Brand New SEEK Thermal Compact PRO - slipped from my fingers - Gone

[ThermallyFrigid]

Well.....I was about to use my NEW Seek Thermal Compact PRO to check the breaker panel for hot breakers.   But in the process, I guess I must have accidentally put a bit of pressure on the device and it popped right out of the USB port and before I could catch it....plopped to the floor.   ARRRRRGH!!

That was all she wrote.   Dead as a door nail.

I've never lost that much money THAT fast at Las Vegas.

You gotta be SUPER SUPER careful with those things.   They are more delicate than the last crown hair on a balding old man.

SEEK REALLY needs to re-design these things with some shock protection.  I'll bet I'm not the only one.

[Vipitis]

How high was the drop? And into what surface? They don't seem to be rugged at all.

I don't believe it's 100% broken from one drop tho.... Unless you broke board, sensor and lens into multiple parts...

[james_s]

If it was really that minor of a drop you could try a warranty claim. IMO a device like that should survive a drop of that nature. It's not as if you dropped it from 20 feet down onto concrete.

[ThermallyFrigid]

It was a slow motion football fumble.....I knew it was going and nothing I could do.

The fall was about 5ft to a concrete floor.   

They are THAT delicate.

I need one of these but I'm gonna have to go with a more rugged unit.

[ThermallyFrigid]

5ft drop.   But it was onto concrete.

There is a video in YouTube of the inside and the guy doing the review says right on the video that they are too delicate with absolutely no protection from even the slightest jars or shocks.

[IwuzBornanerd]

If by "Dead as a door nail." you mean that the app doesn't even acknowledge that it is attached, then I would suspect the crystal in the reference oscillator is broken, rendering the USB & probably everything else non-functional.  It doesn't take much to break those crystals.  If that's all it is it could be a simple repair.  It's likely someone on this board knows what the part number, or an equivalent, is.

[Uho]

I think that repair is possible. Or replace the quartz. Or check the USB cable connection. Maybe it fell out of the connector on impact.
That the problem did not happen again, make the holder.

[DaneLaw]

Are there any damage-signs on it from the outside?
Perhaps take a look at the internals, as I recall from review-videos it should be pretty easy to open with an little push force in the seem and take some close up pictures of the internals if the fault aint obvius.

Here is an example of opening it.https://youtu.be/Wv7SKRffDyo?t=22m17s

otherwise reach out to seek thermal, particularly as your US-based. (would be a shame to just write it off)

[ThermallyFrigid]

What actually happened is that the unit popped out of the USB port.
I'm really not a fan of this USB port device.   It's simply too easy to accidentally touch the unit the wrong way and have it pop out of the USB port or if you drop your phone you can pretty much forget it.

My thought was to go with a Reveal PRO but they are at least several hundred dollars more and the only thing they offer (IMO) is a more rugged casing.
It seems SEEK really needs to change the design of the Compact to provide some shock protection.

So, being that I really need a Thermal camera and the SEEK is one of the few offering 320 x 240 res at the sensor, I'll have to try once more.

However, I'm not about to do so again without protection.   I'll either wrap the device in a custom made self adhesive sponge rubber suit so that if it falls the foam will hopefully cushion the impact or use this device to prevent dropping the phone or the device altogether.  I think preventing a drop in the first place is probably the best 1st line of defense.

[ThermallyFrigid]

Are there any damage-signs on it from the outside?
Perhaps take a look at the internals, as I recall from review-videos it should be pretty easy to open with an little push force in the seem and take some close up pictures of the internals if the fault aint obvius.

Here is an example of opening it.https://youtu.be/Wv7SKRffDyo?t=22m17s

otherwise reach out to seek thermal, particularly as your US-based. (would be a shame to just write it off)

No signs of damage at all.   I looked VERY carefully.   I earlier stated that it was completely dead.....but that's not quite the case.   Apparently it will still turn on, but is out of focus.

[DaneLaw]

Allright' then open it and see if you can align the lens..
Video pasted above on how to proceed if you wanna open it and disassemble it..

btw that YT video of proteting item that is up for sale and you have embedded.. is that you behind that?

[IwuzBornanerd]

No signs of damage at all.   I looked VERY carefully.   I earlier stated that it was completely dead.....but that's not quite the case.   Apparently it will still turn on, but is out of focus.

