Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown

[pomonabill221]

There are a few E4 stock TIC's for around 1K still.  Some even state the firmware version.
Guess the E4-E8+ hacked versions are still less than a stock E8, but the hackers are making a big profit!

[DaveWB]

There are a few E4 stock TIC's for around 1K still.  Some even state the firmware version.
Guess the E4-E8+ hacked versions are still less than a stock E8, but the hackers are making a big profit!

Seems like they were going for about $1300 BIN a couple days ago.

1300
-1000 Camera
-169 eBay PayPal fees(about 13%)
-30 shipping
______________
~$100 profit

I've had a bunch of people write to me from the tutorial videos I posted because they somehow ended up messing up their camera and by the time I'm done helping them get it fixed it would have been easier for them to just buy a pre-hacked one from a seller online. For the inexperienced or for those who aren't 100% confident I think it would be worth the extra, but it is becoming alot easier to hack especially with TIConfig but even then that is not very stable as when I used it it would put a FlashFS subfolder within the FlashFS folder so I went oldschool with cmd or stefbeers utility. There was a guy from Australia who messaged me and told me that he paid his friend $400 to hack his camera for him and he said he watched my videos when he did the hack. He ended up decrypting his cfc file, and encrypted the configTEMPLATE.cfg file without putting in his serial or CRC and then just re-encrypted it. When I told him he acted like it was a little step he missed LOL

[DaveWB]

so hows the stock level at TE? i hope they stock more ...

Calright Instruments has good customer service and ships same day, unlike what I've found from TEquipment. Calright also offers a much better price as they are the authorized Master Distributor for their region. I'd suggest contacting David Swanson at 866.363.6634 and he can probably give you a very fair price. Tell him I sent you too

[tequipment]

Dave,
   We should the same day.  We have 29 units in stock and 100 more due in next week.  We will have more stock than ANYONE in the entire world. 
I trust this is not a shameless plug.  Plugs are fine but we do ship the same day for all USA orders for items in stock ordered before 3pm.

Thanks!
Evan Cirelli

TEquipment.NET

[tequipment]

Also there is no such thing as a Master Flir distributor.  As much as someone may say they are the master in the region.  It sounds good   Heck I would love to put that on my site but we cannot.

Maybe I can lobby Flir for that tile?  Hope you are enjoying the camera.  It is a heck of a unit! 

[DaveWB]

Dave,
   We should the same day.  We have 29 units in stock and 100 more due in next week.  We will have more stock than ANYONE in the entire world. 
I trust this is not a shameless plug.  Plugs are fine but we do ship the same day for all USA orders for items in stock ordered before 3pm.

Thanks!
Evan Cirelli

TEquipment.NET

I'd be more than happy to supply order numbers if you PM me or simply ask Rick B, he'll know who I am. My first order from you guys was perfect, but my 2nd, 3rd, and 4th got messed up everytime, you guys have never shipped same day for me and yes the cameras were instock which is why I ordered from you. Went to Calright and they actually shipped same day plus they ended up giving better pricing by about $50. As far as master distributor, that's what they told me, I guess that could be a title that they gave themselves but I guess it really doesn't matter to me if FLIR gave that to them directly but the price they gave certainly reflects it.

[tequipment]

Dave sent me his order numbers.  He is right.  He had a less than stellar experience  I will look into this on my side with my management team.  I assure you though usually though this is not the case.  No matter what I really do appreciate the feedback.  Thank you.

3roomlap  PM me for an eevblog discount code. 

[echen1024]

I have only ordered with Tequipment once, but can vouch for them. It is true my order was not shipped same business day, but overall I had a fantastic experience with Dawn and the sales team. Unfortunately, I could not purchase my E4 from them since they were out of stock ATM, and the 1.21 hack had not yet been discovered. I purchased from Bell NW, who matched the 6% and were excellent as well.

[tangmu]

I bought from Calright on EBay with a best offer accepted for less than $995, it shipped the same day, and was 1.22.0 like they advertised.

[mucek]

well all i need now is to buy 1 FLIR, is there some kinda strict policy that one cannot buy from overseas, or if you are authorized you are not allowed to sell overseas? or if these are shipped overseas, they will get stopped at customs like some dangerous goods?

Can't you buy the camera locally?

Regards,
Gregor

[Fraser]

The matter of export controls on the Ex series has been discussed previously.

The issues with the E4 are as follows:

1. In spite of what some may believe, the E4 is covered by the ITAR regulations as it is thermal imaging technology. The good news is that ITAR PERMITS the E4 to be exported to countries that are deemed 'friendly' to NATO, without an export licence requirement. However the seller must obtain the end user details....name, country of destination and address before despatch. This requirement is usually met by the use of a Credit Card as that provides the relevant 'tracking'. To find out which countries do not require an export licence please Google ITAR and read the rules on one of the many Thermal Camera dealer web sites.

