Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[Specmaster]

Surely, wheres there hassle there's brass 

[bd139]

You must be unaware of the concept of "slack" as described by the church of subgenius. Crudely defined as "something for nothing"

The function of slack is approximately: slack = return / effort

Too much on the denominator reduces slack. Work is usually about maximising return. I am about maximising slack. Slack is roughly "efficiency" but slack is more focused on decreasing effort than maximising return.  If you're asked to come in and evaluate something for a fee (£500 smackers in the case above) and you walk away having written a couple of emails saying you won't touch it with a barge pole, the ratio is maintained as the denominator is close to zero.

[mnementh]

That's my idea of heaven. A nice messy DC to re-cable.

Apart from one I went to. Lifted a floor panel up and there was 5 inch deep water under it. Ran a fucking mile, especially as no one who worked there claimed to realise that it was the case. Must have been like it for a while.

Just chuck s bilge pump in and switch it on, soon lower the water line.

That's step 1. It's step 2 and above I didn't fancy. Consider schrodinger's cat. Until you observe the state of the cat, you don't know if it's dead or alive. I'd rather someone else opened this box as it's a whole load less hassle for me

Since Harvey pummeled us, that's mostly all I've been doing.

I get the fun part... documenting the damage (mostly a matter of confirming and photographing the high-water line, and inventorying what gear/cabling was below it) then sending that all back to some management-type on a spreadsheet. From there they decide whether to have local talent repair what needs to be repaired, or whether to call in one of the national HazMat service providers. You can tell from the nature of the information they want which way they WANT to proceed; some deployments they clearly seem to feel only a reterm/refresh is necessary.

I think it's more a matter of "Can we shove the really expensive work off to another quarter?" vs "Is this piece of our network mission critical?"

You must be unaware of the concept of "slack" as described by the church of subgenius. Crudely defined as "something for nothing"

The function of slack is approximately: slack = return / effort

Too much on the denominator reduces slack. Work is usually about maximising return. I am about maximising slack. Slack is roughly "efficiency" but slack is more focused on decreasing effort than maximising return.  If you're asked to come in and evaluate something for a fee (£500 smackers in the case above) and you walk away having written a couple of emails saying you won't touch it with a barge pole, the ratio is maintained as the denominator is close to zero.

Yeah, that's the great part for me. I DON'T PULL CABLE, PERIOD. (your "slack factor" at work IRL) I'm to old and too fat for that crap; pulling cable is a young man's game. I'll reterm/cable manage a DC all day long; and while I'm at it I'll build a spreadsheet of what new drops need to be run BY SOMEONE ELSE.

That's why I refer to these service calls as a HALO drop; because the strategy is the same. Single objective (most often intel than actual repair), fixed extraction point, do all you can to reach the objective by the extraction point because everything beyond that extraction point is on a cost/plus basis and the buyer is already paying a premium for the intel.

Once you reach the extraction point, submit your paperwork and go home with a clear conscience knowing you've done your bit for god & country. 


mnem
"Good Night, and may your god go with you." ~ Dave Allen

[bd139]

That's my idea of heaven. A nice messy DC to re-cable.

Apart from one I went to. Lifted a floor panel up and there was 5 inch deep water under it. Ran a fucking mile, especially as no one who worked there claimed to realise that it was the case. Must have been like it for a while.

Just chuck s bilge pump in and switch it on, soon lower the water line.

That's step 1. It's step 2 and above I didn't fancy. Consider schrodinger's cat. Until you observe the state of the cat, you don't know if it's dead or alive. I'd rather someone else opened this box as it's a whole load less hassle for me

Since Harvey pummeled us, that's mostly all I've been doing.

I get the fun part... documenting the damage (mostly a matter of confirming and photographing the high-water line, and inventorying what gear/cabling was below it) then sending that all back to some management-type on a spreadsheet. From there they decide whether to have local talent repair what needs to be repaired, or whether to call in one of the national HazMat service providers. You can tell from the nature of the information they want which way they WANT to proceed; some deployments they clearly seem to feel only a reterm/refresh is necessary.

I think it's more a matter of "Can we shove the really expensive work off to another quarter?" vs "Is this piece of our network mission critical?"

