Altium Price Rises

[Ice-Tea]

I'll probably drop out of maintenance when it expires in December, I'll download the full installer just before it expires and stick with that.  Just too expensive to keep going.

No need for that. You can still download installers and it will work just fine up to the last supported version of the SW.

[jc101]

I'll probably drop out of maintenance when it expires in December, I'll download the full installer just before it expires and stick with that.  Just too expensive to keep going.

No need for that. You can still download installers and it will work just fine up to the last supported version of the SW.

I tend to keep the last few full off-line installer packages, I do this for a number of bits of software.  I have some dev stuff that doesn't have internet access and full installers are needed for those.
I didn't think you could download without a valid user account, I guess my account will remain but show as out of maintenance - I'll find out in December unless they offer some stunning deal, I won't hold my breath.

[ajb]

What's that, you didn't pay back maintenance? Oh, then you can pay all the annual back maintenance, then pay even more to upgrade.

If it were a matter of only paying the back maintenance fees that would be one thing, but regardless of how long the subscription has been lapsed there is--per the last rep I spoke to around the end of the year--a flat $4k subscription lapse penalty on top of the new subscription fee per seat.  Other software with a subscription support model, like Solidworks, only charges the back maintenance for the lapsed period up to the cost of a new license.  That's entirely fair for a subscription update model as far as I'm concerned, whereas Altium are just being dicks about it because they can.

[thm_w]

We have a number of licenses. Our company is growing, and our usage has been increasing.

If you want or need any flexibility at all, you pay more. Want to move a license, you pay. Want to keep your versions sync'd, you upgrade. What's that, you didn't pay back maintenance? Oh, then you can pay all the annual back maintenance, then pay even more to upgrade. Want some flexibility, pay more for a floating license. What's that, you want to use your floating license at a remote site? That'll cost you more! Overseas, even more again!! Got a problem, found a bug? You're doing it wrong...

Maybe sticking to an old perpetual licensed version of Altium works in your situation, but it doesn't work for us.

John

If you need the latest and greatest Altium version and cloud, then I can't see how Kicad is a viable alternative.

The ALF license I used you just drop it on ANY PC and run it, doesn't matter where it is, or if you installed it somewhere else. Although they have georestricted now as you say, blueskull had to use a VPN to get around that AFAIK.
Maybe they don't sell that licenses type any more, or maybe you have to fight through sales bullshit to get one, don't know.

[JohnG]

If you need the latest and greatest Altium version and cloud, then I can't see how Kicad is a viable alternative.

The ALF license I used you just drop it on ANY PC and run it, doesn't matter where it is, or if you installed it somewhere else. Although they have georestricted now as you say, blueskull had to use a VPN to get around that AFAIK.
Maybe they don't sell that licenses type any more, or maybe you have to fight through sales bullshit to get one, don't know.

I never said we needed the cloud. This not useful to us no matter how hard the sell. Our boards are not complex in the sense of parts and high numbers of nodes, and aside from the database library, KiCad may be enough. We will do a design and find out.

We don't need the latest and greatest for our designs, but if you want to add an Altium license, you have to add the latest and greatest. If you want any support, you have to have to pay for the latest and greatest whether you install it or not. If you have to manage a group of people, it can be a headache to manage multiple versions, because it makes it a lot tougher to keep everyone consistent. When we implemented some consistent design procedures and flow, our manufacturing yield went way up and rework went way down, so we are keeping the process in place.

Also, we are not going to use a VPN to get around the license because it is likely to be illegal, and we won't do that as a company.

Altium has some really nice features, and it could be great. But for our situation, the cost of doing business with them has become painful enough that we will invest some actual resources to evaluate KiCad as an alternative. We know that making a switch will be painful. But our current situation is also painful and shows no sign of getting better. Just the opposite, it appears.

John

[thm_w]

I never said we needed the cloud. This not useful to us no matter how hard the sell. Our boards are not complex in the sense of parts and high numbers of nodes, and aside from the database library, KiCad may be enough. We will do a design and find out.

We don't need the latest and greatest for our designs, but if you want to add an Altium license, you have to add the latest and greatest. If you want any support, you have to have to pay for the latest and greatest whether you install it or not. If you have to manage a group of people, it can be a headache to manage multiple versions, because it makes it a lot tougher to keep everyone consistent. When we implemented some consistent design procedures and flow, our manufacturing yield went way up and rework went way down, so we are keeping the process in place.

Also, we are not going to use a VPN to get around the license because it is likely to be illegal, and we won't do that as a company.

Altium has some really nice features, and it could be great. But for our situation, the cost of doing business with them has become painful enough that we will invest some actual resources to evaluate KiCad as an alternative. We know that making a switch will be painful. But our current situation is also painful and shows no sign of getting better. Just the opposite, it appears.

John

License should support any earlier version, so everyone would run the oldest common build. Paying the maintenance costs was probably not necessary, unless they made a specific deal.  https://digitalsales.altium.com/

If you don't need the features for the price, then that's a different argument, and totally valid now that Kicad is more mature.

