New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope

[leppie]

I just received my new DS1054Z an hour ago. 

Three of the four probe clip hoods were defective (just empty plastic shells). 

I chatted with TEquipment, who called Rigol during the chat, and was told that Rigol will ship me replacements. :|

Not a great start, but I am still hoping everything else is fine.

Me too       But just one probe hook for me. No metal part inside...  Luckily, those $10 ebay probe hooks fit well on it, not as nice as the Rigol ones, but still works.   

[hobbyist42]

I received my DS1054Z from Tequipment yesterday.  All the parts and pieces seem to work just fine.  I only had a short time to look over the scope yesterday.

Now I just need to educate myself on how to use all the triggering options.

[sweesiong78]

Everything checked out on my scope , only thing I have to comment on is that the color marker rings dont seem to attach flush on the probes, maybe it  just needs some time to work in the shape ..also the rings come with spares but I'm missing one color

[alank2]

also the rings come with spares but I'm missing one color

With both sets of 2, you should have gotten 4 of each color but only need 2 of each color...

[sweesiong78]

also the rings come with spares but I'm missing one color

With both sets of 2, you should have gotten 4 of each color but only need 2 of each color...

Yup, I only have two for the dark blue ones, so no spares for those (and I would not be concerned if not for the fact that the rings dont seem to attach tight to the probes)

[sweesiong78]

by the way, I noticed on the startup display that the 'installed features' have a trial duration that expires after around 35 hours.....if I do not 'hack' the scope, will all these features go away?

[swperk]

Just to confirm that my upgraded DS1054Z has a measured bandwidth of ~130 MHz, confirmed both by using a leveled signal generator (looking for the -3 dB point), and a pulse generator with a 70 ps risetime. On the system info screen the system software is 00.04.01.SP2, the board version is 0.1.1, and the model is shown as a DS1104Z.

[alank2]

by the way, I noticed on the startup display that the 'installed features' have a trial duration that expires after around 35 hours.....if I do not 'hack' the scope, will all these features go away?

Yes.

[alank2]

Just to confirm that my upgraded DS1054 has a measured bandwidth of ~130 MHz, confirmed both by using a leveled signal generator (looking for the -3 dB point), and a pulse generator with a 70 ps risetime.

What was the rise or fall time?  Some screenshots would be cool to check out.

[swperk]

The actual -3 dB point is about 133 MHz using a leveled signal generator. The scope measures the rise time of the pulse generator as 3.3 ns, so I guess the final answer for the bandwidth depends on whether you use the "traditional" 0.35/(rise time) formula, or if you use the 0.4 to 0.5/(rise time) formula for digital scopes shown in Agilent's (oops, I mean Keysight's) Application Note 1420 "Understanding Oscilloscope Frequency Response and Its Effect on Rise-Time Accuracy." Either way, the bandwidth is plenty high for my needs!

[alank2]

The fram reset is pressing the 5th option button down on the left side during power up.  It resets and starts up in Chinese.

[konablue]

Could someone tell me EEV discount for tequipment?
I think I'll get one of these ordered.

[Fungus]

Just to confirm that my upgraded DS1054Z has a measured bandwidth of ~130 MHz, confirmed both by using a leveled signal generator (looking for the -3 dB point), and a pulse generator with a 70 ps risetime. On the system info screen the system software is 00.04.01.SP2, the board version is 0.1.1, and the model is shown as a DS1104Z.

What did it have before?

What does if have with different numbers of channels enabled?

[BobCollins]

The actual -3 dB point is about 133 MHz using a leveled signal generator. The scope measures the rise time of the pulse generator as 3.3 ns, so I guess the final answer for the bandwidth depends on whether you use the "traditional" 0.35/(rise time) formula, or if you use the 0.4 to 0.5/(rise time) formula for digital scopes shown in Agilent's (oops, I mean Keysight's) Application Note 1420 "Understanding Oscilloscope Frequency Response and Its Effect on Rise-Time Accuracy." Either way, the bandwidth is plenty high for my needs!

Hi swperk,

It seems that you both have access to good signal generators and know how to use them. I would be interested in the response of an unhacked DS1054Z. As Fungus asked, it would also be interesting to know the measured effect on bandwidth of having 2 or 4 channels configured.

Thanks,

Bob

[Fungus]

It seems that you both have access to good signal generators and know how to use them. I would be interested in the response of an unhacked DS1054Z. As Fungus asked, it would also be interesting to know the measured effect on bandwidth of having 2 or 4 channels configured.

Switching between DS1054Z and DS1104Z is really easy with the Ultra Sigma utility.

Use ":SYSTem:OPTion:UNINSTall" to go back to DS1054Z

Use ":SYSTem:OPTion:INSTall XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX" to enter a key, where XXX is your key (without hyphens...)

[crossfireprod]

Has anybody seen / heard anything regarding when TEquipment will have these back in stock?

[alank2]

Has anybody seen / heard anything regarding when TEquipment will have these back in stock?

Start a quick chat with them, it is easy and they'll let you know!

[swperk]

Just to confirm that my upgraded DS1054Z has a measured bandwidth of ~130 MHz, confirmed both by using a leveled signal generator (looking for the -3 dB point), and a pulse generator with a 70 ps risetime. On the system info screen the system software is 00.04.01.SP2, the board version is 0.1.1, and the model is shown as a DS1104Z.

What did it have before?

What does if have with different numbers of channels enabled?