Ah yes you have natural disasters there. Here, about once a year it gets a bit colder and later on it gets a bit warmer. Worst weather we had recently knocked a few bins over. Only problem is this seems to have allowed idiots to breed and now we have a dire problem which is simply general incompetence. It is far worse here than every other country on the damn planet. Even Brazilian backwater town is full of less idiots. The only way we've kept the mortality rate down is by (a) letting most unworthy people remove themselves from the gene pool in the 1940-1980 period and (b) introducing so many signs and rules that you can't breath without being fined.

Ergo, while a hurricane won't take out a network, seeing what happens if you put a beer coaster in the DVD drive on a mission critical database server does happen. There's no natural predator either which takes these muppets out. We even have employment laws that make it difficult and costly to get rid of them, and then you'll turn up at McDonalds and served the same fucking beer mat in a burger or something...

You must be unaware of the concept of "slack" as described by the church of subgenius. Crudely defined as "something for nothing"

The function of slack is approximately: slack = return / effort

Too much on the denominator reduces slack. Work is usually about maximising return. I am about maximising slack. Slack is roughly "efficiency" but slack is more focused on decreasing effort than maximising return.  If you're asked to come in and evaluate something for a fee (£500 smackers in the case above) and you walk away having written a couple of emails saying you won't touch it with a barge pole, the ratio is maintained as the denominator is close to zero.

Yeah, that's the great part for me. I DON'T PULL CABLE, PERIOD. (your "slack factor" at work IRL) I'm to old and too fat for that crap; pulling cable is a young man's game. I'll reterm/cable manage a DC all day long; and while I'm at it I'll build a spreadsheet of what new drops need to be run BY SOMEONE ELSE.

That's why I refer to these service calls as a HALO drop; because the strategy is the same. Single objective (most often intel than actual repair), fixed extraction point, do all you can to reach the objective by the extraction point because everything beyond that extraction point is on a cost/plus basis and the buyer is already paying a premium for the intel.

Once you reach the extraction point, submit your paperwork and go home with a clear conscience knowing you've done your bit for god & country. 


mnem
"Good Night, and may your god go with you." ~ Dave Allen

Now that's how to roll 

Incidentally to anyone in the UK, Idiocracy is on this friday at 9PM on I think Film 4. Go watch.

[Specmaster]

mnem
"Good Night, and may your god go with you." ~ Dave Allen

Now he was a seriously funny man, used to love watching him on TV, sometimes I would ache through laughing so much 

[tautech]

mnem
"Good Night, and may your god go with you." ~ Dave Allen

Now he was a seriously funny man, used to love watching him on TV, sometimes I would ache through laughing so much 

Can you remember all the explanations he had for his missing digit ?

Just one was: the way he held a glass of his fav **% tipple and it eventually dissolved his finger ! 

[Specmaster]

Ah yes you have natural disasters there. Here, about once a year it gets a bit colder and later on it gets a bit warmer. Worst weather we had recently knocked a few bins over. Only problem is this seems to have allowed idiots to breed and now we have a dire problem which is simply general incompetence. It is far worse here than every other country on the damn planet. Even Brazilian backwater town is full of less idiots. The only way we've kept the mortality rate down is by (a) letting most unworthy people remove themselves from the gene pool in the 1940-1980 period and (b) introducing so many signs and rules that you can't breath without being fined.

Ergo, while a hurricane won't take out a network, seeing what happens if you put a beer coaster in the DVD drive on a mission critical database server does happen. There's no natural predator either which takes these muppets out. We even have employment laws that make it difficult and costly to get rid of them, and then you'll turn up at McDonalds and served the same fucking beer mat in a burger or something...

Yep, thats why I stopped going to McDonalds because there fucking burgers tasted just like beer mats, yours I reckon. Only problem now is that we no longer have a bloody Burger King either so it KFC shit.

[Specmaster]

mnem
"Good Night, and may your god go with you." ~ Dave Allen

Now he was a seriously funny man, used to love watching him on TV, sometimes I would ache through laughing so much 

Can you remember all the explanations he had for his missing digit ?

Just one was: the way he held a glass of his fav **% tipple and it eventually dissolved his finger ! 

He also used to say that it was worn down because he was always brushing the dust off his suit. 