2. It is an offence under ITAR to sell or on-pass an E4 to a country or national who is considered hostile to NATO. That is to say, if you act as an agent to provide E4's to unsavoury persons, you are liable to prosecution, a fine and a prison sentence. No kidding....we have a Brit who is presently in a US Prison for such dealings.

3. Dealers in the USA are scared of getting on the wrong side of ITAR and going to Prison. They therefore often state that it is not legal to export the E4. An incorrect statement but understandable as ITAR can be both scary and confusing to the average Joe.

4. US dealers often hate international sales due to the required paperwork involved for no extra profit. Some charge large 'paperwork' fees, especially on ITAR licenced thermal cameras (like my PM695's).

5. Dealers may be concerned about exports upsetting FLIR as they are exporting into other markets. this could be in breech of their dealer agreement....unconfirmed. Not uncommon in the consumer electronics marketplace.

6. Dealers are often wary of international purchases on high cost items for fear of fraud. Credit card fraud is rife these days and the dealers feel exposed when exporting to some regions of the world.

7. The E4 contains a Lithium Ion Battery. It is becoming increasingly complicated to ship a product that contains a Lithium Ion battery and some dealers are concerned about making a mistake so refuse to export, or ship by air. In fact the E4 just needs a certain warning label (available on the internet) in order to ship it by air. Some courier companies are still refusing to ship anything with a Lithium battery in it or charge huge processing fees....one courier charged my employer $1500 to 'process' a single phone battery shipment of 1 battery    Its gone kinda mad on that front !

Aurora

[DJ]

Something of a sad commentary.  We've had a wonderful opportunity to get an exceptional piece of kit, and it is being wrecked by greed. Hacking something for personal use is one thing. Using the members to help one flip product for personal profit is not right.

I've had designs nicked and put up for sale, and the end result is reluctance to share.

So short term a hundred bucks or so, and long term a dead end.

Hacking something for personal use is one thing.  Buying dozens of instruments and flipping them is quite another.

Relatively new here, but hope this is an anomaly.

[edavid]

Plugs are fine but we do ship the same day for all USA orders for items in stock ordered before 3pm.

I ordered mine on a Monday after 3PM, and it didn't ship until Wednesday.  No big deal, but you probably shouldn't make that claim.

[scientist]

I've had designs nicked and put up for sale, and the end result is reluctance to share.

How? Through a board fab?

I think the main reason this is happening if the availability of the hacking tools. When it required editing of filesystems and other work, scammers/flippers/profiteers were scared away. One it became as easy as installing a utility and clicking a few buttons, the profiteers immediately flocked to it.

I would suggest that all of the utilities be removed, as they are making it harder for us to develop hacks and improvements. If committing murder was as easy as this hack, we'd all be dead.

[RAWebb]

Hmmm. Looks like manual level/span is being added to (er, ah, enabled on) the E8... and it's on sale! http://www.tequipment.net/FLIRE8.html?v=7249

[ixfd64]

Perhaps a little off-topic, but does anyone know what kind of cells are used in the FLIR Exx batteries?

[Taucher]

Hmmm. Looks like manual level/span is being added to (er, ah, enabled on) the E8... and it's on sale! http://www.tequipment.net/FLIRE8.html?v=7249

YAY ... at least Flir has realized that this function might be worth several thousand money units premium - and does not cost anything in development
Hopefully one day they will realize that one great product at a great price would sell in quantities that would overwhelm their imagination - but chances are great that somebody will try to be "smart" and introduce crippeling or bad specs again.

Steve Jobs realized this at Apple - make just a few different products, but make them absolutely great in every aspect.

[scientist]

FLIR Tools Android Mobile:

This may be slightly off-topic, but I think somebody can answer my question.  I have an e40 ->e60,
want to put flir tools mobile on an android tablet.  Flir requires that the app, "flir tools mobile," be downloaded
via google play store, which this tablet does not support.  I did install it on my android phone.  I'm wondering
if the installation program is still on my android phone, and could be copied from it over to the tablet and
be installed.  I don't see where any policies are broken here, just that this tablet company chose to use
amazon appstore instead of google, and amazon appstore does not have flir tools.  Would this work?
Of course, it would require that the installation program still be on my android phone, and not deleted.

Jim

Extremely unlikely. Firstly the USB port does not output 5V, so almost certainly no host/OTG support in hardware.

