Author Topic: DS1054Z Calibration problem  (Read 3044 times)

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Offline LaurenceW

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DS1054Z Calibration problem
« on: November 29, 2015, 08:35:21 AM »
Hi all - quick scan didn't turn this issue up anywhere else, so new post started.

I have a Rigol DS1054Z with <ahem> all software options. I recently upgraded to the latest firmware 04.03.SP1.

I now notice that the 'scope won't complete self test. It seems to hang when self testing Ch4 and requires a forced break. I've only recently noticed this - recent software upgrade may/may not be significant??

Screenshot shows all four channels displaying a 50mV pk-pk 2MHz square wave (well, square enough). Look at Ch4 - it is down on the displayed waveform amplitude and measured values - around 38mv pk-pk instead of 50. In all other respects, channel appears to operatre normally. 'Scope parameter file also attached.

Have I got a 3 1/2 channel 'scope?  :( Any ideas?

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Offline tautech

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2015, 08:41:35 AM »
Could you have hurt Ch 4 with a HV input and probe set to 1x ?

Remember these Rigols have only 300V rated channel inputs.
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Offline LaurenceW

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2015, 09:03:34 AM »
Hi Tautech (NZ - Country of my birth!).

I don't think I've put anything untoward into ANY of the inputs - in fact I don't think I've ever even used Ch4 before! No high voltage stuff on the bench. The channel stillworks, it just 20% down across all ranges, that's all.

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Offline tautech

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2015, 09:14:05 AM »
Hi Tautech (NZ - Country of my birth!).

(Lapsed Kiwi)
Greetings Laurence, weathers a lot warmer here and we can have Xmas at the beach.  :-+
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Online Fungus

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2015, 09:36:33 AM »
Did you 'purchase' the "500uV Vertical" option?
 

Offline Orion12

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2015, 09:40:19 AM »

I have a Rigol DS1054Z with <ahem> all software options. I recently upgraded to the latest firmware 04.03.SP1.

I now notice that the 'scope won't complete self test. It seems to hang when self testing Ch4 and requires a forced break. I've only recently noticed this - recent software upgrade may/may not be significant??


I HAD a Rigol DS1054Z with <ahem> all software options ( Except for NO 500uV Option ) running on firmware 04.03.SP1 . . . Worked Normally . . .
THEN
I Upgraded to the "Latest Firmware" which is 00.04.03.SP2 . . .
WHEN
I tried to Run the SELF CALIBRATION the "1st Time" . . . I got some kind of ( FAILURE to Complete Error ) . . . It ran FINE Until the Very End on Channel 4 . . .
THEN
I Noticed the USB Stick was STILL IN my DS1054Z.DS1104Z . . .
THEN
I Removed the USB Stick & Rebooted & Re-Ran the SELF CALIBRATION & It COMPLETED NORMALLY  :-+

Suggest Trying this "NEWER" Firmware Version & Make Sure You DON'T Have the USB Stick in your Scope WHEN Running the SELF CALIBRATION . . .
( Board Version 0.1.1 on my DS1054Z ) LINK to this Newest Firmware Version http://beyondmeasure.rigoltech.com/acton/fs/blocks/showLandingPage/a/1579/p/p-0019/t/page/fm/0

This May Not Fix Your Scope but is Worth a TRY ! :box:

ALSO Take Note : (  "Do not use the DSFR code suggested on the website. Codes for 500uV vertical resolution are intended for oscilloscopes such as the DS2000A series which have the necessary hardware for this feature. The code DSER enables all features except 500uV, which is not supported on the DS1000Z series and will cause erroneous results at this setting." )

Best of Luck with Cheers from Orion12 :)
« Last Edit: November 29, 2015, 11:03:45 AM by Orion12 »
 

Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2015, 10:05:08 AM »
1. The latest firmware is SP2, not SP1, and it comes with its own peculiar "features". Since it seems to be impossible to "roll back" to an earlier Firmware, be sure that you really want to update before you do so.

2. The scope's hardware is not compatible with the 500 uV/division setting. When adding Options use the code "DSER" which is not documented in the Riglol keygen but is supported anyhow.