[bd139]

Ah yes you have natural disasters there. Here, about once a year it gets a bit colder and later on it gets a bit warmer. Worst weather we had recently knocked a few bins over. Only problem is this seems to have allowed idiots to breed and now we have a dire problem which is simply general incompetence. It is far worse here than every other country on the damn planet. Even Brazilian backwater town is full of less idiots. The only way we've kept the mortality rate down is by (a) letting most unworthy people remove themselves from the gene pool in the 1940-1980 period and (b) introducing so many signs and rules that you can't breath without being fined.

Ergo, while a hurricane won't take out a network, seeing what happens if you put a beer coaster in the DVD drive on a mission critical database server does happen. There's no natural predator either which takes these muppets out. We even have employment laws that make it difficult and costly to get rid of them, and then you'll turn up at McDonalds and served the same fucking beer mat in a burger or something...

Yep, thats why I stopped going to McDonalds because there fucking burgers tasted just like beer mats, yours I reckon. Only problem now is that we no longer have a bloody Burger King either so it KFC shit.

That reminds me; was in subway earlier this week and someone came in and asked if they could do an empty footlong sandwich (no meat) with some cheese and mayo in it.  Walked outside and they were emptying a KFC into it. Genius!

[tautech]

mnem
"Good Night, and may your god go with you." ~ Dave Allen

Now he was a seriously funny man, used to love watching him on TV, sometimes I would ache through laughing so much 

Can you remember all the explanations he had for his missing digit ?

Just one was: the way he held a glass of his fav **% tipple and it eventually dissolved his finger ! 

He also used to say that it was worn down because he was always brushing the dust off his suit. 

One I distinctly remember: His dad chopped it off with an axe !

It went something like this:
He was watching dad chop wood and dad spotted him picking his nose.
Stop that boy or I'll chop your finger off !!!

A little while later dad spots him doing it again......PUT YOUR FINGER ON THE BLOCK BOY !

He thought dad would purposely miss his finger and dad thought he would move it. 

[Zeitkind]

Hmmm.. after reading *some* posts here in this thread, I guess I'm at risk... 
Every time an Apple Macintosh (6502 to PPC G5..) was in danger to get trashed, I took the poor one with me. Now I have a Mac-zoo. Some were broken, so I needed tools to repair them - and got myself my first Tek 453, my first "real" multimeter, my second CRO, my third CRO, my first DSO, my sixth DMM...
I just built two new shelves.. just to have enough room for the broken stuff. Still no sure about the Intel Macs that wait outside..

[bitseeker]

My HP 3311A Function Generator miraculously found its way home after being borrowed for 25+ years.

Congrats on your long-lost equipment finding its way home. That doesn't happen often, especially after decades.

He did not remember borrowing it at all, and I only barely remembered the loan. The clincher was the Bourns Knobpot that I had installed some 30 years ago for the DC offset.

That is a really neat multi-turn pot. It's the first time I've seen a Knobpot. I like its altimeter-like display.

[bitseeker]

Hmmm.. after reading *some* posts here in this thread, I guess I'm at risk... 
Every time an Apple Macintosh (6502 to PPC G5..) was in danger to get trashed, I took the poor one with me. Now I have a Mac-zoo. Some were broken, so I needed tools to repair them - and got myself my first Tek 453, my first "real" multimeter, my second CRO, my third CRO, my first DSO, my sixth DMM...
I just built two new shelves.. just to have enough room for the broken stuff. Still no sure about the Intel Macs that wait outside..

Welcome! I see you got your start with PETA and have started to get in DEEP. You fit right in!

[bitseeker]

Here is the Rolls Royce of Bluetooth speakers, you can clearly see the big kick arse woofer along with its mid range and treble drivers on each channel. It weighs a bloody ton, has 3 huge power amps with big heat sinks and the woofer has huge powerful magnet on it too.

Plus it's fun just saying the name, Blaupunkt — with much enthusiasm.

[GreyWoolfe]

Here is the Rolls Royce of Bluetooth speakers, you can clearly see the big kick arse woofer along with its mid range and treble drivers on each channel. It weighs a bloody ton, has 3 huge power amps with big heat sinks and the woofer has huge powerful magnet on it too.

Plus it's fun just saying the name, Blaupunkt — with much enthusiasm.

