracy-response/)
I've got a lot of responses from people doing the upgrade on the AN8009 and not getting any significantly better results. I did on my unit, but maybe they've improved later batches.
I did the mod to my 8008 and 8009 and the reading definitely stabilizes much quicker. I am using Brymen leads and they are quite snug, fitting better than the OEM leads
-
The 200mA fuses are for resale
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/10A-600uA-fuse-for-RM101-102-multimeter/32811804077.html (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/10A-600uA-fuse-for-RM101-102-multimeter/32811804077.html)
its 200mA(109-111) for the aneng 8008 meter
-
Not an AN8008 competitor, due to the price and the larger form factor. But it looks somewhat promising -- might even have proper fuses?
Although the 600V CAT IV rating and the claim that it is "FDA certified" do not instill confidence... ::)
Really?? "it is "FDA certified"!
Now I can give some multimeters to my cows! the heifers will get a kick out of it. :-DD
Shoot, I think I'll get several dozen of those. Start a "cattle" makershed :-DD
-
As far as the AN8008 readings around µV are concerned...
I have a Uni-T UT70D (80,000 count) and a Brymen 867s (up to 500,000 count) both can read down to a resolution of 1 µV
Both have trouble at around the 0 mark at either staying on 0 when leads are shorted or reading accurately in the -10 to +10 µV range, no matter the source of the measurement.
I see this quite often, where someone gets frustrated because open leads on the volts setting does not remain at zero and floats up and down.
This is actually a good feature for those doing electrical work. it shows that not only are you getting 0 voltage on a circuit, but that the wiring inside the wall or wherever is not even connected.
uh, oops. Time to re draw some wire....
-
@TheNewLab, with all the excitement about the FDA-certified meter, it looks like you got your quote nesting mixed up... ;)
-
One question.
I see there is enough space to fit a 9V battery.
Is it possible to add the 9V battery with a 3.5 or 3.3V stabilizer?
-
maybe, if you remove the battery-box.
but why? a pair of AAA's has more mA than a pp3
-
The idea was to increase battery power.
But i will have some loss on stabiliser too... so maybe you're right.
-
Thank you all for the valuable resources you have provided on the Topic of the AN8008. Due to some problems i had with enabling the Temperature readings on my AN8008 i will share a modified eeprom guide. This is nothing new just has some additional infos and resources in there so even "people with limited knowledge - like me 8)" can attempt this.
I tested this on 2 different AN8008 - the newer one has another digit added to the serial number so i guess they were running out of values and it worked on both of them!
Hardware used was an Arduino Nano for the eeprom read and write. Make sure you know the Pinout of your Arduino and connect accordingly!
SDA to SDA and SCL to SCL and GND to GND.
Hopefully this helpes somebody.
Enjoy!
-
Awesome!
-
Welcome to the forum, 12345. I'm surprised that username wasn't already taken. ;D
-
I want to share that I've been able to modify the EEPROM contents of my AN8008 meters (I have two) using the instructions posted by 12345 a couple posts above and the instructions from the Russian thread. I slightly modified them to use the equipment I have on hand.
I used this EEPROM mod to disable the auto off function and the display backlight timeout. I prefer my meters this way.
I have two AN8008 meters.
I got my first unit in 2017 from aliexpres, it has an 8 digit serial.
I got my second unit in 2018 from banggood, it has a 9 digit serial.
The second unit has a slightly different PCB from my first unit - it has exposed solder covered traces going from the 10A input jack to the fuse and from the fuse to the current shunt. The procedure worked equally well for both units.
Here's the steps I used to modify my EEPROM:
1) I connected the following 3 points on the PCB together: both points marked JP2 and the VPP point. (This step is only necessary if you want to write to the EEPROM. EEPROM reads can be performed if you skip this step.)
2) Then I connected my 3.3V arduino pro mini to the P24C02A EEPROM on the AN8008 using a SOIC clip. I only connected both I2C lines (SDA and SCL) and the GND line. I used 4.7k ohm pull up resistors on each of the I2C lines (the lines are pulled up to the voltage on the arduino's 3.3V pin). (The pull up resistors may not be necessary.)
