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Electrical Engineering vs Electronics Engineering vs Computer Engineering

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IDEngineer:

--- Quote from: tggzzz on April 06, 2019, 07:58:53 am ---But that doesn't say anything useful about one type of course over another. It does indicate something about the specific candidate and, if you see sufficient people from the same course then it may indicate something about that course.
--- End quote ---
I didn't mean to cast derision upon ALL CS degrees. However, that particular degree does seem to have a higher than normal incidence of, shall I say, "incompletely educated" graduates. Not sure why, just reporting what I've experienced.

tggzzz:

--- Quote from: IDEngineer on April 06, 2019, 06:49:54 pm ---
--- Quote from: tggzzz on April 06, 2019, 07:58:53 am ---But that doesn't say anything useful about one type of course over another. It does indicate something about the specific candidate and, if you see sufficient people from the same course then it may indicate something about that course.
--- End quote ---
I didn't mean to cast derision upon ALL CS degrees. However, that particular degree does seem to have a higher than normal incidence of, shall I say, "incompletely educated" graduates. Not sure why, just reporting what I've experienced.

--- End quote ---

I know what you are referring to by "incompletely educated", and don't fundamentally disagree. But even then...

I've always been incompletely educated for every new job I've taken. For the more interesting jobs it was inevitable that I would be incompletely educated, since there was no pre-existing education in that topic! What was more important was the drive and ability to learn new things.

You can never get all attributes in one person, be that personality or technical knowledge. Doctors are "incompletely educated" in the art of inserting needles, and nurses are "incompletely educated" in the art of diagnosing cancer. What you need is a team where one person's deficiencies are "masked" by another person's strengths.

IDEngineer:

--- Quote from: tggzzz on April 06, 2019, 08:53:55 pm ---I've always been incompletely educated for every new job I've taken. For the more interesting jobs it was inevitable that I would be incompletely educated, since there was no pre-existing education in that topic!
--- End quote ---
Yes, but I'm correcting for that. To extend Dave's comment above, a new hire may not have memorized the native Assembly language for a microcontroller on a given project - but I think it's fair to expect someone who presents themselves (on paper and in person) as "experienced" with microcontrollers to be able to name a few!

If someone is fresh out of school, there is still a baseline of knowledge (if not actual experience) that is fair to presume. If a EE or CS comes out of school not knowing binary, hex, etc. their education is INCOMPLETE, period, and they have a legitimate complaint against their "university".

If someone claims on their resume/CV and in person that they have some amount of experience, sure - that experience may not be spot-on the project in question. But if they lack even the fundamental skills that would equip them to ramp up on the project and become an asset - instead of a liability - then the incompleteness of their education isn't just a lack of familiarity with the specifics of the project. It's a lack of basic knowledge and experience.

It comes down to what you expected vs. what the person represented they could reasonably deliver. Obviously you scale your expectations, but someone who escaped university with a CS degree without knowing (in my example) binary and hex is less than a "fresh out of school" greenie... they simply do NOT possess a Computer Science education no matter what their diploma might claim. Likewise, someone who escaped university with an EE degree who doesn't know Ohm's Law simply does NOT possess an Electrical Engineering education no matter what their diploma might claim. These are basic, fundamental skills that are part of the education represented by the degree in question.

Could they BECOME qualified? Quite possibly - but did you hire them as an intern expecting to participate in their basic education, or did you hire them as an individual contributor who could be expected to spin up to speed in a reasonable time? There are places for both types of people, but the former makes a terrible substitute for the latter.

tggzzz:
I don't disagree, but then...

In my first job I knew nothing about these newfangled optical fibres, nor radars. But I learned and designed and implemented systems in those areas.

In my second job I knew nothing about lung ventilators, semi-custom ICs, testing building materials, measuring road surfaces, AI languages. But I learned...

In another job I knew nothing about these newfangled computer networks, nor (nonexistent) WLANs, nor SS7 telco signalling systems and the vagueries of cellular propagation. But I learned...

Etc.

windsmurf:
Not to confuse things, but my alma mater, UC Irvine, offer all of these interrelated degrees:
Computational Science   M.S.2, Ph.D.
Computer Engineering   B.S.
Computer Game Science   B.S.
Computer Science   B.S., M.C.S., M.S., Ph.D.
Computer Science and Engineering   B.S.
Data Science   B.S.
Electrical and Computer Engineering   M.S., Ph.D.
Electrical Engineering   B.S.
Engineering   B.S., M.S., Ph.D.
Human Computer Interaction and Design   M.H.C.I.D.
Informatics   B.S., M.S., Ph.D.
Information and Computer Science   B.S., M.S.
Mathematical, Computational, and Systems Biology   M.S., Ph.D.
Networked Systems   M.S., Ph.D.
Software Engineering   B.S., M.S., Ph.D.

 :-//

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