Out of focus and can't be adjusted into focus?  Does the focusing ring turn hard?

If so, read the Seek Thermal Lens Repair topic (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/thermal-imaging/seek-thermal-lens-repair/new/?topicseen#new) for advice on how to proceed & photos of the lens assembly.  The photos are from the non-pro units but the pro is likely very similar to the XR.

Once you have popped the thing open you will have to re-glue it back together (with something other than "super glue"), so I wish I could tell you how to get that lens shroud off without opening the thing...maybe you can figure that out. 

[ThermallyFrigid]

No signs of damage at all.   I looked VERY carefully.   I earlier stated that it was completely dead.....but that's not quite the case.   Apparently it will still turn on, but is out of focus.

Out of focus and can't be adjusted into focus?  Does the focusing ring turn hard?

If so, read the Seek Thermal Lens Repair topic (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/thermal-imaging/seek-thermal-lens-repair/new/?topicseen#new) for advice on how to proceed & photos of the lens assembly.  The photos are from the non-pro units but the pro is likely very similar to the XR.

Once you have popped the thing open you will have to re-glue it back together (with something other than "super glue"), so I wish I could tell you how to get that lens shroud off without opening the thing...maybe you can figure that out. 

I read that entire thread but TBH, I didn't get specific information on readjusting the lens although there was quite a bit of information in that neighborhood.   Also, that was an older XR unit and mine is a newer PRO unit so there's no telling how much of it applies.    Meanwhile, I sent it back to SEEK for repair.   Not sure if it'll be covered under warranty or not.

[Ben321]

Most likely a bad unit. It was likely caused by a failing component like a transistor or IC with bad silicon doping characteristics which didn't pass QA at the factory, but they used it anyway, to cut costs, and even the slightest mechanical shock would move just enough doping atoms in the component's silicon to push it over the threshold of failure. It was just waiting for any excuse to finish breaking. Probably would have eventually failed even without the drop. The mechanical shock of a 5 foot drop can be large for a heavy object, but a small lightweight object (like the Seek Thermal camera) impacts with very little force when dropped from 5 feet. Even if the surface it is dropped onto is concrete. Circuit boards are made with soldered components. To mechanically force a solder connection to come undone, would require an absolutely HUGE impact, like running it over with a car. The plastic case on electronic devices will crack LONG before the mechanical stress is enough to pop components off of their solder connection on the circuit board.

[thm_w]

Return it if its under warranty.

[Bill W]

The mechanical shock of a 5 foot drop can be large for a heavy object, but a small lightweight object (like the Seek Thermal camera) impacts with very little force when dropped from 5 feet. Even if the surface it is dropped onto is concrete. Circuit boards are made with soldered components. To mechanically force a solder connection to come undone, would require an absolutely HUGE impact, like running it over with a car. The plastic case on electronic devices will crack LONG before the mechanical stress is enough to pop components off of their solder connection on the circuit board.

As someone who drops cameras from 2m onto concrete for a living - you are just wrong.  It takes a lot to make a 2m drop proof camera and only good solder joints will hold on to say a C case tantalum.

The deceleration is the killer, 200g or 1000g is not unusual.  So a 'tiny' component on tiny joints suddenly becomes a very heavy component on tiny joints.
However you do not shake silicon apart, although snapping off a few pixels may happen 

[Ben321]

The mechanical shock of a 5 foot drop can be large for a heavy object, but a small lightweight object (like the Seek Thermal camera) impacts with very little force when dropped from 5 feet. Even if the surface it is dropped onto is concrete. Circuit boards are made with soldered components. To mechanically force a solder connection to come undone, would require an absolutely HUGE impact, like running it over with a car. The plastic case on electronic devices will crack LONG before the mechanical stress is enough to pop components off of their solder connection on the circuit board.

As someone who drops cameras from 2m onto concrete for a living - you are just wrong.  It takes a lot to make a 2m drop proof camera and only good solder joints will hold on to say a C case tantalum.

The deceleration is the killer, 200g or 1000g is not unusual.  So a 'tiny' component on tiny joints suddenly becomes a very heavy component on tiny joints.
However you do not shake silicon apart, although snapping off a few pixels may happen 

Unlike other cameras you may have tested, Seek Compact Pro thermal imaging camera is extremely light weight. It is small, and its case is made entirely of plastic. Because it's light, the force of impact is small. Because it is small, the stress (difference in amount of force felt across the object) is even further reduced.  Probably weighs about 20 grams, and is about 1.5 inches in its longest dimension.

