Rigol MSO7000 Unboxing & First Impressions

[rsjsouza]

What is funny is that LeCroy is not competitive in this range at all to have such attitude. The bottom range WaveAce is terrible and several reports mention the Wavesurfer 3000 is quite subpar.

[nctnico]

What is funny is that LeCroy is not competitive in this range at all to have such attitude. The bottom range WaveAce is terrible and several reports mention the Wavesurfer 3000 is quite subpar.

Ofcourse I would have taken the Wavesurfer 3000 for a test drive but I don't want to spend time on that before agreeing on the price. Based on Jportici's experience with the Wavesurfer 3000 I probably wouldn't have bought it. IMHO the R&S RTM3000 is the oscilloscope to beat in the price bracket the DSO7000 is positioned.

[2N3055]

Ofcourse I would have taken the Wavesurfer 3000 for a test drive but I don't want to spend time on that before agreeing on the price. Based on Jportici's experience with the Wavesurfer 3000 I probably wouldn't have bought it. IMHO the R&S RTM3000 is the oscilloscope to beat in the price bracket the DSO7000 is positioned.

Wavesurfer is nice but is not excellent in anything. It doesn't have Peak detect mode, it has sample memory depth that is nor small nor big, it has MSO but it is quite slow compared to even Rigols...
It has WaveScan (that is fantastic) but it is crippled to be just a little better than good search.. And it is quite slowish when you enable more stuff.
It is deliberately crippled not interfere with sales of their mid range products.

RS RTM3000 ticks many right boxes (that is why I was asking for a quote), but their pricing is still ridiculous. Actually, they started to be more reasonable on software options, but bandwidth is still way overpriced. 1GHz scope for 18000€ ?  100->350 MHZ upgrade 4000 € ? 100->500 MHZ upgrade 6700€ ? If upgrade to 500 MHz was 1500-2000€, then I would buy 200 MH scope now (it is in my budget) and upgrade to 500MHz in few months..  6700€ pretty much guarantees I will never buy it.

And if the pricing was like that they would fly of the shelves...

I still might buy 200MHz +all options for mixed signal work, and for 2000 € used 1 GHz scope.   

[nctnico]

I still might buy 200MHz +all options for mixed signal work, and for 2000 € used 1 GHz scope.

That is not a bad idea. I have the 1GHz RTM3004 on my bench but for looking at signals in picosecond territory I'm using an Agilent 54845. The latter goes to 100ps/div while the RTM3000 stops at 500ps/div.

[rsjsouza]

Ofcourse I would have taken the Wavesurfer 3000 for a test drive but I don't want to spend time on that before agreeing on the price. Based on Jportici's experience with the Wavesurfer 3000 I probably wouldn't have bought it. IMHO the R&S RTM3000 is the oscilloscope to beat in the price bracket the DSO7000 is positioned.

I can't necessarily understand the rep's attitude in this case; to me it smells like he did not believe at all in the customer's expertise and tried to pull a realtor's attitude: show something wonderfully irresistible only to try to take advantage of the awe of the customer (quite childish IMHO). Perhaps that is what Sinisa's rant talks about. Regarding the oscilloscope itself, JPortici's review is what I remember as well.

I still might buy 200MHz +all options for mixed signal work, and for 2000 € used 1 GHz scope.   

I don't know about Croatia's market, but here in test gear haven this money buys you quite a decent used oscilloscope.

[iMo]

I don't know about Croatia's market, but here in test gear haven this money buys you quite a decent used oscilloscope.

Europe is pretty different - definitely not the test gear heaven..

[2N3055]

I can't necessarily understand the rep's attitude in this case; to me it smells like he did not believe at all in the customer's expertise and tried to pull a realtor's attitude: show something wonderfully irresistible only to try to take advantage of the awe of the customer (quite childish IMHO). Perhaps that is what Sinisa's rant talks about. Regarding the oscilloscope itself, JPortici's review is what I remember as well.

I apologize to all, it is more like me complaining and sharing  it with my fellows that understand my pain .... :-)))

I don't know about Croatia's market, but here in test gear haven this money buys you quite a decent used oscilloscope.

In EU there is no developed market for used T&M equipment, and in CRO it is nonexistent whatsoever..

Regards,

[nctnico]

I don't know about Croatia's market, but here in test gear haven this money buys you quite a decent used oscilloscope.

Europe is pretty different - definitely not the test gear heaven..

True but good deals can be found on Ebay even with shipping costs and VAT. I've bought equipment and parts from allover the world.

[Dave Turner]

The inbuilt sig gen looks identical to the one on the Rigol DS1074Z. Max 25MHz sine & 15MHZ square waves.

You'd have thought that for a 500MHz scope costing in excess of £10,000 when fully upgraded Rigol would have taken the opportunity to improve the sig gen too, say to 100MHz sine wave; or is that too much like common sense?

