Electronics > Beginners
Chip making process
<< < (20/36) > >>
jmelson:

--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on October 16, 2018, 07:07:58 pm ---
Correct.  I think a mask set was on the order of $50K.
For a anything under 60nm, $1M may be close.

--- End quote ---
I assure you, TODAY, a CMOS mask set at 350 nm is going to be WAY more than $50K.  Maybe a simple, all-digital mask set might go for $200K, but for mixed-signal, there will be a bunch more layers, so it bumps up the price.  I think MOSIS has their masks done in the US, so that may affect the price.

Jon
jmelson:

--- Quote from: brucehoult on October 16, 2018, 10:03:50 pm ---I've heard that there's no choice on multi-project runs as they are different size and shapes packed in and sawing up the wafer to extract some of the dice destroys other nearby ones. It's cheaper to pack them in and make multiple wafers than to align everything in rows and columns the size of the largest die in each row/column plus margin for the saw.

--- End quote ---
On educational projects at MOSIS, they have more restrictive rules.  For commercial MPW projects, you set the size of the chip.  They will often build it slightly larger, to accommodate the sawing operation, but charge you by YOUR specified dimensions.  But, all our chips came out about the size we specified.
They obviously have some special tricks they use in the sawing operation to make this work.

Jon
Wimberleytech:

--- Quote from: jmelson on October 17, 2018, 01:00:24 am ---
--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on October 16, 2018, 07:07:58 pm ---
Correct.  I think a mask set was on the order of $50K.
For a anything under 60nm, $1M may be close.

--- End quote ---
I assure you, TODAY, a CMOS mask set at 350 nm is going to be WAY more than $50K.  Maybe a simple, all-digital mask set might go for $200K, but for mixed-signal, there will be a bunch more layers, so it bumps up the price.  I think MOSIS has their masks done in the US, so that may affect the price.

Jon

--- End quote ---
Well, I pulled out my notebook from 1999.  16 masks DPTM was $50K.  Addition for an extra metal layer.  Today??  Dunno.  Rather doubt your $200K number.  But I have some real-time connections...I will see.
amyk:

--- Quote from: coppice on October 16, 2018, 06:38:43 pm ---Sure, it makes no rational sense to process just one wafer after spending a fortune to make a mask set. Back in the 80s, in the 2um era, direct e-beam written wafers were much saner as one offs.

--- End quote ---
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maskless_lithography

Interesting. I wonder if there are any companies that still offer prototyping on larger processes using direct-write, because from the discussion I gather the bulk of the $$$ in IC prototyping is in the mask (why masks are so expensive is the other question I'm curious about --- is there a ton of human labour involved, and/or do they take a very long time to make?)
coppice:

--- Quote from: amyk on October 17, 2018, 02:58:24 am ---
--- Quote from: coppice on October 16, 2018, 06:38:43 pm ---Sure, it makes no rational sense to process just one wafer after spending a fortune to make a mask set. Back in the 80s, in the 2um era, direct e-beam written wafers were much saner as one offs.

--- End quote ---
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maskless_lithography

Interesting. I wonder if there are any companies that still offer prototyping on larger processes using direct-write, because from the discussion I gather the bulk of the $$$ in IC prototyping is in the mask (why masks are so expensive is the other question I'm curious about --- is there a ton of human labour involved, and/or do they take a very long time to make?)

--- End quote ---
The bulk of your external purchasing costs are software tools and mask costs. However, the bulk of the money you spend is on the engineering work itself. If you are worried about $100k to $200k for a mask set for a medium geometry process (350nm to 180nm), you certainly won't be able to afford to salary bill.
Navigation
Message Index
Next page
Previous page
There was an error while thanking
Thanking...

Go to full version
Powered by SMFPacks Advanced Attachments Uploader Mod