Siglent SDS1202X-E compensation issue (and other manufacturers ?)

[StillTrying]

I wonder how this one's getting on, same country and Amazon as ian.ameline.

To add to the context, I ordered a SDS1202x-e from amazon.ca after confirming via chat that all in stock were supposed to be post fix with BB serial numbers.  I received a unit with the fix with BB serial number.
...
I was on the fence and might have returned it anyway when the large horizontal control knob seized up on Friday. 
Amazon is shipping a replacement so I will see when it arrives.

[CustomEngineerer]

Funny just got tracking info from MegaDepot, and shipping is out of Ohio, pretty sure it’s been dropshiped from Siglent, we shall see what shows up.
 

Pretty sure that is exactly the case. At least it should mean that you should get one of the newer serial numbers since more than likely coming straight from Siglent.

[djadeski]

Just catching up on the thread now as I have been traveling for work.  As an update I too ended up getting a bad unit again with BA serial number.

I returned it to amazon and didn't bother with a third unit - took a refund. Not sure what I will do now in terms of another vendor or see what Siglent does.

-dave

[tautech]

Just catching up on the thread now as I have been traveling for work.  As an update I too ended up getting a bad unit again with BA serial number.

I returned it to amazon and didn't bother with a third unit - took a refund. Not sure what I will do now in terms of another vendor or see what Siglent does.

-dave

Dave, Saelig is very aware of this issue as it was bought to their attention a while back in this thread. Their list price is the same as everyone else and for EEVblog members they offer a 6% discount that you can ask for the code to use in their online checkout. Discount thread in this board.
However you should still contact them to ensure they dispatch a SN# BB unit.
http://www.saelig.com/siglent-sdsx-series/sds1202x-e.htm

[Muttley Snickers]

Just a quick one, is the serial number for this series also displayed internally on the system information screen ?.

[rf-loop]

Just a quick one, is the serial number for this series also displayed internally on the system information screen ?.

Yes.
Serial number is:
- product label outside of the factory carton. (every seller can see this label without opening carton. Also factory shipping
  carton what include 4pcs scopes have every individual scope label outside of this carton.
- serial number label bacside oscilloscope.
- oscilloscope utility - info display (FW version, FPGA version, HW version, serial number, boot counter
- printed in factory calibration certificate

[N0NB]

Just a quick one, is the serial number for this series also displayed internally on the system information screen ?.

Yes.
Serial number is:
- product label outside of the factory carton. (every seller can see this label without opening carton. Also factory shipping
  carton what include 4pcs scopes have every individual scope label outside of this carton.

Here in the USA, at least, the BA scope I received did NOT have a label on the outside of the box with the model/serial number that I could find.

The BB unit I just received does indeed have a label with the model/serial number on the outside on one end of the box .
 

- serial number label bacside oscilloscope.
- oscilloscope utility - info display (FW version, FPGA version, HW version, serial number, boot counter
- printed in factory calibration certificate

Agreed.

[tautech]

Here in the USA, at least, the BA scope I received did NOT have a label on the outside of the box with the model/serial number that I could find.

Something fishy going on here. 

Siglent products have always had labels with model, SN# etc on the outside of the box, without exception !

When double boxed, no, but the inner box.....yes, always !

[Diabolo]

Hello,

My box has the serial number on an outdoor label.
I bought in the 1st SDS1202X-E sold.

Diabolo

[mr.fabe]

Here in the USA, at least, the BA scope I received did NOT have a label on the outside of the box with the model/serial number that I could find.

Something fishy going on here. 

Siglent products have always had labels with model, SN# etc on the outside of the box, without exception !

When double boxed, no, but the inner box.....yes, always !

I have a brown cardboard box with the Siglent logo, no inner packaging, three labels (shipping, Amazon barcode, Siglent barcode with 10 character and model number).  No exposed serial number on packaging.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

[rickv14623]

Here in the USA, at least, the BA scope I received did NOT have a label on the outside of the box with the model/serial number that I could find.

Something fishy going on here. 

Siglent products have always had labels with model, SN# etc on the outside of the box, without exception !

When double boxed, no, but the inner box.....yes, always !

I have a brown cardboard box with the Siglent logo, no inner packaging, three labels (shipping, Amazon barcode, Siglent barcode with 10 character and model number).  No exposed serial number on packaging.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

So, where did you buy that one?

