Author Topic: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?  (Read 9500 times)

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Offline 45Overload

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Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« on: March 06, 2013, 01:07:16 am »
Decided to try a Rigol Dg1022A/U, even though I hear it has a few annoying glitches.  I've used lots of function generators including the big dollar Agilent ones, and the 1022a will be fine for impromptu  bench use.  Does anyone have a line on where to get actual Rigol service manuals with schematics? 

Thanks!
45O
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2013, 04:20:48 am »
Do you really expect to find any service info on any Chinese gear?
These days you can't even get schematics for big-name stuff.
Reverse engineering is the only option.
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Offline PA4TIM

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2013, 10:23:10 am »
Dream on, Chinise service (manuals)  :-DD
www.pa4tim.nl my collection measurement gear and experiments Also lots of info about network analyse
www.schneiderelectronicsrepair.nl  repair of test and calibration equipment
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Offline 45Overload

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2013, 09:41:30 am »
I'm not sure why the Chinese manufacturers would be MORE difficult than anyone else, unless it is an issue of patent infringements.  As more of these products are sold, we will undoubtedly see any recurrent issues that pop up. Rigol USA will service gear purchased elsewhere, but not under warranty. 

Off the subject is the current USA model 1022 as opposed to the 1022A/U.  They have extended the frequency range of the 1022A/U from 20Meg to 25 Meg.  One interesting spec. is the sine wave THD which they claim is about .2%.  I'm comparing it to previous HP analog generators like the 3312 with .5% THD. 

Theoretically, a sine wave read out of a DSP could be much lower than .2%, but once again it is a matter of extra expense somewhere.  In the case of the digital generators, I suppose we are dealing with clock jitter and noise created in the ROM and D/A converters.  In any case it is now easy to sweep practically any bandwidth without clever range switching circuits.
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2013, 10:09:49 am »
I'm not sure why the Chinese manufacturers would be MORE difficult than anyone else,
Because Chinese companies don't give a toss about after-sales service.
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Online nctnico

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2013, 11:24:00 am »
What do you need a servicemanual for? In many cases the PSU goes bad. A PSU ain't rocket science and with some basic understanding they usually are easy to repair. The next thing that can get damaged are inputs and outputs. On low end equipment these usually consist of standard chips. Again not difficult to troubleshoot. IMHO this covers about 99% of the failures you can expect in equipment.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Online EEVblog

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2013, 11:31:48 am »
I'm not sure why the Chinese manufacturers would be MORE difficult than anyone else

Because a good service manual takes a lot of time and resources to produce.
Ok, one person can do it, but that's one less person you have cracking out new design or units.
The bigger older more reputable companies come from an age where that thing was expected, so many still do it, but the new companies have no such history, hence they see no value in it.

Dave.
 

Online nctnico

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2013, 11:57:06 am »
The service manuals Tektronix has been producing for the last 20 years (or more) only cover adjustments and taking the instrument apart to replace modules. I'm sure Rigol has repair manuals for their equipment but they are probably for internal use only.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Wuerstchenhund

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2013, 09:48:59 pm »
The service manuals Tektronix has been producing for the last 20 years (or more) only cover adjustments and taking the instrument apart to replace modules.

The service manuals from HP/Agilent and LeCroy (can't remember the last time I read a Tek SM) usually contain not only a thorough description how the device works internally, they also come with component lists so when something goes up in smoke there's a way to find out what it was without having to disassemble another unit. LeCroy even goes as far as including full schematics of all PCBs, including the PSU. Again, all accompanied by extensive components lists.

Quote
I'm sure Rigol has repair manuals for their equipment but they are probably for internal use only.

I'm not so sure about that. Rigol certainly has schematics but somehow I doubt they have proper service manuals, especially considering that they have no real support network to speak off.
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alm

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2013, 10:30:24 pm »
The service manuals from HP/Agilent and LeCroy (can't remember the last time I read a Tek SM) usually contain not only a thorough description how the device works internally, they also come with component lists so when something goes up in smoke there's a way to find out what it was without having to disassemble another unit. LeCroy even goes as far as including full schematics of all PCBs, including the PSU. Again, all accompanied by extensive components lists.
Is this true for recent designs? Old Tek service manuals also had excellent service manuals. The service manual for the Agilent DSO-X 2000/3000 series only contain performance verification, calibration and module level troubleshooting information. No theory of operation or any component level information.
 