I knew someone that no matter how he tried, he could never say the name right.  It would always come out as Blaupunk-id.

[mnementh]

Ah yes you have natural disasters there. Here, about once a year it gets a bit colder and later on it gets a bit warmer. Worst weather we had recently knocked a few bins over. Only problem is this seems to have allowed idiots to breed and now we have a dire problem which is simply general incompetence. It is far worse here than every other country on the damn planet. Even Brazilian backwater town is full of less idiots. The only way we've kept the mortality rate down is by (a) letting most unworthy people remove themselves from the gene pool in the 1940-1980 period and (b) introducing so many signs and rules that you can't breath without being fined.

Ergo, while a hurricane won't take out a network, seeing what happens if you put a beer coaster in the DVD drive on a mission critical database server does happen. There's no natural predator either which takes these muppets out. We even have employment laws that make it difficult and costly to get rid of them, and then you'll turn up at McDonalds and served the same fucking beer mat in a burger or something...

Ummm... yeah. Clearly you haven't served in an American corporate coprolite cubicle farm. A dumb look is the norm, and even (especially?!?) management has the IQ of lint. How the heck do you think we got Resident Chump? These imbeciles KEEP voting for the sociopaths who are stealing their children's future and selling their teeth for aquarium filler.

Yeah, that's the great part for me. I DON'T PULL CABLE, PERIOD. (your "slack factor" at work IRL) I'm to old and too fat for that crap; pulling cable is a young man's game. I'll reterm/cable manage a DC all day long; and while I'm at it I'll build a spreadsheet of what new drops need to be run BY SOMEONE ELSE.

That's why I refer to these service calls as a HALO drop; because the strategy is the same. Single objective (most often intel rather than actual repair), fixed extraction point, do all you can to reach the objective by the extraction point because everything beyond that extraction point is on a cost/plus basis and the buyer is already paying a premium for the intel.

Once you reach the extraction point, submit your paperwork and go home with a clear conscience knowing you've done your bit for god & country. 


mnem
"Good Night, and may your god go with you." ~ Dave Allen

Now that's how to roll 

Incidentally to anyone in the UK, Idiocracy is on this friday at 9PM on I think Film 4. Go watch.

It's as good as you can make it on your own here; downside is no health insurance, retirement or vacation pay but what you make for yourself. Even establishing good credit is nearly impossible; "Self-Employed" is looked down upon as even worse than "Unemployed". The system is so broken the only way to get what most folks in civilized nations consider "basic services" is to sell your soul to one corporation or another.

Well, I shouldn't say broken... that suggests an accident or stroke of misfortune, when in fact it is the culmination of a 40-year-long concerted effort by those very corporate entities to undo every aspect of FDR's "New Deal". History just keeps repeating itself; even most of the players are the same as caused our Great Depression a century ago.

I really don't need to watch Idiocracy; I'm living it.

This is the end-game in the hostile takeover of a sovereign nation; "Government of the people, by the people and for the people" has become "Government of the majority underclass, by the corporations for the very wealthy very few".

History will mark these as "The Dark Ages" of the American Empire; I suggest you teach your kids Pinyin Chinese and Spanish.


mnem
"Those who fail to learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat those mistakes. Those who DO learn the lessons of history are doomed to watch helplessly as the dumbasses around them repeat those same mistakes."

[Specmaster]

It's as good as you can make it on your own here; downside is no health insurance, retirement or vacation pay but what you make for yourself. Even establishing good credit is nearly impossible; "Self-Employed" is looked down upon as even worse than "Unemployed". The system is so broken the only way to get what most folks in civilized nations consider "basic services" is to sell your soul to one corporation or another.

Well, I shouldn't say broken... that suggests an accident or stroke of misfortune, when in fact it is the culmination of a 40-year-long concerted effort by those very corporate entities to undo every aspect of FDR's "New Deal". History just keeps repeating itself; even most of the players are the same as caused our Great Depression a century ago.

I really don't need to watch Idiocracy; I'm living it.

This is the end-game in the hostile takeover of a sovereign nation; "Government of the people, by the people and for the people" has become "Government of the majority underclass, by the corporations for the very wealthy very few".