[mr.fabe]

Here in the USA, at least, the BA scope I received did NOT have a label on the outside of the box with the model/serial number that I could find.

Something fishy going on here. 

Siglent products have always had labels with model, SN# etc on the outside of the box, without exception !

When double boxed, no, but the inner box.....yes, always !

I have a brown cardboard box with the Siglent logo, no inner packaging, three labels (shipping, Amazon barcode, Siglent barcode with 10 character and model number).  No exposed serial number on packaging.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

So, where did you buy that one?

Amazon.com

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

[rf-loop]

Here in the USA, at least, the BA scope I received did NOT have a label on the outside of the box with the model/serial number that I could find.

Something fishy going on here. 

Siglent products have always had labels with model, SN# etc on the outside of the box, without exception !

When double boxed, no, but the inner box.....yes, always !

I have a brown cardboard box with the Siglent logo, no inner packaging, three labels (shipping, Amazon barcode, Siglent barcode with 10 character and model number).  No exposed serial number on packaging.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

So, where did you buy that one?

Amazon.com

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

I have seen more than just one Siglent original new packages.
Never they have been as this in image what looks like picked up from waste station.

Amazon is what it is...

Is explanation here:
1.
$341.10 Amazon
Used - Like New
Item will come in original packaging.

2.
$341.10 Amazon
Used - Like New
Item will come in original packaging. Packaging will be damaged.

They are recycled items. Just as you return, then these are sold to next victim without any shame. They recycle it so many time that it reach buyer who is too lazy to return.

Even if Amazon tell New, it still may be returned from some previous buyer if they look it can easy sell with claim "New".
Amazon do not have any moral or ethic. Only what matter is they bank account balance what works as moral and ethics handbook.  When I do work least 2 working hour for every single sold scope and many times much more. For example check that scope is not monday morning "lemon" or FW is too old or probe GND spring is missing etc... or if there is example shipping damage. Also never send alone factory carton. Always it is inside outer carton just for avoid shipping damages. Factory carton is part of product, also it need stay in as good condition as possible, least same what it have arrived from manufacturer to me..   But it is also strange they remove serial number off from carton. This is really weird. Exept if Siglent really use different carton label policy for exeptional area as North America.

[mr.fabe]

Just so you know..

The original packaging did not have all the extra tape.  The unit was in a Siglent box, sealed with Siglent security tape, and in excellent condition. Amazon only stuck an address label, and barcode label on.  I reused the box to ship something else and got it back. The point of the picture was to show that the sealed Siglent box from Amazon did not have a "serial number" on the outside of the carton to indicate BA.. , BB.., or whatever.  This unit was new with a calibration certificate dated in August 2017 and received in mid September 2017.  If Siglent now currently ships with the serial number displayed on the packaging, it's a good thing because the vendor we buy from has to know what model they are sending. 

At least the current packaging now matches the quality of service one can expect from the manufacturer at the present time.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

[rf-loop]

Just so you know..

The original packaging did not have all the extra tape.  The unit was in a Siglent box, sealed with Siglent security tape, and in excellent condition. Amazon only stuck an address label, and barcode label on.  I reused the box to ship something else and got it back. The point of the picture was to show that the sealed Siglent box from Amazon did not have a "serial number" on the outside of the carton to indicate BA.. , BB.., or whatever.  This unit was new with a calibration certificate dated in August 2017 and received in mid September 2017.  If Siglent now currently ships with the serial number displayed on the packaging, it's a good thing because the vendor we buy from has to know what model they are sending. 

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

I have co-operated with Siglent several years.
All cartons what arrive from Siglent factory is labeled by product label what include serial number. It is really years ago when situation was some times perhaps different. So, perhaps they use different label policy just for American markets.

Here is image about original genuine siglent factory carton how they are labeled here. (I have edited image so that can not read real serial).

[mr.fabe]

Just so you know..

The original packaging did not have all the extra tape.  The unit was in a Siglent box, sealed with Siglent security tape, and in excellent condition. Amazon only stuck an address label, and barcode label on.  I reused the box to ship something else and got it back. The point of the picture was to show that the sealed Siglent box from Amazon did not have a "serial number" on the outside of the carton to indicate BA.. , BB.., or whatever.  This unit was new with a calibration certificate dated in August 2017 and received in mid September 2017.  If Siglent now currently ships with the serial number displayed on the packaging, it's a good thing because the vendor we buy from has to know what model they are sending. 