[Spirit532]

It is small, and its case is made entirely of plastic.

Magnesium, actually.
The sensor is bonded directly to the PCB though, which is directly attached to the magnesium case with conical pins. Every little vibration hits the sensor with full force, and microbolometers are 3D thermistors floating in a vacuum, so they're prone to falling apart easily.

[eKretz]

Doesn't matter how heavy the item dropped is at all. The important thing is how hard the impact - or more properly I suppose,
how rapid the deceleration - is. That is dependent on the mass of the components separately, not together - and how quickly they are moving and how fast they come to a stop. If the force exceeds the ability of the solder joint or joints to hold the component,  it will come right loose. Tiny components have tiny joints, and the force it takes to break them loose is dependent on surface area of the joint.  It really doesn't take a whole lot to break most of them loose.

[DaneLaw]

Unlike other cameras you may have tested, Seek Compact Pro thermal imaging camera is extremely light weight. It is small, and its case is made entirely of plastic. Because it's light, the force of impact is small. Because it is small, the stress (difference in amount of force felt across the object) is even further reduced.  Probably weighs about 20 grams, and is about 1.5 inches in its longest dimension.

If you check the link a few post above yours' you can easily decipher it ain't plastic, it even got said in the video the exact moment there is linked to ..
restated again:
(t=22m17s)

[IwuzBornanerd]

... microbolometers are 3D thermistors floating in a vacuum, so they're prone to falling apart easily.

It seems like I read somewhere, though, that each pixel has a thermally resistive link, sort of a pedestal, down to the substrate (heat sink) which provides a designed-in rate of heat dissipation from the pixel thereby setting the maximum frame rate and an effective equivalent of shutter speed in a visible light camera.  Perhaps this was a flawed analogy or just my confused interpretation.  But such a "pedestal" might also provide some support to reduce the likelihood of damage from shock.

I bring this up because Bill W said "snapping off a few pixels may happen"--as opposed to many.

[james_s]

Well there has to be something holding the thermistors, they need to be electrically connected. How strong that something is I don't know.

[Ben321]

Unlike other cameras you may have tested, Seek Compact Pro thermal imaging camera is extremely light weight. It is small, and its case is made entirely of plastic. Because it's light, the force of impact is small. Because it is small, the stress (difference in amount of force felt across the object) is even further reduced.  Probably weighs about 20 grams, and is about 1.5 inches in its longest dimension.

If you check the link a few post above yours' you can easily decipher it ain't plastic, it even got said in the video the exact moment there is linked to ..
restated again:
(t=22m17s)

Maybe the newer cases were magnesium, but older ones were plastic, as they didn't provide ground shielding when one guy accidentally gave his Seek Thermal a static shock.

[Ben321]

Doesn't matter how heavy the item dropped is at all. The important thing is how hard the impact - or more properly I suppose,
how rapid the deceleration - is. That is dependent on the mass of the components separately, not together - and how quickly they are moving and how fast they come to a stop. If the force exceeds the ability of the solder joint or joints to hold the component,  it will come right loose. Tiny components have tiny joints, and the force it takes to break them loose is dependent on surface area of the joint.  It really doesn't take a whole lot to break most of them loose.

Very small lightweight components (such as surface mount resistors) won't feel too many Newtons of force from a simple 5 foot drop. Larger ones will feel more force, but they also have bigger solder pads they are soldered too, so more solder, so an overall stronger joint.

[DaneLaw]

Maybe the newer cases were magnesium, but older ones were plastic

Its a video from 2 years ago Aug. 2016

Unlike other cameras you may have tested, Seek Compact Pro thermal imaging camera is extremely light weight. It is small, and its case is made entirely of plastic.

How old do you think the Seek Compact PRO is?

//
But even the standard old Seek, and not the pro-version your refering to as plastic and that there should have been a pro-version even earlier with plastic.. here is a video from 2014 .. A standard Seek as it is before any Pro version, also magnesium casing.  https://youtu.be/8Cr8oZck5m8?t=10m