History will mark these as "The Dark Ages" of the American Empire; I suggest you teach your kids Pinyin Chinese and Spanish.


mnem
"Those who fail to learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat those mistakes. Those who DO learn the lessons of history are doomed to watch helplessly as the dumbasses around them repeat those same mistakes."

So its just like living here in the UK, unless you're wealthy or have friends in high places you just become cannon fodder. Everything is let out on either PPP or PFI schemes which looks highly suspiciously like looking after your friends, we seem to have people in power and others trying to get into power who are more interested in number one rather then serving the people and the country which is what they pledge in their manifesto at election times.

Yes we have a NHS which is supposed to be free at the point of delivery but is it? Opticians and dentists are not free entities, I will be seeing a dentist next week and I don't expect to leave the practise without being relieved of something in the order of £50?

We have people dying after calling for an emergency ambulance because they are having to wait up to 4 hours for one to show up because they are all run by private companies under PPP schemes and so profits are the order of the day and we have cities with insufficient ambulance cover, especially when a lot of them are parked outside A&E depts with patients occupying them, waiting to be admitted for treatment.

The Fire service is being cutback all the time despite cities and towns growing all the time, how do they compute that we need less emergency services while the actual risks are growing at an alarming rate. Police forces being chopped and forced into making savings at a time when we have all kinds of worldwide security threats and attacks as well as crime and other factors to take into account and then there are the armed forces, don't get me started on that front, they are rapidly becoming a laughing stock such are the vicious cutbacks they have had and are enduring with even more to come, reminiscent of a TV program we had years ago called Dads Army https://www.comedy.co.uk/tv/dads_army/

With all the global unrest, surely it is more sensible to reinforce the military not take away its teeth.     

As you rightly say "Those who fail to learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat those mistakes. Those who DO learn the lessons of history are doomed to watch helplessly as the dumbasses around them repeat those same mistakes."

[Specmaster]

Ok, back to TEA again, the Blue controller arrived today but sadly the case and power supply are still if the tracking site is to be believed somewhere between China and the UK, which is where its been now for 7 long days and yet it was all ordered at the same time, I have had the 9501 handle assembly delivered already for over a week now and yet that was not ordered at the same time as the rest, but followed a day or two later and it was all in stock at the time of ordering

Tomorrow I collect my TTi TGP110 pulse generator which will join my TF930, I just wish they would stick to a common colour unless the photo is not a true image of the real thing...

EDIT UPDATE. All the TF930's have been taken bar one which is reserved for Mr Scram and an update for you Mr Scram, they are getting the quotes for shipping it to you now, so it shouldn't be much longer.

[xrunner]

So its just like living here in the UK, unless you're wealthy or have friends in high places you just become cannon fodder.

All my friends are in low places. 

[mnementh]

It's as good as you can make it on your own here; downside is no health insurance, retirement or vacation pay but what you make for yourself. Even establishing good credit is nearly impossible; "Self-Employed" is looked down upon as even worse than "Unemployed". The system is so broken the only way to get what most folks in civilized nations consider "basic services" is to sell your soul to one corporation or another.

Well, I shouldn't say broken... that suggests an accident or stroke of misfortune, when in fact it is the culmination of a 40-year-long concerted effort by those very corporate entities to undo every aspect of FDR's "New Deal". History just keeps repeating itself; even most of the players are the same as caused our Great Depression a century ago.

I really don't need to watch Idiocracy; I'm living it.

This is the end-game in the hostile takeover of a sovereign nation; "Government of the people, by the people and for the people" has become "Government of the majority underclass, by the corporations for the very wealthy very few".

History will mark these as "The Dark Ages" of the American Empire; I suggest you teach your kids Pinyin Chinese and Spanish.


mnem
"Those who fail to learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat those mistakes. Those who DO learn the lessons of history are doomed to watch helplessly as the dumbasses around them repeat those same mistakes."

So its just like living here in the UK, unless you're wealthy or have friends in high places you just become cannon fodder. Everything is let out on either PPP or PFI schemes which looks highly suspiciously like looking after your friends, we seem to have people in power and others trying to get into power who are more interested in number one rather then serving the people and the country which is what they pledge in their manifesto at election times.

Yes we have a NHS which is supposed to be free at the point of delivery but is it? Opticians and dentists are not free entities, I will be seeing a dentist next week and I don't expect to leave the practise without being relieved of something in the order of £50?