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

I have co-operated with Siglent several years.
All cartons what arrive from Siglent factory is labeled by product label what include serial number. It is really years ago when situation was some times perhaps different. So, perhaps they use different label policy just for American markets.

Here is image about original genuine siglent factory carton how they are labeled here. (I have edited image so that can not read real serial).

Thanks for the clarification.  At least it makes it clear for potential buyers that the labels should have the serial number displayed on the exterior packaging.  That definitely adds to the premise that Siglent USA is dumping the old units to unsuspecting buyers since serial number is now displayed.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

[tautech]

Here is image about original genuine Siglent factory carton how they are labeled here.

And here and 1 unit I got from HK many years ago, same.
They have always been that way.

Labeled only on one end but early/old units had a different style label to what we see today but still with model #, SN# and barcode. Old boxes were marked in blue ink not the black we see today.

[josip]

Here is image about original genuine siglent factory carton how they are labeled here. (I have edited image so that can not read real serial).

My BB unit from welectron arrived in identical box

[rf-loop]

Some times it is also good to differentiate what we like and then what are specifications and then what all can meet specifications. (bolded and underlined for clarify confusions what I mean and for give some direction how to read next things.)

If look tightly specifications as they are even these individual manufacturing lots what have this "we do not like this - issue" they do not violate specifications if we look specifications tightly as they are. Of course if we look 1kHz good shape square wave and how scopes typically show it and what kind of display is "default in mind". But, if we draw all worst cases what still do not violate specifications we can surprice.

Here is some kind of draw about level specifications.



Red marked area is accepted error area aka error window. Green line (3 div up from center) is this imaghe reference level "0 dB")

I have not draw these worst case square wave shapes what still meet specs. But everyone can imagine it quite easy as long as he remember what is square wave or what ever other wave than pure sine wave. In mind try dfraw worst case square where what ever harmonic sinewave is affected how ever but inside specification max errors. 

Who want - home exercise: draw worst case square wave shape what meet specification. Use example 1 or 10k square and up to 11th or even 13th harmonics (also use right level of harmonics and then every harmonic affected maximal level errors..  note also that level errors are not specified so that freq rtesponse  is continuously and nicely only decaying over freq range. (remember kleep enough rest breaks and also some fun)

Of course it is not at all what we like and what is our expected square shape in mind based some experience and simplest school books.
Who can accept 1kHz square wave what is worst case and still inside specifications. I do not like and I believe most do not like but claiming they are out of specs is just misunderstanding. Of course, I can always say I do not like this and that - I do not accept this and that. But I can not claim there is violation of the limits of the specifications.
Who is responsible (in law) if some people do not like or accept some things with his own standards in mind what he individual people accept or not, like or not like.

Add: It looks like some peoples can not read so I want pop up this to these  eyes who read unconcentrated.
For build better reputation or keep even allready earned reputation I think it is still wise Siglent handle this case very differently and do all for every customer who do not like this feature and can not accept it. Even if they can still win in law room do they violate or not promised specification. (yes they win if some want try). 

Back to right road.  Add: <<== (and for avoid more misunderstoodings: this was for Siglent as connected to just previous two sentences)

[mr.fabe]

Some times it is also good to differentiate what we like and then what are specifications and then what all can meet specifications.

If look tightly specifications as they are even these individual manufacturing lots what have this "we do not like this - issue" they do not violate specifications if we look specifications tightly as they are. Of course if we look 1kHz good shape square wave and how scopes typically show it and what kind of display is "default in mind". But, if we draw all worst cases what still do not violate specifications we can surprice.

Here is some kind of draw about level specifications.



Red marked area is accepted error area aka error window. Green line (3 div up from center) is this imaghe reference level "0 dB")

I have not draw these worst case square wave shapes what still meet specs. But everyone can imagine it quite easy as long as he remember what is square wave or what ever other wave than pure sine wave. In mind try dfraw worst case square where what ever harmonic sinewave is affected how ever but inside specification max errors. 