3. Try  moving probes around and see if the problem follows the probe. That is, change the probe you are using on CH4 with a different one.

4. Your avatar shows a Nixie, but you say "no HV stuff on the bench" ??
« Last Edit: November 29, 2015, 10:07:30 AM by alsetalokin4017 »
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Offline LaurenceW

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2015, 11:14:15 AM »
Well spotted Alsetalokin! But no nasty nixie voltages on THIS test bench for the last couple of years... see pic!

I definietely do not have the 500uV option installed (I guess as confirmed by the input sensitivity only going down to 1mV/div?)

All four inputs are wired together. The traces for Ch1, 2, 3 are bang on top of one another (when set to the same gain and zero offset), but Ch4 is defo down. It still kinda works - I can just increase the gain using the vernier control to 570mV /div to equal 1V/div then all is well (except for the on-screen voltage readouts are then wrong of course). There is no instability in the trace, just low on gain for Ch 4. It is the same across a wide range of inout scaling factors (from 1mv/Div to 5V/div).

SP2 sounds like a mixed blessing?
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Offline Marcos

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2015, 11:57:43 AM »
I had the same "problem" as yours. Don't worry. Nothing wrong.
Turn your scope on and leave it or use it for more than an hour.
Run calibration after that. It will complete successfully.
Better don't update your firmware yet :)
 

Offline LaurenceW

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2015, 05:34:22 AM »
Hmm, thanks for the suggestion, Marcos, but no joy!

Thinking about things further... it's as if the self-cal electronics (which switches some sort of reference voltage into each input channel's stage) is failing to achive full scale (top of screen) deflection. when it ought to, so the 'scope "winds down" the sensitivity, as a result. The channel continues to work, but just not at the correct gain. Given that there are four channels to choose from, I might hazard a bit of an investigation!
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Offline xrunner

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2015, 06:12:32 AM »
LaurenceW,

It was mentioned that you didn't have the latest firmware -

1. The latest firmware is SP2, not SP1, and it comes with its own peculiar "features". Since it seems to be impossible to "roll back" to an earlier Firmware, be sure that you really want to update before you do so.

I have read back through all your posts: You have since not told us that you have installed SP2 firmware ...  :-//
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Offline Marcos

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2015, 06:40:49 AM »
Well, if he's on SP2 I'm not sure if it will work.
In my case this problem comes up after updating to SP1.
Before SP1, calibration was running fast without the need to wait for some time till the scope gets accommodate with environment.
After that update, the calibration refuses to complete if the scope was not running for at least one hour.
Also, checking update history for their firmware, on the latest versions, seems like they are trying to fix some calibration issues into their newer firmware releases.
 

Offline LaurenceW

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2015, 08:09:36 AM »
Ah!, well, to clarify - Ithought I was on the latest version of the firmware, as that was the version that I last downloaded. But that was maybe a couple of months ago, now I think back. SP1 is definely what's installed now. I see it is no longer the latest... What do I risk losing if I go for SP2?
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Offline MarkF

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2015, 10:27:14 AM »
The scope operation on the latest (SP2) is very slow.  I've seen a few videos where just moving the vertical position of a trace has upward of 1 sec delay after the knob is turned.   I have not and don't intend to upgrade to version SP2.  I will live with SP1.

Rigol's latest version, 00.04.03.SP2, download page also has the release notes if you want to see if there is something you really must have.
 

Offline LaurenceW

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #14 on: December 01, 2015, 06:46:47 AM »
Well thanks for that warning, MarkF! I certainly already find the 'scope a lot slower to respond to panel controls than the old DS1052E it replaces. I don't want to make that already bad situaltion worse! The release notes don't specifually raise any fixes in SP2 that I feel the need for (or indeed, even understand!), So I think I'll stay with SP1.

Nobody has yet suggested that the Ch4 Cal problem on my sample is a familiar or known issue, so I guess I just have to live with it. Now that I know that the problem is local to Ch4 and just an issue of gain, I'll have to compensate the readings and live with it.