3) Then I turned the meter on by moving the rotary knob on the multimeter to the voltage position. The batteries should be present in the meter from here on out or the procedure won't work.
4) I ran the following code on the connected arduino. This is a basic I2C EEPROM read and write code that can be used to read and write to a breadboarded EEPROM or to the EEPROM on the AN8008. When the code is run as is, it will simply read the EEPROM contents and dump them to the serial output for you to capture. It's recommended to save the contents of the EEPROM before you make any changes.
/* WIRING: use 3.3V arduino pro mini
*
* 24C02 GND - arduino GND
* 24C02 SDA - arduino SDA (A4) [this line is pulled to VCC (3.3V) using a 4.7k ohm resisor (10k can also work, or the it can be omitted)]
* 24C02 SCL - arduino SCL (A5) [this line is pulled to VCC (3.3V) using a 4.7k ohm resisor (10k can also work, or the it can be omitted)]
*
* the following 3 points should be bridged together on the an8008 for a successful write: both JP2 points and VPP (reading can be done without this)
*/
#include <Wire.h>
#define PRINTHEXORDEC // print the EEPROM in human readable format (for viewing in arduino serial monitor)
//#define PRINTBYTESTREAM // print raw byte data of the EEPROM (for realterm capture)
#define PRINTFORMAT HEX // put HEX or DEC here
#define PRINTSEPARATOR " "
const int myEEPROM = 0x50;
const int myEEPROMsize = 256;
void setup() {
// put your setup code here, to run once:
Wire.begin();
Serial.begin(9600);
delay(10);
//eepwrite(myEEPROM,0xFB,0x00); // disable an 8008 auto power off function
//eepwrite(myEEPROM,0xFC,0x00); // disable an 8008 backlight timeout
#ifdef PRINTHEXORDEC
for (int i=0; i<myEEPROMsize; i++) {
int readbyte = eepread(myEEPROM,i);
if (PRINTFORMAT == HEX) {
if (readbyte <= 0xF) {
Serial.print("0");
}
}
Serial.print(readbyte, PRINTFORMAT);
if ((i+1) % 16 == 0) {
Serial.println();
}
else {
Serial.print(PRINTSEPARATOR);
}
if ((i+1) % 256 == 0) {
Serial.println();
}
}
#endif
#ifdef PRINTBYTESTREAM
for (int i=0; i<myEEPROMsize; i++) {
int readbyte = eepread(myEEPROM,i);
Serial.write(readbyte);
}
#endif
}
void loop() {
// put your main code here, to run repeatedly:
}
int eepread(int deviceAddr, int dataAddr) {
Wire.beginTransmission(deviceAddr);
Wire.write(dataAddr);
Wire.endTransmission();
Wire.requestFrom(deviceAddr,1);
if (Wire.available()) {
return Wire.read();
}
else {
return -1;
}
}
int eepwrite(int deviceAddr, int dataAddr, byte data) {
Wire.beginTransmission(deviceAddr);
Wire.write(dataAddr);
Wire.write(data);
Wire.endTransmission();
delay(10);
}5) To disable the meter auto off function and backlight timeout, simply uncomment the following two lines and run the sketch again.
//eepwrite(myEEPROM,0xFB,0x00); // disable an 8008 auto power off function
//eepwrite(myEEPROM,0xFC,0x00); // disable an 8008 backlight timeout
You can also set the auto power off and display timeout functions to a custom value.
The byte at address 0xFB defines how long will it take for the auto off function to trigger in minutes. 15min was the default. Set this to 0 to completely disable the function.
The byte at address 0xFC defines how long will it take for the display backlight to turn off after you turned it on in seconds. 120 sec was the default. Set this to 0 to completely disable the function.
You can also use the eeprwrite function in the sketch to write to any address on the EEPROM and perform other mods.
I'm attaching two pictures from the process and the original EEPROM contents from both meters (each once in a readable format and once in raw binary).
-
I finally picked up one of these last Christmas, and found that the 100uF cap was marked as "low ESR."
