Electronics > Beginners
Chip making process
Wimberleytech:
--- Quote from: coppice on October 16, 2018, 06:14:11 pm ---
--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on October 16, 2018, 06:08:33 pm ---
--- Quote from: ZeroResistance on October 16, 2018, 06:01:12 pm ---
--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on October 16, 2018, 05:48:35 pm ---
To work with a foundry, you will have to commit to many thousands of wafers in production.
--- End quote ---
So did you have to commit for like 5000 wafers?
--- End quote ---
That is a detail I do not recall. I would think at least 1000 wafers/month. A foundry is in the speculation business. They will make a bet on your viability. If they believe in your business plan, they will be willing to do much smaller quantities while betting on the future large volumes.
--- End quote ---
A foundry will happily process a single wafer for you. The price won't be the same as when you run a thousand wafers a month, though.
--- End quote ---
Have you ever had a foundry run a single wafer for you?
jmelson:
--- Quote from: ZeroResistance on October 16, 2018, 05:47:17 pm ---Do the foundries also charge you per die on that wafer.
--- End quote ---
There is a cost for the wafer sawing (called singulation), so in large volume, that might be a separate charge.
Jon
coppice:
--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on October 16, 2018, 06:25:28 pm ---
--- Quote from: coppice on October 16, 2018, 06:14:11 pm ---
--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on October 16, 2018, 06:08:33 pm ---
--- Quote from: ZeroResistance on October 16, 2018, 06:01:12 pm ---
--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on October 16, 2018, 05:48:35 pm ---
To work with a foundry, you will have to commit to many thousands of wafers in production.
--- End quote ---
So did you have to commit for like 5000 wafers?
--- End quote ---
That is a detail I do not recall. I would think at least 1000 wafers/month. A foundry is in the speculation business. They will make a bet on your viability. If they believe in your business plan, they will be willing to do much smaller quantities while betting on the future large volumes.
--- End quote ---
A foundry will happily process a single wafer for you. The price won't be the same as when you run a thousand wafers a month, though.
--- End quote ---
Have you ever had a foundry run a single wafer for you?
--- End quote ---
They regularly run a single wafer from a mask set, but you might have a point. I don't actually know anyone who went to a foundry and only did one wafer of business with them.
jmelson:
--- Quote from: ZeroResistance on October 16, 2018, 06:17:46 pm ---
--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on October 16, 2018, 06:08:33 pm ---
--- Quote from: ZeroResistance on October 16, 2018, 06:01:12 pm ---
--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on October 16, 2018, 05:48:35 pm ---
To work with a foundry, you will have to commit to many thousands of wafers in production.
--- End quote ---
So did you have to commit for like 5000 wafers?
--- End quote ---
That is a detail I do not recall. I would think at least 1000 wafers/month. A foundry is in the speculation business. They will make a bet on your viability. If they believe in your business plan, they will be willing to do much smaller quantities while betting on the future large volumes.
--- End quote ---
Ok so that makes it 1000 * $1600 per wafer or USD 1.6M per month. But you also do get 15000 dies per wafer or 15000 * 1000 = 15M dies per month.
So per die cost is 15000/1600 that is around $0.11. Seems to be pretty good for a 10F.
But Microchip need to have assured sales right for it to be profitable?
Another issue for Microchip 15M chips per month is a lot, how will they sell that much, they may probably have another deal with the foundry?
--- End quote ---
But, DO NOT FORGET, your mask set costs you about $1 million - maybe even a lot more!
Jon
jmelson:
--- Quote from: coppice on October 16, 2018, 06:29:32 pm ---They regularly run a single wafer from a mask set, but you might have a point. I don't actually know anyone who went to a foundry and only did one wafer of business with them.
--- End quote ---
I believe MOSIS typically runs about 3-5 wafers for their multi-project runs. That is a bit of insurance against goofs at the foundry. The cost of the extra wafers TOTALLY disappears compared to the cost of the masks.
Jon
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