We have people dying after calling for an emergency ambulance because they are having to wait up to 4 hours for one to show up because they are all run by private companies under PPP schemes and so profits are the order of the day and we have cities with insufficient ambulance cover, especially when a lot of them are parked outside A&E depts with patients occupying them, waiting to be admitted for treatment.

The Fire service is being cutback all the time despite cities and towns growing all the time, how do they compute that we need less emergency services while the actual risks are growing at an alarming rate. Police forces being chopped and forced into making savings at a time when we have all kinds of worldwide security threats and attacks as well as crime and other factors to take into account and then there are the armed forces, don't get me started on that front, they are rapidly becoming a laughing stock such are the vicious cutbacks they have had and are enduring with even more to come, reminiscent of a TV program we had years ago called Dads Army https://www.comedy.co.uk/tv/dads_army/

With all the global unrest, surely it is more sensible to reinforce the military not take away its teeth.     

As you rightly say "Those who fail to learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat those mistakes. Those who DO learn the lessons of history are doomed to watch helplessly as the dumbasses around them repeat those same mistakes."

There is a HUGE difference, I'm afraid.

Medical Care in the US has been turned into a tool for the transfer of wealth upwards; it is so insanely expensive to get any care in a hospital that the average person can't afford routine maintenance, much less an ER visit. I'm over 40 and haven't had a colonoscopy in over 4 years due to no insurance; any hospital visit of any sort starts at $3500 and counts by the minute in hundreds.

My son passed out after stepping out of the shower a week before Thanksgiving; he's had nosebleeds on & off since he was little, and this was another such spell. Fearing the worst, we let the paras take him to the community Methodist Hospital to make sure he could get some blood work in timely fashion to tell us if there was something systemically wrong. Less than 3 hours total including observation, 15 minutes with the doc on rounds and a basic panel of blood work exceeded $10,000.  Even with him on his mother's insurance, our share of that is ~$1400.

"Affordable Health Insurance" is an outright lie; the whole system is rigged to keep you paying into the system for fear of some medical catastrophe but not to actually pay for your care. Most ordinary citizens are paying to some health insurance company money equivalent to (and that rightfully should be paying, but they can't afford) a house note. And once they're paying that, most non-executive salaries pay JUST enough that you can't AFFORD to use your health insurance except for the very few things that come free with it.

So no, there simply is no comparison; here, unless you are owned by some powerful mega-corporation, or you strike the lottery (figuratively or literally) and become independently wealthy, you can pretty much die in a ditch because you damn sure aren't going to be able to pay for health care aside from what can be cured by a bottle of Vicodin and some antibiotics prescribed by a walk-in clinic practitioner at $85/half-hour. No, hospitals don't HAVE TO take care of you anymore; the Hill-Burton act has been shot full of so many holes that you really can pretty much bleed to death on the hospital steps and nobody does a thing. Except hide it from the reporters. 

And then we have to consider our own military-industrial complex; the majority of our GDP (55-70% depending on whom you listen to) goes to support our DOD, which is STILL racking up TRILLIONS in overseas debt to support our neverending War for Oil so a few dozen uber-wealthy oil jizzumillionaires can keep themselves on top of the world economy even though anything that can actually be called oil's already all gone and what remains is just sand mixed with carcinogenic mud.

You worry about your military being weak? Hah. We spend more than the next 13 nations (including you) combined; all those people out there who hate us do so not because we show weakness, but because we're CONSTANTLY sticking our military in the middle of other sovereign nations' internal business. If we were actually doing "humanitarian aid" we would be working with the UN, not on & off being sanctioned by them. WE ARE the cause of most of the global unrest you refer to.

You guys may think you have corruption and incompetence; but yours is just the average run of the mill kind that has evolved over several centuries of natural means. Here, we've had 60 years of outright sociopaths deliberately perfecting the mix; turning our government into a literal deathtrap for the poor.


Cheers, and be glad you still know where both your kidneys are,


mnem
Ow, my spleen!

[djos]

There is a HUGE difference, I'm afraid.