They misspelled the word "AVOID" on the battery cover under the tilt stand (AVIOD (sic)).
It came with a coated drawstring bag with a screen print of the meter on it, but I left the bag on top of the meter and left it with accessories in a new pouch for a few months. It seems the coating on the bag dissolved a patterned onto the clear screen where it touched for that time, rendering the display unreadable. I read up on polishing clear plastic, and had to buy some fine sandpaper and a Novus plastic polish kit, but was able to fix it.
Otherwise, it works as expected, and good value for the price. But I am still mainly using my EEVBlog BM235 and old Fluke 8060.
-
Buying better test leads also makes this DMM alot better..
+1 for this. I replaced the leads on my Aneng 8009 in my toolbag with Brymen gold plated leads. Much more accurate for the low resistance measurements I will be using it for. I threw the OEM leads out.
I did exactly the same thing. I think the leads cost me more than the meter. :-DD
-
Na, it's not worth gold leads because the rotary switch is crap and always has several ohms resistance.
-
Na, it's not worth gold leads because the rotary switch is crap and always has several ohms resistance.
Yeah, but the gold-plated leads still greatly reduce contact problems with the leads themselves. It's nice to know that when I touch the leads to something and don't get an immediate continuity beep I don't need to go jiggling and moving them a bit to make sure it's really not just a lead contact problem.
I have a couple of sets of "good" leads (gold plated, very pointy, silicone) I almost always use with whichever multimeter I'm using. (These aren't truly great leads by any means, but they're a lot better than what come with almost any <$100 multimeter and they were under $10/set, IIRC.) It's one of the better investments I've ever made.
-
Na, it's not worth gold leads because the rotary switch is crap and always has several ohms resistance.
Yeah, but the gold-plated leads still greatly reduce contact problems with the leads themselves. It's nice to know that when I touch the leads to something and don't get an immediate continuity beep I don't need to go jiggling and moving them a bit to make sure it's really not just a lead contact problem.
I have a couple of sets of "good" leads (gold plated, very pointy, silicone) I almost always use with whichever multimeter I'm using. (These aren't truly great leads by any means, but they're a lot better than what come with almost any <$100 multimeter and they were under $10/set, IIRC.) It's one of the better investments I've ever made.
Totally agree, I find they reduce connection latency substantially.
My aneng is just my go anywhere, take loads of abuse meter, I also have a couple of others, including a BM235 from Dave.
-
Na, it's not worth gold leads because the rotary switch is crap and always has several ohms resistance.
Yeah, but the gold-plated leads still greatly reduce contact problems with the leads themselves. It's nice to know that when I touch the leads to something and don't get an immediate continuity beep I don't need to go jiggling and moving them a bit to make sure it's really not just a lead contact problem.
I agree, there was a real difference between the OEM leads and a set of Brymen gold plated leads measuring a 1R1 5% resistor. With the Brymen leads, it was almost dead on, with the OEM leads, the reading was just over 2R. I originally purchased it and an 8009 for low resistance measurements for work but ended up getting a Fluke 101, again swapping out the OEM leads with the Brymen.
-
I have trouble taking the AN8008 seriously, it's no good for low ohms use.
It does not have a zero/null feature, so I have to mentally subtract ohms offset in the meter and leads.
What does it matter then, with gold ends verses chrome-plated steel? The rotary switch is copper. The input banana jacks are chrome-plated steel. You end up subtracting ohms of copper, steel, chrome anyhow.
-
I have trouble taking the AN8008 seriously, it's no good for low ohms use.
man
it is only cheapish meter it is not 4-wire milliohmeter
A few years ago you could say that it has fantastic characteristics for beer price
-
Would you add some gold test leads?
AN8008 always has an ohm or two of resistance, you can't even check 100R resistors to 1%.
It's like toy multimeter for measuring resistance.
-
Would you add some gold test leads?
AN8008 always has an ohm or two of resistance, you can't even check 100R resistors to 1%.
It's like toy multimeter for measuring resistance.