[andyturk]

FWIW, in late 2020 I bought a "perpetual" AD license for $4k USD. It allows me to use it one one machine at a time as long as there's an internet connection at startup. I've seen folks recommend using a file-based (.alf) license, but the Altium sales rep said that wasn't a possibility for the kind of license I have.

When they hit me up for subscription $$, I declined. So now I'm stalled at AD21.9.2, but that's fine for my needs. It definitely paid for itself in projects over the first couple of years, so I'm not complaining (much).

The retail price for a full license when I got mine was $9k USD, so they were willing to discount significantly, but it depended on internal Altium sales team horoscopes. I let them know what I was willing to pay and the rep finally contacted me in December (several months later) and said he had approval if I'd give him a credit card number that day over the phone. I didn't appreciate the arm twisting, but got what I wanted.

I run Altium in a Win10 VM on a beefy MacBook Pro (intel) and it's plenty fast. Zooming around with a 3dconnexion mouse is silky smooth with just the integrated GPU.

I have a vastly beefier iMac Pro which I'd hoped to use with Altium, but the same Altium VM crashes the entire imac when I drag components in 2D. It'll start inverting triangles all over the screen and then eventually die with a windowserver watchdog timeout, requiring a hardware reboot. That's a MacOS problem, not an Altium problem. Thanks, Apple. 

[EEVblog]

FWIW, in late 2020 I bought a "perpetual" AD license for $4k USD. It allows me to use it one one machine at a time as long as there's an internet connection at startup. I've seen folks recommend using a file-based (.alf) license, but the Altium sales rep said that wasn't a possibility for the kind of license I have.

When they hit me up for subscription $$, I declined. So now I'm stalled at AD21.9.2, but that's fine for my needs. It definitely paid for itself in projects over the first couple of years, so I'm not complaining (much).

If it works for you at present, then it's still going to be working for you in a decades time.
Unless you are on the corporate coin, or absolutely must have the latest version to client work, there is little incentive to upgrade.

[tszaboo]

FWIW, in late 2020 I bought a "perpetual" AD license for $4k USD. It allows me to use it one one machine at a time as long as there's an internet connection at startup. I've seen folks recommend using a file-based (.alf) license, but the Altium sales rep said that wasn't a possibility for the kind of license I have.

When they hit me up for subscription $$, I declined. So now I'm stalled at AD21.9.2, but that's fine for my needs. It definitely paid for itself in projects over the first couple of years, so I'm not complaining (much).

If it works for you at present, then it's still going to be working for you in a decades time.
Unless you are on the corporate coin, or absolutely must have the latest version to client work, there is little incentive to upgrade.

Probably the latest update was the Draftsman. It really changed the way I am creating technical documentations for the boards, and I truly think it saves me days of work on a yearly basis.
Its perfect to create assembly guides. It is great to mark isolation distances. It is very useful tool.

[EEVblog]

FWIW, in late 2020 I bought a "perpetual" AD license for $4k USD. It allows me to use it one one machine at a time as long as there's an internet connection at startup. I've seen folks recommend using a file-based (.alf) license, but the Altium sales rep said that wasn't a possibility for the kind of license I have.

When they hit me up for subscription $$, I declined. So now I'm stalled at AD21.9.2, but that's fine for my needs. It definitely paid for itself in projects over the first couple of years, so I'm not complaining (much).

If it works for you at present, then it's still going to be working for you in a decades time.
Unless you are on the corporate coin, or absolutely must have the latest version to client work, there is little incentive to upgrade.

Probably the latest update was the Draftsman. It really changed the way I am creating technical documentations for the boards, and I truly think it saves me days of work on a yearly basis.
Its perfect to create assembly guides. It is great to mark isolation distances. It is very useful tool.

And that's the point, you really only need to upgrade when something new like that comes along that improves your workflow. Once you have that and it works, there is no real need to pay for maintenance and minor upgrades.

[boB]

I'm so glad that Eagle works great for my company and will never expire. 

We have many seats so even though it is "legal" for us to use, it is the version just before Autodesk so is plenty good enough most everything we do with it which is quite a lot.

At least I haven't been spoiled by using Altium.

I do miss Pads some times though.

boB

[Hawaka]

Today I got an email from Altium that the price raise for my type of licence (I believe it's on demand, perpetual) will be 12%. Did you all get that info? Will they make different rises depending on licences type?

[SpacedCowboy]

Got the same thing, yes. Since it’s perpetual, I’m guessing it’s the yearly subs that will increase, which for me will be an evaluation based on need, so … meh

[Spark-Doctor]

  Would be interesting to know how much it's actually increased.   

June 2022, if you are in subscription, to renew £1625.00 + VAT. Out of subscription  £3360.00 + VAT
July  2022, if you are in subscription, to renew £1725.00 + VAT. Out of subscription  £3535.00 + VAT

They did offer me 15% discount in June and 20% discount in July but refused to budge on the renewing fee. I declined and stayed with my perpetual license.