Back to the Calibration routine - it currently hangs during the attempted and failed attempt to cal Ch4. Does anyone know if the routing normally goes on to perform any other cal tasks after the four vertical deflection cals, or is that all it does (about 25 seconds on each channel, I estimate). I guess I might still be missing those...? :-BROKE
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Offline pascal_sweden

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #15 on: December 01, 2015, 06:56:06 AM »
What about warranty? Can't you just send the scope in, and get a new one, where ALL 4 channels work as expected?
 

Offline LaurenceW

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #16 on: December 01, 2015, 09:10:00 AM »
That's an option, Pascal, but I'd have to unistall the quieter fan upgrade, and all those lovely options first! Find a big box, find the cost of return shipment (at least it is within my own country). I've still got 3 months warranty to run, just checked. It's an option, I guess.

If I did this and a replacement comes with latest SP2, are the software hacks upgrades still possible?
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Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #17 on: December 01, 2015, 12:46:04 PM »
1. From your symptoms, especially the failure of the self-cal routine to complete properly, I would say that you have a hardware problem and you should do a warranty return to try to get it fixed. My first DS1054z developed a bad glitch on CH4 within a few days of delivery and I returned it to TEquipment for a warranty replacement, which was greatly eased by the fact that I documented the glitch thoroughly on videos.

2. The SP2 software does fix several issues that are important to me, one being that Setup files containing Math did not load correctly with the old SP1 and earlier software. Another minor fix is that the Units of a math operation did not propagate to the Measurements or the Measure All table; that is, if the Units of the Math are supposed to be Watts, say, this only showed up _sometimes_ in the Math display on screen but the Measurements and Measure All  table would always still say "V" or "U". Both of these issues are fixed in the SP2 firmware, the "Watts" units are carried over to the Measurement displays and the Measure All table, and Setup files containing Math now load correctly. BUT... other people have complained that the SP2 slows down things like Vertical Positioning and etc. This is annoying but isn't really much of a problem, just turn the knobs in "safecracker mode", that is, slowly and gently.  There is also the extra Horizontal Measurements which now include + and - Pulse and Edge counters... complete with the "Pluses" typo on the Measurement display of those items, and the occasional miscount of the actual pulses under certain conditions.

3. But far more serious than those is the Measurement Fail bug, which apparently comes with SP2 and causes all the Measurements to stop working after a random time interval when you have a Math trace displayed. SO it's a tradeoff, whether or not you want to load SP2 or not. If you use complex stored setups including Math you may want it in spite of the bugs. But think carefully, as it is not possible to "roll back" to an earlier firmware version once a newer one is installed, by any known means.

4. The Self-Cal routine takes about 17-19 minutes to complete, and this has been the case with all three of the units I've had and with whatever firmware version is running. You should have the scope well warmed up and have _nothing_ connected to any of the inputs, including USB, LAN, and the auxiliary output on the back of the scope when running the Self-Cal routine.

5. Yes, you can still unlock the scope's bandwidth and options in the usual way after (or before) loading the SP2 firmware.

6. I have now had 3 different DS1054z units on my bench, and even though I actually bought a quiet fan before the first scope arrived because of the noise complaints, I have not actually been bothered by the fan noise so I never installed the quiet fan. It is much quieter than the other equipment fans that are running nearby, like the 5 fans in my computer case, or the air conditioner fan (summer) or heater fan (winter) in my workspace.

7. Don't throw away your original packing materials until you are sure that you aren't going to be returning anything to vendors or manufacturers! Keep your boxes and packing foams etc. until all your warranties are expired! And whenever you get a new bit of hardware, burn it in by leaving it on for a long time, power cycle it, etc. so that you can detect or stimulate failures while still in the original vendor's warranty-return window!
« Last Edit: December 01, 2015, 12:49:52 PM by alsetalokin4017 »
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Offline LaurenceW

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Re: DS1054Z Calibration problem
« Reply #18 on: December 02, 2015, 09:25:25 AM »
alsetalokin4017, Thanks for your fullsome reply.

I think the "return" route is the option I shall now pursue. As luck would have it, I'd "repurposed" some of the original Rigol 'scope packaging for another shipment, but I've an ATTIC FULL of other cardboard boxes (what fire hazard??) so can surely find something to do the job.
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