I mainly use it for checking continuity in new PCB designs and other basic tests in my study. For this sort of thing it's prefect.
-
What am I doing wrong? (factory calibration, no modifications except extra cap to smoth dc-dc regulator's ripple as was suggested somewhere)
Those are my daily drivers (along with K2000), while 121GW sits in the drawer.
PS There is always a lot of bias about cheap equipment.
-
I've cleaned the shit rotary switch a few times, tried various contact cleaners and lubes to prevent oxide from building up but it keeps happening. I don't use this DMM much.
Made in USA multimeters are my daily drivers for obvious reasons.
Update: CAIG DeoxIT F5 (https://caig.com/fader-f-series/) which has Polyphenyl Ether (PPE) totally works :) and the switch works without hassles now.
-
I've cleaned the shit rotary switch a few times, tried various contact cleaners and lubes to prevent oxide from building up but it keeps happening. I don't use this DMM much.
Interesting, I wonder if mine has different contacts and/or plating. I don't want to tear mine down yet because it works... I bought my dmms from aliexpress.
PS did you check your shunt with another dmm? Unlikely, but may be something wrong with it?
-
That shunt measures about 0.015 ohms.
If I turn the rotary switch back and forth a few times, it can go down to less than 0.2 ohms but after a month it goes back up to several ohms or worse. Once it was over 50 ohms.
It seems to be the chinesium copper alloy the wipers are made of, with it's dull brown look and high sulphur content. The PCB has good gold ENIG finish still.
For the meter I bought it from the ANENG store, it seems the metals are such low quality I consider it too unreliable. I could try electroplate the wipers with something.
-
That shunt measures about 0.015 ohms.
If I turn the rotary switch back and forth a few times, it can go down to less than 0.2 ohms but after a month it goes back up to several ohms or worse. Once it was over 50 ohms.
You are definitely doing something wrong, the shunt is not switched but permanently connected to the input terminals.
-
That shunt measures about 0.015 ohms.
If I turn the rotary switch back and forth a few times, it can go down to less than 0.2 ohms but after a month it goes back up to several ohms or worse. Once it was over 50 ohms.
You are definitely doing something wrong, the shunt is not switched but permanently connected to the input terminals.
Read the post on the previous page. :-X
Edit: I cant get the link to work, but its a couple of posts back.
-
For the meter I bought it from the ANENG store, it seems the metals are such low quality I consider it too unreliable. I could try electroplate the wipers with something.
Try to add simple solder bloob
Why not?
-
Read the post on the previous page. :-X
Edit: I cant get the link to work, but its a couple of posts back.
Hmm, which post? Could you indicate the reply number please?
-
Hmm, which post? Could you indicate the reply number please?
It looks like he is not talking about the internal current shunt, but about measuring sub-ohm resistors with the meter.
-
... about measuring sub-ohm resistors with the meter.
Sub-ohm measuring with 2 wires only meter ? Reliably ? ::)
-
... about measuring sub-ohm resistors with the meter.
Sub-ohm measuring with 2 wires only meter ? Reliably ? ::)
Most of the better meters uses separate paths for current source and measurement to the connector, i.e. the switch resistance will not affect the result. That is not always the case on cheap meters.
-
... about measuring sub-ohm resistors with the meter.
Sub-ohm measuring with 2 wires only meter ? Reliably ? ::)
Most of the better meters uses separate paths for current source and measurement to the connector, i.e. the switch resistance will not affect the result. That is not always the case on cheap meters.
Yeah, most bench top meters has 4-W capability, but never seen at "handheld" DMMs, except for LCR meter, but its different animal by it self.
-
Most of the better meters uses separate paths for current source and measurement to the connector, i.e. the switch resistance will not affect the result. That is not always the case on cheap meters.
Yeah, most bench top meters has 4-W capability, but never seen at "handheld" DMMs, except for LCR meter, but its different animal by it self.
I did not talk about bench meters, but standard hand held meters with two terminals where the current source and voltage measurement do not share a switch terminal.
And yes benchmeters is something else and considerable better at low ohmic measurement.
