EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
Electronics => Beginners => Topic started by: alaksana96 on June 22, 2016, 05:13:09 pm
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Hello,
I'm a 2nd Year Electronics and Information Engineering student at Imperial College London, and have used an oscilloscope in my labs during my first year. However, i feel like I need a bit more practice with it, and as such, I would like to buy one.
My question is, what is a good, affordable scope? Sub 200 Pounds.
I've checked Ebay and theres a Tektronix 2235 100MHz scope for 190 Pounds, what other models should i look for?
I've also seen a Tektronix 2225 50MHz for 140 quid.
Thanks!
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Around here analog scopes are considered boat anchors and only DSOs need be discussed.
OTOH, I would seriously consider a 2235 like those on eBay. They will do a fine job of displaying wiggly lines for less than half the cost of a low end DSO.
I like analog scopes. They do the job without a lot of muss and fuss. Better yet, programmers aren't involved with the display.
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Now someone else has addressed the 'Elephant in the room' of analogue versus DSO, I was just wondering what you have been using at Imperial? Ideally you'd want something to at least complement that if you're trying to boost your skills in using them.
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As the OP is an EE student he should purchase for his *future* needs; a DSO.
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Fellows, the budget is 200 GBP - if your DSO solution doesn't fit the criteria, it isn't a solution. Of course he should spend 2 to 6 times as much money for a DSO but the budget is what it is.
There are used DSOs on eBay but I would imagine they are fairly old and not all that much better than an analog scope.
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I'd suggest USB, but in this case I suspect that the OP is more likely to want a front panel UI.
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I've checked Ebay and theres a Tektronix 2235 100MHz scope for 190 Pounds, what other models should i look for?
I've also seen a Tektronix 2225 50MHz for 140 quid.
I'm going to sell my working Tektronix 465 (100MHz) and 475A+DM44 (200MHz). Have a look on ebay for prices, and PM me if you are interested.
If looking for a second-hand instrument, make sure it is working, and don't forget to include shipping costs. Be aware that shipping can cause damage, especially if improperly packed.
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You can buy a new 100MHz, 1GSa/s DSO for under £200.
For example, the Hantek DSO5102P can be found on Aliexpress (http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Hantek-Dso5102p-Digital-Storage-Oscilloscope-100mhz-2channels-1gsa-s-7-Tft-Lcd-Better-Than-Ads1102cal-free/32659380667.html?spm=2114.01010208.3.18.JX9VxF&ws_ab_test=searchweb201556_0,searchweb201602_4_10037_10017_10032_10040,searchweb201603_11&btsid=a2469ca4-1de6-4f95-8336-4f90bcbf496c) for £158.90 with free shipping.
I dunno that I'd call it a good scope, but it's cheap, lightweight, has decent specifications, is reasonably well built and has been extensively documented on the forum. It makes a perfectly decent starter scope if you really can't afford a DS1054Z.
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I would put a vote in for a DSO, often when using a scope I am fault tracing often single shot looking at what happens in the first 5ms etc, before protection circuitry cuts in. Lots to choose from!
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Get a Rigol D1054z directly from a Chinese seller. Many Chinese sellers will mark the value to "gift", so you can evade import duty and VAT.
Without any tax, a DS1054z should cost you no more than 300 pounds including shipping.
DS1054z can be software hacked to its 100MHz sibling with all options enabled, effectively a 700 pound device for 300 pounds.
UK customs are very cranky, they do inspect gifts so the UK has lowered the gift value needed before taxation. Do it wrong and you wont see your scope or your scope could get thrown around. I believe the chinese ship stuff through some channels because when things come from europe they dont get inspected as heavily as if it came from the US nor do they bear any markings like gift. I have ordered many things from china and none of them got taxed or marked as gift. I have before ordered things internationally and have had to endure many mistakes by sellers. Gift, terrible idea as it gets taxed and inspected especially if set to borderline value. Sample, warranty and such would work but they would need to be set to 0 value for the customer/user (with the disclaimer of sample/warranty) but actual item value would still need to be included for shipping insurance. HMRC is very clear about warranty (such as replacement) not being taxed so all you need are some made up documents to show that it is warranty. Many US sellers really get this badly wrong because i've had replacement screens from US for warranty but the seller was dumb that they marked it as sample, put the price of it and i got taxed for both the screen and shipping when i didnt pay for it, not to mention they threw it around that the screen came broken(it was in bubble wrap and other soft things).
If your budget is low get a good used scope, may take a bit of effort but it may be worth it. Cheap scopes however will do fine as long as they have enough memory and processing but if you're trying to measure very sensitive signals than the input noise on the cheap scopes could be a problem. It really depends on what subjects you learn. USB scopes are also a consideration if you dont mind using a computer all the time but some of them like the analog discovery will use your PC's own processing and memory instead which a scope with display in same price range cant match.