Offline Bored@Work

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2013, 11:32:56 pm »
Maybe Rigol had to deliver something to Agilent when Agilent started to sell Rigol oscilloscopes under their own brand. But on the other hand, the stuff is so cheap, why describe detailed repair procedures? A simple pictogram how to correctly throw the thing in the trash might be enough.
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Offline amyk

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2013, 12:17:55 am »
A company that grinds the part numbers off its chips is very unlikely to give you a schematic.
 

Offline s_lannan

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2013, 11:37:58 am »
Do they even have service agents in countries other than China? If there was a service manual, would it be in a language other than Chinese?

 :-DD
 

Offline Bored@Work

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2013, 12:52:52 pm »
Do they even have service agents in countries other than China? If there was a service manual, would it be in a language other than Chinese?

Rigol now has a few persons in Europe. Not many. The initial announcement back then talked about one technician for the whole of Europe. It didn't say if the technician was supposed to do repairs or only application-level support.

Maybe they now have more than one technician. At least in the past Rigol Europe must have been extremely short of people. Mike reported he had to wait for the shipment of a Rigol instrument, because the warehouse guy at Rigol Europe was on holiday.

Rigol has a distributor in the US, making a big fuss about their service. It is anyone's guess if and to what level they do repairs.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2013, 12:55:22 pm by Bored@Work »
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Online nctnico

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #14 on: March 10, 2013, 01:31:18 pm »
The service manuals Tektronix has been producing for the last 20 years (or more) only cover adjustments and taking the instrument apart to replace modules.

The service manuals from HP/Agilent and LeCroy (can't remember the last time I read a Tek SM) usually contain not only a thorough description how the device works internally, they also come with component lists so when something goes up in smoke there's a way to find out what it was without having to disassemble another unit. LeCroy even goes as far as including full schematics of all PCBs, including the PSU. Again, all accompanied by extensive components lists.
You'd better download some more recent Agilent service manuals. Its module level if you are lucky:
http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/54139-97014.pdf
http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/54709-97013.pdf
Quote
Quote
I'm sure Rigol has repair manuals for their equipment but they are probably for internal use only.

I'm not so sure about that. Rigol certainly has schematics but somehow I doubt they have proper service manuals, especially considering that they have no real support network to speak off.
You keep repeating that... If you buy it from a local Rigol seller (which aren't hard to find) then that is where the support comes from. Let them talk to the Chinese.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Wuerstchenhund

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2013, 08:43:52 pm »
You'd better download some more recent Agilent service manuals. Its module level if you are lucky:
http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/54139-97014.pdf
http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/54709-97013.pdf

Well, the first one if for the dreadful Rigol 1000 Series scopes that Agilent has relabelled, so well done for picking a 'service manual' for an item made by the company that has been criticized for the lack of proper service manuals. Since all it does is to say that if there are problems with the scope then send it in for repair it's exactly the level of guidance I'd expect from companies like Rigol.

And the one for the DSO-X4000 (which has actually been developed by Agilent) may not contain extensive components list or be as detailed as for older gear but it still contains board drawings and test/adjustment and failure localisation procedures, which, considering that this is a low end scope with a single highly integrated PCB (with many components you can't buy individually anyways), means the manual still contains lots of useful information for trouble shooting.

It's clear that, with higher integration, there will be less things that can be fixed without access to special tools and components. But there's still a difference between at least giving some flow charts and test procedures to isolate where a fault might be located than spending several pages without actual technical content just to say 'if broken send it in for repair'. So you've actually proven my point (that the manuals from the big names like Agilent are much more useful than what comes out from Chinese vendors like Rigol).

Quote
You keep repeating that... If you buy it from a local Rigol seller (which aren't hard to find) then that is where the support comes from. Let them talk to the Chinese.

So your local Rigol seller actually fixes your scope (of course he has all the equipment, doesn't he?), writes new firmware or produces proper documentation? Certainly not.

And this aside from the fact that your reseller may not be there any more in a month or two (especially in today's economical climate that's far from impossible). And then?