Handheld multimeter with 4 terminal ohm do exist: METRAHIT IM XTRA but it is probably just as expensive as a bench meter.
-
moved to new topic
-
@rafik23
I'm confused, does your post have anything to do with the AN8008?
-
hi
my post is for dtm1106EN i want to analyse data
-
hi
my post is for dtm1106EN i want to analyse data
Then please open a new thread, with a descriptive title. (It should mention the model of meter you are actually talking about.) Thanks!
-
Noobs! :palm:
-
Noobs! :palm:
I`m noob for at last 56 years, is it a problem? Why do You discriminate noobs?
-
Noobs! :palm:
I`m noob for at last 56 years, is it a problem? Why do You discriminate noobs?
I was referring to his post count, all 3 posts were in this topic.
-
Hello. I have one question related to this multimeter (and other multimeters in general) :
When measuring voltage (eg : 220V AC) with probes endings plugged into socket 2 and 3 (the last two sockets, starting from left), is there safe rotary switch positions other than "V" and "mV" ?. AFAIK "A"and "mA" positions are a big no-no (since it's basically a short-circuit) but what about others ? (eg : ohms measurement or continuity test) ?
-
When measuring voltage (eg : 220V AC) with probes endings plugged into socket 2 and 3 (the last two sockets, starting from left), is there safe rotary switch positions other than "V" and "mV" ?
No.
(and I have doubts about the mV position)
nb. Even if the switch is on 'V' the leads can still be in an unsafe position... be sure to triple-check everything.
-
Hello guys :)
So, anyway, I've stupidly managed to burn input divider 5MΩ resistor (R30) on my AN870 by trying to measure output of a (unloaded) CCFL backlight driver |O.
Since 5MΩ is not really a standard value, and as far as I've managed to find out, this resistor is MELF 0.25%, the best I could manage to find locally was two in parallel 10MΩ 1% metal film resistors. Voltage measurement works now, but it is showing a little bit low. Before it would be almost bang on 10.000V when I feed it AD584 10V voltage reference. Now it reads something like 9.954.
Question is: will I ever be able to get back the accuracy with 1% resistors (can't really find any better locally), should i try calibration procedure, or should I scrap the multimeter?
-
Question is: will I ever be able to get back the accuracy with 1% resistors (can't really find any better locally), should i try calibration procedure, or should I scrap the multimeter?
You could buy a load of cheap 1% 4.7M resistors and pick out the two that are best matched.
OTOH the calibration will probably be done with of error so you might have to find two that are slightly mismatched, by just the right amount to make it work (put a pot in series with one of them and dial it in to find the exact ratio needed). :popcorn:
Also think about getting a Fluke 101 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/fluke-101-getting-cheaper/) for measuring things like that in the future.
-
I rarely need to measure that high voltage, CCLF backlit monitors are on the way out anyway.
Thanks for the suggestion. I have 4.7M, 5.1M and 10M, 10pcs each, and will combine them in some way to get the it to measure correctly. As far as I'm aware, those two 5M resistors (R29 and R30) are only for measuring voltage, right? Other things shouldn't be affected?
-
As far as I'm aware, those two 5M resistors (R29 and R30) are only for measuring voltage, right? Other things shouldn't be affected?
Hang on...
Looking at your photo closely I see they're the input protection resistors (leading to the PTC). It's not a voltage divider at all, it's just a 10M (approx) resistance to give a high impedance input and I don't think they're high precision at all. Maybe your problem is simply that you put in a much higher value.
-
Here's higher res photo in the attachment. This should be diveder as it is going straight to the chip, not to the PTC.
-
Hang on...
Looking at your photo closely I see they're the input protection resistors (leading to the PTC). It's not a voltage divider at all, it's just a 10M (approx) resistance to give a high impedance input and I don't think they're high precision at all. Maybe your problem is simply that you put in a much higher value.
The 10Mohm resistors are always part of the input voltage divider and is used in volt AC/DC, it can also be used in other ranges, but usually a about 1Mohm input resistor is used for them and that resistor is not used in a voltage divider only as protection.