So dont try to trick customs as they will also roughen up your stuff. Its better for customs to make a mistake and make them pay for it such as if customs roughen up your package when it is marked fragile and also protected than you get to complain about customs not conforming to basic safety guidelines (such as if it was glass that could hurt the inspection stuff if they threw it about) rather than the seller/buyer making the mistake like putting in the wrong info or papers. I know this being the UK the authorities will get away with things but they cannot escape health and safety as they are big on that. You can also use hazardous goods tag assuming you follow procedure to avoid them from trying to damage it.
Being in the UK you do not have to worry about import duties or tax if you buy from europe but online EU sellers will charge UK tax or perhaps the rest of the UK have increased their VAT to the same as UK.
Just a tip, if you're buying from the US and want it to be much cheaper you can rip-off shipping companies because they love to charge admin cost and pay your tax for you and than send you the bill of tax + admin. So if it is a company like Fedex or UPS they will pay the tax and stuff for you and send you the bill. So what you can do is just not respond and pretend not to be you when they call. It works as long as you dont plan on ordering to the same address and name via the same courier again. If the local courier is used like USPS when sending to the UK it gets handed over to parcelforce who will keep your item, pay your tax and charge you for the tax + admin before sending your item. Parcelforce is essentially royal mail but for international package handling. So use an international courier instead and let them pay the tax for you than just dont pay but you would need to keep in mind not to order to same address/name with that same courier you ripped-off. I have done this for things where the tax is worth hundreds of £ but i didnt pay because prototypes and developer stuff shouldnt be taxed. So avoid couriers that will end up with parcelforce as they will hold your item until you pay.
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All of which ^^^^ is a bloody good argument for finding a local dealer of a known brand and being confident of local support.
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yeah but companies like UPS and fedex will send you your item and than your bill later on so you can skip paying the bill instead and still get your item, that means you can buy internationally without paying tax and let the shipping company pay it out of their own pocket for you.
Ofcourse if they had better systems for tax than people will pay. The first thing they need to do is get rid of admin and late fees because admin cost is supposed to be included in shipping fees.
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There's no need to mess around with international shipping and avoiding taxes. Just buy from here:
http://www.labtronix.co.uk/drupal/shop/oscilloscope/sds1102cml (http://www.labtronix.co.uk/drupal/shop/oscilloscope/sds1102cml)
That's where I got my first scope (that exact model), which I'm now upgrading to an SDS2202X, from the same seller, who I believe is also active on this forum.
So, only £42 outside your budget, UK supplier, no hassle.
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nice find, cheaper than amazon and siglent EU.
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nice find, cheaper than amazon and siglent EU.
Yep, this is they chap https://www.eevblog.com/forum/buysellwanted/new-siglent-and-array-stock-at-labtronix/msg734294/#msg734294 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/buysellwanted/new-siglent-and-array-stock-at-labtronix/msg734294/#msg734294)
Can't beat that price - no VAT and delivery included. I recommend anyone to get in touch with him, he's one of the most helpful sellers I've ever had the pleasure of dealing with. Arranged a nominated Saturday delivery for me, at cost, no problem. Top man.
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There's no need to mess around with international shipping and avoiding taxes. Just buy from here:
http://www.labtronix.co.uk/drupal/shop/oscilloscope/sds1102cml (http://www.labtronix.co.uk/drupal/shop/oscilloscope/sds1102cml)
That's where I got my first scope (that exact model), which I'm now upgrading to an SDS2202X, from the same seller, who I believe is also active on this forum.
So, only £42 outside your budget, UK supplier, no hassle.
Unfortunately that website is yet to be updated as the SDS1102CML is now a plus model SDS1102CML+ with LAN and a higher res display (800*480) all for the same price as before.
http://www.siglenteu.com/pdxx.aspx?id=2346&T=2&tid=1 (http://www.siglenteu.com/pdxx.aspx?id=2346&T=2&tid=1)
While a SDS1102CNL is a little cheaper, the 40 kpts of memory is insufficient to zoom many timebase steps otherwise you find yourself without enough waveform data points for other than repetitive waveforms.
SDS1102CML has been my best seller as a simple to use basic DSO.
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Hi Roger,
Thanks for your great comments, I like happy customers!
Labtronix will be restocked from the beginning of July with the latest models from Siglent (and other manufacturers), including the new SDS1000CML+ range referenced above. We already have reservations and deposits on many of these items. In addition Labtronix has access to Siglent EU warehouse stock which can generally be delivered anywhere in Europe and UK within 5 days all inclusive and no taxes to hike the price.
Look out for our new website coming soon!
As for being active on this forum - I do my best but I'm ususally up to my armpits in circuit design... ;)
All the best
William