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Altium REJECTS takeover bid from Autodesk

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rsjsouza:

--- Quote from: tooki on August 20, 2021, 01:57:30 pm ---
--- Quote from: EEVblog on June 13, 2021, 04:00:32 am ---
--- Quote from: nctnico on June 12, 2021, 08:41:44 pm ---That is not the point. The question is: what is the added value of Altium when (not if) KiCad offers similar functionality?

--- End quote ---

KiCad might appear to offer similar functionaly to Altium if all you ever do is fairly basic to mid level boards. But if you do very complex mid to higher end stuff, Altium is still streets ahead.

--- End quote ---
That reminds me of the people who say that LibreOffice is a complete substitute for MS Office, or that GIMP and Inkscape can replace Photoshop and Illustrator: they have no clue what professional use is, and that the open source apps don’t even begin to cover the specialized features professionals need. They’re perfectly adequate for everyday use in many cases, just not true pro use.

This isn’t to say that open source desktop apps can’t be best-in-class, but IMHO they rarely are, not in functionality, and most certainly not in usability. Quite different from the server stuff, where open source has managed to produce truly outstanding software, just to list one example.

--- End quote ---
Although I use Gimp quite extensively for personal purposes and did a lot of work with Inkscape in a professional environment, I agree with you. Gimp's interface is much more aligned with a professional package and easier to use, but Inkscape (as well as Blender, another one that I used extensively in the past) is quite dense. Obviously that reflects the price you pay for it.

Libreoffice is quite alright and has become quite popular to have an ecosystem on itself. MSOffice, which I use extensively at work (2019 version), has a completely different interface (the ribbon stuff) and is polished in some places, but Powerpoint can still ruin your day if you get a presentation from other user (fonts, spacing, page sizes, etc can get messy). 

Kicad has some annoyances, has an interface quite different than a commercial package but the massive improvement over just a few years gives me a lot of confidence it will be capable of dealing with more and more complex designs.

tooki:

--- Quote from: coppice on August 20, 2021, 04:06:41 pm ---
--- Quote from: tooki on August 20, 2021, 01:57:30 pm ---That reminds me of the people who say that LibreOffice is a complete substitute for MS Office, or that GIMP and Inkscape can replace Photoshop and Illustrator: they have no clue what professional use is, and that the open source apps don’t even begin to cover the specialized features professionals need. They’re perfectly adequate for everyday use in many cases, just not true pro use.

This isn’t to say that open source desktop apps can’t be best-in-class, but IMHO they rarely are, not in functionality, and most certainly not in usability. Quite different from the server stuff, where open source has managed to produce truly outstanding software, just to list one example.

--- End quote ---
LibreOffice is just as good as MS Office. The problem is they both suck, and need huge amounts of work to make them truly fit for purpose.

--- End quote ---
No, it really isn’t. Literally my point: people claim it’s the same without understanding that it is not. Both are good enough for basic needs, but LibreOffice lacks a ton of advanced features used professionally, especially in business workflows. It supports automation in ways LibreOffice can’t dream of, and even where LibreOffice “does” support it, it’s not done with the consistency and reliability of MS Office. (An API is useless if it breaks with every other update…)

Remember this: just because it’s good enough for you doesn’t mean it’s good enough for everyone.

coppice:

--- Quote from: tooki on August 20, 2021, 08:09:46 pm ---
--- Quote from: coppice on August 20, 2021, 04:06:41 pm ---
--- Quote from: tooki on August 20, 2021, 01:57:30 pm ---That reminds me of the people who say that LibreOffice is a complete substitute for MS Office, or that GIMP and Inkscape can replace Photoshop and Illustrator: they have no clue what professional use is, and that the open source apps don’t even begin to cover the specialized features professionals need. They’re perfectly adequate for everyday use in many cases, just not true pro use.

This isn’t to say that open source desktop apps can’t be best-in-class, but IMHO they rarely are, not in functionality, and most certainly not in usability. Quite different from the server stuff, where open source has managed to produce truly outstanding software, just to list one example.

--- End quote ---
LibreOffice is just as good as MS Office. The problem is they both suck, and need huge amounts of work to make them truly fit for purpose.

--- End quote ---
No, it really isn’t. Literally my point: people claim it’s the same without understanding that it is not. Both are good enough for basic needs, but LibreOffice lacks a ton of advanced features used professionally, especially in business workflows. It supports automation in ways LibreOffice can’t dream of, and even where LibreOffice “does” support it, it’s not done with the consistency and reliability of MS Office. (An API is useless if it breaks with every other update…)

Remember this: just because it’s good enough for you doesn’t mean it’s good enough for everyone.

--- End quote ---
MS Office is utter garbage, not fit for purpose. Its not good enough for anything more than trivial uses. Word especially is like a curse on humanity. That's why most serious document producers don't use it. It would be hard for an alternative to be genuinely worse.

Nominal Animal:

--- Quote from: tooki on August 20, 2021, 01:57:30 pm ---That reminds me of the people who say that LibreOffice is a complete substitute for MS Office, or that GIMP and Inkscape can replace Photoshop and Illustrator: they have no clue what professional use is, and that the open source apps don’t even begin to cover the specialized features professionals need.
--- End quote ---
Mighty strong generalizations there, tooki.  Perhaps you might reconsider exactly what you claim about others there?

I must say, I take serious umbrage at your claim that people like I have "no clue" – your emphasis – what professional use of such programs is.

I designed the first set of collectors cards for the Finnish Defence Forces in 1997, using Photoshop and Freehand.  At the time, I was the webmaster there.  Later, when running a company, I did some full stack web development stuff, and preferred Photoshop; and occasionally optimized artwork for use in official mailings etc, for which I typically used Adobe Illustrator.

I do not consider myself a graphic artist; I don't have the visual style needed for that stuff.  I can do cards and icons, which don't need that much "artistry", and things that really interest me.  I've had a couple of my oil pastels on display, but that's it; I could never do commissions or such.  So, not an artist.  I can definitely do the technical job, down to color separation, masks, and even custom rasterization if I need to.  I've even taught a basic course on image processing (using Photoshop and Illustrator), although that was two decades ago.  Most of my Photoshop work was taking proper artwork from a graphics artist, and optimize them for the task at hand (web, letterhead/watermarks, etc.).

All in all, I have a few years of professional Photoshop and Freehand/Illustrator use.  I'm not much of an artist, only technically proficient.

Nowadays, I use GIMP and Inkscape.  I can do everything I did in Illustrator and Photoshop, in GIMP and Inkscape, although the workflow is a bit different.  For color separation and such, you do need additional (open source, possibly customized) tools.

Yes, the free tools lack spit and polish, and don't have the support and documentation behind them that Adobe can provide.  Many common tasks are much more efficient with Photoshop and Illustrator, so anyone using them for their everyday workflow, definitely should consider using them.  But if you only have GIMP and Inkscape, you can still achieve the exact same end results.

(Now, I really do have a bit of an esoteric career background... so, if you suspect I'm embellishing the details, do contact me via PM or email, and I can provide you with sufficient information for you to verify all of the above.)

olkipukki:

--- Quote from: coppice on August 20, 2021, 08:30:31 pm ---Word especially is like a curse on humanity. That's why most serious document producers don't use it.

--- End quote ---
What they are using?

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