-
I've just tried removing one of the 10M resistor, and it is not measuring voltage at all. So definitely they are part of a voltage divider.
After mucking about with different resistors, I've managed to get it to show 9.990V on 10V reference, and 4.995V on 5V refence. I don't think I can make it any better, so I'll leave it as is.
-
The failure of your DMM doesn't appear to be related to the 2*5MOhms dropper resistors directly, if so they both would have been charred. It rather looks like the quite high striking voltage of the CCFL inverter just caused an arc to form from the "hot" terminal of the first resistor to ground, resulting in the underlying FR4 to dissociate/carbonize. In order to repair the instrument properly, you would have to grind away all of the affected FR4 so there won't be any bare carbon residues left in this area. Otherwise, there will always be a low(ish) impedance path to ground, making measuring modelstly high voltages VERY dangerous (provided the source is capable of delivering high energy).
-
I've just tried removing one of the 10M resistor, and it is not measuring voltage at all. So definitely they are part of a voltage divider.
Yep. Those resistors are the input protection for the voltage range. There's two of them in series to make it tougher. If you remove one then the volts can't get through to get a reading.
After mucking about with different resistors, I've managed to get it to show 9.990V on 10V reference, and 4.995V on 5V refence. I don't think I can make it any better, so I'll leave it as is.
Any high-ish values will do but 10M total is the standard.
-
Otherwise, there will always be a low(ish) impedance path to ground, making measuring modelstly high voltages VERY dangerous (provided the source is capable of delivering high energy).
I've dug around the board as best as as coud. How high voltages are we talking about? I've tried measuring 230VAC, and it worked fine. Also, just measured input filter cap on switchmode psu (~325VDC), and it was fine. That's the highest voltage I usually measure.
-
I've tried measuring 230VAC, and it worked fine. Also, just measured input filter cap on switchmode psu (~325VDC), and it was fine. That's the highest voltage I usually measure.
If you "usually" measure voltages like that then it's time to get a Fluke 101.
-
Bad choice of words :D I don't usually measure high voltages, but if I go HV, that's as far as I will go.
-
Just make sure there's no charring left on the PCB. Any amount of carbon deposition will lower the break-down voltage tremendously. This effect is deliberately used on most modern turbine engine spark plugs ("shunted spark plugs") to be able to run the plugs on 2000V exciters instead of the 10+kV required to break down a conventional spark plug, with the accompanying reduced requirements for interconnection, wiring and so on (lower installed weight).
It's impossible to tell at what voltage the "dirty" insulation gap of your DMM will fail, but if you ever use the instrument on mains (I hope only on properly fused indoor circuits) or other similarly elevated voltage / energy circuits, it is reason to worry. Even more so since the AN8008 cannot be considered the most appropriate (read: safe) instrument for this kind of measurement anyway.
-
Thanks for all the advice, I will definitely take more care next time. I bought it for low voltage use mostly anyway.
-
Hello,
This is my first post on the blog (YAY!).
Unfortunately, my Aneng AN8009 has sort of miscalibrated somehow, it was showing values off the usual case and so upon reading few threads(including this one) I came to realize that the meter can be re-calibrated by jumping the J2 pins. Which I did and fiddled around the values. But me being stupid, didn't think of getting an accurate calibration tool( don't have access to one anyway) and made the problem worse. No the meter is pretty much useless as it gives some gibberish value (like 830mV for a 3.86V supply). Even the NCV function doesn't seem to work anymore.
So, basically, I was wondering whether I could flash the EEPROM with the stock calibration value dump? If so, where can I find the dump? I looked everywhere and I couldn't find it. I did look at Kerry D. Wongs blog on extracting the EEPROM dump and I have the necessary stuff to do it as well (Arduino and wires :P )but there is no EEPROM dump for the AN8009 model. Will the AN8008 work with this?
I just need this working again ASAP. Any help is appreciated :)
Thanks & Regards
-
stock calibration value dump?
I might be able to do it tomorrow evening, but no promises.