Thats a shame, Flir tools mobile App looks good , Its the only Android App I've found, and I think it only works with WIFI connection ( I might be wrong ) .

If it's not compatible with your tablet it won't install properly.

[emptech]

Edit:
Problem solved.  Earlier I asked if it would be possible to pull the program (FLIR Tools Mobile) from another
device and plant it on my tablet.  I did better than that, FLIR in Sweden emailed two APK files to me, I sideloaded
them on my tablet.  The email was received on my PC, I connected a usb cable between the tablet and the PC,
copied the files, executed them on the tablet, and bingo, the program installed.

I suspect this is a common problem, but it took somebody in Sweden to fix it, although the local tech support
tried, they didn't solve the problem.

The wi-fi works great, I can now create a hot spot on my tablet, run the FLIR Tools Mobile, and see my camera,
edit the photos, etc.  And of course, can do the same via the wi-fi in my office.

I hope this helps somebody who might have had the same problem, Sideloading!

Jim


I returned the tablet, got tired of fighting it, absolutely have to have google play store. 
Got another with google play, downloaded flir tools mobile, now trying to
figure how to make the camera and tablet talk together.  Flir used to have some tutorials, I can't find them.
If I remember right, I have to create a hot spot with the tablet, have the camera find it and connect to it, right?
I'm trying to find how to create a hot spot with this "Visual Land" tablet.  Downloaded a hot spot app, onwards.

All works fine when I use my htc android phone as a hot spot, but it's screen is too small for this sort of stuff.

edit:  I found a copy of the FLIR Tools Mobile pdf, but it simply wants us to connect us to a wireless network,
again, I believe the tablet has to create a hotspot, right?

Can somebody point me to some flir tutorials on pairing the cam and tablet?

Jim

[joe-c]

Hi Guys,

First time writing here
I was a friend of Camera modifications too.
I wrote a remote control Software for the FLIR Ex (I also really link the Exx, but it is financial out of range).
Here is the Description: http://joe-c.de/pages/posts/programm_ex_tools_158.php

A Copy is now selling for 30€ on ebay: http://www.ebay.de/itm/201086125469
(try to compensate a bricked E4, after trying to flash 1.18.7 to a 1.22 Camera ... Device was sent to FLIR for repair)

Additional...happy hacking

[Mr-Beamer]

OK Very BIG LIKE

[Fraser]

@Joe C

What did FLIR charge to re-flash your E4 please ? This information may be useful to others who end up with a unrecoverable bricked E4.

Is your software going to be available in English please ?

Aurora

[joe-c]

What did FLIR charge to re-flash your E4 please ? This information may be useful to others who end up with a unrecoverable bricked E4.

Hello,
The Camera is still by FLIR. I hope to receive it in the next 2 weeks.

Hat i have done:
1. Set Camera in RNDIS mode
2. open "FLIRInstallNet.exe" from /bin folder (FLIR Tools)
3. Download old firmware  (flir_ex_pn639_v1.18.7_update_pack.zip) from somewhere in this forum
4. flashing the "Z3comb_v1.18.7.fif"
5. Camera restarts later and was found as new Volume (ASCO 23.9MB)
6. only the FLIR logo was shown and the Asco volume... that's it.
I tried to use the hardware UART with "usbfn RNDIS" but nothing happens.
I copied the files inside the ASCO Volume (see attechment). If I store files there and restart the Camera, the files are disappeared.

I have the theory, that FLIR store some command file there and if the Camera restarts they have additional a working RNDIS mode for reflash.
However, they don't will let us know this...

Is your software going to be available in English please ?

The Software is partly in English (the words are shorter ) but more in German. You can see in Schreenshots.
I could look to make it more Multilanguage... If my kids let me...

[mago]

Hi Joe,

your software looks very promising but... pls ...  translate it to english! I will buy a copy at once, if can understand it

[OrBy]

Hi Guys,

First time writing here
I was a friend of Camera modifications too.
I wrote a remote control Software for the FLIR Ex (I also really link the Exx, but it is financial out of range).
Here is the Description: http://joe-c.de/pages/posts/programm_ex_tools_158.php

A Copy is now selling for 30€ on ebay: http://www.ebay.de/itm/201086125469
(try to compensate a bricked E4, after trying to flash 1.18.7 to a 1.22 Camera ... Device was sent to FLIR for repair)

Additional...happy hacking

I really wish I could understand German right now!
Are my eyes playing tricks on me or did you manage to install a WiFi or BT adapter into a hacked up E4? (does it work?)
Looking at your remote control software page it looks like you are doing sequence or video capture as well - how long can it record for? (and can it record with out the UI showing up - raw video)
Would love to know more about the application but Google translate is just not working for your site for me.