Medical Care in the US has been turned into a tool for the transfer of wealth upwards; it is so insanely expensive to get any care in a hospital that the average person can't afford routine maintenance, much less an ER visit. I'm over 40 and haven't had a colonoscopy in over 4 years due to no insurance; any hospital visit of any sort starts at $3500 and counts by the minute in hundreds.

My son passed out after stepping out of the shower a week before Thanksgiving; he's had nosebleeds on & off since he was little, and this was another such spell. Fearing the worst, we let the paras take him to the community Methodist Hospital to make sure he could get some blood work in timely fashion to tell us if there was something systemically wrong. Less than 3 hours total including observation, 15 minutes with the doc on rounds and a basic panel of blood work exceeded $10,000.  Even with him on his mother's insurance, our share of that is ~$1400.

"Affordable Health Insurance" is an outright lie; the whole system is rigged to keep you paying into the system for fear of some medical catastrophe but not to actually pay for your care. Most ordinary citizens are paying to some health insurance company money equivalent to (and that rightfully should be paying, but they can't afford) a house note. And once they're paying that, most non-executive salaries pay JUST enough that you can't AFFORD to use your health insurance except for the very few things that come free with it.

So no, there simply is no comparison; here, unless you are owned by some powerful mega-corporation, or you strike the lottery (figuratively or literally) and become independently wealthy, you can pretty much die in a ditch because you damn sure aren't going to be able to pay for health care aside from what can be cured by a bottle of Vicodin and some antibiotics prescribed by a walk-in clinic practitioner at $85/half-hour. No, hospitals don't HAVE TO take care of you anymore; the Hill-Burton act has been shot full of so many holes that you really can pretty much bleed to death on the hospital steps and nobody does a thing. Except hide it from the reporters. 

And then we have to consider our own military-industrial complex; the majority of our GDP (55-70% depending on whom you listen to) goes to support our DOD, which is STILL racking up TRILLIONS in overseas debt to support our neverending War for Oil so a few dozen uber-wealthy oil jizzumillionaires can keep themselves on top of the world economy even though anything that can actually be called oil's already all gone and what remains is just sand mixed with carcinogenic mud.

You worry about your military being weak? Hah. We spend more than the next 13 nations (including you) combined; all those people out there who hate us do so not because we show weakness, but because we're CONSTANTLY sticking our military in the middle of other sovereign nations' internal business. If we were actually doing "humanitarian aid" we would be working with the UN, not on & off being sanctioned by them. WE ARE the cause of most of the global unrest you refer to.

You guys may think you have corruption and incompetence; but yours is just the average run of the mill kind that has evolved over several centuries of natural means. Here, we've had 60 years of outright sociopaths deliberately perfecting the mix; turning our government into a literal deathtrap for the poor.


Cheers, and be glad you still know where both your kidneys are,


mnem
Ow, my spleen!

Ouch! 

Unfortunately our Aussie conservatives think the US system is fantastic and are continually trying to erode it and return to the system we had in the 60's were private organisations and their shareholders use ppls poor health to make huge profits. 

[beanflying]

The US idea of user pays and so called 'freedom' comes with social shortcomings unless you have the $$

In the last year my health spend from my own pocket would be less than $100 for a few prescriptions (government subsidised as well). Included in that are all the jabs, pokings, probings and proddings a nearly 50 year old lines up for 

We still generally pay for glasses but opticians visits are generally on the national scheme and dentistry unless you want to wait in line if you are on benefits for the public dentist.

We still do have private health and hospitals but they make up a fraction of the overall in complete reversal to the US.

Still "the lucky country" in so many ways in spite of our politicians

[Specmaster]

There is a HUGE difference, I'm afraid.

Medical Care in the US has been turned into a tool for the transfer of wealth upwards; it is so insanely expensive to get any care in a hospital that the average person can't afford routine maintenance, much less an ER visit. I'm over 40 and haven't had a colonoscopy in over 4 years due to no insurance; any hospital visit of any sort starts at $3500 and counts by the minute in hundreds.

My son passed out after stepping out of the shower a week before Thanksgiving; he's had nosebleeds on & off since he was little, and this was another such spell. Fearing the worst, we let the paras take him to the community Methodist Hospital to make sure he could get some blood work in timely fashion to tell us if there was something systemically wrong. Less than 3 hours total including observation, 15 minutes with the doc on rounds and a basic panel of blood work exceeded $10,000.  Even with him on his mother's insurance, our share of that is ~$1400.