-
Well, I desoldered the prom chip, but I don't know how to read it. I have ch341a programmer and Linux. Any hints? All articles I found so far are about reading spi chips, but the one in the dmm is of i2c type (p24c02a). Should it just work, or I need to provide i2c address to the programmer so it can read the eeprom?
PS This is my programmer: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32793476447.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.27424c4dal4nao (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32793476447.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.27424c4dal4nao) .
-
Dump EPROM RM111 this is analog AN8009
-
Well, I dumped the rom with the command below. I hope it's complete because the tool seems to be hardcoded to dump only 24c32 and 24c64 chips. For some reason the output is 4kb, even though the IC itself is supposed to be 2kb. So, use it at your own risk :(
$ sudo ch341eeprom -d -s 24c32 -r 8008.rom
Wrote [4096] bytes to file [out.rom]
Released device interface [0]
libusb: error [do_close] Device handle closed while transfer was still being processed, but the device is still connected as far as we know
libusb: error [do_close] A cancellation hasn't even been scheduled on the transfer for which the device is closing
-
Well, I dumped the rom with the command below. I hope it's complete because the tool seems to be hardcoded to dump only 24c32 and 24c64 chips. For some reason the output is 4kb, even though the IC itself is supposed to be 2kb. So, use it at your own risk :(
$ sudo ch341eeprom -d -s 24c32 -r 8008.rom
Wrote [4096] bytes to file [out.rom]
Released device interface [0]
libusb: error [do_close] Device handle closed while transfer was still being processed, but the device is still connected as far as we know
libusb: error [do_close] A cancellation hasn't even been scheduled on the transfer for which the device is closing
a 24c32 is 32 kbits (hence the 32), or 4kbytes
-
Hi, after modifying with an Arduino "writeByte(I2C_ADDR, 0xAD, (byte) 0x13)", the temperature shown by the meter is 38-40 degrees C even with shorted leads, which is way too high. I've tried a temperature probe from a uni-t and the temperature does rise if I touch it to something hot but it's off with over 15 degrees C. Using the same probe with a "good" meter I get 30C instead of 45C with Aneng.
May it be because I didn't activate Fahrenheit degrees too? (I never use Fahrenheit).
(https://i.postimg.cc/CzzK7RwF/photo-2023-02-21-22-21-41.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/CzzK7RwF)
-
There's little information about the format of the calibration bytes. I would make sure all 5 bytes are correct.
0BH,0CH 00FAH 环境温度(25.0°C) = Cold junction ambient temperature (25.0°C). "Adjustable range 0~50°C", reading with input jacks shorted.
0DH~0FH 03BE00H 环境温度默认ADC值 "Ambient temperature default ADC value"
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F
00: FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF 52 00 FA 00 00 BE 03
-
Yep, I have them exactly like that...
FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF 52 0 FA 0 0 BE 3
10 17 F 27 52 3 6E 50 64 4B 3C 3C A FF 40 FF
7 9A D6 81 64 0 96 0 0 80 A4 80 0 80 FB 78
4E 2 9 D3 FA 9 EE FE 9 8B EC 9 C9 19 A 0
0 1 0 1 0 7 98 0 64 0 64 0 64 0 0 0
0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80
9B 7E EE 7F A 0 EF 2A 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
6C 81 0 80 5C 84 E0 7C 18 1 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 16 0 10 0 C 0 7 13 1 12 3
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 11 0 D 0 9 15 2 0 4
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 A 0 13 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 B 0 0 0 0
D 0 2 10 D 0 3 20 20 0 3 20 20 0 3 10
0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80 41 0 3 5 D 0 2 20
0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80 0 80
0 80 FF FF FF FF FF FF 5A C7 CC F 78 B2 0 0
As someone on the forum experienced same issue Ive found thsee 3 values:
FA 00 C0 CE 03
E6 00 00 BD 03
F0 00 48 CE 03
8008
FA 00 00 BE 03 < this is the default value in the datasheet
FA 00 C0 CE 03 seemd that fixed it. I will try and come with an update.