[2N3055]

The inbuilt sig gen looks identical to the one on the Rigol DS1074Z. Max 25MHz sine & 15MHZ square waves.

You'd have thought that for a 500MHz scope costing in excess of £10,000 when fully upgraded Rigol would have taken the opportunity to improve the sig gen too, say to 100MHz sine wave; or is that too much like common sense?

Most of the competition is not better even on 18000USD scopes. Keysight MSOX-3104T - up to 20 MHz, R&S RTM3000 - up to 25 MHz, LecCroy Wavesurfer 3000 up to 25 MHz...
Only Tek MDO 3000/4000 go to 50Mhz... None of them go to 100MHz.
Siggen on a scope is not a full instrument, it's more like a supplementary function, to give a handy basic signal source that is right there. Actually, 2 ch on Rigol is more useful than higher than 25 MHz frequencies..

[1anX]

Maybe Rigol Australia should get this unit back from Dave and give it to someone who actually wants to test it sometime this year 

Anyone found a comprehensive third party online review of this scope yet?

[MrW0lf]

Maybe Rigol Australia should get this unit back from Dave and give it to someone who actually wants to test it sometime this year 

Anyone found a comprehensive third party online review of this scope yet?

And instead of just feeling the knobs someone might run real test for a change. Extend timebase to say 500ms (default test max 5ms), and much sharper edge (~2ns) or Arduino version of test. They claim full memory (guess 500Mpts? then) measurements, and in real time. Something thought to be impossible and even unneeded by some not long ago...

[1anX]

Maybe Rigol Australia should get this unit back from Dave and give it to someone who actually wants to test it sometime this year 

Anyone found a comprehensive third party online review of this scope yet?

Just went over to EEVBlog2 and wouldn't you know Dave is showing a video edit with the Rigol scope in question getting the teardown treatment!

Maybe sometime soon we will have a meaningful review of Rigol's new scope 

[Fungus]

Just went over to EEVBlog2 and wouldn't you know Dave is showing a video edit with the Rigol scope in question getting the teardown treatment!

Maybe sometime soon we will have a meaningful review of Rigol's new scope 

Did you see the date on that?

[2N3055]

While I really like tear downs, for both entertainment and educational value, they are no product reviews.
It would be nice to see how it is to use it and how good it is..
But that is a huge job. I don't think we'll see it very soon.

[Hydrawerk]

Dave Jones made a teardown. https://www.flickr.com/photos/eevblog/sets/72157698340312471/with/42115912650/
Tehre are CapXon capacitors. 

[dr.diesel]

Dave Jones made a teardown. https://www.flickr.com/photos/eevblog/sets/72157698340312471/with/42115912650/
Tehre are CapXon capacitors. 

I just replaced a less than 1 year old POE injector with bad CapXon caps today, in a 70F office.

[commongrounder]

Those caps are in the power supply, which was outsourced.  Rigol probably treated it as a module and didn’t spec the components used inside.  It will be interesting to see how many will fail during the three year warranty period.

[Fungus]

Those caps are in the power supply, which was outsourced.  Rigol probably treated it as a module and didn’t spec the components used inside.  It will be interesting to see how many will fail during the three year warranty period.

They use CapXon in their other 'scopes and I don't see many failing because of that.

[1anX]

[dr.diesel]

Looking forward to a full review, but lots of unanswered questions still:

 - Still software serial decode?
 - Same super crappy encoders like the 4000 series?
 - Laggy UI?
 - Web interface?
 
And most importantly, will it suffer for years with very poor dedication on the firmware side?  Anyone that bought a 4000 or 6000 will be hesitant to purchase this.

[commongrounder]

Those caps are in the power supply, which was outsourced.  Rigol probably treated it as a module and didn’t spec the components used inside.  It will be interesting to see how many will fail during the three year warranty period.

They use CapXon in their other 'scopes and I don't see many failing because of that.

Don’t get me wrong. I didn’t mean the failure comment to be critical.  My Rigol DS4000 scope has a CapXon populated switching supply in it, and it has been working fine for six years.
Also, despite the firmware hassles on the 4000, I am still considering the 7000 series for a possible upgrade.  I, like others, anxiously await a thorough review.

[Fungus]

Interesting that the power supply appears to only put out one voltage and that half the PCB is taken up with voltage converters.

[bitseeker]

It's not unusual, especially with low voltages. Instead of stringing power traces all over, convert it where it's needed.

[PA0PBZ]

It's not unusual, especially with low voltages. Instead of stringing power traces all over, convert it where it's needed.

Exactly, as you can see the thing wants about 10 different voltages, and you don't want to put that all in the PSU. And splitting it between the PSU and main board just doesn't make sense.