[jayk]

Crazy how expensive Altium has become.  I'm paying a little over $2K/yr for PADS Professional.  There's plenty I dislike about it, but it's pretty good for most things and the support is great.  Like any of these tools, once you learn it (which takes a while), you can get things done pretty quickly.  I wonder if Altium is really twice as good.

[thm_w]

PADS is advertised at $3k/year on their website: https://eda.sw.siemens.com/en-US/pcb/pads/professional/
A perpetual license is $9000. Altium almost twice that.

Feature wise it seems to be similar to Altium, maybe some nicer RF stuff. But a lot of those features are rarely used (FPGAs, signal analysis).

https://static.sw.cdn.siemens.com/siemens-disw-assets/public/82839/en-US/Siemens-SW-Is-Your-Pcb-design-tool-up-to-Speed-WP-82839-C1.pdf

[jayk]

They have better pricing for consultants, but navigating their sales org isn't easy.  I'm not sure about the comparison tables in that document... a lot of the stuff they mention is not part of the basic PADS Pro package, and I'm not sure how much extra it costs (again, getting numbers out of the sales org is not easy as a little guy).  In addition to schematic and PCB, the basic PADS Pro includes a version of Hyperlynx that's stripped-down but still fairly useful for basic SI.  I don't think there's any PI included.  I'm not sure about the analog/mixed-signal sim... I generally just use LTSpice for that sort of thing.

[Analog]

They lost me this time. Too many features and products I don't need or want and zero effort on things I do want. I wish I would have dropped off back in Ver 17 and saved the money towards another package.

[johnboxall]

But after price rise and close Altium sales in my country, i can't buy it.

We all know the real reason why Altium closed sales in Russia.
Enjoy KiCAD.

[beanflying]

This weeks reporting.

Tech star Altium Limited (ASX: ALU) rocketed $5.91, or almost 20 per cent, higher to $35.84 after the electronic design software company reported a 57 per cent rise in net profit, to $US55.5 million.

Don't expect a price reduction anytime soon the shareholders need to be happy.

[JohnG]

In the meantime, my employer has been spending time to see if we can move some of our designs to KiCAD. So far, we have transferred one design with some minor issues that were straightforward to resolve.

At the moment, we are looking to see if we can implement our custom DRC rules. Our current rules are there so that we can have floating circuit net classes so that within the floating net class, we can have a low voltage clearance, but everything outside of the floating net class will have a higher voltage clearance (it's for a floating gate drive and some other floating circuitry). It needs to accommodate the IPC rules for outer and inner layers.

If we can implement our rules within the KiCAD environment, there are two remaining hurdles. The first is whether or not we can manage our output files in a semi-automated way (we use outjob files quite a bit) and the second is our desire for the implementation of a database library.

We have been pleasantly surprised at how well it has gone so far. Still a bit to go, though.

John

[pointhi]

In the meantime, my employer has been spending time to see if we can move some of our designs to KiCAD. So far, we have transferred one design with some minor issues that were straightforward to resolve.

At the moment, we are looking to see if we can implement our custom DRC rules. Our current rules are there so that we can have floating circuit net classes so that within the floating net class, we can have a low voltage clearance, but everything outside of the floating net class will have a higher voltage clearance (it's for a floating gate drive and some other floating circuitry). It needs to accommodate the IPC rules for outer and inner layers.

If we can implement our rules within the KiCAD environment, there are two remaining hurdles. The first is whether or not we can manage our output files in a semi-automated way (we use outjob files quite a bit) and the second is our desire for the implementation of a database library.

We have been pleasantly surprised at how well it has gone so far. Still a bit to go, though.

John

Some hints:

• Output Automation: For example https://github.com/INTI-CMNB/kibot
• Database Library PR: https://gitlab.com/kicad/code/kicad/-/merge_requests/1282

[JohnG]

Some hints:

• Output Automation: For example https://github.com/INTI-CMNB/kibot
• Database Library PR: https://gitlab.com/kicad/code/kicad/-/merge_requests/1282

Thanks for the heads up. I know about some of the extensions for output and panelization, and we would not have started down this road if we didn't think we could make it work. We also have a contractor who has some Python capability and has written some simple but very useful scripts to process our Altium outputs (outjob files are nice, but not quite enough).

I knew the work on the database was slated for V7, but it's nice to see the progress  .

John

[Analog]

This weeks reporting.

Tech star Altium Limited (ASX: ALU) rocketed $5.91, or almost 20 per cent, higher to $35.84 after the electronic design software company reported a 57 per cent rise in net profit, to $US55.5 million.

Don't expect a price reduction anytime soon the shareholders need to be happy.

Do not, my friends, become addicted to profit. It will take hold of you, and you will resent its absence!     -Immortan Joe

[ajawamnet]

They recently released a new 3-tier subscription thing. They removed Multiboard from the "standard" tier.  This clown they have running the marketing ship's gotta go   https://www.altium.com/altium-designer/subscription  I really don't use multiboard - it's hard enough to get Altium to do a single PCB correctly with minimal bugs...