Before the "upgrade" I measured the bandwidth as almost exactly 50 MHz with a sharp rolloff above 50 MHz, consistent with bandwidth limiting in software.

There is no real difference in the bandwidth with multiple channels enabled (see the next paragraph), however, the sample rate drops to 500 MSa/s with two channels enabled, and to 250 MSa/s with three or four channels enabled. The memory depth drops from 24 MSa with one channel to 12 MSa/channel with two channels, and down to 6 MSa/channel with three or four channels enabled.

Because of the slower maximum sample rate with multiple channels enabled, there will be some waveform distortion due to undersampling at the highest sweep speeds. For example, at 5 ns/div a 250 MSa/s sample rate gives only slightly more than one sample per division, so fast waveforms can become very distorted. Changing the acquisition mode to Hi Res or Peak has no particular effect, nor would I expect any, since the samplers are already at their maximum speed. Averaging definitely smooths the waveform, but then there's no way to tell just by looking at it that there's an undersampling problem.

BTW, the risetime of a 70 ps risetime pulse generator as measured by the DS1054Z actually appeared to improve by going from one channel to two channels enabled. That was just an artifact, because the slower sample rate missed some roundoff in the leading edge so the reconstruction by the sin(x)/x interpolator made the edge look faster. Enabling three or four channels slowed the risetime measurement due distortion of the leading edge caused by undersampling.

[BobCollins]

Before the "upgrade" I measured the bandwidth as almost exactly 50 MHz with a sharp rolloff above 50 MHz, consistent with bandwidth limiting in software.

There is no real difference in the bandwidth with multiple channels enabled (see the next paragraph), however, the sample rate drops to 500 MSa/s with two channels enabled, and to 250 MSa/s with three or four channels enabled. The memory depth drops from 24 MSa with one channel to 12 MSa/channel with two channels, and down to 6 MSa/channel with three or four channels enabled.

Because of the slower maximum sample rate with multiple channels enabled, there will be some waveform distortion due to undersampling at the highest sweep speeds. For example, at 5 ns/div a 250 MSa/s sample rate gives only slightly more than one sample per division, so fast waveforms can become very distorted. Changing the acquisition mode to Hi Res or Peak has no particular effect, nor would I expect any, since the samplers are already at their maximum speed. Averaging definitely smooths the waveform, but then there's no way to tell just by looking at it that there's an undersampling problem.

BTW, the risetime of a 70 ps risetime pulse generator as measured by the DS1054Z actually appeared to improve by going from one channel to two channels enabled. That was just an artifact, because the slower sample rate missed some roundoff in the leading edge so the reconstruction by the sin(x)/x interpolator made the edge look faster. Enabling three or four channels slowed the risetime measurement due distortion of the leading edge caused by undersampling.

Thank you!

I have one other question. My new DS1054Z came with a certificate claiming it had been calibrated using a Fluke 9500B Oscilloscope Calibrator. I'm nor sure what calibration means for a digital scope, but do you have any thoughts on whether the frequency range "hack" changes the calibration of the instrument?

[olewales]

I've got mine today. First impression: this thing is DENSE. I would never expect it to weigh as much as it does. Thanks to this it does not slide around the bench easily. Screen is very nice but viewing angles are definitely "optimized" to look at it from above . I didn't own an oscilloscope previously but I've used DS1052E occasionally and resolution-wise its like comparing day to night.

Protocol decoders have somewhat limited use but I am very happy about how responsive I2C trigger is to parameter changes. This makes it viable solution to do quick bus scan for addresses in use.

Included probes also feel quite good. I've already managed to puncture my finger with it so I guess they are reasonably sharp.

After some more play-around I'll probably attempt BW upgrade. Is it worth doing a before/after comparison on few Mhz square wave generated by MCU? Will the difference be noticeable?

[crossfireprod]

Has anybody seen / heard anything regarding when TEquipment will have these back in stock?

Start a quick chat with them, it is easy and they'll let you know!

TEquipment is saying end of October, for anybody else interested.
This is gonna be a long month to wait...

[ragerino]

I'm wondering if the waveform generator from the DS1000Z-S versions can be added by adding the two bnc connectors.
Here's a teardown video of a DS1000Z -> http://youtu.be/xMPPuAOoD8c?t=1m15s

[Rory]

I'm wondering if the waveform generator from the DS1000Z-S versions can be added by adding the two bnc connectors.
Here's a teardown video of a DS1000Z -> http://youtu.be/xMPPuAOoD8c?t=1m15s
[/quote

What about the Source button on the front panel?

[olewales]

I'm wondering if the waveform generator from the DS1000Z-S versions can be added by adding the two bnc connectors.
Here's a teardown video of a DS1000Z -> http://youtu.be/xMPPuAOoD8c?t=1m15s

Unlikely. Fitting DACs to all units would not be very cost efficient. Also, there is a cutout on the board in place where gen BNCs would normally go so they are either on separate board in ds1000z-s or the main board is different.

[Mark_O]

The actual -3 dB point is about 133 MHz using a leveled signal generator.

Thanks for that. 

Did you happen to notice how far out the -10dB or -20db points were?  I'm curious about how fast the falloff is, since in 4-channel mode, the extended BW makes things pretty dicey (aka, probable aliasing).  That would not be an issue, with it's original bandwidth.

In other words, if I had one, I think I'd be more likely to bump it to a 1074z model, instead of 1104z.

ADDED:  that's assuming I was going to be using it in 4-channel mode a lot.  Which I probably would be.