Who want - home exercise: draw worst case square wave shape what meet specification. Use example 1 or 10k square and up to 11th or even 13th harmonics (also use right level of harmonics and then every harmonic affected maximal level errors..  note also that level errors are not specified so that freq rtesponse  is continuously and nicely only decaying over freq range. (remember kleep enough rest breaks and also some fun)

Of course it is not at all what we like and what is our expected square shape in mind based some experience and simplest school books.
Who can accept 1kHz square wave what is worst case and still inside specifications. I do not like and I believe most do not like but claiming they are out of specs is just misunderstanding. Of course, I can always say I do not like this and that - I do not accept this and that. But I can not claim there is violation of the limits of the specifications.
Who is responsible if some people do not like or accept some things with his own standards in mind what he individual people accept or not, like or not like.

For build better reputation or keep even allready earned reputation I think it is still wise Siglent handle this case very differently and do all for every customer who do not like this feature and can not accept it. Even if they can still win in law room do they violate or not promised specification. (yes they win if some want try). 

Back to right road.

You provide a lot of technical feedback on Siglent products.  Are you a distributor or otherwise affiliated with them, i.e., product tester, receive demos, etc?

Just wondering because although I enjoy your analysis on equipment, I only see your focus on the Siglent line and your the only one who tolls the Siglent position.  In fact checking the few hundred posts you made in the past involves Siglent.  Strange to say that my level of acceptance is outside the manufacturing tolerances.  Me and maybe everyone else affected by the defective units.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

[chipss]

Regardless of tolerance is your mind, not placing 2 caps that were in the scope pre production, that makes the scope have known issues, the point about tolerance is mute due to the fix in B.B. serial number units anyway, tying to sweep it under the rug like you are attempting to do. Will not work, recall and rework the goof up, that is the only way to save face on this issue, SIGLENT screwed up twice here, one not installing the two caps, two not recalling early units to fix them, this will only hurt Siglent sales of this unit, if I receive a ba serial number it will be sent back, it is clearly defective, we all know this, your talk of tolerances will not change that, not today, not tomorrow, and clearly you will continue to loose confidence and sales for the SIGLENT brand, bad move SIGLENT, good news is many other brands can easily take your place.

[rf-loop]

Regardless of tolerance is your mind, not placing 2 caps that were in the scope pre production, that makes the scope have known issues, the point about tolerance is mute due to the fix in B.B. serial number units anyway, tying to sweep it under the rug like you are attempting to do. Will not work, recall and rework the goof up, that is the only way to save face on this issue, SIGLENT screwed up twice here, one not installing the two caps, two not recalling early units to fix them, this will only hurt Siglent sales of this unit, if I receive a ba serial number it will be sent back, it is clearly defective, we all know this, your talk of tolerances will not change that, not today, not tomorrow, and clearly you will continue to loose confidence and sales for the SIGLENT brand, bad move SIGLENT, good news is many other brands can easily take your place.

So you did not read what I told or is it better say  you did not understand what I told and some things  there in text many times.
And even more, also some my other comments about this issue time ago. 

[Gandalf_Sr]

...recall and rework the goof up...

Steve (aka Siglent America) says that it's not a problem, he says that the 'BA' scopes are in spec and that it's OK that users have to run probe compensation every time they change vertical range.  Therefore, it's not a "goof up", therefore Siglent won't "recall and rework"...

I would have been happy having mine fixed but, in the end, I sent mine back for a refund.

 

[rf-loop]

...recall and rework the goof up...

Steve (aka Siglent America) says that it's not a problem, he says that the 'BA' scopes are in spec and that it's OK that users have to run probe compensation every time they change vertical range.  Therefore, it's not a "goof up", therefore Siglent won't "recall and rework"...

I would have been happy having mine fixed but, in the end, I sent mine back for a refund.

 

If they are stupid enough to not handle this right way. Only what can teach them is money - as you also just did. Some times money is only commader what can talk, and this is it. I can ask. How much can earn with good or exellent reputation. Nearly without limits. Oh... how much this reputation cost I want also this. Sorry Siglent America but there is not shop where you can go and buy exellent reputation.

[chipss]

Received B.B. sn# from MegaDepot, was indeed dropshiped from SIGLENT.
Still....    excuses for an epic fail, are just that, feel bad for ba owners.
I can read just fine. And I know bs is bs, it’s that simple , it is what it is.
Seems you can’t read, why are B.B. units equipped with the missing caps if ba scopes are um in spec?
Your point makes no sense at all, and is proven by rework letters and sending caps out, and how B.B. units differ, it’s that simple!