"Affordable Health Insurance" is an outright lie; the whole system is rigged to keep you paying into the system for fear of some medical catastrophe but not to actually pay for your care. Most ordinary citizens are paying to some health insurance company money equivalent to (and that rightfully should be paying, but they can't afford) a house note. And once they're paying that, most non-executive salaries pay JUST enough that you can't AFFORD to use your health insurance except for the very few things that come free with it.

So no, there simply is no comparison; here, unless you are owned by some powerful mega-corporation, or you strike the lottery (figuratively or literally) and become independently wealthy, you can pretty much die in a ditch because you damn sure aren't going to be able to pay for health care aside from what can be cured by a bottle of Vicodin and some antibiotics prescribed by a walk-in clinic practitioner at $85/half-hour. No, hospitals don't HAVE TO take care of you anymore; the Hill-Burton act has been shot full of so many holes that you really can pretty much bleed to death on the hospital steps and nobody does a thing. Except hide it from the reporters. 

And then we have to consider our own military-industrial complex; the majority of our GDP (55-70% depending on whom you listen to) goes to support our DOD, which is STILL racking up TRILLIONS in overseas debt to support our neverending War for Oil so a few dozen uber-wealthy oil jizzumillionaires can keep themselves on top of the world economy even though anything that can actually be called oil's already all gone and what remains is just sand mixed with carcinogenic mud.

You worry about your military being weak? Hah. We spend more than the next 13 nations (including you) combined; all those people out there who hate us do so not because we show weakness, but because we're CONSTANTLY sticking our military in the middle of other sovereign nations' internal business. If we were actually doing "humanitarian aid" we would be working with the UN, not on & off being sanctioned by them. WE ARE the cause of most of the global unrest you refer to.

You guys may think you have corruption and incompetence; but yours is just the average run of the mill kind that has evolved over several centuries of natural means. Here, we've had 60 years of outright sociopaths deliberately perfecting the mix; turning our government into a literal deathtrap for the poor.


Cheers, and be glad you still know where both your kidneys are,


mnem
Ow, my spleen!

I thought Obama had put in place a sort of NHS system that the current Chump is trying to undo?The picture you paint is disgusting and the politicians ought to be shot for their lack of care towards the people that they are supposed to be representing, its inhuman to watch your fellow man suffer like that. So what happens if your involved in a RTA and an ambulance is called, do they check if you have the means to pay for any treatment and if you don't, do they leave you at the roadside, or in your car to die?

At least you have a military so you could defend yourselves if you had to. We have a Navy that is shrinking and a aircraft carrier with nothing to fly from it. Army has out dated weaponry and dwindled numbers and our Airforce, well, your 2 bases over here Mildenhall and Lakenheath between them probably have as many planes stationed there as we have in total.

Ouch! 

Unfortunately our Aussie conservatives think the US system is fantastic and are continually trying to erode it and return to the system we had in the 60's were private organisations and their shareholders use ppls poor health to make huge profits. 

Hmm, I thought you Aussies were much more civilised then that, so you have to have personal health insurance as well, and if you don't, what happens then?

It would not surprise me to find that we adopt that scheme here before too long as well as all our leaders seem to care about is extracting as much of our money, over and above what we already pay in direct taxation and it seems we get nothing back. Our roads are national disgrace with huge potholes on them, even on some of our motorways, there are potholes, pretty bad ones as well. Hitting them at 70mph in a car is bad enough to damage the tyres and can do mechanical damage to the cars structure as well, and if you was unlucky enough to hit one while riding a motorbike, you could be thrown all the road, even thrown of your bike and that could end with some dire consequences.

It never used to be this way at all, yes there is a thing called inflation, but we all are paying more and more of our earnings to the government in one form or other of taxation, so where does all that tax go to???

I guess we had better change the topic, as this is an electronics forum not a political debating society, before we get told off.

[Cubdriver]

Guys, let's keep this on test gear, can we?  Don't want to see it get locked on the eve of its anniversary.

-Pat

[Specmaster]

Guys, let's keep this on test gear, can we?  Don't want to see it get locked on the eve of its anniversary.

-Pat

I already have said that we need to back on topic before we get locked up.