You keep on banging about your Rigol seller but quite frankly, if you believe that this equates proper manufacturer support then I'm sorry but you're delusional.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2013, 09:24:14 pm by Wuerstchenhund »
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Offline ted572

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2014, 08:15:44 am »
Here you will find some Rigol Service Manuals.  Get them now before they are gone!

  DM3051,2,4; 3061,2,4 Series Service Guide:
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=10&ved=0CF4QFjAJ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.produktinfo.conrad.com%2Fdatenblaetter%2F100000-124999%2F123957-an-01-en-ServiceGuide_RIGOL_DM3051.pdf&ei=-phNU__VOtSosQSWnYG4DQ&usg=AFQjCNGd3FqpAfrmVXCuTmgOfN03OnwRLQ&bvm=bv.64764171,d.cWc

  DM3058 Service Guide:
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCgQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rigol.com%2Fdownload%2FOversea%2FDMM%2FServiceGuide%2FDM3058_ServiceGuide_EN.pdf&ei=ZZZNU7fxJqTJsQSe_YC4BQ&usg=AFQjCNGAkMteojPEsviFddVcqgr_qoPTnw&bvm=bv.64764171,d.cWc
 
  Rigol DM3068 Service Guide:
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CC4QFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rigol.com%2Fdownload%2FOversea%2FDMM%2FServiceGuide%2FDM3068_ServiceGuide_EN.pdf&ei=-phNU__VOtSosQSWnYG4DQ&usg=AFQjCNEaoMvO2uKGItgAwuemAm0EdkiKcQ&bvm=bv.64764171,d.cWc

  DS1000D,E Series Service Guide:
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CDMQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mikrocontroller.net%2Fattachment%2F112136%2FService_Guide_DS1000E.pdf&ei=Aq5NU57CIPTMsQSv4YGQBQ&usg=AFQjCNEr2Tkmg5DjDzHhslv1nkpFicqHcA&bvm=bv.64764171,d.cWc

  DS4000 Service Manual:
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=9&ved=0CFkQFjAI&url=http%3A%2F%2Frigol.avotronics.co.uk%2Fdownload%2FDS4000%2FDocuments%2FDS4000%2520Service%2520Manual.pdf&ei=-phNU__VOtSosQSWnYG4DQ&usg=AFQjCNGG8ND58T0FzzACkVUaMCEQ6eF6tg&bvm=bv.64764171,d.cWc

    Cheers, Ted572
« Last Edit: April 16, 2014, 01:42:44 pm by ted572 »
 

Offline mrflibble

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #17 on: April 16, 2014, 10:51:19 am »
You might want to edit those google infested urls and replace them with the actual urls. :)

Example for your first link: http://www.produktinfo.conrad.com/datenblaetter/100000-124999/123957-an-01-en-ServiceGuide_RIGOL_DM3051.pdf

As for get them while they're gone, if that is a concern you can download them and add them as an attachement to your post.

 


Online edavid

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #19 on: April 16, 2014, 11:02:03 am »
You might want to edit those google infested urls and replace them with the actual urls. :)

Example for your first link: http://www.produktinfo.conrad.com/datenblaetter/100000-124999/123957-an-01-en-ServiceGuide_RIGOL_DM3051.pdf

This Firefox extension is helpful: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/google-search-link-fix/
 

Offline AndersAnd

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #20 on: April 16, 2014, 05:47:29 pm »
These Rigol Service Guides are also hosted at the website of EEVblog member ve7xen:
http://gotroot.ca/rigol/service%20manuals/
Quote
123957-an-01-en-ServiceGuide_RIGOL_DM3051.pdf   12-Oct-2009 03:37    2.8M   
DM3058_ServiceGuide_EN.pdf   14-Mar-2011 02:42    2.9M   
DM3068_ServiceGuide_EN.pdf   14-Mar-2011 02:38    2.2M   
DS4000 Service Manual.pdf   17-Jan-2014 02:34    1.3M   
Service_Guide_DS1000E.pdf   08-Jun-2011 19:35    1.7M   
« Last Edit: April 16, 2014, 05:58:09 pm by AndersAnd »
 

Offline amyk

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Re: Rigol Service Manuals - Where to find?
« Reply #21 on: April 16, 2014, 10:28:08 pm »
As expected, not much more than how to take it apart and perform basic tests.

 


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