-
After several attempts I have:
28 Celsius with F0 0 48 CE 3
29 Celsius with FA 0 C0 CE 3
33 Celsius with E6 00 48 CE 3
Any ideea on how to get that 25 Celsius ?
Got it: AA 0 0 BE 3
Previously I've had FA 0 0 BE 3 and 33C, so I've substracted 33 - 8 = 25 => AA in hex. :-+
-
Not sure whether this has been mentioned somewhere in this thread, but I discovered a way to disable the auto power-off feature with stock firmware.
1. Switch the meter off.
2. Press and hold the "SEL/HOLD" button.
3. Switch the meter on and release the button once it starts beeping.
If done successfully, it should beep 5 times. It will then also beep twice every 15 minutes - once to give a warning as usual, then again after 1 minute (this is when it would normally power off, but instead it beeps). Really annoying but whatever. Maybe that's why this function is not documented...?
-
Not sure whether this has been mentioned somewhere in this thread, but I discovered a way to disable the auto power-off feature with stock firmware.
1. Switch the meter off.
2. Press and hold the "SEL/HOLD" button.
3. Switch the meter on and release the button once it starts beeping.
If done successfully, it should beep 5 times. It will then also beep twice every 15 minutes - once to give a warning as usual, then again after 1 minute (this is when it would normally power off, but instead it beeps). Really annoying but whatever. Maybe that's why this function is not documented...?
It is documented.
-
Not sure whether this has been mentioned somewhere in this thread, but I discovered a way to disable the auto power-off feature with stock firmware.
1. Switch the meter off.
2. Press and hold the "SEL/HOLD" button.
3. Switch the meter on and release the button once it starts beeping.
If done successfully, it should beep 5 times. It will then also beep twice every 15 minutes - once to give a warning as usual, then again after 1 minute (this is when it would normally power off, but instead it beeps). Really annoying but whatever. Maybe that's why this function is not documented...?
It is documented.
Indeed! I was convinced I'd read somewhere that the auto power-off cannot be disabled, but I guess that was regarding the shabby DT9205 which I also own. I would have checked the manual, but as it appears I've lost it (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/Smileys/default/cry.gif)
-
I would have checked the manual, but as it appears I've lost it (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/Smileys/default/cry.gif)
https://www.mikrocontroller.net/attachment/375155/AN8008.pdf (https://www.mikrocontroller.net/attachment/375155/AN8008.pdf) (all clean from virustotal.com (https://www.virustotal.com/gui/url/ec5b457a71b589e41438652a7a05103983a939f70ea60b947f0400364b582d34?nocache=1))
-
Has anyone else experienced a similar issue? When I switch to measuring in mV, it starts to rise to 99 mV (in 10 to 15 seconds) and throws an OL error because the maximum is 99 mV. When I short probes, it returns to 0 mV and measures the voltage perfectly. It doesn't matter if probes are inserted into it or without them, it only returns to 0mV when short probes.
What could be the issue since everything works fine with my other multimeters?
-
Has anyone else experienced a similar issue? When I switch to measuring in mV, it starts to rise to 99 mV (in 10 to 15 seconds) and throws an OL error because the maximum is 99 mV. When I short probes, it returns to 0 mV and measures the voltage perfectly. It doesn't matter if probes are inserted into it or without them, it only returns to 0mV when short probes.
What could be the issue since everything works fine with my other multimeters?
That's completely normal in mV range.
-
Hi, 2 questions
Can we access readings in UART?
Can it be powered from li-ion battery 10440, ie 3.7v and a dummy cell?
-
Hi, 2 questions
Can we access readings in UART?
No. The UART pins are not bonded out on the die. You can look with a scope for signal but people removed the chip glue and no wire connected inside :(
Be careful - Battery(-) is not multimeter input COM(-) and shorting those will blow the IC.
Can it be powered from li-ion battery 10440, ie 3.7v and a dummy cell?
Operating voltage spec is to 3.6V max. So I would add an LDO with 3.6V output to work with 3.7-4.2V input.
The LCD contrast might go too dark with higher VCC, it can be changed in EEPROM.