Electronics > Beginners

Good electronics simulator for beginner?

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rstofer:

--- Quote from: Wimberleytech on January 05, 2019, 05:18:10 pm ---
--- Quote from: rstofer on January 05, 2019, 04:37:02 pm ---
There is an Electronics pack for MATLAB but I haven't played with it. 

The reason I bring up MATLAB is that there is a concurrent thread about explaining a capacitor.  I wanted to graph the charge and discharge curves and it is easy to do this in MATLAB.

--- End quote ---

MATLAB is not cheap.  Are using the HOME version (which is reasonable)?  Octave is cheap (free...of course).

--- End quote ---

Yes, I am definitely using the Home edition of MATLAB.  There's no way I can afford a commercial license!  I also have a few add-ons that add to the annual fee.  Simulink is one and it is fantastic!  The Arduino interface package is pretty slick.

Octave will run the same exact script (generally).  I don't find the graph output as pleasing and I need to change the fontsize in the various titles but, other than that, Octave works well.  I haven't pursued add-ons with Octave.

MATLAB is pretty well respected in industry.  If I were going to specialize in MATLAB vs Octave, it would be MATLAB first.  For whatever reason, industry doesn't always line up for open source software.  Octave is still a first rate solver.  If I was tight for money or a fan of open source, Octave would be my first choice.

Wimberleytech:

--- Quote from: rstofer on January 05, 2019, 06:39:23 pm ---
MATLAB is pretty well respected in industry. 

--- End quote ---

Indeed we used at all of the places where I have worked.

The kind of work I do not generally does not call for signal processing, so I cannot justify the cost.  If I take a case that needs it, I will justify the cost...always like buying new things!!!

I have octave installed for the rare need.

Zero999:

--- Quote from: Mr. Scram on January 05, 2019, 04:53:41 pm ---
--- Quote from: Eaglecrest on January 05, 2019, 03:57:15 pm ---Please explain the point here and examples of what you seem to believe is a better approach.

--- End quote ---
I'm not sure what you're asking for. LTSpice isn't real-time, whereas other simulators are. Seeing how things move around can help a lot, especially for beginners.

--- End quote ---
I agree that real time simulation can be beneficial for beginners, but woudn't recommend using it much beyond educational purposes.

The problem with any simulator is knowing its limitations.

Mr. Scram:

--- Quote from: Zero999 on January 05, 2019, 08:44:54 pm ---I agree that real time simulation can be beneficial for beginners, but woudn't recommend using it much beyond educational purposes.

The problem with any simulator is knowing its limitations.

--- End quote ---
Agreed. Part of the issue seems to be that LTSpice was developed a while ago now, while these real-time simulators are more modern. The latter also seem to be less mature and more frivolous, sometimes omitting quite a bit of detail. It seems likely that they'll sooner or later mature, or that LTSpice or a successor evolve to include these more modern features. It's undeniable that LTSpice and compatible simulators are well supported by various manufacturers with all kinds of components being available, which is part of their value and why they endure.

Zero999:

--- Quote from: Mr. Scram on January 05, 2019, 08:49:27 pm ---
--- Quote from: Zero999 on January 05, 2019, 08:44:54 pm ---I agree that real time simulation can be beneficial for beginners, but woudn't recommend using it much beyond educational purposes.

The problem with any simulator is knowing its limitations.

--- End quote ---
Agreed. Part of the issue seems to be that LTSpice was developed a while ago now, while these real-time simulators are more modern. The latter also seem to be less mature and more frivolous, sometimes omitting quite a bit of detail. It seems likely that they'll sooner or later mature, or that LTSpice or a successor evolve to include these more modern features. It's undeniable that LTSpice and compatible simulators are well supported by various manufacturers with all kinds of components being available, which is part of their value and why they endure.

--- End quote ---
Real-time simulators are optimised for speed and not much else.

LTSpice is optimised for accuracy and is designed to be flexible and give repeatable results.

The requirements for real time simulators and more professional ones such as LTSpice are conflicting. It's not possible to make a real-time simulator as accurate and repeatable as LTSpice. Take a simple circuit with a push-button switch for example. In a real time simulator, the user will click on the switch component, to get the circuit to respond. In LTSpice, the user would implement it as a time controlled resistor, a voltage, or current controlled switch, with set on/off and rise/fall times. The interactive approach of the real-time simulator may seem easy and intuitive, but it's not as repeatable as the LTSpice approach, because it relies on user input, which is non-repeatable.

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